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MoLAoS
21-09-2012, 12:28 PM
How interested are people in an open source version of Majesty? Ever since Majesty 2 proved to be practically unrelated to the important aspects of the first game I have been thinking about how cool this would be. More maps, more lairs and monsters, better AI, increasing lair production over time, more structures, more spells and upgrades.

I really really miss the thousand+ hours I blew on this game, but I beat all the missions and the expansion and I played oodles of the random maps with different personal rules like only wizards and such.

And an open source version could have the modding the original game was so desperately missing with new scenarios and the possibility of alternate themes and so forth.

Opinions?

frightlever
21-09-2012, 12:57 PM
"Ever since Majesty 2 proved to be practically unrelated to the important aspects of the first game"

To be fair I never played the first game and though I own the sequel on PC I didn't like it much. Played the android version though and had a lot of fun with it. How is the sequel so different from the original?

coldvvvave
21-09-2012, 01:18 PM
Whos going to develop?

Berzee
21-09-2012, 02:33 PM
"How is the sequel so different from the original?"

Most of the fun of the original came from rooting for your heroes, watching them fight, and being delighted/frustrated by their personalities (wizards being so cowardly that they never leveled up; paladins having absolutely no sense of self-preservation -- but each of those come in handy sometimes =). When you built a building, it was mostly because you wanted to help your heroes: Upgraded Marketplaces gave them more powerful items to shop for, and you could be proud of their purchases. Strategically placed taverns for them to rest in. Especially when you got a couple of heroes who teamed up went on a sort of best-friends monster-massacre, it was fun to just sit and watch (lightning bolt poised in your hand in case intervention was needed).

Majesty 2 theoretically had the same mechanics, but it suffered a lack of the all-important personality. They switched from large, colorful sprites to tiny 3d models...aside from that, I haven't ever dug deeply into the game, but overall the heroes seemed less fun to watch. It felt like there was less scope for successful creative kingdom building (i.e. the all-wizards team mentioned by MoLAoS) and entertaining hero combinations.

These are just explanations of why I haven't played Majesty 2 very much; not an in-depth study of the truth of it. But yes! I'd happily play anything new in the vein of the original.

archonsod
21-09-2012, 03:08 PM
The sequel is pretty much identical to the original. That's pretty much it's only problem; it feels more like a remake than any attempt to make an actual sequel (although that said, they did manage to do some interesting stuff with the expansions).

MoLAoS
21-09-2012, 07:00 PM
The sequel is pretty much identical to the original. That's pretty much it's only problem; it feels more like a remake than any attempt to make an actual sequel (although that said, they did manage to do some interesting stuff with the expansions).

Its not at all idenitical. Trading posts that can only be build specific places, capped numbers of each structure, only allowing a single market, no random map generator. There are several other annoying aspects as well.

arathain
21-09-2012, 07:58 PM
Majesty 2 confuses me. The differences seem trivial, since most of the main structure is left intact. It lacks something intangible, in terms of flow and personality, that I can't quite put my finger on. The characters don't look as neat as their original forms, and the voice work is much more bland, but I have a hard time believing cosmetic stuff are all that's missing.

I didn't know there was an Android version- that's exciting.

MoLAoS
21-09-2012, 08:28 PM
Majesty 2 confuses me. The differences seem trivial, since most of the main structure is left intact. It lacks something intangible, in terms of flow and personality, that I can't quite put my finger on. The characters don't look as neat as their original forms, and the voice work is much more bland, but I have a hard time believing cosmetic stuff are all that's missing.

I didn't know there was an Android version- that's exciting.

The problem is its too constricted. You can't really build different ways. One market, and having to place trading posts and temples on specific places is stupid and annoying. And you can't do certain strategies because you can only have 3 of any building.

Really my favorite part is the mod done by Russians, Cold Sunrise. I believe its the only one with cool fire and ice mages.

arathain
21-09-2012, 09:51 PM
I hear what you're saying, but I don't think it's what's bothering me about the game. I mean, they add those restrictions, but in terms of adding hero upgrades there are plenty of tough decisions, given how limited resources can be. In terms of complexities it gives and takes away, which is perfectly fine for a sequel. I'm just not as charmed by the game. Don't know why.

Berzee
21-09-2012, 11:08 PM
Maybe the hero behaviors actually were more interesting in the first game? I assumed it was just because they weren't big and colorful sprites that I was getting that impression, but I hadn't played enough of both games to really get an idea of it. I just remember my heroes doing things that surprised me in Majesty 1, and I would watch them just to see what they were up to. I don't remember that happening in Majesty 2.

All this talk of it makes me want to play Majesty 2 a little bit more so I can be a fair harsh-critic, but the mention of only being able to build on certain building sites reminds me that is the reason why I probably actually stopped playing. =P

About the Open Source Majesty 1 -- are you asking because you have Plans, or just because you want someone to have Plans? =)

MoLAoS
22-09-2012, 12:23 AM
Maybe the hero behaviors actually were more interesting in the first game? I assumed it was just because they weren't big and colorful sprites that I was getting that impression, but I hadn't played enough of both games to really get an idea of it. I just remember my heroes doing things that surprised me in Majesty 1, and I would watch them just to see what they were up to. I don't remember that happening in Majesty 2.

