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	<title>Comments on: Obsidian Explain Alpha Protocol</title>
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		<title>By: Tarn</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-169313</link>
		<dc:creator>Tarn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 21:14:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-169313</guid>
		<description>&quot;Difficulty spikes? in KotOR II? Are you freaking kidding me? I could have finished it with my main character soloing the whole way through. The combat was snoozefestingly easy.&quot;

No, I am not &#039;freaking&#039; kidding you. I imagine it&#039;s Final Fantasy syndrome, whereby if you&#039;ve played the RPG the way the designers wanted you get by just fine. But if you develop your characters slightly differently, or don&#039;t grasp every facet of the arbitrary combat rules, you end up getting completely stuck at a random boss battle somewhere down the line.

As with the rest of the game, I imagine the balancing just wasn&#039;t finished. So lots of people would have breezed through it, while others hit crazy difficulty spikes.

&quot;I don’t play RPGs for animation so I couldn’t give a rats.....&quot;

I doubt people play many game genres specifically for the animation. You don&#039;t play an FPS or a platformer for the animation. It just happens that those genres sometimes have games in which the animation is also really good.

So, no, I don&#039;t play RPGs for the animation either. But it sure would be nice if developers put some effort into that area as well! I don&#039;t see why it being in the RPG genre suddenly gives it a free pass to be crap in a bunch of areas, anymore than being an FPS means you&#039;re allowed to have crappy, cliched writing. The elements might be more or less important depending on genre, but they&#039;re still relevant.

re:KotOR2 characters lecturing
&quot;Maybe, but I’d take that over a bunch of boring sissies having whiny conversations&quot;

Fair enough, you can prefer KotOR2&#039;s dialgoue to KotoR1&#039;s. But that doesn&#039;t stop it being horribly self-indulgent. If I wanted to read that much text I&#039;d be reading a book. If I wanted to listen to that much spoken word I&#039;d listen to an audio drama (although an audio drama would be better acted, I&#039;d hope).

KotOR2&#039;s characters were great on paper, I agree. The game is full of great ideas. But they (and the rest of the game) felt lifeless in their implementation.

&quot;Like I salute anyone who could get through KotOR2’s terrible, long-winded opening&quot;

