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	<title>Comments on: Dawn Of War II, Big Update</title>
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	<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/</link>
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		<title>By: pignoli</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188370</link>
		<dc:creator>pignoli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 08:15:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188370</guid>
		<description>@Cradok: That would be lovely. Except I need a fifth one too, as I accidentally sold one of mine. I could have cried...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Cradok: That would be lovely. Except I need a fifth one too, as I accidentally sold one of mine. I could have cried&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Crispy</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188304</link>
		<dc:creator>Crispy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 02:34:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188304</guid>
		<description>&quot;It sounds very much like that’s either a port, router or provider issue - 3v3 matchmaking usually takes less than 3 minutes for and pretty much everyone I play with.&quot;

Hmm. Netgear router working perfectly fine, a 10mbit, secure and non-shared Virgin Media connection based very close to the exchange and that works better than fine for every other game and a Tech Support forum full of people complaining about exactly the same issue.

No, I think it&#039;s a problem with the matchmaking system somehow. You should thank yourself lucky for being in the minority.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It sounds very much like that’s either a port, router or provider issue &#8211; 3v3 matchmaking usually takes less than 3 minutes for and pretty much everyone I play with.&#8221;</p>
<p>Hmm. Netgear router working perfectly fine, a 10mbit, secure and non-shared Virgin Media connection based very close to the exchange and that works better than fine for every other game and a Tech Support forum full of people complaining about exactly the same issue.</p>
<p>No, I think it&#8217;s a problem with the matchmaking system somehow. You should thank yourself lucky for being in the minority.</p>
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		<title>By: TheDeadlyShoe</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188298</link>
		<dc:creator>TheDeadlyShoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 02:17:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188298</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m pretty impressed with the patch so far. I don&#039;t understand why the 2v2 truskills are seperate from 3v3 though.

PS for players having trouble with nids early on. The problem is that 3 squads of basic nids plus a hero is better in a straight up fight than what most other armies can field that early. The advantage disappears later on, but if you lose too much in the first fight you are in trouble. One recommandation is to find and use buildings.  Most nid players get rippers and hormagaunts and they have no capability at all against buildings. So even if you are out-powered you can dance in and out of buildings, racking up casualties all the while.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m pretty impressed with the patch so far. I don&#8217;t understand why the 2v2 truskills are seperate from 3v3 though.</p>
<p>PS for players having trouble with nids early on. The problem is that 3 squads of basic nids plus a hero is better in a straight up fight than what most other armies can field that early. The advantage disappears later on, but if you lose too much in the first fight you are in trouble. One recommandation is to find and use buildings.  Most nid players get rippers and hormagaunts and they have no capability at all against buildings. So even if you are out-powered you can dance in and out of buildings, racking up casualties all the while.</p>
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		<title>By: Cradok</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188251</link>
		<dc:creator>Cradok</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 23:19:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188251</guid>
		<description>All I want is a fourth set of Terminator armour so I can kit out my whole company...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All I want is a fourth set of Terminator armour so I can kit out my whole company&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: ChampionHyena</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188234</link>
		<dc:creator>ChampionHyena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 22:39:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188234</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote cite=&quot;&quot;&gt;I just can’t get into it. It lacks the ‘40K come to life’ feel of the original, the campaign is tedious and the skirmish mode far too limited to hold long term interest.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I seem to recall one Alec Meer &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/03/31/retro-space-hulk/&quot; title=&quot;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;hearkening back to Space Hulk.&lt;/a&gt; And I quote:

&lt;blockquote cite=&quot;&quot;&gt;Much as I’m fond of it, I’ve always had one major complaint about Dawn of War. It doesn’t feel very Warhammer 40,000. It certainly looks pretty Warhammer 40,000 – fans are well-serviced by grisly animations and the army painter tool – but I never got much sense of the universe’s character. All that colour, all that cartoonishness, all that replenishing lost troops… I want DARKNESS and FEAR and EVERY MAN DOWN IS LIKE A PUNCH TO THE STOMACH.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Definitely sounds like Dawn of War II to me.

