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View Full Version : Halo 4... Halo Series ever coming back to PC?



RedRobin
24-10-2012, 03:36 AM
Just finished watching this pretty epic montage of Halo 4.....
So I ask this question... Do you think the Halo series will ever come back to PC? :(


http://youtu.be/MYApEVvrOls

Voon
24-10-2012, 03:38 AM
that's a Nev and an Er. Micro$hit ain't letting their consolebox title sell outside of it as if they're trying to keep it afloat.

RedRobin
24-10-2012, 03:41 AM
that's a Nev and an Er. Micro$hit ain't letting their consolebox title sell outside of it as if they're trying to keep it afloat.



Only if they knew how much $ they could make from PC gamers from the Halo series :( They are slacking!

Gorzan
24-10-2012, 08:11 AM
It wouldn't be enough for them. You0ve got to think that every game on the xbox gives them a benefit, not to talk about the other services you can contract. Most games on PC don't give them a benefit, so it's better for them to encourage the use of the xbox.
Also, I can't wait for diesel to post here.

Jesus_Phish
24-10-2012, 08:25 AM
Nope, it'll never come back to PC, at least not in an ongoing series form and if it does ever get there it'll be in some bundle.

MS needs Halo as a console exclusive. Having it only on console encourages the following from consumers
-Buying an Xbox, because you wan't to to play the game, you have to have the hardware.
-Buying XBL gold membership, because you'll want to check out the online multiplayer.
-Promoting sales of your other services through Xbox because every time you load that up you're going to see ads for everything from Netflix to avatar costumes.
-Being able to heavily promote that this is the only place you can play this game.

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 09:39 AM
PC Gamers don't want Halo (except this one, but I'm a glorious master gamer)

They just want to be able to WAH WAH WAH and QQ about how average it is having never played it for more than five minutes at a friends house.

But hey, Kudos to Microsoft, I keep paying for their adverts service and replacing the POS hardware when it fails. But thats more on good will based on what they did with the original Xbox, than how they've treated the core audience this generation.

Mohorovicic
24-10-2012, 09:45 AM
I don't hate on Halo, but honestly, the first one was the best and it's readily available on the PC. Halo 2 was alltogether bad, and later titles seem to have moved too far away from the unique half-arcade half-popamole gameplay.


Micro$hit

I think you missed several $ there.

Drake Sigar
24-10-2012, 09:59 AM
The way I see it, when a console company releases a game on PC, they get a lot more money tapping into a new demographic and everyone wins. The way they see it, 98% of PC users are pirates and releasing a game on that platform will not only bring in no profit from PC users, but dip into their Xbox 360 profits too.


PC Gamers don't want Halo (except this one, but I'm a glorious master gamer)

They just want to be able to WAH WAH WAH and QQ about how average it is having never played it for more than five minutes at a friends house.
My little brother is a huge fan of the Halo series and insists I play co-op with him. When I say the series is shit (except for the first one which was pretty good), I do so from a comfortable position of experience. I'm certainly not going to trust a 14 year old's insistence that the story and characters are 'hellacool' over my own instincts.

SanguineAngel
24-10-2012, 10:05 AM
Man, all this talk reminds me of when Halo was originally announced. Anyone remember that? A PC-only openworld FPS Sci-Fi epic based loosely on Ringworld. I was pretty stoked for it back then. I'm also reasonably unfussed whether it comes to the PC - I've played most of them on the X-Box and they leave me cold. Someone needs to go back and look at why Dark Forces and Jedi Knight were such epic games.

Spacewalk
24-10-2012, 10:19 AM
If they did it would probably be a Windows 8 exclusive which wouldn't fly 'round these parts.

Shane
24-10-2012, 10:33 AM
Just finished watching this pretty epic montage of Halo 4.....
So I ask this question... Do you think the Halo series will ever come back to PC? :(


I think we are better off with one less linear manshoot.

Edit: From the spoilers flying around the internet,Halo 4's plot is shit anyway.

bonkers
24-10-2012, 10:39 AM
I would love to see Halo back on the PC (I think it's pretty neat, at least it's better then most other shooters) but as MS does need every edge they need in competition to Sony and have pretty much abandoned the PC as a gaming plattform in the recent past I doubt this will ever happen.

