By Alec Meer on June 21st, 2008 at 12:18 pm.
This isn’t a rant for or against Team Fortress 2 Achievement servers. It’s a recounting of the bizarre/hilarious/terrifying experience I had on one of them – yes, my personal reactions to what I encountered do inevitably slip in, but mostly it’s a portrait of this unique facet of gaming subculture. Whether you agree or disagree with their existence, these beat-the-system servers are fascinating enough to be worth talking about.
“Were you beaten as a child?”
“FOR FUCKS SAKE DONT SHOOT THE FUCKIN ENGI”
“Scout need 2 kill scouts someone spawn scout”
“Retards ur all retards omg retards!!!!”
Having been away from the TF2 scene for a few months until very recently, I wasn’t previously aware of Achievement Servers. I heard about their existence come the release of the Pyro update, and the idea that there were legions of TF2 players grinding away like Lineage players on special maps for impatient unlock-hungerers was so curious that I had to see it for myself. As the sampling of chat-channel quotes above might imply, I wish I hadn’t.
The server I elected to play witness on was an odd, unsettling place. The tiny, custom map placed the red and blue spawn points right next to each other, removed the wait period between respawns, dropped a single capture point in the middle and placed intelligence briefcases at either end. A small pool of water was placed awkwardly in a corner, and health packs scattered in bizarre columns. No-one could ever win this map – it was set up to repeat forever.
From the narrow strip between the start points spawned a constant stream of Pyros – a silent, infinite army. Half the time, it wasn’t possible to escape this six foot starting area, as I’d be toasted into nothingness within milliseconds. Other players screamed time and again that those attacking each other were ‘retards’, oblivious or unconcerned that their unchecked use of this most stereotypical of Angry Internet Man insults made them even more detestable than those they lambasted. Perhaps these kill-crazed interlopers were simply childish troublemakers, but more likely they were chasing the 1m points of fire damage and 1000 kill Achievements.
Once I finally managed to sneak to a safe-ish corner, I couldn’t help but join the fray. There’d been no explanation as to how this server worked, and the only communication between players involved the word ‘retard’. So I presumed mega-death was the done thing here – certainly, that steady stream of disorientated spawnees were fish in a barrel, a Pyro’s wet dream. Stood next to a supply cupboard, with my health and ammo infinitely replenished, I spent a few minutes clocking up kill after kill after kill – forever twisting my TF2 stats. In TF2 proper I play a Heavy almost all the time, but my permanent record is now dominated by Pyro points. They’re just numbers, but they make me oddly sad – it’s as though someone’s stamped LIAR on my Steam page.
As TF2′s achievement system gives only the vaguest sense of progress towards its more long-winded, uber-grindy tasks, my interest and blood lust soon diminished. So my eye at last drifted to the bottom left of the screen, where I noted that I too was now a ‘retard.’ One player on the other team had taken a specific objection to me – a cursory check of the score screen revealed he was one of the six or seven players I was currently Dominating – and was unleashing a storm of horrific invective, predominantly about parental abuse he claimed I’d suffered. Tired of the senseless, joyless carnage, I tried to leave the starting strip to investigate the rest of the map, but he followed me, using his compressed air blast alt-fire to knock me off course, preventing me from reaching anywhere I wanted to go. During my attempts to escape I was killed a few times by other players, and every time Compressed Air Guy was waiting for me upon my respawn.
Meanwhile, a Heavy had spawned. The Pyros circled him excitedly, believing him there to help ‘em reach the MAKIN’ BACON Achievement (roast 50 Heavies). Instead, he let rip. Standing just far away enough from the spawn points to dodge the flames, his amazing cannon was able to shred any and every Pyro before they could get to him. No Pyro on the server was Achieving anything. The chat channel went mad. Fortunately, it did mean Compressed Air Guy finally stopped hounding me.
The banhammer eventually fell on the Heavy, and I took advantage of the brief lull in spawn-point genocide to finally slip into the rest of the small map. At last the nature of this place became clear to me. The map was designed specifically to make certain Achievements easier rather than simply to clock up the kills for the PYROMANCER and FIRECHIEF grinds, as the two or three dozen instant deaths I’d suffered I had initially implied. It was carefully designed as an obstacle course, not the infinite dance of death I’d been swept up in at the spawn point. That’s why there was such vitriol on the chat channels.
Gazing around, left more or less in peace now I was away from the fury of the spawn point, the rest of the place was like a series of surrealistic art installations. To the left, three Pyros forever danced around the capture point, gently roasting but never killing each other. Ding! CONTROLLED BURN.
To the right, a lone Heavy stood by the water’s edge, allowing a half-dozen Pyros to set him ablaze then leaping into the pool to extinguish himself. Then he’d haul himself out and the process would repeat. Burn, douse, burn, douse, burn, douse. Ding! BAPTISM BY FIRE.
Just ahead of me was a Spy, waiting. As I approached him, he coolly flicked his cigarette up from and back into his hand. I waited, unsure whether I should attack. “Come on then”, he said in Chat. I moved closer. He flicked again. This time I emptied my flamethrower onto him. Ding! GOT A LIGHT.
Beyond was a BLU Engineer, also surrounded by a throng of RED Pyros. Planted firmly next to a supply cabinet, he had infinite metal at his disposal. So he built and built tirelessly, seemingly unconcerned that each of his dispensers and turrets and teleporters were destroyed the second they appeared by the mute, masked horde. Ding! ARSONIST. As I watched, a further RED Pyro ran in, paused, then turned his flamethrower on the Engineer. As the helpful BLUman’s charred corpse slumped to the ground, the Chat channel again erupted in outrage.
We waited a while, but the Engineer didn’t return. Who could blame him? The other Pyros said nothing, but I could sense their disappointment. So I changed team, picked Engineer and stepped into the fallen man’s shoes. I built and I built and I built, all of it turned to rubble the second I created it. Sisyphus in a hardhat. I felt slightly pleased to be helping, though no-one thanked me – as I hadn’t thanked those that had assisted me. This was not a place of etiquette. Some 70 or 80 destroyed Teleporters in, I had a moment of horrible self-awareness about exactly what it was I was doing. I had to stop.
And so I climbed back into my red Pyro overalls and continued, reaching the map’s last bizarre setpiece – a concrete bridge atop which were health and ammo packs. A single BLU soldier was beneath it, and I joined a small queue of three or four RED Pyros waiting in front of him. The Soldier looked down at the ground, jumped and fired a rocket. As he sailed smartly into the stratosphere, the first Pyro in the queue let off a jet of flame. Ding! PILOT LIGHT. The Soldier landed neatly on the bridge, replenishedhis health and ammo and was just embarking on his next rocket jump when a sudden shotgun blast from behind me disrupted his manoeuvre. As one, we Pyros turned to look. As we did so, an axe-weilding newcomer charged past me and duly dispatched the poor jarhead. Ding! LUMBERJACK. Good for him. Bad for the waiting Pilot Lighters. Once again, there was much wailing, gnashing of teeth and bellowing of ‘retard.’
By now, I’d ‘earned’ 14 Achievements – enough to unlock the Flare Gun. Woo? I didn’t feel good about it. It wasn’t that I felt like I’d cheated. I was sad because I was not in a place where a team-mate would congratulate me for achieving the unlock – on this server, I was just one more feckless dope grinding away. I didn’t feel good that, though fun in concept, the current nature of the Achievement system seemed to make so many people want/need to shortcut it this horrible, artificial way. And I felt slightly sick at humanity, or at least more so than usual – this server promised altruism, a perfect barter system where good-natured strangers would help each other attain these hallowed Achievements. Instead, it was a mess of self-interest, abuse and griefing. (I’ve since been informed that other Achievement servers are more amiable places, but still – I’m sticking to TF2 vanilla myself). I took one more look at the endless slaughter by the spawn point and logged off, just one achievement shy of the Backburner.
I sated my curiosity, but I’ll never do it again. It’s even made me briefly wish TF2 had never introduced unlocks. I know the Achievement servers weren’t part of Valve’s plan. I know that some people genuinely see them as necessary and even enjoy them. I know that most servers are entirely free from the horrific attitudes I encountered. I know that it’ll all calm down in a little bit when everyone who wants the unlocks has got them. But, to me, the game currently seems grubbier and sadder for this mass obsession with statistics, and I’ll be glad when it’s died down. Yeah, I’ve got my Flare Gun, and it’s certainly a fun toy that expands the possibilities of the game, but I don’t want it. I’m going back to my Heavy. My pure, untainted Heavy – just a big man with a big gun. That’s what I play TF2 for.
21/06/2008 at 12:25 Butler` says:
I couldn’t agree more. I too have just returned to TF2 for the first time in… well, nearly since release.
There again, it could be worse – at least they aren’t adversly effecting my play as such.
21/06/2008 at 12:29 Optimaximal says:
I had an almost similar experience last night – I haven’t bothered with TF2 since before the Medic unlock as I wanted that too cool off.
Due to the free weekend/unlock rush, my TF2 browser was showing barely 30 servers (after all, why bother not filtering the full/HPB/non-VAC ones?) and most of those were these unlock/achievement ‘DM’ servers… and what a pointless crapshoot they are.
The TF2 game dynamic is so heavily geared to teamplay/goal-based gameplay, DM’ing is just poor – the limited weaponry just makes it so damn boring, especially when everyone is a Pyro.
21/06/2008 at 12:29 CrashT says:
What makes me feel worse, is that there are plenty of people ready and willing to defend such servers.
21/06/2008 at 12:32 roBurky says:
I think it was the medic achievements that drove people to do this sort of thing. The pyro achievements are all easily obtained just by playing pyro for a while, but the achievement farming is now habit for people.
Someone who wants the axtinguisher has absolutely no need for the lighting a taunting spy achievement, or the OMGWTFBBQ, and so on, as those are the ones that were left to be actual achievements, not necessary for anything, just there to show off if the opportunity ever arises for you. But after the meidc achievements, lots of people are now in the mindset that they have to get all of the achievements as quickly as possible.
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21/06/2008 at 12:33 Chris Evans says:
What a shame.
Last night I got a whole bunch of people on my friends list to jump on an empty server with me. All I wanted was the achievement whereby you play with 7 friends.
That done the other proceeded to embark on a period of Achievement Whoring. While myself and DuBBle persevered for a bit as pawns in their games we eventually tired and moved elsewhere with Seniath.
Soon we were joined by other members of the RPS Steam Chat and had a jolly old time of TF2 with lots of beer and lots of fun.
Towards the end of the evening we made a move back to the original server where a few of my other friends still remained. From then on we all played properly. Until Hydro that is.
On Hydro us members of [WAS] launched a startling series of counter-attacks against the Red team. Three medics all healing each other at the same time. Three spies disguised as the enemy.
That was fun. Great fun.
Your experience Alec. What a shame.
21/06/2008 at 12:42 Gap Gen says:
Yeah, I’m not sure about the flare gun. I guess it changes the gameplay and makes it more interesting, but being sniped by pyros isn’t that fun.
Good article, though.
21/06/2008 at 12:42 Lacero says:
When I saw the title I thought this was going to be about how 9 pyros and one spy on a team achieve absolutely nothing.
Thankfully it seems to be calming down a bit now. To five pyros per team.
21/06/2008 at 12:47 CRYOGENiC says:
My friend went on one of these servers. I haven’t let him here the end of it. I feel cheated. They should just open up all unlocks if this shit is happening. Love the game btw.
21/06/2008 at 12:47 turban_man says:
I hate achievement servers
21/06/2008 at 12:48 The Hammer says:
Oh, the night the pack came out, I had a load of homophobic insults shouted at me from various players because I joined a perfectly normal server, without a tag that said it was focused on achievements, and proceeded to play normally as a Demoman, capturing points and killing enemies.
They then left the server, leaving four guys still on. I disconnected soon after.
But, you know, FFS, play the game.
21/06/2008 at 12:50 Cigol says:
Thoroughly enjoyed reading that :)
21/06/2008 at 12:52 Jaxtrasi says:
I’m absolutely amazed that achievement progress isn’t restricted to standard public servers running official maps. Can you acquire Ep 2 achievements by modding the rocket map to add the gnome just outside the rocket? Why should you be able to do it with an online game?
21/06/2008 at 12:52 Kast says:
The night of the update, I was on my regular server – everyone grinding away. It was actually (for the most part) very polite and friendly, everyone taking their turn to be the spy or the soldier, and everyone thanking each other for the trouble.
I ‘worked’ my way up to get the flare gun and decided that was enough, I can get the rest by myself. Perhaps not entirely out of a sense of good sportsmanship, but that some gentlemen with all three unlocks was running around shoving it in people’s face. Yes, very nice, you’ve got the axtinguisher. Now give us chaps the chance to get it ourselves, will you?
