By Jim Rossignol on August 25th, 2009 at 5:56 pm.
Did we mention we were rather warm in our anticipation of The Old Republic? John had some pretty hefty preview thoughts to unload after E3, and we’ve been eager to learn a bit more. It seems IGN scooped the internet on that count, with a four part, twenty-minute developer walkthrough of parts of the game, including the early bounty-hunter, smuggler and Sith sequences, with lots more besides. Posted below, it is. This is heavy spoiler territory, obviously, so those of you who are definitely on course to play this game might want to avoid it. On the other hand, that bit where he walks out onto the surface of Hutta…
25/08/2009 at 17:57 Juror #9 says:
Damn Jim…one second im lookin at an elephant and the next second i clicked back and this was the lead article… You guys are fast….good on ya mate.
25/08/2009 at 18:01 Destron says:
Why are the lightsaber hilts so freaking huge?
25/08/2009 at 18:05 Railick says:
Why did they cartoonify the light sabers ? Is this just a strange effect going off or do they always look like this?
25/08/2009 at 18:07 Xercies says:
Heavily instanced, basically singleplayer with maybe some MMO like hubs. I wouldn’t pay monthly for this, this is Guild Wars stuff. The combat at least looks fluid.
25/08/2009 at 18:13 Psychopomp says:
@Xercies
I really don’t get that attitude at all. What do you do in most MMO’s? You run dungeons, or PvP.
Not even to mention the fact that they’re concentrating on showing us what separates it from other MMO’s. If they were showing us overworld crap the internet would be screaming “WOW CLONE,” instead.
25/08/2009 at 18:17 Paul S. says:
The internet always complains. It’s like a bunch of old ladies, getting sweaty over the Daily Mail and whingeing endlessly.
25/08/2009 at 18:18 CJohnson03 says:
25/08/2009 at 18:18 Stupoider says:
Openworld crap? Openworld isn’t crap, Psycho. :o I’m not a fan of heavily instanced worlds, unless all the instances are aiming to group people together and force teamplay. Open world makes it feel more like an MMO rather than a singleplayer game.
I’ll keep watching this, but I don’t think I’m likely to get it.
25/08/2009 at 18:22 Xercies says:
@Psychopump
You forgot exploring a world from one side to another, being able to go to that mountain in the distance see that palace over there and fight some goblins in ruins. Also you get to meet people in that world. Yes there is dungeons in that but usually those are for speciel occasions.
I kind of dislike heavily instanced games because it disconnects you from the world and from the players. Even Guild Wars was a bit to disconnected for my tastes.
25/08/2009 at 18:24 Jacques says:
Sweet jesus the gameplay looks dull.
25/08/2009 at 18:25 Sartoris says:
So full voice acting is their main selling point? Who cares? Especially if the stuff that’s recorded is as poorly written as this. Spend that budet on things that matter, don’t encourage the REDDING IS TEH HARD attitude.
25/08/2009 at 18:29 Schaulustiger says:
The dialogue system looks pretty neat and innovative (and fun!), but combat mechanics seem rather conservative.
And I have to second the people complaining about the – seemingly – heavy instancing. The best moments I had in MMO’s were the ones that truly felt epic due to the number of players present: huge open world pvp battles or big roleplay events. Instancing takes the “massive” out of MMO.
25/08/2009 at 18:40 Patrick says:
If you’d written, “we were rather lukewarm in our reception…” it might have been a terrible pun, so I’m glad you saved us all our sanity by instead liking the game.
25/08/2009 at 18:40 Vinraith says:
The instancing and solo play prospects are very appealing, but I haven’t found it in me to play through a Star Wars game since the series went to shit. Add to that the likelihood of a monthly fee, and all the time-wasting nonsense that goes with it, and I’d be surprised if this one ended up mattering to me.
Still, kudos for serving the silent soloing majority of the MMO community.
25/08/2009 at 18:41 Devan says:
Hmm, the problem with being all ‘heroic’ right from the start is that there’s nowhere to go from there. Sure you’ll learn new moves that do more damage, but the combat mechanic will probably _feel_ the same all the time (like many other MMOs). This may be alleviated by allowing you to switch your control to any of your NPC party members like you could in KOTOR, which would allow you to mix up your playstyles a bit without requiring you to grind out an alt for each class.
As for the central story mechanic, it looks to be very similar to how Mass Effect’s story worked: Massive corridored instances, which are generally unrelated to each other so their outcomes don’t conflict. The difference is that the story, while affecting on your personal and party development, has very little or no effect on the persistent world.
I hope these negative impressions are proven wrong and it turns out to be a lot of fun, but the more game footage I see, the less likely that seems.
25/08/2009 at 18:41 Sagan says:
Looks sweet. They seem to want to make the combat more interesting than WoW from the beginning. In WoW the first ca. 15 levels of combat are really boring, because you are always just hitting one guy over and over again, and don’t need even basic tactics. Here it seems that crowd control and teaming up could be useful from the beginning.
Not sure about the story though. Seems to go back to the simple good/evil decisions that are so out of style nowadays. But Bioware has made that work well before.
I think I am probably going to buy this, simply to play through the story once. Not sure if I will play it as an MMO afterwards.
I really hope, that some of the things in there are just placeholders. Why are all the girls such hotties? That totally does not fit on an imperial ship. The same goes for the model haircut of the asian guy. Imperial guys shouldn’t have haircuts like that. Or look so friendly.
And why are the republic troopers fighting with swords? That just looks stupid. If they absolutely need melee enemies, they should use special droids or trained monsters or something.
25/08/2009 at 18:47 Railick says:
I really liked Jedi Academy, that was the last good Starwars game I played because Star Wars Galaxies
25/08/2009 at 19:24 Cunk says:
It’s an MMO on rails. Look at those ridiculous cues that tell you where to take cover. What is that about? This game is nothing but scripted events, cut scenes, hand-holding, etc. It’s a single-player game with the added feature of grinding.
Why even make it an MMO? Just make it a stand alone game with co-op.
One of the guys in the video really summed up Bioware’s view of the MMO market: “I’m going to wave to this guy because that’s what you do in MMOs.” Yes, that’s what you do in MMOs. No reason to be ambitious about it.
25/08/2009 at 19:26 Jeremy says:
Nice, that looks very cool. I think at this point, for an MMO to try and oust WoW is both foolish, and guaranteed financial suicide. This looks to take a different approach, focusing on story and things like that, which is pretty awesome. Although with the new phasing tech that Blizzard has been using, they’ve really been able to start doing more with story themselves.
Full voice acting isn’t their main selling point, it’s just the first mmo to do that. You might as well say the cover system is their main selling point according to your standards. That being, they mentioned it once in 20 minutes. Also teamwork, and multiplayer dialogue trees. All of those things MUST be their main selling point since they mentioned it in the video.
I’m actually kinda surprised that so many people have all these negative things to say, it really looked awesome to me :)
Sagan: Those are vibroblades, a common Star Wars melee weapon.
