Comments on: Surfacescapes: D&D On Microsoft Surface

By: laugh

laugh — Fri, 23 Oct 2009 16:41:03 +0000

geeks and their stupid crap lol

By: Carda

Carda — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 22:48:40 +0000

“-They should dump the grid and use circles for movement and area-of-effect.”

While that would be great if this were an original game, the concept as I see it is a way to play 4th edition D&D (you’ll notice they mention at-will powers at one point). That’s why they stuck with a grid, to match the gameplay mechanics of what was already there.

So yeah, yours is a very good idea, it just doesn’t fit given the concept they were going for.

By: Stromko

Stromko — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 20:26:32 +0000

Except that he actually has a point. The rules are only a jumping-off point, the point of tabletop roleplaying games is that anything could happen depending on choice and circumstance. In a wargame, you stick to the rules because that’s the only fair way, but a roleplaying game without player choice and GM arbitration falls rather short of its potential.

Nothing saying that someone couldn’t pull some levers behind the GM screen to make that touch interface work with a more open-ended game, but altogether I’m not really convinced. SecondLife has had a perfectly workable interface for quasi-tabletop games (complete with nigh-infinite resources for constructing models, maps and other visual aids), and that still hasn’t taken off.

Ultimately the point of the thing is hanging out with your friends and having something to talk about, the only point of a visual aid is to minimize arguments and keep things straight. People aren’t going to be talking about the graphics years on, they’re going to be talking about that time the druid hit the carnivorous ape with oil, followed by the rogue hitting it with a flaming arrow and igniting the oil, which would’ve been all well and good if the ape hadn’t been grappling the dwarven cleric at the time. And said dwarven cleric got color-sprayed by the sorceror and was dazed for 3 rounds, while the ape managed to resist the effect and keep smacking him about while they were both burning.

I would say that 4e lacks the ability for player creativity and GM arbitration and that you may as well play it strictly through a computer, but then I actually got a good GM and saw that said assumption was wrong.

By: JoeDuck

JoeDuck — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 14:57:33 +0000

@postx: We had some photos around somewhere, we were going to release the code for the webcam control system as open source, but we actually did never get to preparing the page, the campaign got too interesting. I’ll ask the guys and maybe dig up something for you. :-)

By: Wurzel

Wurzel — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:43:49 +0000

It’s a very neat application, and certainly cool for your NWNs or baldur’s gates, but as a DM/GM I’d never use it, simply because of all the stuff you’d need to prpare for sessions. Maybe it’s because I like the white wolf/storyteller kind of system more, where the pcs have an incredible freedom of expression and combat could never work with a grid or w/e. I’m not sure how well this system could react to the PCs deciding to screw the quest and go pillage the nearby village after becoming emperors of the nearby goblin city (true story).

By: Kakksakkamaddafakka

Kakksakkamaddafakka — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:34:18 +0000

This is a misunderstanding of what P&P is.

I have no issues with using this technology for things like maps and whatnot, but recreating dices and total representations of environments is just plain wrong.

The P&P games of late have been infested with an abundance of visual aids. The whole point of P&P is using your imagination. It’s like creating a book while you’re reading it.

The Surface tech is cool though, no doubt about it, and it could certainly be awesome to use in P&P roleplaying, if used correctly.

By: postx

postx — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 10:26:36 +0000

JoeDuck
Would love to see you guys play, do you have any sessions on video?

By: John

John — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 09:53:09 +0000

I think I just had a nerdgasm.

By: JoeDuck

JoeDuck — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 07:38:33 +0000

When we play using our version of this system (see above), the DM has a laptop with a view of the map without fog of war and where he can redraw parts if needed. It works pretty well and there are surprises every minute.
Of course, this adapts very well to a tactical relatively reality based RPG like 4th ed. D&D in the first 10 levels, but it does not help if your terrain is abstract, nondescript or you are flying between planes of existence between clouds of demon souls, for example.
Now what would be seriously awesome would be to make a cooperative RTS game where a team plays on one M$ surface controlling one army while in 10 mts away the other team is playing in another surface. It would demand a lot of coordination and teamwork, but bragging, beer drinking and good times seem very likely with this kind of setup.

By: Edgar the Peaceful

Edgar the Peaceful — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 07:23:15 +0000

i haven’t played D&D for years – actually I miss it, sniff – and I agree that primarily it all happens in the mind, but it’s always used maps to give flavour, both as props and as practical boards with miniatures.

This would be fantastic if it could recognise physical miniature placement on top of its maps.

It would never replace physical dice for me as the virtual roll is not as satisfying as the physical. Also, a nice set of dice are like artefacts. For me they’re the spirirtual / religious symbols of the game, and were crazily exotic and thrilling when I first got the game in the early 80s

By: Wiggett

Wiggett — Wed, 21 Oct 2009 00:48:55 +0000

To everyone paying out on the clunky dice,: This is a WIP, a proof of concept. Issues like how clunky the dice roll is or how lame the wolf graphic is are negligible. The full version will have these things tweaked! Also you see him refer to the player tools controlling the stats etc, they don’t say these tools can’t be minis.

@MacD; I’m pretty sure in the video they both mention and show the DM screen is in fact on a separate monitor from the desk, though they show the walk grid for the wolf on the table as a demonstration.

I think the concept is amazing, so much room for great story telling and computer aided interactivity. Also preparation time would be much better than you think, I spent a whole week preparing a foamcard town for a single encounter on one of my games. I wish I was able to replicate such a thing on an interactive desktop! Also splice in some films of npc interaction.

In fact there is a suggestion; Cut scenes and Interactive visuals for NPC’s (like pre-determined speech etc)

By: Kommissar Nicko

Kommissar Nicko — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 23:32:48 +0000

Looks pretty awesome, but it really doesn’t suit laziness at all. The amount of work that would have to go into making a campaign up would definitely put me off, but then again, so does the potential price tag.