21/06/2008 at 13:01 Seniath says:
First server I joined on the launch night was 2fort. Seeing the mass of Pyros, I went Demo. And got told off. They were, at least, polite about the whole affair, no insults and such.
Still, yes, the whole achievement system in its current state is a bit silly. Great idea in theory, just not in practice. It’s like those stories of people playing Avatar just for the gamer points.
21/06/2008 at 13:06 CrashT says:
I think the worse thing is that this is a Free Weekend, so anybody deciding to try out TF2 this weekend is going to get an experience that not representative of TF2 at all.
21/06/2008 at 13:06 sigma83 says:
whereas I had a very pleasant experience as some chap I had never met before helped me (and conversely me him) get our axtinguishers together on an empty server. Much discussion of whose turn it was, how close we were, etc. Very positive experience.
21/06/2008 at 13:12 Rev says:
I’m just going to see if I got this right.
You joined an achievement server. You somehow felt that arbitrary numbers defined you in any way. And then you proceeded to mope about achievements just because there are such things as achievement servers. Is that right?
For all your ranting on immaturity maybe you should take a look at what it really means to be mature. But then hey what do I know right? Achievements are just little fun add ons, and if you want to farm them or earn them the hard way, more power to you.
I am however hoping that Steam continues this whole system of not needing to unlock every single insane achievement to allow the use of all the new weapons.
CrashT: No, I’d say this weekend will be pretty representative of the game. You know, seeing as it’s the game :V
21/06/2008 at 13:14 Jay says:
I’m quite happy with the situation at the moment (only on normal maps – I hate MMORPGs for grinding, and by God I’m going to avoid it here) – on normal maps, there’s never been a better time to be engineer or demoman
21/06/2008 at 13:14 KindredPhantom says:
I’ll openly admit that half of my medic achievements i got farming on such servers.
Most of the achievement servers are like that, uncontrolled DM. When i was farming i found a nice little server with a few like-minded people which had an admin on most of the time. Even then it was prone to some idiots that seemed to come just to troll, players who had already unlocked all the weapons; had come to just ruin it for everyone else.
On one achievement server which gave you instant 1 million health points healed, i ruined my stats by getting “Most damage” 119,209,149 as Soldier, something which despite my numerous attempts to remove by using the reset stats console command i cannot remove. It is a very obvious mark telling anyone who would read my stats that i cheated at some point, it feels like a blot on a perfectly clean stat sheet. One which i hope i will have the chance to remove one day if i am allowed the option of resetting my stats.
With the pyro achievements i have decided to get them all through normal play, on non achievement farming servers. I hoped the fact that you don’t have to get all the achievements to unlock the weapons and that most of them are fairly reasonable would mean that people would not need to go to the extent of playing on achievement farming servers.
I enjoyed this article it sums up the achievement farming servers quite well and also the sort of players and gameplay that it attracts.
21/06/2008 at 13:15 Commando says:
Achievement servers weren’t part of Valve’s plan?
Achievements are such a poor design decision for tying to unlocks, I don’t see how they skip the blame. What do they expect to happen? You are going to get a ton of people playing pyros trying to get achievements just on regular servers. Everytime they add stuff to a class it’s going to shit on the game for a few weeks by encouraging everyone into trying to achieve arbitary goals instead of just playing the game properly.
Good luck getting in a regular game of TF2 for the next month. Repeat this seven more times for the next year.
21/06/2008 at 13:17 Rev says:
Commando:
Yeah, how dare they want to try things out and have “fun”. Curse you Valve!
21/06/2008 at 13:20 CrashT says:
Rev:
The game as it’s being play but a lot of people right now has very little in common with what it was like just a week ago (Or what it will probably be like a week from now).
I’ve quit playing TF2 for the next few days as servers full of Pyros and people screaming for help getting Achievements is not what got me into playing TF2. If it’s put somebody who’s already a fan off, I don’t think it’s going to do much to encourage new people to play the game, or at least not the type of players who would actually enjoy TF2 as it usually it.
If you want to farm Achievements fine, but keep it to the Achievement servers there are plenty of them. The problem is a lot of people aren’t doing that, and it’s starting to disrupt the play experience for others. I don’t want to fuck with their experience so I stay off Achievement Servers, and I don’t want them to fuck with mine either, so they should stay off standard servers.
21/06/2008 at 13:24 Jay says:
You should see the TF2 forums on the Steam website. What a bunch of ****s
21/06/2008 at 13:26 John P (Katsumoto) says:
Rev – you think its fun for everyone to play the same class and act like homophobic 12 year old american halo kids swearing at anyone who isn’t helping them and not actually, you know, playing the game? I don’t see it.
21/06/2008 at 13:30 Heliocentric says:
Steam have crippled the playstyle of TF2 just to keep up with the likes of CoD4. Sure in CoD4 the unlocked guns are better, but i can kill people with any of those starting guns, they all perform in fundementally the same way, but in TF2 every piece of equipment is (shotguns aside) unique. I’ll never unlock the medic achievements, and not because i dont play medic, just because i’ll never “achieve” the stupid things they asked for, sure they turned it down for the Pryo but i wish it would just be “look free guns”.
Another game with “fundemental” unlocks is Battlefield 2142, BF2 had a few guns which were cool, but no one of those unlocks gave you a real edge. But in 2142 grenades, C4 scanners, stealth cloaks and all manner of other things are unavailble to starting players. Deployable turrets, bullet shields, even the shock paddles intrinsic to the medic (now assault in 2142) are an unlock. I recently got 2142 (£15 in HMV) but i’m not sure if i’ll ever get into it. Without the unlocks i’m crippled, and with the unlocks every person i kill will be tainted with the guilt of “i had an unfair advantage).
I felt great when i took out 20 people who likely had all maner of unlocks in just 3 lives in my first game though, i guess I just perfer being a “have not”.
21/06/2008 at 13:30 MarvintheParanoidAndroid says:
Within the space of about 20 minutes, on a locked server with some friends, I had my Axtinguisher. I won’t try and defend myself (having been on public achievement servers during the medic pack, I completely know how terrible it is), but frankly, I just want to have the new toys to play with without being forced to annoy other players by completing random, arbitrary tasks.
When I finally get my Ubersaw, through getting the rest of my 1 million total heal points, that will be a proper achievement. Causing a dominated player to leave the server? Killing someone with a taunt? Not an achievement.
21/06/2008 at 13:31 Kadayi says:
I think Valve went about this completely the wrong way in releasing achievements on a class by class basis. Instead they should be releasing across the board achievements for all classes, but in small doses (like 2-4 each), that way people would be far more likely to play the game to achieve them rather than resort to these kind of tactics, esp the point damage ones.
21/06/2008 at 13:32 Rev says:
CrashT:
You make it sound like it’s a publicly accessible multiplayer game or something.
Kadayi: Yeah, that would probably have been the way to go, that way everyone just gets to hop on whatever class they like and have at in in a match.
21/06/2008 at 13:32 A-Scale says:
I thought this article was going to be about the Pyro achievements being locked due to a Steam error. From Thursday night to Friday morning I was unable to gain a single point towards any achievement, save for Pyromancer (1m burn points). This was terribly frustrating, as I would be much closer to my sweet new weapons had the achievement system been functional. I’ve heard tell that Valve may have fixed the issue already, but I cannot confirm.
21/06/2008 at 13:34 KindredPhantom says:
Some of the achievements are still a little broke.
21/06/2008 at 13:35 Alec Meer says:
It will settle down, though. I have faith in that. Yeah, it’s gonna happen seven more times or whatever, but each time it’ll only last a little while. So long as the unlocks don’t grant dramatic boons to players who get ‘em I’m fine with the concept. The practice… well, not so convinced yet (I took one look at the Medic achievement list and decided there and then I’d never bother chasing the unlocks), but quite clearly Valve are honing the system and hopefully the next set of achievements will be even more broadly accessible.
And Rev, I visited the achievement server out of journalistic interest in a weird facet of gaming culture, rather than a personal desire for fast unlocks.
21/06/2008 at 13:36 Gnome69 says:
I went into one of those servers. 10 guys, and it was very organized. ppl were helping eachother not only winning achievements but understanding the game and best tricks with the diferent weapons of most classes. (i spent 10 minutes teaching someone how to rocket jump properly). It was like “heaven” among all the achievement servers. i made some good friends on that server that i play with now on a regular basis (i even recruited some for my clan) so not all servers are bad. and the chat, instead of a continuous streaming of “retard” was a stream of “congrats” “cool” and “what you guys need?”
the new weapons shouldn’t need to be unlocked. there will allways be achievement server if we have to do the achievements to get the weapons. instead of unlocking weapons the achievements could be used to unlock other things. like special nickname effect, special taunts, maybe wapons with a diferent look but with the same stats.
21/06/2008 at 13:37 monchberter says:
Haha, personally it’s definitely more than a bit of a noob fest this weekend and as i only play on ‘reputable’ servers it’s really not made much of a difference. Apart from maybe waiting for more than 2-3 players to join the server, you’d just help each other get the more idiosyncratic achievements, like the mostly OTT ‘Clearcutter’ (6 axe kills) or the taunt kill one, but to be honest i’m sure most people got that outside of normal play just to see how it actually worked!
I’m a bit annoyed at the grinding achievements, mainly as i haven’t even got my second medic unlock by playing normally yet, and Medic and Pyro always have been my classes of choice. I don;t suppose i’ll ever get unlocks for the Spy or Demoman as i rarely play them.
If Valve’s intention was to make some weapons rarer, and therefore the players that wield them more of a prized asset to a team, then with all the achievement grinding going on, sorting the ‘wheat from the chaff’ (good players over grinders) will not be any easier.
21/06/2008 at 13:39 dartt says:
What a shame.
I’ve had quite a different experience. Rather than getting annoyed by the hordes of Pyros waddling around the servers I’ve taken it as an oppurtunity to experience the game in a completely different way. The much larger percentage of players as pyros makes all kinds of new tactics viable: building sentry guns right out in the open where usually they’d be quickly destroyed by soldiers and demomen, the effectiveness of HWG+Medic combos is massively enhanced against a team with no snipers, soldiers, spies or demomen.
In a week or so it will all be back to normal (not a bad thing, just a different thing), until then I’m just going to revel in the chaos of it all, oh, and work on those medic achievements!
21/06/2008 at 13:40 CrashT says:
Rev:
“You make it sound like it’s a publicly accessible multiplayer game or something.”
And you’re saying it isn’t? Especially since this is a Free Weekend, which was my point.
Team Fortress 2 is one of the most accessible multi-player games I’ve ever tried. It’s the reason I got back into playing multi-player after years (Prior to TF2 the only MP game I really played was Return to Castle Wolfenstein and that was before Enemy Territory).
21/06/2008 at 13:45 Matt says:
It’s fun to grief on those servers. Slapping down a turret and ripping everyone to shreds is hilarious.
21/06/2008 at 13:48 Guido says:
Valve should regularly go through those achievement servers, and mark everybody they see there that was on for longer than maybe 10 minutes with a non-removable, red and blinking sign on their Steam page.
I might not have unlocked a single one of the Pyro unlocks, nor the Medic unlocks for that matter. But I’d never go and cheat like that on achievement servers. If I want to cheat, I do it in a single player game; cheating in multi player games is despicable and just low.
That includes people who “feel dirty” after, or during, the fact.
21/06/2008 at 13:59 Mman says:
As others said, the worse part is that some of the achievements were broke at first; I went on one of these servers for “Got a Light” (the only one I “farmed”, as it involves ridiculous circumstances that never happen in normal games) and spent about twenty minutes (thanks to the stuff mentioned in this article) trying to burn a helpful spy at various moments in his taunt animation, and it never worked, so I took it a step further and just used an unlocker instead. Hopefully the recent patch fixes those issues though.
21/06/2008 at 14:00 SuperNashwan says:
I think everyone apart from the players themselves have learnt from the first set of unlocks; the new achievements are much more sensible and the few funny-but-hard ones aren’t necessary to get the new toys. GTFO have added a class limit mod to all their servers so there’s only four pyros at a time and other than the sickening damage buff for the pyro, the game is much as it normally is as far as I’m concerned. Would be nice if Valve could hurry up and fix the latest bugged achievements though, I’ve got a bunch that aren’t working and I want my toys (from regular play).
21/06/2008 at 14:02 Arnulf says:
That just made me really laugh out loud.
21/06/2008 at 14:02 Kieron Gillen says:
To go against the flow, I’ve kind of enjoyed it in the way darrt expresses. Masses of Pyros changes the game significantly, and the tactics which work or don’t. It’s not the same game, but… well, a game’s never the same game. Achievement chasing kills the game, obviously, but in the same way – say – a Scout rush can be entertaining, a Pyro mob enlivens things a little.
