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	<title>Comments on: Space Wheeze</title>
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	<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/</link>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-82478</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Aug 2008 14:04:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-82478</guid>
		<description>I liked Dungeon Siege.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I liked Dungeon Siege.</p>
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		<title>By: Adjudicator</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-82364</link>
		<dc:creator>Adjudicator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Aug 2008 10:32:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-82364</guid>
		<description>Well since we all know the problems with Space Siege I think SupCom is a more interesting topic.

SupCom vanilla was an OK game, not great, mostly because of multiplayer. The single player always sucked, and the multiplayer had potential, but had serious problems with the way it was structured. As a competitive RTS player, I didn&#039;t really care about the SP but the MP had to work.

SupCom Forged Alliance is a much better game (multiplayer wise). The SP probably still sucks, I didn&#039;t even bother playing it. The AI is horrible in skirmish mode- it doesnt really bother me, but it will bother some. Multiplayer though, is good. Not Starcraft good or Company of Heroes good, but good enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well since we all know the problems with Space Siege I think SupCom is a more interesting topic.</p>
<p>SupCom vanilla was an OK game, not great, mostly because of multiplayer. The single player always sucked, and the multiplayer had potential, but had serious problems with the way it was structured. As a competitive RTS player, I didn&#8217;t really care about the SP but the MP had to work.</p>
<p>SupCom Forged Alliance is a much better game (multiplayer wise). The SP probably still sucks, I didn&#8217;t even bother playing it. The AI is horrible in skirmish mode- it doesnt really bother me, but it will bother some. Multiplayer though, is good. Not Starcraft good or Company of Heroes good, but good enough.</p>
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		<title>By: Hmm-hmm.</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81797</link>
		<dc:creator>Hmm-hmm.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Aug 2008 22:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81797</guid>
		<description>For some reason I feel the name &#039;Alec Meer&#039; would be quite fitting for a main character in a novel by H.P. Lovecraft.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For some reason I feel the name &#8216;Alec Meer&#8217; would be quite fitting for a main character in a novel by H.P. Lovecraft.</p>
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		<title>By: LionsPhil</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81714</link>
		<dc:creator>LionsPhil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Aug 2008 15:04:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81714</guid>
		<description>The annoying thing with SupCom:FA is that they dropped a spanner in the AI.

Fighting the SupCom hardest skirmish AI: tense. You&#039;d get odd, probing attacks, and then an experimental would show up and say hi. You actually needed to do a bit of intel, which sounds dangerously like &lt;em&gt;strategy&lt;/em&gt;.

Fighting the FA hardest (non-cheating) skirmish AI: yawn. It sets up a bunch of factories and repeat-builds a trickle of tier one units into the gaping maw of your defensive line, and will be lucky to get that up to T2 before you can steamroll it with a Monkeylord. It can be a little &lt;em&gt;exhausting&lt;/em&gt; if it starts to overwhelm your engineering resources, but it&#039;s never really &lt;em&gt;challenging&lt;/em&gt;.

And, as always, neither can build sensible bases, save for some prescripted defence outposts.

The singleplayer campaign is a joke, with the usual SupCom dichotomy of being bitched about the need for haste which, as the PC GAMER review observed, is a great way to make the following objective nigh-impossible. The whole unite-against-red-team&#039;s-AI-gone-bad thing is such a direct rip from CABAL that it&#039;s cringeworthy. I ended up playing Firestorm &lt;em&gt;after&lt;/em&gt; this and, frankly, it did it &lt;em&gt;better&lt;/em&gt;. TibSun, the unloved runt of the C&amp;C series, outdoing the direct descendent of Total Annihilation. What the fnord.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The annoying thing with SupCom:FA is that they dropped a spanner in the AI.</p>
<p>Fighting the SupCom hardest skirmish AI: tense. You&#8217;d get odd, probing attacks, and then an experimental would show up and say hi. You actually needed to do a bit of intel, which sounds dangerously like <em>strategy</em>.</p>
<p>Fighting the FA hardest (non-cheating) skirmish AI: yawn. It sets up a bunch of factories and repeat-builds a trickle of tier one units into the gaping maw of your defensive line, and will be lucky to get that up to T2 before you can steamroll it with a Monkeylord. It can be a little <em>exhausting</em> if it starts to overwhelm your engineering resources, but it&#8217;s never really <em>challenging</em>.</p>
<p>And, as always, neither can build sensible bases, save for some prescripted defence outposts.</p>
<p>The singleplayer campaign is a joke, with the usual SupCom dichotomy of being bitched about the need for haste which, as the PC GAMER review observed, is a great way to make the following objective nigh-impossible. The whole unite-against-red-team&#8217;s-AI-gone-bad thing is such a direct rip from CABAL that it&#8217;s cringeworthy. I ended up playing Firestorm <em>after</em> this and, frankly, it did it <em>better</em>. TibSun, the unloved runt of the C&amp;C series, outdoing the direct descendent of Total Annihilation. What the fnord.</p>
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		<title>By: maxmcg</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81649</link>
		<dc:creator>maxmcg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:47:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81649</guid>
		<description>Decide to check out Shadowgrounds and bought it off Steam. Played it *all* weekend. Great little game!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Decide to check out Shadowgrounds and bought it off Steam. Played it *all* weekend. Great little game!</p>
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		<title>By: caesarbear</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81645</link>
		<dc:creator>caesarbear</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Aug 2008 06:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81645</guid>
		<description>The SupCom campaign doesn&#039;t really have any AI, it&#039;s just scripted as you say Gap Gen. The singleplayer skirmish has AI. In Forged Alliance it&#039;s actually pretty damn good without cheating, and of course, it&#039;s best when played in multiplayer.

