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View Full Version : Is Apple Trying to Build a Cult in Hong Kong?



squirrel
26-09-2011, 09:11 AM
Recently I was told that Apple recently open a directly-owned outlet in Hong Kong, somewhere in its CBD called Central (what a good name, huh, I dont even know where the CBD of Shanghai is, Shanghaiers should also make such a cool name for their CBD I guess). These are the two videos I was forwarded:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ogNj_eE0ww&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTETZLDKuzQ&feature=youtu.be

You dont need to learn Cantonese to understand what's going on in those videos as they are "self-explanatory". Those Apple boys and girls were just yelling around their customers. Looks much like a powerful psychological warfare to me.

NecroKnight
26-09-2011, 10:15 AM
Lol, so much ado about nothing.

Jorum
26-09-2011, 11:31 AM
Apple brand is almost entirely based on image and perception, so it makes sense that they try to make everything exciting and "an event". Otherwise all those potential new customers in Shanhai might notice it's just a very expensive PC.

Xercies
26-09-2011, 12:14 PM
I watched a documentry on technology and it was talking about how Apple stores ahave kind of turned into like a religious experience for a lot of people. It even lights up the same brain waves that religion usually would as well...so I wouldn't be surprised.

Tei
26-09-2011, 01:56 PM
The idea to put design as the most important thing in a electronic device is a interesting one. Suprising enough, only one company, Apple (and under the direction of a single person) has managed to support it. One would expect that people would put more trought on how to design things, both the look & feel. But not. Most things are hazardous put togueter and as much, designed by comite.

Stuff, like the desktops that Microsoft make, are lame and stupid. No one has really trought about the whole thing, or part of it, or how to improve the life of the people using it. And pretty much everything else is build that way. Your car, your dumbphone, the HP laptop.

You can put a mp3 on a table, and next to it a ipod, and you can say the ipod is "just a expensive mp3 player". While the reality is that the ipod is a mineaturized PC, where you can browse webs, watch youtube, read email, maybe connect with ssh with a server and launch a rocket to the moon. There are people that "Get it", and there are people that don't "Get it". The people that don't get it buy a cheap mp3 player.

Rinox
26-09-2011, 03:02 PM
You can put a mp3 on a table, and next to it a ipod, and you can say the ipod is "just a expensive mp3 player". While the reality is that the ipod is a mineaturized PC, where you can browse webs, watch youtube, read email, maybe connect with ssh with a server and launch a rocket to the moon. There are people that "Get it", and there are people that don't "Get it". The people that don't get it buy a cheap mp3 player.

Or, they use a 20 € MP3 player for listening to music and the PC or laptop they have anyway for the rest, instead of a 2X2 cm display item.

gundrea
26-09-2011, 03:29 PM
Stuff, like the desktops that Microsoft make, are lame and stupid. No one has really trought about the whole thing, or part of it, or how to improve the life of the people using it. And pretty much everything else is build that way. Your car, your dumbphone, the HP laptop.



While I find your posts religiously enlightening Tei I must point out that Microsoft do not manufacture PCs.

Tikey
26-09-2011, 03:31 PM
The idea to put design as the most important thing in a electronic device is a interesting one. Suprising enough, only one company, Apple (and under the direction of a single person) has managed to support it. One would expect that people would put more trought on how to design things, both the look & feel. But not. Most things are hazardous put togueter and as much, designed by comite.

Stuff, like the desktops that Microsoft make, are lame and stupid. No one has really trought about the whole thing, or part of it, or how to improve the life of the people using it. And pretty much everything else is build that way. Your car, your dumbphone, the HP laptop.

You can put a mp3 on a table, and next to it a ipod, and you can say the ipod is "just a expensive mp3 player". While the reality is that the ipod is a mineaturized PC, where you can browse webs, watch youtube, read email, maybe connect with ssh with a server and launch a rocket to the moon. There are people that "Get it", and there are people that don't "Get it". The people that don't get it buy a cheap mp3 player.

It's a shame because Microsoft has a very good ID department.
But what apple does that no other company has been able to emulate is the design of experiences. They don't only design the devices with amazing care, but the whole microsystem. That's why it's "walled garden" has been very useful to them.

NecroKnight
26-09-2011, 08:48 PM
Apple products are no better then those of others, but still cost twice as much.

Nalano
26-09-2011, 09:26 PM
The idea to put design as the most important thing in a electronic device is a interesting one. Suprising enough, only one company, Apple (and under the direction of a single person) has managed to support it. One would expect that people would put more trought on how to design things, both the look & feel. But not. Most things are hazardous put togueter and as much, designed by comite.

Stuff, like the desktops that Microsoft make, are lame and stupid. No one has really trought about the whole thing, or part of it, or how to improve the life of the people using it. And pretty much everything else is build that way. Your car, your dumbphone, the HP laptop.