25/08/2009 at 19:27 Jake R. says:
The instancing seems handled in about the only way it could be – cutscene rooms are behind doors or color-coded effect fields. It’s a bit immersion-breaking, but it’s probably the best plausible solution. Also keeps from having to instance entire zones.
25/08/2009 at 19:38 Tei says:
KOTOR was great because was Star Wars reinvented, made better, with more deep. I hope this game has something of that. I hope.
25/08/2009 at 19:40 Dante says:
“Open world makes it feel more like an MMO rather than a singleplayer game.”
And that is exactly the point, what people are hoping from for the old republic is an MMO that plays more like a single player game. Because then it might be a draw for those of us who thing most MMOs are bloody dull.
25/08/2009 at 19:48 Cheezey says:
Everything about this game is screaming to me that its going to live up to the promise it is showing. I’m a big fan of Kotor and ME and it certainly looks as if they are pulling off the fusion with an mmo quite well from watching the videos. I can’t help but feel if they do end up getting it right WoW is going to become a fading memory for many.
If you assume that group instancing is going to work like Parts 3/4 in the videos it’ll be superior to the sterility that i’ve grown acustomed to in WoW. It felt as if that kind of gameplay would make you feel involved in the story, much like Kotor/ME, giving certain choices implications on the story and progression of your character. Even if the implications of your decisions might be a bit shallower on closer examination, it’ll be better than the norm as far as I can see.
I do hope they keep the groupplay smaller scale, on the whole, at least from the perspective of PVE instancing. I’ve spent my fair share of time raiding in WoW and it always irked me that to be involved with the main story you really needed to be raiding 40/25/10 man to experience it. I’ve never felt that the extra numbers have made anything that much more “Epic”, in fact half the time I felt like a tourguide for the 10 dribblers you always had to drag along to make up the numbers!
Pvp wise I wouldnt so much mind the increase in numbers to give a feeling of actually being involved in the conflict on a level that extended beyond yourself and a small group.
It’ll certainly be interesting to hear what else they have planned though, as theres so little real info out there atm that unfortunately assumptions are coming up left, right and centre.
25/08/2009 at 20:03 Andy M says:
I disliked a lot of the animations (especially the fact that the bounty hunter’s feet were sliding across the floor while he walked), I cringed when he started walking headfirst into gunfire, and I almost facepalmed when the guy said “we want you to really feel like a hero from the start.”
Perhaps those are all just personal issues that most people won’t share, but there’s not a chance in hell that I’ll be playing this game. Dull.
25/08/2009 at 20:06 Sunjammer says:
Wow that animation work is awwwkwarrrddd. Does he need to poo or something?
As much of a Bioware and KOTOR fan i am. I’m not sold by these videos.
Is there some rule out there that everyone but CCP are following that dictates that MMORPGs need to play stiffly, awkwardly and look roughly the same? That whole genre needs some serious innovation beyond adding voice acting and dialog options.
25/08/2009 at 20:07 l1ddl3monkey says:
“The Defenestrator” was a Great Hunt winner? Someone’s been reading the Hitman comics…
25/08/2009 at 20:10 Xercies says:
@Dante
And Isk again..why? Why not just make this into a singleplayer game, then you can change the world to your hearts content, maybe put co-op in fo rpeople who want to play with friends. Just making anmmo has certain connotations like a big world(Guild Wars is not considered an mmo) and people to group with. You can’t change the world in an mmo but some people like having things in an mmo stay an mmo. Some people like single player games and not mmos then why play an mmo if you don’t like one and just like singleplayer games.
It really baffles me, choose one…
25/08/2009 at 20:44 Jeremy says:
Why not choose something completely different? Does it really gall you that much?
25/08/2009 at 20:55 Vinraith says:
I’ve never understood the mentality of people that want a game to FORCE other people to play with them. I mean, is it some kind of desperate loneliness thing? A symptom of always being picked last for kickball (no, wait, that was me and I’m not afflicted)? Someone want to explain why I should pay money to be forced to play with strangers?
25/08/2009 at 20:56 Stupoider says:
Nah, Vinraith. It’s just wanting to play in a team. That, and enjoying multiplayer games. How exactly is it a symptom of being lonely?
25/08/2009 at 20:58 Persus-9 says:
As a former Star Wars fan it pains me to see it still so out of touch with what made me love it.
The real strength of Star Wars to me was that it took itself seriously and really tried to sell the story, it made it real by making everything work realistically around it’s few basic fictions. If you could swollow the basic premise of the force and ignore the fact that spaceships wouldn’t work like that in real life then everything else made sense and was explained.
The E3 video really gave me hope http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-09-star-wars/49936 but these videos have crushed it completely. The art style says a lot, the E3 teaser was in a realistic style with the real living dirty world that was the great inovation of the original film, now it’s suddenly a cartoon, great way to sell the fiction that. I know that it was never going to look like that because that’s a pre-rendered cinamatic but the style could have be the same. But beyond the art style the important thing is that pretty much everything in the E3 video can be explained within the fiction and it’s trying as hard as possible to be real. Nobody in that video took on more that three enemies at a time and then only with the element of surprise. In that video one blaster shot or light saber cut is enough to drop anyone even if they’re a Jedi. Even the precision crash landing can be explained away as conceivably possible given that the cargo was entirely made up of sith.
Now we’ve got these latest videos and suddenly we’re talking about heroic Star Wars combat, what? I don’t remember that from the original films, when did that happen exactly? I remember Han Solo confronting about 10 storm troppers on the Death Star but as I recall his solution to that problem was to run really fast. I can’t recall any situation in the Star Wars films except maybe the attack on Jabba’s sail barge where the attackers didn’t make sure they had the advantage first. Heck Obi Wan allowed Vader to kill him because he recognised it was the only way for them to escape a situation where the odds turned against them. I suppose it makes some sort of sense now blaster and lightsaber hits are now apparently about as effective as punching people but that doesn’t make any damn sense at all. I don’t believe this Star Wars, I can’t engage with it because it doesn’t believe in itself, it doesn’t buy into the very fiction it’s meant to be trying to sell, it’s just silly fantasy crap in a way old Star Wars never was.
Sure old Star Wars was silly, very silly even but within the world it was deadly seriously. Heck look at X-Wing and Tie Fighter, look at how seriously those games took the Star Wars universe, can you imagine doing power management to strike a balance between shields and lasers in the modern Star Wars universe? No, that time has past and with it my love for the series.
I really hope people who aren’t depressed former fans get a real kick out of this because I’m sure it’ll be a good game but every time I see the mediocrity that Star Wars has become I see the ghost of what it was and that’s just makes me sad.
25/08/2009 at 20:59 QwanJin says:
Quite frankly, I think people need to quit complaining. Yes this is a MMO from what they are saying. I like the style of gameplay they are using. I prefer small groups or playing by myself as opposed to people running around in complete chaos doing whatever they want. This is not the way that battles are depicted from the movies. There is organization and teamwork. As far as the graphics and character movement….people, this is not even in BETA yet! They are just showing a preview. Many things are bound to be improved before the complete product is released. Singleplayer/versus multiplayer: The way they are doing this is very smart. Think about it. You can play by yourself or with friends. Plus, since there will be a server farm managing the game. Worlds, details, and events can be HUGE, not merely limited by the few gigs of space that typical single player games require on your computer. Personally, I think even this preview is great and can’t wait for the game to come out so I can get my hands on it.
