By John Walker on June 12th, 2008 at 12:08 pm.
A quite remarkable story has emerged about a PC adventure game from Majestic Studios called Limbo Of The Lost. It has, it is alleged, entirely lifted locations and art from at least five other games, apparently proven in a number of screenshots posted by GamePlasma yesterday. Oblivion seems the main target, along with Thief 3 and others. Because, hey, who bought those games? But this is a larger story of peculiarity.
The development of Limbo Of The Lost has been talked about for over a decade, the first announcement of its release finally appearing in 2006 when signed to G2 Games. The press release oddly chose to boast that it had been in development for more than ten years. A lot more than ten years if the following statement is true.
“Originally created as a graphical/text adventure game for the Atari ST and then a traditional point & click game for the Amiga CD32/A1600.”
Not too sure there were many text adventures for the ST kicking around in 1996. Nevermind that the A1600 wasn’t an Amiga model at all.
Skip ahead two years and the game has released the vaguest of releases via G2 at some point in 2008. According to Adventure Gamers,
“The game’s European release through G2 Games late last year resulted only in a few copies available through eBay or from a small Asian retailer, casting doubt about the legitimacy of the release.”
By 7th May, US publisher Tri Synergy announced that they would be publishing the game in N. America (including the feature, “Immersive (being there) sound effects”). As recently as the 5th June a teaser trailer was released, then swiftly replaced due to failing to meet ESRB regulations with this one:
After watching this, it’s not possible to ignore last year’s “behind the scenes” trailer developers Majestic Studios put up:
Um, isn’t that Poser? And I’m not quite sure you can claim your pencil sketches are an “all star cast”. But the most stand-out part of this surely being the name of one of the characters, “Cranny Faggot”. What? Sure, we get the spoonerism. But WHAT?
You may wonder why we’ve not linked to Majestic Studio’s website. Well, that would be because it’s on GeoCities. It’s like there can be nothing about this story that isn’t brilliant. Anyway, it’s either been whipped down, or overloaded by the attention the plagiarism accusations have brought, and you can fail to look at here.
Right, so the best bit. The screenshots. We don’t want to take anything from GamePlasma, and their fantastic discovery, and they deserve the hits they’ll be getting for this story. So head over there to see the full selection. But below is my favourite.
Limbo Of The Lost:
Oblivion:
It gets better. Neogaf posters have been spotting loads more, including scenes that appear to be from Silent Hill 4, Painkiller and Return To Castle Wolfenstein, and screen decor from Diablo 2, while at Just Adventure someone has claimed spoken dialogue has been lifted from Rune. A JA poster also spotted this story about the motley crew behind the game.
RPS readers reckon they’ve spotted more similarities, including further Thief 3 nabs, Pirates of the Caribbean game FMV, and bits from Crysis, Spawn, BioShock, UT2004, and Baldur’s Gate, although we can’t verify any of them yet. Collect them all!
My favourite is the Thief 3 inspiration, linked in this GR thread:
Thief 3:
Limbo Of The Lost:
Note the addition of the skulls on the shelf. The skulls from Diablo 2.
Tri Synergy have responded, issuing a press release stating:
“Tri Synergy is just as shocked as everyone else is by the recent screenshot comparisons. At no point during our dealings with Majestic Studios up until the point that the comparison was first publicly made by a third party did we have any knowledge of these similarities. Additionally, Tri Synergy will discontinue distribution of Limbo of the Lost in both retail and online outlets.”
It’s impossible to imagine more won’t show up. We’re trying to get a copy to see what we can find. If you want to play at home, I’ve put all 76 available screenshots here, as a 20Mb zip.
For now, let’s finish with this quote from an interview with Majestic, as spotted by QT3.
Gordon: So have any more recent games influenced your current project?
Steve: The project is more influenced by film and literature rather than other games, we want the experience to be as original as possible and as such we have made a calculated effort to keep away from other games in the genre. Limbo of the Lost is an experience first and foremost, secondly wrapped up in a game media and genre.
Thanks to Michael for being the first to tip us off to this.
EDIT: I can confirm that it’s a real game – no hoax – and that it is a point and click adventure, with a loosely animated character superimposed on static screenshots.
ANOTHER EDIT: Courtesy of RPS reader Joachim, here’s a preview of Limbo of the Lost from the June 1995 issue of The One. Page 1 and Page 2.
12/06/2008 at 12:17 Phil says:
Awsome – it’s Rom Check Fail, the retail release.
Mash up gaming is on the cutting edge – especially if you’re a intellectual property lawyer.
12/06/2008 at 12:17 Meat Circus says:
lol wut?
Extraordinary.
The bizarre thing about doing something like this is the incomprehensible failure to realise that SOMEBODY WILL NOTICE.
12/06/2008 at 12:19 M says:
Is this some kind of mad hoax?
12/06/2008 at 12:19 Alex says:
That’s incredible. The first posted screenshot of “Oblivion” actually made me gasp.
12/06/2008 at 12:22 Ian says:
I hope and pray that this is real. :D
12/06/2008 at 12:23 Dan Fuller says:
Amazing. I saw this trailer earlier in the month and it looked a bit odd- like one of these surreal games that drift somewhere inbetween indie and big budget publishing quality. Hilarious.
12/06/2008 at 12:24 Alex says:
Ha ha, just watched that “behind the screens” thing.. those ‘sketches’ are awful!
12/06/2008 at 12:27 John Walker says:
I was thinking, “Is this a hoax” all the way through writing the story. Thing is, it’s on sale from Game in the UK, and those screenshots were posted by Majestic on GamesPress as long ago as 2006. Which makes it a really elaborate hoax if it is, and one I wouldn’t be embarrassed to fall for.
12/06/2008 at 12:27 James G says:
The odd thing is that they don’t even try to hide it. The seem to steal textures, models and architecture, and don’t even bother trying to mix them up slightly. Its not even like they’ve ripped of some obscure games that few people have ever played, Oblivion in particular is one of the biggest releases in the past few years.
12/06/2008 at 12:29 Chris Evans says:
I still can’t believe someone would do something like this. The whole thing just sounds like a joke!
12/06/2008 at 12:29 Alex says:
It’s also up on Play.com, for pre-order:
http://www.play.com/Games/PC/4-/877345/-/Product.html?searchstring=Limbo+Of+The+Lost&searchsource=0
12/06/2008 at 12:29 Albides says:
Ohnotheydidn’t! And, man, Cranny Faggot? It’s like the kid in school that used to draw cocks in his exercise book and looked over your shoulder to cheat on tests grew up and got a job in games development.
Also, O Fortuna makes even lame marketing slogans seem downright epic.
12/06/2008 at 12:33 John Walker says:
Let us not forget:
12/06/2008 at 12:33 SlappyBag says:
Theres a clip from crisis in that loller-tralier
Edit: I love the real time shadows bit in the making of video when the shadow is always in the same place no-matter where the light source is affecting the character lol
12/06/2008 at 12:34 The Hammer says:
Hahaha, that Kent Messenger article is class.
“He said: “Everything just sort of fizzled out. Then one day I was working in a pub and Tim and Steve walked in.
“I joked ‘I thought you would be millionaires now’, and they replied ‘actually that is what we wanted to talk to you about’”.
The three put their heads together and after three more years of hard work Limbo of the Lost – a PC adventure game – was born. It is a battle between fate and destiny, with players having to work through a series of puzzles and challenges to reach the end.”
12/06/2008 at 12:42 Freelancepolice says:
Is it a coincidence the acronym of Limbo of the Lost (as long as you ignore ‘the’) is LOL?
The animation on the dogs is priceless.
Story of the year, hands down
12/06/2008 at 12:43 Jon says:
Gameplasma has died by the look of things, time for me to download that zip file.
12/06/2008 at 12:48 AbyssUK says:
Can you guys get any comments from the peeps who make the ripped off games ?? Did these guys somehow get permission ?
12/06/2008 at 12:50 Mooey Poo says:
I’d like to play this, I loved Thief 3 and would enjoy revisiting all the classic locations, albeit in what is probably a far worse game. This game was made for ME AND ME ALONE.