You can put a mp3 on a table, and next to it a ipod, and you can say the ipod is "just a expensive mp3 player". While the reality is that the ipod is a mineaturized PC, where you can browse webs, watch youtube, read email, maybe connect with ssh with a server and launch a rocket to the moon. There are people that "Get it", and there are people that don't "Get it". The people that don't get it buy a cheap mp3 player.


1) What? (http://www.google.com/search?q=tablet+PCs&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#q=tablet+PCs&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&hs=X3x&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=imvnsur&source=univ&tbm=shop&tbo=u&sa=X&ei=et-ATsCpMsjz0gHR9_HdDw&ved=0CLYBEK0E&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=53109c92d744947c&biw=1212&bih=679)

2) Microsoft does not make PCs.

3) Huh? (http://www.google.com/search?q=touch+phone&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#q=touch+phone&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&hs=c4x&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=imvnsr&source=univ&tbm=shop&tbo=u&sa=X&ei=vd-ATo76HIGE0QGipNQD&ved=0CLABEK0E&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=53109c92d744947c&biw=1212&bih=679)

Tikey
26-09-2011, 10:15 PM
Apple products are no better then those of others, but still cost twice as much.

That's because apple doesn't sell products. Apple sell "experiences", sells image. That's what sets it apart.

EDIT: I've realized that my post sounds too much like an ad. But it's important to understand the success of apple how their design process isn't product driven but user focused. And of course their marketing genius has a lot of influence too.
An apple product isn't designed with horsepower in mind or to out-feature the competition. It does have an impressive attention to detail.

Berzee
27-09-2011, 01:19 AM
The people that don't get it buy a cheap mp3 player.

So do the people with very basic mp3 player needs :)

soldant
27-09-2011, 01:38 AM
Tikey is right, Apple sell well based on how they present their device to the end user. In the desktop/laptop sector they're still a niche market and they know it. Personally I think OS X is an atrocious operating system (having used it on and off for a few years) but I can see why some people might like it. They also have done a pretty good job at developing all-in-one systems with a decent amount of grunt. The iMacs have pretty good components for an AIO... it's just that they cost a fortune.

As for the tablet/phone sector: Apple did a lot of good there and I'll gladly give them credit for making an efficient mobile OS. It's not as customisable as many want (given how many people jailbreak it, but Android isn't totally immune to this either) but it's still a good mobile OS which is easy to use and suits the form factor well. Prior to that we had Windows Mobile (terrible), Palm (terribly limited), and tablet PCs ran Windows XP and were pretty much all slow, clunky, and borderline pointless. They didn't invent the form factor but they actually did something worthwhile with it, not "Oh let's just put a desktop OS on this box and hope it works."

Harlander
27-09-2011, 09:16 AM
No one has really trought about the whole thing, or part of it, or how to improve the life of the people using it. And pretty much everything else is build that way. Your car

Yeah! Porsche, Bentley.. what do they know?

Lukasz
27-09-2011, 10:30 AM
I have problem comprehending how people can like apple designs. Outerlook of their products.
They always look the same. Been looking the same for past 5 years. My first ipod nano black looks the same as iphone 4 or whatever the new one is called.
Same shapes, same colors (except that mini mp3 players).
I got sick of it over three years ago and since then it got worse cause its everywhere and its all the same.

Tei
27-09-2011, 12:39 PM
While I find your posts religiously enlightening Tei I must point out that Microsoft do not manufacture PCs.

I was talking about the desktop metaphora. Saying Microsoft make OS's in plural is doubious, so I said desktops, like the Windows 2000, Vista and Windows 7 one. These are more "desktops + new kernel version" that new OS.

Sorry about the confusion.

Anyway, who call PC's "desktops"? what weird type of people say "I have buy a desktop" to mean a PC? burn then!, burn then alive!.


Yeah! Porsche, Bentley.. what do they know?

Ooops. Well.. maybe more people really design things and not just fill bullet point list, other than apple and maybe some luxury car manufacturer. I can't tell, I don't know much about cars to tell what is a bunch of "bullet points" and what is a designed car. Something designed, is something done with a motive, but wen you have a product on your hands, and the color is white, you don't know if the color was choosed by a random number generator, by a comite, by tastes, or is designed. So is hard to tell wen something is designed vs everything else.

Nalano
27-09-2011, 12:52 PM
Anyway, who call PC's "desktops"? what weird type of people say "I have buy a desktop" to mean a PC? burn then!, burn then alive!

They say 'desktops' when they want to differentiate between them and laptops, ie: "This is to be a computer with an actual upgrade path and not just a conversation piece to pick up cankleskanks at Starbucks."

Harlander
27-09-2011, 01:11 PM
So is hard to tell wen something is designed vs everything else.

Not especially. "Designed" doesn't mean "well designed", it just means "designed."

If something is made of more than one part, it's probably had to be designed to specify how its parts will fit together, etc. etc.

Also, I've now read the word designed so many times it's becoming difficult to read.

