What book are you reading? [Archive] - Page 3 - The Rock, Paper, Shotgun Forums

Snargelfargen

01-02-2012, 01:37 AM

Finished 11.22.63, I'll admit it, first time in a long while, probably since reading Maya Angelou in college that I got all damp-eyed at the end of a book. It's a superbly crafted story. In the afterward, King notes some of his research overlapped with another book "Under the Dome" - so I looked it up as well. Haven't heard anything about it except that it's a much more lengthy story, rivaling "The Stand" in terms of scope. I picked an epub version and have gotten about 20 pages in. So far so good. No wiki spoilers this time, promise.

Sounds great. I've always liked King's books just because they tend to have a pretty strong emotional and nostalgic undercurrent running through them. He seems like a fantasy/sci-fi writer who just happens to use horror well.

I was gifted 1Q84 for christmas, and I've just gotten to reading it. It started off as a neat mystery novel, but the story takes a strange turn for the icky halfway through. I'm pretty conflicted. I can't find a way to add spoilers, so just jump to the next post if you don't want to know.

HERE BE SPOILERS!

One of the two protagonists ends up having sex with an underage girl. I'm certainly no prude, and this alone would be fine since it serves the purposes of the story, but the circumstances surrounding the event are all engineered to make the protagonist and the reader rationalize that this was an ok thing to do. The man is (magically?) paralyzed. The girl initiates the sex. It is part of some sort of mystical ceremony. The girl has no pubic hair and in general, is presented as being very young, almost in a fetishistic way, yet her stated age is 17. It's like reading a fanfic, except the execution is much better.

To clarify, I don't have a problem with the protagonist doing a "bad thing", but I feel like Murakami is manipulating the reader into sympathizing with the protagonist in a dishonest way by adding all these details. Why won't he come out and say that his character is a perv and just move on?
So yeah, not sure how I feel about the book so far. Maybe this will make more sense as I get deeper into it. I hope.

Serenegoose

01-02-2012, 10:53 AM

Theblazeuk

01-02-2012, 11:43 AM

I read Perdido Street Station recently after years of trying to get hold of it - prior to that I'd only managed to find 'Un-London'. Both were really good, though Perdido has a rather...frustrating...end. But one that is obviously intended and fits well enough. I really enjoyed the creativity at work in exploring and fleshing out some rather familiar concepts, as well as the introduction of some completely new ones.

So yeah, be checking out more of Meiville. I have a compulsion to try and read things in publishing order though so embassytown is a ways off :)

Althea

01-02-2012, 12:11 PM

It's Un Lun Dun ;)

Serenegoose

01-02-2012, 12:20 PM

It's Un Lun Dun ;) Indeed, and it was a coin toss between whether I got it or Best Served Cold - but I've had my eye on one for a bit longer and I felt its time has come - Un Lun Dun is next on the list, however.

Althea

01-02-2012, 12:33 PM

I've got Un Lun Dun and Kraken sat on my shelves. As cool as I think Miéville is, and as much as I'm on the same political wing as him, I've still not gotten around to reading him.

Still slogging my way through The Goblin Corps by Ari Marmell, sadly.

Shane

01-02-2012, 03:04 PM

I've been thinking of getting The Goblin Corps, how is it?

Kraken is perhaps Mieville's best work date. I think his trio of Bas Lag novels had a lot of potential but the baldy wasted that by trying too hard to impress. Perdido Street Station was a clusterfuck with perhaps the stupidest ending I've seen, The Iron Council felt like a commie propaganda piece (don't get me wrong, I'm leftist myself but I don't like books where any religious or political ideology is romanticized) though it did manage to make me care about the story and the awesome ending more than made up for Perdido's.

Still, I'd heartily recommend them. The world building is very good, Mieville is able to paint a vivid picture of the deep socio-poitical environment of his settings, the characters feel realistic and fleshed-out.

Althea

01-02-2012, 03:08 PM

I've been thinking of getting The Goblin Corps, how is it?
Repetitive, violent and sweary with a great cast of characters, whilst the story is told via over-long chapters.

It's good, don't get me wrong, but it's not perfect.

Nalano

01-02-2012, 05:00 PM

Have you considered that 17 isn't underage everywhere

Legally, sure, but to somebody in California, it doesn't matter what they say in Spain; that shit is ew.

That being said, if you wanna talk sympathetic protagonists who also happen to be convicted of statutory rape, there's always One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

Snargelfargen

01-02-2012, 08:50 PM

Have you considered that 17 isn't underage everywhere and that your conclusion that you're being manipulated into sympathising with the protagonist is erroneous and based on a faulty premise? (that the author thinks it is a: illegal and b: immoral, and is therefore trying to skew your opinion to ignore that, when in actuality it could be perfectly legal where the author is, and legality and morality do not share complete overlap to begin with)

The girl is also described as never having had her period and not having any pubic hair (specifically hairless, not shaved), so stating her age as 17 is at best, disingenuous, when those are the characteristics of someone much, much younger. The man is in his mid-thirties, so legality aside, it is a bizarre and uncomfortable relationship.
Edit: If such a relationship was morally and legally ok in Japan, then why would the author go to such ridiculous lengths to make the male passive? Why couldn't they have a mystic sex ceremony, or better yet, unmystical normal sex where the male was an active participant instead of paralysed and partially unconscious? It's details like that, that make me think the author is uncomfortable with his own subject matter.

That said, I just remembered that there is a particular rare chromosome combination that results in a completely hairless body and a very stereotypically "beautiful" female appearance. If I remember correctly (psych class was a long time ago), that chromosome combo is also technically male, and wouldn't undergo menstruation. Hmm, it would be kind of cool of that is the case, and it might also explain the character's dyslexia, as most abnormal chromosome combinations also cause mental disabilities. The author hasn't shown that this is what he had in mind though, so I am just guessing at this point.

A friend of mine also mentioned that Murakami might be playing with gender roles, since the male protagonist is completely passive and exhibits a lot of feminine traits.
Ok, I have to admit this is interesting stuff even if I don't like the book. Back to reading!

That being said, if you wanna talk sympathetic protagonists who also happen to be convicted of statutory rape, there's always One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

I haven't read this. Is it worth reading as someone who liked the movie?

Nalano

01-02-2012, 09:12 PM

I haven't read this. Is it worth reading as someone who liked the movie?

There's like three movies in total that are arguably as good as the books they're based off of.

So, yes. YES! ffs, read it.

Lukasz

02-02-2012, 12:04 AM

only very few places on this planet, or even in USA have age of consent at 18. yet hollywood raised us to think differently.
and it is rare but not unheard of boy or girl not actually hitting their puberty late into teen years or even adulthood. various things may cause that but if she was on medication her whole life she might not ever had a proper period and her secondary sexual traits never properly developed sans the young look.

db1331

02-02-2012, 12:17 PM

Dracula came loaded on my Nook I got last month. I just started it a couple of days ago. I'm 100-some pages in, really liking it so far.

squirrel

05-02-2012, 07:51 AM

Recently noticed a Chinese novel I read about fifteen years ago, I translate its title as "Strange Phenomena Witnessed With The Two Decades". It is one of the Four Late Ching Social Criticizing Novels. As the genre name suggests, the novel was to criticize the late Ching society in all aspects. The first historic event covered in this novel was in chapter 14 out of 108, the Sino-French War (1884-85), about a Chinese naval warship captain who, under warning of incoming enemy vessel, ordered the whole crew to abandon the ship before even seeing the smoke of that enemy warship. Of course that turned out to be a right warning, but the fact a military officer deserted his post in such manner pretty much tells you much how corrupt the Ching military was during that time. This timing also gives you a brief idea of the time zone this novel covers. I recommend this novel because this book strikingly resemble the nowadays Chinese society we are living in. The protagonist told the story in first person, but had his name covered, and was known as "One Survivor Among Nine Deaths". As his father passed away, he had to leave his home town with his mother to make living. Yet he witnessed more than enough how corrupt the society was and recorded as many as he could. This novel is of course fictional, but mostly inspired by true event, including the little war story mentioned above.

You may read this book online here (http://www.millionbook.net/gd/w/wuyanren/esnmdzgxz/index.html). Dont mind about the copyright because it has long expired.

If you find it difficult to follow without some basic knowledge of modern Chinese history, I recommend this textbook, The Rise of Modern China by Dr. Hsu C. Y. It covers history of China since the Ching dynasty (i.e. since 1644) I was told that this is a very popular textbook in America's colleges for introductory courses in modern Chinese History, the kind of free elective courses one would take aside from major courses. It was supposed that this book would be updated periodically so that the latest development of China would be included. Unfortunately Dr. Hsu died a few years ago so the latest edition is already the last edition. Mine is not the last one.

BTW, talking about novel, currently I am reading The Fifth Witness by Michael Connelly. The book is not exactly new but it was out within last year. The legendary criminal defense lawyer Micky Haller in L.A. switched his main business to foreclosure defense since most criminals could not afford to hire lawyer like him, and went to public defenders instead. While Micky thought this would be all his new business he was going to excel in, one of his client, Lisa Trammel, was charged of murdering her banker Mitchell Bondurant. The suspect motive was too obvious to argue: Mr. Bondurant was to foreclose Lisa's mortgaged home, and Lisa was fighting to resist it. Very naturally Lisa immediately appointed Micky as his defense attorney. Micky's strategy was to uncover some of dirty business Bondurant had been doing before being murdered. Of course Micky was no social fighter. All he hoped to achieve was a criminal motive of someone else to murder the victim so that a reasonable doubt could be established for his client. It was almost immediately that he and his associate found out Bondurant was in financial trouble in real estate investment and he himself might have five mortgaged properties being foreclosed. I've read Part 1, containing 10 chapters.

I looked forward to this novel for some good reasons. I am recently very fond of financial thrillers. Japan happens to produce tons of them. Economic downturn for two decades has made financial crisis such a hot topic for Japanese, I guess. Last month I've read 4 such novels and I just couldn't have enough. Yet I cannot read Japanese so I have to rely on translation. This novel is a crime and legal thriller in nature, but the main theme is about financial crime, which is about to be uncovered by violent crime. Interestingly, Bondurant was not Lisa's original banker. Bondurant's WestLand Financial bought the loan from Lisa's original mortgage bank, of which name was not yet mentioned in Part 1, probably since it is not relevant in the novel anymore. This kind of financial transaction is prevailing in many economy, even in China. They occurred when market value of collateral fall substantially that repayment is in doubt. Some financial institutes may buy those loan in discount and estimate that an amount more than one paid for the purchase could be made. I read from news media that in China, such transactions often involve western banking powers. Morgan Stanley is definitely a major player, but I can't name the others since they are unfamiliar names to me. Anyway those transactions in China involve loan with enterprises as debtors. I didnt read that personnel loans are also being transferred, maybe too difficult to evaluate. This novel, however, is the first source I read to realize that transfers of personal loans have become common place in western economies, and I am shocked to realize how this ruins individual livings. But of course, here come's another issue. Given Lisa's original banker didnt sell her loan, would her property not be foreclosed? Her husband ran away, and her income as a teacher alone was not enough for the montgage payments, not to mention that she later lost her job.

BTW, even this is not commented in the Part 1 of the novel, I dont think Micky lost his businesses in criminal defense just because economic downturn dry up everything as Micky put it. It is for the nature Micky always look for the easy score that he lost his business. As he himself commented, that crime rate hadn't fallen. In fact, how can you expect the crime rate not to rise in the midst of economic recession? Problem is, Micky tried his best to stay away from gangster groups, where the real money is. The closest he could get is a illicient motor racing group called Saint Road something I read about in the first book in the series, The Lincoln Lawyer. Of course, you can imagine that gangsters' money will never be easy money. However, if a lawyer practising criminal law could not take the risk of entering a gold mine, how could one complain about economic outlook?

mrchinchin25

05-02-2012, 10:46 AM

In recent months, I've read

The Profession (Steven Pressfield) -

Love his writing style. A book about professional mercs in the near future.

The Heroes (Joe Abercombie) -

Easily becoming one of my favourite authors - shame I've read all his books now. Very good novel about a battle taking place over a few days, with POVs from both sides.

Starship Troopers (Robert Heinlein) -

I've been meaning to read this for some time. Good book, very different to the film. Reminds me of Haldemans
Forever War (or is that the other way round, was Troopers written first??)

Dyson Sphere (Pellegrino / Zebrowski) -

I'm not a Star Trek fan, but I am a fiend for Dyson Spheres. Didn't enjoy this too much, felt it was too short, and glossed over any real 'fun' exploration that could have been had. Any other good 'Sphere books out there? (I've done the Ringworlds and Judas Unchained ones)

Now reading - Revelation Space (Alastair Reynolds). A hard sci-fi series I'm told, just 10% in at the mo, quite liking it so far.

Cable

05-02-2012, 11:12 AM

I really enjoyed starship troopers too, but they are very different. Not only in that the movie is "dumb" (yet enjoyable) whereas the book obviously has a lot of thought behind it but just the difference between the foot soldiers in the movie who are pretty much walking tanks with nukes in the book.