It’s also the first time I’ve played Pyro significantly, and the changes have kind of introduced me to the class, and I’ve discovered I kinda like it. Which is interesting – the Class-by-class thing is a chance to almost force people into trying other stuff. I suspect the first time I’ll ever play the Sniper – I’m still at 0:00 for him – will be the Sniper pack.
KG
21/06/2008 at 14:13 Mman says:
Despite the hordes (which will die down pretty soon), it’s nice to see the Pyro finally viable; he (she?) was my favorite class in concept but he was underpowered compared to almost everything else before so I had to resort to others. Now he’s brought up to speed (of course, it too early to tell how far things go, and whether it’s too much), I finally get to enjoy truly causing havoc as one.
21/06/2008 at 14:14 Commando says:
Those are good points. I’m just annoyed with how you can’t escape it with everyone playing deathmatch in the middle of the map.
At least the spy update will be hilarious.
21/06/2008 at 14:16 Snarf says:
I always play the pyro, and yes the first few maps after the update were really fun. Watching 15 pyros running towards me was a daunting thing indeed. As of last night the regular servers i play on had started to normalise a little. Yes there were a couple more pyros than normal, but we had the usual spread apart from that.
21/06/2008 at 14:22 PfcBenjamin says:
I was admin on an achievement server last night. I ran a tight ship. Nobody was allowed to do anything without another player’s consent. I encouraged people to group up to get one achievement at a time and take turns. When I saw someone get Milestone 3 I told them to stop trying to get more achievements and help out or leave.
At one point we got this huge influx of players that didn’t know how serious I was. It was nothing but pointless killing in the spawn. I asked them to chill. I told them to chill. I told them to be quiet. I then force taunted them for about a minute.
New kid: “Why are we all taunting?”
Kid who had been there a while: “Because you’re all acting like idiots.”
They all calmed down after that.
21/06/2008 at 14:24 Daniel Rutter says:
You know what this reminds me of?
Grant Stoddard’s sex doll review.
That’s what this reminds me of.
21/06/2008 at 14:25 Riotpoll says:
I wish they’d made the backburner the first weapon to unlock, as it’s so similar to the old pyro flamethrower. On achievements servers it’s so funny going as a heavy and butchering those mindless little chaps running around burning each other, and hearing their cries of abuse. Yes, I am a mean-spirited man.
21/06/2008 at 14:35 Andrew says:
Interesting article – I’ve never joined one of those servers before. I need to get the medic achivements myself, most of which are of the type “typically impossible to get on a random server unless you are online with friends”.
Maybe I should hit one of these places and trade pyro achievements (which I care little for) to get my medic ones. Maybe I should just go on some servers with RPS-group people and ask them for help ;)
But in any case, leave them to it, at least these achievement servers are out of the way. Clan people do it more privately, at least Valve didn’t make it necessary to get 100% of them for the weapons. There will always be people doing this, and while the free weekends might be mucked up I’m happy to have brief spats of rubbish for continual game improvements.
21/06/2008 at 14:42 Mickiscoole says:
I usually play as pyro, however this weekend I’ve decided to learn how to be a medic.
The fact that there are more than 2-3 pyros on a server absolutely ruins my usual play style – less people get set alight, everyone is expecting an ambush from a pyro etc.
I achievement farmed one or two weird achievements for medic, such as the one where you save a person from falling to their death, but that wasn’t on an organised server, that was a few friends of mine just mucking about on an empty server until some other guys rocked up.
I will be getting all of the pyro achievements during normal play, I probably would have enough of them to get the second weapon by now if the achievements were retroactive, but I won’t be for at least another week so that I can go back to playing the same way I was before.
21/06/2008 at 14:43 FFD says:
I wish they’d just go the whole way and have a pyro-only server option. It gets old fast but it’s great for a change.
21/06/2008 at 14:45 Top Man says:
The unlockables are, in my opinion, a stupid idea, but me and 5 friends had a blast goofing off in a passworded server gettign achievements.
21/06/2008 at 14:51 Blobber says:
you have to agree that most of the achievements take ages to get and in the meantime everyone else will use weapons that you want but you dont have yet because you want to play “legit”. That’s BS. The weapons should be available for everyone and not unlocked by achievements. this is not WOW, a grinding game, this is a multiplayer online FPS, the best online FPS around.
21/06/2008 at 14:52 gulag says:
I agree with Keiron. Since the medic update, I’ve played a whole lot of a class I otherwise wouldn’t have had any time for, and as a result I’ve not only found an appreciation for it, I’ve also gotten a 100% better at playing a Medic.
21/06/2008 at 15:09 Doug F says:
I felt slightly guilty when I used an achievement manager program to give myself the weapon unlocking milestones. Now that I’ve read this, I feel a lot better about it – I am still able to earn the acheivements honestly, but didn’t have to jump through hoops for the unlocks.
21/06/2008 at 15:13 wikkiwikkiwildwildwest says:
Reminded me of when the Preacher in Nathan Barley ahem, bashes off other straight men in pub toilets for an article in SugarApe magazine . . . only this is seedier obviously
21/06/2008 at 15:14 Pod says:
Your article made the servers sound like some kind of sleazy opium den – people just getting on with taking their fix, silently passing round the tools, etc.
Personally, I played TF2 today for the first time in months. I never played during the medic pack thingy so I had no idea how hard some of those achievments are (I appear to have a few as well, I assume they are the original ones?). Anyway, I was a bit miffed because I usually just paly Pyro or Scout, a quick look at my stats page will show that, but today I had to be all the other roles because of the excessive pyro-spam going on.
I was also massivey confused by the ‘new’ maps. “Well is now CTF?! What the crap!?!”. Still, I was playing on “decent” servers so I had a mostly normal game.
An additional point about what it’s like coming back to TF2 after so long: I found it hard to play a normal game. And I’m not talking about all the pyros. I ment to all the silly maps and 2fort online servers that I had to avoid. I used to be an avid TFCer, so I’m ‘used’ to all this, but I think World In Conflicts “PLAY NOW!!!” button and having most server being “approved” of has kind of tained me. I just wanted to play vanilla TF2, no stupid server mods or anything, but I had no idea how to go about doing it. Even the usually reliable multiplay/wireplay servers were dedicated to being weird things with custom configs. Bah, I say.
21/06/2008 at 15:17 anon says:
“At last the nature of this place became clear to me. The map was designed specifically to make certain Achievements easier.”
No shit?
“And I felt slightly sick at humanity”
Jesus fucking Christ, its a game, if you want to be sickened, go look at Iraq or Africa or anywhere worse off.
Oh and you ARE [someone who had not been previously informed of the rules of the server], you went in to a server designed for a specific purpose, and fucked it up for all those who were there. If you don’t condone grinding, DON’T FUCKING JOIN, or your no better than a run of the mill greifer.
21/06/2008 at 15:31 James says:
Friday night was pretty bad with masses of pyros on normal servers, but tonight (.au time) it’s mostly back to normal. I’m playing mostly medic right now, since I haven’t seriously played since the first month TF2 came out.
21/06/2008 at 15:31 Mike says:
I saw the achievement servers but haven’t gone on yet. I mean, their more like the anti-achieving servers! So far, Ive unlocked 14 without cheating which I pretty pleased with.
21/06/2008 at 15:32 xenothaulus says:
What disappoints me most about the Pyro update is that I’m no longer “unique” and feel forced to play a different class until the mania dies down a bit. I previously played a Pyro almost exclusively (I dabbled in Demoman and Engineer a few times too) and was usually ridiculed (or off-handedly lauded) by my teammates. Frequently I was the only Pyro on *either* side, and I considered my job to be the shocktroop, to not care how many times I died, or what my kill count was- when people see a Pyro, they freak and go “Kill it kill it!” And while fire’s focused on me, my teammates can pick people off, grab briefcases, etc. I’m a distraction.
Now though, *everyone* is a Pyro, and I’m just another gas mask. Consequently, my playtime for the other classes has been steadily rising, and I’ve found out that being a Heavy with a smart medic is really fun, and other than achievement servers, there’s been no better time to get your Medic achievements, and I’ve discovered the joys of “rocket-sniping” with the Soldier. So this update has gotten me to try new classes too, just in the opposite way as it has for apparently everyone else.
21/06/2008 at 15:34 LQB says:
The whole concept of get ‘x’ number of achievements to unlock ‘y’ weapon is a poor idea to begin with. If anything, the weapons should be unlocked from the get go with the achievements being just bonus stuff for the true Pyros, OR you have it based on play time, 5hrs played as whatever class yields the first unlock, 10hrs for the second, and 15hrs for the 3rd.
However on the topic of achievements boxes…who gives a shit? I find it more abhorrent that people get into such a rage over game unlocks that they go so far as to say those kinds of servers should be blacklisted, and the players in them VAC-banned.
Everyone needs to just leave everyone else alone; if you don’t like farming achievements, well good for you, it doesn’t make you any better or worse than someone who justs wants to play with some news guns.
EDIT: Also, for fucks sake, it’s NOT cheating. Cheating would mean someones breaking game mechanics to give themselves an unfair advantage over everyone else, and last time I checked sitting around wasting your time in an achievement box isn’t cheating.
EDIT-2: I’ll say one last thing, if achievement farmers make you sad, than the way people as a whole treat achievements should make you suicidal. The weirdos who see themselves as better human-beings because they earned their fake accolades “naturally”, and the people who want to feel “special” because they got the unlocks first, so when they find out about people teaming up to unlock weapons they scream bloody murder and demand VAC-bans.
21/06/2008 at 15:42 Penelope says:
To the people complaining about how ordinary servers full of people going for achievements is annoying – have you really looked at the achievement list? They’re very clearly designed to encourage people to do things that make for a fun play experience, and to introduce people to all the things that make Pyro a fun class in normal gameplay.
My experience since the update’s been much different. Last night I played hours on a team that was about 2/3 Pyros most of the time – not because we were achievement grinding in any really organized way, but because we were enjoying it that much. When we lost because there were no long-range or support classes, we’d all just laugh and shout “You know what our problem is? Not enough Pyros!” and when we won, it was all the sweeter because we did it with a handicap and while having a lot of fun. I wish TF2 were more like this all the time.
21/06/2008 at 15:45 ScubaV says:
So does this mean I can get self-righteous about not playing TF2 (even though I own it) just like others get self-righteous about not playing WoW or some other game?
21/06/2008 at 15:46 Forceflow says:
You know, it’s actually quite rewarding to play medic now. Everyone’s on f*cking fire !
21/06/2008 at 15:55 Ging says:
I can live with the achievements and the grinders, I’m sort of used to it – two of the guys in my house are xbox live achievement whores, so grinding for meaningless point values is the norm.
21/06/2008 at 15:59 Lavitz says:
I am just like you guys i returned to tf 2 to check out the pyro after a long time. My friend told me about achievement servers so i knew where to go if i wanted to be a whore. When i went into tf 2 i knew everything since i played enough so all i wanted was achievements so i joined a a random server that wasn’t an achievement box and in there i seen engineers making dispensers and pyro destroying them. For 3 mins i decided to be an engineer then realized that this isn’t fun what so ever and i never played pyro in the first place , so i left and i won’t go back till there is an update for something that I like (soldier,sniper,scout,heavy) but that won’t be for awhile by the time those updates come out i think ill be into BIA or something else.
21/06/2008 at 16:12 Arathain says:
It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, eh?
I waver between being irritated at the sudden imbalance of the game, and enjoying playing the classes that counter Pyros. I’ve had some fabulous rounds as a delighted Heavy. You know, on the whole I think I’m having more fun than not. I’m a regular Pyro player, but I’m happy enough to sit it out for a week or two, then I’ll relearn the class as it stands, get the new weapons and carry on having fun.
The Medic achievements are a different story. I’ll still happily play a Medic, but I think I’ll always be using the vanilla kit.
21/06/2008 at 16:24 Erlam says:
“I think the worse thing is that this is a Free Weekend, so anybody deciding to try out TF2 this weekend is going to get an experience that not representative of TF2 at all.”
I was talking to my friend about that. Which moron thought of that idea? “You know what’d be really fun? If we made the weekend where everyone is the same class… was also the free weekend!”
That, and these achievements have kinda turned me off of the game. I understand the purpose, but they lead to: A) Achievement whoring, and B) unbalance what is supposed to be a totally balanced game. I feel like I’m playing an MMO, not a Team-based FPS.
21/06/2008 at 16:33 Hermes says:
Excellent write up. I’m happy that this time you need only get 22 or whatever the number is of the achievements to unlock all the weapons rather than all the achievements.
I have given up on trying to get all the medic achievements, that uber saw will be forever out of reach.
21/06/2008 at 16:33 RLacey says:
I’m obviously just useless at obtaining achievements. I still haven’t managed to acquire a Medic unlock, despite playing almost no time on any other class. Bizarrely, I haven’t even managed to acquire the achievement for ubercharging a pyro who then sets five people on fire. Even though there’s a huge number of pyros around.
