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	<title>Comments on: Stranded Beyond The Wormhole</title>
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	<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/</link>
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		<title>By: Deerhoof</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-194840</link>
		<dc:creator>Deerhoof</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 12:41:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-194840</guid>
		<description>A few points after reading this entire comments thread.

My corp has been living in a single wormhole system for a couple of months now. It is a Class 5 with a Pulsar Anomaly.

We have a member who is barely 3 months into the game, and is already a very active and useful member of the team.
Living out of a large POS, and relying on your fellow corpmates for things like, scanning out new entrances/exits to empire (to allow members who have left the wormhole for shopping or industrial reasons, OR if they&#039;ve been podded), for running Class 5 Mag/Radar plex in a team of BS, harvesting/hauling Fullerite Gas (C-320 ftw!), scanning the system each day for the new sites/wh&#039;s, and many other things.

All these things we do as a corp, and the new members who are still learning the tricks of EVE, are getting a full experience out here. Being a low SP character doesn&#039;t prevent you from taking advantage of wormholes, even if you can&#039;t set up structures in one of the systems. They can be involved in the logistics, they can haul or harvest VALUABLE gas (6000 units of 320 is worth a billion ISK or more), there&#039;s always opportunity to learn how to use the new scanning system (I love it), and overall, it teaches you how to operate as part of a team.

The PvP within wormholes is superb, and in my opinion has hailed a new era in eve combat. 
The mechanics of wormholes mean several things, 
1, USUALLY no capital ships, being too large to fit in most wormholes, these are very rare to find in w-space.
2, the death of blob-warfare. There&#039;s very little chance of hopping into a wormhole to find yourself confronted by a 50 man roaming HAC gang
3, No local list, means hunting is easier, your prey will not always instantly notice you, or your combat probes, on their scanner. Similarly if you&#039;re mining or harvesting etc, you have to be more vigilant, and keep your eyes on that scanner window looking for hostile probes.

.. and if you DO find yourself with hostile neighbours, you can rest safe in the knowledge that after downtime the next day, the wormhole will no longer lead to their system.

An experienced, high skillpoint player, will fare the same as a relatively low sp player in wh-systems.
The NPC&#039;s are fearsome (in the higher class systems), the logistics require consideration, but the rewards are huge)
The mining/scanning/harvesting requires the most basic of specialized skills, and many different types of ships are adaptable to do these things. 

As a few others on this thread have mentioned, Apocrypha has piqued my interest once again, in a game that I felt was going a little stale.

I&#039;m planning to go on a week-long ramble through wormhole space, from WH to WH in a cov ops with a friend in a combat ship, seeing what there is to see, going where the ever-shifting tide of wormholes takes me. 
If it&#039;s note-worthy, I will report on the trip when I&#039;m safely back in my C5.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few points after reading this entire comments thread.</p>
<p>My corp has been living in a single wormhole system for a couple of months now. It is a Class 5 with a Pulsar Anomaly.</p>
<p>We have a member who is barely 3 months into the game, and is already a very active and useful member of the team.<br />
Living out of a large POS, and relying on your fellow corpmates for things like, scanning out new entrances/exits to empire (to allow members who have left the wormhole for shopping or industrial reasons, OR if they&#8217;ve been podded), for running Class 5 Mag/Radar plex in a team of BS, harvesting/hauling Fullerite Gas (C-320 ftw!), scanning the system each day for the new sites/wh&#8217;s, and many other things.</p>
<p>All these things we do as a corp, and the new members who are still learning the tricks of EVE, are getting a full experience out here. Being a low SP character doesn&#8217;t prevent you from taking advantage of wormholes, even if you can&#8217;t set up structures in one of the systems. They can be involved in the logistics, they can haul or harvest VALUABLE gas (6000 units of 320 is worth a billion ISK or more), there&#8217;s always opportunity to learn how to use the new scanning system (I love it), and overall, it teaches you how to operate as part of a team.</p>
<p>The PvP within wormholes is superb, and in my opinion has hailed a new era in eve combat.<br />
The mechanics of wormholes mean several things,<br />
1, USUALLY no capital ships, being too large to fit in most wormholes, these are very rare to find in w-space.<br />
2, the death of blob-warfare. There&#8217;s very little chance of hopping into a wormhole to find yourself confronted by a 50 man roaming HAC gang<br />
3, No local list, means hunting is easier, your prey will not always instantly notice you, or your combat probes, on their scanner. Similarly if you&#8217;re mining or harvesting etc, you have to be more vigilant, and keep your eyes on that scanner window looking for hostile probes.</p>
<p>.. and if you DO find yourself with hostile neighbours, you can rest safe in the knowledge that after downtime the next day, the wormhole will no longer lead to their system.</p>
<p>An experienced, high skillpoint player, will fare the same as a relatively low sp player in wh-systems.<br />
The NPC&#8217;s are fearsome (in the higher class systems), the logistics require consideration, but the rewards are huge)<br />
The mining/scanning/harvesting requires the most basic of specialized skills, and many different types of ships are adaptable to do these things. </p>
<p>As a few others on this thread have mentioned, Apocrypha has piqued my interest once again, in a game that I felt was going a little stale.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m planning to go on a week-long ramble through wormhole space, from WH to WH in a cov ops with a friend in a combat ship, seeing what there is to see, going where the ever-shifting tide of wormholes takes me.<br />
If it&#8217;s note-worthy, I will report on the trip when I&#8217;m safely back in my C5.</p>
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		<title>By: Zephyr</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-192445</link>
		<dc:creator>Zephyr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 02:48:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-192445</guid>
		<description>Wormholes are amazingly good fun.

