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View Full Version : Which recent modern city builder has a strange citizen class system?



cuc
28-01-2012, 04:53 AM
I remember seeing a city builder being mocked on another forum for its citizen class / social group system. There was a simple graph of its six or eight citizen types arranged into a cycle, and each type doesn't mind being neighbors with the two adjacent types, but detests the opposing types. Both the cultured bohemians and blue collar workers don't mind living near the poor, yet can't get along, that sort of thing.

Which is this game? The description doesn't seem to fit Cities in Motion, and while Cities XL's social class design sounds bad, it doesn't seem to have these types.

Voon
28-01-2012, 05:08 AM
Tropico 3 and 4? Based on my experience, there's low-class, middle-class and upper-class citizens living on my island. It depends on what job their holding, their salary or, maybe, whether they live in houses or shacks.

vinraith
28-01-2012, 05:10 AM
Sim City Societies?



Tropico 3 and 4? Based on my experience, there's low-class, middle-class and upper-class citizens living on my island. It depends on what job their holding, their salary or, maybe, whether they live in houses or shacks.

The system in Tropico isn't nearly as gamey as the one he's describing.

Danny252
28-01-2012, 05:18 AM
I don't think Tropico even has "classes" (well, okay, education maybe) - that's not very communist, now is it? We'll avoid mentioning that my generals' wage is 10x my farm workers' wage.

SC Societies sounds like a pretty good suggestion - but I can't say I've ever touched it. Anno1404 had citizen classes, did 2070 go overboard with them?

Voon
28-01-2012, 05:19 AM
But there is a faction system similar to that, maybe. Though, not related with the topic

Nalano
28-01-2012, 05:41 AM
Cities XL. Four social classes: Unskilled Labor. Skilled Labor, Executives, Elite. However, The OP is probably thinking of City Life, where there are six social classes: Elites, Suits, Radical Chics, Fringe, Blue Collars and Have-Nots. In both games, the player designates which class moves into a neighborhood. I hate that, and I hate those games.

Tropico doesn't have classes: Education is free and jobs are open hire. Housing is limited only by what the tenant (or tenant family) can afford, and since you set the income, you can have all incomes be exactly the same. You can even have communist bankers (though they eventually change their political party if they work there long enough.) Likewise, Simcity 4's citizens are only limited by education, and education is attained solely by living close to educational and cultural facilities. With enough of 'em, you can have a city full of technicians and engineers.

vinraith
28-01-2012, 05:42 AM
Come to think of it, I'm 99% sure the OP is thinking of City Life as Nalano suggests.

Malawi Frontier Guard
28-01-2012, 06:19 AM
http://i.imgur.com/3x3Wd.png

I'm not familiar with the discussion surrounding this issue (or the game), but that seems like a totally reasonable system to build a game around, regardless of whether or not it fits the real world.

Does anyone know the reasons why it has been mocked?

Tei
28-01-2012, 10:20 AM
Anno 2700 or whatever is called has "races" and "classes".

archonsod
28-01-2012, 11:01 AM
mocked[/I]?

Because there's a whole bunch of AIM who think every citybuilder should just be a remake of SimCity.

Althea
28-01-2012, 11:05 AM
Anno 2700 or whatever is called has "races" and "classes".
Anno 2070 has citizen levels and two factions, not races and classes.

cuc
28-01-2012, 01:18 PM
Yes, it was City Life.

My memory of the context when I saw it was hazy, I think the idea was that, even if this is a reasonable model to build game mechanics upon, and rarely attempted in city builders before, such a simplistic depiction can't help to feel like a travesty of social dynamics in real life.

Heliocentric
28-01-2012, 03:04 PM
I know it's not what you were thinking about(city life) , but Startopia actually matches up quite well.

Drinking with Skeletons
28-01-2012, 03:33 PM
@Mala: I think the system is mocked not because it's a poor gameplay mechanic (Heliocentric's reference to Startopia being a prime example) but because it's applied to classes that are modeled off of real-world social classes. Having the rich and the blue collars hate each other is extraordinarily reductive and frankly rather insulting to both groups, to say nothing of the fact that the two really aren't mutually exclusive (a good mechanic who runs his/her own shop can do extremely well, for example).

@Heliocentric: I loved Startopia and I dearly wanted it to get an expansion or a sequel. I wish I could find my disc...

Cooper
28-01-2012, 04:47 PM
Cities XL is absurd. City Life is worse, but in Cities XL you HAVE to have a totally class segregated city. It's utterly absurd, and actually really distatseful. What cities do the developers know of? None I've lived in, clearly.

Tei
28-01-2012, 04:58 PM
Anno 2070 has citizen levels and two factions, not races and classes.

Thats exactly what I said.

archonsod
28-01-2012, 08:03 PM
Cities XL is absurd. City Life is worse, but in Cities XL you HAVE to have a totally class segregated city.
XL doesn't actually have classes, so that would be kinda hard. You have unskilled, skilled, executive and elites; but the only thing those do is determine who can work where. There's no actual citizen interaction in the game funnily enough.

Althea
28-01-2012, 09:07 PM
Thats exactly what I said.
Huh? You said "races" and "classes". The citizen levels/types are a form of class, yes, but not in the way the OP described. Each has more and more needs and unlocks tiers of construction and resource production, but that's about it.

Cooper
28-01-2012, 10:19 PM
XL doesn't actually have classes, so that would be kinda hard. You have unskilled, skilled, executive and elites; but the only thing those do is determine who can work where. There's no actual citizen interaction in the game funnily enough.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Statistics_Socio-economic_Classification

Class = employment in many socio economic indicators.

In anycase, occupation type is not a major factor in determining population types in city blocks.

Heliocentric
29-01-2012, 12:16 AM
@Heliocentric: I loved Startopia and I dearly wanted it to get an expansion or a sequel. I wish I could find my disc...

Its not cherap, but it is legal
http://store.eidos.co.uk/pc-windows-download/StarTopia.php

somini
29-01-2012, 12:34 AM
Cities in Motion also has this. Basically that image Malawi Frontier Guard posted.

Heliocentric
29-01-2012, 01:51 PM
Cities in Motion also has this. Basically that image Malawi Frontier Guard posted.

No, not at all.
Cities it motion is a logistics puzzle business game. Usually at the start of a session I pause, get loads of loans and then check out the traffic flow, the traffic will screw up any busses and any road crossing trams, you can actually lessen traffic flow because the world only has so many people, if they are all using your metro systems the roads will quiet down.

Yes people have a nest of locations, but it always felt entropic enough that it was more about trying to tame chaos rather than just setting the "right answer".

Nalano
29-01-2012, 09:30 PM
No, not at all.
Cities it motion is a logistics puzzle business game. Usually at the start of a session I pause, get loads of loans and then check out the traffic flow, the traffic will screw up any busses and any road crossing trams, you can actually lessen traffic flow because the world only has so many people, if they are all using your metro systems the roads will quiet down.

Yes people have a nest of locations, but it always felt entropic enough that it was more about trying to tame chaos rather than just setting the "right answer".

I have to agree with Heliocentric. The "these people tend to have these workplaces" aspect of Cities in Motion wasn't a sociological statement as it was a puzzle to be solved. Everybody pays the same to use mass transit, and everybody has the same propensity to use mass transit.