Designed designed designed!

soldant
27-09-2011, 01:12 PM
Anyway, who call PC's "desktops"? what weird type of people say "I have buy a desktop" to mean a PC? burn then!, burn then alive!.
The nomenclature has been pretty well chewed up and excreted in a messy fashion when it comes to naming devices and form factors these days. Kind of like how "PC" now refers almost exclusively to Windows-based systems, Mac has become synonymous with Apple, and Linux is just "Everything Linux".

I use "desktop" to refer to the specific form factor of a computer that sits on your desk and is stationary, whether it's ATX, micro ATX, AIO, whatever. Then again, I'm sure other people have a better definition. Let's ask a friend:


"This is to be a computer with an actual upgrade path and not just a conversation piece to pick up cankleskanks at Starbucks."
What the...?

CuriousOrange
27-09-2011, 01:32 PM
I know for a fact that my flatmates Apple products make up for his own lack of identity. He has even used my Pc, loved it. Used my partners Windows Phone, fell in love with it and saw how much better it was than his iPhone. He then claims he will move away from Apple, but can't.

He is trapped, he can see it's the worse product, but he worships them and if he didn't buy their products any more he would lose his identity. The way they lock people in to their products is rather nasty. But very clever.

Tikey
27-09-2011, 01:36 PM
I have problem comprehending how people can like apple designs. Outerlook of their products.
They always look the same. Been looking the same for past 5 years. My first ipod nano black looks the same as iphone 4 or whatever the new one is called.
Same shapes, same colors (except that mini mp3 players).
I got sick of it over three years ago and since then it got worse cause its everywhere and its all the same.

If you want to understand apple design philosophy read about Dieter Rams. But to sum it up. "Good design is as little design as possible".
And also apple aesthetics is part of its brand, they can't go changing it every year. And of course maybe it's a good thing they look similar, it's a consistent design through the company output.

And from a design standpoint apple products are amazing. Their attention to detail in unmatched, and the thought behind the manufacturing process (in a lot of things you can't even appreciate) is very deep. You might not like it but it's impossible to criticise apple's ID.

Nalano
27-09-2011, 01:55 PM
(in a lot of things you can't even appreciate)

"It's all really deep; you wouldn't understand it" is practically a hipster mantra.

Tikey
27-09-2011, 02:02 PM
I meant as in a lot of manufacturing process that aren't reflected on the final product. Internal composition and such. You can't appreciate how they have very little waste of material while looking at an imac, but a lot of thought went into that.


Lukasz
27-09-2011, 03:04 PM
If you want to understand apple design philosophy read about Dieter Rams. But to sum it up. "Good design is as little design as possible".
And also apple aesthetics is part of its brand, they can't go changing it every year. And of course maybe it's a good thing they look similar, it's a consistent design through the company output.

And from a design standpoint apple products are amazing. Their attention to detail in unmatched, and the thought behind the manufacturing process (in a lot of things you can't even appreciate) is very deep. You might not like it but it's impossible to criticise apple's ID.
its not about quality.

they are just plain ugly. same stuff years after years. and its everywhere. everyone else copies it. My niece got recently that ipod for 300 bucks (whatever that is) blackish. its well made no doubt about it but its awful looking. looks the same almost like my ipod nano from over 4 years ago.

Tikey
27-09-2011, 03:23 PM
Ugly and beauty are terribly subjective terms.

Xercies
27-09-2011, 03:58 PM
i find them nice to look at, except for the Ipad that definitely doesn't look that great.

Tei
27-09-2011, 06:24 PM
Ugly and beauty are terribly subjective terms.

Still young is normally prettier than old.

Chaos uglier than some order.

Following proportions prettier than pure chaos or pure octogonal.

We share bias. And we share ideas about what is pretty and elegant.

So while we can't agree on everything, we can agree on something. Knowing and following these ideas we can try to create things with universal appeal. Or with as universal as possible appeal.

Tikey
27-09-2011, 06:47 PM
Yes and no.
Yes, we can get some consensus on some elements of beauty and ugliness, but you can't attack a product because you find it "ugly" without actually giving justification.
Apple products my be "the same" but it could be because of an anachronic aesthetic. And of course all that's been mentioned about order and proportions can be applied to apple products (mainly because that's the design concepts behind them).

Nalano
27-09-2011, 06:55 PM
Yes and no.

This is a dumb tangent. Can we get back to talking about Apple's marketing schema again?

NecroKnight
28-09-2011, 10:00 AM
Apple is really good at making people belive that they are buying something better, something special and by that they are a part of a special community. You can even detect hints of elitism.

By the way, I think the Macs keyboard just looks horrible. When I see it, I feel a urge to smash it with a hammer, to completelly destroy it until it's unreckognisable. Also the mouse doesn't look really comfortable.

Nalano
28-09-2011, 12:59 PM
You can even detect hints of elitism.

Justin Long is more (http://www.slate.com/id/2143810/) than a hint (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/feb/05/comment.media). :P