By Kieron Gillen on August 12th, 2010 at 7:00 pm.

It’s rare as a games journalist that you find yourself sitting in a hall, knowing you’re there for an announcement, without a single clue what the game actually is. You’ve always got theories. And – yeah – I had some, but none that I’d dignify with a word like “theory”. “Guesses” would be as far as I’d go. So when the trailer rolls, it’s a surprise in all sorts of ways. And since there’s a chance this is the first place you’ve heard about the game, we’ll like to recreate the experience for you guys. So, head below for the video they unveiled the game with…
I’d imagine that your responses are complicated. I moved from a smile at the opening references mixed with a slight disappointment that it was going to be something so similar, before switching to excited bewilderment, thinking about how tired I am with steampunk before realising the visual style wasn’t actually steampunk at all, which all rapidly escalated into a cheery WTF?-ness. I scribbled Rainbow Islands vs Bioshock in my notes, later adding Lynch, The Wicker Man, Skies of Arcadia, Pre-War WWI American Triumpialism/Utopianism and all other sorts of fun stuff. The only real disappointment comes with the name: BioShock: Infinite.
Talking to Ken Levine later reveals that there’s a reason for the title, which will only become apparent with play, but it doesn’t seem to initially fit. At first, I thought it was a little like an attempt to do a Final Fantasy. As in, recreate the franchise to mean, “every game in Bioshock can have a totally different world”… but at the moment it’s deliberately foggy whether this is the same universe as Bioshock. I suspect yes, but buried. As such, it seems more like what Assassin’s Creed does. Presently, Bioshock means Rapture and its certain spread of mechanics. By doing this, they’re trying to make Bioshock an approach, with each game offering you some insanely baroque new world, perhaps with something connecting them all. So in the same way that the Assassin’s Creed games can move from Crusades-era Middle East to Renaissance Italy, Bioshock can move from the depths of Rapture to the sky-challenging glory of…
Okay, what the game should be called is Columbia, in the same way that Bioshock should have been called Rapture.
Columbia is the city of the future circa 1900, created as a sort of moving World’s Fair, travelling the world to show the sheer power and majesty of the rising newly technological America – the Moon Landing of its day. Levine argues that between 1880 and 1900 America transformed from this Agrarian backwater to a rising technological power that ended up claiming the 20th century as its own.
Inevitably, it goes wrong. The World’s Fair was secretly weaponized, covered in cannons which go and do what cannons are made for. It goes rogue, causes a terrible international incident and disappears into the clouds never to be seen again.
Skip forward a few years, where in a Chandlerian move, ex-Pinkerton, strikebreaker and general low-life Booker DeWitt is hired to find a woman. This Elizabeth is missing. DeWitt can handle this. It’s what he does. The only problem is that she’s apparently in Columbia… and the mysterious figure hiring you says he can get you there.
Arriving, you discover that she’s not exactly a pure victim. She’s enormously powerful, and she’s caught in the middle of the storm which is tearing apart Columbia. You have to escape, together, and combine your abilities to do so.
Obvious changes first. You aren’t the blank cipher. This time around, you’re playing a character with a distinct personality. Secondly, you aren’t alone. This isn’t the lonely isolation of System Shock 2. This is a game where much of the time you have an equal partner in surviving this crazed world. In fact, it’s not about lonely isolation full stop. The inhabitants of Columbia seem as wired and demented as the Splicers of Rapture, but it’s a different sort of dementia.
The actual walk-through demo of the game – highly choreographed, as they always are at this stage – shows sections which make it clear. A lot is about trying to create the idea of horror and tension in broad-day light. For example, there’s a section where you walk into a bar. Immediately, every eye in the packed place turns to you. The seconds stretch out. You get to move and interact a little – then an inhabitant pulls a gun, and it all kicks off. It escalates into an enormous mob, hunting you down and cornering you. And it really is a mob, with far more enemies converging on you than I saw in Bioshock. Electricity blast after electricity blast fells them, but it’s clearly not going to be enough as they move with measured pace towards you.
At which point the demo actually introduces Elizabeth, who summons a storm cloud above the gathered hordes’ head. Water lashes down… and since they’re wet, the whole crowd are electrocuted. The demo continues, with her making an enormous projectile out of all the bits of cutlery in a passing cart and ending with you taking a whole bloody bridge out between combining your powers. All the while, the characters talk to one another and do some lovely, relatively subtle storytelling. The take-away moment is when you realise that Elizabeth’s nose is bleeding after a particularly telekinetic display. These exertions aren’t easy for her.
The second thing to catch the eye is – to use the true technical phrase – full on proper mentalisms which make Columbia unlike any game environment I’ve ever traversed. My favourite is an early moment where a robotic horse drags a carriage with no wheels along the floor, which is a fantastic sight gag on the horseless carriage. A woman, on the porch of a burning house, silently and solemnly sweeping up. The man covered in ravens. The odd collision-style of the whole world, as if it was made by the most over-literal architect in the world. Make a flying city you say? Well, take a normal building and stick a load of balloons on the side, yeah? The floating islands are connected by grandiose sweeping tracks you attach yourself to and fly along, in either direction – which, with the grand blue skies above you, did make me think of Sonic of all things.
And then the heavyweight creatures which are pursuing Elizabeth. You see a little of one in the trailer – the heart floating in the water chamber, a bearded head attached with wires. The one which ends the playthrough is far larger, a creature which looks like some kind of sadomasochistic take on a giant raven and a gargoyle. And the key element is the array of colour. When, near the conclusion before the arrival of the last creature, the winds pick up and the sky darkens, it’s actually a little disturbing and shows what you gain by using the full array of the palette. It’s not a game about sitting in a closet, covered in grime any more.
But it is a game about a lot of stuff. It’s a game people are going to end up spewing a grand torrent of exciting wank about. It’s got ideas.
The 1880-1900 gap is key. “This isn’t a game about history – but it is a game set in the context of history,” as Levine puts it. In 1880, the US was a country tired and broken by war, having experienced massive casualties. In 1900… it was having different sorts of urges. Levine talks about President McKinley questioning whether they should annex the Philippines, just freed from Spain. At which point Levine reads a full quote from McKinley on the issue, as he tossed and turned whether he should do this potentially horrible thing…
I walked the floor of the White House night after night until midnight; and I am not ashamed to tell you, gentlemen, that I went down on my knees and prayed to Almighty God for light and guidance more than one night. And one night late it came to me this way – I don’t know how it was, but it came: (1) That we could not give them back to Spain – that would be cowardly and dishonorable; (2) that we could not turn them over to France or Germany – our commercial rivals in the Orient – that would be bad business and discreditable; (3) that we could not leave them to themselves – they were unfit for self-government – and they would soon have anarchy and misrule over there worse than Spain’s was; and (4) that there was nothing left for us to do but to take them all, and to educate the Filipinos, and uplift and civilize and Christianize them, and by God’s grace do the very best we could by them, as our fellow men for whom Christ also died. And then I went to bed and went to sleep and slept soundly.
That’s what Bioshock: Infinite is about.
When the demo finishes and Levine leaves the stage, and an enormous image appears on the background. A presidential figure with the bell of liberty in one hand, surrounded by crude stereotypes of immigrants of all stripes. The legend beneath it screams: “It is our holy duty to guard against the foreign hordes”. Repurposed period propaganda posters set the tone. “Her eyes.. so blue! Her skin… so white!” asks one poster “… or are they?” before warning about hidden genetic purity. They permeate the game – “FOR FAITH! FOR RACE! FOR FATHERLAND!” caught my eye along with warnings about the ever-elusive “they” taking your gun, wife and just about everything else.
The fascinating thing about Columbia is that while it’s a failing utopia of some sort, it’s far more functional than Rapture. It’s a game set in the period before World War I has reshaped and coloured this kind of thinking. It’s a game that feels set on the brink of disaster – there is some WWI propaganda starting to creep in, and quiet talk about “The Siege of Columbia”, but the whole mood of the game seems triumphal – the pre-WWI utopianism I was talking about earlier. Not to put too fine a point on it, it’s a city in the skies. It’s worth remembering that the game has been teased as “Icarus”. Icarus would have been a little too on the nose, I suspect, but there’s no doubt that Columbia is going to come crashing down.
Let’s cut to the chase: at this point, it appears the game’s major themes are American Imperialism and fear of immigration. By its simple existence, it’s drawing lines between what happened at the start of the last century and the start of this one. It is, at least potentially, about as political as it gets.
With the game tentatively scheduled for a 2012 release, I can’t wait to see more.

And come back tomorrow for us talking to Ken Levine. The only Bioshock: Infinite interview, I strongly suspect, to mention anarchist Emma Goldman.






12/08/2010 at 19:05 teo says:
Ugh
The written reactions to the trailer were spot on. Total turnoff for me
Shame =( was hoping for something exciting
12/08/2010 at 19:11 Shakermaker says:
You were not excited by the trailer? Odd. I don’t like the franchise at all, but the video made me all giddy.
12/08/2010 at 19:12 Morph says:
Looks and sounds pretty good to me.
12/08/2010 at 19:41 Nallen says:
I loved it.
I played about 45 minutes of Bioshock 2 but I loved Bioshock 1 and was very happy to see another chance for it to be done right, then the change of location…I love Rapture and probably would have recoiled at the prospect of moving Bioshock anywhere else, but having seen it I’m just as excited about this different kind of crazy world.
12/08/2010 at 23:08 Robert says:
I am sooooo puzzled by you people.
There are a gazillion WW II FPS’s/Middle-Earth RPG’s/etc,, but now there’s a trailer for an fps/rpg hybrid with quite an original setting and we have 2 pages about how much it looks like Bioshock.
I wish we had a Call of Duty in the air. I wish we had more games with a slightly more interesting setting than WWII/Tolkien/Crusades/Bat City. I wish we had more games with a slighty more interesting story than “LOOK ZOMBIES, RUN!” or “Your parents got kiled by Evil. No worries you are the prophesized messiah, gogo kill it!”. I wish we had more games with a more diverse politcal imagery than the same old “commies/nazis/iraqis/viet cong are bad”, which actually accurately describes the main antagonists of most shooters nowadays. (apart from zombies/demons ofc.)