Makariel
24-10-2012, 10:52 AM
They just want to be able to WAH WAH WAH and QQ about how average it is having never played it for more than five minutes at a friends house.
I WAH WAH WAH and QQ about how bland it is after playing it on my XBox (which sits comfortably next to my Playstation). Yes, it's better co-op, but co-op everything is better, even Resident Evil 5. I honestly don't get the appeal of Halo. The promotion material always looks so awesome, but when I play the game it feels just torn by trying to be a gripping war hero story about the saviour of humanity, while you teabag whacky aliens. And I don't care that much for competitive multiplayer shooters on anything without a mouse (i.e. consoles).

Diesel-
24-10-2012, 11:02 AM
better question:

Why PC need Halo when we have Much better FPS games avaliable? i could careless. keep that shit away from PC...

Jesus_Phish
24-10-2012, 11:09 AM
better question:

Why PC need Halo when we have Much better FPS games avaliable? i could careless. keep that shit away from PC...


"I don't like it and it wont affect me if it's on the same platform I play on, but I don't want other people to be able to enjoy it"

Halo doesn't need to be on PC, but I'm sure a lot of people would love it to be. I'd love it if the Gears of War series was on pc, it'd mean I could get rid of my 360 which sits around not being used unless I'm playing a gears game.

Ravelle
24-10-2012, 12:15 PM
I love halo but don't own a xbox yet so yeah , it would be great to have in on PC.

DaftPunk
24-10-2012, 12:50 PM
Correct me but Bungie left Microsoft right,and is not working on this game ?

Shane
24-10-2012, 12:58 PM
Correct me but Bungie left Microsoft right,and is not working on this game ?

Yup, they have have multi-game contract with Activision now.

Brit89
24-10-2012, 01:03 PM
I would like for the new Halo to come on the PC; saves me the trouble for buying it for my 360 and actually using it.

Sketch
24-10-2012, 01:16 PM
Yeah it would be good, Reach and 4 would look pretty great on PC.

Finicky
24-10-2012, 01:28 PM
PC Gamers don't want Halo (except this one, but I'm a glorious master gamer)

They just want to be able to WAH WAH WAH and QQ about how average it is having never played it for more than five minutes at a friends house.


But hey, Kudos to Microsoft, I keep paying for their adverts service and replacing the POS hardware when it fails. But thats more on good will based on what they did with the original Xbox, than how they've treated the core audience this generation.

The overwhelming irony of blaming people hating on the series by a lack of reference material, when only someone with no frame of reference for pc shooters would think the series is good, let alone special.

I finished the first halo several times in coop on all difficulties including legendary difficulty and also bought it on pc when halo CE was released for windows (which was total dogshit in mp since it used peer2peer , which back then was still considered unplayable, standards for pc gaming being much higher n all :D),
I also played mp on xbox with the help of an early precursor to tunngle. (me and my friends ended up dissapointed when we tried that option since it was peer 2 peer and p2p is fucking worthless)

The first game had good music and nice AI for the time and nice vehicle physics , and for a console shooter it was way better than anything else and the sandboxy coop was nice.

But that was back in 2001 (when everything in the fps genre but timesplitters on consoles was just atrocious) ...and back when my pc was hopelessly outdated (486 2X:p) so I didn't exactly have much choice.

A friend bought halo 2 before I could, we played through half of the campaign and were both bored (both halo 1 fans back then), it was more of the same and a lot more boring.

Halo 3 came out on xbox 360, I bought a 360 with halo 3 based on the fun I had with the first game, again it was more of the same, with less of the charm and remixed music. BAD and a waste of money.

My 10 year younger brother (so he started with halo3 and halo 3 was fresh for him) also bought halo reach second hand eventually and that one was the same tired old dogshit as well. He played through most of the campaign before he got bored while I visited him, I spent that time on my psp after an hour of boredom in coop.
He had no pc so he had no frame of reference.

So yeah, this is my experience with the series and my reason for finding it all tired old shit that is vastly inferior to pc shooters.
Once I bought a new pc in 2003 I sold my xbox , absolutely no reason to play console shooters like halo or timesplitters when there was cs, ut, bf1942, rtcw and tribes.

