Rage No More: Rage Toolkit Appears

By Jim Rossignol on February 8th, 2013 at 8:00 pm.


Bethblog has word that the Rage tookit has arrived on Steam, along with some serious documentation to speed would-be modders on their way. Carmack has some advice, too, tweeting: “Doing significant work will require patience, because internally we use a 300 core renderfarm for megatexture creation.”

It’d be interesting to see what people could mod in using existing assets, though. If the toolkit gave enough access to get at the inventory and so on then I think there might be a true open world sandbox/economy game in there waiting to get out. But maybe not. Either way, significant work will require patience. And an enthusiasm for Rage.

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129 Comments »

  1. B1A4 says:

    Well, you don’t need megatextures in mods for better gameplay, right?

    • SelfEsteemFund says:

      Supposedly the best PC blog on the net & all I see is whining about megatextures etc. You have the tool kit for one the best engines ever made & rather than give it a try everyone just wants to moan.. This site has really gone to shit.

      • Mario Figueiredo says:

        You cannot hold the RPS writers responsible for the readers comments. That’s just nonsense. What you may want to say is that RPS is a victim of its success. But the article itself is a balanced news piece that makes none of the “moaning” you are seeing on the comments.

        And on the matter of “moaning”, that’s really a matter of debate. If you think people shouldn’t see a reason to complain about Rage engine, i’m afraid it’s your perception of modern FPS engines that has gone to shit.

      • SouperMattie says:

        @SelfEsteemFund why did you whine about whiners, in reply to a commenter who is not really whining?

        B1A4 was noting that gameplay mods should not require any texture work, sidestepping the possible issues that Carmack himself raised about rendering times.

        I see a mix of comments here, positive and negative. Ultimately with language like “this site has really gone to shit”, you turn out to be one of the whiniest commenters on the page. If RPS is in danger of “going to shit”, your comment is doing very little to help the situation.

        To keep this somewhat constructive: I hope somebody does a total conversion mod with super-hi-res everything, set in a much smaller gameworld (eg a single city block) to keep the download size reasonable. I want to see what this engine can do!

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      • SmokinJoeWhite says:

        I dont see how 209.33 hours equates to “a few hours” where did you go to school? The National Academy of BS?

        Take your spam elsewhere, or at least make it halfway believable.

        Now on topic. I really hope some people get into modding this game, I think this engine, if used well and optimised for pc, could be amazing, as it is even with its flaws I loved the game and see that this engine has potential.

  2. Yosharian says:

    Does anyone still play this game?

    Sorry I couldn’t resist! =(

    • GenBanks says:

      I completed it a few days ago… and really enjoyed it!

      • PeteC says:

        Completed the main game yesterday and also really enjoyed it. Just started the DLC today which is also fun so far. The game has flaws but also does a hell of a lot right.

        • Blackcompany says:

          Also really enjoyed Rage. It was not the open world Fallout killer a lot of people had psyched themselves into expecting (for some reason) but it was a good, solid, well built game. Smooth controls, plenty of tools and weapons, and excellent vehicle handling that for some reason Gearbox failed to learn from before releasing Borderlands the Second.

          Though I bought Rage on Day 1 because it looked like my sort of game – it is – I don’t regret it. That said, its much less hardcore than some older shooters, and thus the reason why I like it is, I think, the reason why many fans of previous Id games do not.

          • jrodman says:

            Sorry if it seems shallow of me, but “less hardcore” vs “more hardcore” seems kind of incomprehensible in this context to me, if not all contexts.

            Do you mean it is less like some particular idea or design of shooters, or do you mean it is less like some ideal of shooters, or do you mean that it is less demanding, or something else altogether?

    • Perjoss says:

      Started a new play through a couple of days ago after some messing around with configs and nvidia stuff so I could enable the gpu transcode stuff (im using SLI so, problems). I still cannot get it to look as good as when the game first came out, before that patch that disabled some ini settings. I love the game though, shame about the poor ending.

    • Michael Fogg says:

      Tried it a few times but quit each time because of boredom… the gameplay is just soooo meh to me.

    • LTK says:

      I got it from a sale very recently, and even though it was fun while it lasted, I regret not spending those five euros on something more worthwhile, like Spec Ops or Planescape: Torment.