13/08/2010 at 14:11 SanguineAngel says:
@ Robert
I’m with you a bit here but I definitely understand people’s problems. While yes, the setting is different I think there was quite a strong negative reaction (as well as a positive one) to Bioshock. Tagging this game, despite the location, is a clear indication that this game should be associated with Bioshock 1. As Kieron said, it is entirely likely that, despite the change of location, the rest of the game will have a very familiar feel to it, probably gameplay-wise.
Personally I did not like Bioshock very much. It was ok, the setting was interesting but I thought the game itself was bland and failed to push the bounderies in many areas where it very much could have. The gameplay left me pretty cold, the “RPG emlements” were a joke and, whilst there were some great characters it is true, I do think that the story could have been more interesting and told better.
This is where I am excited and Robert echos my feelings. Not only is the change of location interesting to me here but also a new direction in hopefully character driven storytelling and a genuinely interesting premise as far as games go. To be honest I am struggling to think of an action game centered around resuing the girl this decade besides PoP. That could be my brain failing me though!
Anyway, this is coming from someone who loves Mirror’s Edge partly because the story grabbed me and the story telling was, to my mind, extremely well handled and perfectly paced. So take that as you will.
I would say I am cautiously interested to see where this goes.
12/08/2010 at 19:06 Ben Leggett says:
Um.
12/08/2010 at 19:06 The Hammer says:
…interesting.
12/08/2010 at 19:11 tomwaitsfornoman says:
Kill me with a shoe.
12/08/2010 at 19:12 Brian says:
I vaguely remember Shawn Elliot on the Games For Windows Magazine podcast jokingly musing thusly:
“You know the sequels to Bioshock are going to be Geoshock and Aeroshock?”
“Really?”
“No, but doesn’t that sound plausible?”
12/08/2010 at 19:12 Ben Leggett says:
That gentleman in the screenshot must be VERY bald…
12/08/2010 at 19:12 Bhazor says:
Dude! Spoilers! For a trailer we haven’t seen yet but still.
I’ll wait for the play through demo before I comment. Or read the rest of this article.
12/08/2010 at 19:13 Vinraith says:
I’m intrigued, but then I’m a sucker for dystopian alternate universe settings.
12/08/2010 at 19:14 Tei says:
o7
Great design. Reminds of of Wizard of Oz.
Nice “we are not a kansas anymore” trick to reinvent bioshock. I applaud this.
12/08/2010 at 19:15 Xocrates says:
I’m… divided. Part of me says “Yay! Bioshock.” while other goes “Nooo! Bioshock.”, then the part that says “Yay! Bioshock” is divided between “Yay! Different setting” while other says “Nooo! Different setting”
I’ll keep an eye out, but so far it’s on the “Steam Sale” category as opposed as “Day one”
12/08/2010 at 19:18 Daniel Rivas says:
Ooh, imperialism.
I like how bright it is, after the oppressiveness of Bioshock, though I’m sure there’ll be indoor and night sections.
Really hope this doesn’t come with a lot of potential falls. Tumbling to my death because I wasn’t looking is about my least favourite activity, in-game or otherwise.
Oh, also. Bioshock: Infinity? Really? Bit rubbish.
12/08/2010 at 21:17 Monkeybreadman says:
And where do they go with a sequel?
Bioshock : Really Quite Big,
Bioshock : Bigger Than Your Puny Mind Can Comprehend
Bioshock : Another Bioshock
12/08/2010 at 21:29 Jack says:
BistemShock.
12/08/2010 at 22:47 Bret says:
Bungie already did this bit, and, coincidentally, gave an answer.
Aleph One.
12/08/2010 at 23:19 Urthman says:
Bioshock 4: On the Moon!
12/08/2010 at 19:18 Meat Circus says:
I’d always thought, “oh if only Bioshock were in the sky”.
Well NOW MY SKY-BASED DREAMS ARE ANSWERED.
12/08/2010 at 19:36 Primar says:
If only we could talk to the Splicers.
12/08/2010 at 20:02 RQH says:
@Primar: I don’t know if you mean that jokingly or not (I know it’s often meant as a joke), but yes? I would like to talk to people. More than just the three scattered crit path people in a sea of crazies. For one, it makes the world more believable, and the Bioshock games are almost exclusively about world-building. For another, it might sell the dystopian idea just an itty bit better. Of course any attempt at utopia will collapse if everyone goes psycho. But the reality is our current world can be a bit of a dystopia and it’s built up mostly of mostly reasonable people. It really doesn’t take everyone being batshit crazy all the time. It only takes one person doing something slightly wrong once. But then I guess all the world-building and ideas in Bioshock are really just the dressing for a slightly-smarter-than-average horror game, and they really aren’t as ambitious as they want to appear.
12/08/2010 at 19:19 Ricc says:
I was expectying a totally new IP, so the Bioshock name was a bit of a suprise. The article is spot on, though. This could have been called a spiritual successor as much as a sequel, which is an interesting approach. They will have to do some convincing, I guess, but I’m ready to listen and get excited. :)
12/08/2010 at 19:19 Jools says:
I feel like a troll or something, but that was honestly one of the most boring trailers I’ve seen in ages. I’m so sick of feeling like I’m watching a poorly shot movie trailer when I should be watching a trailer for a game. I have no idea why I should be excited about this, because the trailer says nothing to me about how it will play other than that it’s going to be first person and it has some interesting art direction – and I can probably infer it’ll be similar to Bioshock, I guess. Maybe I’m just getting old, but it’s so hard to care about something like this at all.
13/08/2010 at 18:27 Ozzie says:
I had totally the opposite reaction. Also, seeing that whole thing was don in 1st person, it felt quite game-y to me.
12/08/2010 at 19:21 James G says:
+like
The thing I liked about the original Bioshock was Rapture, a fantastic place to explore, and one with true atmosphere. Bioshock 2 never grabbed me, as Rapture was no longer this unexplored territory, and early reviews were suggesting that it didn’t take us anywhere particularly new in Rapture, of cast particularly novel insights onto its function. As I’ve never been one for FPSs on there own, Bioshock 2 had little attraction.
Here though we have another world to explore, one which appears to be quite distinct from Rapture, but shows the same sense of the importance of place as the first game had.
I’ve got my eye on this one.
12/08/2010 at 19:33 Anthony says:
Bioshock 2 is not a Bad Game.
It’s just more of the same, really. Except without the good writing, or memorable locations. Yeah, you’re a Big Daddy, but you’re not any different from nameless dude from the first one when it comes down to it, especially when you find that other Big Daddies are just as deadly as they always were until you get better guns. It never feels like you’re actually a badass in a diving suit despite the big drill and being able to shoot plasmids and guns at the same time.
It’s a game I really want to like, but can’t find anything specific to actually hinge the desire on. Call it the first vaguely disappointing sequel to a new IP for these next-gen times.
You could almost pull a Caruso and say its… ‘treading water’. YEEAAAAAAH, etc.
But despite all of the above, you couldn’t call it bad. Just unsatisfying. I enjoyed returning to Rapture as a location, but the reunion rang hollow. Unfortunately.
12/08/2010 at 19:47 Red Scharlach says:
BioShock 2 was a step-up from the original in almost every single way.
Was still mediocre.
12/08/2010 at 22:17 Walsh says:
I don’t know, towards the end I felt pretty invincible with my maxed out powers spewing death and destruction everywhere.
The story was more touching to me than the first one, then again I never finished the first one but I finished the second one. The first one I got to the you know what part and a little bit afterwards kind of lost interest.
13/08/2010 at 01:03 Red Scharlach says:
I don’t know, towards the end I felt pretty invincible with my maxed out powers spewing death and destruction everywhere.
Compared to a tacked on escort mission finale and a sub-par end boss, this is actually, a step up.
12/08/2010 at 19:21 Serenegoose says:
That was really interesting, actually. I’m more interested in it than I ever was in Bioshock 1 and 2. I worry that it’ll take itself too seriously though. Would that there was a true pulp adventure game somewhere on this earth. Curious as to why you’re tired of steampunk? Are you talking exclusively about games (the only steampunk game outside of the japanese market I’m familiar with is Thief 2) or all media?
12/08/2010 at 19:21 Meat Circus says:
So, no new Syndicate then?
Thank fuck. My childhood memories are saved.
12/08/2010 at 19:36 Hippo says:
That’s Starbreeze, not Irrational (and EA, not Take Two)..
12/08/2010 at 19:22 Brumisator says:
Irrational, you used to make great, varied games….
I blame 2K…
13/08/2010 at 18:42 Ozzie says:
This doesn’t look different enough for you, save for the title?
I think they do themselves a disfavour by calling it Bioshock: Infinity
12/08/2010 at 19:22 A-Scale says:
OH. MY GOD. TODAY IS A GREAT DAY.
12/08/2010 at 19:22 Mad Doc MacRae says:
I think this would be more interesting if it wasn’t just going to be more bioshock. Bioshock was pretty good but not in the way that I’d want more of it with some name changes.
I wish someone made a game about flying cities and stuff without all the baggage of Bioshock.
13/08/2010 at 18:47 Ozzie says:
Maybe the title is the only baggage? I sure hope so.
12/08/2010 at 19:22 Anthony says:
My first reaction at the name of the game was “Can Levine actually do that?”
I mean, it’s a 2K property. I figured they would withhold all rights to Bioshock in order to drive it into sequel mediocrity and make bank.
Colour me intrigued.
12/08/2010 at 19:25 Daniel Rivas says:
Pretty sure Irrational are still owned by 2K.
12/08/2010 at 19:36 Anthony says:
I get that, I just figured 2K was going down the Activision route of mercilessly flogging a good idea until it had no soul left. Obviously Levine still has pull with the guys who hold the purse strings.
12/08/2010 at 20:25 Taillefer says:
Perhaps that’s why it’s Bioshock: Inifinite. I.e, you can’t do any more after this one, stop making sequels for my game.
Unless it’s “Bioshock Infinity + 1, no returns”
13/08/2010 at 03:09 TheTingler says:
I think you just hit the nail right on the head there, Taillefer.
13/08/2010 at 15:42 Taillefer says:
I should learn to read.
12/08/2010 at 19:22 Monkeybreadman says:
Bioshock in the sky, who’d have thunk it?!
Bet you a squadrillion pounds the next trailers detail “how this is different to the previous bioshocks, etc etc blah blah blah”
12/08/2010 at 23:11 jeremypeel says:
Judging from what we’ve seen and heard so far, they won’t need to spin that hard to convince us it’s different.
12/08/2010 at 19:22 manintheshack says:
I’m still waiting for the twist.