I&#039;ve been playing the game under a month and my corp and I are capable of hauling in loots totalling 200,000,000+ from certain sleeper sites.

Join an established wormholing corp and get a BC with decent shield resists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wormholes are amazingly good fun.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve been playing the game under a month and my corp and I are capable of hauling in loots totalling 200,000,000+ from certain sleeper sites.</p>
<p>Join an established wormholing corp and get a BC with decent shield resists.</p>
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		<title>By: silverx10</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-189649</link>
		<dc:creator>silverx10</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 May 2009 04:30:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-189649</guid>
		<description>Agreed, EVE has a painfully steep learning curve.  I&#039;ve been playing for three days now, and still have essentially no idea what&#039;s going on.  Each item has almost an infinite number of attributes which only adds to the confusion, and the time it takes to actually learn new skills is ridiculous.

Though it does give you a reason to stop playing every now and again.  After all, if you have to wait for a few hours to learn the requisite skill to pilot a cruiser, what else are you gonna do?  Mine?  Yeah, okay.

In closing, I&#039;d say that the game definitely holds promise, but the difficulty factor is keeping me wary about its survivability: at least in my life.

Through all three games I&#039;ve played, I&#039;d say the difficulty flows as such (in order of most difficult to easiest):

EVE Online &gt; EverQuest 2 &gt; World of Warcraft

But I agree with other posters: reading posts like this makes me want to perservere and see how far I can make it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed, EVE has a painfully steep learning curve.  I&#8217;ve been playing for three days now, and still have essentially no idea what&#8217;s going on.  Each item has almost an infinite number of attributes which only adds to the confusion, and the time it takes to actually learn new skills is ridiculous.</p>
<p>Though it does give you a reason to stop playing every now and again.  After all, if you have to wait for a few hours to learn the requisite skill to pilot a cruiser, what else are you gonna do?  Mine?  Yeah, okay.</p>
<p>In closing, I&#8217;d say that the game definitely holds promise, but the difficulty factor is keeping me wary about its survivability: at least in my life.</p>
<p>Through all three games I&#8217;ve played, I&#8217;d say the difficulty flows as such (in order of most difficult to easiest):</p>
<p>EVE Online &gt; EverQuest 2 &gt; World of Warcraft</p>
<p>But I agree with other posters: reading posts like this makes me want to perservere and see how far I can make it.</p>
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		<title>By: psyk</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-178498</link>
		<dc:creator>psyk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 02:48:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-178498</guid>
		<description>&quot;I can’t see you soloing these sleepers in anything smaller.&quot; was soloing sleepers in a wolf but then the wh went pop and I had to self destruct my ship and pod was a happy day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I can’t see you soloing these sleepers in anything smaller.&#8221; was soloing sleepers in a wolf but then the wh went pop and I had to self destruct my ship and pod was a happy day.</p>
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		<title>By: ucnt</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-178490</link>
		<dc:creator>ucnt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 02:14:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-178490</guid>
		<description>Thats not that bad -- how bout this one...