    • Tally says:

      Yes. Finished my 3rd playthrough in Ultra Nightmare and it was terrific. I understand some people’s misgivings about it but within its ambitions its a great game. The gunplay is punchy and really fun (the new rebar gun is especially fun) and the art and characters are beautiful.

      One especially great way to play: Fists of Rage + Quad Damage + health regen powerup = sprinting decapitation punches of Authority Enforcers.

    • Anthile says:

      It’s a decent enough shooter if full of anticlimaxes. The Mad Max style vehicle sections are pretty awful, though. I really wish they would have gone… beyond thunderdome.

    • Yosharian says:

      I see that id employees have invaded this thread

    • GreatGreyBeast says:

      I finally got around to playing it a couple months ago. HATED it, because of the awful job they did with driving controls for M+KB, and put it away after a couple hours.

      Picked it up again last month after hooking my computer into the TV and getting a gamepad. Much better. Kindof grindy and very linear level design, but solid and enjoyable enough to keep me going. And then it got better as I went along – levels widened up a bit, got a pleasant mix of side quests, weapon variety is much better than Borderlands (especially with the Scorchers expansion, which I HIGHLY recommend), and I actually came to really love the driving mechanics, though enemy respawns gave me occasional flashbacks to Far Cry 2. There’s a solid foundation here for some modder to make an awesome kart racer.

      Ending let me down on sour note, though. Abrupt and unchallenging, and you only get the “BFG” at the very last level which it isn’t terribly useful for. Still, a good game well worth $15 or less, and which leaves lots of potential for a superior sequel.

  3. trjp says:

    Living proof that access to mega hardware doesn’t make-up for choosing a tired setting and some lazy gameplay eh?

    “Hey, let’s do a post-nuclear-war setting shooter with some slightly naff driving stuff because that’s not been done before much”

    I actually think Rage is OK but it’s a big mess of a thing where none of the bits are really as good as they could/should be – even the technical bits…

    It’s not Doom3 tho so we can be grateful for that, at least.

    • Jason Moyer says:

      “post-nuclear-war”

      What?

      While I’m thinking of it, other than Fallout, how many post-nuclear-war games are there really?

      • woodsey says:

        Metro and Stalker come to mind. Even if not in games particularly, it’s a pretty big thing in general if you consider books, TV and film also. That gives people fatigue. So if you’re not going to do anything particularly interesting with it, then you’re going to have a bad time.

        • Jason Moyer says:

          Stalker is post nuclear war? I wouldn’t even call it post-apocalyptic, since presumably everything outside the Zone is normal.

          • woodsey says:

            It may as well be. Rage isn’t either, technically, but it’s still got wastelands and mutants and oddball pockets of humanity. Same difference.

          • Baines says:

            STALKER is post nuclear incident, but Chernobyl itself isn’t even responsible for a lot of what happens in the Zone.

            The end result is a game that makes people think of Fallout though, and Fallout was post nuclear war.

            Though Rage always made me think more of Borderlands (which isn’t post nuclear war or post apocalyptic either).

      • HadToLogin says:

        Post-nuclear-war games: Wasteland. Metro, Krater, Fallen Earth.

        Nuclear-something in background: STALKER.

        And Borderlands easily could be Fallout on crack :) .

    • welverin says:

      To be nitpciky: it’s not post nuclear war, it’s post asteroid impact.

      p.s. I too am one of the people who liked the game, one of the many things that suffered from unmet high expectations and the binary it’s great/sucks world we live in.

    • Shooop says:

      The setting was fine I thought. The problem is I wanted to explore more of it, but the game was nothing but coridoors.

    • SmokinJoeWhite says:

      Rage isn’t “post nuclear war”, it’s post apocalyptic.

  4. f1x says:

    And I’m still one of those cursed users that cannot play because of texture popping and technical issues

    • mr.ioes says:

      I feel you bro ;(
      I really would like to play it, but all those workarounds available just don’t cut it.

      • f1x says:

        Well, my graphics cards seems to be one of those that won’t get the game to work properly no matter which custom setting, rageconfig file, I use

        believe me I’ve tried everything that is out there in the forums/internet

  5. brau says:

    Just wait for the out”RAGE” that people will have when they experience this.