25/08/2009 at 21:00 Vinraith says:
@Stupoider
The “forced” part. Just wanting to play a multiplayer game is fine, all one needs is the OPTION to group to make that happen. FORCED grouping is something else entirely. In the first case you’re controlling your own game experience, in the second you’re demanding control of everyone else’s as well.
25/08/2009 at 21:01 Stupoider says:
Also, there’s nothing wrong with playing with strangers. If you haven’t noticed, real life is full of strangers. What’s wrong with making a few friends while you play, instead of being stuck in your own little world?
25/08/2009 at 21:02 Vinraith says:
You’re still missing that key little word that means that, instead of having the option to play with strangers if I’m in the mood, I ALWAYS have to do so in order to play the game at all.
25/08/2009 at 21:03 Stupoider says:
Well, many people don’t mind being forced to play with strangers. Matchmaking systems force you to play with strangers, joining a random server in CS:S will make you play with strangers. If you want the option to not group, and then never group, what’s the point in having the second option?
25/08/2009 at 21:06 Vinraith says:
I group when I choose with whom I choose (ie with friends when they’re around, or on that rare occasion I feel like playing with a pick-up group). Even if I didn’t, though, it’d be important to have the option there for people that DO enjoy grouping. More options = more satisfied players. The real question is why deprive players of the option NOT to group? What’s the motivation, there?
25/08/2009 at 21:09 Psychopomp says:
The internet:”THEY SHOWED US INSTANCES THAT MUST BE THE WHOLE GAME HURP DURP”
25/08/2009 at 21:09 Psychopomp says:
@Vin
Because the internet hates change.
25/08/2009 at 21:11 Heliocentric says:
I guess its like the new battlefield 1943, they force you into squads if you don’t join one (might be server side choice) because it encourages cooperation. Whether you like it or not :)
25/08/2009 at 21:11 Stupoider says:
It means there are more people for other’s to group with.
Separating people from the game world into their own world, which isn’t influenced by other people, it ceases to be an MMO.
25/08/2009 at 21:12 Vinraith says:
@Psychopomp
Ah, but it’s not even change, now is it? Guild Wars handled this issue beautifully, but it’s just about the only MMO-like game to have done so. There, if I wanted to play alone, I could fill out a party with AI. If I wanted to play with friends or a pick up group, I just created/joined a group. Simple.
You know the best part, though? And this is an issue that NO other MMO seems to handle well, from what I’ve seen: If I could only fine, say, 2 friends for an area that required 8 players, we could just bring along 5 AI to fill out the group.
Now that’s proper flexibility.
25/08/2009 at 21:14 Vinraith says:
@Stupoider: “It means there are more people for other’s to group with.”
Now we’re getting to the reality of the situation. The people that DON”T want to group should be forced to do so so that those people who DO want to group have someone to play with. Read as: it’s more important that the MP crowd have fun than that the SP crowd has fun.
25/08/2009 at 21:17 Stupoider says:
If they don’t want to group, why are they playing an MMO?
Aaanyway, I don’t see this going anywhere. Why don’t we see people asking Valve for a TF2 singleplayer campaign? Probably because it’s best played online.
25/08/2009 at 21:17 Meat Circus says:
@Psychopomp:
No, there’s still hope there’s 60 levels of tedious PvE “kill 30 Ewoks” grinds of doom.
25/08/2009 at 21:21 Vinraith says:
@Stupoider
The lack of bots in TF2 has always been a sticking point with a lot of people.
“If they don’t want to group, why are they playing an MMO?”
Because they like the other characteristics of MMO’s? They enjoy a player-driven economy? A vast, sprawling world that’s constantly updated? The ability to easily group with friends or strangers when the mood strikes? Other characteristics particular to the game in question (EVE’s setting and graphics, WoW’s story, whatever)?
25/08/2009 at 21:25 Dinger says:
You know, I don’t like the grind as much as the next guy, but “Kill 30 Ewoks”? Where do I sign? How about 100?
25/08/2009 at 21:27 Meat Circus says:
@Dinger:
You may be right. Perhaps it wasn’t the best example.
25/08/2009 at 21:28 Vinraith says:
@Dinger
You raise an intriguing point. The deaths need to be VERY well animated and gruesome, though. I want to hear that “dying ewok” noise, and preferably want to see an ewok come over and shake the one I just killed, looking sad (right before I kill IT, of course).
Suddenly I’m hoping there’s the Star Wars equivalent of a chain saw in this game…
25/08/2009 at 21:28 Nihlus says:
awful looking game play and graphic.
25/08/2009 at 21:30 Tei says:
Re: Forced grouping. Forced soloing.
Games with a multiplayer aspect sould reward grouping, because grouping is hard, but is more rewarding on the long term than soloing: you have a more complete experience.
Forced soloing suck. Is wen grouping in a game is not encouraged, so theres not groups or groups only stay 1 minute.
Forced grouping suck. I suppose. I like grouping, so I have never feel “forced” to group.
New MMO’s sould have areas where the soloers can have fun, because these people are about the 50% of the population now. And have areas where groupers can have fun, and are not soloable, because the groupers are the other 50%. This balance is hard, and most games are releasing solo-friendly and anti-grouping. Combined this with the strange rejection to RP in a RPG ( OH, A GUY ROLEPLAYING IN A ROLEPLAYING GAME!.. OH, HE MUST BE A CRAZY GUY !). We have today MMORPG that are Singleplayer ..Online.. …Games. The other letters fail and die, much for the despair of these that like M-MO-RP-GAMES (yes, games where massive ammount of players roleplay a character in a world!).
25/08/2009 at 21:32 Jeremy says:
Seriously, just make a game based entirely on killing Ewoks.
As for the forced grouping, is that even happening in this game? Or did I miss a key element in the conversation? Or are you referencing something like WoW, where it isn’t required, unless of course you actually want to experience all of the content?
25/08/2009 at 21:34 Jeremy says:
@Tei (also sorry for double post)
Part of the difficulty in grouping is based on the fact that people are D-bags.
25/08/2009 at 21:39 Sagan says:
A good MMO that forces you to group would get me to play an MMO again. Because for me the entire point of playing MMO’s is playing with other people.
I played DAoC for a year or so, and I really enjoyed that. The only way to level up in that game was to team up. Because you needed to kill groups of enemies or very strong enemies to get a decent amount of XP, and you couldn’t do that solo.
I tried playing WoW twice. Both times I gave up before the trial time was over, because every single person except for me wanted to go through the low level zones solo. And when I finally did manage to group up with someone, it gave us no advantage whatsoever. We killed one really hard cyclone-thingy, and it gave us the same amount of XP as the super-easy mobs. The entire game seemed so pointless to me. Why play an MMO if everyone is solo, and if you get no advantage for playing in groups?
I realize that that probably changes at higher levels. But I always got bored before that.