12/06/2008 at 12:51 John Walker says:
You can see the comparisons from GamePlasma on Games Radar’s forum:
http://forum.gamesradar.com/viewtopic.php?t=120121
EDIT: GamePlasma is working fine now.
12/06/2008 at 12:55 Lu-Tze says:
My favourite one is the rip from the motion picture Spawn. Taking screenshots of games and using them as backgrounds = very very bad. Ripping hollywood movies into your FMVs = completely mindnumbingly stupid.
12/06/2008 at 12:55 Paul Moloney says:
Totally obvious; I spotted the Keeper Library from Thief: DS used in the above screenshot immediately.
I especially like the way they scrawled a couple of words on the shelves to make theirs “different”, the way Vanilla Ice added one more note to the “Under Pressure” sample to claim it was original.
P.
12/06/2008 at 13:00 kuddles says:
Every time I visit another forum or site, someone has spotted another game that this title “borrowed” from. It seems like Majestic accidentally managed to great the most ground-breaking adventure meta-game of all time.
Here’s a couple tips for future thieves:
1. Pick games that haven’t sold millions of copies.
2. Put a little effort into hiding it’s origins. Leaving the same coat of arms on the wall is a no-no.
12/06/2008 at 13:03 Schadenfreude says:
I am so tempted to buy this. Those guys have some big hairy balls. Where their brains should be, obviously, but still…
12/06/2008 at 13:07 Fede says:
Looks really like a hoax. The LotL character’s shadow is always going in the same direction, regardless of lights, like they just “pasted” him (with shadow) over screenshots taken from other games.
12/06/2008 at 13:10 Duoae says:
Haha, i loved scanning over that gamesradar thread. Someone was calling it GOTY – well, it’s got so many great games in it that it must be game of the decade!
Oh yeah, reminds me of the time i saw a C&C Orca fighter sent in for a BBC contest to design your own aircraft… i wanted to write in and let them know that the kid didn’t think it up…
12/06/2008 at 13:10 MeestaNob! says:
Has. To. Be. A. HOAX. Has to be.
Surely the best viral advertising ever. It just cant be real.
12/06/2008 at 13:17 Mooey Poo says:
Here’s a headline:
Majestic Oblivious to Obvious Oblivion Theft
12/06/2008 at 13:18 Ben Abraham says:
PASTICHE comes to gaming!!!!! FINALLY!
Edit: Internet Archive have files on the original geocities webpage from as far back as 2006… 2 year long setup for a hoax? Epic.
Edit, edit: Just for fun, compare the bit at the start of the latest teaser trailer underwater bit with the Bioshock intro video. The sunset is IDENTICAL even if they have added different water.
12/06/2008 at 13:19 ZeeKat says:
There’s no way it can be true, they superimposed player dude on screens or something, it looks lame with shadow always pointing the same direction etc. No one is that stupid and/or detached from reality to try to sell such ripfest.
12/06/2008 at 13:21 Jonathan says:
Oooooh I think I spotted a new one
LOWER_REACHES_4_ in the zip file. Isn’t that the shop in Thief 3 zoomed in slightly?
LOWER_REACHES_14_ and _15_ and _24_ are all from Painkiller.
Apology if these were spotted on game plasma but the site doesn’t seem to be working.
12/06/2008 at 13:26 Lukasz says:
haha. what a bizarre world.
12/06/2008 at 13:28 Malagate says:
Yes Jonathan, I do believe that the LOWER_REACHES_4_ is the shop in Thief 3, especially as on the shelves on the right of the picture there’s a practice lock for sale. Either best viral marketing ever or a massive case of stupid with the soon to come legal raping of the decade.
12/06/2008 at 13:34 The Hammer says:
Hahaha, they even have UT2004 copied. UT2004!
12/06/2008 at 13:37 mark says:
heh, also noticed on that trailer the coin/medal thing is from baldur’s gate i think? (the golden one with the skull in the middle)
edit: actually after checking i dont think it is…. very similar though
12/06/2008 at 13:37 Ben Abraham says:
Could this be…. is this really… the new ZOO RACE?
12/06/2008 at 13:42 Duncan says:
Fucking awesome!
Pissing myself here, cheers guys :-D
12/06/2008 at 13:45 Gap Gen says:
Did these guys have a budget? Because it doesn’t look like they had a budget.
12/06/2008 at 13:46 Schadenfreude says:
The cinematic with the boat seems really familiar. Thought it was Gothic 3 intro at first but I was wrong; can’t find the ending of Gothic 2 though. Can anyone confirm or deny?
EDIT: Unless that’s one of the things swiped from Pirates of the Caribbean.
12/06/2008 at 13:51 Ging says:
The boat sequence is (I believe) swiped from PotC.
It’s awesome, they’ve made a meta game out of figuring out which games they’ve stolen from for their game… I think there must be an award due to them for best game design ever.
If this is a hoax / viral marketing ploy, it’s a really, really long term one.
12/06/2008 at 13:54 Jonathan says:
Amazon’s selling it too. This is either genuine or the best laid hoax ever.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/G2-Games-Limbo-Lost-PC/dp/B000EBREPY/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1213275021&sr=8-6
Theres more intellectual property theft here than in the entire history of sprite comics.
12/06/2008 at 13:55 Maximum Fish says:
That first trailer’s got two or three cutscenes from the Pirates of the Caribbean game by Akella in it too.
Actually, this cinematics video for PotC has about 1/3 of the “Limbo of the Lost” trailer in it, including the waking up on the beach segment, all the stuff with ships basically and the crab-covered skeleton, which showed up every time you died in Pirates.
This may already be common knowledge, just about any site relating to this surreal story is totally swamped so i haven’t done too much investigating.
12/06/2008 at 13:55 Ryan Lodata says:
I can assure all of you that what you see is indeed true. My first instinct was the same thing that you guys have commented. “This must be a hoax or my writer photoshopped it” After I did my fact-checking, there was no denying this. I hope you guys have enjoyed the read!
P.S. Fantastic write-up John
12/06/2008 at 13:57 Lukasz says:
apparently the game rips off silent hill.
haven’t seen it though…
12/06/2008 at 13:58 Mooey Poo says:
With regards to it being a hoax, I don’t believe it is so. I’m guessing it’s one of those point ‘n clickers with pre-rendered backdrops and a rendered character and shadow. Like all modern low-budget P’nC games.
12/06/2008 at 14:02 AbyssUK says:
The 3d scene are so similar they must have used a straight 3d ripper like this one (http://www.deep-shadows.com/hax/3DRipperDX.htm)
I bet there so lazy they didn’t even bother to ‘recreate’ the scenes they ripped them straight into 3dmax with textures and everything.. now this is a billion times worse than piracy!
12/06/2008 at 14:03 Nick says:
This is the best games news ever.
12/06/2008 at 14:07 Duncan says:
Cheers for the Amazon link Jonathan – I just had to comment on the review :-D
Had to be Bovis that wrote it, or maybe one of the other perpetrators.
12/06/2008 at 14:07 Mattress says:
I’ve found a torrent of it! Oh this is going to be great! Heck, how can stealing from them possibly be illegal when they’re thieves themselves?
12/06/2008 at 14:08 Paul Moloney says:
Of course, is it possible that the other games ripped off _them_?
I think a defence with that level of chutzpah is the only option left to Majestic at this stage.
There’s an interview here with Steve Bovis which says the same was in development since 1995!
http://www.justadventure.com/Interviews/Limbo/SteveBovis.shtm
You kind of wonder what “in development” means, other than “play some games and take some screenshots for, uh, research”.
P.
12/06/2008 at 14:08 Ryan Lodata says:
@abyssUK
The game is set on 2d environments. The most likely thing that they did was to take screenshots of the individual games and just drop them in Limbo of the Lost. When you think about this game, think about the early Police Quest games.
12/06/2008 at 14:08 John Walker says:
Just for the record, Mattress, it’s still entirely illegal. And they are very much alleged thieves for the moment.