    From the PDF:

    TYPICAL BUILD TIMES:
     Initial map loads: 20–60 minutes
     Load times after initial load: 1–3 minutes
     Build an asset mod (does not include any maps): 10–30 minutes
     Build a mod that includes one map about the size of Wellspring: 20–40 minutes

    Also… a 35 to 45 gig install!
    AND!

    From Shacknews: “Don’t expect your modding progress to be quick and painless, though. “Doing significant work will require patience, because internally we use a 300 core renderfarm for megatexture creation,” id’s John Carmack said on Twitter.” Hah. I guess, that’s why.

    Have fun!

    • Kaira- says:

      Well, that seems pretty abysmal. And when I say abysmal, I mean “who thought this would be a good idea?”

      • mrmalodor says:

        John Carmack, the father of FPS.

      • JP says:

        “Who thought this would be a good idea?”

        Someone who builds engines for a large studio that can afford to throw horsepower at problems that would cripple small teams.

        I’m really sad that Carmack’s career turned out this way, after he did so much to democratize game development with the Doom and Quake source releases.

        • Perjoss says:

          From listening to his keynotes (unless i totally misunderstood) it seems he’s really sad it turned out that way too. I get the impression he really regrets delving so deep into console development.

    • Petethegoat says:

      If this is similar to what they used to develop it, then suddenly it’s not surprising that it’s such a lacklustre game.

      • Forceflow says:

        *sigh*

        The fact that you need some major hardware to use the development tools does not make a technology invalid. For AAA development, buying some plenty-core-servers is peanuts.

    • Ernesto says:

      Apparently original development was done on a 300 core machine. If you want to develop with the same tools, you have to wait for your result. This is not surprising and I don’t understand your problem.

      • jrodman says:

        Well, 300 core cluster, which is probably like 37 computers or so.
        But yes I don’t have those either.

        • Ernesto says:

          Where does it say, that you need a 300-core cluster? You can run the tools on a normal PC and get the same result. The only difference is, that you have to wait longer for the result, obviously.

          • Mario Figueiredo says:

            To be fair, if any of these folks complaining about the speed, spend 4-7 hours encoding a 15 minute game video to youtube, I’ll hold it against them.

            But the argument here is that this engine seemingly forces modders to an unnecessary large amount of time wasted on rendering duties, when the results of this technology are less then stellar, Ernesto. And that’s a fair point.

  6. Kingmarzo says:

    Im probably in the minority but I really like Rage

    • dgz says:

      I like RAGE, too. The Scorchers DLC is pretty amazing. Railgun nom nom

      While I’d like better graphics, it’s the id gameplay that I love so much. Run and gun is actually possible in their games. Unmatched.

      Modding this will be pretty hard. Carmack said that 6 or so years ago.

      • RichardFairbrass says:

        The Railgun was indeed nice, but quite an odd weapon as its 3 functionalities had no relationship to eachother. It’s like they wanted to add 3 new weapons and just decided to bundle them all into one.

        The rebar launcher is very nice too, almost more of a railgun than the railgun itself. What a shame about the crazy reload time.

    • GenBanks says:

      Yeah, I don’t really understand the hate. I thought it was a fun game with great style/setting.
      Although I couldn’t get myself to play it all the way through until I was able to upgrade from my Radeon 5870 to a GTX 670. It’s only really worth it if the game can run on your PC.

      • SmokinJoeWhite says:

        Yeah, it’s a really strange game as far as just not running on some pc’s, ran fine on my radeon 4870, hated my cousins 5870… go figure.

        • SmokinJoeWhite says:

          Not to mention it ran even better on my laptop with a geforce 540m less than half the ram and a quater of the cpu power.

  7. iucounu says:

    Why are these hard-to-render textures so shitty to look at?

    • mrmalodor says:

      Because the trade-off of Carmack’s retarded system is long rendering times. To compensate, you have to render at a fugly resolution. But on the flip side, this technology will be viable for hi-res map creation in just 10-15 years! (LOL)

    • phelix says:

      Because, er, consoles.