And I realize that playing solo is what people want, and that I am in the minority here. And that is why I don’t play MMO’s anymore.
So if MMO developers would want me to play their MMO, they should force people into playing in groups, by giving groups advantages over playing solo. Otherwise I am just going to be disappointed again.
25/08/2009 at 21:41 Tei says:
@Jeremy: I have played in pug’s all my life. Having *GREAT* fun in Anarchy Online and Vanguard…. I could admit that there are D-bags in L4D, and *maybe* in WoW. But I have played lots of other multiplayer games, where people is nice to me. There will be always websites like MySpace of Angelfire, or the Consoles* or WoW, so all the D-bags are concentrated there, and the normal people can have fun in the othe websites and games.
*I hate musicians.
25/08/2009 at 21:45 Tei says:
I am often embarrassed by my own comments :-/
25/08/2009 at 21:46 Vinraith says:
@Jeremy
It was suggested that MMO’s should force people to play in groups, which is how this conversation started. With regards to TOR, my understanding is that it’s going to be VERY soloable, and this upsets people that feel the only reason to play an MMO is to force others to play with you.
25/08/2009 at 21:51 Sagan says:
Sorry that was too long. Here is my point:
If you don’t force people to group, they won’t. If soloing is as effective as playing in groups, then everyone is going to play solo.
And that will ruin the experience for me, who is looking for other people to play with.
Try to start a new character in WoW right now and try to find a person to group with. You won’t for the first 20 levels. And that is the reason, why MMO’s should force you to group by giving incentives.
I know I am in the minority and I know that won’t change.
25/08/2009 at 21:53 An Innocuous Coin says:
Well, the plot bits look interesting, but I have to admit some skepticism at a plot-heavy approach in an MMO.
Graphically…well, the view of Hutta off in the distance looked nice, but up close…I don’t know, the graphical style really isn’t doing it for me.
Combat looks terrible. Yes, cover system is new in an MMO, thats nice, but you’re still jamming a button over and over to do a move, and for me the fact you can pour dozens of blaster shots into someone, or flail at someone with a lightsaber and have them NOT die almost instantly really cuts down on the power fantasy they’re going for, here.
Seriously, what are lightsaber duels without the possibility of horrible maiming upon being hit? Nothing, I tell you. =c
25/08/2009 at 21:54 Vinraith says:
@Sagan: “If you don’t force people to group, they won’t. ”
And what does that tell us?
25/08/2009 at 21:57 Juror #9 says:
Man, i think the last SW games i played were Tie-Fighter vs. X-Wing and Dark Forces both of those i liked quite a bit.
25/08/2009 at 21:58 Vinraith says:
Now see, here’s where I miss the edit button, because that was unnecessarily snide. Apologies Saga, you’ve already admitted you’re in the minority and that’s the only point to be proven there. I’m done.
25/08/2009 at 22:00 JonFitt says:
So have they announced the pricing model yet? I’m already going to have to buy two copies; so since it seems reliant on lots of instances like GW, does that mean we’ll have a GW pay structure?
25/08/2009 at 22:04 Heliocentric says:
No, its based on a things people are irrationally fanatic about. So there will be a monthly fee.
25/08/2009 at 22:08 JonFitt says:
Damn. I don’t play MMOs, a good part of that being because of the monthly fee. Do they tend to have family plans?
25/08/2009 at 22:10 Vinraith says:
@Heliocentric
You’re probably right, of course, but have they actually announced a pricing structure?
25/08/2009 at 22:18 Jeremy says:
@Tei,
I have definitely had success in finding groups too, but trying to find 25 people (like in WoW) is just so difficult. I really enjoy the 10 man instances, because it actually makes it seem a little more epic. Can you imagine Lord of the Rings where the fellowship consists of 25 – 40 people ripping through everything? I enjoy smaller engagements, it let’s you actually know the people you’re fighting with and it’s a little more forgiving in terms of (Use X ability at Y time, twice during the fight, just after Boss A uses his ability Z). For me, that sort of purely structured fighting isn’t that exciting.
Still, I like the choice to group or not to group, the problem is that most people only want to group if there is an incentive (new gear) and once you’re loaded, you no longer have any reason to group. Until an MMO actually allows individuals to shape the world in some way, there really are no heroes at all, just 11 million players going after the same gear, playing the same part.
25/08/2009 at 22:20 Heliocentric says:
No family plans ever. Bleeding families dry is what mmo’s like best.
If kotor is an okay game you’ll likely wow style fee’s if its actually excellent you’ll likely need to use your first born as a deposit and bleed yourself to near death and then send the blood in hundreds of tiny bottles by carrier pigeon. The blood will be used to sate the devil who allowed such magnificence.
25/08/2009 at 22:25 Andreas says:
I don’t know. While I love the idea of an MMO in the Star Wars universe, there’s something very off-putting about that game. It just doesn’t feel right.
The voice-acting/writing wasn’t particularly good either. That overly badass sith warrior in there was funny at first, but it got old fast, and ruined any sense of immersion.
Regarding the monthly fees, those are justified when you have 24/7 support dedicated to that single game and continuous updates over a long period. It’s not the “MMO” part that makes them use the subscription model, I think.
I really don’t think they’re going in the right direction with this.
25/08/2009 at 22:29 JonFitt says:
It’s a worthwhile pointing out that increasingly while I’m buying just as many games, rarely now do I buy one full priced. I make liberal use of Steam sales, and play more Indie titles.
If this is going to run me 2 * $50 + 2 * $15/month, I might skip it no matter how good it is. Do not want/need.
25/08/2009 at 22:31 JonFitt says:
Oh, and let it be known: I understand the financial justification behind it, but that still doesn’t make me want to pay for it.
25/08/2009 at 22:32 Backov says:
I have to agree about the problems with starting as a hero.
Wouldn’t it be more interesting to have your first skill as a leet Jedi knigget be:
“Probably Won’t Cut Your Own Leg Off: Rank 1″
25/08/2009 at 22:46 Quine says:
Watching a lone guy standing in the open shrugging off the occasional blaster bolt while he picks off three hapless minions whose mates very nearby are determinedly not getting involved isn’t really bringing the whole heroic vibe for me.
Hit locations, lucky shots, proper ragdolls, destructible cover and the whole joyful anarchy of a gunfights would improve things somewhat, but that’s not what MMOs do…:(
25/08/2009 at 22:50 Andreas says:
After having read through the comments, I can only say I agree wholeheartedly with everything Persus-9 said.
It doesn’t take itself seriously enough. At all.
25/08/2009 at 22:56 Quine says:
What Andreas said Perseus-9 said +1.
It does rather feel like they’re riding the license and the MMO teacups, rather than trying to give us an actual *world*. Still at least we might be spared mobs popping out of thing air before they attack.
25/08/2009 at 23:01 We Fly Spitfires - MMORPG Blog says:
I’m very excited about SW:TOR and the trailers are looking great. I love the focus on more of a storyline, my only worry being that it ends up being too much like a single player game and not a MMO.