12/06/2008 at 14:15 ohmen says:
Shows how generic a lot of games look. I checked all the screens in that zip file and aside from a sack that looked like it could have come from Oblivion I didn’t ID anything, but since I was looking for similarities I was constantly vaguely reminded of stuff I’ve played that any given corridor could easily fit into.
My visual recognition skills may suck. But the Oblivion shop and the hall belonging to the Vampire Count are obivous to me without the comparison shots.
The Hammer: which is UT2004? In the teaser after the suspiciously-well-rendered-hmm-is-that-Crysis looking bit? edit: oh, the gamesradar thread has the shots.
12/06/2008 at 14:16 Gap Gen says:
I guess technically torrenting this game is infringing on the copyright holders, whoever they may be.
12/06/2008 at 14:18 rob says:
It seems they’re using an engine called Wintermute which uses 2D backgrounds, so it’s likely that the ripped off elements are direct screen shots from the various games. A few of them have undergone some photoshopping to make them look slightly different but otherwise they seem to be blatant screen grabs. The animated bits in the videos seem to come from commercial movies or are created by some animation package (as John mentioned maybe Poser?)
Here is the profile of one of the developers on the engine’s forums. I found this post to be particularly amusing.
12/06/2008 at 14:18 AbyssUK says:
@Ryan
Really ?? Its 2D, the video clearly shows 3d environments and stuff…my god that’s even lazier than I first imagined! I say we charge them with witchcraft and bring back burning at the stake!
12/06/2008 at 14:19 Matthew says:
Was the title of the game lifted from the 1975 book on the Bermuda Triangle, I wonder?
12/06/2008 at 14:20 John Walker says:
Gap Gen – I suppose you could argue that you already own legitimate copies of the majority of the game’s content.
12/06/2008 at 14:22 diebroken says:
Take a look at a behind the scenes video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=li6-ewgKupA
The artwork is really suspect – especially the Dragonlore reference (classic DOS days)
12/06/2008 at 14:27 mandrill says:
I want to hear from Majestic about this, either they’ve perpetrated the greatest video game hoax in the world (and on the entire industry it would seem) or they’re guilty of plagiarism of the highest degree.
The fact that the publisher didn’t notice is a damning indictment of their worthiness to be in the business at all.
12/06/2008 at 14:30 tanstaafl says:
With the storm this has kicked up across the Internet, has anyone from Majestic made any comment at all yet? You would think they would at least have something to say.
12/06/2008 at 14:31 Juvenihilist says:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/0786911816/sr=1-91/qid=1213277320/ref=dp_image_0?ie=UTF8&n=283155&s=books&qid=1213277320&sr=1-91
Second Trailer – 2:14 – looks remarkably similar to a certain Dragonlance picture..
12/06/2008 at 14:31 Gap Gen says:
Gap Gen – I suppose you could argue that you already own legitimate copies of the majority of the game’s content.
Heh, this is true (assuming you own ALL the games it’s stolen from). Then again, the EULAs probably forbid more than just copyright violation.
I wonder if they’d get off of being sued purely because it’s so unbelievable. Maybe they should employ the Chewbacca defence.
12/06/2008 at 14:33 Gap Gen says:
Looking at the Amazon page, even the manufacturer’s description is wonderful: http://www.amazon.co.uk/G2-Games-Limbo-Lost-PC/dp/B000EBREPY/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1213275021&sr=8-6
12/06/2008 at 14:38 Möller says:
There is some more information over at Wintermute forum
http://forum.dead-code.org/index.php?topic=2746.0
12/06/2008 at 14:39 John Walker says:
A man could get upset when people post comments linking to things that are in the post!
12/06/2008 at 14:39 Ryan Lodata says:
Trisynergy, the publisher, has apologized and pulled the game from production. They said that they have contacted Majestic and are awaiting a response. Some sites are reporting that the developers went on “Vacation” after finish the “game.”
12/06/2008 at 14:41 Schadenfreude says:
@ Gap Gen: Never mind the manufacturer’s description, it’s that rather suspicious 5-star review that makes me chuckle…
12/06/2008 at 14:42 Second says:
Here in HOL you can take a look at the Amiga “version” of the “game”. My brother and I had ran into it some months back thinking nothing of it, but… now, what a story!
12/06/2008 at 14:56 AbyssUK says:
Ha the last post by SBOVIS on that wintermute forum is an advert for a 2d/3d background artist written on the 8th of June! The cheek of the man!
12/06/2008 at 14:56 Paul Moloney says:
It’s worth highlighting the link to the Kent Messenger article which you mentioned above:
http://www.kentmessenger.co.uk/paper/default.asp?article_id=9644&slide_id=1&newspage=2&searchkeyword=&searchpage=1
This is great, and am I being unfair in thinking they look like a bunch of chancers?
P.
12/06/2008 at 15:00 Bytex says:
The final pencil drawing of a kind of floating castle is extremely similar to the cover of (awesome) progmetal band Ayreon’s “Into the Electric Castle” album..this thing has so many cloned images you have to wonder.
12/06/2008 at 15:02 Rook says:
How can this not be the most blatent hoax ever. Look at the real time lighting demonstration and just watch the shadow. It’s hilarious.
12/06/2008 at 15:04 cyrenic says:
I have a hard time seeing this as a hoax. With such a long set up time I think they would have second guessed themselves as the hoax has a Very Real threat of legal consequences. Just my guess. I could easily be overestimating their chances of being sued.
12/06/2008 at 15:06 fluffy bunny says:
It’s not a hoax, I’ve played it myself. It was incredibly strange. I didn’t notice the stolen assets, but I didn’t get very far either. The part about the long development is true too – I still have the issue of The One Amiga where this is previewed.
12/06/2008 at 15:10 Duncan says:
SBOVIS’s 400-odd posts on the wintermute forum would imply to me that this is not a hoax. ;-)
12/06/2008 at 15:19 tackle says:
This is by far the most incredible and bizarre thing I’ve heard of in the gaming world.
12/06/2008 at 15:22 Saflo says:
Incredible.
12/06/2008 at 15:33 Mattress says:
What with the publisher pulling the game, we could just make a claim for vapour-ware…
On the other hand, Majestic Entertainment could also claim they were just making a stand-alone, paid-for mod of Oblivion, Thief, Unreal Tournament and Vampire Bloodlines… I somehow that’d withstand the scrutiny of the courts though…
12/06/2008 at 15:38 mark says:
tri-synergy is the publisher right? im sure i saw an interview with the main developer who said that prior to majestic, their company was called tri-synergy…
so is the developer self-publishing then? and if so, doesn’t that mean that the ‘we were just as shocked as you were’ claim is probably bs?
12/06/2008 at 15:41 Pidesco says:
It is clear that Limbo of the Lost is obviously meant as meta-commentary on the current state of game development. It is an epic call for renovation and innovation within the industry.
12/06/2008 at 15:42 Lukasz says:
@mark: nah. these are two separate companies.
12/06/2008 at 15:44 fluffy bunny says:
mark: Tri-Synergy is an established US publisher (pretty small-time, but they’ve been around for ages), and other than publishing Limbo they have nothing to do with the British developers of this game.
Anyway, I wonder what’ll happen now. I guess Tri-Synergy and the other publishers of this game (G2 Games in Europe, 1C in Russia/the East) are desperately trying to avoid being sued, but will pulling the game from sale be enough? Was it their responsibility to check for such things before they agreed to publish, or can they get away with claiming (probably truthfully) that they had no idea about this?
I’m assuming the devs will be sued to hell and back, but seeing as they’re tiny I doubt there will be anything to gain from this – they probably wouldn’t have any money to pay.
12/06/2008 at 15:50 SlappyBag says:
Wait wait wait – Surely if they have been developing this for 10 years, how don’t we know every other developer hasn’t just ripped them off?
Heh =P
12/06/2008 at 15:54 tackle says:
I believe this is hilarious in many ways, it’s just a matter of choosing which way to look at it.