      • iucounu says:

        Well, I bought this on PS3 for a fiver, so, yeah. Mainly got it so I could play co-op with a friend – we both had a spare afternoon – and feel like I want my fiver back.

    • pkt-zer0 says:

      AFAIK it’s just due to compression. So if you’re willing to spare the HDD space, you can have super-hi-res textures as well. Which wouldn’t fit on two DVDs (source textures were 1TB or something), which is why they’re not in the game. Carmack said it might be interesting to release a small location with high-res textures on Steam or something, so that could be cool.

      • dgz says:

        They will not release anything, though. At least that is what Carmack said. He lied that hi-res version don’t actually look that better. Heh, yeah…

      • lijenstina says:

        1 TB of data doesn’t mean much if the source format and size of the individual segments of textures are not specified.

  8. Triplanetary says:

    I will never “rage no more” about Rage. It’s like the game was doing everything in its power to piss me off. And it’s like John Carmack stopped learning about game design in the 90s. In fact, it’s like he’s forgotten important elements of game design since Doom 3. Doom 3 may be mediocre, but it never pissed me off. But Rage? Rage just pisses me off.

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m not losing any sleep over it. I picked it up for a couple bucks on Steam and promptly uninstalled it after trying it for a couple hours. No skin off my ass.

    EDIT: I mean, seriously, a 300-core renderfarm to render your shitty-looking “megatextures”? I’ve seen games developed on people’s desktop PCs that look better. I’m not being snarky; I really have. It’s not hard to make textures that look better than Rage.

  9. Petethegoat says:

    I wonder if someone will make a mod that adds in places where the jump button is useful. I played 6 or 7 hours, and I never found something I could jump over.

    • dgz says:

      Never heard of strafe and circle jumping, eh? It’s beyond useful if you know what you’re doing. Try jumping on ramps while sprinting.

      Sadly, there are invisible walls even high in the air…

  10. Beelzebud says:

    35GB for mod tools.
    300 cores recommended for decent performance
    1 hour to load a map the first time

    Everyone at id Software went insane, didn’t they?

    I say this seriously, because when you look at the blurry low-res mess that is most of Rage’s up close environments it just boggles the mind that they thought having really great looking cliffs that you can never touch, was that important.

    • Mario Figueiredo says:

      I remember Carmack laying out the reasons for all this. It’s essentially about looking into the future of gaming as far as as rendering capabilities are concerned.

      Seems to me Id is just moving into irrelevance with this nonsense. By the time we could render these textures at acceptable speed on a typical consumer computer, it’s quite possible that his engine will be just too obsolete on all other fields of game development to be of any significance to a developer.

      It was Rage, the game, that did annoy me though. Not so much Id silly forays into optimistic futurology. This is a company that I really wanted to remain relevant in the industry. But they released a bad game after having released another bad games years before. And the “bad” is revealing of how little culture the company seems to have embraced of modern FPS.

      I too have played since the days of Castle Wolfenstein and Doom. But have been able to adapt myself to the evolution of this genre. Apparently Carmack hasn’t. And that is a shame. A strong relevant Id would have been a benefit to us all.

      • Reapy says:

        Internet is full of technophobes. We have one mouth yelling about lets push hardware, lets use our pcs to full capacity, lets try something new, why are the AAA’s always doing the same thing over and over again.

        Then you have someone trying a radical different approach to engine tech, make a game engine that doesn’t look like crysis or unreal, and it’s all oh my god he is stupid what a jackass blah blah blah.

        Even if it failed, at least money was put into it and it was tried. Honestly I thought rage looked awesome, and different than anything out there, that is worth something. I won’t argue that iD has been sleeping with some modern game designs, but still, what amazing tech it is, at least appreciate someone putting an assload of money into trying something different, something I thought we all look for on RPS daily.

        • darkmouse20001 says:

          RAGE is one of the best looking games I’ve ever played – I was very impressed with the engine, and quite enjoyed the game.

    • Muzman says:

      Games are sold mostly on screenshots and videos these days so…yeah.

  11. BreadBitten says:

    Here’s hoping some kind soul finds the time and effort required to fix the menus for us at the mouse and keyboard brigade.