25/08/2009 at 23:02 Sagan says:
@Vinraith:
Even though I know I am in the minority, I still hope that some developer will realize that there are people like me out there, and they will make a game for us.
A game where grouping again gives you advantages right from level 1. Where everyone is always looking for a group, because you can play better that way than alone.
That would be the MMO I would play. Unfortunately developers would have to stop copying WoW for that, which isn’t very likely to happen.
25/08/2009 at 23:11 heroic zero says:
@Persus-9: I feel the same way. :(
Star Wars used to be so good. Then the prequels came in like a drunk and just pissed all over everything.
Maybe it was hoping for too much, to wish that this game could be a little bubble of old style Star Wars goodness in spite of everything, in spite of all the undoing of a favorite childhood myth.
The videos were tremendously underwhelming, though. It’s too bad, I was actually looking forward to this — I miss the good old Star Wars days. I wanted this to be good.
Better than that, anyway.
25/08/2009 at 23:38 Stupoider says:
I never thought I was in the minority, considering all the people who play WoW and enjoy being forced into playing with their friends and what not.
Also, with Guild Wars being my first MMO, I hated the singleplayer aspects of it. I only ever played it because it was free-to-play. :>
26/08/2009 at 00:02 Legionary says:
It looks good overall. However, my concerns included a slightly inconsistent art direction (the captain and first officer looked as though they’d been modelled properly, the junior officer later on looked highly stylised and almost an anime character. Running animation was poor and looked as though the character was floating across the floor, but that’ll almost certainly be fixed for release. Also, their plans of genuine contact in combat proved to be too impractical to implement fully I see. Ah well, not a huge deal so long as it doesn’t get to the point where it looks daft.
I look forward to hearing more from the game developers. As an avid Star Wars fan (though not of the prequels) I’ll be buying TOR, almost without a doubt.
26/08/2009 at 00:08 Stromko says:
Cripes. Well, it looks good to me. MMOs are mostly really crap, if we compare this to KOTOR 1 and assume that a new KOTOR would have to be inevitably better (like KOTOR 2, you know, *sarcasm*), then maybe it wouldn’t look that great. Compared to the storytelling and gameplay in every MMO I’ve ever played, it looks pretty good.
I loved the old X-Wing and TIE fighter games, but this is a different setting. It’s Old Republic. The pandering to the films by basing all the classes off heroic / villainous archetypes from said films comes off a little weak, but if we assume history repeats itself … The Old Republic time-line also seems to be a sort of high-powered setting, with Force users all over the place, Mandalorians, etcetera, so it’s no big upset that we’ve got ace Bounty Hunters and brilliant Smugglers as PC classes.
I wish Bioware had tried to jump on the MMO gravyboat before they joined the EA empire, but maybe they just couldn’t handle a project of this size without the funding that buyout provides. I just hope they don’t lose their souls / talent like every other studio under that umbrella has.
I fear they’re going down the path of Origin Systems. Cranking out Ultima Online expansions and adding elves and crazy shit like that. Seriously, there’d be freaking elves in Old Republic, or catgirls or some other attempt to pander to an ever- expansive- to- the- point- of- meaningless- mainstream. Please god, never again.
26/08/2009 at 00:12 armlesscorps says:
I think this game has got potential, and it looks like there is a lot of things that are being done right ( focus on teamplay to defeat the instances, the environments also look very cool).
The main worry I have is that the central premise of their approach ( let players have choices that have lasting effects) is totally antagonistic with the general way MMO’s work, they are infamous for having your actions have no effect at all, and there are other elements that seem like they are best suited to an SP game and not an MMO.
When you are running an instance for example and you think it would be an interesting choice to kill the commander in the video, are your team going to then kick you because it wasnt the right choice in terms of loot?
Everything that has been shown so far makes me think that the game will be great to play a trial of and get through the central story ( until it ends or becomes tedious) but theres basically nothing shown yet of the MMO’ness of the game that is the thing that keeps people paying the subscriptions. I’m sure Bioware want that sub money and they have things that will keep people playing, but it hasnt been shown yet. That is probably the main reason for this skeptism that its just an SP game with a sub.
Bioware need to start showing the other stuff that hey have held back, because the combat seems very promising but I think people need to see more of the world and the cities before they just disregard it as a non purchase.
With regards to teamplay forced or otherwise in an MMO. It is wrong to say people only play an MMo to be forced to group with others. Forming a group is just another challenge like completing a mission or something, it takes time but you feel like you have achieved something when you get a group ( a challenge in itself) and get it to the end of a mission, im sure thats the main reason I like grouping in MMO’s anyway. When Vinraith said that he liked Guild Wars because you can use bots, thats fine for Guild wars gameplay but its not really possible to make a bot that could do this in WoW or in The Old Republic because the teamwork required seems too advanced, so other players are a matter of necessity.
I like the idea that you need good teamwork to survive in The old republic and im hoping it can take this and the other things that make MMO’s great and wrap them around an engaging story with great player choices.
26/08/2009 at 00:17 armlesscorps says:
^^ dint realise that was so long i should have spaced it out better
26/08/2009 at 00:25 Dante says:
“And Isk again..why? Why not just make this into a singleplayer game”
Because MMOs offer a wide open space with a lot of potential, and to restrict them into a single banal gameplay mechanic is a silly idea by anyone’s standards.
You might as well ask, when System Shock added RPG elements to the shooter, why not play an RPG? Sometimes a synergy of two styles is greater than the component parts. And MMOs in particularly could stand to learn some lessons from the single player experience.
26/08/2009 at 00:26 Dante says:
Also, for people pissing and moaning about animation and such. Do you even understand the words “work in progress”?
26/08/2009 at 00:32 Legionary says:
I do think it’s reasonable to look at the footage of a game under development which has been released to market said game and make judgements based on that footage. Some of the animations there are poor, and it’s perfectly fine to say that so long as one also keeps in mind that it’s not a finished product.
If you can’t criticise animations on an in-development game video then where does it end? We may as well all sit around in silence and ignore the video entirely. The bottom line is that we’re being shown these things for a reason, and part of that reason is to get discussion going about the game.
Being reasonable is important, but it works both ways.
26/08/2009 at 01:09 Locust says:
That Mandalorian waves like a sissy.
26/08/2009 at 01:23 troy says:
Meh …. was hoping that this was going to show some promise .
Its warcraft on starwats clothes. Nothing new nothing ground breaking same old mmo concept . sigh…..
next to look forward to is . unfortunately star trek.
i was really hoping this was going to be cool .
26/08/2009 at 01:36 tehbearjew says:
i may be wrong but didnt tabula rasa introduce “the first cover system in an MMO” anyway?
26/08/2009 at 03:07 bill says:
It looks like a really great singleplayer game, with nice multiplayer built in.
But i don’t see why it needs to be an MMO. All of that would have worked great (better?) as a multiplayer part of an RPG.
Its gona be like paying a monthly fee for multiplayer Baldur’s Gate.
26/08/2009 at 03:22 Psychopomp says:
“Well, it looks good to me. MMOs are mostly really crap, if we compare this to KOTOR 1 and assume that a new KOTOR would have to be inevitably better (like KOTOR 2, you know, *sarcasm*)”
You know, there’s a lot of us who believe that KotOR 2, in spite of its many many flaws, was a much better game.
