By Kieron Gillen on April 20th, 2009 at 3:17 pm.
News just in from Gamasutra. Bethesda’s Pete Hines, speaking in London, revealed that KOTOR2/NWN2 veterans Obsidian are working on a new Fallout game going under the name “Fallout: New Vegas”. The only facts we have are that it’s not Fallout Tactics, Brotherhood of Steel and doesn’t impact what the actual main Bethesda Fallout team are doing. Which does make the puzzle be exactly what it could be. My gut response guess would be something using the Fallout 3 engine, in a locale well away from where Bethesda are operating – perhaps, I dare say, in Vegas – and probably set in a different period. But that’s just nonsense I’ve just made up, obv. It could be a Fallout Slot Machine Game for all I know. The comments thread is your place for speculation.
My dear, poor Fallout, I cry at the sight of your fragile, once-beautiful bottom destroyed by so much violent pounding :’(
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It’ll be Oblivion with nuns.
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It is pretty obviously a crossover between Ubisoft’s Tom Clancy’s Rainbow Six’s Vegas 2′s franchise-based squad-based game thing and the Fallout universe. Terrorists have taken over New New Vegas and it’s up to you and your wise-cracking team mates to take them out using any means necesarry. Your means are limited to guns and your imagination but mostly just guns and grenades. Moral choices involve: capping a dude in the head or capping a dude in his groin. Stats are handled by Vegas 2′s grind-based progress method. Shoot 100 groins to gain a level in groin shooting.
Obviously.
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it’s clearly fallout pinball
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Neverwinter Nights 2 with guns?
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Alpha protocol with different guns?
Man, the possibilities.
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KoTOR2.5 with an ending, whoopa!
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“Neverwinter Nights 2 with guns?”
LOL, yeah.
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So we’ll get a Fallout game with a real story and writing that doesn’t make a six year old wince with pain?
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I HOPE it’s Fallout Pinball.
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Heh, so I suppose it’s back home, in a way. Certainly more at home than it ever would be with whatever Interplay is now.
Little surprised at the immediate pessemism. Be fair, Obsidian’s the closest to a spiritual successor to Black Isle that there is.
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I find it interesting that they emphasize that the game is not Fallout Tactics nor Brotherhood of Steel. Seems like they didn’t like those entries in the series either.
The main points of the article that spark my interest however are the fact that he says that “It has no impact on what [Bethesda Game Studios game director] Todd Howard and his guys are planning.” This quote leads me to believe that Bethesda might be working on another entry in the series already, and not just DLC.
Why do I have this strange feeling that this game won’t be an RPG. Fallout Racing anyone?
Actually, on second thought, maybe this game is just Fallout 2.5. Obsidian connecting the first games with the third. You never know.
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I picture the opening cinematic from the last Resident Evil Extinction teaser and think wasteland Vegas could work out ok. At least the default color scheme from Fallout 3 would be an accurate environmental fit regardless of the radioactivity debate.
Worst case scenario: Fallout MMO. *shudder*
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Can we all just pretend Fallout 3 never happened and give whatever Obsidian creates (assuming it’s decent) the title? Because whatever the merits of Bethesda’s post-apocalyptic RPG are, it is just not Fallout.
Disclaimer: I say this as a mostly uninformed AIM.
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I don’t know what game are creating, but It will start with your main character memory deleted/amnestic.
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Yeah, because Fallout 3 totally made my niece wince! I’m excited for this game, I definitely respect the Obsidian name and hopefully they pump out some good stuff here. Didn’t quite a few of the old Fallout boys end up leaving Interplay and starting Obsidian?
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Its quite obviously Fallout Tycoon…
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You’re all completely wrong. It’s very obviously a bit of marketing synergy brand marriage type of thing between Fallout and open world vegas simulator This is Vegas. Tramp around post apocalyptic Vegas and experience the delights of triple breasted hookers, rusty slot machines (orr-err) and hitting people in the face with VATS.
Actually, I’m sure the game I was originally thinking of wasn’t This is Vegas, but something else that was possibly talked about here. Oh well, my google-fu is weak today.
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Yeah, because Fallout 3 totally made my niece wince! I’m excited for this game, I definitely respect the Obsidian name and hopefully they pump out some good stuff here. Didn’t quite a few of the old Fallout boys end up leaving Interplay and starting Obsidian?
I think Chris Avellone recently joined Obsidian (from Interplays V13 MMO), didn’t he?
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Are people REALLY still bent outa shape about Fallout 3? Jesus guys, move the hell on.