  12. Text_Fish says:

    From page 8 of the EULA:

    If You distribute or otherwise make available New Materials, You automatically grant to Bethesda Softworks the irrevocable, perpetual, royalty free, sublicensable right and license under all applicable copyrights and intellectual property rights laws to use, reproduce, modify, adapt, perform, display, distribute and otherwise exploit and/or dispose of the New Materials (or any part of the New Materials) in any way Bethesda Softworks, or its respective designee(s), sees fit. You also waive and agree never to assert against Bethesda Softworks or its affiliates, distributors or licensors any moral rights or similar rights, however designated, that You may have in or to any of the New Materials.

    • Zealuu says:

      That sounds awful and all that, but how does it compare to the EULAs of say, TESCS/GECK/CK? If they’re all the same, then I wouldn’t worry about Bethesda “otherwise exploiting” your mod, except for maybe including it as a design choice on their part in a subsequent game.

    • Citrus says:

      Apparently Text_Fish thought that mods were the properties of their creators, not the people who actually made the bloody game modders are modding.

      • zeroskill says:

        Well it isn’t. Mod’s you create shouldn’t be property of the creators of the original game. See Dota/Dota 2. Assets you created should be your assets, just as assets created by Bethesda/id should be Bethesda/id’s assets. It’s common sense.

        If it was true what you are saying, Dota would belong to Blizzard, which it, thank god, doesn’t.

  13. Zealuu says:

    Rage was okay, although I wonder why they put so much effort and marketing into disguising a fairly solid corridor shooter as an open world, post-apocalyptic racing game.

    As for this, I think the game itself is too closed in its design, the toolset far too late, and – by the looks of it – much too cumbersome to produce much of interest.

  14. db1331 says:

    I do not see id as the lead developer in games.

  15. subshell001 says:

    While Rage had its problems at launch, in its current state it is one of the best performing games in history as far as GPU performance goes.

    On a retina MacBook Pro under Boot Camp, I am able to play rage at full resolution (2880×1800) and get about 40-50fps. That is so spectacular- I was blown away by what I saw (looked fantastic at that HiDPI). Most games I need to put down to about 1900×1200 to get good performance.

    I thought Rage was fun. The multiplayer was/is the weakest link.

  16. Nettacki says:

    I thought it was a fun game. In terms of mod tools: better late than never I suppose.

  17. excel_excel says:

    I remember seeing that shitty screenshot for Rage showing the textures on the wall, and they had a pipe on it, that wasn’t sticking out, it was flat, part of the texture. No matter how high res that texture looks, it’ll still be a flat pipe drawn on a wall.

  18. jacobyoung says:

    Sorry for spam, check out my channel for a RAGE lets play!
    http://www.youtube.com/user/ThatIndieRogue?feature=mhee

  19. DickSocrates says:

    First never map will be E1M1 from Doom.

  20. tangoliber says:

    I really like Rage, and I have been waiting a while for this toolkit, even though I can’t mod myself.

    What I’d like to see:
    1) Some Doom style levels
    2) The aim-down-sights stripped out, and the hipfire accuracy tightened. I want a more accurate shotgun, and much more accurate pistol / assault rifle. The laser sight Authority Machine gun is already pretty nice though.

  21. Forceflow says:

    The tech behind RAGE is pretty impressive. I agree that they didn’t choose a great setting to demonstrate it (murky brown/gray is murky brown/gray in ANY resolution), but the idea of having textures as one unified stream where you pick samples from is excellent. iD (and Carmack, in particular) have also been pushing for driver extensions to support virtual texturing.

    In the end, this will lead to a unified representation of geometry/texturing/lighting parameters in a hierarchical structure (a SVO – Sparse Voxel Octree), which opens up a new can of great unique geometry/detail possibilities.

    I agree RAGE was a mediocre game at best, but I totally respect iD/Bethesda for releasing this development toolkit.

    And to all people complaining about how many cores you need to bake a megatexture at a reasonable speed: it’s a pre-process step, and AAA development has big money to throw around – why wouldn’t you do it? 200 cores are peanuts. You think you can compile (vis baking, texture baking, culling) a BF3 map on a measly consumer desktop?

    It’s most certainly no indicator on how mature or worthy certain tech is, and it’s most certainly not a bad idea to do things in this way.