12/06/2008 at 16:16 RLacey says:
I was supposed to be reviewing this for Adventure Gamers. Never have I been so irritated that the press copy I was issued with doesn’t appear to have downloaded properly (attempting again atm)…
12/06/2008 at 16:17 Not-A-Bot says:
@SlappyBag: Yeah, their game is so awesome, all the big developers over the past ten years couldn’t help but take stuff from it. No one’s saying anything because they don’t want us to know the truth.
12/06/2008 at 16:26 Optimaximal says:
This made me laugh…
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/2615/limboofthelostboxartkk9.jpg
12/06/2008 at 16:27 TychoCelchuuu says:
I’ve been reading about this all morning. Pretty funny stuff. You have to have some serious chutzpah to try something like this. That and a lawyer.
12/06/2008 at 16:29 Alliteration says:
Is the forum splash page at the Wintermute engine site supposed to say “Create your own oblivion/thief 3/etc” with ‘adventure’ crossed out? I wonder if this was somehow intentional or they were hacked? The frontpage is completely normal.
12/06/2008 at 16:32 Gap Gen says:
Pidesco: A great theory, even if the lawyers might not agree.
12/06/2008 at 16:36 Maximum Fish says:
Wintermute! Hooray for a Neuromancer reference. This thread just got even better.
12/06/2008 at 16:39 Optimaximal says:
Given how the Wintermute devs are vocally repulsed by Majestics efforts, I think someone was having a bit of fun at their expense.
That said, whether the people having the fun were WM devs or hackers is open to debate :)
12/06/2008 at 16:39 espy says:
Bizarre. And incredibly funny. Great find!
12/06/2008 at 16:41 Second says:
fluffy bunny, would you be in any way able to scan that particular magazine for us to see? Being an Amiga enthusiast of sorts (I used to be a subscriber to the magazine, too), I would love to see that preview!
At AdventureGamers, people have pointed out how a character called “FABLE” has been advertising and hyping up the game, under false pretenses, in various adventure gaming forums such as here and here!
12/06/2008 at 16:43 James says:
I’ll still not convinced, I think it’s an elaborate hoax or viral marketing. Nobody is that stupid, surely?
Either way, very funny stuff :)
12/06/2008 at 16:47 Cooper says:
Seconded for that mag scan.
This has been keeping me amused for the best part of the afternoon. It’s like a whole new form of meta-gaming…
12/06/2008 at 16:49 CakeAddict says:
This is a joke right?
…. right?
12/06/2008 at 16:52 tackle says:
http://www.pokerpages.com/players/profiles/46740/steve-bovis.htm
Could that be him?
12/06/2008 at 16:54 John Walker says:
It’s not a hoax! It’s not a joke! Well, if it is, it’s a commercially available one that’s going to get them sued into a black hole.
fluffy – if you can scan the Amiga preview, email it to john@rockpapershotgun.com and I’ll add it to the post.
12/06/2008 at 16:57 Chaz says:
This has got to be the best games story I’ve read in years, I love it :)
12/06/2008 at 17:04 Ryan Lodata says:
I will tell you one thing. It is rather funny seeing all the comments and the dissection of this from all the gamers out there. I mean, copying the Spawn movie, comeone!
12/06/2008 at 17:06 Donald Duck says:
More on this story on my blog -
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=1903#more-1903
12/06/2008 at 17:11 Demikaze (Michael) says:
http://bestbooksonthenet.amazonwebstore.com/Limbo-of-the-Lost-Revised-and/M/B000GE5320.htm?utm_campaign=froogle&utm_medium=organic&utm_source=froogle
Apparently, even the story (well, at least the very opening) is a direct rip-off of this book…
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?t=60823&page=2
And according to penny arcade, they even ‘re-appropriated’ a picture of a Wraith from Lord of the Rings…
I love it.
12/06/2008 at 17:13 weegosan says:
when outsourcing goes bad!
12/06/2008 at 17:16 Fat Zombie says:
What I love is that not only did these guys rip images from games, they even ripped backgrounds from addons!
This one here? This is a rip of a screenshot from an addon-level for UT2004, HelmzDeep. This, in turn, is a custom map based on the fictional keep of the same name.
Wow. That’s so many levels of plagiarism, it hurts my thinkey-cells.
12/06/2008 at 17:20 cyrenic says:
@Donald Duck
You win this thread.
12/06/2008 at 17:33 Erlam says:
Those guys are either long gone, or about to be so poor they can’t even be sued. This is just.. it made my day.
12/06/2008 at 17:34 tackle says:
When will this be made into a movie?
12/06/2008 at 17:36 Donald Duck says:
I won? I won? I won? Did I win? What did I win? If it’s not cake I don’t want it.
12/06/2008 at 17:40 Mike says:
Sorry I haven’t read all the comments so I may be repeating but someone else on another forum thinks they might have nicked the title of their game! This is insane, and easily the funniest news of the month…
http://bestbooksonthenet.amazonwebstore.com/Limbo-of-the-Lost-Revised-and/M/B000GE5320.htm?utm_campaign=froogle&utm_medium=organic&utm_source=froogle
12/06/2008 at 17:41 Paul Moloney says:
When I realized what Donald Duck did, Coke came out my nose (the fizzy sort).
Well done, sir.
In the Just Adventures forum, a reviewer of the game writes:
“this is amazing……….! i am completely dumbfounded……….
i have written a small text to add to my review of the game… i hope randy reads and approves it asap so it can go up right away ”
How. Did. She. Not. Notice?
I think this will all be great advertising for Wintermute, actually (I’m downloading it right now.) They could add the tag line “If these three losers can publish a game with it, anyone can!”.
P.
12/06/2008 at 17:46 Little Green Man says:
Oh god that is very, very stupid. You’ve got to wonder whether they just never thought that SOMEONE might notice. Utter stupidity.
12/06/2008 at 17:47 Talisker says:
Are these the same Steve Bovises?
http://www.kentmessenger.co.uk/paper/default.asp?article_id=9644&slide_id=1&newspage=2&searchkeyword=&searchpage=1
http://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/player.php?a=g&n=24257
If the poker guy has lost a lot of weight over the past three years, he could well be the guy in the middle of the article pic.
12/06/2008 at 17:48 James G says:
There is some fantastic irony on the LotL wikipedia page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limbo_of_the_Lost
If you look at the discussion, all the images have been flagged up as requiring ‘Fair use Rationale’
12/06/2008 at 17:50 rob says:
http://www.gameplasma.com/limbo_of_the_lost_or_oblivion/
Window seat, please.
12/06/2008 at 17:56 Gap Gen says:
Shall we all go on Amazon and plagiarise other reviews to post as reviews for this?
12/06/2008 at 18:03 Second says:
At this link you can find a preview of the original game – sadly not the one fluffy bunny has access to, but a few others :D
What a mind-boggling thing! What happened to the pub pals from Kent? :D
12/06/2008 at 18:04 Noc says:
I’ve a challenge for you folks, that involves a sneaking suspicion of mine:
See how many of these background images you can find on Google. Part of me is half-convinced that this HAS to be the result of someone building game content out of a Google Image search.
12/06/2008 at 18:10 fluffy bunny says:
Second & John: I can scan it later tonight. I’m not at home ATM.
12/06/2008 at 18:41 Frans Coehoorn says:
Limbo of the Lost, or LOL for short.
12/06/2008 at 18:56 terry says:
Winner of the award for “Least Convincing Vapourware” (after MMORPG Dawn (baby tossing catapults!) and DN Forever (George Broussard!), I can smell it.
12/06/2008 at 18:57 Forth says:
It’s not *stealing* per se, it’s…er…sampling and remixing. Obviously.
Next up – Lego Doom Raider, The Zelda Scrolls and Lula: The Deus Sexy Empire.
12/06/2008 at 19:03 fuggles says:
hehe… look at this! The game came out in Europe and the lead guy created a duplicate account to first praise the game and then to slap down someone on a forum, using himself as backup
http://www.gameboomers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=233736&fpart=1
He then went onto another website pretending to be his own daughter and saying how great the game is
http://justadventure.com/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1196172821/0
12/06/2008 at 19:06 John Walker says:
I love that this comment thread has become emblematic of the game. People who posted the comments first, quickly sue the people who repeated them!