12/08/2010 at 19:24 Freud says:
Colour me intrigued. Much more exciting than a Bioshock 3 has any right to be.
12/08/2010 at 19:28 Xercies says:
I think the reason there using the name is money which is a shame to be honest..kind of says that there is no originality and we must use existing names before we can make these games because we want money. other then that i am intrigued…and the aesthetic i am already liking to be honest.
12/08/2010 at 19:28 Spliter says:
Awesome trailer.
It does to you precisely what a trailer should.
cool… another bioshock.
oh HAHA! It’s just a reference!!
Oh wait… It’s still a bioshock…
oh HAHA! It looks so gorgeous, and it’s in the clouds! it’s not bioshock afterall!
Oh , it is Bioshock afterall! But in clouds!
12/08/2010 at 19:29 Atalanta says:
“Bioshock: Infinite”? Oh dear.
Terrible name aside, this looks awfully neat. I like the setting (both the “in the sky!” bit and the historical bit) and I like how bright the whole thing is.
12/08/2010 at 19:30 DiamondDog says:
Well, the original Bioshock was a massive disappointment for me. Partly my own fault for getting far too excited about it.
So, the only reasonable response to this news is…. hmmmm, alright….
12/08/2010 at 19:31 Red Scharlach says:
Now they have even less of an excuse to make a dull corridor-shooter. Let’s hope they take it to heart.
12/08/2010 at 19:32 Vague-rant says:
After watching about 2/3s of that trailer I was going to say something like “It’s Bioshock but in the sky!”. Then I realized that that’s what it actually was…
I shall give it exactly half of ein chance.
12/08/2010 at 19:32 Ian says:
Oh cripes, I’ve not even finished the first one yet.
12/08/2010 at 19:34 blindpsychic says:
They really love rubbing the water+electricity bit in our faces
12/08/2010 at 19:39 Xercies says:
Hmm which worries me a it to be honest..its not one of the most original combinations and it showed in bioshock that that was the only combination they had really thought of lol. Hopefully they can show us something else because there obsession last time made the plasmids a bit to meh for my liking.
12/08/2010 at 19:35 Al3xand3r says:
How about a new Dungeon Master?
12/08/2010 at 19:39 Red Scharlach says:
You really want them to do that when they’ve already got X-COM and Syndicate on the chopping block?
12/08/2010 at 19:39 Al3xand3r says:
Wrong topic :)
12/08/2010 at 19:48 Red Scharlach says:
If the title is anything to go by, not particularly: Still in it for the scratch, originality be damned.
12/08/2010 at 19:36 terry says:
I’m giving this one a cautious “WTF” until I see some more.
12/08/2010 at 19:38 Al3xand3r says:
It looks cool, I just hope they don’t try to connect it to Bioshock 1 & 2 in any way other than the name (sales power I understand). It seems like it should be its own thing, and hopefully offer fresh gameplay, a more open structure, etc. Maybe an RPG-like with adventure elements as you converse with people and solve crimes or something (why not start the game as you try to solve the murder of the guy in the intro?), rather than merely try to escape a place gone horribly wrong. Something like a serious take on Anachronox. I mean, give us a fully realised world, not a paper cutout backdrop for lots of shooting.
12/08/2010 at 20:05 RQH says:
@Al3xand3r: This.
12/08/2010 at 19:38 laikapants says:
The only thing that I have a bigger irrational fear of than the deep open ocean is falling from a great height. Seriously, my palms clam up thinking about it. This will not be good for my sanity.
12/08/2010 at 19:53 subedii says:
Mirror’s Edge was particularly good (bad) for that effect.
After the first time I fell off a building, I tended to instinctively look away after that.
12/08/2010 at 20:01 terry says:
The Half Life 2 bridge scared the piss out of me. There weren’t even any zombies :(
12/08/2010 at 20:34 Fumarole says:
There’s nothing irrational about falling to your (presumable) death from a great height.
Oh I see what you did there…
12/08/2010 at 21:08 Atalanta says:
@terry — at one point the HL2 bridge terrified me so badly I started crying. I had to stop the game and sit quietly on the floor for a little while before I could continue.
Video games don’t usually trigger my fear of heights (as in, nothing in Mirror’s Edge or Assassin’s Creed bothered me), and I kind of hope they do include some truly terror-inducing views.
12/08/2010 at 22:19 Sarlix says:
@Atalanta I’ve been immersed in a computer game before but never to that extent. I think I’m kind of envious lol…
13/08/2010 at 00:19 Jad says:
I became so immersed in Stalker once that after I quit the game, a minor bug in Steam (I think the games list suddenly scrolled to the bottom without my input) induced actual blind-fear panic because I thought something malevolent and supernatural was fucking with me.
13/08/2010 at 12:41 Sarlix says:
@Jad Haha good one.
21/08/2010 at 11:16 Forceflow says:
To quote Douglas Adams: “It’s not the fall that kills you. It’s the sudden stop at the end.”
12/08/2010 at 19:40 Jason Moyer says:
That large round thing about to smack you in the face isn’t the ground, it’s a tactless political metaphor wrapped around one of the worst ideas for a game ever.
12/08/2010 at 19:50 Daniel Rivas says:
Oh, my.
Not a fan, then?
12/08/2010 at 19:54 Jason Moyer says:
The idea of a hybrid fps/rpg where you’re running around a series of floating islands with Bioshock-y mechanics is awesome, I’m just not really a big fan of political wank in my videogames.
12/08/2010 at 19:58 subedii says:
So you just didn’t like the implementation in Bioshock, or you just don’t like the idea in general?
The former I can sort of understand, the latter… well…
12/08/2010 at 20:05 Jason Moyer says:
Bioshock 1 and 2 were tearing into political philosophy whereas the setup for BS Infinite seems ripe for some completely generic contemporary political commentary.
12/08/2010 at 20:19 subedii says:
till not sure what you mean by “tearing into” there.
I mean, if you’re saying that thematically this has less potential to look at politics than Bioshock does, then I think that all comes down to how it’s implemented.
Personally speaking, whilst I was interested in the idea of a game that addressed Randian thoughts and followed through on them, I don’t think the game fully succeeded in doing so. It presented an interesting setting in any case, so I guess I didn’t mind as much.
12/08/2010 at 23:19 LintMan says:
@subedii:
I think what Jason meant is that while Bioshock goes after a political philosophy, it’s not tied to current politics. He’s afraid this new game is being set up to be a thinly veiled metaphor for some current political situation as a way to make political commentary on it. I’m not sure what – perhaps something along the lines of a mataphor for US imperialism in the Iraq War or Afganistan.
12/08/2010 at 23:46 subedii says:
I’d actually disagree there. Because a bit like Imperialism, something like absolute, Laissez Faire capitalism (which is largely what people take from objectivism today) is something that while a philosophy in itself, is very much present in modern day politics. Not just in the US, but especially any place where there’s a heavy corporate influence on politics.
As an, the recent US healthcare bill. Whether any US visitors to this site agreed or disagreed with the push for healthcare in the US, an extremely large part of the dissent was voiced in forms like “you’re using MY money to pay for other, lazy people who aren’t willing to work for it themselves”. There was an inherent fear that this meant a slide into the dreaded communist socialism, that a privatised and completely free-market healthcare system was the ONLY system that could possibly work for the US, and that it was the only just system. The market would regulate itself. That’s pretty much Objectivism any way you slice it. Heck, in Andrew Ryan’s opening speech, one of the first things he says is “Is a man not entitled to the Sweat of his brow? No says the man in Washington, it belongs to the poor”. He could have just as easily been talking about the healthcare debate in the US today. :P
People can draw the parallels with modern politics, but I suspect that the only real reason it won’t be difficult to draw those parallels is because those philosophies are still prevalent today. With regards to this one, Manifest Destiny didn’t disappear, it just took on different forms.
13/08/2010 at 00:22 Raum says:
Why is that a bad thing, though?
13/08/2010 at 00:29 Raum says:
That it’s current I mean (directed at Jason).
13/08/2010 at 03:46 Jason Moyer says:
I just find the whole “OMG WE’RE BEING SUPER F’ING SUBVERSIVE” (thanks Harvey) thing to be incredibly tired and overused. If I wanted to critique imperialism I’m pretty sure that instead of going for some clumsy Star Wars prequel-ish clumsy metaphorical cleverness I could find plenty of examples from the actual era the game is set in. Maybe I’m just being naive and Columbia just goes around raiding Spanish colonies or something.
13/08/2010 at 03:47 Jason Moyer says:
Of course, if you did go with political issues that were contemporary to the time period, you’d lose the entire “hay guyz, we got somtin impotant 2 say hear lulz” aspect.
13/08/2010 at 17:45 DMcCool says:
Mate, you’ve just seen a few screenshots and a short trailer At best you know something about the aesthetic, and nothing at all about the political commentary (if there is any), only the area of political philosophy the game will be exploring. How can this possibly make you angry? Finding out a subject will be explored automatically fills you full of rage because you assume it’ll be explored poorly? I don’t get the cynicism.
I have this to say about the game: Steampunk, yay!
12/08/2010 at 19:42 Heliosicle says:
I feel like Bioshock may have been forced on them in some way to franchise the game.
Is this actually Bioshock 3? Or just a spin-off? Looks cool anyhow, and if they still have 2 years or 1 1/2 to work on it, that must be good.
12/08/2010 at 20:39 Fumarole says:
It’s System Shock 5, actually.
12/08/2010 at 19:44 Coldwave says:
Its gonna be a dumbed down Bioshock 2 which is a dumbed down Bioshock which is a dumbed down System Shock 2 which is a dumbed down System Shock which was probably a dumbed down Ultima Underworld.
12/08/2010 at 19:44 Muzman says:
I was hoping more for Bioshock 3: Arena myself.
(nb: no I wasn’t)
12/08/2010 at 19:47 Flameberge says:
Rubbish name.
The setting is fantastic, the ideas are interesting, the underlying politics should stir up discussions. But, the cutting and pasting of so many of the Bioshock mechanics, perhaps explains the name, and is perhaps why I’m not too excited. Telekenisis instead of plasmids. A mob of enemies that charge at you, just like splicers; and big stompy robot suit guys who try to kill you, just like Big Daddies.
12/08/2010 at 19:48 Nallen says:
LMAO what the hell is the other RPS video hosted by them with Jim and John?! hilarious!