Rakysh

05-02-2012, 11:32 AM

Not only in that the movie is "dumb" (yet enjoyable)
I sort of think you might have missed the point of the film there. It's quite a clever skewering of fascism and US imperialism, and remarkably prescient regarding the post-9/11 word.

Cable

05-02-2012, 11:45 AM

Fair enough, i did get some of that but I may have missed it on a higher level

Vexing Vision

05-02-2012, 03:11 PM

The Heroes (Joe Abercombie) -
Easily becoming one of my favourite authors - shame I've read all his books now. Very good novel about a battle taking place over a few days, with POVs from both sides.

Just let me chime in for the love of Abercrombie - while I thought that The Heroes was his weakest book so far, I still found it immensely enjoyable, and his next books are bought blindly.

His next one is supposed to hit around Q4 this year, and I can't wait for it.

Serenegoose

05-02-2012, 04:31 PM

I'm about halfway through Best Served Cold by Joe Abercrombie, and just finished the first of the Hunger Games books.

After this, I think The City and The City by China Mieville and Catching Fire, the second hunger games book.

Althea

05-02-2012, 04:32 PM

Catching Fire, the second hunger games book.
Which is the second best, and second worst one.

Mockingjay is just utter bollocks.

Serenegoose

05-02-2012, 04:34 PM

Which is the second best, and second worst one.

Mockingjay is just utter bollocks.

I just don't even want to know. I'm still really, really quite upset about Rue :( I don't think that'd have happened if I went in with preconceptions.

Althea

05-02-2012, 04:36 PM

True. Sorry :p

Fiyenyaa

05-02-2012, 04:55 PM

On my "to read" shelf;
- Eisenhorn Trilogy (Dan Abnett)
- Best Served Cold (Joe Abercrombie)
- The Heroes (Joe Abercrombie)
- The Travels of Ibn Battutah (Tim Mackintosh-Smith)
- Revelation Space (Alastair Reynolds)
- The Tent, The Bucket and Me (Emma Kennedy)

Danny252

05-02-2012, 08:01 PM

Currently on Magician (R E Feist). It's the first time I've decided to read a book again - I read a lot of Fiest when I was young(er), but a few months back I saw the books again and suspected I was probably too young to have taken in everything. Being about halfway through the book, I think I was right in my thinking; there's bits I remember very well, some where I can't recall who the characters are, and parts I thought were in entirely different books!

westyfield

05-02-2012, 08:14 PM

Althea

05-02-2012, 08:16 PM

Are the Hunger Games books worth reading as an adult? They're children's books, right? Would it be like reading Harry Potter (which I found childish when I was nine) or like reading Mortal Engines (which will remain awesome for all time)? Kinda interested in them as the film's coming out soon.
No, they're Young Adult books.

The first should definitely be read - it's a clever mix between 1984 and Battle Royale. The second is fairly similar to the first, but shaken up a bit, and the third is... oh dear. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but it's not like the first two.

westyfield

06-02-2012, 12:05 AM

No, they're Young Adult books.

The first should definitely be read - it's a clever mix between 1984 and Battle Royale. The second is fairly similar to the first, but shaken up a bit, and the third is... oh dear. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but it's not like the first two.

Oh excellent, I'll give them a read then. Thanks!

db1331

06-02-2012, 01:50 PM

I read Shadow Divers last year and have been recommending it to everyone. It's a true story about some guys who discover and eventually identify the wreck of a WWII U-boat about 60 miles off the coast of NJ. It all starts when an old fisherman divulges info on his favorite fishing hole to a salvage diver. It's a deep water wreck, and has a strange profile on his fish finder, not like any wreck he's ever seen. The wreck sits at just about the limit of what a diver of that time could reach, so it's extremely dangerous. At first they don't know what the hell it is, but eventually someone brings up a dinner plate with a swastika on the bottom, and the pieces start to fall into place. They spend years searching the wreck, eventually swimming inside among the remains of the crew, trying to find something with an identifying number on it, all the while trying to keep it's location a secret from rival divers. A few people lost their lives diving it, and the obsession cost another his marriage.

The most interesting part of the book was probably after the eventual identification of the U-boat. They are able to look up the members of the crew of the ship, and travel to Germany and meet with their families and tell them what ultimately became of their loved ones. One old grandmother was just a teen when her fiance left on the U-boat, and they were to be married when he returned. She never knew what happened to him all those years. They even got an interview with a man who was just a boy at the time, but vividly remembered being on the ship the day it left to say goodbye to his older brother.

And of course, there are lots of great pictures of the wreck and the items they found, from torpedoes to a knife with a crewman's name engraved on the handle. I HIGHLY recommend reading it. It starts out like a great adventure book, and ends with some interesting perspective from the families on the other side of the war.

groovychainsaw

06-02-2012, 04:12 PM

A new train commute and an e-reader has revived my time available for reading. I continue to get through SF/Fantasy 'classics'. In the last 2 months, I've completed the following (with one/two-line reviews!):

The Sword of Shannara, Terry Brooks - So similar to Lord of the Rings in the early stages I'm surprised they didn't sue :-). Decidedly average, not sure if I should bother continuing the series - does it improve?

The Stars My Destination, Alfred Bester - Surprisngly modern and dark for a 1950s story out the magazines, the most anti-hero type I've ever come across in sci-fi - he maims, tortures and kills to get his revenge, wrecking himself in the process (there's some fantastically inventive torture near the end that's pretty shocking even now - I can't imagine what it would have been like in the 50s). It is a quality revenge story. It reminded me of oldboy in it's protaganist's fixation on destruction. Surprisingly good. I think it could make for a fantastic sci-fi revenge film if it was ever adapted.

Downbelow station - C J cherryh - A less famous book, but a Hugo-winning novel from 1982. Moderately hard sci-fi about civil war in space, all revolving around one space station. Think a little like battlestar galactica, a little babylon 5. Good story, but takes itself maybe a bit too seriously.

The Forever war - A slightly grittier take on Starship troopers, with the excellent central conceit of relativistic travel in an interstellar war meaning that your soldiers you send away don't return to earth for several hundred years, arrive in battle to face a foe who's had many years more weapons development, and return home to an entirely different society. Really good anti-war novel, obviously influenced by Vietnam etc. Greatly enjoyed this, good training/battle scenes balanced with the social concepts of soldiers reintegrating with society after going through those experiences :-)

And finally, about 10 pages away from finishing Roadside Picnic, Boris and Arkady Strugatsky's famous sci-fi Novella about 'Stalkers' going into the 'forbidden zone'. Which obviously, is the inspiration behind the stalker games (throwing bolts to detect 'anomalies' is straight out of the book). A lot more weird and Russian than the games, naturally, with no shooting or bad guys, a lot is based around the mental health of the stalkers who keep going back to the zone. I feel a straight adaptation of the book would make a fascinating exploration game on its own, with truly bizarre environmental encounters in the zone. Quite quirky and bizarre, but certainly doesn't feel like any western sci-fi I've read, definitely worth trying.

Danny252

07-02-2012, 12:07 AM

I've recently instituted what I have deemed the "Kitchen Book" - the idea being that I'll permanently keep a book in the kitchen somewhere, so I can pass time waiting for my cuppa to brew/ignore my retarded flatmates arguing over Big Brother whilst cooking my dinner.

I grabbed The Salmon of Doubt off my bookshelf (a collection of unpublished material that Douglas Adams was working on at the time of his death). It's quite a nice choice for the Kitchen Book - most of the excerpts are pretty short and suitably timed to go with tea-making. The only issue I've found is that I'm blasting through it, due to my completely non-obvious addiction to tea.

I've not made a cuppa in half an hour, I'd better rectify that with another few pages of reading...

Shane

07-02-2012, 04:09 AM

The Red Market: about the trade of human organs, bones, children and other stuff. Kind of meh.

The Fifth Mountain: Second of Coelho's works that I read (first being The Winner Stands Alone), 'twas kind of shitty.

Reading The Gobline Corps now. Everything about the book is mundan and simplistic whether it's the dialogue or the characters. It seems Ari Marmell thinks that the bad-dudes'-perspective gimmick will be enough to carry the book forward. It doesn't feel that different from the generic fantasy stuff other than the fact that the characters eat and rape people after every dozen pages as if to remind readers that this one's different.
I did manage to grudgingly chortle at some of the lines though.

DeekyFun

07-02-2012, 07:37 AM

The Sword of Shannara, Terry Brooks - So similar to Lord of the Rings in the early stages I'm surprised they didn't sue :-). Decidedly average, not sure if I should bother continuing the series - does it improve?

I enjoyed the Shannara books. There's quite a lot of three-to-four book long series set in that World, and they are quite similar, so if Sword didn't grip you, then possibly not worth bothering with the others. There is quite a bit of similarity to LotR, at the start, but with the difference that Brooks kills off his characters with a bit more haste, and to me, the World feels a little bit more dangerous.

groovychainsaw

07-02-2012, 12:44 PM

@Deekyfun
I'm probably being a little bit harsh, The Sword of Shannara got better towards the end, once it had decided to go off the lord of the rings plot into something a bit different. But there was a still a lot that nearly made me give up. The first half of the book has two boys being chased by ghostly black-clad hunters (nazgul!) across the wilderness whilst being helped by a combination of ranger and wizard, then a prince/hunter. Finally they get to a town and a 'fellowship' is arranged of dwarves, elves, hunter, prince along with a plan. Then they go through some mines, which doesn't go well, due to the goblins. It starts to change its focus a bit then and moves away from Tolkien's plot, but there's still an epic siege (helms deep) whilst a small band sneak into the bad guy's realm (Mordor).

I particularly loved the token effort to make the dwarves seem not like Tolkien's, too, by making them behave exactly the same as LOTR's dwarves, but they're claustrophobic and afraid of mines!

Having said all that, I stuck with it and it differentiated itself a bit better later on. One or two interesting encounters suggest more world outside, including an attack by a war-robot(?) in an abandoned factory, which is glossed over quickly and is tonally a bit odd, consistent with some history as it has been introduced, but not surprising the characters as much as it probably should? This sort of thing suggests the world has changed a lot and there's more history/depth to be had. A bit more work on those elements rather than the lord of the rings-copying plot might have lifted it. I guess I just got frustrated by guessing what was going to happen based on lord of the rings and being proved right more often than not.

I'm probably a lot harsher on fantasy for being unoriginal than sci-fi, maybe that's because sci-fi has a larger space to play in and attracts wilder/more allegorical ideas whereas fantasy is often stuck in tolkien's world, either consciously or subconsciously.

Here's a question for the crowd - what fantasy books/series manage to go off Tolkien-style fantasy into something a bit different (And I've read The book of the new sun by Gene Wolfe, which I guess is the obvious one, and is brilliant!). I'm running out of books at my current rate of reading, so all help gratefully received :-)

Serenegoose

07-02-2012, 12:53 PM

Read anything by Brandon Sanderson - I've not seen anything of his that fits the LOTR tropes at all, and his magic systems are a lot of fun to read and make for great action scenes.

Shane

07-02-2012, 12:55 PM

what fantasy books/series manage to go off Tolkien-style fantasy into something a bit different?

Andrzej Sapkowski for one.

DeekyFun

07-02-2012, 01:12 PM

@Groovychainsaw
It certainly sticks to an long worn and established template (actually maybe moreso than I realised), but I think there are ways it differs. It's been ages since I've read them, but I remember enjoying the explanation of where these species (the dwarves, elves etc.) came from, and the idea that the fantasy setting is the result of the collapse of a more futuristic World. Some of the characters in later novels are more interesting than just being Tolkien Tropes, but I will admit there are definate cases where the characters are similar, both to LotR's and also to characters in other shanara novels.

It may be bad to admit it, but perhaps part of the reason is the slightly pulpy way it works - I actually think it's a lot more fun to read than LotR and uses hooks and devices more similar to thriller novels etc. It's not exactly high-brow reasoning I guess!

Feldspar

07-02-2012, 01:23 PM

Here's a question for the crowd - what fantasy books/series manage to go off Tolkien-style fantasy into something a bit different (And I've read The book of the new sun by Gene Wolfe, which I guess is the obvious one, and is brilliant!). I'm running out of books at my current rate of reading, so all help gratefully received :-)

Coming immediately to mind is Steph Swainson's Circle trilogy (The Year Of Our War, No Present Like Time and The Modern World) and it's prequal (Above The Snowline), set in a lightly satirical world, it's the story of how people just can't get on with each other and accomplish great things. One of my favourite series, it uses first person, nurmerous flashbacks, a lack of tolkienisms and a complete disregard of most of the usual fantasy tropes to carve it's own niche.

Richard Morgan's The Steel Remains goes for a pseudo sci-fi approach with it's tale of three warriors unable to fit into the societies they once saved in a previous war. There's plenty of swordplay, but if you are slightly prudish you may disapprove of the explicit sex scenes.

And, more in keeping with the usual fantasy series, there's Brandon Sanderson's Stormlight Archive series that has 2 tomes out so far (as far as I know), which seems to have gone out of it's way to be a non-Tolkien world, which is cleverly handed out in very small chunks in the books.

