By Alec Meer on July 30th, 2010 at 11:09 pm.
I did a bad thing. I bought an Apple Magic Trackpad. I know, I know! In my defense, I intend to use it with a PC rather than a Mac, and I bought it primarily to try and ease up a nasty bout of RSI. The latter hasn’t worked one bit, so now I really have to work on justifying the former.
If you’re not aware of it – briefly, it’s an oversized multitouch trackpad, like you’d usually find on a laptop but strangely reimagined as a standalone Bluetooth unit that looks a bit like a desktop calendar that’s run out of pages. Though many (i.e. one person) have called me a fool for even trying, I have also gamed on it successfully. Somewhat.
There’s been a hullaballoo about it in Macland, with shrieking types believing it spells the end of the mouse and a move towards making Macs iPad-y. Nonsense, poppycock, what rot. Of course it doesn’t – it’s just designed as a mouse alternative for show-offs with neatly-manicured beards. I.e. not me. Which is another reason I bought it: to try and pervert it utterly by chaining it to Windows. I’ll show them, etc. Oh, they’re not listening. Never mind.
It doesn’t work quite as intended on PC due to Apple making its multitouch operation bound into OSX functions, but it is possible to install it on it and get most of its features working in Windows (I’ll show you how in a moment) – and to use it for games without abject failure.
Let me add the proviso that it is not better than a mouse for gaming. It’s worse, at least if you’re a veteran mouse+WSADer. It’s just that, unlike every other mouse alternative in the history of the universe ever, it’s not absolutely hopeless. You can game with it, and I’ve used it to play a significant amount of StarCraft 2′s singleplayer. It works pretty well, the only real downside being dragging a box to select a whole bunch of stuff can flake out. All told, it’s definitely not as efficient as a mouse – but it does work. The mouse has a viable alternative. That’s been a long time coming, it really has.
I wouldn’t dare use it for multiplayer, because you just can’t quite coax that kind of speed of response out of it. There is definitely a tactile, futurist pleasure to using it for strategy though – a sense of stroking the world, interacting a little more directly rather than moving a plastic oval around a piece of wood/plastic/titanium/human bone/whatever the hell you people use for desks these days. Even though the mouse is unquestionably the better tool for the job, I keep gravitating towards this – and not purely because it’s a new toy. Oh, and I can hold it one hand and tap at it with the other, not having to involve a desk at all, which does feel terribly Star Trekky.
Particularly, the size of the thing (about 5 inches square) is enough that you don’t feel cramped: it’s a proper interface, not the strange half-measure that a standard laptop trackpad constitutes.
Haven’t tried it with much else yet, though it worked a treat in Peggle. I suspect it’s no good whatsoever for shooters, but I look forward to trying.
In terms of multi-touch features, I’ve persuaded it to do zooming and scrolling, but that’s it. Which puts it on a par with a three-button mouse. Hooray, big bloody deal. Given it does rotating and app-switching and all sorts on OSX, I feel there’s some potential locked inside this weird, blank, shiny slab, however. Its size and its direct finger-responsitivity make it a pleasure to use – but it does need to do more.
If it was programmable, its multi-touch nature would make it a wondrous thing for stuff like RTSes and MMOs, keying certain areas or gestures to certain functions. Given that it hasn’t helped my RSI one bit I’m probably going to return it to the shop, but a part of me wants to hold out and see if any clever buggers manage to write custom software for it. It’s a touch interface for the PC which doesn’t require a special monitor that you have to leave greasy fingerprints all over. I’m very interested to see where that could go in terms of games, presuming people can find a way past whatever locked doors Apple’s erected around it.
If you’re considering getting one, my final word remains that the mouse is unquestionably better for gaming, but for some genres this future-slab is definitely viable. Don’t kid yourself you’re getting it for anything other than indulgent reasons, though: there isn’t any practical justification for it. It’s probably the most fun I’ve ever had with a square of metal and glass attached to a battery, however, and again I’m looking forward to seeing what modders make of it.
Oh, and to install it on Windows, unless you want it to function solely as a one-button mouse, you need to fool your PC into thinking it’s a Mac. A Mac with Windows installed on a partition thanks to Apple’s Bootcamp software, specifically. Which is easier than it sounds. I figured this all out the hard way myself, though I guess guides must exist by now.
You need to obtain from somewhere (Apple don’t host it directly, but it’s very easy to find) the Bootcamp 3.0 driver pack; it will refuse to install directly because it can immediately tell your PC isn’t a Mac. No matter – use Winrar or suchlike to extract everything from the .exe – it’s actually a compressed archive file disguised as an executable. Explore the extracted folders, ignore the Setup file you immediately see and instead go to Drivers -Apple. Run the Bootcamp (or Bootcamp 64, if you’re on a 64-bit operating system) file there and everything will install.
You then need to pop to Apple’s site and download the Bootcamp 3.1 update (32 bit, 64 bit). Repeat the extract-from-the-exe process and then find and run Bootcampupdate.exe. Then grab the Magic Trackpad update for Windows (32 bit, 64 bit) – you can install that directly, without the extraction stuff, as it will believe you legitimately have Bootcamp installed.
Reboot and that, then finally pair your Trackpad via Bluetooth. Having Bootcamp installed isn’t any kind of problem or resource hog, but it will set your keyboard to an Apple layout. You can restore that to normal via Control Panel.
Right, back to slightly awkward gaming for me.
30/07/2010 at 23:15 RLacey says:
Any idea how this compares to, say, the Wacom Bamboo /?
30/07/2010 at 23:16 RLacey says:
That was meant to say “Touch/Pen & Touch”. Typing skills desert me at the moment.
31/07/2010 at 08:38 sfury says:
Probably better, except for drawing.
Funny story – I have an older and bigger Wacom Bamboo (Pen only) and got stranded only with it for a week or two when my gaming mouse broke and I had no spare, also decided to hold out for my paycheck to buy a better mouse afterwards.