Also, I like how &quot;streamlined&quot; suddenly means &quot;shallow.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote cite=""><p>I just can’t get into it. It lacks the ‘40K come to life’ feel of the original, the campaign is tedious and the skirmish mode far too limited to hold long term interest.</p></blockquote>
<p>I seem to recall one Alec Meer <a href="http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/03/31/retro-space-hulk/" title="" rel="nofollow">hearkening back to Space Hulk.</a> And I quote:</p>
<blockquote cite=""><p>Much as I’m fond of it, I’ve always had one major complaint about Dawn of War. It doesn’t feel very Warhammer 40,000. It certainly looks pretty Warhammer 40,000 – fans are well-serviced by grisly animations and the army painter tool – but I never got much sense of the universe’s character. All that colour, all that cartoonishness, all that replenishing lost troops… I want DARKNESS and FEAR and EVERY MAN DOWN IS LIKE A PUNCH TO THE STOMACH.</p></blockquote>
<p>Definitely sounds like Dawn of War II to me.</p>
<p>Also, I like how &#8220;streamlined&#8221; suddenly means &#8220;shallow.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Him</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188187</link>
		<dc:creator>Him</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 20:38:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188187</guid>
		<description>My big funtime trick with &#039;nid players convinced of their own superiority is to offer them a sacrificial scout unit, which them pulls back into range of a devastator squad sat just out of sight.
Fun times!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My big funtime trick with &#8216;nid players convinced of their own superiority is to offer them a sacrificial scout unit, which them pulls back into range of a devastator squad sat just out of sight.<br />
Fun times!</p>
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		<title>By: Erlam</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188137</link>
		<dc:creator>Erlam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 18:51:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188137</guid>
		<description>&quot;I just can’t get into it. It lacks the ‘40K come to life’ feel of the original, the campaign is tedious and the skirmish mode far too limited to hold long term interest.&quot;

Really? I think the only game I&#039;ve played based on 40k table top that feels like it is DoW2. I&#039;m not saying that&#039;s good, but it feels much more like the tabletop than past DoW, etc.

That said, I agree that they think that the nids are ok. And they may be - it could be that at the higher echelons of playing, Nids fall behind.

But for casual players, they often find the Nids hard to counter. I myself can never figure out what unit to build to counter their melee/ranged/explosive/artillery combos. You know, 4 minutes in...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I just can’t get into it. It lacks the ‘40K come to life’ feel of the original, the campaign is tedious and the skirmish mode far too limited to hold long term interest.&#8221;</p>
<p>Really? I think the only game I&#8217;ve played based on 40k table top that feels like it is DoW2. I&#8217;m not saying that&#8217;s good, but it feels much more like the tabletop than past DoW, etc.</p>
<p>That said, I agree that they think that the nids are ok. And they may be &#8211; it could be that at the higher echelons of playing, Nids fall behind.</p>
<p>But for casual players, they often find the Nids hard to counter. I myself can never figure out what unit to build to counter their melee/ranged/explosive/artillery combos. You know, 4 minutes in&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Hulk</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188129</link>
		<dc:creator>Hulk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 18:22:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188129</guid>
		<description>Shallow game still shallow!  Hulk Smash!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shallow game still shallow!  Hulk Smash!</p>
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		<title>By: Fumarole</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188121</link>
		<dc:creator>Fumarole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 17:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188121</guid>
		<description>You might want to re-read my post and your response a few more times before deciding who has trouble getting their point across via text.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You might want to re-read my post and your response a few more times before deciding who has trouble getting their point across via text.</p>
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		<title>By: DK</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188112</link>
		<dc:creator>DK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 17:36:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188112</guid>
		<description>&quot;It still takes a monumental age to get into a 3v3 Ranked Match and, once there, you will often find yourself ‘matched’ with people from across the globe, who subsequently get kicked for lagging the game and are replaced by an AI-player who, although improved in this patch, still can’t hold a candle to an average Human player, crippling your team in the process.&quot;
It sounds very much like that&#039;s either a port, router or provider issue - 3v3 matchmaking usually takes less than 3 minutes for and pretty much everyone I play with.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It still takes a monumental age to get into a 3v3 Ranked Match and, once there, you will often find yourself ‘matched’ with people from across the globe, who subsequently get kicked for lagging the game and are replaced by an AI-player who, although improved in this patch, still can’t hold a candle to an average Human player, crippling your team in the process.&#8221;<br />
It sounds very much like that&#8217;s either a port, router or provider issue &#8211; 3v3 matchmaking usually takes less than 3 minutes for and pretty much everyone I play with.</p>
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		<title>By: Crispy</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188109</link>
		<dc:creator>Crispy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 17:24:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188109</guid>
		<description>(the RPS comment edit countdown begins at 30 minutes, but I think it&#039;s supposed to show only 5 minutes because it stopped me from re-editing just now)