As for the article: Could be good. A spin off game offering the same style of goods as Fallout 3 but in a different location would be a good thing.
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The thing that I felt was lacking in Fallout 3 was narrative or, more importantly, a contextual/historical narrative. Approaching the series for the first time, little was explained to me. I wanted some sort of historical grounding – at least a few conversations that taught me a little more about the world. But I was never given the option to grill people on the subject. When I finally came across the library, I was quite excited, thinking that I could finally learn a little about this city. But there were no tomes or terminals to illuminate me. I know we’re meant to be embodying the Vault Dweller, someone who has no knowledge of the outside world, but this made my thirst for this knowledge paramount. “Here,” the game says, “take this expansive and detailed world. Explore it! Loot it! Learn diddly about it!”. In this respect, I think it was a bit behind Oblivion which had countless books to feast upon. I garnered a very real sense of that fantasy world. Fallout 3 is a great game, it’s brilliantly impressive, and I wanted to learn as much as I could about this stunning creation. It’s just a shame I couldn’t. Here’s hoping this new entry takes this into account.
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Yeah, J. E. Sawyer works at Obsidian, who I think was lead developer on Black Isle’s initial stab at Fallout 3; so I imagine he must be made up at the news that he gets a second bite of the cherry, this time with a backer that appears to be financially stable.
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Cue the angry internet men known as NMA. Wish they’d quit their cryin’.
Hopefully the dialogue wont be as awful as Fallout 3′s was.
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“I find it interesting that they emphasize that the game is not Fallout Tactics nor Brotherhood of Steel. Seems like they didn’t like those entries in the series either.”
Much more likely that they just want to confirm it’s a genuine RPG rather than a spin-off in a different vein.
Fallout Tactics is actually an excellent game and after F3 ejaculated and wiped dog poop over the cannon, there’s really not a single thing to hold against it.
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Have you seen the NMAers’ responses? “Bethesda will force Obsidian to make it an awful shooter!”
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I originally read the headline as ‘Bethesda to do new Fallout Game’ and was tempted to post a sardonic comment which denied the existence of excrement to a well known fictional detective. Then my brain actually started working and suddenly the post was a lot more interesting.
I liked Fallout 3, and that comes from someone who would probably be classed in the Oblivion haters camp. (Although I’d be lazing around the middle somewhere, rather than upfront shouting at the riot police.) However the thought of Obsidian getting involved is certainly interesting. I just hope they are given plenty of time, and a few lessons on Q&A, although I’m not convinced that Bethesda are the best people to advise here, as FO3 had a few too many CTDs for my taste. (Although something I tweaked early on did seem to reduce these dramatically)
I’m hoping for Mask of the Betrayer with guns.
I’ve seen several people say this, but haven’t seen any gross contradictions, although I haven’t read the Fallout Bible so may be missing something key.
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Wow! You just can’t have enough Fallout. I’m really excited as soon as it is not an MMO.
I would love it to be a parallel story set in Vegas, made in the same engine, but with good dialogues and character.
Maybe some vehicle riding would be cool. Also more colours on the palette. At least we know there will be neon lights. Hopefully they’re still working!
I also expect them to have the time to finish the game.
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In a bold move, Obsidian will dispense with interactivity for Fallout: New Vegas: The Musical.
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I guess we can assume it’s an RPG if Obsidian is working on a franchise that is essentially an RPG (Tactics and BoS be damned).
Much as I liked F3 for what it was, I do hope Obsidian brings a little more depth back to the character development of Fallout…having tag skills work as in the original games, allowing skills to go over 100% (at great cost) and bring back the old perk/trait system. Why were they even omitted in the first place?
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Obsidian?
If those guys get funds and time, they might be able to do something nice. Considering that NWN2 was AWFUL on the technical side and KoTOR2 got bloody screwed because of the release pressure… Heh…
Still! Better than Bethesda.
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It would be NICE if Obsidian made it play like a real fallout game (iso/turn based), but I know that’s more or less impossible.
However, getting some decent writing all up in will be a huge breath of fresh air. I think Bethesda will be smart enough about their new Golden Boy IP to not allow them to ship with awful bugs.
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How did FO3 mess up with Fallout canon? Or did you mean a literal cannon?
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I’m with you, Snappyterm, 100 per cent. They’re a brilliant development studio, and the thought of a Fallout by Obsidian leaves me feeling as giggly and excited as … oh, I don’t know, some morbid kid on halloween who has a really good costume, or something.