So I got to experiment a bit – anything resembling an FPS was impossible to play (even tried AAAAaaaAAyouknowtherest!). Ended up playing mostly quests and Civ4 – maybe not as comfortable as a real mouse but almost no problems.
30/07/2010 at 23:18 Jacques says:
You could always take a look at Wacom’s Bamboo Fun, which does all the touch stuff, but also works fine on Windows.
30/07/2010 at 23:18 Jacques says:
Beaten to the draw :(
30/07/2010 at 23:19 Kunal says:
There is a wacom tablet – the bamboo touch . which has a similar size and optionally comes with pen input. AFAIK, it is programmable within windows.
30/07/2010 at 23:20 Kunal says:
Woah ! 3 Wacom mentions in one go
30/07/2010 at 23:22 Alec Meer says:
Yeah, I was aware of it – but I fancied giving this one a go.
30/07/2010 at 23:28 Doctor_Hellsturm says:
But useless aganst RSI? *sadface* I keep searching for alternatives to.
31/07/2010 at 00:25 mandrill says:
Admit it Meer, you’re a closet apple fanboi! Traitor!
31/07/2010 at 00:54 Paul B says:
Admit it mandrill, you’re a closet apple fanboi outer! Traitor!
31/07/2010 at 08:37 Duoae says:
@ Doctor_Hellsturm
Have you tried the evoluent vertical mouse? I got one for my RSI and it really helped. Comes in left-handed and right handed variants too.
Now, if i get RSI using that i just switch back to normal mice for a while! :D
31/07/2010 at 09:41 TheLocalTroll says:
I suffer from quite a few years of RSI as well. I have found, as mentioned already, that vertical mice help A LOT.
If you cannot afford the “real” vertical mouse or one of those pilot stick like things (70-80+ EUR some of those), you could always opt for
http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/mouseandkeyboard/productdetails.aspx?pid=086
I also use the cheap keyboard solution, which, thank god, is also spillproof:
http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/mouseandkeyboard/productdetails.aspx?pid=040
There’s actually an ergo desktop package of these I think, too, which ends up really cheap.
It took about 2-3 days to readjust to the mouse, but after that when you spend even 5 minutes with a “normal” mouse you will instantly feel how much worse the normal ones are.
Wanted to post this last time you mentioned RSI already, but better late than never.
This will definitely help, even on a budget.
One caveat: you might develop a tendency to hold the mouse wrong, i.e. tense up the index finger like with the old mouse instead of letting the hand actually REST on the mouse. Be sure to control what you are doing and check. You will know what I mean over time.
Also, do these:
http://www.will-harris.com/yoga/rsi.html
This is no humbug. I have done these and after a week, two tops, you WILL notice a difference if you diligently do the full rotation. Versus utterly painful burning everything all day and night, this is a small time sacrifice in comparison.
Hope you get better.
01/08/2010 at 07:19 D says:
This is by far the best type of mouse I have tried against RSI. Keeps your hands centered at the keyboard. But I guess it depends on which problem with RSI you have.
http://www.fentek-ind.com/rollermouse.htm
01/08/2010 at 22:55 FunkyBadger says:
Have you tried trackballs?
30/07/2010 at 23:22 PhiIl Cameron says:
I’ve heard tell of something called a Wacom Bamboo that does similar to what you’re talking about, but comes with a pen too. I think people should try that, as apparently it’s programmable for windows, too.
30/07/2010 at 23:23 the affront says:
I just switch the mouse to my left hand when my right is too fucked up by gaming. Sure, you can’t seriously game with it, at least nothing competitive, but for regular stuff and browsing it works just fine after a short while and that is often enough to take some strain off. The more often you do it the easier and more accurate it gets, too, obviously.
30/07/2010 at 23:47 Colthor says:
Yeah, swapping hands works well. I use the mouse on the left of my laptop and the right of my desktop to even out the wear and tear.
The only awkward thing is there are depressingly few ambidextrous mice.
The mouse being put on the left-hand side of our first PC was an accidental blessing.
30/07/2010 at 23:23 frightlever says:
Um…. an Evoluent mouse removed all, well almost all, of my RSI. But if you FPS you will FPS less good then. I’ve accepted it. Normal mousing makes my fingers and thumb go numb in about thirty seconds.
30/07/2010 at 23:26 frightlever says:
Oh, I should say, I went through every ergonomic mouse available, and trackballs, before I found the Evoluent. First one cost me over a ton. Second one, that I bought as a spare was about seventy quid. They really work.
30/07/2010 at 23:27 Dr Lulz says:
ALL HAIL THE WACOM BAMBOO
*insert hypnotoad image here*
31/07/2010 at 08:42 sfury says:
http://r33b.net/
30/07/2010 at 23:27 rebb says:
Anything that looks remotely like competition for Wacom is good in my book.
Maybe that will make them drop some of their hilarious prices someday.
31/07/2010 at 13:23 Bhazor says:
This is Apple, a company which is not exactly renowned for it’s competitive pricing.
30/07/2010 at 23:27 Hmm-Hmm. says:
Yes.. yes.. yessss! More Apple products! Buy.. more! *cough*
One a somewhat more serious note, it’ll be interesting to hear about your gaming experiences with this thing.
30/07/2010 at 23:28 jalf says:
Ever since Ars Technica’s review, I’m reading it as Tragic Macpad.
30/07/2010 at 23:28 RC-1290'Dreadnought' says:
I can recommend getting a multi-touch-screen (one with the option to use pen, if you get a tablet pc), when they become a little bit cheaper. It works really nice (if you have the correct drivers and have the ability to scroll, that is).
30/07/2010 at 23:28 DeptRedunDept says:
But why not try the Wacom Bamboo instead?
30/07/2010 at 23:29 DJ Phantoon says:
You know why they’re not listening, Alec?