Any of those I'd recommend giving a go.

groovychainsaw

07-02-2012, 01:24 PM

@ Serenegoose, Shane, Feldspar - Thanks for the suggestions chaps, I'd forgotten about Andrzej Sapkowski - having played the witcher games, they certainly show a different type of world. I'll look into all of those suggestions, they sound interesting.

@Deekyfun - The history of the world and races does seem interesting (being a collapsed version of a more industrial-era world) but wasn't featured enough in this first book. I'll also agree that its not as serious as LOTR and I did enjoy that too, I don't necessarily need a book to be super-clever, I enjoy pulpy as much as the next man (as some of the other books I've read recently probably show).

Shane

07-02-2012, 02:02 PM

All this talk of history reminds me that I'm a sucker for lore and depiction of various civilizations, alien or otherwise. Do you peeps have any recommendations for any sci-fi/fantasy works that have in-depth lore with a large variety of races/species a la Malazan or Bas Lag?

Rakysh

07-02-2012, 06:39 PM

@Groovy, I'd second the Brandon Sanderson and also suggest The Left Hand Of God and its sequel, The Last Four Things. Quite low fantasy, but very interesting and very good.

Althea

07-02-2012, 06:41 PM

The Left Hand Of God and its sequel, The Last Four Things. Quite low fantasy, but very interesting and very good.
I counter that suggestion by saying it's misdirected and uses our-world terminology for the sake of it, so much so that it causes confusion.

As for large variety - who better than Adrian Tchaikovsky with his Shadows of the Apt series? Just make sure you get the UK editions - the US publisher seems to have stopped releasing them.

Rakysh

07-02-2012, 06:42 PM

I think the third one will make it make sense, but I'm willing to let it not. I'm intrigued by misdirected though, how so?

Althea

07-02-2012, 06:43 PM

I think the third one will make it make sense, but I'm willing to let it not. I'm intrigued by misdirected though, how so?
Easy. By referencing real-world things (such as cities) it creates an impression that it's set in our world. If my memory of the first 100 pages of that book are correct, it isn't set in our world.

It was a very divisive book in the SFF community - you either loved it or you hated it.

Rakysh

07-02-2012, 06:47 PM

Fair enough. It's sort of an alternate dimension type thing, I suppose. I like the way it toys with expectations of various bits and bobs, but maybe I'm just crediting it with more intelligence than it has. Ah well.

corbain

08-02-2012, 07:37 AM

what fantasy books/series manage to go off Tolkien-style fantasy into something a bit different?

Andrzej Sapkowski for one.

Well George R. R. Martin springs to mind

cjlr

08-02-2012, 01:44 PM

I just hard that Samuel Youd, aka John Christopher among other pseudonyms, has passed away. RIP to a great author.

If only had my copies of the Tripods and the Burning Lands here for a quick re-read. Mind-blowing, for a kid to read those the first time.

Shane

08-02-2012, 01:46 PM

Yea, Martin's very good but his last two books were utter shit. I find it hard to believe that they were written by the same author.

Zephro

09-02-2012, 12:38 PM

Not really fantasy but I've been reading Rivers of London and Moon Over Soho, by Ben Aaronovitch, recently. They're good fun, managed to get a reference to Wong Kei's and System Shock 2 on the same page. They're about a special branch of the met who deal with magic users in London. Not very deep, what fantasy novel is, but good fun and some funny moments. The author also clearly loves London so really makes it shine.

mrchinchin25

10-02-2012, 10:16 AM

Now reading - Revelation Space (Alastair Reynolds). A hard sci-fi series I'm told, just 10% in at the mo, quite liking it so far.

33% in, starting to get hooked. Loving the "our theories about the aliens are maybe not accurate" and "wierd stuff that scares you and may be lurking in your brain" vibes.

mrchinchin25

10-02-2012, 10:18 AM

Just let me chime in for the love of Abercrombie - while I thought that The Heroes was his weakest book so far, I still found it immensely enjoyable, and his next books are bought blindly.

His next one is supposed to hit around Q4 this year, and I can't wait for it.

I'm not sure I class Heroes as his weakest book (although to be fair, I don't dare say any of his books are his weakest - I don't want the bloody cross carved into me!)

I'm a sucker for well written battles where you can visualise the scale and locations of the battle - and this sold it in spades, with maps and all sorts of goodies.

mrchinchin25

10-02-2012, 10:19 AM

Shane

10-02-2012, 01:25 PM

Would the Eisenhorn Trilogy be a good starter for those uninitiated to the Wh20k universe(yes, we are more than a myth)?

Rakysh

10-02-2012, 02:01 PM

I think Cain would be a better place to start, but Eisenhorn will probably do ok. Actually, 15 Hours is pretty good and fairly short and accessible, so I'd start there- it was my first 40k book, I think.

Althea

10-02-2012, 02:11 PM

Cain or Gaunt's Ghosts will be best, but if you want to read about the SPAYSE MAHREENS then you want the Ultramarines trilogy.

squirrel

11-02-2012, 05:06 AM

I found some of you mates' recommendations very interesting. Unfortunately the only English book store in my area refuses to stock them, say they dont expect those to popular here. They offer to order them for me but prices are very expensive. They charge USD30 for a novel. I understand their cost and risk, it's just those price tags are not affordable for me.

The only way I can order myself is probably through Amazon.com, but it's shipping costs are way too high. I wonder if the shipping cost is really that high or if Amazon.com profits directly for internationally shipping.

Feldspar

11-02-2012, 09:47 AM

Shane

11-02-2012, 12:15 PM

Or just freaking download them off warez sites.

Kaira-

11-02-2012, 01:04 PM

Got "The Year of Our War" as a birthday gift, so started reading that. Seems interesting enough, though I find it (at least in the beginning) quite hard to follow what is happening.

squirrel

12-02-2012, 08:47 AM

Distribution costs are high, more so for small packages. Remember that as well as Amazon having to make a profit on your order (after all they are a business), the distribution companies also have to make their buck and the high prices of fuel are cutting into their profit margins.

Remember that ordering from the US means that your parcel is travelling airfreight, so your shipping costs have to pay for:-

Amazon packaging up your goods
Someone driving your parcel to the airport
Someone loading the plane
The plane flight
Someone off-loading the plane
Sorting of the parcel through customs and in a regional distribution centre
Delivering the parcel to you.

And it may be more complex than that. I doubt Amazon.com profits directly from the international shipping, maybe indirectly with cheaper rates due to volume, I know the company I work for don't, we expend effort trying to make sure we are getting stuff to the customers as cheap as possible.

Could you order them in electronic form, surely that would work out cheaper in the long run?

I used to order from Amazon.com before the English bookstore in my area started business. Actually if one planned carefully for ordering, shippment cost can be affordable, but prerequisite, you have to group as many items as possible. Having each order containing only a few items and shipping cost is prohibitively high.

I want to order electronic versions too but I am so concerned about DRM. I can't tolerate "purchasing" sth. I cannot truly own, as for games, and as for books.

Or just freaking download them off warez sites.

Hey actually I know some places. But you know, the first rule of Fight Club is......

Feldspar

12-02-2012, 11:14 AM

Got "The Year of Our War" as a birthday gift, so started reading that. Seems interesting enough, though I find it (at least in the beginning) quite hard to follow what is happening.

Yeah, it's not that easy to follow at first, many characters are either known by name or title interchangably but not both together; doesn't stop to explain concepts much (but this does keep the flow and doesn't assume the reader is slow and needs everything explaining); jumps into flashbacks often without warning; and starts in the middle of action (thus avoiding the slow labourious start, I mean how many times do you want to read about some guy growing up in a sleepy village).

Persevere, though, the series is a nice set of interlinked stories with the narrator as the fulcrum but not always the focus.

Unaco

12-02-2012, 04:23 PM

Mostly I've been rereading the preliminary synopsis for Joe Abercrombie's forthcoming book...

“Shy South comes home to her farm to find a blackened shell, her brother and sister stolen, and knows she’ll have to go back to bad old ways if she’s ever to see them again. She sets off in pursuit with only her cowardly old step-father Lamb for company. But it turns out he’s hiding a bloody past of his own. None bloodier. Their journey will take them across the lawless plains, to a frontier town gripped by gold fever, through feuds, duels, and massacres, high into unmapped mountains to a reckoning with ancient enemies, and force them into alliance with Nicomo Cosca, infamous soldier of fortune, a man no one should ever have to trust…”

First thing: Nicomo Cosca!

Second thing: Who's the bloodiest man we know? (rhetorical question, it's quite obvious who it will be). Expected publication is Autumn in the UK. Can't wait!

Aside from that, I have recently given up reading Feist's Riftwar Saga... I got through Magician, and a few chapters into Silverthorn, but it really typifies the reasons I shunned fantasy for much of my life*: It's twee, it's sanitised, it's cliched, it's generic. I might go back to it, when I have absolutely nothing else to read.

Instead, I've picked up The Judging Eye (part 1 of Bakker's Aspect Emperor trilogy) and ordered White Luck Warrior. After them, I'll probably read books 12 & 13 of the Wheel of Time... Then I'm at something of a loss. Scott Lynch's Locke Lamora books seem appealing, but I know there are only 2 out of 7 planned books published, and I much prefer to consume entire series in one go.

*I was given the Hobbit by an English teacher when I was ~12 years old. I despised it. 16 years after, I got into Fantasy through ASoIaF, and in the last year have read that, first 11 books of Wheel of Time, Joe Abercrombie's 5 books, all of Erikson and Esselmont's Malazan books, the Complete Tales of the Black Company and The Prince of Nothing Trilogy.

Jockie

15-02-2012, 09:27 AM

Was wondering if anyone could help me in a couple of ways.

Firstly, does anyone have any recommendations for good cyberpunk stories (be it short story collections or novels) past the obvious like Neuromancer?

Secondly, the reason I'm asking is i'm researching for my final creative writing assignment at uni and I'd quite like to know if my idea is in any way original. Essentially it's about a near-future story about a man-made afterlife, where human consciousness can be replicated in electronic form and are able to inhabit articifial environments, exploring ideas like the monetisation of the afterlife, religious reactions and terrorism/hacking. Does this sound familiar to anyone? (i'm sure it's been done before but my search results have been inconclusive)

mrpier

15-02-2012, 10:36 AM

Jockie - For your second point, there has been some authors that have written about this in their works, Peter F. Hamilton in the latest the Void series has a sort of government made up of post-existence humans, not really the focus of the series though.

Iain m. Banks has touched up against this in several of the culture novels, most extensively (I think, haven't read all of his books yet) in Surface Detail.

Tad Williams uses something similar in his Otherland books, although the focus is initially on it as a sort of videogame. This is also written in a near-future setting.

westyfield

15-02-2012, 10:52 AM

Essentially it's about a near-future story about a man-made afterlife, where human consciousness can be replicated in electronic form and are able to inhabit articifial environments, exploring ideas like the monetisation of the afterlife, religious reactions and terrorism/hacking. Does this sound familiar to anyone? (i'm sure it's been done before but my search results have been inconclusive)

Altered Carbon by Richard Morgan is a little like that, except it's not artificial - a person's consciousness is stored on a chip that's implanted in their neck. When they die, they download into a new body (which could be a clone, or an entirely different one). Only the rich can afford it, so an elite class appears that can do pretty much anything it wants. It's quite good, a solid future-noir detective/action story (the protagonist is a mercenary solving a man's murder - but the man is still alive in a new body). Not entirely sure it's what you're looking for but I'd recommend it anyway.

Jockie

15-02-2012, 11:51 AM

Thanks to both of you, very helpful.

Feldspar

15-02-2012, 12:06 PM

The Red Men by Matthew De Abaitua kind of covers this from a different angle, the titular red men are simulations of living people maintained digitally to enhance the productivity of their living counterparts and part of the book explores the differences of how a digital person isn't bound by the physical or moral laws of the real world, inhabiting a world of back-ups and resets.

Kelron

15-02-2012, 10:17 PM

SMiD

16-02-2012, 12:03 AM

Would the Eisenhorn Trilogy be a good starter for those uninitiated to the Wh20k universe(yes, we are more than a myth)?

Eisenhorn is where I'm starting; a friend has graciously loaned it to me. Outside of WH, I'm finding a hunger to read some Christie; already finished Death on the Nile and looking for a "next step".

Oh, and I've been completely hung up on Heretics of Dune. I started it maybe a year ago and cannot find the spirit to read past chapter 6 or so. I think in part it has to do with how far removed it is from the beloved characters of the first book(s).

Theblazeuk

16-02-2012, 03:00 PM

Would the Eisenhorn Trilogy be a good starter for those uninitiated to the Wh20k universe(yes, we are more than a myth)?

Yeah, but I would go with Gaunts Ghosts by the same author. Or at least follow up Eisenhorn with the series - it's more accessible IMO and has some of the best depictions of all-out war from the view of grunts caught in the meatgrinder. Eisenhorn lets you see more of whats going on in WH40k beyond the frontlines, but really, in the grim darkness of the future there is only war.

Jockie, your idea sounds familiar but all I can think for examples are stories where this digital afterlife has been a mere side-note in the overall book.

