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View Full Version : Weekly sales of MW3 hit 12million, wow...



CrazyEthan
17-11-2011, 09:24 AM
I have to say that the number is sick. Oh man, I can't wait to see the yearly sales figure of MW3.

BF3 week 2 sales
Battlefield 3 (Xbox 360) over 3.07million----awesome
Battlefield 3 (PS 3) over 2.17million-----perfect
Battlefield 3 (PC) over 657,000----not bad
MW3 weekly sales
Call of Duty 8: Mordern Warfare 3 (Xbox 360) 7 million---fantastic

Call of Duty 8: Mordern Warfare 3 (PS3) over 4 million----brilliant

Call of Duty 8: Mordern Warfare 3 (PC) over 500,000----kind of suck

371

Jockie
17-11-2011, 10:43 AM
Where are the stats from?

CrazyEthan
17-11-2011, 10:49 AM
They are from vgchartz.com!

Althea
17-11-2011, 10:53 AM
Was it ever confirmed the PC of MW3 only did 500k? Last I heard, that was PC and DS, and it wasn't known if that included digital.

apricotsoup
17-11-2011, 10:57 AM
Almost all of these charts completely ignore digital and vgchartz have been proved massively wrong on many occasions.

I wouldn't take these numbers as anything other than informed speculation.

Vexing Vision
17-11-2011, 02:28 PM
VGchartz is actually quite accurate for boxed titles.

However, VGChartz does not take any digital distribution into account. At all. No Steam, no D2D, no Gamersgate. They do track Amazon though, at least.

Jockie
17-11-2011, 02:31 PM
VGchartz is actually quite accurate for boxed titles.

However, VGChartz does not take any digital distribution into account. At all. No Steam, no D2D, no Gamersgate. They do track Amazon though, at least.

Pretty much rules out any degree of accuracy regarding PC sales then.

Vexing Vision
17-11-2011, 02:43 PM
Pretty much rules out any degree of accuracy regarding PC sales then.

Yup. But giving a pretty good view at Console-sales, which are useful enough.

Kadayi
17-11-2011, 03:09 PM
Yeah VG chartz are generally terrible when it comes to PC sales data: -

http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/game/43322/deus-ex-human-revolution/

DXHR only sold 200K PC units apparently..

squirrel
17-11-2011, 03:30 PM
Almost all of these charts completely ignore digital and vgchartz have been proved massively wrong on many occasions.

I wouldn't take these numbers as anything other than informed speculation.

Since both games are implemented with restrictive DRM (I know most of you are Steam fanboy, but Steam IS restrictive DRM), I think most people would prefer download version over disc version. Besides, I heard angry complaints from my friends that disc version of Battlefield 3 is one hell of buggy soft. Some even took 3 hours to install. Yes you read this right, THREE HOURS!! Some less well built laser head might have been destroyed by overheating I guess. Seems to be caused by absence of latest update on the disc version, which caused some compatibility issues with Origin (I dont know, installation itself requires Origin? I thought only activation requires it). Interestingly, some said that they could actually take the CD-keys to download the soft online from Origin, much faster than the buggy installation from disc. I cannot try out the game myself so I cannot verify if this method really works though.

Otherwise, sale counts of less than 700K on a platform is really disappointing. Community support is too damn weak for an online game to survive for more than 1 year. Not a good investment for gamers.

kyrieee
17-11-2011, 03:32 PM
On the other hand Witcher 2 only sold something like 25% or less of its units digitally. Maybe we like to assume that DD is bigger than it actually is.

CrinnyCow
17-11-2011, 05:41 PM
On the other hand Witcher 2 only sold something like 25% or less of its units digitally. Maybe we like to assume that DD is bigger than it actually is.

But TW2 also offered a MUCH bigger incentive to buy physical then Battlefield 3 or MW3. The Witcher 2 isn't tied to any service through DRM and came will all kinds of extras that appeal directly toward the crowd the game was aimed at. In this case, buying the physical copy of TW2 was a clearly better purchase whereas Battlefield 3 and Modern Warfare 3 offered little or nothing in the way of complimentary physical content.

Lukasz
17-11-2011, 10:24 PM
what cow the crinny said.

I buy most of my games digitally yet there was only one choice with TW2. especially since i got the so awesome collectors edition.

so B3 did not beat COD. Wonder how much removal from steam harmed the sales.