    • othello says:

      The tech is pretty impressive. It is one of the best looking games on the xbox, for example, and will perform admirably on a heterogeneous chip like Ivy Bridge. It suffers from problems on the PC because it was designed to save on compute power through streaming, which is kind of the opposite of what modern discrete GPUs are good at.

      The whole sparse voxel octree thing is a bit far fetched, however. The memory requirements would be gigantic (yes, even with a sparse data set). Geometry really isn’t much of a problem in real time graphics since we can just throw more compute power at it.

    • Citrus says:

      “Murky brown/gray”.. might wanna upgrade that Riva TNT you have there champ.

      RAGE has more colors than Doom, Quake and all COD games combined.

      • dgz says:

        Well, they went crazy with post-processing. I have a couple of toggles (turn PP on/off, set gamma to 1 or 1.5) to fix that and it works pretty good. Most areas look way better without PP.

    • kavika says:

      > murky brown/gray is murky brown/gray in ANY resolution

      Did you ever play the Quake games…? That’s what ID does :)

  22. MeestaNob says:

    I don’t even know why they’re bothering, the game is dead and Megatexures killed it.

    • Forceflow says:

      Megatextures didn’t kill anything. Mediocre gameplay killed it.

      • wyrmsine says:

        Yeah, Rage is pretty much the current perfect example of mediocrity in gaming. Excellent art direction, lazy, uninspired game.

        EDIT: … and the one thing I was looking forward to was mod tools for it, but at 35gb, I just can’t be bothered.

      • mrmalodor says:

        Nope, megatextures killed it. Face the facts. Everyone expected a beautiful game thanks to this new technology. What they got was turds smeared all over the screen.

        • dgz says:

          Then “everyone” expected something that wasn’t promised. They’ve been saying UNIQUE textures, not extremely hi-res.

          Surely, you can’t be that blinded by hate to deny that no other game has such level of texture/surface/decal variety. And runs with twice the framerate of every other good looking FPS out there.

          • jrodman says:

            I think it’s fair to say when game makers say

            “Blah blah blah SHINYTHING(TM) blah blah SHINYTHING. blah blah blah blah blah SHINYTHING(TM).”

            for a good year or two about some graphics tech, that people can excused for thinking that SHINYTHING is supposed to look awesome. And when it turns out to be full of issues and not look very good there’s going to be some sort of backlash. And that backlash is deserved.

            You don’t *have* to stump around your “new tech omg” as a hype building technique. If you choose to do so for something that turns out to not look good, then you are just reaping what you sow.

            That said, I personally think *fallout* from the tech (shit not working on AMD cards etc) is more to blame for any sales problems than than the way it looked once it was working. But I think the biggest issue was just being a run of hte mill shooter in an overly crowded field.

          • Beelzebud says:

            It’s just not true that all textures in the game are UNIQUE. Look around at the first town you visit closely, and you can find repeating textures all over the place. The trade-off wasn’t worth it.

            You get beautiful vistas that you can never reach, and everything in front of you looks like Quake 2 era textures, or worse in some cases. The myth that no texture repeats is just that.

  23. Xzi says:

    You needed a 300-core renderfarm to make a game as ugly as RAGE?

  24. wodin says:

    I thought the animations where great and the game good..not excellent..but good.

  25. Arglebargle says:

    Does this still absolutely suck for AMD video cards? I’ve ignored it, even at rock bottom prices, because the word was performance was still abysmal.

    • Xzi says:

      Nah, that was fixed quite a while ago. So no performance issues, but the real question you should be asking is if the game is actually worth playing. And to that, I’d say no. Except for having far too many noticeably low-res textures, it’s just your run-of-the-mill shooter. So you might as well play Borderlands 2 or Far Cry 3 instead.

  26. Engonge says:

    The world will be a better place when carmack stops shoving 60 fps down our throats.

    • Nettacki says:

      Wait, you’re AGAINST 60 fps for every game ever?

      • mrmalodor says:

        Tell me, what good is 60 FPS to anyone if the trade-off is ugly textures?

        • dgz says:

          I’d trade 120 FPS for ugly textures any day, you console twat.