ColOfNature

16-02-2012, 08:12 PM

Secondly, the reason I'm asking is i'm researching for my final creative writing assignment at uni and I'd quite like to know if my idea is in any way original. Essentially it's about a near-future story about a man-made afterlife, where human consciousness can be replicated in electronic form and are able to inhabit articifial environments, exploring ideas like the monetisation of the afterlife, religious reactions and terrorism/hacking. Does this sound familiar to anyone? (i'm sure it's been done before but my search results have been inconclusive)

Iain M. Banks' Surface Detail has quite a bit on the subject of digital afterlives. From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_Detail):

Some of the plot occurs in various simulated environments. As the book begins, a simulated war game—the "War in Heaven"—has been running for several decades. The simulated war is to determine whether to allow or to disallow cultures in the galaxy from running Hells, simulated afterlives in which the mind-states of the deceased are tortured.

coldvvvave

17-02-2012, 07:49 AM

Olympos (Den Symmons)

Even after reading the first book( Ilium) I'm not sure if I like it or not.

Serenegoose

21-02-2012, 05:50 PM

Finished Best Served Cold, now onto The Steel Remains by Richard Morgan.

Kadayi

21-02-2012, 08:58 PM

Secondly, the reason I'm asking is i'm researching for my final creative writing assignment at uni and I'd quite like to know if my idea is in any way original. Essentially it's about a near-future story about a man-made afterlife, where human consciousness can be replicated in electronic form and are able to inhabit articifial environments, exploring ideas like the monetisation of the afterlife, religious reactions and terrorism/hacking. Does this sound familiar to anyone? (i'm sure it's been done before but my search results have been inconclusive)

I guess the issue is, if everything is unreal where in lies the value? Both in terms of everyone within the artificial environment to each other (you're effectively living in a world devoid of physical constraint) as well as the responsibility the living have towards maintaining it. Also if a persons identity can be replicated flawlessly, what happens when you make a copy and release it into the same space. Who is the real Jockie?

Keep

21-02-2012, 10:04 PM

Secondly, the reason I'm asking is i'm researching for my final creative writing assignment at uni

Care to share it when it's done?

Jockie

21-02-2012, 10:43 PM

Care to share it when it's done?

Depends whether I am deeply ashamed of it after it's finished!

Keep

22-02-2012, 01:08 AM

Heh, I know that feeling. Still, if you wanna show it around, you've got an audience here.

Voon

22-02-2012, 05:50 AM

still reading this one
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c2/The_Brothers_Karamazov.jpg

R-F

22-02-2012, 08:51 AM

No matter what, Ciaphas Cain is the best place to start in WH40k. It does drop you a bit in the thick of it, but the characters more than make up for it.

Jockie

22-02-2012, 09:50 AM

Heh, I know that feeling. Still, if you wanna show it around, you've got an audience here.

Cheers, critique is always useful, but it's difficult releasing your malformed children into the world! At the moment I'm still waiting on an approval for my proposal - this is my equivalent of the final course dissertation.

mickygor

22-02-2012, 09:52 AM

I'm currently rereading the Dragonriders of Pern books, in the recommended order. Up to Moreta: Dragonlady of Pern.

Shane

22-02-2012, 10:02 AM

No matter what, Ciaphas Cain is the best place to start in WH40k. It does drop you a bit in the thick of it, but the characters more than make up for it.

Well, I've been reading Ciaphas Cain, and while I did quite enjoy the first half of the novel, the gimmick of having a cowardly but accidentally competent Commissar begins to wear thin. The rationalization behind the things he does because of his self-serving nature begins to feel stupid as the novel progresses. Everything else about the novel is firmly mediocre, as if the writer expected that the lead character's unconventional nature would be enough to get the readers through the novels.

I also read the first of Space Wolves trilogy. 'Twas the same testosterone fueled dudebro-porn as, say, the Gears of War games.

Althea

22-02-2012, 10:07 AM

Well, I've been reading Ciaphas Cain, and while I did quite enjoy the first half of the novel, the gimmick of having a cowardly but accidentally competent Commissar begins to wear thin. The rationalization of everything that Cain begins to feel more and more stupid as the novel progresses. Everything else about the novel is firmly mediocre, as if the writer expected that the lead characters unconventional nature would be enough to get the readers through the novels.
First novel? Well, I've read the first six and whilst it does wear thin a little, they're pretty damned good books.

Theblazeuk

22-02-2012, 11:17 AM

Gaunt's Ghosts are above and beyond the fething best WH40k books. The inverse of Cain in that Commisar Gaunt is really a big damn hero and so are his men (and later, women).

Cain is fun but as said, a little thin. Whereas Gaunt has some humor, lots of action and a deep streak of horror running through it, Cain's character and his success kind of undermines the sheer nastiness of the imperium's enemies for me.

mrpier

22-02-2012, 11:59 AM

I'm just finishing the Founding omnibus for Gaunts ghosts and it's pretty good, though I will say Eisenhorn was better, it's maybe on par with Ravenor I'd say. Mostly I wasn't too fond of the second story where every soldier gets his own short story. It reminded me a bit of Sgt. Rock, which I guess is the same type of stories in a different medium.

Althea

22-02-2012, 01:09 PM

The inverse of Cain in that Commisar Gaunt is really a big damn hero and so are his men (and later, women).
Later? Cain, from the start, is full of strong, powerful women. Whether it's the 597th, the forces of Perlia or even just a certain flirty techpriest, he's constantly supported by women. Sadly, the Cain books are some of the few (in print) 40k books with any real number of women. Only others I can think of are the Shira Calpurnia books and the Sisters of Battle series. Last Chancers is now out of print (AGAIN - much to my annoyance), so yeah. Not a lot to read if you want wimminz in the 40k universe.

Theblazeuk

22-02-2012, 02:58 PM

Later? Cain, from the start, is full of strong, powerful women. Whether it's the 597th, the forces of Perlia or even just a certain flirty techpriest, he's constantly supported by women. Sadly, the Cain books are some of the few (in print) 40k books with any real number of women.

Well the Tanith first-and-only was a typical single-sex army at first. It's only when they get their numbers bolstered by the Verghast irregulars that women become regular and prominent characters of the books

Last Chancers is now out of print

Oo Last Chancers. I'd put that in second after the Ghosts.

Althea

22-02-2012, 03:03 PM

Well the Tanith first-and-only was a typical single-sex army at first. It's only when they get their numbers bolstered by the Verghast irregulars that women become regular and prominent characters of the books
I see. I only have the first omnibus and I really can't see myself getting to it at any point in the near future, let alone the rest of the series.

Oo Last Chancers. I'd put that in second after the Ghosts.
I'd love to read it, but used copies are expensive, it's out of print anyway and Black Library can shove their ebook pricing up their arse.

Zephro

22-02-2012, 05:01 PM

Well, I've been reading Ciaphas Cain, and while I did quite enjoy the first half of the novel, the gimmick of having a cowardly but accidentally competent Commissar begins to wear thin. The rationalization behind the things he does because of his self-serving nature begins to feel stupid as the novel progresses. Everything else about the novel is firmly mediocre, as if the writer expected that the lead character's unconventional nature would be enough to get the readers through the novels.

Try read Flashman which Cain is a poor rip off of (though which BL book isn't?). They work far better with the anti-hero as it's far better satire.

squirrel

23-02-2012, 02:02 PM

Just finished The Fifth Witness by Mr. Michael Connelly. Turns out "the fifth witness" doesn't refer to witness no. 5, but to a witness who takes the Fifth Amendment Right. I learnt about the Fifth Amendment Right from an American drama, The Good Wife, the episode 1 of season 2. It is the right grant to the US citizen by the Fifth Amendment of the US Constitution to refuse to, even being legally demanded to testify, comment on any issue that may risk incriminating himself. Interesting, I wonder if anyone outside the USA would know the meaning of "the fifth witness" only by looking at this title.

This is the 4th novel for the Lincoln Lawyer series, and the 2nd book in the series I've read. Great reading. Without risking for spoiler, I would say that the theme of this title is quite consistent with the 1st Lincoln Lawyer. The individuals who are tasked to maintain the judicial system are often corrupted, but the system itself is not. If you consider the bureaucrats to be incompetent and selfish jerks, they will surprise you when they turn the table to deliver the justice. No matter how many loop holes there are in the justice system, criminals will eventually be brought to justice.

Theblazeuk

23-02-2012, 04:30 PM

I see. I only have the first omnibus and I really can't see myself getting to it at any point in the near future, let alone the rest of the series.

Well if you own it, you should give it a try. Probably surprise you - and plus what good is an unread book.

Althea

23-02-2012, 04:34 PM

Well if you own it, you should give it a try. Probably surprise you - and plus what good is an unread book.
I will get to it, but it's in the lower half of my To-Read pile.

LennyLeonardo

28-02-2012, 12:56 AM

Just finished The Hunger Games. Absolutely loved it. The writing style is fairly simple and is clearly aiming for the young adult audience, but you barely notice - the world is so comlex and involving, and it allows for a really fascinating critique of reality TV and what it's doing to us. But even if you're not into that, the whole Battle Royale on TV set-up is pure gold, and the characters are brilliant. Fivety squillion stars.

Fumarole

28-02-2012, 01:12 AM

I've finally gotten around to Unseen Academicals. After that are I Shall Wear Midnight and two omnibuses from the W40K universe: Hammer of the Emperor and Enforcer. Those four should keep me occupied for quite a few weeks.

westyfield

28-02-2012, 06:29 AM

Finished 1Q84 volume 1 and 2 the other day, gotta read 3 sometime.
Now reading Century Rain by Alastair Reynolds.
Seriously, look at this cover. LOOK AT IT. (http://www.awwwards.com/awards/images/2011/07/covers_321.jpg) Damn that's a good-looking book.

Dougal Mcfrugal

28-02-2012, 06:32 AM

Jockie - Surface Detail by Iain M Banks has a great deal about artifical afterlife(s). It's set within The Culture universe if you've read any of those,

timeric

28-02-2012, 08:46 AM

I have just started the book Hunger games.

LennyLeonardo

28-02-2012, 11:43 AM

I have just started the book Hunger games.

You're in for a treat my friend.

Althea

28-02-2012, 11:46 AM

You're in for a treat my friend.
He's a bot/spammer.

NathanH

28-02-2012, 12:34 PM

I just finished "1492: The Year Our World Began", which is an overview of the world in the 100 years or so up to that date. It was pretty good, although I didn't like the structure too much and occasionally got confused.

I have just started "Liberty's Exiles", which chronicles the experiences of Americans loyal to the British who had to leave after the War of Independence.

LennyLeonardo

28-02-2012, 01:40 PM

He's a bot/spammer.

Really? How can you tell? I'm new to this forum lark.

Althea

28-02-2012, 01:41 PM

Really? How can you tell? I'm new to this forum lark.
I looked at his profile.

westyfield

28-02-2012, 02:05 PM

He's a bot/spammer.

It's weird though, he doesn't seem to be advertising anything. Perhaps it's some new spambot that tries to build up a reputation first, so it doesn't have the telltale 'first post recommendation' that we see so often.

Althea

28-02-2012, 02:06 PM

It's weird though, he doesn't seem to be advertising anything. Perhaps it's some new spambot that tries to build up a reputation first, so it doesn't have the telltale 'first post recommendation' that we see so often.
Check his profile, you should see a signature field there.

Looks like he was a dumbass and unticked "Show your signature"

squareking

28-02-2012, 02:32 PM

darix is the same, it appears.

I have a short stack of books either coming in or needing finishing.

Incoming -- my first foray into WH40k lit:

Eisenhorn omnibus
Ravenor omnibus

Queue:

An Essay on Typography
Red Mars

Serenegoose

28-02-2012, 02:50 PM

He's a bot/spammer.

Wait.

Aren't you?

Perhaps this implication might put you in the mood to buy some cheap genuine italian bags ????

Althea

28-02-2012, 02:54 PM

Wait.

Aren't you?

Perhaps this implication might put you in the mood to buy some cheap genuine italian bags ????
Uh, no. I'm a backpack kind of gal.

Fumarole

29-02-2012, 01:32 AM

Incoming -- my first foray into WH40k lit:

Eisenhorn omnibus
Ravenor omnibus

Quite a good pick for a first time W40k list.

squareking

29-02-2012, 03:42 AM

Quite a good pick for a first time W40k list.

I did some research. :)

BlueJohn

03-03-2012, 12:54 PM

has any one read ender's game? im trying to decide what to read and its between taht or reading the wheel of time as i have the first 3 books but never got through the first one years ago

Althea

03-03-2012, 01:30 PM

has any one read ender's game?
Ender's Game as written by this guy? (http://www.afterelton.com/people/2008/7/orsonscottcard)

No. I'll never read it.

Nalano

03-03-2012, 02:30 PM

has any one read ender's game? im trying to decide what to read and its between taht or reading the wheel of time as i have the first 3 books but never got through the first one years ago

The first one's all you need. The rest are paternalist claptrap. (So's the first, but it's not rubbed in your face as much)

SouperSteve0

03-03-2012, 07:00 PM

Slaughter house 5

Keep

03-03-2012, 07:18 PM

Slaughter house 5

D'ya like it?