12/08/2010 at 19:50 Nallen says:
Oh it’s two posts down. Fail.
12/08/2010 at 19:49 Alexander Norris says:
I really wish that this had a) not looked like BioShock and b) not been called BioShock. The basic premise excites me, but a rehash of BioShock with slightly different environments does not, and I was under the impression this would be an entirely new IP.
Really hope they ditch the name and further trailers don’t look nearly as much like trailers for the first two games.
12/08/2010 at 19:50 Simon says:
Now, I wasn’t especially interested in Bioshock from what I heard from friends who’d played it and giving the demo a try. It sounded a little standard-shooter-with-a-twist. But this? This looks very neat indeed.
12/08/2010 at 19:51 zakkmiester says:
I…
I’m so confused.
But very VERY interested.
12/08/2010 at 19:59 WTF says:
Wow – so another over-hyped piece of ripped of nonsense from Levine. We can walk around his ugly Unreal 2 tech engine (yes people – Unreal 2 – they never went to 3), examine the ugliest character models in the history of gaming and listen to him quote swathes of actual writers in a desperate attempt to make his game look deep and learned.
I cannot believe that people pay any attention to anything he says any more. It is obvious that nothing he ever does will live up to even the tiniest amount of its hype and we will just be presented with another generic, ugly and utterly boring corridor shooter.
12/08/2010 at 20:00 Bhazor says:
Aww diddums.
12/08/2010 at 20:05 subedii says:
Wait what’s Peter Molyneux got to do with this?
12/08/2010 at 20:06 WTF says:
QUICK! QUICK! Someone’s opinion differs from mine! I must mock them!!!
12/08/2010 at 20:15 subedii says:
Nobody’s mocking you personally, and it doesn’t matter what your opinion is considering that several posters above have already expressed similar dismay.
Kindly stop over-reacting and getting angry over nothing.
12/08/2010 at 20:16 WTF says:
@subedii
That wasn’t directed at you – You’re post was funny.
Telling people what to do on forums though – that’s just daft
12/08/2010 at 20:20 Vague-rant says:
You just seem so angry… Not that your not allowed, but it seems a little much to get worked up over. I suspect he wasn’t mocking your opinion, just the level of anger over a game that very little is known about.
12/08/2010 at 20:42 WTF says:
@Vague-rant
Fair enough – tbh I am not angry at the game – that is of so little consequence I could not get angry about it. What I am angry about is the hype surrounding anything Bioshock. That game was actually offensive to me, if not because of how appalling it was, then because of the ludicrous amount of lip service and over the top adoration it receives and this game is gonna get the same amount of shovelled on BS even before anyone sees it and regardless of how bad it turns out to be.
12/08/2010 at 21:13 Bhazor says:
“That game was actually offensive to me”
Aww diddums.
13/08/2010 at 01:36 Urthman says:
I also really don’t like the plastic look of the Bioshock graphics. The characters look like a wax museum come to life (which is maybe the right kind of creepy for Bioshock) and the environments look like a wax museum that hasn’t come to life.
I really wish they’d gone with a newer or different engine for this.
12/08/2010 at 20:04 Gunsmith AKA NanosuitNinja says:
im not impressed, after system shock 1 and 2 bioshock angered the piss out of me, never bothered with bioshock 2 and whilst they continue to push this kiddie frendly console orientated shit out i dont think i’ll be bothering with any other of thier titles.
12/08/2010 at 20:09 James G says:
Kiddie friendly? I realise you’re probably trying to express your displeasure at certain mechanics which you enjoyed in SS bot being present in Bioshock, but I’m not sure ‘Kiddie friendly’ is quite the term I’d use to describe Bioshock.
12/08/2010 at 23:18 jeremypeel says:
Seconded, James.
12/08/2010 at 20:06 geldonyetich says:
Aw, I was hoping it’d be another Freedom Force.
BioShock: Infinite. The name suggests it may be persistent world, which would be interesting.
I’ll give it a spin, but I imagine I’m in for a year or two wait.
More interested in hearing how X-Com, Irrational’s other game, will turn out.
12/08/2010 at 20:10 Vandelay says:
From confusion, to disappointment, to excitement, to potential “meh”, to “hmm…”.
I was not expecting a continuation of the Bioshock franchise and it really leaves me conflicted. Bioshock did some great things. It was one of the most intelligent mainstream games I had played, in much the same way (to steal a Kermodian line) Christopher Nolan’s Batman films have brought art house sensibilities to mainstream cinemas. The art direction was fantastic and Rapture was truly a wonderful design, even in its highly linear form we saw it in. But the gameplay itself was very sub-par FPS stuff, without the added interesting bits we were promised earlier on (glancing over that recently released design document for Bioshock is even more depressing.)
The info we have here seems to indicate a similar situation. I love the bright and colourful look of this new city. The ideas sound interesting and like nothing any other game has attempted. Then we come to brief mentions of gameplay and we have the same old electric plasmids (which I’m sure were a creation of Rapture and shouldn’t be anywhere else,) and crazy citizens charging at you.
Obviously this is very early days and not much has been shown, but my initial response to seeing more Bioshock was a hope that they may be able to attempt to include some of the fantastic gameplay ideas they originally had with the first game, rather than treading the same old ground.
12/08/2010 at 20:11 Jimbo says:
Skyshock. Totally called it.
12/08/2010 at 20:42 Olddan says:
Flioshock!
Flyoshock?
12/08/2010 at 20:44 Nick says:
Filoshock. mmm…
12/08/2010 at 20:48 Zwebbie says:
Sky-o-shock?
12/08/2010 at 21:27 Jimbo says:
That’s exactly right: Ken Levitate’s Skyoshock.
12/08/2010 at 20:14 PrepareToMeetThyGod says:
I’ll be pre-ordering this, whatever anyone says. Bravo Irrational Games, bravo.
12/08/2010 at 20:16 Pidesco says:
So this sounds and looks like Bioshock in a new setting?
As I recall, the good things about Bioshock were the setting and the art direction. Everything else was a bit rubbish. So they’re changing what was good in Bioshock while leaving what was bad untouched?
12/08/2010 at 20:25 Jimbo says:
No, the good thing about Bioshock was that it had a novel setting and brilliant art direction. Not that it had a specific setting and a specific art direction.
Continuing to rely on the established setting and art style ad nauseum would be anti-Bioshock if anything.
imo.
12/08/2010 at 23:23 jeremypeel says:
Yup yup. I don’t think the regression argument would hold any water without the Bioshock name appearing here. Obviously it builds on the first game, but this looks like genuine progression to me.
12/08/2010 at 23:26 Pidesco says:
Continuing to rely on the same crap gameplay as Bioshock is a lot worse than relying on the same setting. Which is what they seem to be planning on doing.
13/08/2010 at 00:38 jeremypeel says:
What I mean is the setting – along with the continuous interaction with other characters in-game – suggests that the gameplay will have to be significantly advanced, presumably using Bioshock as a base. If you didn’t like Bioshock’s gameplay though I imagine you’re right in expecting not to enjoy it; I don’t think we can expect the mechanics to be fundamentally changed.
13/08/2010 at 00:52 Zerotonine says:
Well, we haven’t seen any gameplay yet, so it’s hard to tell what this is. But then again I’m a sucker for interesting settings.
However, Ken Levine has posted a message on the Irrational site that promises some changes from the formula, check it out: http://bit.ly/bLkXm2
12/08/2010 at 20:17 Skinlo says:
Looks pretty cool!
12/08/2010 at 20:17 ShaunCG says:
“And come back tomorrow for us talking to Ken Levine. The only Bioshock: Infinite interview, I strongly suspect, to mention anarchist Emma Goldman.”
And this is why I love you guys.
I have to say that I am also deeply excited about this, both for the ideas (I have faith that Levine can deliver despite Bioshock’s flaws) and the transposing of Shock-esque gameplay into such a unique FPS environment.
12/08/2010 at 20:19 Esc says:
uggggg it looks exactly like bioshock, just in the air and people are wearing different clothes.
I don’t really know how I feel about this. It looks GORGEOUS and a floating city based on 1880s imperial america is quite, quite interesting. But I can’t help feeling a little played. That Irrational are just spinning a couple big wheels that do a whacky shooter madlib: city set in starts to fall apart because all the inhabitants are slavish adherents to which have big clunky techno-horror-guardians.
But what else DO we do but riff on old ideas and improve them in games? I guess I was just hoping for a new IP, like that would make a difference. It is part of the “Bioshock” series and therefore should be echoing bioshock’s themes and design. If it was just named “colombia” standalone everyone would be sniggering about how they just changed the decor of bishock so making it part of the bioshock family does make sense.
The core of my mixed feelings come from bioshock: I loved the setting and the thesis but wasn’t impressed with the gameplay. Should I like a game just because of its visuals and themes?
12/08/2010 at 20:21 Esc says:
oh carp that is supposed to read:
madlib: [Time Period] city set in [Fantastic Environment] starts to fall apart because all the inhabitants are slavish adherents to [A Political Philosophy] which have big clunky techno-horror-guardians.
12/08/2010 at 20:36 Jimbo says:
I was hoping for and kinda expecting them to make Skyshock, but I was hoping it would be a totally seperate universe, with more of a futuristic dystopian feel to it.
I want glass walkways with rain hammering against it goddamit. I want to be in a glass city inside a thunder storm.
12/08/2010 at 20:44 James G says:
I’m not sure at the moment I’m entirely adverse to a simple re-skin, as ultimately it was the skin of Bioshock which appealed to me most. Of course, a re-skin could be anything as simple as a paint job, right down to a bit of internal DIY. By which I mean you could end up telling almost exactly the same story as Bioshock, through the same mechanisms, with only a few pieces of find-replace and pallet swap to disguise that, or you could have a decent re-think and ensure that your world is neatly consistent. I’m hoping for the latter.
With respect to the gameplay elements though, I suppose we’ll need to wait for a gameplay trailer. Having a companion could help shake things up, although this will largely depend on how they use her.
12/08/2010 at 20:19 ShadowNate says:
I’m fairly sure there’s supposed to be a sarcastic remark on the title. The “Bioshock: Infinite” tilte brings “Duke Nukem: Forever” to mind.
12/08/2010 at 20:20 cyrenic says:
So…we’ll wander around a highly stylized, technically advanced city that’s falling apart. We’ll fight a humanoid enemy and a big stompy robot enemy using conventional weapons and magic. And we’ll probably collect audio journals along the way.