So I found a WH in the same system I had a pos at, I spent 3 hours going in and out in small ships running anomolies  in the system taking out some sleeper loot.  

Leaving my scanner ship at my pos, i went in one last time finished an anomoly, and fly back to the wormhole to get my salvager ship -- and what do I see on overview?

NOTHING

yep you guess it, stuck all alone in a WH with no probes to find my way out..

Now thats a bitch ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thats not that bad &#8212; how bout this one&#8230;</p>
<p>So I found a WH in the same system I had a pos at, I spent 3 hours going in and out in small ships running anomolies  in the system taking out some sleeper loot.  </p>
<p>Leaving my scanner ship at my pos, i went in one last time finished an anomoly, and fly back to the wormhole to get my salvager ship &#8212; and what do I see on overview?</p>
<p>NOTHING</p>
<p>yep you guess it, stuck all alone in a WH with no probes to find my way out..</p>
<p>Now thats a bitch ;)</p>
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		<title>By: schmunkel98</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-168254</link>
		<dc:creator>schmunkel98</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 20:05:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-168254</guid>
		<description>To add to what Fergie said on the new player experience:

I had been playing WoW(flamesuit activated) for a while and craved a SCI-FI MMO. EVE looked like a great fit. The offline skill system appears great until you realize the amount of time it will take you to actually be able to do anything effectively. This can be months away or even years depending on your goal.  Yes, you can go out there and PvP in a frigate with relatively low skillpoints, but you are going to be extremely easy pickings. About the only thing you can do in EVE from the start effectively is mining and mission running. These are incredibly boring with the exception of the more advanced missions that require much larger ships and friends to be able to do. 

I played EVE for roughly 8 months. I even made my way out into 0.0 with a good corp to experience &quot;real pvp&quot;. This consisted of two things. The first was large fleet battles that were nothing more than focus firing one target after another with very little tactics until one side won. The other was small PvP that consisted mainly of either camping out at a gate for hours with the hopes of seeing anyone or getting ganked when traveling back from empire space. Even if you did find someone while camping, you had to spend a significant amount of time actually hunting them down. 

I, like many here, really wanted to like this game. However, there are just too obstacles to have to overcome.  I&#039;m praying someone else can make a game with the good points of EVE without the pitfalls.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To add to what Fergie said on the new player experience:</p>
<p>I had been playing WoW(flamesuit activated) for a while and craved a SCI-FI MMO. EVE looked like a great fit. The offline skill system appears great until you realize the amount of time it will take you to actually be able to do anything effectively. This can be months away or even years depending on your goal.  Yes, you can go out there and PvP in a frigate with relatively low skillpoints, but you are going to be extremely easy pickings. About the only thing you can do in EVE from the start effectively is mining and mission running. These are incredibly boring with the exception of the more advanced missions that require much larger ships and friends to be able to do. </p>
<p>I played EVE for roughly 8 months. I even made my way out into 0.0 with a good corp to experience &#8220;real pvp&#8221;. This consisted of two things. The first was large fleet battles that were nothing more than focus firing one target after another with very little tactics until one side won. The other was small PvP that consisted mainly of either camping out at a gate for hours with the hopes of seeing anyone or getting ganked when traveling back from empire space. Even if you did find someone while camping, you had to spend a significant amount of time actually hunting them down. </p>
<p>I, like many here, really wanted to like this game. However, there are just too obstacles to have to overcome.  I&#8217;m praying someone else can make a game with the good points of EVE without the pitfalls.</p>
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		<title>By: Fergie</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-167756</link>
		<dc:creator>Fergie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 10:24:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-167756</guid>
		<description>&quot;The same is true for fleet battles: where 100 vs 100 was a once a big battle, now 400 vs 400 is possible, and fairly routine.&quot;