What I'm getting to is to me halo and timesplitters and golden eye etc are like a can of old beans, they'll be servicable if you have nothing else to eat but noone with a full fridge of delicious foodstuffs is going 'man I really wish I could have some more old beans'. Unless all they've ever tasted is old beans... no frame of reference and all that.
Sort of like how many american kids think salty third rate food like bacon is the most delicious thing there is.

PS the fov in that video makes me nauseous.

db1331
24-10-2012, 02:28 PM
That video actually looks good to some of you? Is it the horrendously low fov, the sluggish controls, or the one hit insta-kills that have you so excited? It looks like baby's first FPS. I wouldn't try it if it were F2P.

mashakos
24-10-2012, 02:31 PM
I think the dev teams at Microsoft Studios backed the Xbox project so enthusiastically back in the late '90s out of the fatigue that comes with releasing PC titles. After all, the name xbox is derived from DirectX-Box, which is a good indication of the aspirations of the various dev teams that form Microsoft studios; PC game development without PC platform problems.

It's actually sad that so many talented game developers think this way. Their games will be lost in the ether unless they religiously preserve their source code for future remakes or a proper xbox/xbox 360 emulator is released 50 years from now.

Shane
24-10-2012, 02:33 PM
Halo, Killzone, Gears of War, Uncharted, these are all mediocre games hyped up by the millions spent on marketing. There is nothing in the Halo series to like except for the soundtrack, but I heard they did away with the composer.

gundato
24-10-2012, 02:38 PM
....
Did you just badmouth Uncharted? Them be fighting words :p


And it never ceases to amaze me how ridiculous PC fanboys have become. Console fanboys tend to say "We are better than X because we have Y". PC fanboys say "We are better than X because we don't have Y". As though the mere existence of something forces them to embrace it, rather than just ignore it and move along.

Personally, I don't really think I am missing much not having played Halo after 1 (and half of 2). But I wouldn't mind being able to buy an HD Re-release of the first three (and Reach, which I hear was pretty good). It can't hurt, and I am interested in playing it to see how things tie into Marathon (which apparently is no longer true with Halo 4. Sadness).
But my big concern is: Halo is really at its best in multiplayer. The re-release would likely have a VERY small community (potentially split 3-4 ways). That would be bad.

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 03:17 PM
What are all these legendary exclusive FPS games that exist on PC?

Will somebody please tell me?

Pretty much all there is are console ports that are only optimized for recent hardware configurations.

Crysis 1? Sandbox in the vain of Halo that has a superior console version in a newer engine.

Stalker? Ridiculously buggy with janky gameplay although has some nice atmosphere.

Team Fortress 2? Hat Simulator.

Arma? A game where the AI can't drive vehicles, walk, or fight. The AI is only any good if it gets the drop on you.

Serious Sam? Still copying Doom but with more brown.

It's so telling you all have to come to the topic to bash the game.

Mohorovicic
24-10-2012, 03:23 PM
Crysis 1? Sandbox in the vain of Halo that has a superior console version in a newer engine.

...okay you're going to have to explain that one.

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 03:27 PM
It got released on Consoles for 14.99 digital only in the Cry-engine 3, with remastered suit powers.

Runs at a solid 30 fps and has 3D support etc etc.

The gameplay concessions made the game a LOT more fun.

Visual differences on a state of the art TV are minimal to the pc original.

Shane
24-10-2012, 03:29 PM
"Visual differences on a state of the art TV are minimal to the pc original."

You better be joking...

mashakos
24-10-2012, 03:30 PM
Runs at a solid 30 fps and has 3D support etc etc.
Fail. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIXT2ALlfvc)

30fps. please :)

Mohorovicic
24-10-2012, 03:33 PM
It got released on Consoles for 14.99 digital only in the Cry-engine 3, with remastered suit powers.

You mean with the dumbed down powers from the sequel?


Runs at a solid 30 fps and has 3D support etc etc.

Wow, whole 30FPS huh?


Visual differences on a state of the art TV are minimal to the pc original.

You know, just the fact that you consider quality of TV to be a determining factor in game's graphics speaks volumes about validity of your claims.

db1331
24-10-2012, 03:39 PM
It got released on Consoles for 14.99 digital only in the Cry-engine 3, with remastered suit powers.

Runs at a solid 30 fps and has 3D support etc etc.

The gameplay concessions made the game a LOT more fun.

Visual differences on a state of the art TV are minimal to the pc original.