26/08/2009 at 05:08 jarvoll says:
I was going to bitch about lightsaber cuts and blaster hits NOT instantly killing their respective victims, but a few others beat me to it. I would like to add, though, that I feel that there’s absolutely no point having fully voiced dialogue (“immersive”) when you break immersion three seconds later when my guy takes a blaster bolt to the face as if it were a gentle cloud of sweet perfume. Star Wars games will always be 100% fail until they realize that lightsaber battles are about:
1) Who can physically and/or force-ically endure longest
2) Who can avoid being touched longest,
NOT who can reduce his enemy’s HP bar to 0 the quickest.
I also want to say that, even were I to have a burning (hah!) desire to play WoW, its pricing structure would forever arrest that desire. Not, you understand, because I have an inherent problem paying for something, but because of the following (note, AU$1 = around US$0.75 and about half a pound/euro):
-5 years-ish
-11 million subscribers (since it had to rise from 0, let’s call it an average of 7 million over the 5 years, to be conservative)
-AU$15 per month per subscriber
so that’s 5 x 15 x 7,000,000 which is AU$525M. Now I assume it’ll run for at least another year (assuming their new MMO comes out in a year and leeches every single WoW subber), so that’ll add AU$125M, bringing the total to AU$650M.
Now, they’ve sold 11 million copies of the client, to which I’ll assign the conservative value of AU$50 (in reality it’s generally rather more expensive, but this is an expensive game country). This adds AU$550M, bringing the total to AU$1.2B. I read recently (in the SC2 previews, I believe) that they have around a 90% client-expansion conversion rate. So 90% of 11 million subbers have also bought Burning Crusade and WotLK, and I’ll also assume the same number of purchases of Cataclysm, to which I’ll assign the (again, very conservative) price of AU$20 each. So around 10M x AU$60 adds another $600M. So, they’re sitting on AU$1.8 BILLION.
I have read that, over its ENTIRE lifespan, all development and support of WoW and its expansions has cost Blizzard a grand total of US$200,000,000. Converting to australian dollars and subtracting from their gross profits, we are left with: AU$1,560,000,000 *profit*. Pure profit.
According to their website, Blizzard has 250 employees. This total divided by 250 tells us that, assuming they all took an equal share of this profit, each Blizzard employee is laughing all the way to his or her SIX POINT TWO FOUR MILLION-DOLLAR bank account. In United States dollars, that’s around $5,250,000. EACH. If a Ferrari 350 costs $250,000 (an insane amount to pay for a vehicle in the first place), each Blizzard employee could purchase 21. These people are stupidly, incomprehensively rich.
Now, I personally feel that for anyone to have that kind of wealth is immoral. Disgusting and reprehensible. But I do recognize that that’s just my personal belief; I’m sure many of you are happy in a system that allows for that kind of wealth. But this is fact: they do NOT need to charge a $15-per-month sub fee to ‘keep the game going’. Not even close. They could charge a tenth of that, in fact, and each and every one of their employees would have earnt $500,000 over five years, a six-figure annual income.
To conclude: I will play Wow, Blizzard, when you charge me one dollar and fifty cents per month subscription fee. In the meantime, enjoy your 5,250 (21×250) Ferraris.
26/08/2009 at 05:40 Psychopomp says:
On the other hand: $15 a month is far from a lot of money, dude. Get over yourself. This is capitalism, this is how things work. I’m a socialist, and I accepted this ages ago.
26/08/2009 at 05:58 jarvoll says:
Like I said, I don’t actually have a problem paying for a game to play a game. That, however, is furnishing someone’s second golden-walled mansion to play a game.
26/08/2009 at 06:26 Xfonic says:
KoToR was THE best in the series.. And the graphics were fine WHY mess with it?? Two words –> “Casual gamer”.. Yep.. it is a selling point when the kids can pick it up and you are forced to play , as a serious gamer, with a group of retarded 8 year olds who just want to hop around and do nothing serious in game..
BioWare you should scrap this one.. FIRE you project directors and start over.. Because no one and I mean NO ONE with half a brain would play this… And for the fat nerds (reading up) who said that Guild Wars is not considered an MMO.. I guess running around killing boars as a cow makes you hard core? You don’t like it because you are not good enough to play it.. Sucka
The new Tor = Graphics suck – Gameplay sucks – Voice acting sucks (seriously.. who cares) – Story – Sucks (Re-hashed a billion times over) – Development team apparently sucks because they wouldn’t know a decent game if it bit them in the face… The same mentality that prob thinks the Xbox live avatars are cool… I will spend my money on something else /rant
26/08/2009 at 06:30 Feintlocke says:
I seriously hope they try a new business model with this game. I’m not paying for a subscription when I could just buy Mass Effect 2. Maybe throw out some base classes (and their respective story arcs) in the box and charge for the other classes/stories like expansions. I’d bite.
So far they haven’t shown a single reason why this should be an MMO and not a single player game with optional coop.
In other news that hotbutton combat system is soooo oollllddd and boring. Again, I’d rather have Mass Effect 2.
26/08/2009 at 06:31 Psychopomp says:
@Xfonic
BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH-
Wait, you’re not joking?
Oh, well, that just makes it funnier.
26/08/2009 at 06:36 Psychopomp says:
No, really.
I *love* people who go into the comments section of a PC only gaming blog, and call other people nerds.
26/08/2009 at 07:38 Jayt says:
Wonder if this game will feel grindy
26/08/2009 at 09:47 somberlain says:
@Xfonic:
Guilde Wars was never described as an mmo, and when it came out you could read that everywhere
26/08/2009 at 09:50 somberlain says:
Quote from official GW website:
“Rather than labeling Guild Wars an MMORPG, we prefer to call it a CORPG (Competitive Online Role-Playing Game). Guild Wars was designed from the ground up to create the best possible competitive role-playing experience.”
(I just found that to add :p)
26/08/2009 at 10:10 Bobsy says:
“I hope you’re as excited about The Old Republic as we are”
That’s extremely unlikely. Bioware are way too pleased with themselves over this, and it’s coming off as smugness for things which really aren’t especially great leaps forward. A fully voiced MMO is great, of course, but it’s hardly a major selling point. The multiplayer dialogue is far more important, but they just don’t seem to realise this, and we barely got to see what it was like in that video.
They’re not taking a very polite attitude with promoting this game. A lot of people have extremely significant grievences with the contept of TOR, and not only are these being poorly addressed, Bioware are coming of as aloof and superior, banging their own drum about how amazing they are at what they’re doing without giving much away in terms of actual information.
Incidentally, nothing in those videos is up to date. It’s footage that was captured ages ago when the ‘Fully Voiced’ video was released. And the scenario was first described months ago in a PCG feature. So this is old footage of old content. I wonder how long ago these videos in their current format were assembled.