All this talk of it makes me want to play Majesty 2 a little bit more so I can be a fair harsh-critic, but the mention of only being able to build on certain building sites reminds me that is the reason why I probably actually stopped playing. =P

About the Open Source Majesty 1 -- are you asking because you have Plans, or just because you want someone to have Plans? =)

I have somewhat of plans. I forked the Glest Advanced Engine some months ago, although not for the purposes of a Majesty clone. I have 7 games in mind which are quite different from what I see out there, essentially because they each contain a separate aspect of an ideal MMO I once designed, but of course I cannot make an MMO.

A Majesty clone was something I was thinking of as a side project. Even my first main game is pretty far out, GAE/Glest has a terrible model format, lack of game logic, lack of stuff like spec and light maps, and currently I am implementing an HTML/CSS GUI. So I have a shit load of work to do before I even get to making a game.

I was hoping that someone had already been working on this but also gauging interest so I could decide whether to spend the time to put the mechanics needed for Majesty into the engine, although they might be included by default because the range of games I am planning is so large.

deano2099
22-09-2012, 01:43 AM
Although 1 and 2 looked similar, I found they played very differently as the emphasis was in different places.

Crucially, heroes go off on their own in M1. That meant I rarely used flagged. It also meant they got killed a lot, and you couldn't just buy them back from the graveyard.

In M2, heroes won't leave town except for a flag, which changes the dynamic to something different entirely. M2 felt like an RTS with an odd control mechanic, M1 felt like a management game.

MoLAoS
22-09-2012, 02:16 AM
Although 1 and 2 looked similar, I found they played very differently as the emphasis was in different places.

Crucially, heroes go off on their own in M1. That meant I rarely used flagged. It also meant they got killed a lot, and you couldn't just buy them back from the graveyard.

In M2, heroes won't leave town except for a flag, which changes the dynamic to something different entirely. M2 felt like an RTS with an odd control mechanic, M1 felt like a management game.

That's a really good point.

I especially didn't like how you had to abuse the graveyard to win in number 2. And in general you had less heroes.

sabrage
22-09-2012, 09:06 AM
Opinions?
Majesty is awesome.

MoLAoS
22-09-2012, 09:25 AM
Majesty is awesome.

I asked for opinions. Not objective facts.

levictus
22-09-2012, 03:40 PM
I think an open source Majesty 1 style game would be very successful. I haven't played any other games with such a unique mix of town/hero management.

I still put in about 6-7 hours every month into Majesty 1.

Majesty was a failure. It failed to replicate the gameplay and charm of the original.

Carra
23-09-2012, 12:34 AM
Majesty is a game that I still play once every two years or so, it's brilliant.

The sequel was good too but nowhere near as good. I agree with Berzee, the sequel misses the originals charm. I didn't feel so involved with my heroes. And that's what this game is about, following them, rooting for them and being "OH NOES" when they die.

A Majesty clone? Great idea, this idea really hasn't been used much in the last decade.

MoLAoS
23-09-2012, 01:55 AM
Majesty is a game that I still play once every two years or so, it's brilliant.

The sequel was good too but nowhere near as good. I agree with Berzee, the sequel misses the originals charm. I didn't feel so involved with my heroes. And that's what this game is about, following them, rooting for them and being "OH NOES" when they die.

A Majesty clone? Great idea, this idea really hasn't been used much in the last decade.

Hah I remember in the old game how a high level hero dying was almost enough to make me cry, whereas the new version its no big deal.

Pantagruel
23-09-2012, 05:20 AM
Majesty 1 was so good, one of my favorite games ever! "Pretty bright light.. Bleeeeh!"
But the second one had something missing, I dunno what it was, but it just isn't the same.

Berzee
23-09-2012, 11:21 AM
Unbeknownst to me, there actually seem to be a goodly number of mods for majesty 2. Anyone know if any of these make it more Majestic?

(Failing that, a mod to put Adepts back in would be acceptable).

MoLAoS
23-09-2012, 09:02 PM
Unbeknownst to me, there actually seem to be a goodly number of mods for majesty 2. Anyone know if any of these make it more Majestic?

(Failing that, a mod to put Adepts back in would be acceptable).

The only Majesty 2 mod I was aware of is Cold Sunrise. Although modDB lists Reloaded as well. Plus of course we have the expansions.

I really liked Cold Sunrise.

arathain
23-09-2012, 10:21 PM
Majesty 1 was so good, one of my favorite games ever! "Pretty bright light.. Bleeeeh!"
But the second one had something missing, I dunno what it was, but it just isn't the same.

"Oo, a pretty star!"

MoLAoS
24-09-2012, 07:57 AM
If anyone is interested I'm taking a break from libRocket integration to make a small demo of a pseudo Majesty because I hate graphics and GUI programming and wanted to do something fun.

Basically you can play a cut down version of Majesty with these buildings and units:
Castle
House
Market
Warriors Guild
Rangers Guild
Wizards Guild
Warrior
Ranger
Wizard
Peasant
Tax Collector
Guard Post
Guard
Palace Guard
Blacksmith

I'm gonna hack it up from my current engine build over this week before I go back to libRocket crap for the weekend.
I want to see if I can get heroes to behave properly and have flags working as well.

Sadly no adorable voice acting or majesty like graphics, I'm using stock Glest assets since modeling would take up to 1 to 2 more weeks. I am gonna have one enemy type that imitates melee goblins and maybe one for goblin champions. Should also have pseduo gobling watch towers and one or two goblin base types. My goal is to get it to work without using lua scripting.