The day the spy gets upgrades is the day I stop playing this game for an indefinite period.
But yeah… I hate these achievements, because I know I’ll never manage to get them all. And I’m getting a bit sick of being killed by people who happen to have the weapons that I’m not entitled to…
21/06/2008 at 16:37 Erlam says:
Out of curiousity, does anyone know a good ‘vanila’ server? I’d really like to play with all these unlocks (which sucks, because the Pyro really needed some help.)
21/06/2008 at 16:42 Nah says:
Erlam – it’s a free weekend, so for most of the people playing the pyro isn’t any newer or more worth playing than all the other classes, so it’s not that unbalanced. Jump on and have a look.
Doing it -without- the free weekend to provide people playing other classes would be a worse idea.
21/06/2008 at 16:51 Quirk says:
The mostly-Pyro servers have been a golden opportunity to see how the new update rebalances things.
Despite tales of soldiers mostly doing all right, some of my experiences suggest that once you’ve got a few career pyros out there with reasonable alt-fire skills, they’re going to take a hammering when they meet a pyro at close range. They’ve also had their rocket damage protection taken away, so they’ve been weakened most. Demo stickies are now easily cleared by a pyro. That weakens them some. Scouts are suffering too, particularly from the pyro damage range extension stripping off a lot more of their health if they get singed. Spies suffer a little, largely because pyros are more playable and will show up in larger numbers.
Medics can be blown off their ubercharge, though as the pyro has to get close enough to do so that’ll only be an issue in some circumstances. They also win some, on the other hand, as the pyro’s increase of firepower with the damage range change will make him a tempting alternative to a heavy when your ubercharge is good to go.
Engineers, on the other hand, can now enlist pyros to defend their sentries against spies, soldiers and demomen. Big win for them. Snipers and heavies are fairly mildly affected, and these three classes all benefit from facing pyros over classes with more ranged weaponry.
Most of the classes which have suffered were considered “stronger” classes anyway (at least in competition play). The weaker ones stand to benefit from their anti-pyro capabilities – all except for the poor spy, who really needs a shot in the arm to bring him up to par. Still, overall it looks like a useful rebalancing.
21/06/2008 at 17:06 Taras says:
If you take out the gaming-specific references, everything there sounds precisely like a scene from Dante’s Inferno, right down to the dispositions and discourse of those involved. That’s a bit unsettling.
21/06/2008 at 17:24 Calabi says:
You have a point there. Team Fortress 2 is the new hell. Join it at your own peril, oblivious to the madness of it all.
21/06/2008 at 17:51 Xander77 says:
I got my “taunts” and “axes” achievements on such a server. Don’t really see the point of farming anything else – playing as a pyro will get you all the other achievements naturally and quickly.
However, the concept of bypassing *retarded* (term used most intetionally) demands for new and improved weapons via cooperation is a GREAT one. Achievement servers are the natural and CORRECT response to unlock requirements.
21/06/2008 at 18:00 Benjamin Barker says:
I had a little stretch where I played TF2. Multiplayer games are not my thing, but I was very attracted by the art direction… I kind of want to go back but the unlocking system is off-putting to me. There are now weapons some players have and others don’t, resulting in an arms race. And if you don’t keep up, you’ll feel nerfed.
Are there servers that only let in players who haven’t yet gotten the unlocks? Does the game at least take them into account when it balances the teams?
21/06/2008 at 18:06 Benjamin Barker says:
@Xander77: Maybe you’re right. I could just play on one after all. It’s a way of fast-forwarding through the arms-race. However, there’s still the balance problem of other players who haven’t gotten them.
21/06/2008 at 18:25 Xander77 says:
Also. achievement servers are the best place to organize a game of crit rocket tennis between two pyro teams. I seriously need to record one of those, for future generations.
21/06/2008 at 18:41 ORYLY says:
1. Create listen server
CONSOLE COMMANDS:
2. sv_cheats 1
4. mp_teams_unbalance_limit 0
5. add bots
6. sv_cheats 0
7. retry
8. Grind! You can use the commands “bot_mimic” and “bot_flipout” to position them easily.
21/06/2008 at 18:43 Skalpadda says:
It’s not like the unlockable weapons are a gazillion times better and will magically win you games, so worrying about “falling behind in the arms race” is a bit silly.
21/06/2008 at 18:50 Mman says:
“it’s a free weekend, so for most of the people playing the pyro isn’t any newer or more worth playing than all the other classes, so it’s not that unbalanced. Jump on and have a look.
Doing it -without- the free weekend to provide people playing other classes would be a worse idea.”
Yeah, I always thought providing a free weekend right when the achievements hit is a really good idea, as all the new blood means a bunch of people trying out every class. Plus it helps people who are trying to get achievements, as all the beginners makes getting them easier.
Other than tons of Pyros I’ve seen big disruption in “normal” servers; I’m guessing most people are subtly manipulating things for the optimal circumstances to get achievements (that’s what I do anyway), but the games still go along just fine on the vast majority of servers I’ve played.
21/06/2008 at 18:59 Fazer says:
Geez, 79 comments already? I won’t lie I had read them all, but I’ll add my 2 cents.
People are [differently-minded] for going to Pyro achievementbox servers, because clearly his achievements are better designed then Medic’s ones and can be easily get through a normal game. Some of them require time, some of them are a matter of luck, but you fricking DON’T NEED TO COLLECT THEM ALL to unlock 3 weapons. You need only 10 unlocks for first, 15 for next and 20 for the last. So you have a choice which one you want to obtain and then you’re left with 15 achievements just for fun.
I really hope Valve will apply the same 10-15-20 pattern to Medic achievements. This would help to discourage [differently-minded people] from wasting their time.
21/06/2008 at 19:08 Frymaster says:
arguably the first unlock is the most “interesting” one (though the backburner is LETHAL and imo almost overpowered), and I reckon you can get the first one without farming at all. I certainly got the medic 1st unlock that way – there are a few more I could get if I farmed, but kritzkrieg doesn’t interest me
As in all these things, it depends on the servers. Servers with class restrictions, for example, will be doing a roaring trade right now, or servers with strong communities and decent admin’ing
21/06/2008 at 19:27 RichPowers says:
My experience on an achievement farm was completely the opposite. I got 17 achievements in an hour. No llamas. Plenty of engies, zoomed-in snipers, and scout weenies helping everyone. For the “making bacon” achievement, 4 people went heavy so the pyros could get it done faster. I was truly surprised by how well it went during my time on that server. Besides, I’d rather have people doing the taunt achievements on farm servers instead of disrupting real games. Seriously, how the hell else can you kill a spy who’s flicking a cigarette?
And the three servers I play (mostly 24/7 Dustbowl and Gold Rush) have had a healthy balance of classes — especially compared to the medic update. Surprised once again I was.
21/06/2008 at 19:31 Andy Johnson says:
What we really need is for, as Frymaster suggested, Valve to retrospectively lower the unlock requirements for the medic’s new toys. In all my time playing TF2 (all of which has been long after the Medic update) I have never, ever come across anyone with the ubersaw. There’s something wrong there – Medic achievements are both too hard to achieve and too numerous.
21/06/2008 at 19:41 matte_k says:
Just spent two hours this afternoon on an fairly empty server with about 6 of us chatting and mucking about and getting some of the more obscure achievements, for both medic and pyro. Also discovering that some are terribly broken and don’t work on some servers (pretty much the spy-related ones). It was fun, and introduced me to a couple of friendly players with good humour that I have now added.
However, Alec’s experience pretty much sums up my half hour on Friday on a public server. Hopefully by next week I can actually get back to my usual class of Pyro and collect the remaining achievements in the course of normal play.
It seems that Valve have done this specifically, varying the kind of Achievements and how you get them. Some have to be played during the course of a normal game, and some you can quickly grab with a bunch of friends. The medic set had some stupidly hard ones unless you did it on an Achievements server, so I get the feeling that the next set of add-ons will be even more balanced, and the likelihood of a weekend of “Legions Of Engy’s” will be reduced…
21/06/2008 at 20:47 jeffb1119 says:
relax.. in 2 weeks tf2 will be back to the same.. except now.. u will have 2 pyros on your team instead of 0 or 1.
21/06/2008 at 20:52 Bahumat says:
I too, like PfC there, admined a tight ship of an achievement server. Sadly, Pyro has always been my favorite class (like, 95+ hours there, no more than 30 hours anything else), so for me, it was pretty much bringing my game up on par with the rest.
Could I have sacrificed 6 hours or so of regular play to get most of those achievements? Yes. But frankly, I’m not made of free time. My two hour investment in an achievementbox server gave me four more hours of free time to enjoy the game I wanted (and paid) to play.
The entire idea of achievements=unlockable versatility is bullshit. I didn’t just buy the game as-is, I bought it with the future of the game in mind.
Do I feel bad about achievementboxing? Only slightly. Having the Backburner in my arsenal, thus allowing me to play the classic Pyro style I’ve always loved, however, more than makes up for that mild bad feeling with a whole lot of *FWOOOOORSSSH* AAAHAHAAHAAAA! feelings.
Ultimately, gentlemen and ladies, the sooner you get your unlocks the sooner you can stop worrying about your unlocks and get back to actually playing the game.
21/06/2008 at 21:00 Jimbo says:
My experience of getting the acheivements was actually very positive. Managed to find a pretty empty achievementbox_pyro server and me and this dude took it in turns to help each other out. It was good fun, and we zoomed through them.
21/06/2008 at 21:14 rockpaperchao999 says:
I’m proud to say that I got 9 achievements by myself, without help! I had to ask someone to stand still for the OMGWTFBBQ Achievement to get 10 and the flare gun though. :(
21/06/2008 at 21:17 Down Rodeo says:
I am something of an achievement whore, with the medic unlocks I got the class-specific ubercharges and “Big Pharma” in a private server (where are you going to find a heavy who is willing to use an ubercharge to hit people?). We discussed it there and kinda felt justified as we were not on other servers, ruining their games. But then perhaps Valve’s plan was that people would get the achievements very slowly.
I reckon a better plan would be to release the updates two at a time – for instance, soldier and engineer. That would at least balance out an attacking and defending force. Otherwise it will be near-unplayable for many days.
Wait, that’s almost what’s happening at the moment.
One final thought – the unlocks were designed with balance in mind. It seems that the new weapons are to be better in certain situations rather than better overall.
21/06/2008 at 21:20 Alex says:
Stop your moaning for a second and think, wouldn’t you rather have all the farmers on servers like this, rather than ruinging the play on “real” servers? Imagine how lame it would be if you were a heavy, your medic gets an uber, and ditches you to pop it on a scout so he can get his achievement? Put that in your flamethrower and smoke it.
21/06/2008 at 21:45 Xander77 says:
“Andy Johnson” – seriously? It seems every person to main medic I see has the ubergun.
According to valve stats, 2% of all gamers have it. But, to pust that in perspective, approximately 58% have won 5 games or more, so… most people with any kind of long lasting investmestment in the game and/or interest in playing medic have it.
21/06/2008 at 21:56 FlashIV says:
It took me only about 6 hours of normal non-farming pyro playing to unlock all three weapons. Valve made a good change in the way unlocks are handled with this patch. Most of the ones I got were normal game stuff, ignite 3 medics w/ubers, ignite x disguised spies, etc… but I did get a couple fun ones, OMGWTFBBQ has to be the best.
Then when I finally got my 22nd with “Pilot Light” on a Soldier who was trying to jump through a window, Ding! FlashIV has achieved Milestone 3, and the soldier who I just killed congratulated me :)
I have no trouble finding vanilla servers, probably cause I’m close enough to Chicago, and this is one of the most entertaining games I’ve played in a long time.
21/06/2008 at 22:10 Steven Malis says:
Its actually really fun to play on an achievement server that has a password on it. That way you get no ‘retards’ and you actually have fun.
21/06/2008 at 22:11 DMcC says:
Y’know, I really have to thank you for the time you’ve taken to delve into this nasty little subject. In particular I appreciate your emphasis on what you experienced, what you witnessed, and your reactions to saidsame, rather than some lamebrained straight up judgement.
21/06/2008 at 22:14 Jiki says:
The scene where he stopped his journey to be a engy for a while, but then understood his actions and continued with his journey, felt so ….. like from a novel or smth. :P A search for something unknown, stopped by an object on the path and took its place for so long, but then continued after noticing he’s becoming an object on the path like everybody else.