26/08/2009 at 10:16 Kanakotka says:
The only issue i see is calling this an MMO. Guild Wars is not an MMO either… and that’s a good thing. This, and guild wars, are multiplayer games, not massively, but multiplayer nevertheless, with big chatrooms… not very different to many multiplayer source games, for one. Or GunZ.
26/08/2009 at 10:51 Legionary says:
I do think, though, that it’s rather silly to say “why is this an MMO” – City of Heroes’ content is almost entirely instanced beyond the city zones that’re used to travel to the entrance of missions, are you asking why that’s an MMO?
TOR doesn’t have you often sat around in the hub areas killing ten banthas, but that doesn’t mean it’s a single player game that you’ll pay subscription fees to play any more than City of Heroes is single player. Games which use instanced quests rather than having everything out in the open have the capacity for more interesting missions because there’s a limit to what you can do when other players are wandering around in the area of the mission.
Just because it’s taking a different approach to Warcraft and its imitators doesn’t mean it’s not an MMO. Do you REALLY want World of Star Warscraft?
26/08/2009 at 11:06 Bobsy says:
@Legionary
I’d rather have Eve + Planetside in Star Wars clothing. IS THAT SO BLOODY DIFFICULT?
(hint: yes, it is)
26/08/2009 at 11:19 Morten says:
I like starwars. When I initially played SWG, I felt they got the crafting right, just never enough options for each profession. Combat, was boring. I can’t think of a better word, but im sure one of you non politically incorrecy people can come up with one.
Im a little freaked by the video because the combat reminded me alot of the combat in SWG really. (of course ts a work in progress) but it was the whole feel of it. I fear that it will be a game that makes you grind to get access to nice voiced over cutscenes, and not much else. Thats all I really got from that video.
Starwars is a huge universe, “dumbing it down” to a focus of character development, and only character development has been seen and done before, changing the journey slighty, in regards to get to the highest level, isnt going to make a game great. been seen, been done, doing it tomorrow.
In conslusion:
The stories might be good, but will I have to grind ½ hour of tedious combat for 30 seconds worth of cutscene?
Will It have any impact on the game (other then my characters development) what I do?
if the answers is Yes, No. Then I wont be buying the game. And it does seem like a shame because the idea is good, but if they mess up the execution, it will be a long time before another finacial backer will risk developing such a game.
26/08/2009 at 11:33 Cheezey says:
It really is suprising me with the amount of negative views people are getting after seeing those videos.
I will say perhaps some of the graphical look/feel of the game is a little less dark than you might expect for the sith side of things but other than that I think the style will work quite well. I do highly doubt they influenced the art style to appeal to younger audience though, I mean the games going to have slicing people up with a sword for cripes sake.
I think graphically it might of been appeased significantly had they just stuck with the KOTOR look and feel, which would of provided that more serious/darker look in places.
Regarding the Instancing:
Has it even been announced that its going to work like Guild Wars with non-instanced hubs and instanced everything else? or is this just a huge assumption everyone is making on seeing those videos?
Considering its just one guy showing you around I’d of thought the potential lack of other players was an obvious one, and not some sinister fuel for the angry internet man fire.
26/08/2009 at 11:36 rei says:
Cranking out Ultima Online expansions and adding elves and crazy shit like that.
Wait, elves? In my Ultima?
What a travesty. I’m glad I never managed to get into that game.
As for TOR, I didn’t dare hope much, but these clips were still a disappointment. Aside from just looking tedious and genric, the ego-stroking and sucking up to the player disgusts me.
26/08/2009 at 12:19 Ryan says:
While the combat system looks old and similar to wow (keep in mind they’ve stated a fair few times that there are aspects of combat they aren’t willing to release yet), atleast the animations in the sith’s combat looked brutal enough. Too bad the art style and out of combat animations are pretty poor. I actually liked how the models reacted to getting kicked in the crotch etc though.
They still haven’t delved into the pvp half yet. That alone, I imagine, will be a large part of the Massively Multiplayer experience, and i’m sure there’ll be your standard open world MMO style planets. I look at it this way, story driven content could be the newest, and greatest end game material for those of us who want something other than just raiding.
26/08/2009 at 12:27 Tei says:
All games that want to look generic need the characters to wear something like full plate, or if the theme is sci-fi, wear something like a robot chest with giganteous shoulderpads.
I don’t remenber the sith or the jedi with these armors. Other than Darth Vader, but he was something like fused to his armor by a accident.
The stormtropper armor, yes, the mandalorian armor, yes… these make the characters looks like robots. But everything else on star wars looks more human… more like *cough* leather armor.
If this game is done right, there will be a implementation of “sets”, where if you have all the items of the armor of a mandalorian, you will get extra bonuses. Otherwhise, people will have mandalorian armor, mixed with stormtroper-y armor, mixed with some randum sith elements, and a pink laser blade.
Why I sould care about this? because is Star Wars.
26/08/2009 at 12:42 Sol says:
What concerns me about this game is that you’re not playing character classes, you’re playing a character.
You don’t play a bounty hunter, you play a boba fett clone.
You dont play a sith warrior, you play a darth vader clone.
You dont play a smuggler, you play a han solo clone.
I don’t want to be boba fett, or darth vader, I want to be my own character.
Does every bounty hunter in the galaxy get a jetpack, a flame thrower and a rocket launcher? Is it part of your induction seminar?
26/08/2009 at 12:56 leelad says:
NERVES OF STEEEEL!!!!!
Duke nukem delayed because LA have hired him as a voice actor?
26/08/2009 at 13:13 Hmm-Hmm. says:
It’s strange but I feel like I haven’t even glimpsed the game yet. It’s all so.. okay-ish? In a bland way. It’s like I’m thinking: “Is this it?”
And I wonder how the choices they give will work out. If they are far-reaching it could be a bummer to party up with someone who chooses things you wouldn’t have. If they’re not.. then it’s not much more than flavour. A gimmick.
Still, it very much feels like a single player game coupled with some basic aspects of the generic MMO. And I really don’t like how the players aren’t pushed at any point (maybe somewhat during the boss fight). If npcs pose no threat, mowing through them may be easy, but much less fun as well.
Thoroughly unimpressed, I’m afraid to say.
26/08/2009 at 13:14 drof1337 says:
So… much… hatred.
Judge the game when you know more about it. Judge it when it’s not over a year from release.
I for one am fucking excited about what this game could represent, and I may well be disappointed with it when I get to play it, but I might think it’s the best thing since sliced bread. If it’s crap, I’ll be the first one to hold up my hands and admit it.
But from what I’ve seen I am impressed. Apart from that Sonic the Hedgehog DS abortion, Bioware haven’t released a bad game in my opinion.
If this is Kotor crossed with an MMO, I’ll be happy to play it. In fact, the average MMO man, who plays the game hardcore for maybe a month or two before moving onto the next game will probably loiter in this game for longer because of the story elements. I know I would and I’m hardly unique in my gameplay habits.
If they keep adding more storylines and plot elements for high level and there’s some PVP, some old fashioned grinding for those who want to, raiding, trade and space combat then they’re on to a winner with at least a reasonably sized portion of the gaming world.