The reason why SupCom adds strategy is because it expands the play area and how you interact with it. Much the same way Total War is more than just two lines of units in any other RTS. I think there&#039;s quite a lot to SupCom that you&#039;re missing Gap Gen. The spectacle is not point.

Hopefully the same team will be working on Demigod.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The SupCom campaign doesn&#8217;t really have any AI, it&#8217;s just scripted as you say Gap Gen. The singleplayer skirmish has AI. In Forged Alliance it&#8217;s actually pretty damn good without cheating, and of course, it&#8217;s best when played in multiplayer.</p>
<p>The reason why SupCom adds strategy is because it expands the play area and how you interact with it. Much the same way Total War is more than just two lines of units in any other RTS. I think there&#8217;s quite a lot to SupCom that you&#8217;re missing Gap Gen. The spectacle is not point.</p>
<p>Hopefully the same team will be working on Demigod.</p>
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		<title>By: exGasser</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81632</link>
		<dc:creator>exGasser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Aug 2008 02:27:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81632</guid>
		<description>Dear god I love this review, and comments.. It almost helps deal with the giant scar in my life from working for Taylor for years and years.. Thank you all.

And yeah Duoae, a lot of us left after DS, althought more left after DS2 than DS1. Taylor talks big, but in the end he really is just full of gas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear god I love this review, and comments.. It almost helps deal with the giant scar in my life from working for Taylor for years and years.. Thank you all.</p>
<p>And yeah Duoae, a lot of us left after DS, althought more left after DS2 than DS1. Taylor talks big, but in the end he really is just full of gas.</p>
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		<title>By: Gap Gen</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81303</link>
		<dc:creator>Gap Gen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:17:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81303</guid>
		<description>&lt;cite&gt;God forbid someone tries to add some strategy into the genre.&lt;/cite&gt;
Yeah, that&#039;d be good. Someone on another forum said of TA/Sup Com that rather than making one factory and producing ten tanks, you make ten factories and produce 500 tanks. There&#039;s no real tactical difference. TA did have some interesting tactics, but much of it was spectacle. It&#039;s a shame Sup Com loses that a bit simply because when zoomed out, a Colossus exploding looks much like a peewee exploding when zoomed in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><cite>God forbid someone tries to add some strategy into the genre.</cite><br />
Yeah, that&#8217;d be good. Someone on another forum said of TA/Sup Com that rather than making one factory and producing ten tanks, you make ten factories and produce 500 tanks. There&#8217;s no real tactical difference. TA did have some interesting tactics, but much of it was spectacle. It&#8217;s a shame Sup Com loses that a bit simply because when zoomed out, a Colossus exploding looks much like a peewee exploding when zoomed in.</p>
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		<title>By: Gap Gen</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81302</link>
		<dc:creator>Gap Gen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81302</guid>
		<description>&lt;cite&gt;I never get this argument. Clearly Dungeon Siege was a waste of time and could have benefited from better characters and story, but I fail to see how SupCom needs that. I never understand the criticism that allowing a strategic overview is somehow a strike against an RTS. God forbid someone tries to add some strategy into the genre.&lt;/cite&gt;
What my comment in parenthesis meant was: Regardless as to whether Chris Taylor can write (he can&#039;t), the single player AI does nothing more than stream scripted waves of units at you until you pop their factories. The campaign is hard simply because of the number of forces the enemy can throw at you with their given scripting, rather than giving you the feeling of accomplishment at having destroyed a worthy adversary.