Because it’s hard to hear much of anything with your head shoved up your ass.
I guess Steve Jobs’ voice resonates in a tone that can make it past the buttocks layer.
31/07/2010 at 01:05 aerozol says:
Uncalled for.
31/07/2010 at 01:09 Skinlo says:
Umm, chill?
I find all Apple product a waste of time, but theres no need to be overly offensive about it.
31/07/2010 at 03:05 solipsistnation says:
[Insert obligatory Mac user outrage here.]
Seriously, uncalled-for.
31/07/2010 at 03:41 HawkesOfSavileRow says:
Dont mind him, i hear his grandfather was raped by an apple.
31/07/2010 at 22:24 DrGonzo says:
Well screw you guys then. I recently had to travel home to my parents and fix their oh so very reliable macs. I’m sooo sick of reading about apple.
I’m just peeved as this may be another blog that starts reporting lots of mac-ish stuff. Which is fine, but I don’t want to read it.
31/07/2010 at 22:28 DrGonzo says:
Also, why is everyone getting RSI from using mice? I use them all the time and I’m fine. Though I did get cramps struggling with the iMac mouse.
01/08/2010 at 07:15 Red Avatar says:
I’m with you DJ Phantoon. Anyone PC gamer who has to work with Macs knows how terrible they are and it doesn’t help to hear all those clueless people keep going on about about great Macs are when they’ve given you nothing but trouble. Macs may be simple but that comes at a very steep price: if something is wrong, it’s VERY hard to fix it or to find the solution and it often involves using the console which is ridiculous. Macs are far from miracle machines – compared to Vista and Windows 7, every Mac at work has to be rebooted a lot more often so don’t believe the hype.
30/07/2010 at 23:31 Mithrandir0x says:
Didn’t know Mac had done a huge, fancy and overpriced trackpad where I can place on my coffee mug in a stylish and zen “modus operandi”. Heh… Another way to defile a Mac designed products :3
Strange that you prefered to check the trackpad when you can have both kinds of interaction (mouse + trackpad) with the Magic mouse. Maybe is not possible to use it well on Windows platform?
30/07/2010 at 23:36 Thants says:
You know, I used to play FPSs on a big track-ball and it actually worked fairly well.
31/07/2010 at 03:47 Ironic Man says:
I heard pro Heavies in TF2 use track balls.
31/07/2010 at 14:37 Mr_Day says:
At one point I had both a mouse and a trackball plugged in, and would switch between them at will. Usually used the trackball for rts games, Homeworld and the like.
But then, I love (and still have) that MS Strategic Commander. I wish they would update the software for it, it was quite fantastic.
30/07/2010 at 23:39 deanimate says:
I have RSI type issues and these days I use a Wacom Intuos 2 A5 in place of the mouse. It’s a hell of a lot more comfortable than a mouse because your arm is in a more natural position. I’ve also been using it for SCII and it works extremely well indeed. I’m crap at SC but at least I can play without worrying about the number of clicks my poor ligaments are having to take.
They’re quite pricey so the suggestion, “give one a go” is not the most viable. I would however recommend at least an A5 sized one. A6 size might be ok for some but I found it a bit too petite.
30/07/2010 at 23:45 stahlwerk says:
I’m suprised you had to go through the Bootcamp install process… doesn’t the “ordinary” driver support two-finger-right-clicking?
Also, the mild case of RSI I’m having atm is mostly from two-finger scrolling on my Macbook trackpad. Damn you, vertical internet!
31/07/2010 at 13:28 Bhazor says:
That’s a point, there seems to be a lot more movement required to use this than a traditional mouse and without anything to support the weight of your hand. Interesting to hear about the RSI this causes.
31/07/2010 at 00:05 Alex McLarty says:
At £59 I won’t be getting one.
31/07/2010 at 00:05 Hunter says:
So why not use a Wacom Bamboo Touch that does everything this does. To top it off it is for $20 less and you get a nicer product with no overblown form over function design that is completely PC/Mac compatible. Alternatively, for $30 more than Apple’s new toy you can get the Pen & Touch version of the Bamboo that works as a graphics tablet too!
Only people with more stubbly beard and turtleneck than brain need or want a Magic Trackpad.
31/07/2010 at 00:15 WiPa says:
How about a Wacom Bamboo Touch? Great those things.
31/07/2010 at 08:46 sfury says:
SHUT UP! Two of my friends died using Wacom Bamboo Touch!
You insensitive clod.
31/07/2010 at 00:17 Calabi says:
I use my [not affiliated with wacom and not advertising in anyway]Wacom Bambo, to play some games, that swarm game for one, its good and mostly rsi free.
31/07/2010 at 00:22 Radiant says:
In an ideal world they’d invent a touch screen the size of a mouse pad that had a mirror image of what is on my desktop.
If developers could also control what was displayed on the mouse mat screen that would basically make me ejaculate without closing my eyes.
31/07/2010 at 00:35 BooleanBob says:
I’m not too late to suggest you try the Wacom Bamboo?
31/07/2010 at 00:39 Matt says:
Hey! Hey! Wacom Bamboo!
31/07/2010 at 00:44 Wulf says:
I use a trackball to avoid RSI, people have called me a fool, but I’m actually really quite good with it, and in all my years I still haven’t developed RSI, so I guess it’s actually worked. I might not be quite fast enough to play competitive multiplayer games online with other, real people, but since I don’t do that anyway (I’m not a fan of online competitive games, preferring online co-op ones instead), I actually find it suffices for my needs.
My hardware isn’t anything special, either. Well, I lie, it is, sort of. It’s a Logitech Trackman. The reason this is important, so very important, is because the ball is under the thumb. Other trackballs place the ball under the fingers, and this is a horrible design choice, it’s terrible for gaming, and considering that I once had strain from trying to use one, it defeats the purpose of trying to use one to stop RSI. The Trackman, however, has its ball under the thumb, you use your thumb to control the cursor, and your fingers to click.