Hmmm.
12/08/2010 at 20:25 Solitude says:
Since when did any of that start being a bad thing?
12/08/2010 at 20:28 Fergus says:
I may be being a stick in the mud, but my response to it was a very firm “meh”.
If Irrational think that just changing the setting is going to recreate the memorable experience of BioShock 1, then they’ve missed the point of what made that game good. I’ll wait for some plot teasers and/or evidence of significant gameplay innovation before passing judgment.
12/08/2010 at 20:29 Hoernchen says:
Ah. Old game, new location. Color me not impressed.
12/08/2010 at 20:32 Kid A says:
*shakes head, solitar tear rolls down cheek*
Why.
12/08/2010 at 20:33 Justin says:
I’d argue that the imperialism of that era wasn’t a “be afraid of the nonwhites!” concept, but more a “societies don’t work until they are Western Christian and buying our finished goods made from their raw materials” idea. Segregation was still very strong and therefore people tended to think alien cultures were all external. This changed with the huge amount of U.S. immigration in the 1910+ years.
I’d say that’s a very fine historical point to argue when it’s a video game… but it’s interesting that a video game can even bring up that subject. So maybe there’s a bit of a grand idea here after all.
12/08/2010 at 20:33 Seamus says:
No.
12/08/2010 at 20:40 Freud says:
I hope gameplay have more depth than Bioshock. If this turns out to be a shooter with plasm…er whatever they choose to call the the magic this time around, I will be quite disappointed. Bioshocks shooting was quite boring once you had spent the 10 minutes to explore plasmids.
12/08/2010 at 20:43 Sardaukar says:
I’m surprised Theodore Roosevelt wasn’t mentioned in relation to this. Columbia, the Great White Fleet, who can miss that comparison. While he certainly wasn’t as xenophobic as this sounds, he was definitely against foreigners remaining foreign in any way once they were in the country. Toss in eugenics, and there you go. Columbia, home of… Russel Theovelt? Some other Ayn Rand-Andrew Ryan conversion.
12/08/2010 at 20:45 Bowlby says:
“Talking to Ken Levine later reveals that there’s a reason for the title, which will only become apparent with play”.
I can solve that mystery right now: it’s for marketing reasons.
The trailer presents it very much as BioShock in the sky, and, I’ve got to be honest, I’ve never felt an adoration for either game in the series. The combat’s always been slightly clunky, I feel, and dramatically I think it overplays its cards. The world of Columbia – now, artistically and culturally I’m quite intrigued. I just don’t want it to be the same gameplay with a re-skin.
12/08/2010 at 20:45 Emphursis says:
Looks and sounds horrible.
I don’t get the fuss around Bioshock, so I will definitely pass on this one.
Anyway, who else finds the setting highly ironic? A setting such as this would be impossible for anyone in 1900, let alone a nation who’s ‘major moment’ in the previous hundred years was winning a war against themselves…
12/08/2010 at 20:49 Tuor says:
Considering that Bioshock was an attack on Libertarianism, I’m not surprised that Levine has decided to attack another ideology I assume he disagrees with. Not buying this one.
12/08/2010 at 21:35 subedii says:
I wouldn’t really say it was an “attack” on libertarianim at all, more just an attempt at deconstructing it and following it through.
It wasn’t necessarily as successful as I’d have liked, but it did at least take a look, and gave it a bit more of an analysis than most media I’ve seen have ever even tried.
12/08/2010 at 23:06 A-Scale says:
I didn’t realize there were any 1910esque “white man’s burden” American exceptionalists left to anger.
12/08/2010 at 20:49 circadianwolf says:
Holy shit, it’s the Chums of Chance (from Against the Day): The Game.
12/08/2010 at 22:57 Davian says:
Hey, you’re right! Let’s hope there’s a an S/M hardcore sex minigame with Yashmeen. /whipcrack
12/08/2010 at 20:54 m_s0 says:
Oh, another Bioshock. Great.
12/08/2010 at 20:56 m_s0 says:
[boots up System Shock]
12/08/2010 at 20:55 Po0py says:
I’m glad that K Levine is not afraid to put a splattering of theme in his games. Call it a literary game. That’s what I felt Bioshock was aiming for and I hope this one goes deeper.
12/08/2010 at 20:56 Sarlix says:
I’m not sure if theres anyone alive who is more turned off by Bioshock than me. I tried to complete that game 4 times, each time I somehow stopped playing at around the same point. I tried to like it, I really did. But now whenever I hear or read the name I feel like sticking my head into a trash compactor. I’m too scared to read the article…
12/08/2010 at 20:59 Radiant says:
“Levine argues that between 1880 and 1900 America transformed from this Agrarian backwater to a rising technological power that ended up claiming the 20th century as its own.”
Yeah fuck the Queen.
12/08/2010 at 21:04 Kbohls says:
If this game didn’t have “Bioshock” in the title everyone would be loving it.
12/08/2010 at 21:09 Allandaros says:
I never really got too gripped by Bioshock, wasn’t too interested. But this does catch my attention, primarily because the 1890-1900 period is not well represented in gaming, or popular culture in general. And yet, as Levine’s discussion demonstrates, there is a lot of fodder there for creative and interesting ideas.
I have no idea how this will play out as a game, but as a storytelling concept I’m moderately interested.
12/08/2010 at 21:11 The Dark One says:
Anything that sounds like a mix of John Hodgman’s Ar, Larry Niven’s Permanent Floating Riot Club and the Crimson Permanent Assurance is going to be interesting.
One can only hope the game lives up to the setting.
12/08/2010 at 21:14 MehMan says:
I don’t understand why they said they were working on a new ip when it seems to just be a Bioshock prequel. The setting looks amazing, the story Irrational-quality. But the gameplay (-gasp-, yes that old thing!) seems almost identical.
12/08/2010 at 21:14 Adventurous Putty says:
A play-by-play of my responses to the trailer.
-Oh OK underwater city and Big Daddy means Bioshock — except not, because that’d be far far too easy. I’m proven right, except then I see “1893 World’s Fair” (which, as I am an American, immediately evokes the White City and steampunk and utopianism) and I go “oh shit oh shit oh shit” and begin to become sexually stimulated.
-Big horrible thing starts thrashing around our invariably tophatted hero and I’m like “oh my god oh my god” and he’s OUT the window and OH MY GOD OH MY GOD LOOK IT’S A DIRIGIBLE IT CAN’T BE IT CAN’T BE A DIRIGIBLE IT’S TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE
-(I came)
-oh my god oh my god dirigible it’s steampunk oh my god it’s a real steampunk video game oh my god he’s sliding down the dirigible IT’S A DIRIGIBLE oh my god
-oh my god look at the buildings and the landscape below look it’s like the midwest except he has a top hat and oh my god he’s still falling oh my god why is it so visceral oh my god what wait roses what oh wow oh look roses lady lady she’s a nice lady look at that reminds me of columbia kinda or a WWI poster which is pretty much the same thing wait roses what OH NO NICE LADY LOOK BEHIND YOU THE BIG MEAN MAN IS OH NOOOOOO falling falling falling wow oh my god this game looks amazing why are my pants wet oh wait oh
Wait.
Bioshock.
God, now you had to go and ruin it, didn’t you Levine?
12/08/2010 at 21:20 A-Scale says:
Let us pray that the Irrational guys don’t read RPS comments. You crybabies wouldn’t know a good game if it bit your on the ass.
12/08/2010 at 21:27 Shazbut says:
THIS!
Here’s me thinking we actually knew what we wanted and were just frustrated at how rarely we see it. Turns out you’re all just a bunch of cynical pricks.
12/08/2010 at 21:28 Jimbo says:
Bit my what on the ass?
12/08/2010 at 21:43 Adventurous Putty says:
Do you really want to know?
And to be honest, this may be the first time I agree with A-Scale on just about anything. Besides the title (which is just silly — should’ve been a different franchise) the idea is awesome. I can’t believe you think steampunk is overused when it really has yet to permeate into mainstream culture in the first place.
12/08/2010 at 22:25 Fergus says:
Yes, the idea is awesome as a standalone product, and if this didn’t have the BioShock name attached to it we would all be highly excited about this idea.
The problem is that BioShock as a game … wasn’t very good. The storyline and atmosphere of that game were what made it special. What we really want is new, funner gameplay instead of “oh look you can do the same old crap in the sky now, isn’t that cool?”
Of course, this is judging the book by its cover, seeing as how we don’t know what the gameplay will be like yet.
12/08/2010 at 22:50 Freud says:
Most comments are relatively positive. May I suggest you stop trawling through the commentaries looking for negative ones so you can lash out at the “crybabies” and relax a bit.
12/08/2010 at 23:00 A-Scale says:
Most, Freud? I looked casually at the comments (until I vomited) and 1/2 to 3/4 of the comments were cynical crybaby bullshit. Are we even on the same webpage?
12/08/2010 at 23:04 Zwebbie says:
You’re right, A-Scale, I would indeed not recognize Deus Ex if it had transformed into something capable of ass biting :) .
12/08/2010 at 23:58 Freud says:
@ A-scale
Thats nonsense. Most comments about this new game are positive about the design (and that is pretty much all we know about the game now). Then we have loads of comments about how the Bioshocks were/weren’t satisfying, mostly regarding gameplay mechanics since pretty much everyone loves Rapture and how it is realized. I guess that is what you consider “cynical crybaby bullshit”. Having different preferences than you. Sorry this didn’t turn into the hallelujah choir you seem to think it should have.
You are by far the most negative person in this comment field.
13/08/2010 at 01:38 A-Scale says:
This isn’t a matter of opinion, it’s a matter of fact. Count up the negative comments in these three pages. You will find them to overwhelm the positive comments.
12/08/2010 at 21:25 Seamus says:
Steampunk has been done to death now. That, and it’s just a really lame aesthetic in the 1st place.
By what I’m reading from this and Destructoid’s article is that now they’re throwing in an additional layer of contrivance over Bioshock’s plasmid system, in that you have an NPC casting plasmids into which you cast plasmids before you actually get to shoot anybody in the face. What gives?
I don’t care if Irrational has grandiose delusions of their games being more than humble 1st-person shooters. At the end of the day, that’s exactly what they are. Your primary method of interaction in Bioshock was shooting people, no matter which way you look at it. For them to contrive the act of shooting people by having to do X, then Y did not make it any more cerebral, intriguing, or rewarding. It turned the ages-old videogame paradigm of shooting people into something more complex and chore-like than it needed to be.