No doubt the multiplayer is different, but the AI at least isn&#039;t very convincing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><cite>I never get this argument. Clearly Dungeon Siege was a waste of time and could have benefited from better characters and story, but I fail to see how SupCom needs that. I never understand the criticism that allowing a strategic overview is somehow a strike against an RTS. God forbid someone tries to add some strategy into the genre.</cite><br />
What my comment in parenthesis meant was: Regardless as to whether Chris Taylor can write (he can&#8217;t), the single player AI does nothing more than stream scripted waves of units at you until you pop their factories. The campaign is hard simply because of the number of forces the enemy can throw at you with their given scripting, rather than giving you the feeling of accomplishment at having destroyed a worthy adversary.</p>
<p>No doubt the multiplayer is different, but the AI at least isn&#8217;t very convincing.</p>
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		<title>By: Optimaximal</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81242</link>
		<dc:creator>Optimaximal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 10:52:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81242</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve NEVER liked Chris Taylor&#039;s games...  Yes, they may be a bit more cerebral than their contemporaries and do sometimes push the boundaries of the hardware they&#039;re played on, but they&#039;re often boring, dull, generic and lacking in anything that makes me want to play them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve NEVER liked Chris Taylor&#8217;s games&#8230;  Yes, they may be a bit more cerebral than their contemporaries and do sometimes push the boundaries of the hardware they&#8217;re played on, but they&#8217;re often boring, dull, generic and lacking in anything that makes me want to play them.</p>
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		<title>By: Duoae</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81231</link>
		<dc:creator>Duoae</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 08:59:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81231</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve not got enough time to read through the rest of the comments (Or more accurately i&#039;m not going to make the time ;)) but my thoughts on this game were always, &quot;It looks crap&quot;.

Seriously, Dungeon siege 2 was rubbish compared with the original and Space Siege always looked like an empty shell of a game devoid of something that you could learn to love. Even Demigod looks pretty lacklustre and i have no intent of even renting that game when it comes out. I just feel that since Total Annhilation and Dungeon Siege all of their other games designs just aren&#039;t working. I didn&#039;t like Supreme Commander though i bought that because i loved TA so much.

I don&#039;t know what&#039;s happened to the studio but has there been a big change in staff within the period following DS 1?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve not got enough time to read through the rest of the comments (Or more accurately i&#8217;m not going to make the time ;)) but my thoughts on this game were always, &#8220;It looks crap&#8221;.</p>
<p>Seriously, Dungeon siege 2 was rubbish compared with the original and Space Siege always looked like an empty shell of a game devoid of something that you could learn to love. Even Demigod looks pretty lacklustre and i have no intent of even renting that game when it comes out. I just feel that since Total Annhilation and Dungeon Siege all of their other games designs just aren&#8217;t working. I didn&#8217;t like Supreme Commander though i bought that because i loved TA so much.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know what&#8217;s happened to the studio but has there been a big change in staff within the period following DS 1?</p>
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		<title>By: caesarbear</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/08/22/space-wheeze/comment-page-1/#comment-81173</link>
		<dc:creator>caesarbear</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 23:50:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=2370#comment-81173</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Chris Taylor turned the RTS into space invaders&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I never get this argument. Clearly Dungeon Siege was a waste of time and could have benefited from better characters and story, but I fail to see how SupCom needs that. I never understand the criticism that allowing a strategic overview is somehow a strike against an RTS. God forbid someone tries to add some strategy into the genre.

I don&#039;t like story cutscenes interrupting my gameplay as is. Most RTS games that try to tell a story fail miserably, because the format is not right for story telling. You have to concoct completely unbelievable reasons for why you&#039;re always rebuilding that barracks or rediscovering that tech. The alternative is to sacrifice gameplay and freedom for story, and that&#039;s hardly a positive imo.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Chris Taylor turned the RTS into space invaders</p></blockquote>
<p>I never get this argument. Clearly Dungeon Siege was a waste of time and could have benefited from better characters and story, but I fail to see how SupCom needs that. I never understand the criticism that allowing a strategic overview is somehow a strike against an RTS. God forbid someone tries to add some strategy into the genre.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t like story cutscenes interrupting my gameplay as is. Most RTS games that try to tell a story fail miserably, because the format is not right for story telling. You have to concoct completely unbelievable reasons for why you&#8217;re always rebuilding that barracks or rediscovering that tech. The alternative is to sacrifice gameplay and freedom for story, and that&#8217;s hardly a positive imo.</p>
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