Drake Sigar

03-03-2012, 07:54 PM

Eisenhorn omnibus
Ravenor omnibus

You won't regret it. I know in the grim darkness of the future there is only war an' all that jazz, but it sure gets tiresome reading chapter after bloodsoaked chapter. Eisenhorn has other things going for it, like exploring Imperial society and focusing on a small group of unorthodox badasses who go from job to job in their spacecraft - an idea we can't seem to get enough of if Serenity and the Ebon Hawk are anything to go by.

Theblazeuk

03-03-2012, 10:14 PM

The first one's all you need. The rest are paternalist claptrap. (So's the first, but it's not rubbed in your face as much)

Yep. And avoid the Alvin Maker series like the plague. Seems like an interesting Americana-magician story, turns a bit hideous before too long. Mind you whatever I think of Card and his views, I did really enjoy Ender's Game.

Slaughter house 5

I literally just started Man Without A Country. I think if you don't like Vonnegut or at least think there is a lot of sense in his madness, there is something deeply distrustful about you.

Serenegoose

03-03-2012, 10:36 PM

Almost all of the way through The steel Remains - it was fun, I guess, but I'm not sure I found it hugely memorable.

After that I've had copies of The Ambassador's Mission and The Rogue kicking around since they were released - Trudi Canavan is fairly light (very much a good thing in this case, I'm a little burnt out on heavy stories), but I think she's got a real knack for telling easy to read, fun stories with engaging characters.

CWalker

03-03-2012, 10:36 PM

Currently trying to muster up the courage to continue Storm of Swords pt 1, for I don't want to get sucked in to a 7 hour binge reading session as I've done in the past. It's jolly good stuff though.

westyfield

04-03-2012, 12:12 AM

Currently trying to muster up the courage to continue Storm of Swords pt 1, for I don't want to get sucked in to a 7 hour binge reading session as I've done in the past. It's jolly good stuff though.

You can't avoid it. I blitzed through parts one and two whilst on holiday in Malta/Gozo last year. Tearing myself away from the books to go exploring led to some strange situations due to the tv series having been partly filmed there.
"Hey wait, this is the entrance to Kings Landing!"
"This is where Daenerys and Drogo got married!"
"And this is where stupid Ned Stark got spoilered!"

squirrel

04-03-2012, 04:23 AM

Stuffed & Starved: The Hidden Battle for the World Food System by Mr. Raj Patel. This is not a new book I think.

I recently noticed the Taiwan translated Chinese version of this English book. Food issue is always a hot topic here. As the title stated clearly, this books is arguing for the unjust food supply system, which leads to starvation problem in poor (or South as termed by Mr. Patel), and health (mainly obesity problem) in the not-so-rich world. I am getting started with its introduction, which argues against the food system controlled by international food cartels unjustly twisted by food supplying system operate.

Kadayi

04-03-2012, 09:45 AM

"And this is where stupid Ned Stark got spoilered!"

*chortles*

I'm still laughing about that dude on youtube losing his shit over that.

westyfield

04-03-2012, 12:06 PM

*chortles*

I'm still laughing about that dude on youtube losing his shit over that.

I must have missed that. Did he get angry because it happened, or because someone spoiled it for him?

Vague-rant

04-03-2012, 02:50 PM

Just finished The Heroes. Spoilers below...

Not bad. I skipped "Best Served Cold" and I preferred The First Law but I think thats at least partly because I really liked the character Logen Ninefingers. I suppose I should've been realistic. It was nice to see characters of old make the odd appearance, but it wasn't enough. I also, really didn't like Black Dow's demise. Isn't it meant to be a punishable offence to interrupt a Challenge?

I really want to find out more about what on earth is going on with Bayaz and the others. Presumably that'll be revealed in other books.

Stellar Duck

04-03-2012, 07:52 PM

Just finished reading The Stars My Destination which I found to be a lovely book.

Then I started A Canticle for Liebowitz and I'm just done with the first part. So far it's good, and it feels like it's a proto-Fallout in some ways.

Next up is either Faucoult's Pendulum by Umberto Eco, as I ground to a stand still on my last attempt.

SouperSteve0

05-03-2012, 12:12 AM

D'ya like it?

Uhh yeah it was interesting. Not one of my favorites but everything about it is interesting. Vonnegut wrote very strangely.

corbain

05-03-2012, 04:27 AM

I must have missed that. Did he get angry because it happened, or because someone spoiled it for him?

Because it happened

Cable

05-03-2012, 04:50 AM

I just finished The Left Hand of Darkness by Ursula LeGuin which was pretty interesting. A really cool viewpoint on a new culture and how it was influenced by the world on which it arose.

Now i've just started Neuromancer and enjoying it so far, pretty prophetic especially given it was written before the internet was widespread and the similarities of the beginning to Blade Runner are quite funny given he said he wrote the first third before it came out.

ChainsawHands

05-03-2012, 10:21 AM

"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel."

So, bright blue then...

Stellar Duck

05-03-2012, 06:58 PM

"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel."

I rate that line up there with "Call me Ishmael." or "It was a pleasure to burn."

A wonderful way to set the tone for the book.

cjlr

05-03-2012, 07:03 PM

A wonderful way to set the tone for the book.

Was it Neal Stephenson who noted that, in this day of digital inputs, a no-signal defaults to a bright blue?

I had to actually try to find a good source of analog static to demonstrate interference the other day.

Feldspar

05-03-2012, 07:33 PM

Was it Neal Stephenson who noted that, in this day of digital inputs, a no-signal defaults to a bright blue?

Except my TV which defaults to black with a box telling you there's no signal.

TailSwallower

05-03-2012, 07:41 PM

I've been reading A Serpent Uncoiled by Simon Spurrier. It's crime/detective fiction, so I think I won't be able to know exactly how good it actually is until I get to the end, but I'm half way through and enjoying it thoroughly.

Stellar Duck

05-03-2012, 08:52 PM

Was it Neal Stephenson who noted that, in this day of digital inputs, a no-signal defaults to a bright blue?

I had to actually try to find a good source of analog static to demonstrate interference the other day.

It's always a bit weird when real world technology advances more than the science fiction. :)

But aside from that static pictures are rare these days, I do think it's a great way Gibson chose to start the book.

And it may very well have been Neal Stephenson.

Edit: by the way: did you manage to find a source of static?

DaftPunk

05-03-2012, 09:11 PM

I just read I am legend for the first time and i liked it. Now i'm going to read The Stand,from Stephen King,after that The Road :p

ColOfNature

05-03-2012, 09:17 PM

Just read Vernor Vinge's novella True Names. Predates Neuromancer by about 5 years and describes a virtual world recognisable to any cyberpunk aficionado. Might have to go back to the rest of Vinge's oeuvre now: Rainbows End is the only other one I've read, although I tried A Fire Upon the Deep a while back and struggled to get into it.

Theblazeuk

06-03-2012, 10:24 AM

Ahh The Stand, my favourite ever Stephen King book. Must have read it about 5 times.

Currently reading Breverton's Phantasmagoria, though think I might make this a back-burner since it's all small chunks of info and lore. I do have Mievilles The Scar sitting in my slush pile...

Uhh yeah it was interesting. Not one of my favorites but everything about it is interesting. Vonnegut wrote very strangely.

So it goes.

Nalano

09-03-2012, 06:40 AM

Jeremy Paxman's Empire.

I joke that the three ethnicities I embody are united by only two things: Alcoholism, and a hatred of the British. After reading Kwasi Kwarteng's rather apologist Ghosts of Empire, I figured something with less of a selective vision was in order.

Theblazeuk

09-03-2012, 02:25 PM

I was under the impression Paxman's accompanying TV show was a bit apologist as well in a nostalgic civilizing mission kind of way. All based on hearsay though I must admit.

squirrel

11-03-2012, 11:13 AM

Track

11-03-2012, 04:31 PM

Last two books that I read were The Hunger Games and Slaughterhouse Five; both fantastic, but in completely different ways.
I also read V For Vendetta, which was decent, though personally I thought that the more streamlines plot of the film version was a bit better.

Currently i'm working my way through American Gods. I'm not very far into it, but it's quite good, and i'm curious to see how HBO does a certain early scene involving a prostitute (if you've read the book, you know which one) when they adapt it.

Xercies

11-03-2012, 05:41 PM

Well considering its HBO he channel of T&A i can imagine it not being cut at all.

Fumarole

11-03-2012, 06:21 PM

Currently i'm working my way through American Gods. I'm not very far into it, but it's quite good, and i'm curious to see how HBO does a certain early scene involving a prostitute (if you've read the book, you know which one) when they adapt it.I didn't realize HBO was doing it, thanks for the info. And knowing HBO, that scene will be deliciously graphic.

kirrus

13-03-2012, 04:43 PM

Currently reading William Gibson's All Tomorrow's Parties, so far proving decent, but difficult to get into. .

Jockie

13-03-2012, 07:25 PM

Just finished the First Law Trilogy by Joe Abercombie, as recommended by quite a few people in this thread and I really enjoyed it. Love the way it messed around with fantasy tropes, while remaining a compelling example of the genre.

I will probably give Best Served Cold and The Heroes a look at some point, but I have a couple of Iain M Banks books sat on my Kindle waiting for a read.

Vexing Vision

13-03-2012, 10:49 PM

Best Served Cold is my absolute favourite Abercrombie book.

I've just started rereading the First Law trilogy after recommending it to a close friend who finally caved in. Glotka is my favourite main character of any book I have ever read.

Track

14-03-2012, 01:00 AM

Well considering its HBO he channel of T&A i can imagine it not being cut at all.

Oh, I definitely imagine it'll be there (why wouldn't you do that scene if you had the option?), I just can't imagine how they'll portray it. It would probably look completely ridiculous if they just did it straight-up.

maggihussy

14-03-2012, 03:52 AM

I have very much interested in reading the books as well novels also. But,my favorite book is Sherlock Holmes. i read each and every part of sherlock homes. I loved to read it . every page i got surprised when i read it.

Rii

15-03-2012, 02:14 PM

I am trying to look for stocks of thrillers The Tomorrow series, currently consisting of 7 books, by Mr. John Marsden.

Australia as background, it's about a group of youths who went to picnic / camping in the country side. When they returned home town they found that Australia was suddenly invaded by a foreign army (nationality not specified, for obvious reason. But I dont like that the recent movie adaptation hinted that it was the Chinese army). Their home town was occupied and all their family members were held in prison camp. This series is therefore about their effort to fight the invaders.

I recommended this series to the only English bookstore in my town and they were pretty interested. Seems like they would stock this so I don't have to order individually, save the ordering cost. Oh Yeah!!

I remember reading this series as it came out in high school. I somehow wound up reading only books 2-6 and so missed out on both the opening and closing chapters of the saga. But yeah, it's basically Red Dawn transplanted to Australia in young-adult novel form, minus the irony that Red Dawn was a response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. *snicker* Or perhaps the irony is just of a different kind, what with the coming of the white man to Australia and all. Still, as I recall the novels at least pay lip service to that angle.

The identity of the invaders is an interesting question. Realistically, an invasion of Australia in the current global environment is a gross implausibility. To judge between the various implausible candidates it merely depends on which aspects of reality you most care to suspend. For better or worse, China is probably the least implausible candidate. From a material point of view the United States is the most plausible candidate (diplomatic relations are a comparatively easy thing to sweep aside via hypothetical developments) but the novels rule out that possibility on several counts, most obviously in that the invaders don't speak English.

EDIT:

Oh yeah, and I'm reading The God of Small Things by Arundhati Roy. I also read Ender's Game recently, at the conclusion of which the thought foremost in my mind was what a colossal wanker the author is. "Oh I'm so uncomfortable writing an introduction to this novel, that's why it's 30 pages long and consists mostly of self-congratulation and the re-printing of actual love letters I have received from admirers." I was actually pleasantly surprised by the novel itself, if I'd first read it when I was 12 I'd probably look back on it fondly too, much as I do Starship Troopers. But the author's own comments leave such a bad taste in one's mouth. =/

Theblazeuk

15-03-2012, 03:36 PM

Enders Game should come with a disclaimer: WARNING - Do not read author's comments until after book is finished

I'm nearing the latter third of China Mieville's The Scar. Really loving it! Moar I say.

Althea

15-03-2012, 03:38 PM

Enders Game should come with a disclaimer: WARNING - Do not read author's comments until after book is finished
It should have a big warning on the cover that says: "WARNING - Do not buy. The author is a dick. A massive dick. You cannot comprehend how much of a dick this guy is. Go buy something else"

Unaco

15-03-2012, 05:03 PM

It should have a big warning on the cover that says: "WARNING - Do not buy. The author is a dick. A massive dick. You cannot comprehend how much of a dick this guy is. Go buy something else"

And should those same labels be on all Lovecraft books (major racist, hideous anti-semite)? Or Raymond Chandler (mysogynist alcoholic who treated women appallingly)? Hemingway (mysogynist alcoholic)? Harlan Ellison (violent, disparaging man without a shred of decency)? What about the music of Richard Wagner (who's writing, not his music, were quite racist and anti-semitic)? Mozart (incest, sexual perversity)?