21/06/2008 at 23:01 Ryan says:
I still have mixed feelings about the unlocks as a whole- while I like the idea of adding versatility and customizability to the classes, the implementation seems horribly flawed. Still, the Pyro achievements are a huge step toward sanity for people who want to earn their weapons on live-fire servers. I took advantage of the free weekend to introduce a friend to the basics of the game and get a couple of the near-impossible achievements (OMGWTFBBQ and Got a Light?), but only after earning my first twelve achievements on normal public servers. Pyro is my favorite class, so I hardly had to do anything differently, except for setting more ambushes near the base entrances and tunnel exits in 2fort to force attackers (especially Scouts) to retreat for the water and douse themselves.
Right now I’ve got the first two unlocks. The Flaregun is a fantastic idea and well-implemented- it’s a very clear tradeoff, giving the Pyro long-range capability at the expense of a ranged weapon that works underwater and a key tool against other Pyros. And I’m having a blast working on the Attention Getter achievement, which highlights just how great the Pyro is for harassment (especially against Snipers). The Backburner, though, seems HUGELY unbalanced. Guaranteed crits from behind, without a corresponding damage increase from the front? And fifty bonus health on top of that? Somehow giving up a brand-new ability that established Pyros won’t miss much doesn’t seem like an adequate tradeoff. As it is, I wouldn’t dream of using the regular flamethrower, at least until the new Pyros have had enough and go back to their normal classes. Clearing Demoman minefields is nice, but against other Pyros the Backburner is an indispensable advantage.
21/06/2008 at 23:56 Ryan says:
er, corresponding damage DECREASE, obviously. D’oh.
21/06/2008 at 23:59 Miker says:
I personally got about 16 achievements on an achievement server, and I do feel bad about it now, because my stats are horribly messed up — 9 dominations, 15000+ damage, etc, as a Pyro. I did it, though, wanting to get the new weapons. If the weaons hadn’t been at stake, I wouldn’t have cared, just like I couldn’t care less about gamerscore. But the collector in me wanted those weapons, which is why I farmed.
22/06/2008 at 00:17 Hatmaster says:
I got around 18 of the medic pack on achievement servers, but now regret it greatly – most points 442 as medic? no thanks.
I decided it wasn’t worth the guilt this time around, so did the Pyro pack through normal play.
I have already unlocked all 3 new weapons, and love them,but this is really only because of the lowered unlock points and the toning-down of the achievements’ difficulties. the satisfaction factor is also a bonus.
22/06/2008 at 00:50 Batolemaeus says:
The achievement System ruined the game for me, plain and simple.
I used to play Medic all the time, because i liked the class. Someday, suddenly, there were a crapload of them and the teams achieved nothing.
I switched to pyro, as it was very useful with a bunch of ubercharging medics, and was a fun class. Then the servers were stormed by bandwaggon retards who were grinding achievements as their e-peen enhancement.
I now switched to Engineer…but i think i’ll quit playing tf2 and get into a game where i can enjoy a community that doesn’t grind e-peen enlargements and ruins teamplay.
I don’t play games like tf2 or cs:s to level up my character, actually, i play them because i can just jump in and play how i want, without any idiotic game mechanic trying to force me into killing people with melee when i’m a medic.
I get leveling up in mmorpgs already, now i get it in tf2. One good reason to avoid it.
22/06/2008 at 01:37 tyrannosaurus-drew says:
You knew exactly what you were getting yourself into.
22/06/2008 at 02:00 MeestaNob! says:
I fell into one of those servers here in AU last night. There’s something entirely pointless about achievement farming that these people don’t seem to understand.
So, to make my point, I spawned as an engineer and waited until the perfect opportunity to charge to the center of the surprisingly small space and quickly built up a level 3 sentry.
The moaning from all concerned was priceless.
The only unfortunate side affect of this harsh lesson is that now engineer is my highest scoring class with fucking 40, but that could have gone up exponentially until the morons finally got a clue and spawned as demomen or soldiers and WORKED AS A TEAM, as the game title implies.
Aside from my skewed Steam stats, I feel no shame whatsoever.
22/06/2008 at 02:30 AMT says:
Am I the only one who thought that this would make a great machinima drama? It was a very well written article, albeit does show the very worst of achievement servers.
I had the same problem with medic – my stats had been dominated by the points I earned in a heavily modded server. I was eventually able to resolve that problem, and I am happily re-earning the achievements as I play on normal TF2 servers.
Rest assured that the reset stats option will make its way back into TF2 once some bugs have been fixed. However, as before, it will reset everything or nothing.
22/06/2008 at 02:37 The Hammer says:
You know, I don’t see why Valve didn’t just immediately let people use the weapons as soon as the packs are released, giving them the choice from the off. Sure, there is less reason to continuously play, but this, to me, isn’t exactly playing.
Considering that the weapons are all balanced anyway, and none are superior to each other, it’d not be as though people are getting better weapons for nothing (not that they should get better weapons at all. More experienced players having better guns is a sure-fire way to put off newbies).
22/06/2008 at 02:52 fearian says:
It’s funny, The day of the update, me and three friends has coincidentally planned a LAN. Some, Dawn of War, CoD4, maybe TF2. But when we started up a local TF2 game we noticed something:
‘Surely valve won’t let you get acheivements in a local game? It has to be a dedicated server right?’
Ding!
‘Haha, what? now let me set you on fire!’
With mates, a slow, insulting grind became a fast hilarious race to each milestone. We had tons of fun. Not once did we think of it as cheating, just a grind, like any MMO. It was hilarious bouncing back rocket after rocket waiting for a crit, but then realising the constant: Shoom. Baf. Boom made a perfect beat. now it was a rhythm game!
Later we jumped on pubbie servers and did the Axe taunt to show off our new axstinguishers. after games resumed normallity, we quit and played something else.
22/06/2008 at 03:54 ShaRose says:
Well, at least if you don’t like achievement farming servers, there’s a program out there that can unlock all the achievements for any steam game, without the game running. And, as an added bonus, it’s not an account stealer, and the method actually works, without being bannable by VAC. I know it because I have the source, and I’ve modded it somewhat. Someone I know actually made his own and let me (and a few others) have the source to it, to compile and screw with at will. But apart from that, Alec, the method lets you select specific achievements, and wipe them out as well as give you them. Someone else is going to recode his in C# and add a gui :D
22/06/2008 at 04:31 somedumbguy says:
LBQ is the only one here who has any sense at all, including the OP. If you don’t like what’s happening right now in TF2 then (and apparently this is where things get tricky for people) DON’T PLAY IT FOR A FEW WEEKS. Just for the love of god stop whining. If you don’t approve of achievement servers then just don’t join them, end of story. This does not mean don’t join them but complain about it on teh infonetz to a bunch of other [people], and it certainly doesn’t mean join them and then write a whole fucking article on how you think it feels “dirty” to get achievements this way. The OP [has a different opinion to me]. “The map was designed specifically to make certain Achievements easier” Duh, really, no shit. Someone give this guy a Peabody! He also mentioned that he went there to satisfy his curiosity. Umm… the map is called achievement box, I can’t imagine how that would drum up curiosity. Did he say to himself “gee, achievement box. I wonder what that’s for. It couldn’t possibly be some place where people gather to get achievements, could it?” The OP obviously knew full well what the map was for but he joined anyway so that he could get some material for this [article I clearly haven't actually read]. So what’s lamer? Getting achievements lazy way or [writing about doing so] on a global forum?
PS. I don’t use achievement servers and I’m not defending them either. I’m just saying how people want to play their game is their own damn business.
22/06/2008 at 04:36 Buemba says:
While the idea of unlocking new weapons is nice, tying them to achievements isn’t. The moment someone joins a server with the goal of “hitting an enemy with the bonesaw five times in a row without dying or missing” or “setting 5 people carrying your team’s briefcase on fire” instead of “helping the team win” he stops being an asset and might as well not even be considered part of the team at all (Worse, he’s taking a spot on the server that could’ve been occupied by someone who actually wanted to play the game the way it was intended to be played), and Valve is encouraging that behavior when they force us to do meet these wildly arbitrary conditions to get new stuff.
Want to do unlockable weapons? Fine. Make them purchasable using points. If your team wins the match the points you earned in it go to your “bank”, and they can later be exchanged for any weapon of any class you want. Since Valve is releasing these in packs of 3 make the first weapon cost 50 points, the second 200 and the third 500 or something. That way you encourage people to work towards wining and it gives those points you get in a match a use other than bragging rights.
22/06/2008 at 04:36 HandyMan says:
http://www.fortress-forever.com/ FTW baby!!
22/06/2008 at 04:59 Mark says:
Unlockables are bad news.
22/06/2008 at 05:19 Poisoned Al says:
My feelings on achievement servers is mixed. One it IS cheating and that sucks. Two, if the server is not locked to known people, they are just cluster-fucks.
However, the uber-saw was too hard to get without cheating so I’ll give that a pass (mostly becuase I cheated myself to get the remaining achievements, and I too feel bad about screwing my stats up), and it gets achievement whores out of the real games. I am more angered at the sight of a medic ubering a damn scout with a heavy and demo next to him, then I ever will someone using an achievement server to get the new toys.
22/06/2008 at 05:22 Poisoned Al says:
Also, Buemba’s point idea FTW!
22/06/2008 at 05:47 wyrmsine says:
I was pretty grateful for the achievement server when the Medic update rolled out. Since I no longer had time to play 20 hours a week, and my stats from when I could weren’t tracked, a cheat server was my only option to test out the new weapons. And oddly, the server was really efficient. Sure, whenever someone showed up and started griefing, everyone turned into idiots, but there was a steady rotation of good teachers skilled at herding cats.
Still don’t have the ubersaw and never expect to get it – the requirements are simply too stupid. The Axtinguisher, on the other hand, I can expect to get through regular play, and it’ll be a nice surprise when I do.
22/06/2008 at 06:44 Puh-lease! says:
The achievement servers are a godsend. The thing is, Valve has released this new content, which everyone is going to want to try, even if these aren’t their main classes. In order to obtain this content Valve is forcing us to play as these classes. Despite what some people may say, obtaining these achievements requires a considerable amount of time. If everyone who wanted the content only played legitimately, they would be forced to play a certain class even if there is already an excess of that class. Valve has forced us to choose between cheating and playing horribly imbalanced games.
The achievement servers allow those who want the new content to obtain it without mucking up an enjoyable and balanced game. Some of us simply do not have the time to master the Pyro and kill FIFTY Heavy Weapons guys, but we still would like to try out this part of the game. Don’t knock these servers because you feel as though you are somehow superior by achieving the achievements in game. We love the game just as much as you do. That’s why we use the achievement servers! We want to enjoy as much of the TF2 experience as possible, and if that means cheating, then so be it. For me, the achievement servers have been an extremely interesting and fulfilling part of of my TF2 playtime. But that’s another story.
22/06/2008 at 07:58 PeterBeck says:
I agree and disagree.
I don’t mind achievement servers, used them myself, and then I go back to playing real matches on a real TF2 server, and I play it as a team player. The special servers are there to keep achievement whoring out of the real gameplay matches.
Now, what I do agree with is that through this achievements are cheapened, as instead of being a surprise, it’s a labour and grind. But I more blame developers for this, and I think that if achievements were to do what they should, they’d be all hidden until unlocked.
Me, I got my three new weapons, and the majority of my achievements, and I’m gonna be back to playing true matches now. Maybe I’ll play pyro and take advantage of what I gained, maybe I’ll play some other class instead. It’s a game, and, within rules and etiquette, I and others have the privilege to play it any way we’d like to.
22/06/2008 at 08:19 dorian says:
CRY SOME MORE! WAAAAAAAAAAA Hahaha WAAAAAAAAAA.
just think as the achievement servers as a game all in its own. its fun to go back to them once you got your stuff and be a “retard” and work your best to prevent them from getting thier achievements.
22/06/2008 at 09:01 Y3k-Bug says:
A question to further spur discussion:
Would anyone argue that the concept of achievement servers was spawned more from Valve’s rather bizarre set of achievements for the Medic pack? Alot of the achievements from that pack literally REQUIRED you to “farm” them.
And while myself and about 5 friends went and unlocked everything using this method on a private server, I can say that I now wish I hadn’t. The Pyro pack achievements are so well designed, and occur during normal gameplay.
22/06/2008 at 09:11 Dave says:
I’m not sure why people feel the need to farm for these on achievement servers. I unlocked the Backburner without any extraordinary effort and I’m just a mediocre player with occasional good streaks.
(Though I did play Pyro sometimes when it was obvious I could have gotten more kills or contributed more to the team as another class, and I did go shotgun when the flare gun would have been more useful and vice versa just for achievement’s sake. And I’ve gotten far more axe kills than usual, but I figure that’s mostly due to newbies and lots of people playing classes they’re not used to.)
22/06/2008 at 09:25 Jordan says:
I absolutely have cheated some achievements and I don’t regret it in the least. The only ones I’ve gone for are impossible under normal play. For example, one Medic achievement is Placebo Effect: get your ubercharge meter full, then kill 5 enemies without deploying it or dying.