Althea
17-11-2011, 10:29 PM
so B3 did not beat COD. Wonder how much removal from steam harmed the sales.
Removal? It was never there to be removed. I would also think that the Origin requirement probably did more to harm sales than a no-show on Steam, anyway.

But either way, BF3's retail sales show immediately that Steam does not and will not make or break a major release.

Lukasz
17-11-2011, 10:36 PM
Removal? It was never there to be removed.
yeah yeah. EA removal. You know what i meant.

I would also think that the Origin requirement probably did more to harm sales than a no-show on Steam, anyway.
You are probably right.
but still major sales are on console and B3 has just half of what COD has.

Althea
17-11-2011, 10:47 PM
yeah yeah. EA removal. You know what i meant.
No, not really. Are you referring to the times Valve removed a few EA games from Steam, because Valve are selfish and want all t3h DLC monehz for themselves?


but still major sales are on console and B3 has just half of what COD has.
Because many would have had their pre-orders in as soon as MW3 was announced, Battlefield as a series has little history and heritage on consoles and as such isn't as big a "brand" as MW3, and it released just at the start of a massive release schedule for major publishers. I think BF3 did very well, all things considered.

Lukasz
17-11-2011, 10:51 PM
No, not really. Are you referring to the times Valve removed a few EA games from Steam, because Valve are selfish and want all t3h DLC monehz for themselves?
I am referring to new EA games not being published on Steam anymore.

Althea
17-11-2011, 11:00 PM
I am referring to new EA games not being published on Steam anymore.
But they are. Not all of them, admittedly, but some are still appearing.

Lukasz
17-11-2011, 11:06 PM
But they are. Not all of them, admittedly, but some are still appearing.

Really? i was not aware of any new EA releases on steam. I thought it was completely removal of any new EA games.

Smashbox
17-11-2011, 11:21 PM
On the other hand Witcher 2 only sold something like 25% or less of its units digitally. Maybe we like to assume that DD is bigger than it actually is.
I thought I read The Witcher 2 's Steam sales were higher than all others combined.

Althea
17-11-2011, 11:29 PM
I thought I read The Witcher 2 's Steam sales were higher than all others combined.
The Witcher 2 did ~1M units according to the referenced report. 25% of those were digital, and of those 25% of sales, ~80% came from Steam. The other digital sales (GOG, etc) made up the last ~20%.


Really? i was not aware of any new EA releases on steam. I thought it was completely removal of any new EA games.
Nope. The "removal" only really affected Dragon Age 2 and Crysis 2, because EA were/wanted to sell DLC without Valve as a middleman - as they had done for years, basically. Valve had reportedly updated their terms for publishers, and such behaviour was not "allowed". The latest EA-developed games to arrive were The Sims 3 Pets and The Sims Medieval: Pirates and Nobles (http://store.steampowered.com/publisher/Electronic%20Arts), two expansion packs for titles already on Steam. You know what's stupid? Bulletstorm is a GfWL game that came out about two weeks before DA2, and that's still on Steam but its DLC isn't available. Ridiculous, if you ask me.

Lukasz
17-11-2011, 11:57 PM
Nope. The "removal" only really affected Dragon Age 2 and Crysis 2, because EA were/wanted to sell DLC without Valve as a middleman - as they had done for years, basically. Valve had reportedly updated their terms for publishers, and such behaviour was not "allowed". The latest EA-developed games to arrive were The Sims 3 Pets and The Sims Medieval: Pirates and Nobles (http://store.steampowered.com/publisher/Electronic%20Arts), two expansion packs for titles already on Steam. You know what's stupid? Bulletstorm is a GfWL game that came out about two weeks before DA2, and that's still on Steam but its DLC isn't available. Ridiculous, if you ask me.
Yeah. I checked that myself. The removed Crysis 2 and DA2 but not new games were released on steam since then. Alice is the oldest and it is 5 months old.
What you quoted are just expansion packs to games already released on steam so not releasing them would screw any customer who bought the core games which EA cannot afford to do.

so yeah EA does not release any new games on Steam at the moment.
thats what I meant by "removal". and how B3 not being on steam affected its PC sales and sales altogether. if it did at all.