Also: Neverwinter Nights with guns is… can I be blunt? It’s so stupid it hurts my noggin. Here’s a snippet to consider: An open World NWN module with guns and a post-apocalyptic setting would be almost exactly the same as Fallout 1/2, so Fallout 1/2 are technically NWN with guns, by that logic. Thus NWN with guns is the most pointless bit of lawl i’ve seen in a while.
Oblivion with guns might have worked because Oblivion was such a different game to, say, Baldur’s Gate, and aside from setting and rules, Baldur’s Gate wasn’t that different from Fallout. Neverwinter Nights and Neverwinter Nights 2 aren’t that different from Fallout at all, in all but setting and weapons.
What I’m getting at is that this makes it completely redundant to point out that this might be NWN with guns, because change things around in NWN enough and you could make a damned fine Fallout game, less so with Oblivion. Oblivion with guns was more for an “Oh God, no.” reaction, which NWN wouldn’t illicit, I’d imagine.
In fact, a lot of RPGs back in the day were just that; same backbone, very similar engine and feel, tweaks to the rules, and just a very different setting and story separating them.
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Its rainbow 6 vegas without guns.
But seriously, a fallout 3 expandalone. With CSI bits. And instead of vats you get a slot machine which determines criticals. Also mobsters.
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KoToR2 bored me to sleep in 2 hours (as opposed to the original, which was brilliant, if a bit console-ish). NWN2 just blew huge chunks.
Sorry, but this is a nearly guaranteed DevFail = 1, funding or no funding.
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Being isometric and turn based had absolutely nothing to do with what made Fallout 1/2 great games, else Tactics would be considered a great spinoff instead of Jagged Alliance vs Mad Max but crap. Because, let’s face it, JA v MM would actually be freaking awesome.
As for Obsidian bringing back the trait/perk system or drastically changing, well, anything about the engine – hohoho. I’d say this is, essentially, going to be the same deal that they threw out for KoToR II and NWN2 – using someone else’s tools and world to tell a story they think is interesting and compelling. They might tweak the FO3 ‘verse to better fit the story, but just as KoToR II didn’t suddenly have mounts or free roaming ‘speeder exploration, I wouldn’t expect a new FO game to be substantially different from what Betthesda came up with.
And you know what? I am absolutely 100% fine with that. I love Fallout 3 (as I loved Fallout 2) and Obsidian have, in the past, shown that they’re pretty good at telling engaging, sophisticated and thoughtful stories when given someone else’s tech to play with. And given so many of their studio has experience with the FO franchise already, why would you be pessimistic so early?
I think, this time, we might just be able to have nice things. Fingers crossed.
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Personally, I’m hoping for a post-apocalyptic Elvis simulator.
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I quite liked fallout tactics. The multiplayer was somewhat interesting too. Actually in terms outright enjoyment rather than ‘its legacy as a fallout game’ it was a success. Set up a sniper in cover flank covered positions and clear out fortified positions with a grenade.
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Fear and Fallout.
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“Be fair, Obsidian’s the closest to a spiritual successor to Black Isle that there is.”
They’re as far from being a spiritual successor to Black Isle as they are from ever finishing a game. Fallout 3 is a hackjob, but at least Bethesda actually finished that hackjob – Obsidian won’t even do that.
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It’s a post-apocalyptic simcity.
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Please let them finish this one before releasing it. KOTOR2 was such a disappointment.
But all round good news as fas as I’m concerned. These mini-morsels of extra content have not enticed me at all, but a full blown additional game would be great.
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I love how this has become a “think of the funniest title and mismatch” game.
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So help me if it ends with Rocks Fall Everyone Dies…
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Bethesda is evil. :(
Seriously now: F3 is a victim of overly grand expectations built off of years of nostalgia goggles. Yes, the writing might of been a little shoddier, and the ending maybe a little poorly done, but otherwise? It was a fairly faithful sequel in terms of a story in a series that I don’t believe had the greatest storyline ever (save the village/vault/cheerleader, save the world!), and characters that weren’t that ‘alive’ (honestly, I would say that every memorable character from F1 or F2– and no, whores do not count as memorable characters– could be matched by an equally memorable one in F3, but even then few in any of the games really ‘grew’).
“It’ll be Oblivion with nuns.”
Yes, please!
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Best case: An expandalone focused on recreating the feel and open ended crime drama of New Reno with an updated Fallout 3 engine
Worse case: A rushed cash-in, packaged in a box of sand scorpions with Ebola.
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Why is it a puzzle? Bethesda just mean that Obsidian’s game is not related to them in the graphic engine (since beth’s a staff that makes engines, engines are what they care about), and especially in being a sister-company like bioware which co-operate and exchange ideas.