Serenegoose

15-03-2012, 05:12 PM

Actually now reading The Ambassador's Mission, as opposed to just threatening to. As ever, it's one of those books where I start reading and it's page 200 and I'm not really actually done, I'd quite like to just keep going but I have other things to do.

Althea

15-03-2012, 06:11 PM

And should those same labels be on all Lovecraft books (major racist, hideous anti-semite)? Or Raymond Chandler (mysogynist alcoholic who treated women appallingly)? Hemingway (mysogynist alcoholic)? Harlan Ellison (violent, disparaging man without a shred of decency)? What about the music of Richard Wagner (who's writing, not his music, were quite racist and anti-semitic)? Mozart (incest, sexual perversity)?
Most of them are quite dead though, aren't they? And, of course, one has to apply context to things - not absolve them of what they did, but take it within some context and be thankful that such views are becoming less and less accepted.

OSC isn't and currently contributes financially (i.e. with the money wot he gets from those books) to organisations who seek to restrict/limit the rights of a certain minority, if not completely recriminalise such behaviour.

If I buy Lovecraft, he doesn't get any money from me. If I buy OSC (which I don't), he does.

Rakysh

15-03-2012, 06:23 PM

Solution: buy it from a charity or second hand bookshop.

Althea

15-03-2012, 06:25 PM

Solution #2: Don't buy it at all and spread the word.

Rii

15-03-2012, 06:35 PM

Kadayi

15-03-2012, 06:37 PM

The information bomb - Paul Virilio.

A series of articles written by Virilio. Dense stuff tbh, but given when the writing was done (pre- 1998) surprisingly prescient in terms of predicting the impact of information technology upon society and how the the immediacy of transmission has usurped the physical to a greater or lesser degree.

Jockie

15-03-2012, 06:51 PM

Ooh I like this game. Let us not neglect Poe who married his 13yr-old cousin at age 27.

If we can go cross-media, then are we now all banned from watching the films of Polanski (pedo) and Von Trier (nazi/terrible sense of humour, depending on who you believe)?

Serenegoose

15-03-2012, 07:31 PM

Honestly, it's a legit concern because OSC is going to use your money to try and fuck people up. I don't donate to charities I disagree with, or buy from companies whose practices I dislike, but I also pick my fights. If I applied the rule universally, I'd never buy anything from anyone - Which is unsustainable. Why should a creative work like a book or a film be exempt from these considerations, but I refused to buy AC2 til the ubidrm was toned down to a system I could at least live with?

Though in all honesty, this is why I try not to find out anything about any of the authors I like. Better for me, in this case, to live in ignorance, sad though that might be.

Unaco

15-03-2012, 07:42 PM

Honestly, it's a legit concern because OSC is going to use your money to try and fuck people up.

But, he's not making money from his deplorable beliefs. He keeps them out of his creative works. I don't think that he shouldn't be allowed to earn a living because of his personal beliefs.

Serenegoose

15-03-2012, 07:44 PM

But, he's not making money from his deplorable beliefs. He keeps them out of his creative works. I don't think that he shouldn't be allowed to earn a living because of his personal beliefs.

I'm not stopping him? But if he wants to earn a living from me then he'll have to be a lot less shitty to groups I belong to.

Althea

15-03-2012, 07:44 PM

He keeps them out of his creative works. I don't think that he shouldn't be allowed to earn a living because of his personal beliefs.
Does he fuck.

Hamlet's Father? Ender's Game? Pretty much *every* sci-fi book he's written?

Nalano

15-03-2012, 07:46 PM

If you're going to stop reading/listening/watching material made by people who are troubled/flawed, you'll have very few works to consume.

Shit, alcoholism knocks out a pretty sizable chunk of literature alone.

Althea

15-03-2012, 07:50 PM

If you're going to stop reading/listening/watching material made by people who are troubled/flawed, you'll have very few works to consume.
As SG said, it's a case of picking fights. If you're going to be a homophobic anti-gay rights activist, I have every right to tell you to stick your beliefs up your bigoted arse and I have every right to not support you financially by buying your books.

If someone has a problem with alcohol, then that is different. That is a problem which needs some level of intervention, and I cannot provide that. Chances are you'll use my money to get pissed, but as long as you don't hurt anyone in the process, then fine. Do what you like with your life if you choose to be that way, but if you need help then I hope you get it.

There's a difference between being troubled/flawed and a massive dick. OSC is the latter. He's not the former, he knows full well what he's like.

Unaco

15-03-2012, 07:50 PM

Hamlet's Father? Ender's Game? Pretty much *every* sci-fi book he's written?

Hamlet's Father, I'll grant you... But Ender's Game? What is so deplorable about it?

As SG said, it's a case of picking fights. If you're going to be a homophobic anti-gay rights activist, I have every right to tell you to stick your beliefs up your bigoted arse and I have every right to not support you financially by buying your books.

But that's not what you're saying. You're calling for him to be blacklisted, big warning stickers on his works, because his beliefs outside of those works you find disagreeable. Why just stop at OSC? Shouldn't ALL creative works come with a warning sticker listing the creators beliefs, incase someone finds it disagreeable?

Althea

15-03-2012, 08:01 PM

Hamlet's Father, I'll grant you... But Ender's Game? What is so deplorable about it?
It, like a lot of his books, does contain at least hints of homophobia. I would have thought the enemies being called "The Buggers" would kinda explain itself.

But that's not what you're saying. You're calling for him to be blacklisted, big warning stickers on his works, because his beliefs outside of those works you find disagreeable. Why just stop at OSC? Shouldn't ALL creative works come with a warning sticker listing the creators beliefs, incase someone finds it disagreeable?
Oh no I made a slightly exaggerated comment based on a not-too-serious suggestion by another poster that means I must really believe it should have a bright pink cover that tells people not to buy it

Unaco

15-03-2012, 08:11 PM

It, like a lot of his books, does contain at least hints of homophobia. I would have thought the enemies being called "The Buggers" would kinda explain itself.

Hints of Homophobia huh? As in, that's what someone has interpreted from it? And that's how we should judge creative work... from what people have been able to interpret from it? And are these hints of homophobia shown as positive? Or are they just featured in the book?

And "The Buggers"? Oh no, OSC made a reference to the Insect like qualities of the Formics (from Formicidae - Ants) in their name... a race that is, ultimately, misunderstood and painted in a very favourable light... and you see it as being self explanatory homophobia.

Althea

15-03-2012, 08:17 PM

Hints of Homophobia huh? As in, that's what someone has interpreted from it? And that's how we should judge creative work... from what people have been able to interpret from it? And are these hints of homophobia shown as positive? Or are they just featured in the book?
How the crap do you have "positive homophobia"?

And "The Buggers"? Oh no, OSC made a reference to the Insect like qualities of the Formics (from Formicidae - Ants) in their name... a race that is, ultimately, misunderstood and painted in a very favourable light... and you see it as being self explanatory homophobia.
Yes, I'm aware of that explanation. Are you also aware of the word "buggery"? As in "to bugger" someone? Are you aware that it was a word used in criminal law to define homosexual acts between men, amongst other "unnatural" penetrative acts? Considering OSC's views and beliefs, I would hardly pass it off as anything closely resembling coincidence. They are shown to be attacking humanity, are they not? Let's see... the Buggers are attacking humanity. Hmm... Yeah, you don't see it?

He knew that word. He knew its history. He didn't use it for the fun of it. He. Was. Making. A. Point.

Unaco

15-03-2012, 08:30 PM

How the crap do you have "positive homophobia"?

Is the Homophobia shown in a positive light, like the good thing to do? Or does a character just show some homophobia? Having a Homophobic character in a novel doesn't make that novel homophobic. If it's the defining trait of the great Hero main character, then sure... but if it's just a feature, not shown as a positive thing, then no.

Yes, I'm aware of that explanation. Are you also aware of the word "buggery"? As in "to bugger" someone? Are you aware that it was a word used in criminal law to define homosexual acts between men, amongst other "unnatural" penetrative acts? Considering OSC's views and beliefs, I would hardly pass it off as anything closely resembling coincidence. They are shown to be attacking humanity, are they not? Let's see... the Buggers are attacking humanity. Hmm... Yeah, you don't see it?

He knew that word. He knew its history. He didn't use it for the fun of it. He. Was. Making. A. Point.

Quite aware of it, yes. And yes, the Buggers are attacking humanity. But, the Buggers are ultimately found to be misunderstood (they attacked humans not realising they were sentient, things sort of spiralled from that), and are redeemed in the end. So, the point he was making is that, due to politics and human nature and misunderstandings between people, terrible things happen, but ultimately that's the wrong way to go, and if everyone (humans & formics, gays & non-gays) just get together and communicate, everything is cool. Or, the Buggers may have thrown the first stone, but ultimately, their persecution and eradication is a bad thing, so homophobia, and the persecution of homosexuals is a bad thing, drummed up by man's natural instincts to attack what they see as alien, and through political expediency and exigency. Hmmm... you don't see that? That in the end OSC actually doesn't want to attack homosexuals.

Why attribute to malice something which may have just been an unfortunate choice of derogatory term for the antagonists of the book?

Nalano

15-03-2012, 08:32 PM

Chances are you'll use my money to get pissed, but as long as you don't hurt anyone in the process, then fine.

Eheheheh. Alcoholism can and does hurt a looooooootta people.

Althea

15-03-2012, 08:33 PM

Is the Homophobia shown in a positive light, like the good thing to do? Or does a character just show some homophobia? Having a Homophobic character in a novel doesn't make that novel homophobic. If it's the defining trait of the great Hero main character, then sure... but if it's just a feature, not shown as a positive thing, then no.
Card is, by nature, homophobic. You cannot separate him from his work. Some authors you can - him? No.

Why attribute to malice something which may have just been an unfortunate choice of derogatory term for the antagonists of the book?
Jeez, how naive are you? There is no such thing as an unfortunate choice of derogatory term. He chose it, and used it, for a reason.

If OSC doesn't "want to attack" homosexuals, as you imply, why the flying fuck cakes does he do it?

Eheheheh. Alcoholism can and does hurt a looooooootta people.
Yes, it can and does.

Nalano

15-03-2012, 08:35 PM

Yes, it can and does.

So would you read a book written by an alcoholic, with the reasonable assumption that the advance/proceeds for said book probably allowed the author to continue a destructive lifestyle?

As for espousing values antithetical to modern open society, Wagner was kind of a fascist. Ride of the Valkyries is a fantastic fascist anthem (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzDyVk7DTVQ). Should we stop listening to his music?

Althea

15-03-2012, 08:38 PM

So would you read a book written by an alcoholic, with the reasonable assumption that the advance/proceeds for said book probably allowed the author to continue a destructive lifestyle?
It is a situation I haven't yet encountered, so I have no answer. Alcoholism is often a self-destructive problem that requires medical or psychological intervention due to its nature. Being a homophobic bigot and an active (financially and otherwise) anti-rights activist is not the same.

Cable

15-03-2012, 08:43 PM

Everybody who has ever written a book has written in through their own personal set of biases and prejudices, Card's is more obvious than others and if you choose not to read his books because of it that's fine but it's ok for people to read them if they choose to. It is not possible to separate any creator from their work they influence it's entire creation, how can a book have nothing to do with it's author?

Unaco

15-03-2012, 08:43 PM

Card is, by nature, homophobic. You cannot separate him from his work. Some authors you can - him? No.

Why not?

Jeez, how naive are you? There is no such thing as an unfortunate choice of derogatory term. He chose it, and used it, for a reason.

A derogatory term for an Insect like antagonist. Unfortunate that it also happened to be a derogatory term for homosexuals. The lack of any other homophobia, and the ultimately sympathetic view on the Buggers leads me to believe that it wasn't chosen to attack homosexuals... if he was making an analogy between homosexuals and the Buggers, why would he ultimately redeem them?

If OSC doesn't "want to attack" homosexuals, as you imply, [B]why the flying fuck cakes does he do it?

You interpret the use of the term Bugger as showing that OSC was drawing similarities between the Formics and Homosexuals, that it was a derogatory term for both, and was used as such. But if you continue that interpretation, the only conclusion you can come to, with the Buggers being shown to be misunderstood and their persecution as a negative, is that OSC ultimately sympathises with homosexuals, as he does the Buggers. So... you can't interpret the Buggers being an analogy to homosexuals, unless you accept that he's ultimately painting homosexuals in a favourable light. I think that interpretation is pretty silly... I didn't mean it... but I think it shows that the interpretation of the use of Bugger as a deliberate attack on homosexuals is also a bit silly.

What I'm saying is you can separate OSC's homophobia from his work, at least with Ender's Game. I don't find it has any homophobia in it, and no credible interpretation or analysis I've seen argues that it does contain homophobia.

Nalano

15-03-2012, 08:44 PM

It is a situation I haven't yet encountered, so I have no answer. Alcoholism is often a self-destructive problem that requires medical or psychological intervention due to its nature.

Take away the "self-". And there's still Wagner. Hell, thanks to the nature of the times, one could find fault in just about every creative pre-1960.

Althea

15-03-2012, 08:51 PM

Why not?
Because his attitudes and ideas are in his books. Whether it's subtle and hinted at or full-blown bullshit á la Hamlet's Father, it's there. You buy his books, you give him money, you fuel his activities. That is not good.