Althea
18-11-2011, 12:03 AM
Yeah. I checked that myself. The removed Crysis 2 and DA2 but not new games were released on steam since then. Alice is the oldest and it is 5 months old.
What you quoted are just expansion packs to games already released on steam so not releasing them would screw any customer who bought the core games which EA cannot afford to do.

so yeah EA does not release any new games on Steam at the moment.
Aside from BF3, have EA actually released any games since Alice? I honestly don't think they have, so we can't say that they're not releasing new games on Steam. According to their site (http://www.ea.com/uk/past-year#2) (it's a UK link, not sure it'll work for you), they've only released one Harry Potter game since Alice, and even then the only Harry Potter game on Steam now is the Years 1-4 LEGO game, which has nothing to do with EA. The other EA HP titles aren't there.

Lukasz
18-11-2011, 12:09 AM
Aside from BF3, have EA actually released any games since Alice? I honestly don't think they have, so we can't say that they're not releasing new games on Steam. According to their site (http://www.ea.com/uk/past-year#2) (it's a UK link, not sure it'll work for you), they've only released one Harry Potter game since Alice, and even then the only Harry Potter game on Steam now is the Years 1-4 LEGO game, which has nothing to do with EA. The other EA HP titles aren't there.
mhm. no preoder for me3 but its on origin, d2d (can't check that but google shows its there) and gamersgate. anyhow we will see whether december releases are on steam or not...

Althea
18-11-2011, 12:14 AM
And? It's not just EA who don't have their upcoming titles up on Steam. Ubisoft's Anno 2070 only appeared today, on release day. Mass Effect 3 isn't showing on GamersGate for me, but Kingdoms of Amalur is. The Sims expansion packs I mentioned were available for pre-order in various places, but basically showed up on or close to the release date - it's not uncommon for it to happen with Steam.

For all we know, EA are trying to get their games on Steam but Valve are blocking them. Until we are in possession of all the facts - which we are not - we cannot assume it is EA at fault.

Lukasz
18-11-2011, 01:24 AM
we cannot assume it is EA at fault.

? I never assumed that. what relevance it has in the first place to B3 sales?

CrazyEthan
18-11-2011, 07:52 AM
Was it ever confirmed the PC of MW3 only did 500k? Last I heard, that was PC and DS, and it wasn't known if that included digital.
PC is declining, no, no digital sales included I think.

sabrage
18-11-2011, 08:04 AM
PC isn't declining; iron sights simulators have a different target audience than the vast majority of PC gamers. Portal 2 outsold its console counterparts on the PC.

Subatomic
18-11-2011, 08:21 AM
On the other hand Witcher 2 only sold something like 25% or less of its units digitally. Maybe we like to assume that DD is bigger than it actually is.

I think many people do that. For one, I'm sure the majority of "casual" and younger gamers still buy their games in stores or order them from online retailers like amazon (or their parents buy them there). Second, Steam is a bad deal in a lot of countries, with AAA games being more expensive on the DD market than in retail. Also, unlike the UK and US, most of stores still have PC games on their shelves across the rest of the world. ;)

Skalpadda
18-11-2011, 08:47 AM
Nope. The "removal" only really affected Dragon Age 2 and Crysis 2, because EA were/wanted to sell DLC without Valve as a middleman - as they had done for years, basically. Valve had reportedly updated their terms for publishers, and such behaviour was not "allowed".

Are there any solid sources on this or is it still just speculation based on a snarky and vague EA press release?

Althea
18-11-2011, 10:20 AM
? I never assumed that. what relevance it has in the first place to B3 sales?
You are the one who said "EA aren't releasing new games on Steam". And I never said it was relevant to the Battlefield 3 sales.


Are there any solid sources on this or is it still just speculation based on a snarky and vague EA press release?
Well, Valve have hardly come out and denied it, have they? Gaben has just said some shit about money and that's it. But look at the Steam store - Have you seen any games recently that have sold DLC externally (ignoring the F2P MMOs)? When Fable 3 came on Steam, it brought its DLC with it. I reckon there has to be some truth to it, although I won't say I 100% believe EA.

Lukasz
18-11-2011, 11:07 AM
You are the one who said "EA aren't releasing new games on Steam". And I never said it was relevant to the Battlefield 3 sales.

So? did I say it's their fault/it's not their fault?