Why would you think they refer to the setting or period?
So it’s gonna be a TRUE Fallout rpg turn-based most likely with NwN2 engine. See? It’s not so hard when one uses logics.
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This is great news! I can’t wait to learn more about the project.
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*crying with happiness*
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Sounds interesting. Could Fallout: New Vegas be to Fallout 3 as GTA: Vice City was to GTA 3?
I’m excited at least. It would be fun to see a more direct continuation of the stories set on the west coast. There’s quite a bit of missing time in between Fallout 2 and 3.
Maybe it could include some of the Brotherhood of Steel and, of course Super Mutants, on their way east?
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This is terrific news.
I just couldn’t bring myself to play Fallout3, I hated how soulless Oblivion was and it looked like Fallout3 would be too similar. The original games are among my favourites (of course) so didn’t want those memories soured either.
However Obsidian still have enough talent from the ex Black Isle people and I’m very confident will do justice to the originals. Colour me interested.
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@Taillefer:
Yes! Fear and Fallout in Las Vegas.
I approve of this idea.
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After reading “Lets Play KOTOR2″, I am like totally impresed by these guys. Give me a character like Kreia, or HK-47.
Man.. these guys writted (or made posible) this lines:
Definition: ‘Love’ is making a shot to the knees of a target 120 kilometers away using an Aratech sniper rifle with a tri-light scope… Love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticule, and together, achieving a singular purpose against statistically long odds.
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@Orange: Eh, Fallout3 was actually a pretty good game. I agree with you on Oblivion, but I think they actually managed to pull off Fallout pretty well, even for Oblivion-haters :D
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This could be the best thing to happen to the Fallout series since Fallout 2. Or it could be a disaster as this will be the first open ended game Obsidian has made and, seeing as everyone expects it to be Fallout 3.5, i can’t see it being extremely innovative.
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Obsidian have an interesting poll on their interweb site right now. Apparently the largest group of their fans think that an isometric turn based engine is their favourite option for RPG combat. I’d link to it but you dirty Deus Ex fetishists would probably mess it up by voting for the wrong option.
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@sinnerman
I voted for the ‘Real-time Isometric’ option, assuming that this covered the ‘Pause and Play’ option seen in Baldurs’ Gate. Seems to be remarkably unpopular though.
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Hell, if you want Fear and Loathing, in Fallout 3 you could take a whole bunch of drugs and go round updating your journal.
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I’m all for Fallout 3 : Cart Racer, I wanan ride the megaton cart that is just the bomb with wheels attached and the entire race you’re slowly dieing from radiation and if people bump you to hard everyone loses. That would add some detailed gameplay to the genre :P
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I don’t favour real time with pause myself James but Obsidian fans in particular have had to struggle with the implementation in NWN2. It’s a real chore to play that game with any tactical nuance. Bioware get round that by not having any tactical nuances but Obsidian are more traditional. j/k.
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It’ll be tough to adapt Obsidian’s dialog-heavy, narrative-heavy approach to Bethesda’s engine without some real modification, since Bethesda’s engine can’t accommodate long dialogs. It’ll also be interesting to see if Obsidian is allowed to make a game without full voice-acting, which is pretty much a necessity if they’re to expand the narrative scope (while avoiding the mostly execrable quality of Bethesda’s voice-acting).
Mostly, I’m just interested in what Obsidian can get away with, assuming they generate a game based on the same engine and gameplay mechanics with only short-term modifications. If Obsidian makes too many changes, the game could reflect quite badly on Bethesda’s inevitable Fallout 4.
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@James G
I’d love to see some ‘Pause and Play’ action (oh, the irony!) too. It’s possible, why not? BioWare are still keeping it with Dragon Age. KOTOR 2 had it, NWN 2 ha… probably has it (still haven’t started it).
What scares me though is the direction they’ve taken with Alpha Protocol, but still I’m very positive if someone can make a true successor to Black Isle’s Fallouts right now – it’s Obsidian.
2010 release point makes me very happy too, but also afraid with the history they have for rushed games.
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I hated Oblivion as much as the next guy (probably more) but I’m really confused by the type of hate directed at Fallout 3.
I actually found the dialogue fairly interesting, often quite amusing, and only once or twice did I think the voice acting sounded ‘odd.’ Also, the fact people take shots at the dingy pallet, which simultaneously decrying the lack of accuracy, smacks of random flailing. Fallout was brown as, well, shit, and that is carried over into 3. The atmosphere is extremely similar, and I think that was done well.