I’ve never had wrist pains, and I doubt I’m ever going to, but then aside from lots of weird health issues, my body seems to be a pretty good healer, so that might be a factor too, Iono. I think it’s mostly just using a trackball, though. Will using a trackball help you if you have RSI? …I honestly don’t know, I really don’t. I don’t know what to say about that. What I will say is try it though, but try it before you lay down any money. I don’t want to feel guilty about advising people to lay down money on something that won’t work. But if you find it does ease your RSI (since it requires no wrist movement, and very little finger movement, only the thumb is active), then all the better, eh?
31/07/2010 at 00:50 Vinraith says:
I’ve got a Logitech Trackman that I use with my laptop, as it’s easier than hauling around a mouse and mousepad. I game with it a fair bit, mostly TBS and RTS games, and it seems to work fine. I’m not sure I could play an FPS with it, but perhaps with practice I’d be surprised.
I’ve heard from quite a few people with RSI problems that track balls helped them, since there’s no need to move the wrist when using one. I have the occasional mild tendonitis flare up, but they’re poorly correlated to mouse usage so I can’t vouch one way or the other.
31/07/2010 at 01:13 Wulf says:
It’s quite possible to play any sort of game with a trackball, really. I did well at Plain Sight with a trackball, I’m not sure what the last FPS I played was, so I can’t really go there. That was a while ago though, I haven’t done a lot of FPS games, lately. Hm. But I played both Portal and Left4Dead 2 with ease on a trackball, so that probably says something. I also completed Transformers: War for Cybertron via a trackball and a keyboard.
So, yep, it’s definitely doable. In fact, I’ve heard of top-notch competitive gamers who swear by trackballs as well, but they use a more expensive sort than mine.
31/07/2010 at 01:21 Vinraith says:
Yeah, if you can play L4D2 with it you’re pretty much covered. I haven’t made a serious attempt in that direction, but it seems to me I’d have a hard time finding a balance between control/sensitivity and range of motion. Like I said, though, it’s probably just a matter of practice.
31/07/2010 at 02:05 mechtroid says:
Yeah, there’s a guy in my clan who plays with a trackball and really nice headphones… Makes him immune to backstabs when playing heavy in TF2. The guy spins around so fast when you decloack you’d think he teleported.
31/07/2010 at 04:19 DeepSleeper says:
This is one rare thing we agree on. The Logitech Trackman is the greatest control device ever made.
31/07/2010 at 09:34 Alex says:
I’ve found the Kensington Expert Mouse (trackball, despite the name!) to be excellent. It has a large ball, finger based, rather than thumb based, which I find both quicker and more precise, with a scroll wheel and four buttons makes it viable mouse replacement. I use a mouse at work, and the trackball at home, to hopefully halve the repetitive part of RSI.
I don’t like it for FPS, but for every other genre I’ve tried it’s excellent. Superior for RTS, in fact.
31/07/2010 at 18:34 Guhndahb says:
The Trackman intrigued me when it first came out, and it seemed a really good idea, but, unfortunately, it didn’t work for me. Initially it was fine. But as I used it more my thumb started to involuntarily twitch as I used it. So, of course, I used it some more, and then my thumb would twitch even when I wasn’t using it. When I started losing sleep because my thumb wouldn’t stop twitching all night, even jammed under my pillow to hold it still, I finally got the point. :)
31/07/2010 at 00:52 reginald says:
WACOM BAMBOOO BLAH BLAH BLAH
31/07/2010 at 01:11 MycoRunner says:
I’d be curious if more features, like pinch-to-zoom, would work on OS-X, IN SC2. It’s one thing to play around on the desktop, but can you make it work in applications? (Wait, SC2 is available for Mac, is it not?
Also, what kind of keyboard is that Alec?
31/07/2010 at 01:12 tariqone says:
Waboo Bamcom. You’ll thank me.
31/07/2010 at 01:40 Colthor says:
Wacko Manboob?
31/07/2010 at 08:48 sfury says:
Wabam Comboo
31/07/2010 at 01:14 Skorpeyon says:
I used to do just that with a Microsoft trackball mouse they had with a VERY similar design to the Logitech one except that the ball was higher up and just fit my hand more comfortably. Sadly, Microsoft’s is now out of production, and I’ve worn out two of them in my PC/gaming lifetime. It really is great for FPS’s, especially overly twitchy ones. For a while I used that and a Nostromo for local in-home LAN parties, where space is always limited (5 guys with desktops and CRT monitors + one small trailer = using kitchen counters as desks). One of the guys at one such LAN party claimed I was cheating because I was stretched back, relaxed in a fold-out chair with the Nostromo on my left leg, my Microsoft trackball mouse on my right, and kicking everyone’s ass in UT.
31/07/2010 at 01:16 Skorpeyon says:
Ugh, reply fail, that was supposed to go to Wulf’s comment above. :(
31/07/2010 at 21:22 bwion says:
I have one of these too, and I am dreading the inevitable day when it finally breaks and I have to look for some lesser input device to replace it.
31/07/2010 at 01:23 Emil Eriksson says:
It’s probably best if you RPS guys just pretend that Apple is a company that doesn’t exist since mentioning Apple seems to provoke angry responses for no reason at all.
01/08/2010 at 07:23 Red Avatar says:
If you count snobbish elitist and selfish (according to a recent survey) people pissing on PCs and PC gamers as “no reason”, sure. You DO realize this is a PC gaming website, don’t you? So why be surprised that after all the mud flinging from Apple and Mac users towards us, PC users are not that friendly?
31/07/2010 at 01:32 Chris Keegan says:
Artists who use photoshop for drawing/painting with sometimes use a mouse in the left hand and a graphics (pressure sensitive)tablet with a pen in the right. This could be useful in the other hand for some games for say navigating or driving and your right mouse for shooting your errr cannon off.