26/08/2009 at 13:26 vasagi says:
i love mmo’s
FACT-watching other people play mmo’s is rubbish
that is all
26/08/2009 at 13:32 Paul Moloney says:
“What do you do in most MMO’s? You run dungeons, or PvP”
Speaking for myself, I reckon 99% of the time I spent in WoW was in non-instanced areas. I don’t get the point of MMOs that are mainly instanced either.
P.
26/08/2009 at 13:59 Neut says:
Why is this game an MMO again?
26/08/2009 at 14:05 JKjoker says:
Neut: isn’t it obvious ? monthly milking sounds a lot better than one time only milking
26/08/2009 at 14:50 Jeffery Wilson says:
I enjoyed the video preview! I cant wait to play, Im so sick and tired of Fantasy MMO’s.
Also I am so tired of hearing about how “TERRIBLE” Instanced worlds are;
1. “WOW Is endless, you can really feel like your in that world” Well to put it bluntly, WOW is 6 year old graphics and looks every bit of 10 years old. I call b@ll$hit on this, you are walking around in an Obviously Cartoon World, with Obviously Cartoon Monsters, with Obviously Cartoon Characters, swinging Obviously Cartoon weapons and you believe instancing breaks the suspendsion of disbelief? You just wanna prevent anything from questioning your Obviously Cartoony game.
2. “Instancing is old school” – Until Networks become 10X faster than they are now and that is common place for locations all over the world, if you want to increase graphics detail, increase story content and make “truely better game worlds” Your going to have to use instancing. WOW is the peak for graphics detail even in todays world without instancing. So every game looks like WOW or you wait a couple of minutes between areas. Big deal.
Waiting on the Instancing screen isnt a big deal with the modern attack modes of some of these game it’s the only time I even get to have a pause, they seem like non-stop action or free PvP makes the only safe place logging off.
26/08/2009 at 15:22 JKjoker says:
i though the idea behind “instancing” was so that other players wouldnt bother your party while you were busy kicking ass, you know unlike OLD mmos ?
and if you think any new mmo will not have a cartoon world with cartoon monsters and obviously cartoon characters swinging obviously cartoon weapons you should stop smoking whatever you are smoking
26/08/2009 at 15:49 Jesrad says:
This looks like a shambles. A generic MMO with bad writing and endless combat against weak enemies is nothing to be excited about.
All the nonsense about making the action “iconic” and the player feel “heroic” made the developers seem like planks, so there’s little chance of this changing for the better.
26/08/2009 at 16:03 Masked Dave says:
Looks fun :)
26/08/2009 at 16:07 JKjoker says:
rule number 1 of a pnp rpg dungeon master : do not give a player special powers, it pisses everyone else off
rule number 1 of mmo marketing : try to get customers to think they can be special and better than everyone else playing the game
uh…
26/08/2009 at 18:20 Psychopomp says:
“WOW is the peak for graphics detail even in todays world without instancing. ”
Someone has never played EVE…
26/08/2009 at 19:42 neoanderthal says:
The combat looks, hmm, interesting. I noticed the bounty hunter had a WAR-type action point equivalent (in terms of player resources that recharge during combat), and that the Sith Warrior uses something akin to a rage mechanic. I also noticed the game uses a global cooldown timer for abilities. Auto-attack didn’t seem to be present, unless it’s like WAR and is just something that runs in the background while you’re hammering on your abilities.
As for the items that are not combat mechanics, I think that the cutscenes for the instances (sorry, flashpoints) might be cool the first time you run one, but would get really old if you are doing the thing for the nth time. I feel that might also be a problem with the dialog – I noticed it’s possible to skip through the dialog after a bit, but the player is still required to listen to at least a portion of the NPC talking. If you’re rolling your 4th bounty hunter and listening to the character creation dialog, this would be tedious to say the least.
From the Sith starting area, it’s evident that “kill x of y quests exist in this game, and who knows what else. I also find the idea that every member of the same class starts on the same world to be faintly ridiculous.
Who knows what they’ll pull out of their collective hats before release date, though. I’d certainly be interested to see what they have in mind for Player vs Player, which I hope goes beyond the duels and battlegrounds in WoW. I also hope if there are collection-style quests, the completely abandon the drop-rate-as-a-percentage mechanic that WoW uses to full effect.
26/08/2009 at 20:43 Psychopomp says:
You know, aside from the fact that they’ve not stated that the whole-game-aside-from-cities is instanced, there’s more to an MMO than an uninstanced overworld.
Oh wait, I forgot, Morrowind isn’t an RPG because it doesn’t have moral choices.
Not to mention that Men of War isn’t a strategy game, because it doesn’t have base building and tech trees,
27/08/2009 at 02:11 Legionary says:
>>“WOW is the peak for graphics detail even in todays world without instancing. ”
>Someone has never played EVE…
Or just about any MMO released after WoW and one or two released before it.
27/08/2009 at 10:13 Hillbilly jimbo says:
Regarding how innovative this game will be, Bioware said it themselves. They are simply adding the extra ‘pillar’ of storyline to the other foundations of an MMO. Nevermind that those other pillars are made of steaming piles of Sith. What matters is that the game is cartoony, will retain a couple million users, and generate revenue. DAS IST ALLES!
27/08/2009 at 10:25 Half-evolved Primate says:
If the game provides many an opportunity to grief, I will be all in. Quite simply, NOTHING in an MMO has brought me the ecstatic joy and hilarity I experienced in SWG, convincing poor saps I was a jedi (and gaining ‘shelter’ in their homes), then robbing the place blind. It was so glitched at some point you could do quests over and over and I would peddle ‘unique’ quest rewards for dough. One can make fun from the shittiest of games, says I!
27/08/2009 at 21:37 Concept says:
Meh, I have mixed feelings about this.
Firstly, the characters look horribly cartoonish. What’s with all the anime hair?
Animations aren’t the best, but a big improvement from what I saw a while ago. Voice acting looked very sluggish in parts.
But then again, this still is looking like an awesome game, the co-operation looks well thought and combat still has a hope of being slightly more interesting than press this to hit then 10000 times.
27/08/2009 at 23:06 Adventurous Putty says:
It doesn’t help that they butchered their own setting. The original two KOTORs were set 4000 years before the Original Trilogy/Clone Wars precisely so that they could explore avenues not allowed by the cliched “Empire versus Rebels” thing. So we got to see a lot of different dynamics that, while reminiscent of the movies, were clearly different/predecessors.
This, on the other hand, has literally returned to the same exact Empire vs Rebels formula, including the symbols for the Empire and the clone troopers. It doesn’t make any sense within the grander scheme of the universe and feels horribly contrived — they should’ve made it Star Wars Galaxies 2, then.
28/08/2009 at 19:13 Sonic Goo says:
I wonder how many MMO players have ever thought ‘man, I wish this quest text was fully voiced, that would be so much better’…
31/08/2009 at 02:22 Carson says:
This game looks awesome! I can’t wait to play it! This game blows that stupid world of warcraft crap out of the water. Woot! Star Wars is so bomb!
06/09/2009 at 21:31 no says:
Star Wars… *YAWN*