Assuming this achievement never existed, if you are ever seriously tempted to fight five enemies in a row as a medic with a full meter, you are among the worst teammates that have ever existed. No medic remotely in his right mind would want to do this, and it runs completely counter to proper Medic play. My best class has always been medic, and after 90 hours of play, 10 of them as medic (I give all classes equal time), my record for kills in a single life outside of an achievement server is still 2. Medic is my highest average score class despite this because medics are never supposed to fight unless they find themselves alone due to unfortunate circumstances. There’s little chance even if I play another 30 hours as medic that 5 kills is ever going to happen for me when I’m playing seriously.
This leaves me with two options if I ever want to have all the unlockable weapons:
1. Grind for the achievement on normal servers, thus being a bad teammate and putting my personal score record in the gutter.
2. Grind for the achievement on an achievement server, which is faster, doesn’t lose a real game for anyone else, and tends my record sharply upward for a short time (as opposed to slightly downwards for a very, very long time).
From this perspective, the decision to cheat on this and other similarly impossible achievements is a no-brainer.
Fortunately the Pyro pack has hardly any, and even those are not absurdly counter to proper pyro play, just absurdly unlikely, plus you don’t need all the achievements for the Pyro weapons, so there’s much less reason to cheat.
But anyway, every time some idiot ruined an achievement server I just left for a different one. It’s not too hard if you’re patient to get some quality time with very few undesired kills.
22/06/2008 at 10:21 madhaha says:
Find an achievemenets server where there aren’t any admin and setup a sentry ;)
22/06/2008 at 10:40 RandomEngy says:
Since you only need 22/35 for all the weapons and the achievement difficult was toned back a lot, you can get all the Pyro weapons in a few hours of normal play. If people want to go farm them to try to get them a little bit faster, fine. But it’s really not required.
22/06/2008 at 12:51 The Hammer says:
Is this a forum thread? What’s with all the references to the “OP”?
22/06/2008 at 13:51 You are all [of different opinions to me] says:
Gee, you kids sure do like achieving stuff in them video games.
It’s not serious business. I want to play with some new toys and enjoy myself, rather than act like a [differently-minded person] and screw up actual games attempting to taunt people to death. So me and a few friends spent fifteen minutes on an empty server.
Now I can play minesweeper or spyro, and I can enjoy myself. If you need some sense of deep satisfaction from a video game, that’s cool. But I want to have fun, so I’ll just get the achievements quick. And it’s none of your [differently-minded] place to complain about it. You want to show off about how you totally earned your ubersaw legit, then i’ll not stop you. But I will say you’d be more at home playing WoW.
22/06/2008 at 14:41 Kyorisu says:
This is why you use private achievement servers like I do with a few close mates. You get all the achievments you need a lot faster than any pub achievement server.
22/06/2008 at 15:56 toni says:
well, who cares about achievements ?
i think achievements servers are the communities answer to valves badly designed game where you HAVE to play it to get what you have paid for. either they introduce a feature right away or it’s useless because some will have them some not and it’s bad for new players that just got the game. achievements and unlocks are the stupidest thing on earth and I loathe all companies bringing this bad concept to PC gaming.
22/06/2008 at 16:18 Airplane says:
Why on Earth does anyone care about achievements? I gain little to no satisfaction getting them, it’s just a message that says I did a certain event whoopdie doo. I’d rather shoot people to death than try and burn a Spy flicking a cigarette. I grinded my weapons as soon as they came out in about 20 minutes with my friends and I don’t regret it even a little. I got to use the new weapons as soon as they came out and had a blast.
To sum it up new weapons=cool, achievements=who the fuck cares.
22/06/2008 at 16:23 Baconados says:
These servers are basically hell.
My clan runs one, and I tried to get it in such a way the server was actually helping people.
It took over 90 bans and over 1000 kicks.
I recieved a message from the guy who pays for the server, saying I need to lighten up on banning potential members.
I said “Have we sunk so low we take the idiots who join the server, don’t look at rules, and then proceed to spawn camp for hours straight?”
Basically, my status in the clan is extremely shaky now. :/
These fucking things even cause clan</b drama.
22/06/2008 at 16:29 unangbangkay says:
@Toni
It isn’t really a question of bad fundamentals. I’m reasonably certain Valve did a hell of a lot of testing to make sure the new unlocks were balanced. The bad decision was making them unlockable in the first place. It damages the sense of equality that’s critical to any multiplayer-only title.
Whenever a player feels like he’s missing out because he isn’t a tweener with a whole summer to devote to this kind of thing, that’s a bad decision.
Achievements to build pointless e-penis gamerscores are fine, but attaching actual value to them is a recipe for disaster, as these achievement servers prove. I couldn’t care less if my large e-penis gained me a “special” AXE body spray gift set (it was proposed at one point), but when it gives someone a potential advantage just because they visit an achievement server or have money to burn, that’s a game-killer.
22/06/2008 at 16:41 Admiral says:
well, i actually went into one of these, and believe it or not, there was team work, and we helped each other out half the time. There were the guys that were just jerks, but they quickly stopped once the knew what was up. Then again, there was that godmode mod…
anyways, I also love the heavy and when that one comes around I will try my best to just get the achis the right way… And scre the medic ones, they are ridiculous….
22/06/2008 at 17:41 Mostly Unashamed says:
I was not ashamed of myself for going to achievement servers to earn many of my medic achievements, a class that I do not play often. However, I went into one that had altered much of the game play and quickly found myself with several achievements that should require hours of play, such as Chief of Medicine. I quickly left the server, because I feel that it is one thing to grind them out, but it is an entirely different thing to have them handed to you on a silver platter. And now I have nearly 2000 points in a single life as Medic. I am not ashamed of trying to get achievements. I am only ashamed of those that were handed to me. I still have two to go on Medic to get the Ubersaw, not counting Milestone 3, and I will be earning it through regular play.
22/06/2008 at 18:10 TheHat says:
One way to fix this is make it so that only certain official maps let you get achievements.
No way to stop a group of friends from going on an empty server and helping each other though.
22/06/2008 at 18:59 RobotLiberationArmy says:
I was under the impression that achievements were a sort “oh, cool” type of thing but apparently some people take them more seriously than religion.
Honestly, I got on an empty server with some friends and did both Medic and Pyro achievements. Both times were a lot of fun I’d probably do it again without any reward (minus the idiots who’d come and yelling “please halp me with x” and the German 10-year olds) because playing videogames with friends is fun and we had an excuse to to goofy stuff we wouldn’t have thought of otherwise.
Maybe I’m just an evil, immoral person, or just somebody who recognizes that it is, in fact, a videogame.
EDIT: That said, I throughly condone going on achievement servers and meesing it up, because it’s funny.
22/06/2008 at 19:13 grinch says:
achievments in a multiplayer online game = phail!
they shudve at least built in a button “unlock all achievments”
22/06/2008 at 19:25 chris says:
…”Ding!”?? There is no ding.
Achievement servers are there to get dumb achievements done quick and get all weapons. Obviously if you don’t want your stats messed up, you don’t go to them. Its a trade-off. If you aren’t willing to trade in your stats, then don’t do it. Seriously, how could you write such a long article on such a simple concept..?
22/06/2008 at 19:41 Alec Meer says:
/me sighs.
22/06/2008 at 20:18 Don says:
The ‘Concerned’ guy mentioned achievement servers on his 1fort blog which was the first I’d heard of them. They sound rather sad but as others have said the fault is mainly Valve’s. When I looked at the medic achievements I took one look and said ‘Sod that’. Ubering a scout and getting five kills, ubering a heavy and getting 2 (it was even more to start with) by punching and so on. These are tactics you’d never use when playing for real and don’t help you be a better medic. Since I only play medic occasionally I wasn’t too bothered, I eventually got the 1st unlock a couple of days ago, albeit by wasting an uber on Goldrush before the start as trying to uber 2 players at once in the field proved to be a waste of time.
They seem to have done better with the pyro, most of the achievements are ones you’ll do sooner or later if you play pyro for any length of time and since you don’t need the lot you can ignore the sillier/chancier ones.
22/06/2008 at 21:20 Uzer says:
Will the new weapons make the game irrelevant for new players?
People who play longer will have the better weapons making it all the more difficult for new players to play successfully and/or casually. If that is indeed the case why should I go ahead and buy the game? I played this weekend and thoroughly enjoyed my experience but this sort of skewing is the only thing that’s stopping me from getting it. I’d like the game’s victories to be on a level plane. Will these inaccessible new weapons change this?
22/06/2008 at 21:41 ShaRose says:
No, to grief right you need three guys. Either all heavys, a heavy on each end and a sentry in the middle, or three sentry guns spread out.
23/06/2008 at 01:22 Nimic says:
I was pretty fanatical about TF2 when it was released, but I have to say that unlockable weapons is pretty damn close to putting me off the game for good. It’s mind-boggling how an otherwise fantastic company like Valve can think it’d be a good idea to tie new weapons to achievements. Particularly when a lot of the achievements (certainly for medic, anyway) are of the kind that almost make you less useful to your team than if you were on the other team.
23/06/2008 at 01:37 Syntaxus says:
I hate the medic achievements, to the point where I’ve gone on such a server to clear some of them out. I don’t even like playing medic too much. Much prefer scout, demo, or soldier… Requiring all the achievements to unlock a weapon was a mistake, as well as including so many utterly ridiculous ones. I would be furious if a Heavy I had ubered attempted to punch enemies, I can’t imagine there being a situation where the best class to use an uber on would be a scout, etc. In the end, the medic pack has turned me off the game and especially playing medic, rather than its intended effect.
On the other hand…
The pyro update was well done in my opinion. The flaregun, at least, is a good tradeoff – At least when half the server population has partial immunity to immolation. The backburner and axtinguisher are almost always better than the normal versions, however… Which seems to ring falsely against the TF2 ideals of an even playing field. A pyro with a normal flamer versus a backburner should always lose (thanks to extra health) unless he gets lucky with crits, and that’s assuming the backburner pyro is incapable of getting behind him.
Strange that I have discovered my love for the scout during such a pyro-laden weekend, their chief adversary… Back to stealing the intelligence for me.
23/06/2008 at 02:35 Quirk says:
Uzer: No, not at all.
Firstly, Valve have learned from the Medic frenzy. The new weapons can all be unlocked in a few hours of normal play, and that’s how I unlocked mine. If you like a class enough to play it fairly often, you’ll get all the unlocks from now on, I suspect.
Secondly, they’re not that significantly better. The Flaregun will, in most circumstances, be worse. The Backburner does well against newer and weaker players, but the competition players don’t seem to think it’ll see much use in their circles – the regular compression blast, however, is being treated as potentially a major change in game balance. Certainly, I’d rather have the compression blast when facing a team of demos and soldiers. The Axtinguisher is broadly likely to be better against non-pyros, but you’ll rarely use the axe anyway. New weapons give extra options, but they’re not so far an across-the-board improvement. Even the Ubersaw, for all its potent bonus, is weaker in the situations you usually -need- a Bonesaw in (like chewing through a line of medic-heavy-soldier trying to invade your intel room; I’ve had some good killing streaks as medic made possible by the speed and high damage of the Bonesaw). Some of them are in most circumstances going to be inferior, such as the Kritzkreig and Flaregun.
In summary, the new weapons are unlikely to make much difference compared to the playing skill of someone who’s spent the time getting them legitimately, and it’s not likely to take that long to manage that. Get the game, it’s a lot of fun, and if you still feel concerned, concentrate your efforts on one class enough to get its weapons when they come out. It’ll only be about six hours of play, and you’ll get a lot more than that out of Team Fortress.
23/06/2008 at 03:38 LemonJoose says:
Just another piece of evidence confirming the lameness of unlockable content. Grinding in MMOs and RPGs sucks — why create a grind in FPSs?
23/06/2008 at 04:45 Sahagin says:
Sometimes I’ll go scout when there’s another scout on the team and stay right next to him for a while to help Pyros get the Weenie achievement. Or I’ll go medic and stay right next to the person I’m healing, I’ll leave if a Pyro is dominating me. It’s my little way of balancing out the toughness of some of the other achievements.
23/06/2008 at 08:10 KBKarma says:
I once followed a friend into an achievement server by complete accident. The hilarious thing was, it wasn’t counting the achievements. Y’know how the latest update mentioned that some server weren’t counting the achievements? Yeah, this was one of those.
Another time, my brother joined a normal server, where people had decided to grind Pyro. He looked around, grinned, and went Soldier. He then started camping one of the opposing team’s spawn points. He got about four guys before they stopped coming out. So he went and capped the int a bit.