What the fuck are you talking about? Have you even seen any of the console screens or footage? It looks substantially worse than the vanilla PC version, let alone a modded one.

DaftPunk
24-10-2012, 03:40 PM
Omg patrick swayze,you can't be serious with those claims xD

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 03:45 PM
TV features upscaling and sharpening (it looks like your using an FXAA injector like on Skyrim for example plus no jaggies) along with Motion Flow which generates frames between frames to give the appearance of... more frames.

Means every game appears silky smooth (about 120 fps) even if the ancient console boxes aren't capable of running it so.

Doom 3 BFG edition (PC) looks great on it (I turn of those extra features, my PC can beast it)

Also the suit powers were streamlined, not dumbed down. It made the Crysis games a whole lot better in some respects.

Ahhh to be a glorious master gamer that enjoys games for what they are, no matter the platform! A gamer capable of having fun.

gundato
24-10-2012, 03:53 PM
I agree with Dirty Dancing in principle, but I am also gonna call crap on the Crysis visuals :p. In general, a (properly ported/designed) PC game has a much higher potential for visual shinies. In practice, it depends on how powerful your rig is and most people won't notice the difference.

The rest is mostly spot-on though, and I also agree that the streamlined controls are better (a case of "consolitis" being good, as it were).

db1331
24-10-2012, 04:02 PM
I liked on the Crysis console trailer how they used the term "Remastered lighting" instead of "We had to take out HDR."

Drake Sigar
24-10-2012, 04:06 PM
Arma? A game where the AI can't drive vehicles
They drive better than me.

RakeShark
24-10-2012, 04:54 PM
People may crap on Halo for being a toybox thing, but I will say Halo deathmatch is the most fun with friends since Quake/Quake2/Tribes2. Low grav and rocket launchers, lazer swords and sticky nades. I mean, a typical Halo map will usually have as much vertical as it does horizontal. It's whacky and floaty enough to be a lot of fun.

'Course, that opinion of mine may be skewed, because I say fuck off to this realistic modern/near-future shit that CS spawned.

Mohorovicic
24-10-2012, 05:26 PM
Ahhh to be a glorious master gamer that enjoys games for what they are, no matter the platform! A gamer capable of having fun.

For someone who claims to enjoy games "no matter the platform" you sure sound pretty bent on proving the console versions are just as good if not better. In fact you sound quite rustled.


Also the suit powers were streamlined, not dumbed down.

"Streamlining" is keeping the same functionality while making it more accessible at the same time. "Dumbing down" is removing functionality. Crysis 2 did the latter.

Kaira-
24-10-2012, 05:42 PM
People may crap on Halo for being a toybox thing, but I will say Halo deathmatch is the most fun with friends since Quake/Quake2/Tribes2. Low grav and rocket launchers, lazer swords and sticky nades. I mean, a typical Halo map will usually have as much vertical as it does horizontal. It's whacky and floaty enough to be a lot of fun.

'Course, that opinion of mine may be skewed, because I say fuck off to this realistic modern/near-future shit that CS spawned.

I agree. Our favorite used to be Halo 2's deathmatch, playing on Lockout, no shields, no radar, and weapons consisting only of shotguns, grenades and swords. What I'd give to be half a decade younger again...

Diesel-
24-10-2012, 05:43 PM
Gears, halo, uncharted, killzone are all mediocre franchises praise by corrupt mainstream media

Finicky
24-10-2012, 05:44 PM
....
Did you just badmouth Uncharted? Them be fighting words :p


.

.... as nice as the artstyle and animations etc are in uncharted , the gameplay is shit.
You chesthigh wall shoot endless endless endless waves of baddies (with a shitty gamepad to boot) with some shallow autoplatforming inbetween.

I liked uc1 for being an interactive indiana jones movie basically with an entertaining cast (a little bit too much shooting), but the second game... ughhhhhhh I couldn't take the endless repetetive shooting anymore by the monk temple near the end into that over the top retarded vehicle scene.
The idea of a dumbed down way easier more cinematic tomb raider with better production values wasn't bad, but it really doesn't lend itself to doing it more than once EVER. The gameplay is just not interesting and the game has you shoot down 10.000 people so there is a lot of it.

Also this is a pc forum...
I hear natural selection 2 is pretty cool!