12/06/2008 at 19:06 eyemessiah says:
Wow, crazier than Languatron!
Can anyone else hear the siege tank deploying (or undeploying?) just before the Tri-Syn logo?
12/06/2008 at 19:13 Optimaximal says:
I swear even the Majestic Games logo is stolen from some art book somewhere.
12/06/2008 at 19:15 Jerrot says:
Well, no, the Wintermute Engine Forum site was not hacked, we just are torn between laughing about so much stupidity and being worried about what “MAJESTIC STUDIOS” has done to the adventure scene and to other smaller developer teams, who do their best to create some game and have to fight hard for a publisher contract. We also welcome all those guests on the site, but it’s a pity that such a sad topic is the origin, which puts the engine into a light that it simply doesn’t deserve.
So – yes, we are having a little fun out of desperation. ;-)
No more to say, I’m still somewhere between speechless and angry and sad.
12/06/2008 at 19:24 Ryan Lodata says:
Nevermind
12/06/2008 at 19:25 Hermit says:
Pretty sure Optimaximal is spot on about the logo too. Funnily enough, we used to have an Amiga500, and a very similar tiger picture was included as one of the default/example pieces in an art program we got with it (The name of which I can’t recall, sadly). Maybe harking back to the roots of this little cowboy dev outfit? :p
Edit: In fact, looking at the image again I’m sure we had an artbook in one of our old art classrooms which had that image on the front cover. Again, can’t recall the name (Though it was a good ten years ago or so)
12/06/2008 at 19:51 fluffy bunny says:
OMG, that GameBoomers thread is insane! I mean, ignoring the fact that the developer is using a fake forum personality to back up his arguments, he is actually complaining that the reviewer, who completed the game, helped other people out when they were stuck. Yes.
(start reading on page four for the most interesting stuff)
Edit (priceless):
“I for one do not like stategy guides or hint books or walkthroughs as they do kill the gameplay created by the game no matter what the genre. In fact we as developers would turn down any offer from PRIMA GUIDES for a guide book even though it would create revenue for us.”
I wonder if Prima Guides ever got in touch with them? :-p
12/06/2008 at 19:52 John Walker says:
What’s more insane is the reviewer instructing people to “run not walk” to get the game.
12/06/2008 at 19:56 Someyoungguy says:
How do they get the models and animations to look so real?
12/06/2008 at 19:59 fluffy bunny says:
John: You should have the scans now, btw. I also found a preview in an issue of Amiga Action , but it’s not that good TBH, and there are already a couple of previews from other mags online. But if you want it let me know.
12/06/2008 at 20:05 Nimic says:
This is easily the funniest development in the history of that which has been developed.
12/06/2008 at 20:21 rei says:
This is amazing.
Call me naive, but I don’t think anyone can be stupid enough to think they would get away with something as blatant as that for very long. If they did this for money (why else?) they must’ve realized there would be economic repercussions. The only explanation I can think of is that they in fact used stolen identities and their only contact with the publisher was a prepaid mobile number and a P.O. box. They must’ve thought they’d milk the publisher for as much money as possible, and at the first sign of anyone figuring them out they’d split never to be heard from again.
I won’t be surprised if the next time we hear from these guys it’ll be the real owners of their identities.
(caveat: I didn’t feel like reading all 130 comments, so if someone already said the exact same thing please don’t sue me :()
12/06/2008 at 20:50 Indagator says:
My emotions have run the gamut on this one – disbelief that anyone would be that brazen/foolish, glee at the impending calamity they brought upon themselves with their blatant plagiarism and forum antics. And now I’m just sad. They’ve destroyed any chance of ever getting this game (or any other) published.
The thing that brought it home for me was the preview from 1995. This game has been in development for more than a decade. It might even be closer to 20 years, judging by the various interview comments. The developers spent something like a third of their lives trying to get this published, and now all that effort is gone.
It probably would have been a mildly competent adventure game and been popular enough in those circles, judging from the reviewer on the GameBoomers thread, if they’d just shelled out a little money for some starving student to whip up some textures for them. Instead, they over reached and it cost them everything, right at their moment of triumph.
It’s like a greek tragedy, hubris and all.
12/06/2008 at 21:01 Cooper says:
Anyone else smell a meme being fermented?
12/06/2008 at 21:08 RC-1290'Dreadnought' says:
One of the first posts developer(kit-basher) SBOVIS made on the Wintermute forum to recruit some people for his project contained this line: “Only serious people need apply.”
…
Right…
Well I guess he was serious about ripping stuff out of other games. I wonder if he got much success in recruiting new pirates.
12/06/2008 at 21:26 AbyssUK says:
on a certain site named after sea going plunderers there appears to be a Limbo.of.the.Lost.Bonus.DVD… now that must be funny
12/06/2008 at 21:33 Paul Moloney says:
I’m sure the God of Anti-Piracy would allow anyone to “procure” that, considering it merely a venial sin. In penance, buy 2 full-price games this month. Now go and sin no more, child.
P.
12/06/2008 at 21:44 Ian says:
Is there any truth to the rumor that the final boss is a turtle like dragon monster named “Bowser”?
12/06/2008 at 22:01 James says:
Ian: I’ll let you know, once I get past the final area:
http://comma8comma1.co.uk/tmp/lotl.jpg
12/06/2008 at 22:04 eyemessiah says:
Seriously, no one can hear the siege tank?
12/06/2008 at 22:16 Ubernutz says:
I just found out that these guys live in the same town as me, about 15 minutes walk away. I feel like getting some answers.
12/06/2008 at 22:22 Gap Gen says:
Actually, sharing sound effects is pretty common. Although usually they ask first, I’d guess.
12/06/2008 at 22:35 mooey poo says:
@Indagator:
“The developers spent something like a third of their lives trying to get this published, and now all that effort is gone.”
No, they probably spent a third of their lives taking drugs paid for by the advances for the game, then realised they ought to put something out.
Hopefully Duke Nuke ‘Em won’t be like this.
12/06/2008 at 23:03 changeling says:
this will seem really obscure, but in the making of video, i swear that anyone who’s read the Edge Chronicles might recognise the “Keep of Lost Souls” as one Sanctaphrax. they need to find some… *gasp* Individuality?
12/06/2008 at 23:34 Frymaster says:
“Actually, sharing sound effects is pretty common. Although usually they ask first, I’d guess”
Not so much that as everyone buys their sound effects from the same people. The noise familiar to many people as “door in doom shutting” or “demon in doom noticing you” appear EVERYWHERE. I seem to remember the effect in Magic Carpet when you sped up was the same as an Imp throwing a fireball at you in Doom, as well
12/06/2008 at 23:38 Nick says:
Yeah, you’ll regularly hear certain bear or horse sound effects in games and even TV/Films as well, I believe you can pay for general libraries of sounds and stuff.
12/06/2008 at 23:49 Cunning Stunt says:
I literally choked when I saw this article, christ this has to be the funniest thing I’ve seen all year!
What a trio of talentless bell-ends.
12/06/2008 at 23:50 sbs says:
This is just incredible
I can’t seem to stop laughing
This has to be true, it’s too good to be a lie. Nobody could come up with something like this even if they tried.
And even if – Thanks for the very good laugh
13/06/2008 at 00:18 Aya says:
Being the one that wrote the review for Just Adventure, I can assure you this is not a hoax! I have tried to register at NeoGAF to post some details about playing the game, but registration has to be manually validated! So I am waiting to get permission to post. Stay tuned over there if you are interested.
13/06/2008 at 00:51 malkav11 says:
What astounds me is this: if this is truly the same game being worked on by the same people as the Amiga one being previewed back in ’95….they clearly had an artist capable of doing original work then. It doesn’t look good to my modern eye, but I can’t imagine it was in vastly superior company back then. What happened to that? How do you go 13 years and then some on making a game, only to lazily plagiarize a bunch of graphics from other sources for the final release?