I loved reading about all the vaults, why they were made, and what was done to those inside them. I also loved the great backstory about Nuka Quantum, the Laser weapons, the Plasma weapons, the Brotherhood, the family running to the Vault, the Supermutant creation, the Chinese invasion… etc etc. It actually reminded me a lot, discovering-plot-wise, of Deus Ex.
“Fallout Tactics is actually an excellent game and after F3 ejaculated and wiped dog poop over the cannon, there’s really not a single thing to hold against it.”
What canon did they ruin, exactly? I don’t remember anything in particular being non-Fallout…y.
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obsidian making fallout is, like, a totally decent idea.
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Troika Games resurrected with unlimited resources and the Fallout license would be perfect, but I guess this is the next best thing. Just hope they get enough time to finish this one.
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Right, after this, they can get along to making Arcanum 2.
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Well for one the prospect of a Fallout from a company with Avellone and Urquhart at the helm makes me jizzum with delight. It could be a return to the Fallout of decent voice acting/dialogue! Obviously the NWN2 engine would be perfect but I am a billion percent sure it will be the Bethesda engine. I do find it quite funny how people on the interwebs are screaming that Obsidian “always ruin sequels, damn them, damn them!”. Rar! Anyway, ’tis good news as far as i’m concerned ;)
Note – I did enjoy Fallout 3. But I completed it fairly quickly and have little desire to go back to it. I still pull out the originals every year for some fun. Of course Fallout 3 hasn’t been out a year yet, maybe I will feel the urge sooner or later
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3rd person Real Time for me, I want a camera that can move around.
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YES YES!
Obsidian ROCK
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I will be saddened if we don’t get to fluff for porn studios in this one.
Only gaming could have made me write that sentence.
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70 comments in 4 hours? I guess people really care about Fallout!
Edit: Oh wow, the edit button is back!
Pretty sure I’m not logged in Helio!
VVVVVVV
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Edit never went. You just need to be logged into the forum.
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Has it always been timed? This countdown frightens me…
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Failout muahwahahhaahahahhahaAHA!!
Bring on more Fallout! Obsidian is gut.
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Have Obsidian ever been allowed to finish a game by their corporate masters? KotOR2 can’t reasonably be said to be their fault, but I don’t know anything about NWN2′s development or problems.
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More Fallout? Yes please. Just don’t milk it like a glorified franchise. Make the most of it. I trust in Obsidian.
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It’ll probably be just as mediocre as the rest of that series was.
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So, wait. If Bethesda makes a fallout game, it will suck and fail.
If Bioware makes a game, it sucks because it isn’t Obsidian.
But now, when Obsidian (which was formed by some of the guys involved with the first two Fallouts) is involved in a Fallout game, it will inevitably suck?
I thought NMA was unpleasable before, but now…
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I was hoping for Fallout Quest: A Post-Apocalyptic Point and Click Adventure!
Hmm… actually that sounds like a good idea….
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Anythings better than a Fallout Kart Racing. Remember those in the late 90s?
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The nwn2 engine sucked and where are the ctds in my version of fo3 2 plays through and nada I want my ctds.
Click to Edit (29 minutes and 41 seconds)
not even signed up to the forum
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NMA being pleased with anything other than their rose tinted view of the past is akin to an event whereupon a black hole folds back in on itself and becomes a red giant while creating a fully formed solar system with silicon based life forms existing on one of the planets’ surface and NMA shits all over the planet because these guys aren’t taking turns when they walk.
My one hope for this project is that, for once, a publisher won’t rush Obsidian. Maybe we won’t see the game for 10 years, but it will rock. HARD.
-EDIT 2- Apologies. Reading further along the NMA thread, I see that, at a minimum, Brother None understands. “Simply consider one thing: is there any viable event (so not Troika coming back to life and taking over Fallout) that could have been better for us fans than this? Realistically speaking, this is the best thing that could have happened to the license from our perspective.” If the most outspoken of NMA can see that this has the potential to be as good as it can get, I have hope for those little Silicon life forms after all. ;) Much love, NMA.
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I’m actually one of the few that liked NWN2 (it was way better than the original btw), so this is really good news.
Scrying the future has never been my strongest skill, but in light of the comment I made in the Fallout MMO comments thread a few days ago, where I wished the next Fallout game was either done by Obsidian or stayed with Bethesda, not Interplay.. man.
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If its made by Obsidian it’ll probably have a little more conversation and a little less action than Fallout 3.
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Since Obsidian made KOTOR 2, I hope this one will actually have good writing and voice acting, unlike Bethesda projects. I’m hopeful.