A derogatory term for an Insect like antagonist. Unfortunate that it also happened to be a derogatory term for homosexuals. The lack of any other homophobia, and the ultimately sympathetic view on the Buggers leads me to believe that it wasn't chosen to attack homosexuals... if he was making an analogy between homosexuals and the Buggers, why would he ultimately redeem them?
Who knows? There's nothing unfortunate about it, though, considering the term had been in use for over four hundred years before Card even farted for the first time, so combined with his seemingly-encyclopaedic knowledge of homosexuals and homosexuality, one is on shaky ground if suggesting it's mere coincidence

You interpret the use of the term Bugger as showing that OSC was drawing similarities between the Formics and Homosexuals, that it was a derogatory term for both, and was used as such. But if you continue that interpretation, the only conclusion you can come to, with the Buggers being shown to be misunderstood and their persecution as a negative, is that OSC ultimately sympathises with homosexuals, as he does the Buggers. So... you can't interpret the Buggers being an analogy to homosexuals, unless you accept that he's ultimately painting homosexuals in a favourable light. I think that interpretation is pretty silly... I didn't mean it... but I think it shows that the use of Bugger as a deliberate attack on homosexuals is also a bit silly.
I interpret it as I see it. A race called "The Buggers", whether in colloquial terms or otherwise, are the antagonists as they attack humanity. How else can one see it? Whether they're redeemed or not is completely irrelevant, the parallels have been drawn. I've not read it - I certainly have no intention of reading it - and there are people better placed to argue that point. *My* point was that it clearly was linked, that the parallels are there and that it was a deliberate choice on the part of OSC to term them as such.

What I'm saying is you can separate OSC's homophobia from his work, at least with Ender's Game. I don't find it has any homophobia in it, and no credible interpretation or analysis I've seen argues that it does contain homophobia.
And that does not absolve him at all on any level, whether it's Ender's Game (often a gateway into his work) or any other piece he's written. His views, his financial activities, his support - you cannot separate his views from his work at all. They are wound together tightly - looser on some titles, more visible on others - but the ties are there regardless of the piece.

Unaco

15-03-2012, 08:55 PM

I interpret it as I see it. A race called "The Buggers", whether in colloquial terms or otherwise, are the antagonists as they attack humanity. How else can one see it? Whether they're redeemed or not is completely irrelevant, the parallels have been drawn. I've not read it - I certainly have no intention of reading it - and there are people better placed to argue that point. *My* point was that it clearly was linked, that the parallels are there and that it was a deliberate choice on the part of OSC to term them as such.

So... The use of Bugger is relevant, and the fact the Formics are attacking humanity is relevant, but not the ultimate resolution to the book? Why not? If it clearly was linked, why does the ultimate redemption of the Buggers not come into your interpretation? Why ignore that part and just take the beginning out of context? Apply the interpretation consistently, or not at all.

If, as you say, OSC has deep seated homophobic attitudes that leech into every aspect of his work and life, he sure f*cked up by making the Buggers misunderstood and not monsters.

Althea

15-03-2012, 09:00 PM

Well, I can't answer that without reading it, can I? But you can also say "Well, if he's such a homophobe, why does he have gay characters in his books?", can't you? Wait... Lovecraft was a racist and he had ethnic characters in his books. Oops.

Nalano

15-03-2012, 09:02 PM

Well, I can't answer that without reading it, can I?

And here is where the argument ends. Game, set, match, Unaco.

Vague-rant

15-03-2012, 09:12 PM

Also, if you must continue, have your own thread.

Just flicking through House of Silk. Been a fair number of years since I've read Sherlock Holmes so I'm probably not the best person to try and compare it to the "originals". It does seem to be trying a bit hard to be like the originals some times though.

Cable

15-03-2012, 09:21 PM

Jockie

15-03-2012, 10:57 PM

I read Ready Player One, by Ernest Cline for research purposes (see my post several pages back if you can be arsed) and have mixed feelings on it. It's essentially about an MMO that has become the dominant reality for a lot of people in the near future as energy crisis have left much of the world in poverty. In the MMO, the deceased creator has left a series of puzzles or 'easter eggs' and the first person to discover them wins his billion dollar fortune. The creator is also obsessed with 80's games, films and music which all play a part.

As a page turner, it's great. The pacing is tight as hell and it flows off the page. However, the constant pop culture referencing kinds of floats into self-indulgence and well, at times it's all a bit wish-fulfillment fantasy (lacking in plausability). The 'real-world' segments felt a bit flat too, (possibly this was a stylistic choice). It's what you might term a 'cracking yarn' great fun while you're reading it, but it falls apart a little on further analysis. In case your wondering how the MMO cringe factor fits in - it's very well researched and the author knows his stuff, but at times again, it's not all that plausible.

westyfield

15-03-2012, 11:00 PM

I'm reading through Do Androids dream of electric sheep again. I still really like it but i still regret a bit that i read it before i watched blade runner and so was a bit disappointed by the movie instead of just enjoying it for what it was.

I had the same problem. Read the book, loved it, watched the film, didn't enjoy it as much. I can appreciate it from a technical standpoint, but it misses so much out that I thought was really important in the book.

Still reading Alastair Reynolds's Century Rain, haven't got much further but the upcoming Easter holiday will provide some prime reading time.

Nalano

16-03-2012, 05:13 AM

I had the same problem. Read the book, loved it, watched the film, didn't enjoy it as much. I can appreciate it from a technical standpoint, but it misses so much out that I thought was really important in the book.

That's funny, because I thought that PKDick's books were best suited for movies (and there certainly are a lot of 'em made of his works) because he crafts great themes - likely due to his storied history with LSD - that peter out after a hundred pages. I read DADoEC before I watched Blade Runner, and I loved 'em both. I may even like Blade Runner more.

Currently reading Daniel Cavicchi's Listening and Longing.

Cable

16-03-2012, 08:20 AM

I read DADoEC before I watched Blade Runner, and I loved 'em both. I may even like Blade Runner more.

I think I mainly missed the narrative complexity of the book, and I didn't think all the questions about what really makes us human came across as well. I felt the focus on the animals etc was key to the book but was just completely passed over in the movie. To be honest the main problem was probably expecting a faithful translation into film as opposed to it being it's own thing mainly.

Theblazeuk

16-03-2012, 02:40 PM

I much prefer the movie, as it's a better, more focused story. However the book has a wider variety of themes and is also a good read - to be honest, the two have as much in common as From Hell's adaptation and its source material. A Scanner Darkly is the closest PKD (was about to write 'Dick adaptation'! No) adaptation I think.

Nalano

16-03-2012, 03:42 PM

To be honest the main problem was probably expecting a faithful translation into film as opposed to it being it's own thing mainly.

Fuck faithful translations. The medium is different. A Clockwork Orange and A Clockwork Orange are two separate and distinct works, and they're both awesome.

Berzee

16-03-2012, 03:56 PM

I'm all for the movie being different than the book -- but if you're going to make it very much different, why name it after the book? Why not just take the extra half-step to making your own movie, or is it just a coasting-on-the-name-recognition thing?

(I have never actually seen A Clockwork Orange...I'm thinking here mainly of some utterly abominable book-to-movie "translations", in particular -- Howl's Moving Castle -- that alter things so much that you might not be able to tell the two are related if not for the title being the same...Blade Runner doesn't really fit in there because they did in fact change the title -- but I haven't seen that either...mainly I just wanted to post something here so I could feel involved...I'll go now).

Nalano

16-03-2012, 04:02 PM

I'm all for the movie being different than the book -- but if you're going to make it very much different, why name it after the book?

Because it's the same story as the book. Just not down to every little detail because the media are different and things don't translate well.

I have never actually seen A Clockwork Orange

Do yourself a favor and go see it. It's not what Burgess would have done, but I think Kubrick's a better movie director than Burgess.

As for piss-poor book-to-movie translations, well duh, and I can think of maybe three movies that were as epic as the books they took their cues from, but that doesn't change the principle of the thing: They're not 1:1 translations.

Berzee

16-03-2012, 04:19 PM

They're not actually 1:1 translations
Still, I would like to see more of those. =) Some of the movie versions of Jane Austen stories do a pretty faithful recreation of the books, and I never thought they suffered for it (though those books are so exhaustively detailed it's possible there are tons of differences I just don't notice).

In other news, I think I've got The Clockwork Orange confused in my head with James and the Giant Peach.
Is the Orange book worth reading too? Maybe I will read it someday when I begin reading new things again.

Xercies

16-03-2012, 04:23 PM

Still, I would like to see more of those.

Well the time scale of the book versus the movie means that you probably will never get that. Also really whats the point? The book is there read it, I think a film version should go its own way, in fact some of the best film versions of books are anti the book which is kind of true with Clockwork Orange, its clear Kubrick didn't agree with Burgess in the film.

Nalano

16-03-2012, 04:34 PM

Still, I would like to see more of those. =) Some of the movie versions of Jane Austen stories do a pretty faithful recreation of the books, and I never thought they suffered for it (though those books are so exhaustively detailed it's possible there are tons of differences I just don't notice).

[...]

Is the Orange book worth reading too? Maybe I will read it someday when I begin reading new things again.

Dry costume dramas are dry costume dramas. Whatever skill Jane Austen had in crafting a story, the life was drained out in order to make inoffensive movies.

Everything Burgess wrote is worth reading. I'd suggest, on top of ACO, The Wanting Seed and the Enderby cycle.

Well the time scale of the book versus the movie means that you probably will never get that. Also really whats the point? The book is there read it, I think a film version should go its own way, in fact some of the best film versions of books are anti the book which is kind of true with Clockwork Orange, its clear Kubrick didn't agree with Burgess in the film.[/COLOR][/LEFT]

Hell, Chuck Palahniuk stated that he liked David Fincher's ending to Fight Club more than his own.

Tikey

16-03-2012, 06:38 PM

If you get to read The Clockwork Orange (if your edition is similar to mine) you'll notice that there is a glossary. Don't use it. I found it when I finished the book. I saw that there were a lot of pages left and there it was, all the rare words I didn't understand at first. I was a bit frustrated with that discovery but I enjoyed the book a lot more without knowing the meaning of the words beforehand.

Livebythesword

16-03-2012, 07:44 PM

Unaco

16-03-2012, 08:24 PM

I started reading A Clash of Kings a pretty long time ago (second part of a Song of Ice and Fire by GRR Martin) but I stopped reading because things started going so badly for the good guys that I couldn't get myself to continue. But I'll have to finish it someday before the second season of Game of Thrones comes out.

You've only got ~16 days. Season 2 starts April 1st in US, April 2nd in UK. Although, if you thought ACoK had things going badly for the good guys, you might not want to read A Storm of Swords... Although things tend to go badly most people, good or bad, in that.

I highly recommend it, however, especially if you're watching the TV series... The series has been fantastic so far, and from what I've read, it's shaping up to continue that way. But, the TV show does have to compromise, it's inevitable*, and the books really are, in my opinion, the better medium for the story. I had a friend who started watching, and loving, the TV series. Then after it had all aired, she mentioned she was going to pick up the books, so I loaned her my copies. She's nearly finished the 2nd book, and loving it, and says she's really glad she's reading the books before seeing the series, so as not to have the TV series (no matter how good it is) somehow spoil the books. People's mileage may vary on that though... there will be people that would never read the books, but will watch and love the TV series, or people that will prefer the TV series to the books.

*A good example of this I recently read, was GRRM's original script treatment for the moment in the first series when Robb calls his bannermen, and the Ravens fly. He wrote and described a really epic sequence, showing the Ravens arriving, and all of the Lords and whatnot calling their men and preparing to march, and marching out... showing all the diversity of the Nortmen, all the big names and locations. He sent it to the two guys (Benioff & Wise) who run the show, and they responded that it was fantastic, and they'd love to do it... If they had 5-10 times the budget, and an extra 2-4 hours runtime for the series. GRRM conceded, he understands (from working in TV) that there does have to be that compromise, and that his 1st drafts are for himself largely, he knows he'll have to cut away at that, and that, to keep the show profitable and supported by HBO, there can't be a 100% translation of the book to the screen.

Joseph-Sulphur

16-03-2012, 08:46 PM

I just read What It Was by George Pelecanos, and I heartily recommend it. Pelecanos wrote for The Wire and The Pacific, and he's a prolific crime writer too. It's set in 1970s D.C., and while it's not exactly deep it's well written, fast paced and exciting. Pelecanos's love of the city and his memories of it create a real sense of atmosphere. Worth a read for sure if you're into American crime novels.

Jockie

16-03-2012, 09:01 PM

You've only got ~16 days. Season 2 starts April 1st in US, April 2nd in UK. Although, if you thought ACoK had things going badly for the good guys, you might not want to read A Storm of Swords... Although things tend to go badly most people, good or bad, in that.