13/06/2008 at 00:59 Al3xand3r says:
None of them were into game development for years before attempting this again. One of them was actually working a pub. Go figure. I mean, come on, they used a freeware adventure game engine and created a game out of screenshots of other games. It sure doesn’t show any real dedication, just a bunch of older dudes looking to make a quick buck. They probably achieved it too. Just goes to show what kind of dumbfuck publishers rule this industry if they can fall for the bullshit talk of such an unlikely group and fund and actually release their game. It’s a good example of what the industry has degraded to. Someone with flashy talks and mock up screenshots can dazzle a publisher while people with a real vision rarely get the chance to realise it. Screw this. Yay for (REAL) independent developers.
13/06/2008 at 01:27 capital L says:
Honestly, I kinda want to play the original version of this game, some of the screen shots from the Amiga mags look boss. (I don’t know about the 20 minute “historical” intro video though…)
13/06/2008 at 01:33 Laurence says:
Check out the menu button (first screenshot of the zip file). They are exactly the same as Battle for Middle Earth.
http://pnmedia.gamespy.com/planetcnc.gamespy.com/features/reviews/bfme/mainmenu.jpg
13/06/2008 at 02:01 Andre says:
Tragic!
13/06/2008 at 02:19 Sucram says:
Maidstone! I’m surprised they even had Amiga’s.
13/06/2008 at 03:32 Muzman says:
We need a definitive expression for this particular ‘party dance’.
The Limbo of The Lost: An arhythm game where one tries to get over by bending over backwards to scrape the bottom of the barrel, with or without a sock puppet. (Yes, I can’t give a citation, but I just know I have to apologise to Yes Minister for most of that one)
To pull a Limbo Of the Lost: to scam in gross ignorance or underestimation of the All Seeing Internet and suffer subsequent mockery.
corrupt usage “There’s so much Limbo there I don’t know what hurts more, my sides or my spine”
13/06/2008 at 04:21 Zed says:
Am I the only one who thinks their protagonist did a chinplant in a chocolate cake?
13/06/2008 at 05:00 Vollgassen says:
Oh it’s going to be so sad and painful to see their dreams crushed to nothingness.
Where do you think they stole their logo from?
13/06/2008 at 07:37 Lukasz says:
@Laurance
now that’s just ridiculous….
Story of the year!
13/06/2008 at 09:47 Dinger says:
Majestic Fail.
No, the real story is a year from now, after their publishers get their pound of flesh from the poor guy, and the copyright holders finally stop laughing (really no benefit in suing, even if you can probly sue the whole pub as gavelkind heirs). Then some journalist with an eye to a feature heads up Kent-ways and gets the full and honest story of how exactly one does such a thing.
I was thinking Mr. Bovis might post that he’s shocked to hear what his artist has done, but the credits lay the blame pretty squarely on his shoulders. My guess is sheer stupidity. You’d be surprised how many cases of idiotic plagiarism go through the university: heck, people still turn in term papers with the IE-provided URL at the bottom of the page.
13/06/2008 at 11:01 Paul Moloney says:
Aya,
(1) How. Did. You. Not. Notice?
(2) How does a P.O.S like that game deserve a grade B review?
P.
13/06/2008 at 11:13 Jochen Scheisse says:
Looks like a Publisher con set up by a bunch of stoners.
13/06/2008 at 12:46 YogSo says:
Duncan:
But there aren’t “400-odd posts”, there are exactly 404 posts, or so it says his forum profile. As in 404 File Not Found, you know? Just a coincidence?
13/06/2008 at 13:24 batak says:
I got it.. just had to download it. My god, it is real… and it is bad.
13/06/2008 at 13:30 Aya says:
@Paul Moloney:
1. I did not notice simply because i have played none of the games it ripped off. 90% of the games I play are adventure games, and I play a few survival horror here and there and a lot of Kick Off 2! :)
1a. Majestic was clever enough to not rip any adventure games off. Trust me when I tell you that I would have picked it up if they ripped off even the most obscure of adventures, since I’ve played hundreds of them.
1b. Did you notice that NOBODY noticed even when screenshots and previews were posted? I posted sshots of the game when I wrote the preview for Just Adventure. Nobody noticed then. That is because the people who read JA, and other adventure sites, are mainly adventure gamers who rarely play games like Oblivion, or, even more, UT or Painkiller.
2. I review and judge adventure games based on their substance ONLY. My grades come from puzzles, characters, story and atmosphere (depending on the kind of adventure I am reviewing). I have mentioned that many times in my reviews. A game can LOOK like a pos, but if it scores high in the aforementioned areas, it will get a good grade (example, review of the indie game Other Worlds). LotL, as you will read in my review, was pretty decent as an adventure, and even though very unbalanced between chapters, for an adventure gamer (note: NOT for a gamer that may casually play an adventure) would be a fun experience to play. Adventure gamers are JA’s target audience.
2b. As you may have already noticed, I have added a disclaimer to my review and have changed the grade to F. Regardless of what the game is about, what they did is an absolute disgrace and they do not deserve one penny out of it. I do hope Tri Synergy (the publisher) don’t get too much damage out of this. Even though they should have been more careful, they certainly shouldn’t pay dearly for somebody else’s fraud.
13/06/2008 at 13:36 Cooper says:
Not sure if that magazine got scanned, but in the meantime:
http://hol.abime.net/4305
http://hol.abime.net/4305/screenshot
Scans:
http://amr.abime.net/review_35215
Could someone upload pages 32-33 of The One issue 81, please?
Check out the contents page here:
http://amr.abime.net/issue_364_pages
13/06/2008 at 13:49 fluffy bunny says:
“Could someone upload pages 32-33 of The One issue 81, please?”
Those were uploaded yesterday, and are linked to in this RPS post. Check the last edit.
13/06/2008 at 13:52 John Walker says:
And in fairness to Aya, a B on JA is the equivalent of minus eight hundred million percent elsewhere : )
13/06/2008 at 13:55 Cooper says:
Sorry, I didn’t notice that.
Anyone have any old copies of CD32 Gamer? Apparently one of their issues had a demo… I’ve done some hunting, and it’s not in issues 1-10…
http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=28161
13/06/2008 at 14:10 Chris Keegan says:
Here it gets a good review:
http://www.justadventure.com/reviews/LimboOfTheLost/LotL.shtm
Have i seen these guys before from somewhere?
http://www.kentonline.co.uk/images/paper/PD1403578_l.jpg
and dont say lock, stock and two smoking blah blah?
13/06/2008 at 14:11 Aya says:
@John & Paul: When it comes to grades, I honestly wish they didn’t exist. I do not want to grade games. People tend to focus on grades way more than they should. I believe that if a review is well written it can tell you if you will like the game or not, regardless if it gives an A or a D, since somebody’s A is somebody else’s D and vice versa.
13/06/2008 at 14:15 X-K says:
Hmmmm.
Two con-artists and Ricky Gervais in the middle…
Seriously though, I’m sure I’ve seen the guys either side of the middle one on programs about gangsters/criminals from the 80s/70s…
13/06/2008 at 14:15 John Walker says:
Chris, your comment had better have been a joke, or I’m firing you out of the comment canon.
13/06/2008 at 14:23 Chris Keegan says:
It sure was, i guess i forgot to put :p at the end of my sentence.
We need more rogue developers :p
13/06/2008 at 14:26 Paul Moloney says:
There does seem to be an awful lot of A and B score in the JA review list.
There’s a Dungeon of Shame listing 5 games which score F, but that seems a very low proportion of the overall number of games.
Also, the definition of “adventure game” seems a bit odd – BloodRayne is included, but no mention of “Vampire the Masquerade – Bloodlines”?
P.
13/06/2008 at 14:52 Aya says:
Just Adventure does review a few non-adventure games occasionally. Since 2004, when I started writing for the site, non-adventure games reviewed are marked with their proper genre, eg Action/Adventure, RPG etc. In their majority, those reviews are written under the adventure gamer’s pov, ie whether those games would have an appeal to somebody who mainly plays adventure games.