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I doubt they’ll set it in Vegas. It could just as easily be set in New Reno, which is the same thing as Vegas.
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I’m excited about this. I can’t think of a non-defunct studio I’d rather see working on it. I think the gang at Obsidian will take fiddling with the Fallout universe extremely seriously.
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Pete Hines mentions in an interview – http://www.shacknews.com/featuredarticle.x?id=1113 – that they have been in talks about that for some time now and the deal was probably wrapped – so why announcig it right now?
Are they trying to completely drown Interplay’s MMO stint? Or is that being in the works the reason for their reaction towards the MMO and license stuff in the 1st place?
Funny stuff, but I’m really looking forward to Obsidian’s comeback and lost any interest (if I even had one) in Interplay’s.
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Obsidian specializes in ruining sequals, their past projects like Kotor2 and NWN2 make me fear they wont be able to pull this off, I would of sooner handed the sequel over to Squarenix then Obsidian because I’d like to see to a vault full of moogles.
HULKAMANIA!
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Homunculus says:
It would be interesting to see how long they’ve been working on this. Sawyer was the project lead for Obsidian’s canceled Aliens RPG. That probably means he was busy unless his game was canceled a long time before that information was made public.
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Aliens RPG wasn’t cancelled a long time before it was made public, no.
And Sawyer is the lead. Link.
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I think that would be kind of annoying. Work for years on a fallout title only to have it ripped out from beneath you and then told a few years later that you are working on another one. I mean, it would be awesome but at the same time a little vexing.
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Obsidian develops a new Fallout title? I’m looking forward to what they can come up with. Should be interesting…
And please stop the whining about Fallout 3. It is like all of Bethesda’s games since Morrowind: A basic game which is there to be modded. I already love my modded Fallout and the community is still young. There’s definitely more to come.
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I’ve checked NMA and they seem for the most part, very pleased with this turn of events… albeit with very cautious optimism because it may well end up just being Fallout 3.5 (or worse KotoR– 2.5).
I really wish people would stop trying to paint them as unpleasable wretches especially considering that they were COMPLETELY 100% CORRECT about Fallout 3
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bhlaab: I didn’t know they thought F3 was perfectly passable, that’s awfully cool of them.
Also, all this talk about old Black Isle employees taking part in development and the automatic assumption that it will mean gold is ridiculously. It’s not like developers who’ve made a good game or two have ever gone astray, right? SPORE FWT.
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Ladies and gentlepeoples, it would appear that Fallout is now ‘A Franchise’, weep for your souls, weep for all our souls.
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What did Brotherhood of Steel, or Tactics make it? Or hell, what did Fallout 2 suggest it was?
Clearly, we should’ve been crying ourselves to sleep a long time ago (I’ve been way ahead of the curve on that point).
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Well if they use the same engine as Fallout 3 they had better give the animations an overhaul. Even Left 4 Dead is light-years ahead of Fallout 3 in the animation department.
Hell, Day of Defeat has better animations.
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I’m a bit mystified by all the Obsidian hate. KOTORII is famously unfinished, yes, but until that point it’s amazing. NWN2 had some severe technical problems out of the gate (too early release, yep) and still has some interface quirks, but I’m not sure why it would be considered unfinished. The bugs have been mostly patched into submission, the campaign has solid content all the way through and an ending I found entirely satisfying (and was WAYWAYWAYWAY better than the original NWN campaign, Bioware’s only major failure thus far), and as far as I know Mask of the Betrayer was pretty much a successful launch with a very well regarded critical response.
Not seeing any ruining there, and only one unfinished game – one that established them as a studio and where I’m pretty sure they had little to no control over things like when it launched and whether or not it got patched into a completed state.
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Yeah, see you “fans” need to read this and start taking yourselves about eight-thousand times less seriously. READY GO.
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I couldn’t get anywhere in Fallout 3, the dodgy animations drew me completely out of the world they created, and I was under the misconception that being an RPG it’s strengths would lie in the dialogue … at least I am no longer so naive.
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“Obsidian specializes in ruining sequals, their past projects like Kotor2″
If Obsidian were allowed to actually complete the game instead of being forced to push it out in time for Christmas, KOTOR2 would have been superior to the first one in nearly every way. Not their fault. Period.
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Avellone, Urquheart, Sawyer…someone get Boyarski on the line!!