If you control resources and keep your units alive, it&#039;s very easy to gain back those VPs and hold them. If you watch the higher-skilled players in head-to-heads you&#039;ll notice they usually spend the first couple of minutes securing resources before capping any VPs.

This is because
resources + unit preservation = army strength = map control = VP control = victory</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(the RPS comment edit countdown begins at 30 minutes, but I think it&#8217;s supposed to show only 5 minutes because it stopped me from re-editing just now)</p>
<p>If you control resources and keep your units alive, it&#8217;s very easy to gain back those VPs and hold them. If you watch the higher-skilled players in head-to-heads you&#8217;ll notice they usually spend the first couple of minutes securing resources before capping any VPs.</p>
<p>This is because<br />
resources + unit preservation = army strength = map control = VP control = victory</p>
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		<title>By: Crispy</title>
		<link>http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/13/dawn-of-war-ii-big-update/comment-page-1/#comment-188103</link>
		<dc:creator>Crispy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 17:07:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/?p=11508#comment-188103</guid>
		<description>I generally welcome everything in the update, but the big thing missing from that list is the matchmaking system hasn&#039;t been fixed.

It still takes a monumental age to get into a 3v3 Ranked Match and, once there, you will often find yourself &#039;matched&#039; with people from across the globe, who subsequently get kicked for lagging the game and are replaced by an AI-player who, although improved in this patch, still can&#039;t hold a candle to an average Human player, crippling your team in the process.

1v1 and 2v2 matchmaking are much faster, but you still end up with TrueSkill 27 &amp; 24 vs. TS 1 &amp; 6 whitewashes.

---

Re: The VP argument

It&#039;s perfectly doable to come back against someone with only 50 VPs left to your name. What will lose you games is poor unit preservation and not controlling resources. If you control resources and keep your units alive, it&#039;s very easy to gain back those VPs and hold them.

The main key is never letting the enemy get 3 VPs. Always keep it so they have at most 2 more active VPs than you. This means it will take 4m10 seconds to tick down instead of 2m45s.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I generally welcome everything in the update, but the big thing missing from that list is the matchmaking system hasn&#8217;t been fixed.</p>
<p>It still takes a monumental age to get into a 3v3 Ranked Match and, once there, you will often find yourself &#8216;matched&#8217; with people from across the globe, who subsequently get kicked for lagging the game and are replaced by an AI-player who, although improved in this patch, still can&#8217;t hold a candle to an average Human player, crippling your team in the process.</p>
<p>1v1 and 2v2 matchmaking are much faster, but you still end up with TrueSkill 27 &amp; 24 vs. TS 1 &amp; 6 whitewashes.</p>
<p>&#8212;</p>
<p>Re: The VP argument</p>
<p>It&#8217;s perfectly doable to come back against someone with only 50 VPs left to your name. What will lose you games is poor unit preservation and not controlling resources. If you control resources and keep your units alive, it&#8217;s very easy to gain back those VPs and hold them.</p>
<p>The main key is never letting the enemy get 3 VPs. Always keep it so they have at most 2 more active VPs than you. This means it will take 4m10 seconds to tick down instead of 2m45s.</p>
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