Did you try it both ways?
31/07/2010 at 14:26 Jake says:
I’ve just tried the mouse + pen combo, how is this supposed to work exactly?
31/07/2010 at 01:47 TeeJay says:
Admittedly not all RSI is the same. I had really bad ‘carpal tunnel’ pain (underside of wrist) that would shoot pain all the way up my arm. I solved it via a combination of lowering the desk surface and raising my chair height to drop and straighten my wrist and transfer weight bearing away from my wrist and onto my ellbow instead, cost = £0. (I also got an extra-large sized & thick Steelseries mouse mat).
I also purchased a Logitech G5 mouse to try out before getting a £100 ergonomic mouse (it is easier to get hold of an MX518 (£25) now). Happily the combination of desk/chair/G5 worked so well I haven’t bothered with the ergonomic mouse.
Two useful references:
Cornell University’s page about mouse ergonomics: http://ergo.human.cornell.edu/cumousetips.html
Razer’s guide to different types of gaming mouse grip and size/shape: http://www2.razerzone.com/MouseGuide/
31/07/2010 at 01:55 Adam says:
if you really want to avoid RSI, you just need a quality mousemat and quality mouse.
contrary to most people’s beliefs, the majority of RSI comes from the lateral movement of the mouse not the grip/clicking. if you get a nice surface which requires no effort to move the mouse, coupled with a quality ergonomic mouse you’ll lose all pain.
i prefer destrukt original mat + ime1.1, but there are plenty of others: everglide titan, qck+, zowie all do good mats and ime 1.1, 3.0, razer deathadder, zowie ec1/2, are all effortless mice.
quality equipment really does help! ;)
31/07/2010 at 01:57 Zwebbie says:
We had to endure much, you and I, but within the week, there will be Wacom Bamboos running the world.
31/07/2010 at 09:45 nil says:
No – within six months.
31/07/2010 at 02:02 Owen says:
Hey Alec I hear the Wacom Bamboo might be worth a… Oooh aah, why are you looking at me like that? NO! PLEASE ALEC NO!! GOD I’M SORRY I JUST THOUGHT…
*sounds of bludgeoning with a flat metal object*
31/07/2010 at 02:07 Requiem says:
I find fingertip trackballs are superb for gaming, thumb controlled trackballs just swapped pains in my wrist for pains in my thumb. I use an old Microsoft Trackball Explorer, though it’s falling to bits now.
I’ve never used a mouse for gaming, I don’t know how people can do it, they seem to move so slow. Nearly as bad as a thumb stick.
31/07/2010 at 02:08 Requiem says:
Gah that was in reply to Wulf.
31/07/2010 at 02:13 Novotny says:
I’m sorry you have RSI :(
I’ve suffered from it mildly, and can tell you that playing guitar in the meantime has somehow prevented it coming back. In that, I’m now mousing more than I used to when it first struck, over a longer period, and the only difference is that I now also play guitar quite regularly. Make of that what you will.
31/07/2010 at 02:22 Surgeon says:
I meant to Twitter you this the other day when I seen your tweet Alec…
I’ve been gaming from about 1984, and after years of C64 joystick and keyboard use, and then PC K+M abuse, accompanied by years and years of software testing, my wrists, fingers and hands started to suffer about 2 years ago.
Between work and home, I’ve managed to find ways to combat my RSI :
Work :
Evoluent Mouse and Microsoft Natural Ergonomic 4000 Keyboard
The Evoluent, as frightlever mentions above, really has done wonders for my RSI.
The orientation of the mouse took a good couple of months to fully get used to, but it really is amazing how much of a difference it makes.
The MS keyboard is great for typing.
Especially with the negative tilt front wrist rest attachment, and the split between the two sides of the keyboard.
Again, it took a bit of getting used to, but has made it so much easier
It does look like something from the Enterprise, and the two on my desk together draw a lot of comment in work, but I couldn’t care less.
http://images.amazon.com/images/G/09/detail/review/b000bq6noa.01.gif
Home :
Evoluent Mouse and Logitech G13 Gamepad
I’ve got the same mouse for home use.
At first it was difficult, but I now don’t notice any difference when playing BC2 competitively.
Instead of the MS keyboard that I use at work, I’ve got a Logitech G13 gamepad instead.
The close proximity of all the keys means I don’t stretch my fingers as much to reach required keys, especially my little finger being a lefty (stretching between the arrows and the numpad).
The wrist rest and slight negative tilt of the keypad help give support that you wouldn’t get from a keyboard for gaming, even from the Natural Ergonomic 4000.
I haven’t had any problems with any games supporting it, and again it really does help alleviate the RSI.
Posture and wrist exercises have also helped, as has sleeping on my back with arms held straight by my side, but it is these new peripherals that have made me feel like I can still put in the same number of hours gaming as I used to, without suffering from that dreaded RSI.
Evoluent Mouse :
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000WIF1UE/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=103612307&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B000UNWFL4&pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_r=1VWPC6AX29YPS2875QGH
Microsfot Ergonomic 4000 :
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Natural-Ergonomic-Keyboard-4000/dp/B000B9RYG8/ref=pd_bxgy_ce_img_c
Logitech G13 :
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=KB-154-LG
Good luck :)
31/07/2010 at 02:23 frozenwindex says:
It works okay for shooters. I play TF2 on the standard mac trackpad, and it suck not having the ability to (right)click and altclick at the same time. Its a bit tweaky on scrolling, though.
blargblarg.
31/07/2010 at 02:44 sabnock says:
Why even use that? Especially when there’s other hardware that has multitouch, a pen and made for windows. i think it’s called Wacom SHUT THE FUCK UP.
31/07/2010 at 07:09 Radiant says:
I couldn’t find that one on the wacom website.
Must be discontinued.