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 05:46 PM
I just wanna know what all these legendary games are people keep referring to.

I'm in a fortunate position to be able to pick and choosy over what games I play and what platforms I play them on, I get the best of all worlds.

As for Crysis... the powers, or indeed the functionality of the suit is a mess.

Edit: But it was better in the second.

Kaira-
24-10-2012, 05:50 PM
Gears, halo, uncharted, killzone are all mediocre franchises praise by corrupt mainstream media

Corrupt mainstream media = they like games I don't like and they make money while liking games?

mashakos
24-10-2012, 05:52 PM
As for Crysis... the powers, or indeed the functionality of the suit is a mess.

even if they were a "mess" (i.e not dumbed down like in the sequel), the PC version wins by default because there are about 20 mods I know of that meet your definition of "streamlined". Mods make any PC game the winner :)

gundato
24-10-2012, 06:03 PM
.... as nice as the artstyle and animations etc are in uncharted , the gameplay is shit.
You chesthigh wall shoot endless endless endless waves of baddies (with a shitty gamepad to boot) with some shallow autoplatforming inbetween.

I liked uc1 for being an interactive indiana jones movie basically with an entertaining cast (a little bit too much shooting), but the second game... ughhhhhhh I couldn't take the endless repetetive shooting anymore by the monk temple near the end into that over the top retarded vehicle scene.
The idea of a dumbed down way easier more cinematic tomb raider with better production values wasn't bad, but it really doesn't lend itself to doing it more than once EVER. The gameplay is just not interesting and the game has you shoot down 10.000 people so there is a lot of it.

Also this is a pc forum...
I hear natural selection 2 is pretty cool!

Deus Ex: You shoot endless endless waves of baddies (with awkward keyboard controlled powers to boot) with some shallow talking inbetween (the dialogue system WAS pretty weak).

But the thing is: It does an amazing job with that. Deus Ex tells a wonderful story that makes you forget about the controls being awkward, even for when it was released. And the bulletsponge enemies you face later on (if you actually fight :p)

Uncharted isn't perfect, but it accomplishes what it set out to do: Being an insanely fun interactive movie. Then it does it two more times to boot.



even if they were a "mess" (i.e not dumbed down like in the sequel), the PC version wins by default because there are about 20 mods I know of that meet your definition of "streamlined". Mods make any PC game the winner :)

Kind of controversial to say (so if anyone wants to whinge that I am trying to be controversial, feel free), but I would argue that mods actually ruined UT3 (and 2k3, to a good degree). Or, more specifically, the expectation of mods.

The original UT is wonderful and might be the best arena FPS ever. And it had a metric crapton of mods
2k3 and UT3 both felt very half-assed and were launched alongside modding contests (make something unreal). Essentially, Epic was counting on mods to make the game playable and were just making an engine (which sold like hotcakes). Unfortunately: If a game is crap, people don't want it. And if people don't want it, mods don't get made.

I am sure someone can think of a few more examples where the expectation of modders fixing a game actually hurt it. But I think it is always important to consider context: Mods can make a good game better, but they can't make a crap game good.

Finicky
24-10-2012, 06:06 PM
Fail. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIXT2ALlfvc)

30fps. please :)
Since this is now the official gametrailers/ign quality thread on rps:

No need to even go there:p crysis 1 on consoles runs at 10-25 fps much of the time ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwD2ty2UfBM ) .... and the settings are a mix between low and medium (the LOD is scaled WAY back) and they had to cut the VTOL levels.
The high quality object motion blur got replaced by the same shitty low quality default blur from crysis 2.

It's a trollpost/sarcastic post:p just look at the tone, he is pulling your leg:p the state of the art tv part is a dead giveaway.

@ gundato: dissing deux ex's gameplay (which is varied and elaborate)....
If I didn't know that account is a forum personality made for trolling and taking the piss out of everything I'd get mad.

Diesel-
24-10-2012, 06:10 PM
Corrupt mainstream media = they like games I don't like and they make money while liking games?

it means games are nothing special and praise like best thing since slice bread. its all money talks

Tikey
24-10-2012, 06:30 PM
Gears, halo, uncharted, killzone are all mediocre franchises praise by corrupt mainstream media

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-whEZCOgjrQ8/T5tzQmGe-PI/AAAAAAAAASk/ppfxDHV4tOg/s1600/tin-foil-hat.jpg

Makariel
24-10-2012, 06:32 PM
Killzone 2 is a anti-war game. It made me feel like I'm in a miserable place where I didn't want to be, just like war I presume?