          Ever heard of this thing that makes gamers play the fucking games? It’s called gameplay.

          • MarcP says:

            Blaming the 60 FPS focus or using it as an excuse for ugly textures is silly either way. There’s no shortage of great looking games running at 60 FPS on your average $1000 gaming rig, it doesn’t have to be one or the other.

  27. mseifullah says:

    I’m sure there were some significant achievements made from all in the R&D that went into idTech 5 — specifically the texturing features — but I also believe that idTech 5 just wasn’t ready for prime time.

    When you look at the latest Crytek engine game with its hi-fidelity textures, amazing lighting, and real time map editing; or Unreal Engine 3 & 4 with it’s overall versatility and scalability, it becomes apparent that whatever the ultimate advantages or rendering break-throughs that idTech 5 enabled, it didn’t show (well) in the final product.

    I’ve been going to Quakecon every year for the last 10 years and id Software has always had my unwavering support. So that’s why it breaks my heart to admit that Rage neither looked or played impressively, as compared to other games that came out before and around the same time as Rage. Crysis 2 looked better, and arguably played better, than Rage.

    I know one advantage that was touted in lots of interviews was that the entire game would be uniquely textured — no more tiled textures. But you know what? I barely, if at all, see tiled textures in big production games nowadays. Yeah, they’re probably there, but they’re hidden extremely well. And the textures that I do see are usually are very sharp and detailed. But because the textures in Rage were so lo-res, the fact that they were all unique did nothing. Rage had some down-right beautiful vistas, and it looked pretty stellar — until you got closer to things.

    So, couple the lack of visual fidelity with the extremely late and unreasonably high modding requirements, and this “tool-kit” is dead on arrival for all but the most adventurous of people.

    Edit: You know, if id Software had said upfront after Rage’s release that “Our game-world required an in-house 300 core render farm to get things done in a reasonable amount of time” I don’t think people would have been asking for mod tools anymore. As it stands now, it’s just late and frustrating.

    • soldant says:

      Tiled textures are everywhere. Look at any wall, floor, or other piece of level geometry, you’ll notice them. You don’t notice them not because they’re well hidden (they’re not) but because they’re so totally inconsequential that you don’t pay any attention. The walls of my room might as well be a tiled texture for all the difference it would make. There are marks on the wall and subtle variations in paint, but when I’m in here I don’t notice them until I stop to look.

      Rage’s non-repeating terrain textures looked great when you stopped and stared at them… but I didn’t pay any attention to them because I was playing a game, and when they’re hurtling past while I’m driving a crappy vehicle I’m not going to notice them. What I did notice was the abysmal detail on things like notice boards or posters, which aren’t inconsequential and shouldn’t be so poorly done.

    • dgz says:

      “Edit: You know, if id Software had said upfront after Rage’s release that “Our game-world required an in-house 300 core render farm to get things done in a reasonable amount of time” I don’t think people would have been asking for mod tools anymore. As it stands now, it’s just late and frustrating.”

      If really attended every QuakeCon for the past 10 years, you should’ve heard Carmack saying that for the last 5 years during his keynotes. Just saying.

      • mseifullah says:

        I attended all the keynotes, and while he did mention that there were some hefty machines doing some pre-bake work, he never mentioned — to the best of my memory — that they were using a render farm or that it would take an extraordinary amount of time to make maps.

        I’ve just spent the last 40 minutes or so trying to dig through the Quakecon keynotes of previous years to find the clip of me asking John, during the Q &A portion of the keynote in 2011, about whether map making in Rage versus Doom 3 was actually a step backwards rather than a step forward. I didn’t find it yet, but you’re right in that he has said at various points, that making new content for Rage was basically going to be a non-starter because of the complexity of everything:

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zgYG-_ha28#t=1h23m10s

  28. killmachine says:

    one of the reasons i bought rage was the editor. i waited for the editor. now i’m getting it. just about 30 gigs ahead to download. i’m curious.

    • Cytrom says:

      I’ve played arund with the megatexture tech way back in enemy territory quake wars, and i’ve found it tó be an extremely inefficient solution that’s just not gonna work. The long and ultimately unfruitful developement of Rage just reassured me in what i’ve known years prior it’s release. there is nothing exciting in id tech 5, just an excrutiatingly overcomlicated workflow, ridiculous install size, and completely static game world that is hard to modify or iterate, with very little benefits.