And Bioshock: Infinity looks to be no different. Ken Levine is an auteur of the worst kind.
12/08/2010 at 23:02 A-Scale says:
And you are a critic of the most vapid variety.
13/08/2010 at 12:39 Seamus says:
I’m not a critic. At least not yet. I just happen to have opinions that you disagree with.
12/08/2010 at 21:25 Shazbut says:
After trying 6 or 7 times to express myself calmly and eloquently, I just want to say this:
Fuck all your cynicism. Seriously.
12/08/2010 at 21:30 Dominic White says:
Amen to that. Everywhere I look online, the reactions to this reveal have been curmudgeonly at best, outright furious at worst.
What the flying fuck has happened to gamers? Seriously, if I ever end up sounding like that, I want someone to punch me in the face until I stop. Intolerable tossers one and all.
12/08/2010 at 21:34 Vinraith says:
A lot of people felt very burned by what Bioshock promised to be versus what it turned out to be. I should hasten to add, here, that I’m not one of them (I missed the hype entirely, got the game in a Steam sale, and quite enjoyed it) but I can understand the mentality. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. Conversely, I think giving Irrational the benefit of the doubt to build the existing Bioshock model into something closer to what was originally envisioned is much more productive than immediate vitriolic dismissal of anything that carries the name. Still, to each his own.
12/08/2010 at 21:40 subedii says:
I pretty much didn’t experience any of the “hype” either. My reaction to Bioshock was largely to be impressed with it. It had some rough edges, the combat could have been better. But the actual visual design was extremely well done, and it took an effort to try and make an interesting setting and story, with the whole Randian thing going on.
12/08/2010 at 21:49 Adventurous Putty says:
I’m a bit disappointed that they decided to add to the Bioshock franchise instead of making something new outright (I mean, really, what connection could there be to Bioshock story-wise besides something really stupid and arbitrary?).
But again: STEAMPUNK. Visions of the seemingly dead Edge of Twilight come to mind, except different. Again, since when is steampunk overused? Inquiring minds would like to know, as certainly the people on my street would have no idea what it is when asked.
12/08/2010 at 21:56 Shazbut says:
I do understand the frustration at Bioshock being more stripped down, less RPG-ish, or even – dare I use those words – dumbed down, in comparison to System Shock. But the ambition was there, as is evident whenever the developers talk about it. They TRIED. This is what’s important. The problem we have is that nobody bloody tries. At least they tried to make it as dense and wonderful as SS. Here they are with a new game, with Ken Levine on board, the opportunity to realise that ambition again, and almost nobody gets it.
And, I’m not saying it WILL be as good as SS, or whatever people want. But when opportunities like this come along, we have to be supportive of the developers. If they have the ambition we’ve got to back them totally. We have to be clear that we know what we fucking want. Otherwise we just sound like a load of whiny nerds, and I swear to God, that will bring down the whole damn ship.
12/08/2010 at 21:57 Sarlix says:
@Shazbut & Dominic White – Until I got to your comments I took what everyone was saying with a pinch of salt, I mean they are just giving their opinion on a computer game, it’s what the comment section is for right? You guys were just plain rude :-(
12/08/2010 at 22:03 Jimbo says:
I don’t know, I’m pretty neutral about it so far, but if you go around telling people you have taken Ken Levine off of the Bioshock sequel so that he can “work on an original title”, and then that “original title” is revealed as Bioshock… it isn’t all that surprising that some people might be a bit miffed.
We need to know more I think. Simply changing the ‘isolator’ from water to air isn’t enough of a change by itself to warrant considering this as anything other than just more Bioshock. That’s fine for the people that want it, but not exactly an exciting revelation for those that wanted (and had been told to expect) something new.
12/08/2010 at 22:18 Shazbut says:
@Sarlix
Having calmed down a bit now that’s off my chest, I stress that none of my frustration was directed at any individual. But seeing a collective behave in this way is upsetting because they have greater power and I genuinely believe responses like this are damaging. Cynicism destroys creativity. Already we are giving them no room to move by behaving in this way. Nobody will ever want to try if they habitually see this type of fan response. Even if they know it’s just people being emotional, it still some negative impact. It doesn’t help. Lets be brief. It just doesn’t help.
I’m sorry you felt the need to make a sadface. I don’t like people being sad. I’m just angry myself, but I’m the one looking for a bit of optimism and excitement.
12/08/2010 at 22:28 Sarlix says:
@Shazbut Thanks for clarifying, and I think you make a good point. I think Cynicism and optimism are both important, you just need too find the right balance. You turned my sad face into a happy one :-)
12/08/2010 at 22:45 Shazbut says:
@Sarlix
*truly humbled*
Anyway, I think the game looks and sounds great :)
12/08/2010 at 22:56 LintMan says:
I think a lot of the hate comes not from what Bioshock actually is, but from what is was not, ie: System Shock 3. A lot of SS2 fans are pretty bitter that Bioshock didn’t (in their opinions) deliver on its promise to be its “spiritual successor”. This new game, being another Bioshock title, inherits the same blowback.
Personally, I thought Bioshock was flawed but overall very good. I didn’t really need “more of the same” from Bioshock 2 so I skipped that. Their “new IP” being more Bioshock is a bit disappointing to me, but I’m thinking that’s more my reaction to the name than to what the game is actually about.
12/08/2010 at 23:19 Bowlby says:
Well, look: BioShock was very impressive for its fresh concept and narrative; BioShock 2 felt like a slightly more polished rehash of the first. Don’t people have a basis to be just a little sceptical of the next game in the series?
Anyway, this is a teaser trailer, not gameplay footage; so, really, it tells us very little, almost nothing, about the game. Secondly, and more importantly, the release is set for 2012, which is an absolute age away, and I would be very surprised if the game ends up being half of what they’ve initially designed it to be.
12/08/2010 at 21:32 DK says:
“We’re gonna announce a new game! Project ICARUS! Completely new IP!”
“It’s another Bioshock. Did we say new IP? We meant yet another tired rehash!”
Reminds a lot of how they announced Bioshock.
“We’re gonna make a spiritual Sequel to System Shock! It’s gonna be awesome!”
“Did we say spiritual sequel? We meant System Shocks neanderthal brother, the one we hit on the head!”
12/08/2010 at 21:33 Slamelov says:
A bit dissapointed. I waited for a new IP, or may be Deep Cover, but this is another Bioshock. I know Ken Levine says that it doesn’t, that is a full new game. May be, but I don’t believe in flying soucers…
12/08/2010 at 21:37 squidlarkin says:
I feel like I’m beating a dead horse with this comment, but it’s my dead horse and I’ll beat it as long as I want to.
System Shock 2 had a genuine scarcity of resources, a tense mood heightened by the very real prospect of failure, and a complex set of character development choices with significant, long term impact on how the game would play out.
The subsequent Shocks have thrown this out in favor of “zap lightning when there’s water, zap fire when there’s oil”. And they really seem to think this is innovative.
Irrational keeps nailing it with setting and tone, but when did they lose their passion for making games that were interesting to play?
12/08/2010 at 21:39 Seamus says:
This. PArdon my previous rambling. You summed it up a lot better than I did, except I’m not nearly as hot on the setting.
12/08/2010 at 23:04 A-Scale says:
If you think fire and oil mechanics are why people claim Bioshock was innovative you’ve missed the point entirely.
13/08/2010 at 00:47 squidlarkin says:
You misunderstand me. I think Irrational thinks the fire and oil mechanics are innovative. Although in point of fact I’m not sure how Bioshock can be seen as anything but a step backward.
13/08/2010 at 01:36 A-Scale says:
I don’t misunderstand you, I just think you’re making shit up.
12/08/2010 at 21:38 V. Tchitcerhine. says:
Immediately I thought ‘Oh no, not another Rapture jaunt’… then the revelation you weren’t in Kansas any more was stunning. The more I read about this, the more excited I become. The time period is just ripe for an incredible exploration, especially considering the already manifest themes of empire and anarchism. I already love the touch that the protagonist is an ex-Pinkerton Agency detective. As an aside, the famous industrialist Andrew Carnegie sent Pinkerton agents to break the Homestead strike, resulting in the lynching of labour union organiser and anti-war activist Frank Short. The potential for exploring the period is just immense and seems to already be masterfully done, such as the reference to America’s brutal occupation of the Philippines (creating probably the first surveillance-police state).
Also an avid fan of anarchist writing and principles (of Mill, Humboldt, Goldman, Chomsky and others), I cannot wait to see the treatment of the philosophy in the game. The gameplay additions such as volatile NPCs, open gameplay spaces and other details are also really promising.
Again, I was initially jaded, but on reflection, I’m fucking sold.
12/08/2010 at 21:38 Frankle says:
So will the game after this be in a dungeon and then after that on a mountain then on land to then finnaly be……well I’ll hand it over to Tim Curry for the word on the final one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yMy7JuGpJM
12/08/2010 at 21:39 Davian says:
Infinite…what? Isn’t that an adjective? Shouldn’t it follow the “HERP of DERP: THE DERPING” form? I am disappointed.
12/08/2010 at 21:57 Diogo Ribeiro says:
Whoa. /Neo
12/08/2010 at 22:09 RandomOne says:
Why couldn’t they just name it “Bioshock: Columbia”? Seems a far more reasonable name than Bioshock: Infinite IMO.
Oh and I’m torn between excitement and disappointment. I would rather have more stuff be different e.g. cyberpunk instead of steampunk or just sci-fi even. But it’s still a whole new world to explore…
12/08/2010 at 22:10 Dave says:
Well. I like the style. Everything else I guess remains to be seen.
12/08/2010 at 22:20 zorba says:
Pretty cool how they differentiate this and Bioshock by saying they only share the same basic mechanics, guess System Shock 2, whose tortured core still powers all of this, got lost along the way
12/08/2010 at 22:25 lurk says:
Heyyy, Freedom Force was around before Bioshock, shouldn’t they do Freedom Force 3 before Bioshock 3?
Or at least do it after System Shock 4 but before System Shock 5 :/
12/08/2010 at 22:34 Tetragrammaton says:
hmmmmm
12/08/2010 at 22:36 sfury says:
Meh.