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Was I the only one who preferred the original NWN to it’s sequel? The original NWN campaign let you progress in a relatively freeform manner, with the overarching story (admittedly uninsipiring) providing structure in which to quest. NWN2 might have all the great story in the world, but the blatant railroading through the portion of the game I played put me off ever wanting to finish it. The story line seemed to consist of “blah blah story exposition, now run over there”, rinse and repeat. If this is the kind of storyline people are excited about Obsidian injecting into other games, I’ll pass thanks. They seem to give about as much control over the storyline as your average JRPG (ie. none).
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^ They did that because they knew they could get away with it. The type of hardcore fanbase that plays D&D games don’t do it for story, they do it for the geeky number crunching, min-maxing stuff.
If even 1/10th of the story/writing/VO greatness of KOTOR 2 makes it into this game, it will be a vast improvement over F3.
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NWN2 was a clear improvement on NWN in terms of characters and writing. Although really it’s the expansion Mask of the Betrayer which is made the game fantastic, one of the finest rpg experiences since planescape.
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I really wish people would stop trying to paint them as unpleasable wretches especially considering that they were COMPLETELY 100% CORRECT about Fallout 3
They hated Fallout 3 before there was a Fallout 3. Worse, their community produces literally nothing but hatred. Even the Deus Ex community — similar in size, similar in scope — has produced a number of passable, interesting mods. The Fallout people don’t even produce bad fanfiction.
They just produce bile. Huge, steaming, buckets of bile. C.f. ‘dogshit and semen’ post above.
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“If Obsidian were allowed to actually complete the game instead of being forced to push it out in time for Christmas, KOTOR2 would have been superior to the first one in nearly every way. Not their fault. Period.”
Obisidian themselves have admitted repeatedly that they made huge mistakes with KotOR2 and NWN2, that lead to those games being as bad as they were. They’ve yet to prove that they can not make those mistakes.
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@DK: I am curious to know what your source on this is.
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Is it just me, or does it kinda feel like Obsidian are cheating on Bioware?
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What the hell is next, Fallout: Miami!?
“What we have here, Ian… *puts power armor helmet on* is one hot ghoul.”
YEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
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WE DON’T GET FOOLED AGAIN!
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…I would totally play Fallout: Miami. As long as The Who was somehow involved.
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DK, KOTORII as it was intended to be in its finished form, would have been fantastic. The standard of dialogue was already far higher than the, already good, original.
NWN2 was disappointing, I would agree, but MoTB was fantastic. Absolutely top-notch.
It’s a studio made up of people who made Planescape, Fallout one and two, Baldur’s Gate one and two. I’m astounded that you don’t have even the vaguest optimism.
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I’d admit with my limited experience with Obsidian, my first thought to hearing about this was akin to “What, so we’ll get Fallout: Incomplete now?”; undeserved or not, they’d certainly have to convince me otherwise.
All that nonwithstanding, I’m actually not sure what to expect. KotOR II was.. well, it had potential, but most of it felt hidden behind incompleteness and not so good ideas, and NWN2.. I thought it started off great, personal quest I could be engaged in and all.. and then it hit the titular city and they just produced a gun and shot the plot I was enjoying in the head. By the time I was over in something or other mountains killing something or other orcs and had forgotten what I was trying to do in the first place, I decided the developers and I simply did not agree on what makes good story and gave up.
What all that means for Obsidian and Fallout 3 I’m not sure. Might be decent, but past experiences make me expect it’ll be a garble of Fallout 3 + plenty of good ideas + plenty of not so good ideas and a feeling of lacking polish.
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Optimistic. Bethesda doesn’t care about writing quality and have admitted as much. Obsidian made KOTOR 2 and Mask of the Betrayer, which we should all agree were quite nicely written.
So yay for writing.
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Obsidian is a great company and i think it’s a very interesting attitude of Bethesda to allow some other developer to make a game using the Fallout name, i mean they have expended millions to buy the license.I know they are going to gain money from this game some way(by publishing it maybe?), but even so i think it’s great to allow another company to act upon their IP like that.
Let’s see what happens now. My expectation is to have a game more emphasized in roleplaying than Fallout 3 was, checking by Obsidian background. Anyway anything is possible
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@Snappyterm: “DK, KOTORII as it was intended to be in its finished form, would have been fantastic. The standard of dialogue was already far higher than the, already good, original.”
And I could be rich had I won the lottery. Could have, would have is irrelevant. Obisidian have yet to finish a game – why the hell should they be given the benefit of the doubt that “this time they really will!”.
@Pantsman, many of the interviews with about KotOR2/NWN2 Development.
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Chris Avellone, Chris Avellone, Chris Avellone. Chris Avellone.
Chris Avellone.
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Chris Avellone? Chris Avellone!