13/06/2008 at 15:02 Paul Moloney says:
“In their majority, those reviews are written under the adventure gamer’s pov, ie whether those games would have an appeal to somebody who mainly plays adventure games.”
Well, I guess my point is that a FPS/RPG V:MB, with lots of dialogue, interactivity, multiple plot lines, etc, would be far more suited to an adventure gamer than a linear button-masher like BloodRayne.
Haven’t played many adventure games, but I did pick up “Broken Sword” for my little GBA recently and really got into it; handhelds are a good platform for those old-style adventure games, I think. I’m tempted to pick up with a Nintendo DS or an an open-source GP2X so I can play the old Lucasarts games.
P.
P.
13/06/2008 at 15:17 Ryan Lodata says:
I completely support Aya on this. There are tons of adventure games out there that are deep and involving. Some people like physical puzzles and some like the kind in electronic form.
13/06/2008 at 15:28 Lukasz says:
but you guys gave Broken Sword II a grade ‘C’ Aya.
:)
do you still have the game? can a person who loves Oblivion play it? I want to see more rip offs screens.
13/06/2008 at 15:42 Aya says:
One thing that needs to be perfectly clear is that grades within JA (or any site for that matter) cannot be compared when given by different reviewers. So a C game by reviewer x and a B game by reviewer y don’t necessarily mean that you will like B more than C. One needs to, first of all, read the review text and, if a certain site is a site of preference, learn the reviewers’ likes and dislikes, and in that way you can eventually know if you would agree with a certain grade. Personally, I have favorite reviewers (within and outside JA) who I blindly trust, as well as “hated” reviewers with whom I disagree 99.9% of the time.
About non-adventure games, it’s true that one game may have more appealing aspects than another, but there is no certain guideline which is followed. So you do see reviews of Half Life 2 or Doom 3 on JA too, but may not see a certain survival horror game (survival horror, imo, is the closest an action genre comes to adventure).
13/06/2008 at 16:08 Dan says:
I love that this comment thread has become emblematic of the game. People who posted the comments first, quickly sue the people who repeated them!
(Sorry, somebody had to do it)
13/06/2008 at 16:25 AndrewC says:
Yes. John Walker 30 or so posts above.
13/06/2008 at 16:30 AndrewC says:
Unless that was a joke. In which case: dsfluasgdvmnkl;asd;niasdfvb
13/06/2008 at 19:15 Krono says:
I’m sorry Aya, but when JustAdventures gives Monkey Island 1 and 2 less than an A, you’ve got to think “do these people really know what makes a good adventure game?” And the answer has got to be an affirming “No, not now, not ever.”
13/06/2008 at 19:51 Noc says:
At first, it occurred to me that maybe we were being a little unfair. Not very much, but a little. Maybe the team simply didn’t have an artist, and the cobbling-together of other works was the result of a sort of “Make due with what we’ve got” collage. Which puts me more in the mind of “Unfeasible and misguided” than “Maliciously plagiaristic.” It made me wonder what the game would have ended up like if they’d actually known someone capable of putting together some proper artwork for it.
Then I read the GameBoomers thread and stopped worrying about it. Even (especially) if we’re looking at it as a personal project instead of a business venture, the whole “Backing yourself up with alternate accounts” thing is pretty slimy.
And Krono: I agree with the sentiment, but . . . seriously, that’s a pretty loose ball of mud to be slinging. It’s like saying “You don’t know what makes a good RPG because you thought that Planescape:Torment wasn’t the best thing ever.” Despite the fact that it did, you know, get off to something of a slow start and had clunky combat.
13/06/2008 at 20:06 Krono says:
Limbo of the Lost got a higher score than the Secret of Monkey Island. That’s like giving those crappy Kawasaki racing games a higher score than something like Burnout.
edit: And Planescape: Torment was the best thing ever. :P
13/06/2008 at 20:09 Gap Gen says:
Yeah, I mean if you sell something filled with stolen artwork you pretty much deserve to be sued. If it were just a free online project it might rate more favourably. I fail to see how anyone could think that bodily ripping stuff from other sources isn’t plagiarism, or at least anyone over 15.
13/06/2008 at 20:47 Noc says:
Krono: Remember the article like, two days ago on here about the problem with scores in game reviews?
Your response to this is EXACTLY the problem they’re talking about. And I agree with you, too: LoL looked, if nothing else, lazy, and the atrocious grammar from the previews (“Mankind are the one that creates evil on earth!”) doesn’t give me any confidence that the game itself, even if it wasn’t stitched together out of (I’m still suspecting) Google Searched screenshots is anything but mediocre. And Monkey Island had me laughing right up the point where I got stuck.
But . . . but but but, “You don’t know what you’re talking about because some other guy on the site you post at gave this other game a lower score” is a tremendously lazy judgment to make. And if you read the Monkey Island review, then you’d discover that it’s from the perspective of someone who doesn’t come to the table with a tremendous amount of patience for the genre. He uses the phrase “Third Person Inventory Click-fest,” even, which (while a little odd a take to find on JA) is a perfectly apt way to describe the game and a big part of the reason why I lost patience with it and tend to avoid similar games.
Aya clearly has neither this problem or this perspective. LoL still looks like shit to me, and I’d argue against his judgment if I’d actually played it and this was the place for such a discussion . . . but my point about the “Omg this other game got a lower score” argument still stands.
13/06/2008 at 21:03 Some Guy says:
It could simply be that they outsourced material to a 3rd party and this is what they got back. Maybe they assumed it was original and it simply was not. When outsourcing art you could run this risk.
13/06/2008 at 22:05 Krono says:
Read the reviews on JustAdventure, hardly any of them are professional, and mostly are opinionated, crap reviews. I seriously doubt anyone there has a degree in Journalism, which is a requirement in the REAL gaming press. And since they are a review community, it doesn’t matter who did the review, they’re represented as a whole. For example, if I’m complaining about a review Seanbaby gave in EGM, I don’t say “Seanbaby’s an idiot, he gave X a crap review, but gave piece of crap Y a 9 out of 10!” I say EGM, not Seanbaby.
13/06/2008 at 22:33 Aya says:
@Krono: You are right about what you are saying about a reviewer representing the site and not him/herself, and yes, it is what most ppl do – saying “EGM/JA/Gamespot/etc gave such and such grade” and not “reviewer x did”.
When it comes to older reviews (LONG before my time), I try to not criticize or judge when it comes to their content or their writer. But let’s just say that JA had a “different kind” of reviewers in general in the beginning. I have very often heard the example of the Monkey Island reviews. To tell you the truth, I have suggested some of the older reviews to be redone…
13/06/2008 at 22:53 Stumo says:
Could it be that in fact the guys who did the recent rip off are completely separate from the guys who did the one 10 years ago – i.e. they’ve just ripped off that history and title along with everything else?
14/06/2008 at 17:57 The Hammer says:
Maybe they’ve stolen their very identities too.
I’m really thinking that these guys musn’t have known that it’s generally considered a bit naughty to copy assets. Otherwise, how the hells did they have the idea?!
15/06/2008 at 05:13 Lukasz says:
LoL belongs to this obscure, low profile, adventure genre! They probably hoped that nobody will notice. Justadventure did not.
15/06/2008 at 22:25 John W says:
“I seriously doubt anyone there has a degree in Journalism, which is a requirement in the REAL gaming press.”
That’s utter nonsense. Of the four of us here, Alec has a journalism qualification. Kieron has a biology degree, Jim has philosophy degree, and mine is a BA Hons in Youth And Community Work & Applied Theology. First class!
I have issues with JA and the specialist adventure press. Richard Cobbett and I once spent many days discussing these on the excellent AdventureGamers forum (search it for my or Richard’s names). To sum it up, and to nab Richard’s line (which I’m sure I said once too), it’s like reading a battered wife defending her husband’s actions. “Adventure games don’t mean to push me down the stairs. They do it because they love me.”
However, there’s no call for personally bashing anyone, so please stop that.
Also, why aren’t I yellow today?