Althea
18-11-2011, 11:19 AM
So? did I say it's their fault/it's not their fault?
Not in that way, no, but the way you phrased it implied you were saying that EA are choosing not to release games on Steam, ergo one could take that to mean you are saying that it's EA's fault that some of their new titles - of which there are actually only two (Battlefield 3, Need for Speed: The Run) - are not on Steam.

Wording is key.

Lukasz
18-11-2011, 11:38 AM
Not in that way, no, but the way you phrased it implied you were saying that EA are choosing not to release games on Steam, ergo one could take that to mean you are saying that it's EA's fault that some of their new titles - of which there are actually only two (Battlefield 3, Need for Speed: The Run) - are not on Steam.

Wording is key.
Reading what people write is the key :) :) Your assumption had no evidence as it was simple statement of fact that EA is not releasing games on steam anymore (there is no statement about them not wanting/valve forbidding). Any implications are perceived.

Anyhow your misunderstanding is not an issue and our little discussion is completely offtopic.


So MW3 sold better than each previous COD game
http://www.mw3-forum.com/call-of-duty-modern-warfare-3/mw3-sales-figures

I guess market doesn't have enough of COD games and activision can produce one every year. As a person who did not really play much of COD series (only MW1 SP mode and MW2 MP on xbox for few hours) is there any real difference between games?
They are modern shooters so how creative can they really be?

Skalpadda
18-11-2011, 02:03 PM
Well, Valve have hardly come out and denied it, have they? Gaben has just said some shit about money and that's it. But look at the Steam store - Have you seen any games recently that have sold DLC externally (ignoring the F2P MMOs)? When Fable 3 came on Steam, it brought its DLC with it. I reckon there has to be some truth to it, although I won't say I 100% believe EA.

You mean this, (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/08/17/newell-says-valve-need-to-bring-ea-back/) I assume? I'm not saying you or anyone else is wrong, just that what both EA and Valve have said is so vague that the only thing that can be safely assumed is that it has something to do with selling content and one or both of them not being happy with the other one's terms. Anything else seems to be a case of the magical speculation -> assumption -> fact process of internet forums.

deano2099
18-11-2011, 02:26 PM
On the other hand Witcher 2 only sold something like 25% or less of its units digitally. Maybe we like to assume that DD is bigger than it actually is.

I don't think so, it's just different. Sure, Witcher 2 is at 25% digital, at the moment. 6 months from release. Thing is, box sales will slow down, they're probably not pressing new copies, they'll be disappearing from shop shelves and so on. Around the same time, Witcher 2 will be $10 in the Steam or GOG Xmas sales. And later than that $5... they'll keep moving.

Thing is, when people talk about gaming sales as a whole, they're talking about all sorts of games of varying ages. But when it comes to specific games, it's always about sales in the past year or less (often just the first month).

That a game ships 25% digital copies in the first sixth month makes me fairly sure it'll hit 50% digital over three years.

Althea
18-11-2011, 03:13 PM
I don't think so, it's just different. Sure, Witcher 2 is at 25% digital, at the moment. 6 months from release. Thing is, box sales will slow down, they're probably not pressing new copies, they'll be disappearing from shop shelves and so on. Around the same time, Witcher 2 will be $10 in the Steam or GOG Xmas sales. And later than that $5... they'll keep moving.
The Witcher 2.0 releases in retail form this month, I believe. I think it might even be next week. It's not stopping any time soon.


You mean this, (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/08/17/newell-says-valve-need-to-bring-ea-back/) I assume? I'm not saying you or anyone else is wrong, just that what both EA and Valve have said is so vague that the only thing that can be safely assumed is that it has something to do with selling content and one or both of them not being happy with the other one's terms. Anything else seems to be a case of the magical speculation -> assumption -> fact process of internet forums.
Pretty much. I don't think either side is really saying anything, but we've heard more from EA. I don't think either side hates each other, and EA are still the distributors for retail releases of Valve games, so I think it's fairly obvious that they're still "chums", but I have to say if it's true about Valve updating their terms, it's a bit... you know, dickish on their side.

deano2099
18-11-2011, 03:22 PM
The Witcher 2.0 releases in retail form this month, I believe. I think it might even be next week. It's not stopping any time soon.