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@DK
They’ve also only produced two games thus far. That said, if you count expansions, Mask of the Betrayer is essentially complete and is indeed one of the best RPG experiences I’ve had in recent memory (if not all memory).
That said, even if it does end up somewhat incomplete, I daresay the experience more than makes up for it. KOTOR II was phenomenal, even considering the rushed latter third. No other game besides the Baldur’s Gate Trilogy has ever had me so fully attached to the characters, or so deeply invested into their situation.
Also, it was Lucasart’s fault. And you know their track record at this point.
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Reply to DK- Three questions
Have you played either of their games?
Which interviews are you talking about?
Do you have an NMA account?
Woo for an Obsidian game and free kneecapping to any publisher that goes near them.
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@Bhazor,
If by “either” you mean more than two, then yes. KotOR2, NWN2 + expansions (Mask of the Betrayer was almost finished, but the Obisidian managed to break the Aurora engine so completely for vanilla NWN2, MotB was also utterly broken).
I don’t obsessively save every interview with every developer I read, sorry.
And no, I don’t even know what NMA stands for.
@Zyrusticae: KotOR2 was phenomenal in the same way a hotdog is phenomenal right until you get far enough down to bite into the shit they put in down at the end. It doesn’t matter how “great” it was before – you still bit into shit at the end – it completely destroys the entire package.
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@Bhazor, you’re in luck regarding your question #2:
“We agreed to a tight schedule and delivered,” Avellone admits, “so it was on us. The game probably could have stood to cook for a few more months, but I should’ve been more responsible with the feature set. Looking back, I wish we’d cut minigames and one or two companions.”
from here:
http://www.edge-online.com/magazine/chris-avellone-dark-knight-0
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@ACS: Somewhat ironic, innit, that you critique NMA for baseless, bitter drivel with no constructive contributions, then make that mistake yourself? A simple look ’round NMA’s mod forums/discussions would’ve enlightened you. Heck, RPS has even linked to some of the mods produced by NMA’s community, so you hardly have an excuse even if you don’t visit any other sites. ;)
NMA folks may be…passionate…but it’s totally wrong to claim that they’ve contributed no modding or other expertise back to the internets as a whole.
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Reply to DK
“We agreed to a tight schedule and delivered,” Ahhh, so they didn’t have enough time then because their publisher enforced a stupid deadline. That completely validates your idea that they somehow did it on purpose.
I guess we just have very, very different views on KOTOR 2 then. It’s just that yours are wrong.
Edit: Ooh, edits!
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@Bhazor, that’s an astonishing feat of selective reading.
“so it was on us.” “…I should’ve been more responsible with the feature set.”
The correct responsive when you have a certain timeframe to make a game isn’t to write about the game you would have liked to make in your dream journal and deliver some pieces of a game – it’s to make the game that you actually CAN make.
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So awesome, who better to hand this to than Obsidian?
She’s coming home.
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@DK: Essentially then, their mistake was excessive ambition.
Call me crazy, but I’m actually glad they made that mistake.
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I’d rather have 20 awesome hours and 1 crap one than miss out on 20 awesome hours because there weren’t 21 awesome hours.
KoToR II’s great, I still don’t get the fuss over the end. It’s fine, none of the cut content matters.
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Obsidian have been getting stronger with each game, by Avellone’s own admission. There’s too much talent and passion at that company to not be successful.
Chances are Alpha Protocol will be by far the more interesting game compared to this though.
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RAINBOW FALLOUT: VEGAS
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Cry harder fanboys, someone might care what you think of Fallout 3.
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@”There’s too much talent and passion at that company to not be successful.”
The same could have been said about Troika. We all know how that one ended. Companies that live solely on the long past successes of some employees don’t succeed. See Troika, see Flagship, see Obisidian, etc.
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Reply to Dk
Except the development was cut short half way through.
Their only internal problem was over ambition, which leads to a huge game, which leads to a complete arse of a game to beta test. Which leads to profit!
Troika used an outdated engine for Arcanum and a wholly unsuitable and unfinished one for Vampire. Troika went under in large part because contractual obligations meant Vampire couldn’t be released until after HL2 was released at which point no one cared about it because HL2 was released. Publishers ‘ey?
Temple of Elemental Evil was also a wee bit gash.
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Hello Fallout Kitty.
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Reply to DK
Troika wasn’t financially successful, but they were critically successful. Which at this point seems to be your main concern.
As more of a general comment, anyone complaining about Obsidian REALLY needs to play Mask of the Betrayer before saying they don’t have it in them to make a fantastic game. (Yea it’s an expansion. You can still play it without playing the original NWN2 though).
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