Wow, I&#039;d actually forgotten about that giant, rambling opening level. Bizarre. I seem to recall another very large space station-y type hub that hardly had anything in it, and which they hadn&#039;t bothered to really light at all...so dreary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Difficulty spikes? in KotOR II? Are you freaking kidding me? I could have finished it with my main character soloing the whole way through. The combat was snoozefestingly easy.&#8221;</p>
<p>No, I am not &#8216;freaking&#8217; kidding you. I imagine it&#8217;s Final Fantasy syndrome, whereby if you&#8217;ve played the RPG the way the designers wanted you get by just fine. But if you develop your characters slightly differently, or don&#8217;t grasp every facet of the arbitrary combat rules, you end up getting completely stuck at a random boss battle somewhere down the line.</p>
<p>As with the rest of the game, I imagine the balancing just wasn&#8217;t finished. So lots of people would have breezed through it, while others hit crazy difficulty spikes.</p>
<p>&#8220;I don’t play RPGs for animation so I couldn’t give a rats&#8230;..&#8221;</p>
<p>I doubt people play many game genres specifically for the animation. You don&#8217;t play an FPS or a platformer for the animation. It just happens that those genres sometimes have games in which the animation is also really good.</p>
<p>So, no, I don&#8217;t play RPGs for the animation either. But it sure would be nice if developers put some effort into that area as well! I don&#8217;t see why it being in the RPG genre suddenly gives it a free pass to be crap in a bunch of areas, anymore than being an FPS means you&#8217;re allowed to have crappy, cliched writing. The elements might be more or less important depending on genre, but they&#8217;re still relevant.</p>
<p>re:KotOR2 characters lecturing<br />
&#8220;Maybe, but I’d take that over a bunch of boring sissies having whiny conversations&#8221;</p>
<p>Fair enough, you can prefer KotOR2&#8217;s dialgoue to KotoR1&#8217;s. But that doesn&#8217;t stop it being horribly self-indulgent. If I wanted to read that much text I&#8217;d be reading a book. If I wanted to listen to that much spoken word I&#8217;d listen to an audio drama (although an audio drama would be better acted, I&#8217;d hope).</p>
<p>KotOR2&#8217;s characters were great on paper, I agree. The game is full of great ideas. But they (and the rest of the game) felt lifeless in their implementation.</p>
<p>&#8220;Like I salute anyone who could get through KotOR2’s terrible, long-winded opening&#8221;</p>
<p>Wow, I&#8217;d actually forgotten about that giant, rambling opening level. Bizarre. I seem to recall another very large space station-y type hub that hardly had anything in it, and which they hadn&#8217;t bothered to really light at all&#8230;so dreary.</p>
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		<title>By: whalleywhat</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-169026</link>
		<dc:creator>whalleywhat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 08:29:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-169026</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m excited by Obsidian&#039;s track record for releasing quality, not broken at all products.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m excited by Obsidian&#8217;s track record for releasing quality, not broken at all products.</p>
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		<title>By: Muzman</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168840</link>
		<dc:creator>Muzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 15:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168840</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
skalpadda says:
Apparently the enemies were a bit too good with grenades, and tended to kill you, a lot. &lt;/blockquote&gt;
Pshaw!  To know real fear they should try Shadow of Chernobyl with the AMK mod.  That impliments grenade throwing with terrifyingly realistic damage/radius and riccochet-ing shrapnel to boot.  
Throwing one well in any conflict will either kill a whole lot of people or scatter the field of battle rather wide (including thrower and his mates if they don&#039;t do it right).
And before anyone says it, I reckon it&#039;s great fun.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>
skalpadda says:<br />
Apparently the enemies were a bit too good with grenades, and tended to kill you, a lot. </p></blockquote>
<p>Pshaw!  To know real fear they should try Shadow of Chernobyl with the AMK mod.  That impliments grenade throwing with terrifyingly realistic damage/radius and riccochet-ing shrapnel to boot.<br />
Throwing one well in any conflict will either kill a whole lot of people or scatter the field of battle rather wide (including thrower and his mates if they don&#8217;t do it right).<br />
And before anyone says it, I reckon it&#8217;s great fun.</p>
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		<title>By: SuperNashwan</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168837</link>
		<dc:creator>SuperNashwan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 14:42:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168837</guid>
		<description>I always have reservations about Obsidian, I&#039;ve just never really engaged with one of their games.  Like I salute anyone who could get through KotOR2&#039;s terrible, long-winded opening to find a decent game beyond.  But they really do seem the uncompromising sort, so my money says accusations of dumbing down with action elements will be off the mark.  I just hope that Obsidian realise that with the action elements comes a greater responsibility for designing the environment in an interesting way as well as the conversation/inventory/levelling systems which we know they can do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I always have reservations about Obsidian, I&#8217;ve just never really engaged with one of their games.  Like I salute anyone who could get through KotOR2&#8217;s terrible, long-winded opening to find a decent game beyond.  But they really do seem the uncompromising sort, so my money says accusations of dumbing down with action elements will be off the mark.  I just hope that Obsidian realise that with the action elements comes a greater responsibility for designing the environment in an interesting way as well as the conversation/inventory/levelling systems which we know they can do.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Moyer</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168821</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Moyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 12:45:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168821</guid>
		<description>If this sucks it will be the first time Chris Avellone has missed the mark.  I&#039;m tending to think it&#039;s going to be great, and the clunky animations don&#039;t look any worse than Mass Effect from what I can tell.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If this sucks it will be the first time Chris Avellone has missed the mark.  I&#8217;m tending to think it&#8217;s going to be great, and the clunky animations don&#8217;t look any worse than Mass Effect from what I can tell.</p>
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		<title>By: BigJonno</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168797</link>
		<dc:creator>BigJonno</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 10:18:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168797</guid>
		<description>&quot;I really wish they’d show off the actual RPG stuff.&quot;

Exactly. This is the same pattern as Mass Effect as Fallout 3 and Mass Effect. They&#039;re showing the action stuff to get all the shooter types interested, but that tells us nothing about how good it is as an RPG. And if it&#039;s anything like ME, we&#039;ll see a bunch of reviews telling us that it&#039;s a substandard shooter with boring talky bits.