I highly recommend it, however, especially if you're watching the TV series... The series has been fantastic so far, and from what I've read, it's shaping up to continue that way. But, the TV show does have to compromise, it's inevitable*, and the books really are, in my opinion, the better medium for the story. I had a friend who started watching, and loving, the TV series. Then after it had all aired, she mentioned she was going to pick up the books, so I loaned her my copies. She's nearly finished the 2nd book, and loving it, and says she's really glad she's reading the books before seeing the series, so as not to have the TV series (no matter how good it is) somehow spoil the books. People's mileage may vary on that though... there will be people that would never read the books, but will watch and love the TV series, or people that will prefer the TV series to the books.

*A good example of this I recently read, was GRRM's original script treatment for the moment in the first series when Robb calls his bannermen, and the Ravens fly. He wrote and described a really epic sequence, showing the Ravens arriving, and all of the Lords and whatnot calling their men and preparing to march, and marching out... showing all the diversity of the Nortmen, all the big names and locations. He sent it to the two guys (Benioff & Wise) who run the show, and they responded that it was fantastic, and they'd love to do it... If they had 5-10 times the budget, and an extra 2-4 hours runtime for the series. GRRM conceded, he understands (from working in TV) that there does have to be that compromise, and that his 1st drafts are for himself largely, he knows he'll have to cut away at that, and that, to keep the show profitable and supported by HBO, there can't be a 100% translation of the book to the screen.

Pretty much agree, but I think there's a fairy good chance of the later series' being better than the later books

Cable

16-03-2012, 10:28 PM

Hell, Chuck Palahniuk stated that he liked David Fincher's ending to Fight Club more than his own.

That's funny I much preferred the ending in the book. Also you've reminded me I need to read a clockwork orange too

Fumarole

16-03-2012, 11:08 PM

Fuck faithful translations. The medium is different. This reasoning leads to abominable movies like I Am Legend. Sure it can work, but I'd wager the result is shite more often than not, sort of like porting games from console to PC.

Nalano

17-03-2012, 02:19 AM

This reasoning leads to abominable movies like I Am Legend. Sure it can work, but I'd wager the result is shite more often than not, sort of like porting games from console to PC.

Abominable movies come from abominable directors. There's nothing you can do about that.

Rii

17-03-2012, 03:43 AM

Starship Troopers is an interesting case study. As a translation of the novel the film is abominable, apparently deliberately so. As a work in itself, however, the film is a wonderful satire not (as intended) of the novel, but rather of contemporary American militarism. There's an article on Cracked somewhere highlighting the various uncanny parallels between the film and the War on Terror which makes for funtimes reading.

In the end its simply unfortunate that the two works happen to share the same title, particularly because the film now feeds into popular perception of the book -- where said perception was already a particularly virulent example of Chinese whispers into which the actual content of the novel never really figures. Which isn't to suggest that the novel is a literary or philosophical masterpiece -- it is what it is: an adolescent-level introduction to various concepts of moral philosophy wrapped around a story about guys with guns in powered armour.

The more I think about it, the more apt the comparison with Ender's Game seems.

Keep

17-03-2012, 12:28 PM

I'm being a massive wanker and reading Proust. Slight redemption: I'm really not enjoying it. But I started, and I've got this annoying quirk of not wanting to condemn something before I've really given it the best chances, so here I am. Dammit.

Welp, finished it finally. Nothing but scorn for it by the end. Rubbish. Oh wellz.

Ravelle

17-03-2012, 02:54 PM

I'm walfway through Mass Effect: Ascension.

corbain

17-03-2012, 03:35 PM

Just finished Dickens "Oliver Twist" and must say how enjoyable it was. Quite easy to read, short chapters made progress feel easier perhaps. I have the gamer addiction of needing to complete some "stage" to get satisfaction.

It's the first i've read from my Folio Society collection of his complete works which I bought a few years ago. I really should post some pictures of my bookeshelves here.. i'm making it my mission to turn my house into a library, in the mould of this place:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOCqVm2yz2c

Serenegoose

17-03-2012, 05:14 PM

Finished 'The Ambassador's Mission' - that was fun as anticipated, though perhaps she hopped around the 3 main characters a little too quickly - It feels like a scene only just begins and it's ending again. Still, took me 3 afternoons to read, and does a better job at 'the mages circle' than Dragon Age ever did.

pkdawson

17-03-2012, 10:03 PM

However, the constant pop culture referencing kinds of floats into self-indulgence
I completely agree with all of this. I liked the concept of Ready Player One, but it often degenerates into little more than a vehicle for the author's own obsession with 80s pop culture. It's a bit much. Entertaining fluff, a fun read but a little disappointing.

(One important example of implausibility: I'm quite sure I'm not the only one who instantly caught on to the reference in the first clue. Anyone even a little bit familiar with Gary Gygax would get it, but apparently it stumped millions of obsessive "gunters" for years.)

Vague-rant

18-03-2012, 07:39 AM

Just finished "The Painted Man" (or The Warded Man in some regions). Not bad, but not great either. Certainly I'll try to get my hands on the second book. Characters plot etc. all range from average to good, but I did have a few niggles. The time lapses in the writing seem a little odd- not between chapters, but every now and then it'll jump forward as though there was once text there, but it got cut to speed up the story.

Also, as someone not normally annoyed by this kind of thing, the repeated use of "an herb" made me confused, annoyed and then angry. It appears strangely often in the text and I have to pretend that the h is silent with everyone speaking in a midlands accent.

Althea

18-03-2012, 07:45 AM

Also, as someone not normally annoyed by this kind of thing, the repeated use of "an herb" made me confused, annoyed and then angry. It appears strangely often in the text and I have to pretend that the h is silent with everyone speaking in a midlands accent.
Well, he's an American author.

MD!

18-03-2012, 09:23 AM

Feldspar

18-03-2012, 10:18 AM

Oh man. People who drop the 'h' in 'herb', despite speaking an accent/dialect that never usually drops 'h'es. Don't get me started -.-

I'm sure that had me laughing in DA:O, usually it is because they completely seperate an from 'erb and don't let it flow naturally (I'm very lazy with spoken language).

On topic: Just finished Charles Stross's Halting State a book that I should have probably read ages ago but was put off by the blurb on the back making it sound silly. Being a near future SF novel I'm sure it will probably date horribly over the next few years, but it was written with the likes of RPS readers in mind, without resorting to painfully stopping to explain jargon constantly and maintains a sly, slightly buried humour throughout. Basically it explores how net use has infiltrated day-to-day life and wraps a techno-thriller around augmented and virtually reality games. The use of a second person viewpoint is interesting but works really well, switching between the three main characters between chapters and at no time does the book seem labourious or merely filling pages. I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Nalano

18-03-2012, 02:13 PM

Oh man. People who drop the 'h' in 'herb', despite speaking an accent/dialect that never usually drops 'h'es. Don't get me started -.-

I'm sorry, are the English getting angry that people are speaking English wrong?

Rakysh

18-03-2012, 02:44 PM

If an English person with an English accent drops the "h", I think irritation is acceptable. Obviously don't be a dick about it though.

Keep

18-03-2012, 03:17 PM

My favorite 'erb is uhregeno, but bay-zil and cilantro are nice too.

Fumarole

18-03-2012, 03:25 PM

I just finished Unseen Academicals and I must say it certainly wasn't my favorite Discworld book. In fact I think it may be the weakest. I can't remember ever flipping back in previous Prachett books to see if what I was currently reading jived with what came before, but I was doing that all throughout this book. Also, am I wrong or is this the first book to not feature Death?

Feldspar

18-03-2012, 05:28 PM

I haven't read any Discworld novels for years, but I'm fairly certain they don't all include Death.

Fumarole

18-03-2012, 05:34 PM

According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_(Discworld)) Death is in every book except The Wee Free Men and Snuff (which I have yet to read). Interesting, normally I take note of his appearance but I must have missed it in this one. I guess this may be a symptom of me not normally being as engrossed in a Discworld novel as I usually am.

MD!

18-03-2012, 09:03 PM

I'm sorry, are the English getting angry that people are speaking English wrong?

I'm not English, and I wasn't angry. Thanks for apologising though; through you, I forgive your people their (ridiculous) errors.

Theblazeuk

19-03-2012, 11:17 AM

Who the needs the H in 'erb eh?

Probably something like half the country drops their H's. Weird conversation.

(edit - I do get what you mean with 'An Herb' though, which is just poor editing)

westyfield

19-03-2012, 11:44 AM

People who drop their 'H's are the worst. Presumably in a few generations we'll call someone who studies the past "a nistorian". It's napron/apron, nadder/adder, norange/orange all over again, and I hate it.
Grr.

Tikey

19-03-2012, 12:44 PM

I finished reading PKD's Ubik. I practically devoured it in less than two days. I always thought that PKD's short stories were much better than his novels. I stand corrected. This book was an amazing display of his writing.

Similar

19-03-2012, 06:46 PM

Read The Hunger Games trilogy in a day and a half, so I guess it grabbed me. Knowing practically nothing about it before I started reading was nice too.

Oof

21-03-2012, 08:33 AM

About Financial Accounting.

Sigh.

LennyLeonardo

21-03-2012, 08:57 AM

I LOVE it. I really hope the future has nistorians. Also nistorectomies, neiroglyphics and nydrogen.

Actually, dropping the 'h' isn't much like the nadder/norange thing. There, you're removing the 'n' from the original noun and giving it to the 'a' to form 'an' due to a slight confusion with the pronunciation. Here it's almost the opposite. You're giving the 'n' from 'an' to the noun and removing the 'h', which is often removed in pronunciation by right-thinking cockneys.

Not having a go or anything, just saying.

Serenegoose

21-03-2012, 04:48 PM

Now I'm finished The Rogue, too. That series won't update til August (sadface) so I'm back to rooting around in bookshops to find something I want to read in the meantime.

ChiYeon

22-03-2012, 06:40 AM

the alchemist: pualo coehlo

Serenegoose

22-03-2012, 12:51 PM

The Blade itself, Joe Abercrombie. The entirely male cast is a bit offputting but oh well.

Ian

22-03-2012, 03:58 PM

Finished the second Song of Ice and Fire book. Tyrion is the best.

Reading The Collaborator by Gerald Seymour now, but I've got the next SOIAF book ordered. Is it at the third one that I've read I should expect it to tail off a bit?

Jockie

22-03-2012, 04:54 PM

but I've got the next SOIAF book ordered. Is it at the third one that I've read I should expect it to tail off a bit?

Depends, Storm of swords was split into two books in the UK, both are excellent. Feast for Crows is probably the weakest in the series and ADWD is a little bit laboured in terms of plotting (but on the plus side has lots of Tyrion).

So end of book four, unless you got ASOS in one volume.

Cable

22-03-2012, 07:49 PM

Yea I think Storm of Swords was my favourite one probably the 4th and 5th ones go a bit downhill. I still enjoyed them though.

westyfield

22-03-2012, 08:17 PM

Reading The Collaborator by Gerald Seymour now, but I've got the next SOIAF book ordered. Is it at the third one that I've read I should expect it to tail off a bit?

A Feast for Crows (book 4) is the one that seems to drag on a bit. A Storm of Swords (book 3, but it's in two volumes) is probably my favourite after the first book. It's where shit gets real, as the urban youth would have one say.

Ravelle

22-03-2012, 10:06 PM

I finished the second Mass Effect Novel : Ascension and ordered the next in line, can't wait to continue reading.

Fumarole

22-03-2012, 11:04 PM

the alchemist: pualo coehlo'tis a good book. One Christmas many years a go a friend of mine bought a copy for everyone he was giving gifts to.

Ian

23-03-2012, 10:05 AM

Yeah, I'm two-voluming it for Storm of Swords which initially confused the bejesus out of me as I didn't know it had been split.

Jockie

23-03-2012, 10:23 AM

I finished Best Served Cold Last a couple days ago, decided to move onto The Heroes yesterday.

*SPOILERS*
I loved Shivers' inverted character arc in BSC. Normally a protagonist (although he's not the 'main' character, he's a close second) character grows, normally an author works hard to make an unlikeable character likable (hell he did it with Jezal and Glotka to a degree in First Law trilogy). Here the character's ideals erode until he's left as a sort of scarred and bitter husk of a man. Only criticism is that he felt a little bit Ninefingers mk II (goes away to a foreign land, is optimistic about becoming a better person, ends up worse/relapsing into violence).

Apparently BSC received criticism on its release for having no characters who were likeable. I find that bizarre, although all of the characters are morally dubious, they're all likeable in their own way. Even Morveer a preening little rat of a man, is sympathetic, because he's an emotionally retarded narcissist who is incapable of empathy or seeing himself through anyone else's eyes.

---

Got a kindle for my birthday (21st Feb) and realised I've read 6 full-length books since then already, including 4 Joe Abercrombie, Ender's Game (I know, boo hiss etc.) and Ready Player One by Ernest Cline. There are probably a few arguements about how Kindles are evil, because they're tied to a single retailer and they lack the 'soul' of a traditional book, but I fucking love mine, just makes the process of buying and reading books so simple and quick.

Rii

23-03-2012, 01:24 PM

Currently reading:

The End of Eternity -- Isaac Asimov
Patterns of Empire: the British and American Empires, 1688 to the Present -- Julian Go
The Science of Good and Evil -- Michael Shermer

On a vaguely related note, curse Amazon for ending free shipping to Aus/NZ!

Serenegoose

23-03-2012, 01:28 PM