Comments on: Dragon Age: Origins: Origins

By: Jochen Scheisse

Jochen Scheisse — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 17:10:19 +0000

Well, I enjoy rolling candy shovels full of dice for my part. Cyberpunk is also nice of course, but the fixed target number – amount of successes thing feels easier to judge to me.

By: Funky Badger

Funky Badger — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 08:44:59 +0000

I’ve always hated the WoD system – too many dice, ditto for SR, although I’ve not used v4.0. Most elegant system is clearly Interlock, a.k.a. Cyberpunk 2020. (FYI: Stat + Skill + Exploding d10 vs. Difficulty number/Opposed Roll and that’s aboot it)

By: Jochen Scheisse

Jochen Scheisse — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 00:11:11 +0000

You think so? I always felt that it was just as simplified as it needed to be, complete with a good point build system. Look at Shadowrun 4.0, it essentially copied all the good parts of nWoD.

By: Funky Badger

Funky Badger — Sat, 01 Nov 2008 00:02:55 +0000

Heh, WoD had an unlovely clunky system in 1991, and it’s only got worse since… ;-)

By: Jochen Scheisse

Jochen Scheisse — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 23:39:43 +0000

And the replacement for D20 has IMO always been WoD style. Rolling Attributes was old in the 80s.

By: Jochen Scheisse

Jochen Scheisse — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 22:01:35 +0000

Looks and sounds just great. I’m really looking forward to this.

By: Funky Badger

Funky Badger — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 18:28:24 +0000

@Trithemius

“In the BG games if you are not casting spells or using items your choice is “point my character at this enemy or that enemy”. All the “decisions” are being made randomly by the computer as it plays AD&D2e in the background.”

So apart from when you’re making decisions, you’re making, umm, some different decisions? I think Oblivion’s at the other end of the “interactive combat” spectrum, as you have to hit a key for each strike, I always thought the BG games’ combat was quite fitting but YMMV.

And, as James G alluded to, D20 is dead (and somewhat ironically the replacement is becoming a pen and paper version of WoW. Hang on, I didn’t mean ironically, I meant incestuously)

By: James G

James G — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 12:23:36 +0000

@Trithemius

Dragon Age isn’t D20, its Bioware’s own system which although pause and play makes use of more complex calculations that would be possible with a simple D20 system. Furthermore, they have introduced more variety to fighter characters’ approaches, giving them something more akin to the variety usually seen with magic users.

By: Angel Dust

Angel Dust — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 09:28:11 +0000

Man, it seems like a real step backward from Mass Effect in terms of animation, voice acting and writing.

By: Trithemius

Trithemius — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 03:19:04 +0000

(Sorry for the serial postings, the formatting was looking a bit hinky when I tried to consolidate them)
@Fumarole
Someone liked Mass Effect’s combat? Wow.
ME’s combat felt more like I was playing a computer game and less like I was watching a machinima of a D&D session.
Perhaps this is a problem for me because I tend to split my time between playing computer games and playing RPGs so I am not seriously jonesing for the next computerised version of tabletop RPG combat?

By: Trithemius

Trithemius — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 03:17:40 +0000

@theanorak
Bioware make a “spiritual successor” to Baldur’s Gate and everyone complains that haven’t moved on since 1802 and why-oh-why are we still using the same combat/world/tropes/etc.

It’s not the “spiritual successor” bit that vexes me – it’s the it’s the same *game* bit. I’d like something that draws me into the game a bit more, that requires that I respond to in-game events rather than just watch.

The tropes don’t bother me at all, it’s a deliberate positioning of the colour of the game. It’d be like saying “WTF Nazis again” in a game about the Normandy invasions.

I’m certain I’ll purchase and play, and quite probably enjoy, this game. I just can’t help but think that an opportunity was lost here. Who better than BioWare is in a position to experiment with this sort of thing?

For the record, I hate this Angry Internet Man thing. It’s a piece of enabling terminology that allows people discount criticism on the basis that someone else is making similar criticisms in a more strident fashion.

By: Trithemius

Trithemius — Fri, 31 Oct 2008 03:02:27 +0000

TW games and Kings Bounty are games where the combat is abstracted or scaled up. In TW games the decisions I am making are strategic and operational, with tactical decisions being mostly in the realm of “this hill or that hill” or “charge now, or regroup first”. Combat in Kings Bounty is more like a kind of hallucinatory chess game.

In both of these examples thought the choices made are meaningful. In the BG games if you are not casting spells or using items your choice is “point my character at this enemy or that enemy”. All the “decisions” are being made randomly by the computer as it plays AD&D2e in the background.

I can’t help but feel that this is pretty wasteful thing to do with a computer. It’d essentially like watching someone play D&D very quickly with the difference being that you are alone.

I played Secret of the Silver Blades, Wake of the Ravager, the Baldur’s Gates, the Icewind Dales, Dungeon Siege, and the Diablos. I enjoyed these games when I played them. I just think that now maybe CRPG designers could do something more clever and interesting with their combat systems, something that leverages the capabilities of the platform at bit more. We’ve been doing this stuff for 20 years now…

(Oh shit, did I say leverage? Jesus…)