A game getting a second retail release (outside of the budget labels, which seem to be scaling back) is pretty rare though.

deano2099
18-11-2011, 03:27 PM
but I have to say if it's true about Valve updating their terms, it's a bit... you know, dickish on their side.

From what I've seen, Valve are insisting that if you sell DLC at all, you also have to sell that DLC on Steam. Which is a bit arsey but in theory it's good for the consumer (they get the choice of where to buy DLC). Valve's refusal to comment about anything is what I find most frustrating, especially as most people seem to fall for it (Steam don't say anything so people assume they're in the right).

Althea
18-11-2011, 03:46 PM
A game getting a second retail release (outside of the budget labels, which seem to be scaling back) is pretty rare though.
I don't know, it sort of is but isn't. Are we counting complete/GotY editions or not? Those come a year or two after release and effectively put it back on the shelf.


From what I've seen, Valve are insisting that if you sell DLC at all, you also have to sell that DLC on Steam. Which is a bit arsey but in theory it's good for the consumer (they get the choice of where to buy DLC). Valve's refusal to comment about anything is what I find most frustrating, especially as most people seem to fall for it (Steam don't say anything so people assume they're in the right).
Yeah, pretty much. I don't think Valve have the right to demand or insist that at all. I think it should be optional, yeah, but I don't think they should be able to demand that. It's not like Crysis 2/Dragon Age 2 had lots of DLC, either, so it's a bit of a delayed reaction.

Skalpadda
18-11-2011, 04:40 PM
Pretty much. I don't think either side is really saying anything, but we've heard more from EA. I don't think either side hates each other, and EA are still the distributors for retail releases of Valve games, so I think it's fairly obvious that they're still "chums", but I have to say if it's true about Valve updating their terms, it's a bit... you know, dickish on their side.

Why is it dickish? There are plenty of stores and distributors who have criteria for the products they sell.

Being able to buy and download DLC or other content through the same store you bought the game makes sense and makes it easier for customers. I certainly would've grabbed the Fallout 3 DLC if it was available with two clicks on Steam rather than having to buy pretend Microsoft points from the horror that is GFWL.

Buying DLC through the Bioware store was a pain in the backside involving setting up a new account, buying points (the price of which was hilariously listed in the wrong currency), buying DLC for those points and then having to download and run a bunch of installers, all on a horribly designed website.

I get that the publishers feel thrilled to be able to pocket the entire sale, but I don't think it's unreasonable of Valve to want extra content for games they sell be available through Steam and it can't be bad for customers to have the option of buying it from there.

apricotsoup
18-11-2011, 04:41 PM
I believe the steam DLC issue was due to them wanting to have free to play games on steam without having to host the game and get no money for the transactions. Which is understandable but blanketing every game under the same banner was an extra step.

Personally I'd rather have all the DLC on steam as the bioware shop for instance was a bit crap and so incredibly overpriced that I felt bad after getting some. Due to that I've pretty much sworn off of DLC which isn't heavily discounted.

baboonanza
18-11-2011, 04:44 PM
And if Valve did allow it then who's to say publishers wouldn't start shipping stripped-down game with more expensive DLC as a way of side-stepping Valves cut? Valve could always refuse to sell them but it would still be a poor result all-round.

Althea
18-11-2011, 07:13 PM
I get that the publishers feel thrilled to be able to pocket the entire sale, but I don't think it's unreasonable of Valve to want extra content for games they sell be available through Steam and it can't be bad for customers to have the option of buying it from there.
But Valve are going about it the wrong way. They should encourage publishers to put their DLC on Steam, not throw their toys out of the pram and sulk if a publisher chooses not to. I prefer not to have Steam manage my DLC, because Steam's idea of managing DLC is "All DLC you own installed or all DLC you own installed", so if one bit of DLC causes issues then I might be screwed over because I can't download the game without the DLC. That's not to say it's happened, but I don't like Valve telling me what I can have installed and what I can't.

By blocking external DLC sales, what are Valve gaining? Nothing, absolutely nothing. It's up to the publisher to make the experience easier for the customer, but it is not Valve's responsibility. There'll come a point when Valve push a publisher too hard in the wrong way, I reckon.