31/07/2010 at 03:11 solipsistnation says:
I use a MacBook Pro for most of my general internetting. The multi-touch thing seemed weird at first, but at this point it’s weird to use a laptop with a trackpad that _doesn’t_ do the multitouch thing. 2-finger scrolling, zooming in and out, and so on and so forth are really, really nice. It’d be nice if the Magic Trackpad (I like Macs, but that’s an AWFUL name) could do that on PCs too, so PC users could see why it’s nice. (Or I guess there’s some Wacom thing somebody mentioned somewhere…) For general web browsing and stuff, it’s the sort of functionality that seems kind of like pointless feature creep until you actually use it, and a few hours later you’re wondering how you ever got along without it…
I’ve played Civ IV on my MacBook with it, and it is, in fact, really great. I’ve played Torchlight with it, and it’s really awful. Flash games that use a lot of mouse action? Also not good. It all depends on the types of games you’re playing. I haven’t even bothered FPSing with the trackpad.
31/07/2010 at 19:42 Saiko Kila says:
Well, I’m happy to inform you that you guess wrong. There is no need for Wacom solution because there multitouch on PC pads (I mean – not Apple-PC pads). More, there are also official drivers which unlock multitouch on OLDER synaptic touchpads. I have links to HP version of these drivers, but I think I saw them on Synaptic website too. Or something very similar, which also explained how to perform these fancy two-fingers zooms, pinches and rotates.
31/07/2010 at 03:14 mlaskus says:
Touchpads are surprisingly effective when it comes to playing FPS games. As long as you don’t have to make fast turns by more than 60 degrees. I breezed through CoD 4 on veteran(including epilogue) using a touchpad. I also used it in multiplayer for a while and my scores were just as good as when I used a mouse.
31/07/2010 at 04:10 oxymormon says:
I actually used one of those ooooooold Microsoft Trackball Optical meese for about 5 years before it finally quit on me. Best mouse I’ve ever had. Fit my hand perfectly, no strain of the fingers or wrist when using it, and I got so used to it that I never had a problem playing games all the way RTS to FPS. Unfortunately, one of the steel ball bearings that holds the trackball in place popped out, and reduced the mouse to sticky ball syndrome.
31/07/2010 at 04:12 oxymormon says:
One of these days I will get a reply on the first try… This was supposed to be directed to Wulf above.
31/07/2010 at 04:29 elitehakor says:
I’ve got a Logitecth Trackball and I really don’t like it. But I seem to be really good at Heavy.
31/07/2010 at 04:48 Neut says:
I HAVE A WACOM BAMBOO!
31/07/2010 at 08:52 sfury says:
But it turned you into a neut.
Damn those witcheries and magicks!
31/07/2010 at 05:22 Witek says:
I never quite grasped all the rage that people have towards the Apple products.
Using an Amiga, then IBM machine running DOS, finally PC with various iterations of Windows, what’s wrong with me going for an Apple product? Is it because of all the stereotypes pertaining to the Mac users? Fuck that, seriously. The operating system is good, the trackpad on my laptop is so amazing (responsivity, size, functions) that using my other family members’ computers means plugging in a mouse to avoid frustration. You have to use it with OSX, for at least a month, to get how good exactly it is. Seriously.
31/07/2010 at 05:52 Joey says:
I used to rock a Mad Catz Panther XL (http://www.tweak3d.net/reviews/madcatz/pantherxl/). Now that was a trackball/joystick
31/07/2010 at 06:12 DarkNoghri says:
You have what appears to be my speakers. Either that or the new version.
Good speakers they are, too.
That is all.
31/07/2010 at 18:17 Rath says:
Ditto. Very good things, though I wish they had a remote.
31/07/2010 at 06:40 Spacewalk says:
Just what are you doing using this aesthetically pleasing Mac product, Alec. You must set things right by buying the first piece of ugly and rugged PC hardware you can find when you next go out.
31/07/2010 at 14:28 Jake says:
Yes like the Cyborg R.A.T. 7, to hell with RSI it looks like a Transformer.
31/07/2010 at 07:54 DJ Lee says:
I game mainly on my MacBook Pro and the multitouch trackpad has been a joy to use.
It is NOT good for fast paced competitive Multiplayer games, FPS or RTS, that requires precision like Counter Strike or CoD.
However, I am actually more used to playing TF2 and L4D2 on my MacBook now.
One of the best thing is that you don’t have to move your wrist around much and when the sensitivity is tunes just right, I can achieve almost same performance as I can with mouse on the trackpad. (With the exception of Sniper rifle and the Direct MISS”
Tried DoD on it but I can’t keep up with the recoil on the support guns.
And Starcraft Original, I plugged my mouse mid game in frustration.
31/07/2010 at 08:05 Paperflyer says:
I always had problems with my wrist, too. With every single mouse I used and to a lesser extend with every touchpad I used (including Mac ones). However, there is the Apple Magic Mouse. When I first started using it, it instantly began to hurt (usually, it starts hurting only after a few hours), but, two days later, wrist pain vanished. And hasn’t come back yet while using that mouse.
Now that mouse is not what you would call feature-complete either. Scrolling and two buttons is about all you get. It is extremely flat however, which makes for quite an unusual grabbing experience and that is great for my wrist. I would suggest giving it a try at least…
31/07/2010 at 08:19 VelvetFistIronGlove says:
“overblown form over function”? This has a bit to put batteries in, and the rest is all trackpad. If you’re going to mock apple products, at least use a semblance of logic.
31/07/2010 at 08:21 VelvetFistIronGlove says:
Reply fail *sigh*.
31/07/2010 at 09:07 Warduke says:
I think this whole thing was just a smoke screen so Alec could show off the size of his monitor in that pic above.
31/07/2010 at 09:46 terry says:
My dad got one of these and my mother threw it out because “it looked like packaging to me”. Yup.
31/07/2010 at 10:11 jeremypeel says:
That’s the best critique of Apple’s products I’ve ever heard.