23/06/2008 at 10:34 Sleepydragn1 says:
I play TF2 only sometimes but, I used to play Halo 3 (don’t get me wrong, I play Source Games quite often but, I don’t play TF2 too much) and the same thing sometimes was atempted on Matchmaking. They would sometimes gather and I would go in and kick their ass which, started the regular game up again. I hate players who do that, it’s such a cheap method and also, all of the achievements (at least on Xbox 360) don’t count for anything yet people cheat like that (or at least attempt). It really is nice when you’ve been working for a achivement and you finally get it. You don’t get that feeling with Achievement Servers. At least they fixed it by having random matchmaking in Halo 3 but, this probally wouldn’t work as well in TF2 for PC because of all the mods but, they could do it with only offical maps.
23/06/2008 at 11:16 lost_e says:
I feel dirty after using one of these achievement servers for one achievement…proceeding to do about 8 more which i was on the verge of achieving…but never again will i do it.
23/06/2008 at 11:21 Kronos says:
I was on a server exactly like this, same map too.
I joined the server, not needing anymore achievements to unlock anything, I had 23 at that point, but decided to just help out or something. About 10 minutes in after escaping from the spawn point, i finally made it to the back, only to be killed again. After another 10 minutes of trying to escape the heavy at spawn, I respawned as a heavy, and proceeded to kill the first heavy, and continued to kill everyone on the red team out of spite. Then everything fell into chaos, blu vs red, for a good 3 hours, with my back to the ammo/health chest. I eventually had to start switching to soldier for a few minutes every now and then because I wouldn’t live long enough to spin up the mini gun with at least 8 Pyros flaming me. It was a fun time. :D
23/06/2008 at 11:22 Flubb says:
Valve could do two things to rectify it:
1. Allow the new weapons for free but only for a week or two. This allows everyone to try them without grinding. After the newness has worn off, only the dedicated players will be trying for the achievements.
2. Make the achievements long term based. This won’t stop the grinding, but again, if point 1 works, then only very dedicated stat wh0res and career players will gain the new unlockables. Want the new gun? 2000 kills. Want new kit? 5 million points.
My top three classes are spy, pyro and medic in that order, and it peeves me no end to play 120+ hours with them, only to have some weeny grind for a few hours and gain all the unlockables. My spyder-sense tingles because I just *know* the next class upgrade will be spy, and despite the fact it’s my career character, idiots will be running around with stupidly powerful powerups, while I have to slowly work my way up, unbalanced against the rest of them.
23/06/2008 at 11:40 Edwin Herdman says:
Outside of MMORPG, this grinding-when-you-least-expect trend started (as far as I know) in Battlefield 2. Not only did you have grinding for levels (unlocks), you also had it for the bazillion medals and ribbons and everything else. EA wipes the accounts of people reported to be engaging in such behavior, which makes it even more hilarious.
And yeah, it works pretty much the same there, except god help you if you get caught in an endless shot-revive cycle and they don’t care if you can get back into the game. That’s a good thing about TF2 – no chance of some guys fooling around with your gametime to keep you immobilized indefinitely.
23/06/2008 at 12:02 Lu-Tze says:
Flaregun? I’d never give up my shottie, until compression blast it was usually my default running around weapon.
Backburner? Sorry, compression blast is just too awesome.
Axtinguisher? Yeah actually, i’d probably use that. But Not that fussed about it.
The compression blast really DOES change things. Engineer nests have a new best friend in the form of a class that sit on a dispenser toasting anything and everything that comes near, blow away stickies with ease, and halt ubers in their tracks (or better, launch them into the air so the Sentries propel them to the far corner of the map).
Once again though, the lack of backdating does irritate me. The incidental one off achievements I can live with, like Weenie Roast and such, but i’ve got over a DAY of time clocked as Pyro, so starting with 0 fire damage just feels like a kick in the teeth. I think the adverse effect of the unlocks will decrease as the number of expanded classes increases. Obviously right now there are loads of Pyros, but still lots of Medics. It’s probably going to be Spy or Engineer next, and when that does come out the balance will shift again, but with less severity.
23/06/2008 at 12:27 Malagate says:
To quote Flubb:My spyder-sense tingles because I just *know* the next class upgrade will be spy, and despite the fact it’s my career character, idiots will be running around with stupidly powerful powerups, while I have to slowly work my way up, unbalanced against the rest of them.
Hmm, I feel I must disagree with the notion that the newer weapons unbalance the play between vanilla players and achievement players. I’ve found that as a Pyro not using any unlocked (only got the flaregun so far) that I can more than hold my own against a Pyro that’s using the full range of unlocks, it’s just a case of adeptly using the air blasts and shotgun to good effect. I get the feeling that many people forget they can air blast now, as I still rarely see it being used by other players yet when it is used effectively it can keep your team safe by knocking back those backburner Pyros amongst other neat abilities.
Judging by this it is doubtful that in the Spy update that they’d give their unlocks a massive advantage over the regular equipment, there will most definately be drawbacks for using a more specialised tool ala Pyro and Medic unlocks.
I suspect you’re right about the Spy being next though, either that or they’ll do a defensive class next:
i.e. Support->Offensive->Defensive->Repeat
I can’t wait to find out, I really hope it is the Spy as then I can easily grab more of my Pyro achievements, just as I’ve been getting my Medic achievements whilst all the Pyros are around!
23/06/2008 at 12:39 CrashT says:
Neither these unlockable, nor those available for the Medic significantly unbalance the game. Which makes me wonder why so many people seem so desperate to get their hands on them.
23/06/2008 at 12:55 Flubb says:
@Malagate
Last night I found myself consistently run over by pyros at a speed which I never had using the generic pyro weapons. It might have been my perception about the situation, but it seemed like pyros were steamrolling me regardless of what class I had (I presume the backburner option had much to do with it). My experiments with the heavy fared a little better but I was shocked at the takedown time. Even toe to toe with an unlocked pyro, I came away worse for wear.
But roll on spy unlockables :> I’ll have my vengeance on you all!
23/06/2008 at 13:19 Sam says:
@Flubb
I suspect that part of the effect you’re seeing is due to the flamethrower (both normal and Backburner) no longer having any damage fall-off. Since the damage fall-off towards the tip of the flame was previously very significant, this makes Pyros extremely effective at the kind of mid-range they normally flame at…
23/06/2008 at 13:32 COCKLES says:
Why is everyone surprised about this? TF2 is just a horrible dumbed down console version of the original for the masses.
23/06/2008 at 13:40 Malagate says:
@Sam & Flubb
Yes, flames are full power as long as they touch you, when this is combined with the slippery back-hit detection it can make a backburner quite nasty. You have to keep your distance these days, if you let them get in range then you will die quickly with or without backburners, which I think is fine as it’s wasn’t exactly hugely deadly before unless you were right next to the target.
23/06/2008 at 15:00 Derek K. says:
I’m a bit confused by the suggestion that there aren’t any normal TF2 games.
I’m one of the noobs that got sucked in by the free weekend.
Every server I visited was a normal game. I saw a ton that said “achievement server” – I avoided those, knowing what they were. I played on the Old Timer’s Guild server a lot, and on server labelled “Noobs only” and had a blast – so much so that my wife and I bought the game, and continued to play in to the night.
I found that I actually prefer servers that have a limit of 3-6 of any one class. It forces a diversity, and teaches you how to fight other folks….
Also, I found pyro to be a delightfully useless class when I played them. Anyone care to point me to a good source of guides on how to play classes well?
Also also: @cockles: Thank you. I was surprised it took that long for someone to point out how aewsum they were and bash a game because it’s “dumbed down for consoles” and not nearly as good as the original or the one they play.
23/06/2008 at 15:53 Cunzy1 1 says:
Oh man, you think it’s bad now. Wait for the sniper pack. It’ll be like CS all over again.
23/06/2008 at 18:03 KingMob says:
it’s as though someone’s stamped LIAR on my Steam page
Yes, that’s exactly what it’s like. Eventually the excitement over each new set of achievements and unlocks will die down, and people will decide for themselves whether they want to be cheaters or enjoy the game properly.
23/06/2008 at 19:50 kjinx says:
CoD4′s “unlocks” are so easy to get by just playing the game, everyone has them in a couple weeks at most there’s no need for “achievement servers”. There are lots of other interesting and fun Challenges but they’re just they’re own reward — they don’t “get” you anything. I’m working on my “golden assault” rifle — when I get it — it won’t shoot any better than the drab brown one they handed me when I first booted the game. I think CoD4 has got it right on this one. I used to play Killzone on the PS2 “ranking up mania” and glitching killed that game after about a year.
23/06/2008 at 20:14 Beatnik says:
Good article. Those achievement servers are pretty awful. I went on one to get my axe achievement, and earned the rest of my achievements through almost normal pyro play (almost because I normally don’t kill people with taunts). The pyro achievements are MUCH more in line with ‘good’ gameplay than the medi achievements, and I earned all 23 that I was looking for within 20-25 hours of play.
Alec – RPS should have a list of solid servers for different games. What server(s) do you frequent? I’ll humbly suggest my group’s server, Focusedgaming.com TF2, as an alternate server with solid teamplay, good class distributions most of the time, people who actively use VOIP, etc. I’d love to hear about other quality TF2 servers that are managed well with a solid base of regulars.
23/06/2008 at 22:47 Sentry Gun says:
I’d done achievement servers for the Medic achievements, and waded through these hellholes in that experience. These places are truly unholy places. The epitome of terrible.
I’ve since taken a liking to building Sentries in these servers, not worrying the slightest about achievements, and not tainting my records with another 1335 points in one life. While they were good in theory, the achievements cause almost everyone to go crazy about them, trying to get the weapons as fast as possible. A shame really.
24/06/2008 at 01:02 Nurdbot says:
The achivement system is horribly insane, as is the implementation and development of the rewards. VALVE really need to put their thinking caps on, because now I dread any TF2 update that promises new content.
24/06/2008 at 01:50 sigma83 says:
Derek K.: Evildaedalus has a youtube channel where he outlines how to play videos for certain classes. Go have a looksie. Glad you’re enjoying the game :D
24/06/2008 at 01:54 PTizzle says:
They really need to only allow acheivments to be gained on public servers with official maps and put some kind of restriction on servers into it.
I mean, it’s all well and dandy people want to farm them, but what’s the point of putting them into the game in the first place? Hopefully they rectify this, as I do like the idea of acheivements/gamerpoints.
24/06/2008 at 03:08 Ci2e says:
I personally don’t play TF2 anymore and I personally think if they were doing this on a custom server then what’s the crime if this was happening on every server then I can see getting canned for it…
I find myself going back to Battlefield 2 because I enjoy jets and helicopters with ants capturing everything below me. I like the support role but I don’t like trying to time every tactical event in perfect synchronization to the point where I get bored. As previously stated kits are very limiting and now you have to get 1000 kills just to get an augmented kit which probably replaces your previous base weapons. I’m almost tempted to join a server like that just to see if it really is worth 1000 kills as a pyro…
They should add a lot more weapons and gadgets but the time to balance all that would take Valve a good few years…
Is it worth the wait? hrmmm…
Whatever happened to the customer was always right?
24/06/2008 at 14:05 CrashT says:
From latest TF2 update:
“Reduced Medic’s unlockable requirements to match that of the Pyro’s. Medic players now meeting the requirements will receive their unlockables shortly after joining a server.”
24/06/2008 at 14:07 Anonymous says:
I managed to complete all the Pyro Achievements by myself using a bug with bots which allowed me to record achievements and stats in my own server.
Not much better than going into Achievement Servers, but at least I didn’t have to put up with ‘DURR U R RETARD DURR DURR’ attitude.
Of course, getting it ‘legit’ would’ve been much more satisfying, but I just wanted that Axtinguisher. :D
24/06/2008 at 14:49 moonracer says:
I haven’t played much TF2, but I enjoyed playing 2142 achievement servers a couple times. If you find a server with people that play by the rules set, something like “pistol and knife only” matches can be a fun alternative to regular game play, regardless of achievements.
24/06/2008 at 14:59 InVinoVeritas says:
I was pleasantly surprised with the latest patch that lowered the Medic achievement requirements for the unlockables. So now I’ve got my Critzcrieg, and for the life of me, I can’t figure out a situation where it’s better than the invulnerability. Any suggestions?
24/06/2008 at 15:13 Captain Bland says:
A friend of mine claims it is very effective on defence. if you’re just hanging around the point e.g. Stage 2 Cap 2 on Dustbowl you can deploy it as attackers round the corner, mowing down any enemy your heavy sees. Yes, of course you could use the Ubercharge in that scenario, but i think Kritzkrieg would be fun and pretty effective.
24/06/2008 at 19:23 FngKestrel says:
I’ve been actually taking this time with the pyro achievements to go back and work on my medic achievements.
With everyone whoring as a pyro, getting the medic’s “Infernal Medicine” was a snap.
I’m not really worried about people scrambling to get the unlockables, mainly because Valve has demonstrated great attention to game balance, and while the new items look cool, their overall usefulness is affected more by your play style than anything else.