This is very true and an issue of lag, the last major battle to be talked about had over 600 ships destroyed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The same is true for fleet battles: where 100 vs 100 was a once a big battle, now 400 vs 400 is possible, and fairly routine.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is very true and an issue of lag, the last major battle to be talked about had over 600 ships destroyed.</p>
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		<title>By: Fergie</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-167750</link>
		<dc:creator>Fergie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 10:20:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-167750</guid>
		<description>To the many that are unsure how a new player can get along in EVE....it is a huge misconception, even by many that play EVE. That low SP players are weak and useless... i found this out when our corp joined a more PvP alliance.... our corp is mostly miners and PvE mission runners.... 

I was very surprised to find out that even thou I had an extra million or two skillpoints and could fly bigger ships they had vast more PvP experience and could wipe my battleship with there smaller PvP fit ships with ease.

If you start EVE, find a corp....they will help you out and bring you to exactly where you want to go if you are willing to put in the time and effort EVE is a great game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To the many that are unsure how a new player can get along in EVE&#8230;.it is a huge misconception, even by many that play EVE. That low SP players are weak and useless&#8230; i found this out when our corp joined a more PvP alliance&#8230;. our corp is mostly miners and PvE mission runners&#8230;. </p>
<p>I was very surprised to find out that even thou I had an extra million or two skillpoints and could fly bigger ships they had vast more PvP experience and could wipe my battleship with there smaller PvP fit ships with ease.</p>
<p>If you start EVE, find a corp&#8230;.they will help you out and bring you to exactly where you want to go if you are willing to put in the time and effort EVE is a great game.</p>
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		<title>By: Mil</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-159141</link>
		<dc:creator>Mil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:35:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-159141</guid>
		<description>Re newb-friendly corps, EVE University seems to be very highly recommended by many people.  You should be able to contact them in-game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re newb-friendly corps, EVE University seems to be very highly recommended by many people.  You should be able to contact them in-game.</p>
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		<title>By: Daedren</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-158912</link>
		<dc:creator>Daedren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:58:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-158912</guid>
		<description>Nice writeup. Made me go reactivate my EVE trial account. I want to like this game, I really do! 

If anyone has any advice on a good noob friendly corp (or maybe a RPS one?) or would mind answering a few questions, drop me a line. (daniel@r1ft.com)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice writeup. Made me go reactivate my EVE trial account. I want to like this game, I really do! </p>
<p>If anyone has any advice on a good noob friendly corp (or maybe a RPS one?) or would mind answering a few questions, drop me a line. (daniel@r1ft.com)</p>
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		<title>By: nabeel</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-158822</link>
		<dc:creator>nabeel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:58:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-158822</guid>
		<description>Good stuff, Roburky, nice read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good stuff, Roburky, nice read.</p>
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		<title>By: paddytehpyro</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/03/14/stranded-beyond-the-wormhole/comment-page-2/#comment-158819</link>
		<dc:creator>paddytehpyro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:48:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9114#comment-158819</guid>
		<description>Pah to Jita. Dodixie is sheer horror atm. Its one of (if not the) main trade hub of Gallente space. After the Apoc it seems to be capped at about 200 people. This is no where near enough in the evening where the server actually disconnected me (and quite a few other people) then when we logged back in asked us to move to an adjacent system :/. Even now I have ships left in there that I cannot reach. And about a dozen buy orders not being filled :)

Overall though its a little thing really. I&#039;ve been happy cruising about in my covert-ops scanning down WHs for my corp to exploit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pah to Jita. Dodixie is sheer horror atm. Its one of (if not the) main trade hub of Gallente space. After the Apoc it seems to be capped at about 200 people. This is no where near enough in the evening where the server actually disconnected me (and quite a few other people) then when we logged back in asked us to move to an adjacent system :/. Even now I have ships left in there that I cannot reach. And about a dozen buy orders not being filled :)</p>
<p>Overall though its a little thing really. I&#8217;ve been happy cruising about in my covert-ops scanning down WHs for my corp to exploit.</p>
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