12/08/2010 at 22:42 v.dog says:
It looks like it’s gaining altitude. Hopefully the next Shock game will be set in space. I’ve always wanted a Shock game set in space. ;)
12/08/2010 at 23:13 sfury says:
But what evil automaton will be chasing you in space? They’d have to use rogue AI or two… or MANY.
13/08/2010 at 15:01 circadianwolf says:
We have been promised Bioshock 5 on the moon, after all.
13/08/2010 at 17:43 sfury says:
…battling Julle Vernes and his evil steampunk cronies, surely.
12/08/2010 at 22:43 MaxwellKraft says:
“Irrational keeps nailing it with setting and tone, but when did they lose their passion for making games that were interesting to play?”
This.
System Shock 2′s setting was basically just Neuromancer meets Alien, but it didn’t matter because the *gameplay* gave you so many interesting options. You can invest in invisibility and sneak around OR you can invest in the energy sword and hacking skills and basically be Hiro Protagonist OR you can use heavy weapons and blow everything away OR…
BioShock was fun, but didn’t really give you much freedom other than “Do you want to fight this horde of baddies by shooting them, or by stunning them and then shooting them?”. The whole objectionist society gone wrong(er) would be much more interesting in a game where you had to try and, say, try and keep your family from starving to death (“Do you join Atlas’s revolution OR do you open up a fishery despite the unstable economic situation OR do you sell one of your kids to the Little Sister orphanage OR…) but ended up just being wallpaper for a good but not ground-breaking shooter.
And now we BioShock: Infinite, which aims to improve on the first two by…changing the setting. Fantastic.
“BUT YOU DON’T KNOW ANYTHING! THEY HAVEN’T EVEN SHOWN ANY GAMEPLAY YET!”
Yeah, that’s exactly the problem. BioShock: Infinite is a game. It is not an exercise in “how much of Ken Levine’s liberal arts degree can we shoehorn into a series of corridors full of people to shoot?” I don’t care about where it takes place. That doesn’t matter. What matters (since this is a video game and thus interactive) is what the player can actually do. So we’re in the sky, does that mean I can get a jet pack and fly around open ended levels? Can I sneak around by climbing under the bottom of the city? Will there be massive airship-on-airship battles that AREN’T just cut scenes or scripted events? Or will my biggest choice be “do I get the ice or the fire attack first?”
Given how BioShock 2 went, I’m betting on the latter.
12/08/2010 at 22:43 Acosta says:
Checking the interviews, it’s funny how Irrational’s Timothy Gerritsen says that is was totally their call, they wanted to make a sequel. It’s pretty sad when we can’t blame evil corporate overlords about the lack of ideas in the industry (yes, I’m exaggerating, but just a bit)
Using electricity on wet enemies, summoning bees (sorry, no, crows this time), telekinesis, facing robotic cyborgs… if they designed the trailer to make you believe that this is Bioshock “like you have never seen before”, they failed miserably. I just could think “been there, done that”, and hey won’t impress me with a change of setting and a new political philosophy confrontation to explore, no matter how beautiful they can render the scenarios.
I guess I’m dissappointed, I thought the point of the unnecessary Bioshock 2 was to free Irrational to make something new and/or different, not Bioshock 3. I have no doubts it will be a good and intelligent game, I just miss the “shock” I had when I discovered the first details of Bioshock.
12/08/2010 at 22:48 Jockie says:
Basically hoped for something more than Bioshock 3, I’ll play it and it will probably be good, but Bioshock 2 was nothing more than an entertaining romp for me, it didn’t grip me except for one moment where your perspective is changed (people who played it will know what I mean). Besides if you’re going to take an established series in a totally different direction, why not create a new IP, other than for the obvious marketing benefits.
12/08/2010 at 22:54 LOVERS says:
break dance
dans kurslari
dans
12/08/2010 at 23:05 Destroye says:
I might buy it.
12/08/2010 at 23:10 i saw dasein says:
nativism, nationalism/fascism and fear of the “other’ are just as much political philosophies as is libertarianism or anarcho capitalism
12/08/2010 at 23:38 chesh says:
THE FUCKING HALF-LIFE 2 BRIDGE.
I recently replayed it (achievements!) and my girlfriend was wondering why I seemed to be having a panic attack. Of course it was the goddamn bridge. It might not be so bad if I had feet, I’m never quite sure where I’m standing in HL2.
</offtopic&rt;
12/08/2010 at 23:39 chesh says:
er, that comment was supposed to go elsewhere. bah.
13/08/2010 at 00:24 jalf says:
Heh, I was thinking Tim Schafer actually… ;)
Anyway, this looks intriguing. Am I allowed to say that without pissing off anyone or coming across as a dumb slobbering Bioshock fanboy? Bioshock really really didn’t live up to its potential, and perhaps this won’t either. But so far, the setting and the visual style has caught my interest.
Of course, I said the exact same thing about Bioshock a couple of years ago. We’ll see how it turns out.
But really, it’s hardly worth getting so angry over, is it? A game that might turn out to be good, or might not live up to its potential? And people hoping it will actually be good?
Some people need to work out some anger issues, methinks. It’s just a game.
13/08/2010 at 08:14 Hidden_7 says:
Not to pick a fight with you in particular, but I find it odd in general when people negatively critique games as “not living up to their potential.”
To my mind, games in the recent past that have lived up to their potential are the likes of the Modern Warfares. Because they had such little potential, so it was an easy mark to hit. Potential is, in my opinion, a product of ambition. Games are at a point right now where even a fairly common amount of ambition is hard to realize. Games with lots of ambition and potential then, very very rarely get even remotely close to meeting it all. Personally however, I’d rather play those games than ones that achieve their limited potential.
All that being said, I’d much rather play a game that achieves an incredibly grand potential. Bioshock, though I think it was really a rather good game, has a lot of room to improve, and I’d absolutely love to see Infinite be the game that improves that.
13/08/2010 at 00:25 SwiftRanger says:
While the trailer is intriguing this is yet another shooter from Irrational, I am starting to believe they just don’t want to make strategy games. Silly buggers.
13/08/2010 at 00:30 mihor_fego says:
Pynchon’s “Against the day” as inspiration?
13/08/2010 at 01:40 A-Scale says:
Caesar’s Column by Ignatius Donelly, I was thinking.
13/08/2010 at 00:38 Kris says:
I like the setting, art style and the possible exploration of the concept of ‘manifest destiny’. Especially as I reeber studying how it was parralleled in Germany. Don’t feel it needed the Bioshock name, prehas just a subtitle stating ‘written by Ken Levine’ would convey the feel of the game. Though the skyanes and floating islands with steampunk reminds me of a world/level in Metroid Prime 3. Then again Bioshock felt like it owed a debt to Metroid games in general.
13/08/2010 at 00:42 Kris says:
Apologies for above typos – touchscreen dislikes calluses on fingers.
13/08/2010 at 00:39 R. Eden says:
If Columbia is anything like the flying (and part-time raiding) party described in Adams’ “Life, the Universe, and Everything,” then count me in!
13/08/2010 at 00:56 Dagda says:
Absolutely fantastic.
13/08/2010 at 01:04 Red Scharlach says:
i liked this game better when it was called mario vs. airman
13/08/2010 at 01:56 manveruppd says:
I thought the whole concept and setting is brilliant!
13/08/2010 at 02:24 perilisk says:
I like the idea of treating Bioshock like Final Fantasy; the appeal of the first was about the ideas explored, the novelty, and the fact that it was a throwaway settings — bringing us back to Rapture for Bioshock 2 was disappointing, although understandable from a business perspective.
It would be nice if the city wasn’t in the process of falling apart and was had a decent ratio of mostly non-violent folks to rampaging enemies, rather than being populated solely by fast zombies. At the very least, a stealthy character should be able to see the inhabitants under “normal” circumstances.
Hopefully they’ll give us a fairly nuanced deconstruction of the ideologies of the time (imperialism, yes, but also futurism, technocracy, and socialism, and maybe (1890′s-era American) liberalism, anarchism, populism, and so on) , maybe hit on the assassination at the end of the real-world fair or ragtime music or (particularly) the Frontier Thesis. In fact, the Frontier Thesis might be a critical thematic component: maybe “Infinite” is a reference to an “infinite” frontier in the form of the sky (and perhaps eventually, space)?
13/08/2010 at 02:55 Feanor says:
@K Marin are already working on the sequel:
Bioshock Infinite +1
13/08/2010 at 03:22 vanarbulax says:
I for one welcome this new influx of brightly coloured, highly saturated off-kilter dystopias. It brings my dream of a modern fully-fledged “The Prisoner” style game a step closer.
13/08/2010 at 03:26 Fata_Morgana says:
That there are people already complaining about this game…
I just…
No really…
How in the…
What.
13/08/2010 at 06:33 drewski says:
Don’t like the name. Love everything else.
13/08/2010 at 08:17 dayeight says:
Well, Emma Goldman was an npc in that Ultima 6 spin off Martian Dreams….
13/08/2010 at 08:29 ManaTree says:
I can’t believe most of you. What the fuck?!
1) WE HAVEN’T PLAYED THE GAME. Judging the game now is idiotic. Exactly how many times does this have to go through your heads?
2) Project Icarus was not anything more than a moniker. I don’t recall Irrational ever saying that it was explicitly a new IP. Or a rehash. I don’t recall anything. I actually thought it’d be a new IP, but frankly, this is awesome.
3) OH HEY, DID YOU ALREADY FORGET THAT WE HAVEN’T PLAYED THE GAME? Because you might have. Poor fellows.
4) Ken Levine feels that this is a proper sequel with respect to how BioShock feels, not the setting, not the story. In other words, BioShock is a bunch of immersive sims, pretty much. I’m generalizing it, but around that.
5) Your old games are not gone.
6) Leave your judgments of the game at the door, by the way.
7) One trailer does not tell us everything. Didn’t we learn this from movies? A trailer does not suffice, much less in games than film. Games even need demos for any kind of proper human metric.
8) Shame on you for getting suckered by hype.
9) Did you forget to give the game a chance? No? Good!
That should be a lot of them. Respond away. I suspect I’ll have started a flame war within the hour, but I think I’m being very reasonable with what I’m saying (my tone is a bit flamey, I’ll admit, but I am damn disappointed at the reaction).
13/08/2010 at 11:16 AndrewC says:
@Manatree: Oh. I hope I’m not offending the the previous two pages by not having read them yet, but does this post mean they are full of people being all negative about it, probably due to some rather tellingly angry issues they have wth Bioshock?