  29. Shooop says:

    Textures that require a render farm to make unless you load them in extremely low resolution? Why would anyone think for a moment that would be a good idea for a game?

    It would be wonderful for movies, but games? What is wrong with Carmac?

    • Robbert says:

      How it it a bad idea? They have a huge server farm that makes working with them relatively painless. Obviously they didn’t just drop megatextures because it makes modding harder.

      • Cytrom says:

        If a game is hard to mod (with the dev toolkit) then the engine is hard to develope with, because modding IS game developement. Its no accident that nobody licensed id tech 5 for their games, not even bethesda and its sub studios.

        • El_Emmental says:

          Not exactly, depending on the SDK modding might not have access to “deeper” elements of the game/engine.

          Bethesda (Zenimax) is not trying to license id Tech 5 because it would require a lot more developers to adapt it for external development and try to compete with the Unreal Engine (and the others, Cry Engine, Unity, etc), when the video game industry isn’t really sure how it’s going to evolve in the next 5 years.

  30. Robbert says:

    I think it’s pretty sad how everyone begged for modding tools when it came out and iD was like “No, it requires tons of space, RAM and CPU power. You wouldn’t like it.” and now they finally caved and released these completely free and now every second comment is “I don’t like it, it requires too much space/RAM/CPU power. iD sucks. They ignore their community, etc etc”

    • Shadowcat says:

      Exactly what I was about to post. More evidence that people are idiots.

      That said, the comments might have been less stupid in general if all the articles announcing the release and requirements of these tools had prefixed them with the relevant history — no doubt there are plenty of people who never saw the original discussions.

    • Cytrom says:

      so you are saying that selling (and buying) shit, is just fine, as long as you are told beforehand that its shit. That still doesn’t change the fact that its shit, so people have every right to call it what it is.

      • Mario Figueiredo says:

        No. He’s saying that it’s sad because they complained there were no creation tools, were told these would require a whole lot of computer resources and when those tools were made available, people complained they required a lot of computer resources.

        Of course, he’s got no evidence that the same people complaining then are the same people complaining now, so his point is really mute. He’s just looking at the whole and failing to realize it’s made of parts.

        • jrodman says:

          My low-quality comment is that points that are no longer worth pursuing because they have been obviated are “moot”. Things that are “mute” cannot speak (or perhaps have had their volume/attenuation set to 0). Unless we’re anthropomorphizing abstractions, they can’t really ever speak in the first place.

          Pedantry function powering down.

  31. Numerical says:

    No one’s probably gonna read this and I’m a bit late to this comment section, but despite al lthe shortcomings of RAGE and difficulties I had just getting it to run, once I did I enjoyed the atmosphere quite a bit. The megatexture thing is a bit uncalled for since honestly large muddy tetures are no better than crisp smaller tiled textures, at least when done in an effective manner.

    I would be tempted to take a look at this toolkit but my computer wouldn’t handle it well. I do hope that maybe some intrepid modders are able to make some new content because this game could use some. I haven’t played the DLC so I don’t know for sure how much content it adds, though. Would be nice to broaden the map a bit, add some new weapons, enemies, towns and maybe tweak that ending. As with most mods it would probably take a while and be a too little too late, hell the game will be two years old in October.

  32. jacobyoung says:

    Hey guys check out my ongoing lets play of RAGE on YouTube!
    http://www.youtube.com/user/ThatIndieRogue?feature=mhee

  33. kupofatu says:

    until I looked at the check 4 $7584, I didnt believe that…my… mom in-law had been realey erning money in there spare time from there pretty old laptop.. there uncles cousin has done this for less than twenty months and by now cleared the morgage on their place and purchased a top of the range Peugeot 205 GTi. we looked here, http://www.Cloud65.com

  34. kavika says:

    Sooooo I guess people don’t remember how long it took to do a vis/lighting pass back in the Quake 1 days? Comparable at least – probably on the same order of magnitude.

    You know what would be cool is if the community created a distributed computing process for this. Not sure how feasible it is, but might be worth trying :)

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