For instance, I got the blutsauger for my medic. I played with it for a few months, realized that I really valued the crits more than the health leeching, and put the blutsauger back on the proverbial shelf.
24/06/2008 at 23:40 rpm says:
1. They should have released all of the achievements at once so that you could play a decent game of TF2. It’s been 90% medics in games to 90% Pyros and we will have to go through it 7 more times. At least in the achievement servers you know what your getting.
I am hoping they reenable the stat reset button so I can get back to my true stats.
25/06/2008 at 07:56 Anonymous says:
I hate to say this, but anybody who thinks that Valve should release all the Achievements at once has [a different opinion to me].
In the first place, it’s a LOT of time and work to come up with and code all the Achievements, and it makes no sense to be sitting on them until they’re all finished when they could easily be released in sensible packets, like, say, every class.
Secondly, if they release all the unlockables at the same time, then they will have to try to balance all the unlockables at the same time, a task comparable to the initial balancing of TF2 that we all apparently treasure so much.
Finally, it’s bad business sense. By releasing them one-by-one, they drum up new anticipation for the game. We’ve all seen how well that worked for the Pyro pack, no?
25/06/2008 at 08:39 Noc says:
Sir, by that logic . . . why release the whole GAME at once, either? I mean, if you strung out TF2′s release over the course of each map and class, each of which is a lot of work, NOTHING would have to sit there unused for a while and interest would be constantly drummed up!
I agree with Valve releasing these things one at a time. It helps keep updates coming quicker, so we aren’t waiting years for new content, and lets people get a handle on each update one at a time instead of being bombarded with dozens of new factors at once.
But those two factors (which you didn’t mention at all, notwithstanding) there are very good reasons for being DONE with something before you release it, instead of trying to get every bit of code out the door as soon as it’s compiled. The addition of unlockables will, once it’s finished, amount to a complete overhaul of the game, and it’s present, half-finished stage DOES create issues.
Similarly, balancing the unlockables against each other instead of against vanilla TF2 play would result in an arguably better solution. And unless I’m looking at this the wrong way, the actual tweaking isn’t necessarily particularly code-intensive: more damage here, less ammo there, et cetera. And what’s more, Valve has proven that they’re both capable and willing to perform such changes, which means there’s really no downside to doing so once all the cards are already on the table.
And yes, it IS engendering interest incrementally, which is good for business. But stringing players along with breadcrumbs rarely lasts – I’d say it’s only the fact presence of inventive and high-quality content in each release that keeps people excited. It’s less about “Ooh, new content,” and more about itching to see what Valve’s come up with this time.
So, yes. They’re totally going about things in the right way. But not for the reasons you mentioned.
25/06/2008 at 12:02 Crispy says:
I still cannot believe that Valve could be so oblivious to the desire for achievement maps and servers to match their ludicrously unattainable Medic achievements. All the answers clues were there if they’d asked the right questions of their design:
Q: Who is our playerbase?
A: A wide audience, from casual to hardcore players.
Q: Will all of the players have the ability to get the weapons through normal play?
A: No.
Q: Who will want the new weapons?
A: Almost every single player will feel they have a right to access the content in the game they paid for.
Q: Are there any easy methods to gaining the achievements?
A: Yes. Organisation (a.k.a. farming, a practise not uncommon in other multiplayer games, such as MMOs)
Q: Do these shortcut methods sit happily with the intended TF2 experience?
A: No. Clearly achievement farming is a tedious and self-interested process.
The question isn’t whether they created the monster, the question is more whether they did so through incompetance or ambivalence. They’ve improved how accessible the weapons are for average players, but they also forced their players down the path to achievement farming because it was the only logical option for someone who has limited time to play (which Valve has always stated is the type of player they have tried to cater to with TF2) but a lot of ludicrously randomly-occurring/unintuitive/counter-productive achievements.
25/06/2008 at 14:28 NIck says:
As a casual player, I dont like when a hardcore player is “given” improved weapons and health. To make it fair to me they should just unlock my weapons when I have played a certain amount of total time or give me a temporary weapon until I respawn when I kill someone with all the cool toys.
25/06/2008 at 18:31 Anonymous says:
@Noc: Those two points are along what I meant for my first point, because that’s WHY you wouldn’t sit on the entire thing until they’re all done. I just completely failed to make that clear.
That said, I was mainly considering it more from the developer’s perspective. One of the things that really gets me is when people complain and go “Why didn’t the developer do something this way?!” when if they thought about it from the developer’s perspective for even a little bit, they’d understand.
For some other points: You wouldn’t release the game in increments because that, too, is bad business sense [though I think some other game developers have gotten away with making people pay for unplaytested games]. The new unlockables would have to be balanced against the original weapons, as well, and of course it’s much harder to get 27 weapons at once correct than it is to get three at a time.
28/06/2008 at 00:22 Mini says:
Honestly, you have to [have a different opinion to me] to play on a pub, and you do, in all fact, deserve to be spawn-camped by an endless stream of mouthbreathers who call you a retard because, congratulations, you didn’t put a lock on the server.
29/06/2008 at 04:09 Jeremy says:
I only got to play for the couple of days it was out for free but, I was still able to follow and that was, well, quite hilarious.
29/06/2008 at 18:53 neilyo says:
why the fuck should i have to play 1000 hours if i want to play the game with decent weapons? [I am angry that some people have a different opinion to me] im going to achievment server for 30 minutes then play real for 1. better than the alternative. lol am i demeaning the value of the game fuk that.
29/06/2008 at 19:04 Al3xand3r says:
You’re only showing [that you have a different opinion] really. It certainly doesn’t take 1000 hours to get the achievements and you can certainly play the game with decent weapons right out of the box (or digital download). The achievement weapons won’t make you a better player, nor more efficient, and this kind of mindset shows you’ll never be good at the game if you aren’t willing to sit down and play enough to actually learn the game. But that’s your loss, not anyone else’s. You’re the one who will be bored of or frustrated with the game you paid for. Especially since you get so easily frustrated that you come in here swearing out of the blue. I expect you’ll be doing a lot of that swearing online also but oh well, you’ll just get muted and keep dying miserable deaths :)
29/06/2008 at 20:15 Erlam says:
“The achievement weapons won’t make you a better player, nor more efficient, and this kind of mindset shows you’ll never be good at the game if you aren’t willing to sit down and play enough to actually learn the game.”
The Medic needler. Explain how the new one isn’t far, far better than the standard one. Or the Pyro’s Backburner. 50 more health and insta-crit from behind?
30/06/2008 at 09:32 Anonymous says:
@Erlam: Actually, since the Blutsauger removes the possibility of crits, it actually does less damage than the normal one, so if a Medic kills you with one they probably had a fair chance of killing you with the Syringe Gun. Besides which, if you are a good offensive class, you should be able to kill a Medic anyway; Medics are still pretty squishy overall.
The Backburner, however, I do think is a little overpowered. I’ve heard a number of suggestions such as lowering the 50 health to 25 or replacing it with a speed boost, and I think those would probably be a better option. Regardless, due to the lack of damage fall-off on the Pyro’s flamethrower now, if any Pyro sneaks up behind you their chances of killing you are pretty good anyway.
03/07/2008 at 02:55 Airdoo says:
I couldn’t care less about the idiots who play on Achievement Servers, I just hate how now most real server boxes have put a class amount limit so I can’t play as the Pyro which I have enjoyed since first played TF2. I unlocked all the new weapons honestly thinking that I don’t care about the new stuff if I get it whoop de do, if not oh well better luck next time. I only asked when the how many achievements where needed for each milestone but that was it and I occasionally checked the number of achievements I had. So now I use the flare gun and Axtinguisher and then switch between the Backburner, on larger maps when I need to be sneaky, and then the regular Flamethrower when I have to be defensive or need to get to point A to B with the most amount of health by using the air blast to clear stickies, missiles and players. Also the Heavy is then next class to get the Achievements for those who want to get started.
04/07/2008 at 07:23 Krupo says:
Wonder how many people will be caught by surprise when they find out the next pack is actually for the heavy. Damn, the TF2 blog is certainly an interesting source of news. :)
21/07/2008 at 21:39 sam says:
im so pissed! my little bro did one of these to get unlocks and now i hide my steam page in shame…:(
30/07/2008 at 03:26 Stevo says:
Today I finally started playing Medic, and I did so for about three hours. I thought to myself “I wounder what the “Blutsucker” is like, or the “Urber Saw”. So I went into an achievements server, and did some achievements… only to be extremly disapointed in myself. Now I’ve got two new Medic items, a ruined stats sheet, and a small dislike for the game. I came upon this page (Which, by the way, is brilliently written and enjoyable to read) while searching the web relentlessly for a way to reset my achievements and stats… :’(
31/08/2008 at 04:12 Chris says:
What is everyone complaining about? These kind of servers knock out 2 kinds of flamers out of normal gameplay:
1: Normally, if there were no achievement maps, then players would be spamming servers trying to get every single achievement, and nothing else. Yes, we already have them, but in fewer quantities, and now when they come to public servers they have many fewer achievements to spam, meaning they’re done sooner.
2.) Straight up flamers. They’re having a ball pissing off other people trying to get these achievements, rather than joining real servers, and mic spamming, ubering enemy spys on purpose, etc. The more that are spamming these games, are the fewer that are pissing you off in the main servers.
18/09/2008 at 20:54 Wah says:
Seems that some of you take this game pretty seriously. This is tf2 not WoW.
how many people do you think bought this game so they could grind achievements? First person shooters are not about completing tasks that are of no use to your team just so you can have access to all of the equipment.
They are about everyone being on the same level using the same gear with skill/teamwork being the deciding factors.
18/10/2008 at 06:01 Fartnog Buttstinkle says:
I like how John P. felt the need to point out that they’re all “homophobic 12 year old american halo kids” as opposed to say, the Canadian, German, British, etc. kids who are all well-spoken, well-mannered angels.
26/12/2008 at 12:45 Kodaz says:
I hate achievements.
I bought Team Fortress 2 about one week ago, and I was amazed to see the oh-so-great items my long time playing friends had and I, the newbie, had not.
It really spoils some of the fun for me as some of the items has more advantages than disadvantages, for example the über-saw. Maybe if I had saw each update a time I would’nt be so disappointed, but I bought the game and BAM! One hundred achievments to unlock if you want the whole experience. I mean, some achievements are okay, but the ones like: Got a Light or OMGWTFBBQ are purely circunstancial and useless to get, you end up fucking up your team’s game if you try to get them. I’m not saying that I endorse achievements servers, I think it’s against the objective of a team-based game like TF2, but again, so are the achievements to me.
23/03/2009 at 23:52 peter says:
“you end up fucking up your team’s game if you try to get them”
that’s how i feel sometimes. most achievements seem to be geared towards playing the class how it’s meant to be played, but there are a few thrown in that will end up in the player hurting their team for the sake of a colored icon.
that’s the reason i joined an achievement server. i had already earned enough pyro achievements by playing normally to unlock all 3 weapons, yet i found myself wasting time trying to get achievements i didn’t really need for anything, so i joined an achievement server and took care of them so i could go back to playing the game normally.
so i have no problem with achievement servers if you only use them once you’ve unlocked the items for that class. otherwise it’s just annoying, but whatever, i’ll be happier with my sandman when i’ve earned it.
20/04/2009 at 20:04 Jason says:
The Pyro Gun makes Pyros kinda like snipers.. I don’t like it :(.
24/04/2009 at 00:04 Patrick says:
I read this article soon after having spent about an hour and a half on an achievement server. It had to be the most retarded hour and a half of gaming in my life. Pyro’s my favorite class, and although I’m not in any rush to get those shiny new Pyro weapons, I did grind my way to a flare gun. Wasn’t too difficult, as I only needed four or five achievements to get it. What kept me playing was a sick fascination, sort of like wasting time watching weird video clips on ebaumsworld.com, or something like that. An hour and a half of mowing down bots (something like ten spies and one heavy), and the odd brave soul, or fool, who decided to play for the BLU bots.
Anyway, I’ve got no problem with the achievement servers. They’re a bit ridiculous, somewhat pathetic, and mildly amusing. I just doubt I’ll play on them anymore.
11/07/2009 at 21:31 Internetpope says:
You have to admit GRIEFING on an achievement server is a great thing to behold, though it seems these days people are far more silent and don’t use ‘retard’ at all.
Some whiny people use voteban, and it’s even more fun when they can’t voteban you because other players actually like you.
However, I do use achievement servers sometimes, mostly only for the achievements that you’d fuck your team for if you tried to get them. Also, I already have all of the unlocks so i’m not gaining much.
23/08/2009 at 07:41 Ketamonkey says:
You’re a pretty decent writer. That was an enjoyable, smart read.