/sigh</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I really wish they’d show off the actual RPG stuff.&#8221;</p>
<p>Exactly. This is the same pattern as Mass Effect as Fallout 3 and Mass Effect. They&#8217;re showing the action stuff to get all the shooter types interested, but that tells us nothing about how good it is as an RPG. And if it&#8217;s anything like ME, we&#8217;ll see a bunch of reviews telling us that it&#8217;s a substandard shooter with boring talky bits.</p>
<p>/sigh</p>
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		<title>By: caesarbear</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168771</link>
		<dc:creator>caesarbear</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 06:55:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168771</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;From the videos i got impression it’s going to be “spy” game in the sense of Sid Meier’s Covert Action crossed with Bourne novels. The “problem solving” part seems to come in form of decisions made by the player during the dialogue sections.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Yeah, the typical dialogue trees is what I mean by no problem solving. Picking one of the three dialog options isn&#039;t solving of any kind. I was actually hoping Alpha Protocol would be something like a modern take on Covert Action, but it&#039;s not looking like that at all. Covert Action had tons of problem solving. Decoding messages,  who to tail, where to place taps, all done under time management. The combat in Covert Action was often the climax or the result of a screw-up, just like in a &quot;spy&quot; movie. Alpha Protocol is looking more like Jack Bauer. Combat serves to unlock the next piece of dialogue and story. In other words, you don&#039;t participate in the story, you&#039;re simply told the story in segments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>From the videos i got impression it’s going to be “spy” game in the sense of Sid Meier’s Covert Action crossed with Bourne novels. The “problem solving” part seems to come in form of decisions made by the player during the dialogue sections.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yeah, the typical dialogue trees is what I mean by no problem solving. Picking one of the three dialog options isn&#8217;t solving of any kind. I was actually hoping Alpha Protocol would be something like a modern take on Covert Action, but it&#8217;s not looking like that at all. Covert Action had tons of problem solving. Decoding messages,  who to tail, where to place taps, all done under time management. The combat in Covert Action was often the climax or the result of a screw-up, just like in a &#8220;spy&#8221; movie. Alpha Protocol is looking more like Jack Bauer. Combat serves to unlock the next piece of dialogue and story. In other words, you don&#8217;t participate in the story, you&#8217;re simply told the story in segments.</p>
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		<title>By: skalpadda</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168770</link>
		<dc:creator>skalpadda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 06:53:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168770</guid>
		<description>Apparently the enemies were a bit too good with grenades, and tended to kill you, a lot. I haven&#039;t actually played it though :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apparently the enemies were a bit too good with grenades, and tended to kill you, a lot. I haven&#8217;t actually played it though :)</p>
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		<title>By: Muzman</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168752</link>
		<dc:creator>Muzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 04:17:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168752</guid>
		<description>Yes I really did mean to type &#039;grenade&#039; there and not just mash all the letters in the word at once.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes I really did mean to type &#8216;grenade&#8217; there and not just mash all the letters in the word at once.</p>
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		<title>By: Muzman</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168750</link>
		<dc:creator>Muzman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 04:11:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168750</guid>
		<description>Oh, the devs in the basement game.  I remember.
A pity they don&#039;t mention the price of shooting the arms dealer.  Surely that will have some cost as well (since leaving him in the game apparently makes things harder later on)
Looks interesting though.  Quite Deus Ex-y actually (or is it more Mass Effect-y and the DX nerds will now kill me?).

Anyway,  what&#039;s wrong with the grangde use in Clear Sky?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, the devs in the basement game.  I remember.<br />
A pity they don&#8217;t mention the price of shooting the arms dealer.  Surely that will have some cost as well (since leaving him in the game apparently makes things harder later on)<br />
Looks interesting though.  Quite Deus Ex-y actually (or is it more Mass Effect-y and the DX nerds will now kill me?).</p>
<p>Anyway,  what&#8217;s wrong with the grangde use in Clear Sky?</p>
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		<title>By: skalpadda</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168739</link>
		<dc:creator>skalpadda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 02:40:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168739</guid>
		<description>I really wish they&#039;d show off the actual RPG stuff. 3 second action clips while the devs sit and say &quot;choice, consequence&quot; doesn&#039;t seem very convincing. I hope it&#039;s just to get people&#039;s attention.

KotOR or KotOR2? I&#039;d dare say KotOR2 had an abundance of great concepts and some really intriguing characters, but it failed in making much of it, where the first game was a well rounded and complete experience. Most of the more interesting ideas where lifted from the original game, like the failings of the Jedi, the nature of the force and a lot of other ideas that explored different aspects of the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really wish they&#8217;d show off the actual RPG stuff. 3 second action clips while the devs sit and say &#8220;choice, consequence&#8221; doesn&#8217;t seem very convincing. I hope it&#8217;s just to get people&#8217;s attention.</p>
<p>KotOR or KotOR2? I&#8217;d dare say KotOR2 had an abundance of great concepts and some really intriguing characters, but it failed in making much of it, where the first game was a well rounded and complete experience. Most of the more interesting ideas where lifted from the original game, like the failings of the Jedi, the nature of the force and a lot of other ideas that explored different aspects of the world.</p>
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		<title>By: kyrieee</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/04/04/obsidian-explain-alpha-protocol/comment-page-1/#comment-168734</link>
		<dc:creator>kyrieee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Apr 2009 01:55:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=9856#comment-168734</guid>
		<description>&quot;KotOR2 didn’t have conversations, it had lectures.&quot;

Maybe, but I&#039;d take that over a bunch of boring sissies having whiny conversations

I thought the story in the KotOR II was more evenly paced than the one in the first game. If you take out the twist from that one you don&#039;t end up with something very interesting.

It&#039;s just personal preference. I enjoyed the characters that Obsidian wrote much more than the ones BioWare wrote. I can look past the game being unfinished</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;KotOR2 didn’t have conversations, it had lectures.&#8221;</p>
<p>Maybe, but I&#8217;d take that over a bunch of boring sissies having whiny conversations</p>
<p>I thought the story in the KotOR II was more evenly paced than the one in the first game. If you take out the twist from that one you don&#8217;t end up with something very interesting.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s just personal preference. I enjoyed the characters that Obsidian wrote much more than the ones BioWare wrote. I can look past the game being unfinished</p>
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