That’s fairly sad, but it’s OK. We’ll live.
13/08/2010 at 11:20 DK says:
Here’s something for your 1) and 3):
WE ALREADY KNOW WHAT THEY’RE DOING.
They’ve done it in Bioshock. They’ve done it in Bioshock 2. They’ve done it in Deus Ex2. They’ve done it a hundred times before.
There is no magical “unannounced feature” that you just have to “wait and see” and “don’t judge it yet”.
The only thing you’re doing with that attitude is giving the Marketing Department an orgasm.
13/08/2010 at 11:22 AndrewC says:
@Manatree: we’re they allcaps-ing a lot too?
13/08/2010 at 11:49 negativedge says:
Personally, I only express my opinions as mathematically graphed functions after grand jury presentations. This way, I don’t commit the horrible sin of using my mind to react to a given set of information.
13/08/2010 at 13:44 ManaTree says:
@AndrewC
Remember XCOM and X-COM? Not as many, but plenty of angry voices, nonetheless. Many irrationally so.
@DK
Oh please. That’s taking what I’m saying out of proportion. And an orgasm for a marketing department? Really? I say that I’m partially flaming and clearly that’s a GREAT marketing tool, eh?
Get a grip on your head. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt, though.
It’s only fair to give anyone a chance. It doesn’t matter how many times they fuck up, these are game studios, not criminals or, God forbid, Bobby Kotick. By the way, I don’t know why you’d bring up BioShock 2 or Deus Ex 2. You mean as sequels? If that’s your argument, it doesn’t hold, I’m sorry. It doesn’t matter if it’s first game, the second game, the 50th game or the 1000th game. They can be good or bad, irregardless. And it’s not any studio we’re talking about; it’s Irrational. They stand a far better chance at making a good game than many studios.
13/08/2010 at 14:54 Acosta says:
It’s adorable seeing people feel so insecure of their opinion that they need to criticise others to feel better themselves.
Get over it.
13/08/2010 at 08:50 MartinNr5 says:
Excellent article Kieron – very well written.
And I do want this game. If done right it can be awesome.
13/08/2010 at 08:54 theblazeuk says:
I see your point an- LOOK ZOMBIES RUN!
13/08/2010 at 11:12 Okami says:
It’s published by 2k, they’ll crush any vestige of political commentary out of it by the time they’re done with it.
13/08/2010 at 12:13 JohnS says:
I don’t understand some of the more negative comments either. If it was about space marines or WWII I might sympathise with them.
“Oh, another architectural marvel in a fantastical environment with sociopolitical commentary. Haven’t we had enough of those?”
13/08/2010 at 12:16 Dawngreeter says:
I’m so unbelievably bored by this. Seriously, another anachronistic and weirdly conceived failed utopia with superpowered people where Big Daddies roam? Really? I can imagine the board meeting.
Billy: We can make another Bioshock, exactly like the two we already made, but this time it’ll be… IN A VOLCANO!
Jim: That’s so goddamn innovative, I’m getting goosebumps! But maybe we’re pushing it too far?
Billy: Yeah, we might be. People’s heads will explode, the populace isn’t ready for such huge strides forward.
Jim: Yeah. We’ll wait for the volcano idea a bit later. How about… in the sky?
Billy: Awesome! Let’s mildly change the appearance of Big Daddies as well. I like it when we innovate the exact same things we already innovated twice.
Jim: And they said we couldn’t become game designers with accounting degrees, hah!
13/08/2010 at 12:28 AndrewC says:
I’d suggest you being bored by such imaginative settings is that the standard near future/dystopia setting is so utterly endemic it doesn’t even feel like a cliche anymore.
13/08/2010 at 12:49 Dawngreeter says:
What imaginative settings? It’s an imaginative setting. Singular. The one we’ve already seen. If they want to tell stories about it, by all means, be my guest. This just feels, like someone already said in the comments, like a game of mad libs. It’s not underwater, it’s in the sky. Hoorah, another crop of fans hailing the innovation of substituting one weird environment for another.
Also, it’s not an issue of cliches. A well-established setting allows stories to focus on more than just explaining their whys and wherefores. Mere fact that you can take a cyberpunkish near-future sprawl, a zombie apocalypse or anything like that and have 100% of your audience know exactly what’s going on allows you to commit the entirety of your narrative to specific characters, circumstances, etc. An establishing shot of a noir detective in a pouring rain tells you everything you need to know about the entire world the protagonist inhabits. That’s smart use of the language of any given medium.
This ain’t it. This is “let’s pull another weird stunt from the hat because it seemed to work the last time around”. I don’t care if it’s in the sky. I don’t care what slightly different kind of superpower the people have. Not a single thing here tells us anything contained within this wacky impossible sky city is of importance. The sky city is the big sale. Feh. This is their huge change, substituting “underwater” for “airborne”, because it’s bigger than Bioshock 2′s change of “individualist” into “collectivist”. Even though it was the EXACT SAME STORY.
I am fairly certain everyone reading this can already guess the majority of the narrative. And it won’t be political. As much as I admire Kieron’s ability to hope for the best after so much experience that really should have made him more of a cynic. But then, that’s why I love RPS.
13/08/2010 at 13:10 AndrewC says:
Oh. Well we disagree about how interesting narratives are expressed in games.
13/08/2010 at 12:27 SuperNashwan says:
Interesting setting but if the combat’s as clunky as the other Bioshocks I’ll be giving this a miss as well.
13/08/2010 at 13:25 toni says:
I’m sorry but I failed to see what “Ideas” the game got you talk about being exciting ?
to me it sounds just like a BS sequel/expansion in a different setting with the same combat/powers and an excuse for a quicksave called Elika/aehm, Elizabeth. BS1 teaser was epic, this is very underwhelming. Waiting for the gameplay demo for next verdict.
13/08/2010 at 14:13 bill says:
If it’s like bioshock, but a bit different (for variation) and with a bit more variation of actions. (talking to people!) then it’d rock.
Bioshock was awesome, until you realised that there wasn’t much to do. After they cleverly pointed out it was an on-rails shooter, they should have switched styles and opened it up Deus-Ex style. Instead they continued as an on-rails shooter, and it slowly lost it’s appeal.
Hopefully this Bioshock (terrible name, but good for marketing i guess) will have more Deus Ex / Bloodlines in it’s DNA. That’s all it’d take to make it awesome.
13/08/2010 at 15:28 FuzzyKitty says:
This totally has me giddy for the same reason many people have mentioned – the environment. Any discussion I’ve ever had with friends on Bioshock always includes raves about the Plastic Surgeon and to a slightly lesser extent, the Musician. Those levels brought more raw emotion than I’ve seen in most games I’ve ever played and did an excellent job embodying the bleak atmosphere. Those are the memorable characters/levels that will always stick with me, alongside similar lunatics like Killer 7′s Ulmeyda or Clive Barker’s Undying’s Aaron (The character wasn’t totally memorable, but the setting he was in is frankly the only memory I have from that game. But what a memory it was).
We can all be different types of gamers and have different expectations. I don’t expect much “gameplay innovation” or something revolutionary from the FPS genre. The core gameplay has not drastically changed for so many years. If we were to remove all theme and setting from shooters, would they really be that different? I don’t believe so.
However, I, like I imagine most of you, crave, if not demand, something new from whatever new title I play. If I, going into a shooter title, already assume that there’s not going to be much fundamentally different from Doom, Turok, Deus Ex, Call of Duty, and even the forgettable titles like Soldier of Fortune (although who can forget how grotesque the body damage was in that?), where can I look for change or innovation? Atmospheric immerision. System Shock and Bioshock had me in stories I devoured. I look forward to sinking my teeth into a new world.
13/08/2010 at 15:59 Huggster says:
Yes it looks great – but enough with the armoured suits already!
And the sad string music!
Anyway’s read the “Horror of the Heights” by A C Doyle
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/537
13/08/2010 at 16:21 shinygerbil says:
I am looking forward to this game. A spiritual successor to a spiritual successor, or something more closely tied?
I am hoping there is as much emphasis on story/experience over gameplay/game mechanics as in Bioshock the First. I would love to wander in that city and feel like I was actually there.
But they should have called it BIOGASM: ON THE MOON.
13/08/2010 at 18:38 BrutalSlayingIsAJoy says:
I will keep it brief:
Shitty shit shit shit seems shitty shit shit.
But if the actualy gamePLAY is better than what everything else so far suggests (blood, gore, dismemberment, less pretend moral bollocks, something that is actually FUN, destructible everythings, infinite ways of doing something, being able to completely go about doing tomfoolery and take plot and peoples apart, etc, etc, i.e. all things that barely ever are either done at all or properly), then I’m all up for it.
So yea, wow, like totally giddy about this one.
Not.
13/08/2010 at 19:53 Chris says:
If this wants to be super-predictable, Andrew Ryan’s a clone of the guy who made this city and the chick is the predecessor of the eve/adam users.
14/08/2010 at 04:46 perilisk says:
But Andrew Ryan was Russian IIRC, and the eve-adam users were ordinary people who injected themselves with stem cells grown from sea slugs.
Maybe Elizabeth is an ancestor of Sophia and Eleanor Lamb, though. Could be she’s the end result of a eugenics program geared toward nurturing telepathic ability in humans, if eugenics is supposed to be a theme.
14/08/2010 at 00:29 Iucounu says:
“Gyroshock.”
14/08/2010 at 19:53 Tanysha says:
As always: The angry internet men leave their damp and moldy hideouts to rave at the sight of an original setting.
I loved Bioshock 1.
It helped, of course, that I hate playing shooters anyway and strolled happily through Rapture on the Easy-Setting, free to enjoy the marvelous design, the beautiful architecture, the stunning music and the fabulous thoughts about objectivist philosophy. And I think there was some fighting which I only vaguely recall because of the aforementioned wise decision to lower the shooty-part to easy.
Reading some of the comments in this thread I am reminded why there are so few enjoyable settings these days:
Why bother inventing something new, if most people cry havok if there are no Nazis, elves, dwarves, Jedi, space marines or emotionally crippled misogynists to be found?
Looking forward to another weird and sad and pretty city to explore!
15/08/2010 at 15:59 Zack says:
@sanguineangel
resident evil 4
any mario or zelda game
shadow of the colossus
kingdom hearts
ico
off the top of my head, im pretty sure all these games are based around rescuing a female character.