16/06/2008 at 00:05 Kaerb says:
The characters and monsters are copied from Lands of Lore games (the hounds and the goblin guy with the huge nose).
16/06/2008 at 10:06 Paul Moloney says:
“Adventure games don’t mean to push me down the stairs. They do it because they love me.”
Arf. I buy Retro Gamer mag for an occasional nostalgia trip. But there’s alway someone who, rather than enjoying the old games for what they are, try to insist that they’re _real_ games, not like all those crappy modern games we have now, with their millions of polygons and emergent gameplay.
I never got the point of the vast majority of adventure games – that is, combine multiple items illogically to solve an illogical puzzle.
Nostalgia – heroin for old people.
Is this the Adventure Gamer thread?
http://www.adventuregamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7922&highlight=cobbett
P.
16/06/2008 at 15:29 Paul Moloney says:
“Is this the Adventure Gamer thread?
http://www.adventuregamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7922&highlight=cobbett”
I’ve been reading that thread all morning; it’s hysterical. Sort of like John and Richard shouting into a cave somewhere in the Pacific: “You can come out now; the Allies have won!”.
P.
16/06/2008 at 19:42 gyiknhhh says:
i’d just like to say to meat circus that it’s not as if they didn’t think that anybody would notice, they finished as quickly as possible and vanished with investor money
17/06/2008 at 00:34 Springheel says:
In the “behind the scenes” video, I recognized at least 4 pencil sketches as being poor copies of late 80s/early 90s fantasy art, including the dragonlance one others mentioned.
17/06/2008 at 13:45 Hellfish says:
Maybe I’m grasping at straws here, but doesn’t the “Masu” sketch from the making-of preview remind anybody else of Darkman?
18/06/2008 at 03:03 ima rube says:
read the comments on the uk amazon site. its a joke, guys-and a pretty funny one, at that.
18/06/2008 at 11:10 Lukasz says:
haha. whoever wrote those comments deserves a prize. i loved them!
19/06/2008 at 15:45 Paul Moloney says:
I got mail from the Kent Messenger journalist responsible for the original Limbo of the Lost story to point to her followup:
http://www.kentmessenger.co.uk/news/default.asp?article_id=43527
P.
19/06/2008 at 16:13 Demikaze (Michael) says:
Even some of the original Amiga scenes were from other games… (scroll to the bottom of the page.
19/06/2008 at 16:47 AbyssUK says:
@Demikaze
Also they stole artwork from beetlejuice… my god
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=310683&page=14
19/06/2008 at 18:45 JuneFrog says:
This comment is intended to aya whose critics I usually praise but why being so not indulgent with people who steal some basic material from some more or less interesting games like oblivion or diablo while lol is a hell of a good game.
I had a hell of a good time playing it and I don’t think independant developers should be discouraged from doing great more or less legal artistic things (think about Andy Warhol for instance)
From my point of view a good game depends more on a spirit than technical and bloody copyright issues.
Long live to the developers of Limbo :)
19/06/2008 at 20:47 JuneFrog says:
By the way, I’m actually a friend of one of the scam arti… uh… ‘developers’ of this cop… err… game…
19/06/2008 at 21:12 Kieron Gillen says:
You should mail us a contact phone number for ‘em then. :)
(I’ve been nosing around for it on the quiet all week)
KG
20/06/2008 at 14:20 Marko Hautamäki says:
FREE TO PUBLISH
Composers announcement about Limbo of the Lost
June 20th 2008, in Berlin, Germany
Following the controversy currently revolving around Limbo of the Lost pc game, released by Majestic Studios, UK, I feel a comment from my part is necessary as this situation has all the potential to make irreversible damage to my name as composer and thus hinder my future career opportunities. Furthermore, I have seen my name mentioned in several internet discussion forums and there has been speculation about if the game contains stolen music but so far that has not been proven one way or another. Majestic Studios project leader Steve Bovis has assured me that there isn’t any stolen music in the game.
I composed all the game level background music you hear in the game itself, as well as most of the animated features included on the bonus DVD. My music was also used in many of the game trailers and features, easily found online. In addition to my music, there are also pieces not made by myself. On those I can not comment but I can 100% guarantee everything I was involved in and I have the original project files to prove that.
As a further proof, I uploaded some of the pieces on my demo site, accessible at http://chaosresearch.googlepages.com
I worked on the music for Limbo of the Lost game from May 2006 to December 2006 as an outsourcer, so I was never a part of Majestic Studios core team. I also don’t have any information regarding the specifics of the creation process of the game. The stolen graphical assets were as much a shock to me than to anyone else and I hope there will be some explanation to that from Majestic Studios. At the moment they are the only ones who know how or why this happened.
I am only credited for my music in the .pdf manual of the game.
Sincerely,
Marko Hautamäki, composer
###
21/06/2008 at 01:16 Matt Burris says:
The thing is, if any of these people involved outside of Majestic Studio actually PLAYED games, this never would’ve never been released or been a problem.
This is a sad state of the gaming industry, a large portion of them aren’t even gamers, but just greedy posers.
21/06/2008 at 03:48 Marcus Booster says:
I was laughing so hard I was crying. I tried to explain why this is so funny to my girlfriend which was impossible.
Everything is just so absolutely ridiculous I have to believe this is a joke. Either way it’s brilliant!
Geocities?!
21/06/2008 at 10:14 Larington says:
Hmm, this is the sort of thing that can happen when the visiting execs don’t actually play games, serves ‘em right, too.
23/06/2008 at 17:42 Robert Baker says:
Seen the box art? Even the hype (“Absolutely Brilliant!”) is stolen from CodeMasters. :-)
24/06/2008 at 04:50 Michael Panik says:
Wow. Can you saw Movie MAker? This is like the gayest crap ever. Like, I’m 15 and I could have done about 100x better on…everthing on this page, except the models. Those were professionally done, as we all know.
24/06/2008 at 20:28 Gavos says:
Heh Heh Heh. I can safely say that the game is real – I managed to purchase it, brand new , on Ebay a couple of months ago, and I got it really cheap too (under £9 incl postage). Seeing as it now seemingly hard to find, I am quite chuffed that I own this particular unique piece of gaming history! As to GAME selling it in the UK, not any more, it would seem – it is currently not available. Ho hum indeed!
27/06/2008 at 21:40 Chris says:
That character, Cranny Faggot, is pretty much identical to Blix, the goblin charged with killing the unicorns in the movie Legend, too.
27/06/2008 at 21:59 Jochen Scheisse says:
In other news: Warcraft Universe – An Astonishing Tale
25/07/2008 at 17:13 Joshua says:
This game even if it didnt take the screenshots from other games(which it clearly did) is the worst looking game in the world. this looks like a game from 1995 I am so angry that people like this are aloud to breath. What makes me most angry is in one of the scenes they stole it had a piture of Count Skingrad in it and they didnt even bother to take it out when they stole it…I mean c’mon.
26/07/2008 at 21:04 hermann says:
All this fuss is like a punch in all these crap reviewers. How this game got a good rate is beyond any sense. It’s not just for being a screenshot carbon copy. The game is horrible! Absurd puzzles, poor characters, confused storyline. I know adventure gamers don’t give a damn about graphics, but boy this game is so ugly and amateur.
21/09/2008 at 20:25 Dante Incarnate says:
After watching the Teaser Trailer. I got a couple more Games to Add to the List, Halo 3 is copied in the trailer at 1:49 and 1:45 is Incredibly Reminiscant of Fallout 1/2
03/01/2009 at 15:32 Max says:
That trailer is painful. Why did they have shots of walking around an actual 3d world when the game uses static backgrounds?
23/03/2009 at 22:21 Brickey says:
Hmmm..I beleive the part where thier website title pops up is the song from Jedi Outcast where Kyle Katarn dies. Cheers! You made me laugh!
28/03/2009 at 23:13 Newbunkle says:
I really miss this slow motion train wreck. I want to know what happens next. :(
23/05/2009 at 22:02 doh says:
June 1995 issue? WOW
Sometimes you just have to let go.