The GfWL Marketplace experience wasn't bad when I bought my Fable 3 DLC, I think they changed it when they rebranded it (but before they assimilated it into Xbox.com) and I paid with real money and not moon money. And I didn't have the problems you did with the BioWare store. I can't remember exactly, but I'm sure it was tied to my EA account, I bought my points in GBP (albeit in moon money quantities - not something I'm a fan of) and I had no issues installing it - ME2 DLC used installers, DA:O did so in-game. I won't disagree that the site was piss-poor, but again, I had no issues.

Smashbox
18-11-2011, 08:11 PM
But Valve are going about it the wrong way. They should encourage publishers to put their DLC on Steam, not throw their toys out of the pram and sulk if a publisher chooses not to.

Until we are in possession of all the facts - which we are not - we cannot assume it is Valve at fault.

Althea
18-11-2011, 08:14 PM
I should have clarified by saying that was me assuming Valve are at fault for the sake of argument.

Skalpadda
18-11-2011, 08:27 PM
But Valve are going about it the wrong way. They should encourage publishers to put their DLC on Steam, not throw their toys out of the pram and sulk if a publisher chooses not to.

You're reading an awful lot of emotion into the whole thing there.


I prefer not to have Steam manage my DLC, because Steam's idea of managing DLC is "All DLC you own installed or all DLC you own installed", so if one bit of DLC causes issues then I might be screwed over because I can't download the game without the DLC. That's not to say it's happened, but I don't like Valve telling me what I can have installed and what I can't.

That's a fair point, but it's a matter of personal preference. In any case I very much doubt it was ever a matter of Steam wanting exclusive rights to sell DLC. If you don't like the way Steam does DLC installing you could just buy it from elsewhere.


By blocking external DLC sales, what are Valve gaining? Nothing, absolutely nothing.

More money? Happier customers who don't have to create accounts and spread their credit card info all over the place?


It's up to the publisher to make the experience easier for the customer, but it is not Valve's responsibility.

It's not the responsibility of a store to provide a good experience for it's customers? Sorry but that makes no sense whatsoever.


The GfWL Marketplace experience wasn't bad when I bought my Fable 3 DLC, I think they changed it when they rebranded it (but before they assimilated it into Xbox.com) and I paid with real money and not moon money. And I didn't have the problems you did with the BioWare store. I can't remember exactly, but I'm sure it was tied to my EA account, I bought my points in GBP (albeit in moon money quantities - not something I'm a fan of) and I had no issues installing it - ME2 DLC used installers, DA:O did so in-game. I won't disagree that the site was piss-poor, but again, I had no issues.

So how would the DLC also being available on Steam make a difference to your positive experiences with GFWL and the Bioware store?

Althea
18-11-2011, 08:38 PM
That's a fair point, but it's a matter of personal preference. In any case I very much doubt it was ever a matter of Steam wanting exclusive rights to sell DLC. If you don't like the way Steam does DLC installing you could just buy it from elsewhere.
But what if it's a Steamworks title, as many are these days, or if it's a title only available on Steam? I'm buggered then, aren't I?


More money? Happier customers who don't have to create accounts and spread their credit card info all over the place?
How do Valve get more money by not having certain major releases on their store?


It's not the responsibility of a store to provide a good experience for it's customers? Sorry but that makes no sense whatsoever.
I didn't say that. It's the publisher's responsibility to make the experience easier - i.e. referencing the point about having the DLC on any store along with the game - but it is not Valve's responsibility to make certain that happens. They should certainly give publishers encouragement to sell the DLC on Steam as well, but I do not believe they should force the issue.


So how would the DLC also being available on Steam make a difference to your positive experiences with GFWL and the Bioware store?
I don't see how it's relevant. I've never said the DLC cannot be on Steam - indeed it is for Fable 3 - and it's not been unknown for GfWL content to be on sale on sites like Direct2Drive (you can buy some of the BioShock 2 DLC there, I believe). I'm really unsure what you're asking.

deano2099
18-11-2011, 08:45 PM
I prefer not to have Steam manage my DLC, because Steam's idea of managing DLC is "All DLC you own installed or all DLC you own installed", so if one bit of DLC causes issues then I might be screwed over because I can't download the game without the DLC.

Kinda the point though. You want the choice to have Steam manage your DLC or not. So does everyone else, including Steam themselves. You should still be able to buy the DLC elsewhere if you want to.