The JG Man
24-10-2012, 06:51 PM
I actually saw a few similarities between Halo and Crysis when I came to playing the latter. The overall feel felt not worlds apart, especially in the latter half of the game.

Anyhow, I really enjoy the Halo series. The campaign has had its ups and downs; 1 was great, probably remaining the best, whilst 2 and the first half of 3 never really did much for me. Of course, when you get to The Ark in 3, it really turned it up and notch and was damn good. I felt Reach, as an entire package, was excellent, with a highly enjoyable campaign, great multiplayer, fantastic horde mode in Firefight and Forge providing a ton of possibilities. I've kept saying to people that I would love for Reach to come onto the PC.

With Halo 4, I feel like I've definitely been sucked into the hype once more, but I felt it pay off with 3 and Reach and I'm now trying to decide if the campaign alone is worth it for a rental, or if I should just dismiss the new trilogy as something I'll never play and the Chief's story ends where it does at the end of 3. I don't know.

I think Halo gets a lot of stick all over the place, but it's sort of understandable that it got so massive it was never going to cater perfectly to all the people it had enticed. For me, it offers a usually pretty damn good campaign in an interesting sci-fi universe, with vibrant scenarios and good dialogue and characters (or at least good enough). The gameplay is fairly varied and is pitted well against some, generally speaking, very good AI. Halo is rarely "shoot all the bad dudes as they pop up" and more "Who do I need to take down first? Who is a better target? If I kill him, I'll have his weapon but then I'll still have these numbers against me." Then we have the multiplayer which as a slightly less frenetic arena shooter struck a chord with me.

I don't think Halo is as good as the people who absolutely love it to no end believe it is, but I certainly really, really enjoy it. It's a damn shame it hasn't come to the PC past 2, and even with that the knowledge that if it was it'd be saddled with GFWL. Still, whenever I hear Halo being talked about for prolonged periods of time, I find myself fighting the urge to re-install 1.

db1331
24-10-2012, 06:53 PM
Metro Last Light is the biggest overhyped piece of shit game ever.

gundato
24-10-2012, 06:54 PM
Metro Last Light is the biggest overhyped piece of shit game ever.

Uhm... okay?

Although, that actually DOES fit the tone of the thread pretty well. Random, emotional, and angry :p

Mohorovicic
24-10-2012, 06:55 PM
Deus Ex: You shoot endless endless waves of baddies (with awkward keyboard controlled powers to boot) with some shallow talking inbetween (the dialogue system WAS pretty weak).

RPS Forums - We Deliver!

gundato
24-10-2012, 07:02 PM
Hey, I love Deus Ex, but it is a product of its time. The combat is very generic, the controls are clunky, and the MIBs and MJ12 troops are pretty spongey. And the dialogue, while interesting, reeked of "first year film student" (which is still true of most games :p). Nothing is perfect. You can make a classic sound like trash or a horrible game sound amazing.

And the thing is: Even though it had MANY mechanical problems (even at the time), the end result is amazing. That is the rest of that post, but I guess you just wanted the internet equivalent of a soundbite.

Sketch
24-10-2012, 07:02 PM
If I covered his name up it sounds like something you would say.

Wow sure is hatey in here.

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 07:13 PM
The only thing that spoils Deus Ex is the fact you are gazillion dollar cyborg THAT CANT FUCKING SHOOT STRAIGHT.

mashakos
24-10-2012, 07:22 PM
It's a trollpost/sarcastic post:p just look at the tone, he is pulling your leg:p the state of the art tv part is a dead giveaway.
I know, hence the smiles. Dude was not doing a good ob.

Vandelay
24-10-2012, 07:23 PM
Hey, I love Deus Ex, but it is a product of its time. The combat is very generic, the controls are clunky, and the MIBs and MJ12 troops are pretty spongey. And the dialogue, while interesting, reeked of "first year film student" (which is still true of most games :p). Nothing is perfect.