31/07/2010 at 09:51 Huggster says:
I will second what others have said, RSI is a lot about desk positioning and how you let you body fall into a position without realising it. My current set up I have a chair with supportive, padded arms I rest my elbows on.
I have helped staff at work overcome finger RSI as well as lower arm RSI. As far as I am concerned for people like us who use a computer a lot I don’t think the cost should be too much of a worry – otherwise you could have serious health issues further down the line with your hands and joints.
Also depends whether you claw / fingertip control your mouse. Most FPS gamers claw the mouse and move it with wrist and fingers. Palm gamers move the whole lower arm from the elbow.
I would say a thumb trackball is a good idea or a vertical mouse.
A good supportive chair and sitting position is also far more important than you think.
31/07/2010 at 09:58 kwyjibo says:
Let’s take the worse thing, the most infuriating thing about laptops, and make it into a standalone accessory.
But make it look really shiny like, and the idiots will flock to it, as they have every Apple product.
31/07/2010 at 10:47 deanimate says:
classic apple
31/07/2010 at 10:09 c-Row says:
Rule #1: As a Mac user, never read the comment section of an article covering an Apple product on a PC-centered website. I am a bit disappointed that RPS isn’t an exception to that rule.
01/08/2010 at 08:36 Red Avatar says:
Compared to Mac sites covering PC items, PC users are very tame and super friendly. I’ve never seen so much frothing as on Mac sites over anything non-Mac. For PC users, it’s all about functionality (and a touch pad which Apple made so it wouldn’t work properly on a PC says it all), but for Mac users, it seems to be all about the brand.
31/07/2010 at 10:40 robaal says:
Ah, but is there some multi-touch alternative that is also wireless? This apple thingy could work very nicely for HTPC-like mousing.
31/07/2010 at 11:17 SpakAttack says:
RSI is no fun.
I know this poisonous apple hardware hasn’t helped you, but I’d recommend trying a Powerball instead.
It worked wonders for me, cured my wrist and hand pain after a couple of weeks of occasional use.
I use a computer for about 80% of my waking hours, only now it’s joyfully pain free!
They’re like £10+ from Amazon.
31/07/2010 at 11:45 deanimate says:
“poisonous apple hardware” LOL! Nice way to put it
31/07/2010 at 11:17 daniel says:
reading this has made my shoot-finger hurt again. thank you!
31/07/2010 at 12:29 cowthief skank says:
The vertical mouse worked for me. Worked so well I persuaded my work to get one each for me and two colleagues.
31/07/2010 at 12:37 Helpful says:
I suffer from quite a few years of RSI as well. I have found, as mentioned already, that vertical mice help A LOT.
If you cannot afford the “real” vertical mouse or one of those pilot stick like things (70-80+ EUR some of those), you could always opt for
http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/mouseandkeyboard/productdetails.aspx?pid=086
I also use the cheap keyboard solution, which, thank god, is also spillproof:
http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/mouseandkeyboard/productdetails.aspx?pid=040
There’s actually an ergo desktop package of these I think, too, which ends up really cheap.
It took about 2-3 days to readjust to the mouse, but after that when you spend even 5 minutes with a “normal” mouse you will instantly feel how much worse the normal ones are.
Wanted to post this last time you mentioned RSI already, but better late than never.
This will definitely help, even on a budget.
One caveat: you might develop a tendency to hold the mouse wrong, i.e. tense up the index finger like with the old mouse instead of letting the hand actually REST on the mouse. Be sure to control what you are doing and check. You will know what I mean over time.
Also, do these:
http://www.will-harris.com/yoga/rsi.html
This is no humbug. I have done these and after a week, two tops, you WILL notice a difference if you diligently do the full rotation. Versus utterly painful burning everything all day and night, this is a small time sacrifice in comparison.
Hope you get better.
31/07/2010 at 12:42 LionsPhil says:
@rebb: Wut? The Wacom Bamboo is something like £50. That’s the one that’s an actual good graphics tablet rather than some touch gimmick with a load of bundled crapware (“Fun”).
Wacoms are actually affordable now. All we need is for this whole WinTab/Ink trainwreck to get sorted out. Sigh.
31/07/2010 at 13:05 jalf says:
If Windows users were as sensitive about attacks on “their” brand as Mac users are, they’d have to stay offline for the rest of their lives.
Seriously, lighten up.
I know it’s probably very disloyal to the Cult of Jobs to go listening to non-Mac users, but it doesn’t actually cause any physical harm.
31/07/2010 at 15:10 MacD says:
No, sorry: the best trackball ever built was the Microsoft Trackman Explorer. It’s gonna sound disgusting (:P), but the large ball and the shape made that trackball the most ergonomical I’ve ever used. Too bad that the button broke after years of use.
But there’s a reason the MS TE goes for hundreds of bucks on ebay, secondhand!
31/07/2010 at 15:12 Lokey says:
The benefit of the apple style trackpad over say the wacom number is the fact that it clicks. A real physical click so you can hold a drag and still reposition your fingers. The wacom has you doing some weird double tap to drag bullshit that doesn’t feel right imo. It’s a shame they hbent got the same function set on the windows drivers tho…
31/07/2010 at 19:47 deanimate says:
Unless I’m somehow misinterpreting what you’re saying then I think you’re mistaken there. If I want to drag on my tablet I just tap the pen to the tablet, keep the pen on the tablet and then drag.
Works a treat :D
Bloody love this tablet
31/07/2010 at 15:22 Bassism says:
I’ve been using my first generation MBP’s trackpad for nearly everything for years now. I find it much more relaxing for normalesque things, and in many games I find it to be more immersive than a mouse. I can even get along in some slowish FPSes and things.
I actually don’t like the new apple trackpads nearly as much. I like my seperate, easy to push button at the bottom, rather than the impossible to push integrated button on the new ones. I haven’t used the macgic trackpad, but I can only assume that it’s fairly easy to push given the bottom feet button setup, which I think would make for a good solution.