But what if it's a Steamworks title, as many are these days, or if it's a title only available on Steam? I'm buggered then, aren't I?
But that's not the fault of Steam. No-one is made to use Steamworks exclusively.

Skalpadda
18-11-2011, 08:47 PM
I think we may be talking past each other here. If I'm not misunderstanding you, you seem to be arguing from the assumption that Steam demanded exclusivity while I'm assuming they wanted the DLC to be available through Steam as well.

Althea
18-11-2011, 09:00 PM
I think we may be talking past each other here. If I'm not misunderstanding you, you seem to be arguing from the assumption that Steam demanded exclusivity while I'm assuming they wanted the DLC to be available through Steam as well.
Indeed it does. My apologies.


Kinda the point though. You want the choice to have Steam manage your DLC or not. So does everyone else, including Steam themselves. You should still be able to buy the DLC elsewhere if you want to.

But that's not the fault of Steam. No-one is made to use Steamworks exclusively.
But that's not a choice! With Steamworks, you - in 99% of cases - have no choice but to have that game on Steam. I can't have DoWII without Steam. I can't have Skyrim without Steam. I can't have New Vegas without Steam. It's Steam or no game. That is not what I call a choice. I have no problems with Steamworks as a DRM form, but I don't necessarily agree with it.

And even if I buy DLC anywhere else, especially if it's a Steam-only or Steamworks game (Sanctum, for example), I'm buggered because Steam is a requirement. If I uninstall Sanctum for a reason, as an example, and have to reinstall it because a piece of DLC caused an issue, but the issue persists because I have that DLC, what can I do? You can't pick-and-choose the DLC that installs. It's everything you own, that's the only "choice" you have.

Skalpadda
18-11-2011, 09:07 PM
Developers and publishers could still sell DLC with a separate installer. There's nothing preventing you from adding on content to games sold on Steam, even if it's a Steamworks game.

deano2099
18-11-2011, 09:08 PM
But that's not a choice! With Steamworks, you - in 99% of cases - have no choice but to have that game on Steam. I can't have DoWII without Steam. I can't have Skyrim without Steam. I can't have New Vegas without Steam. It's Steam or no game. That is not what I call a choice. I have no problems with Steamworks as a DRM form, but I don't necessarily agree with it.

And even if I buy DLC anywhere else, especially if it's a Steam-only or Steamworks game (Sanctum, for example), I'm buggered because Steam is a requirement. If I uninstall Sanctum for a reason, as an example, and have to reinstall it because a piece of DLC caused an issue, but the issue persists because I have that DLC, what can I do? You can't pick-and-choose the DLC that installs. It's everything you own, that's the only "choice" you have.

Yes, but Steam isn't insisting anyone use Steamworks. I agree that having DLC only available in one place, be that Steam, the developer's website or GoG.com is not ideal. Because we all have preferences.

But as far as I know, Steam insisted that EA put their DLC on Steam in addition to their own platform. Not instead of. Steam obviously don't mind being the only platform for DLC, but that's never a requirement. They weren't telling EA to use Steamworks exclusively.

Two different arguments, and I think we basically agree on both.

Nalano
19-11-2011, 01:54 AM
Can somebody point me to the place where Valve demanded DLC exclusivity?


So how would the DLC also being available on Steam make a difference to your positive experiences with GFWL and the Bioware store?

Wait. Somebody has a positive experience with GfWL? Was it a masochistic thing?

Dexter
19-11-2011, 02:07 AM
VGChart has like 650.000 units total "Lifetime" tracked sales for BF: Bad Company 2: http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales-data/31444/battlefield-bad-company-2/

Yet bfbcs tracks over 3.3 million PC accounts for the game: http://bfbcs.com/

I wouldn't take the site too seriously, it might be alright to judge the general sales trend or comparing with some of the past games because they're likely using the same methods of tracking the data but other than that it is often highly inaccurate at best.

Also I find it rather highly strange that someone is happy about Call of Duty selling well at all...

Althea
19-11-2011, 09:51 AM
Can somebody point me to the place where Valve demanded DLC exclusivity?
They didn't. I don't think anyone here even said that, but it was a misunderstanding.

Nalano
19-11-2011, 10:25 AM
They didn't. I don't think anyone here even said that, but it was a misunderstanding.

No, it was said. I'm pointing out the absurdity of it.