It does make me smile the way people seem to just ignore the faults of Deus Ex. The combat is atrocious, the dialogue is completely unnatural (starting a conversation about political philosophy with a random barman?) and delivered in an incredibly dull way, and the art direction is mostly pretty bland too. I would also disagree with Gundato on it actually having a good plot, as I always see it as the gaming equivalent of the Da Vinci Code.

None of that stops it being an incredible game. Playing it today amongst the current crop of games, it stands out even more as something special.

Mohorovicic
24-10-2012, 07:36 PM
Hey, I love Deus Ex, but it is a product of its time. The combat is very generic, the controls are clunky, and the MIBs and MJ12 troops are pretty spongey. And the dialogue, while interesting, reeked of "first year film student" (which is still true of most games :p). Nothing is perfect.

Except your ability to be wrong about everything you say in this thread, apparently.

Kaira-
24-10-2012, 08:13 PM
Except your ability to be wrong about everything you say in this thread, apparently.

I like your wisdom and ability to bring concrete proof on the table.

Finicky
24-10-2012, 08:28 PM
Killzone 2 is a anti-war game. It made me feel like I'm in a miserable place where I didn't want to be, just like war I presume?

To me it just felt like a VERY laggy (input lag) shooter with nice animations and a lot of explosions.
Better than all the caw a doodys and gears of wars, but the input lag made it worthless to play (even more worthless than a shooter on a controller already is going to be).
The game has over 150 ms input lag from the engine alone, which is a record for shittyness.
By comparison: burnout paradise has 67ms of input lag, most 30 fps games have 100-115 ms, the killzone 2 guys managed to fuck up to the point of 150 ms, thats 1 and a half tenths of a second before your display lag even comes into play..

Finicky
24-10-2012, 08:30 PM
I think Halo gets a lot of stick all over the place, but it's sort of understandable that it got so massive it was never going to cater perfectly to all the people it had enticed. For me, it offers a usually pretty damn good campaign in an interesting sci-fi universe, with vibrant scenarios and good dialogue and characters (or at least good enough). The gameplay is fairly varied and is pitted well against some, generally speaking, very good AI. Halo is rarely "shoot all the bad dudes as they pop up" and more "Who do I need to take down first? Who is a better target? If I kill him, I'll have his weapon but then I'll still have these numbers against me." Then we have the multiplayer which as a slightly less frenetic arena shooter struck a chord with me.

I don't think Halo is as good as the people who absolutely love it to no end believe it is, but I certainly really, really enjoy it. It's a damn shame it hasn't come to the PC past 2, and even with that the knowledge that if it was it'd be saddled with GFWL. Still, whenever I hear Halo being talked about for prolonged periods of time, I find myself fighting the urge to re-install 1.
For a console shooter halo is definitely the only decent one...
Projectile weapons, not just overly scripted corridors but some open spaces to run around in, proper physics for vehicles, some vertical gameplay...
The point was that it's still a poor man's tribes and a waste of time if you have a PC.

Basically the reaction you often get is: if you think this is that amazing then jesus christ broaden your horizons, you've been staring at shadows on your console cave wall for too long....


TV features upscaling and sharpening (it looks like your using an FXAA injector like on Skyrim for example plus no jaggies) along with Motion Flow which generates frames between frames to give the appearance of... more frames.

Means every game appears silky smooth (about 120 fps) even if the ancient console boxes aren't capable of running it so.

Doom 3 BFG edition (PC) looks great on it (I turn of those extra features, my PC can beast it)

Also the suit powers were streamlined, not dumbed down. It made the Crysis games a whole lot better in some respects.

Ahhh to be a glorious master gamer that enjoys games for what they are, no matter the platform! A gamer capable of having fun.
Did you read that stuff on the stickers of your TV?
120 hz motionflow = frame interpolation = degraded image quality, artifacts, blur and most importantly OODLES OF INPUT LAG.
Even console fanboys will tell you to turn that shit off because the input lag it causes is awful.

The same goes for sharpening (extra input lag),dynamic contrast (crushed blacks) and DNR (image degradation and input lag)

It's tiring to reason with people who take their wisdoms off product pamflets and know absolutely NOTHING about what they speak of.

edit: I'm awaiting the part where you tell me 'my tv has no iput lag LOL it has 5 ms response time' or some other sad misconception.