It’s also worth noting that in addition to the lack of multitouch, I’ve found that my trackpad feels somewhat less responsive and nice under the windows drivers compared to the mac ones. Of course, it may just be a case of them abandoning the windows drivers for the older trackpads to concentrate on the newer ones, so they might be awesome in windows.
I’m not sure how much sense it would make to buy one purely for gaming, but if I had a desktop I would seriously consider replacing my mouse with one, or at least having the choice of both.
31/07/2010 at 17:04 Trying2Help says:
I suffer from quite a few years of RSI as well. I have found, as mentioned already, that vertical mice help A LOT.
If you cannot afford the “real” vertical mouse or one of those pilot stick like things (70-80+ EUR some of those), you could always opt for the “Microsoft Natural Wireless Laser Mouse 6000″ which is around half the price and works great for me.
I also use the cheap keyboard solution, which, thank god, is also spillproof, the microsoft comfort curve keyboard 2000.
I think there’s actually an ergo desktop package of these I think, too, which ends up really cheap.
It took about 2-3 days to readjust to the mouse, but after that when you spend even 5 minutes with a “normal” mouse you will instantly feel how much worse the normal ones are.
Wanted to post this last time you mentioned RSI already, but better late than never.
This will definitely help, even on a budget.
One caveat: you might develop a tendency to hold the mouse wrong, i.e. tense up the index finger like with the old mouse instead of letting the hand actually REST on the mouse. Be sure to control what you are doing and check. You will know what I mean over time.
Also, do these:
http://www.will-harris.com/yoga/rsi.html
This is no humbug. I have done these and after a week, two tops, you WILL notice a difference if you diligently do the full rotation. Versus utterly painful burning everything all day and night, this is a small time sacrifice in comparison.
Hope you get better.
31/07/2010 at 18:17 Nallen says:
How is it that even after using a PC for 7-10 hours a day 5-7 days a week for 10 years I have no RSI?
31/07/2010 at 19:36 Radiant says:
High mouse speed and the fact that you use your fingers and not your wrist to move the mouse.
*crystal ball*
31/07/2010 at 19:53 Nallen says:
You’re…right. lol.
Wish I hadn’t knocked a bottle of beer over my £300 wacom :(
31/07/2010 at 19:41 Maale says:
This is supposed to be a reply to Wulf, hopefully it ends up in the right place.
Before, when the internet was young, I had a normal mouse and ended up having a case of RSI. Now I have been using Logitech Trackman for ages (10-15 years, I think) and I haven’t had any issues. Going through my fourth or fifth mouse at the moment. Works like a charm for all the games I play. Especially the fast 180 degree turning in FPS-games is like standard feature, couldn’t play without it.
31/07/2010 at 19:43 Maale says:
Reply fail…
31/07/2010 at 19:45 ken says:
“I’m very interested to see where that could go in terms of games, presuming people can find a way past whatever locked doors Apple’s erected around it.”
It’s a shame that while Apple does make some fine products, they are a company that people have come to expect locked doors from.
-Sent from my MacBook
31/07/2010 at 21:37 dmh says:
When it comes to RSI, I’ve found the only thing that worked for me was switching from a mouse to a trackball. The OH GAWD MAH WRIST went away overnight.
That said, I still use a mouse for gaming and 3d modeling work, but these are far from the majority of my computer time.
01/08/2010 at 10:48 Sufferer says:
If whatever you had vanished over night, you didn’t have it properly. I can be away from PC for 2 days and still have “the burn”.
As for all these trackball suggestions, some concrete, cheap models would be nice.
There are as usual 5 trackball mouse variations available even on the logitech trackman.
01/08/2010 at 02:45 bill says:
I have a slightly older wacom and I found it pretty useless for games. (much to my disappointment).
And touchpads on laptops are horrible for games, so i’m having a hard time seeing why a bigger touchpad would be any better.
01/08/2010 at 10:34 Bindibadgi says:
Your wrists need augmenting.
/statutory deus ex reference.
/statutory re-installation of deus ex on someone referencing it.
01/08/2010 at 10:45 AndrewC says:
Why are people constantly de-installing Deus Ex? It’s only a gig or so! I tell you, PC gamers are some fickle motherfuckers I swears.
01/08/2010 at 15:26 BeamSplashX says:
Wacom Wiimote, Alec. Or the Wacomole, though you have to click on things that pop up pretty quickly if you use that one.
01/08/2010 at 16:13 Faxmachinen says:
The reason you get RSI with a regular mouse (or indeed a touch pad), is because you’re using large muscle groups for small movements. Therefore, trackballs are clearly superior. It takes a while to master, but once you do, you can even play FPSs as well as before, if not better.
02/08/2010 at 12:48 wiper says:
Aye, trackballs are fantastic for FPS’s (finger-operated ones at least – it may just be me, but my thumb just isn’t precise enough or fast enough), as well as strategy games and any other cursor-centric titles. I personally swear by the old Intellimouse trackballs, which is a problem as they’re long-since discontinued. Not sure what I’ll do when mine gives up the ghost – no other trackball has been as comfortable or as functional, to my hand at least. It would, of course, be useless to any left-handers though.
02/08/2010 at 12:49 wiper says:
(that was meant as a reply to the trackball-conversation a fair way above. Ah well)
21/03/2012 at 02:28 dinorceeho says:
Quite true. Neither pad is big enough to draw on and gestures look fancy until you start activating them accidentally. Just this week I had to turn off gestures on a MacBook Pro (which has gestures enabled by default) because the user was accidentally triggering unwanted features. You can come close by using software to assign additional functions to mouse buttons, but then comes the point where you want to rotate an image, and you think ‘well, I’ll see if I can spin it using 2 fingers on the trackpad’ and realise that’s a hell of a lot quicker than anything except keyboard shortcuts.gio xach