Patrick Swayze
24-10-2012, 08:55 PM
For a console shooter halo is definitely the only decent one...
Projectile weapons, not just overly scripted corridors but some open spaces to run around in, proper physics for vehicles, some vertical gameplay...
The point was that it's still a poor man's tribes and a waste of time if you have a PC.

Basically the reaction you often get is: if you think this is that amazing then jesus christ broaden your horizons, you've been staring at shadows on your console cave wall for too long....


Did you read that stuff on the stickers of your TV?
120 hz motionflow = frame interpolation = degraded image quality, artifacts, blur and most importantly OODLES OF INPUT LAG.
Even console fanboys will tell you to turn that shit off because the input lag it causes is awful.

The same goes for sharpening (extra input lag),dynamic contrast (crushed blacks) and DNR (image degradation and input lag)

It's tiring to reason with people who take their wisdoms off product pamflets and know absolutely NOTHING about what they speak of.

edit: I'm awaiting the part where you tell me 'my tv has no iput lag LOL it has 5 ms response time' or some other sad misconception.

Yeah I'm aware of such things as Input lag. Like I said I game on all platforms. I'm not some herp derp console fanboy, nor am I some retarded PC elitist making up for my social short comings.

And this was meant to be a conversation about games but the trolls have done a good job of derailing the conversation, and still haven't managed to list all their amazing PC exclusive fps games.

lasikbear
24-10-2012, 09:22 PM
I agree. Our favorite used to be Halo 2's deathmatch, playing on Lockout, no shields, no radar, and weapons consisting only of shotguns, grenades and swords. What I'd give to be half a decade younger again...

That was exactly how I liked to play too, except I have no idea what the maps are called. Swords N Shotguns was always on the one with the conveyor belts with bombs on them.

Sketch
24-10-2012, 09:25 PM
Colossus :p

Finicky
24-10-2012, 09:33 PM
Yeah I'm aware of such things as Input lag. Like I said I game on all platforms. I'm not some herp derp console fanboy, nor am I some retarded PC elitist making up for my social short comings.

And this was meant to be a conversation about games but the trolls have done a good job of derailing the conversation, and still haven't managed to list all their amazing PC exclusive fps games.
Oh you were actually serious:D
Tribes ascend, planetside 2, natural selection 2 , hawken (fps with mech player skins and jetpacks), quake live and everything you already named and dismissed...
These 4 alone (especially NS2) will provide years and years of entertainment that you can't get on the controller boxes.


I think I've already established I'm not some fanboy, I have both 'hd' consoles and a bunch of games on them. My standards are higher that's the difference.
I'm dissapointed with my ps3 and xbox because I paid good money for them and was expecting more console games (ssx, rollcage, platformers, split screen supporting racing games, action games) and instead it's mostly and endless stream of shitty 'cinematic' QTE games and shooters.
I didn't derail the thread btw, the op asked if people want halo for the pc again, and I explained why I don't.

You clearly aren't aware of 'such things as input lag' , since you suggest people play with motionflow on (what a stupid stupid idea).

P.S : the real gamer's response would be : there is something better? tell me more!
That was my reaction when I played quake, ut, rollercoaster tycoon , dungeon keeper, red alert etc at friend's houses before I could afford a new pc with a capable gpu myself.

Sketch
24-10-2012, 09:34 PM
Lots of multiplayer FPS' yay.

The JG Man
24-10-2012, 10:12 PM
The point was that it's still a poor man's tribes and a waste of time if you have a PC.

Basically the reaction you often get is: if you think this is that amazing then jesus christ broaden your horizons, you've been staring at shadows on your console cave wall for too long....

Maybe. UT2K4 is still great, I like(d) the Battlefield series, greatly enjoying Planetside 2, played through STALKER and a few other big FPS. I still think that, pitted against those, Halo is still good. The fact is, there's a wealth of great games available that cater to different particulars. Halo strikes a nice balance in a few things that yes, might be excelled at in other games, but as a whole package might not be as good as a Halo title.

siegarettes
24-10-2012, 10:22 PM
I actually rather admire what Bungie brought to the series. Especially after playing some many Modern Warfare clones, the freedom and sandboxy elements of combat of the series were incredibly refreshing. It gives you a lot of tools to deal with a situation, instead of most shooters these days that say "go here, kill this with this weapon".

Mohorovicic
25-10-2012, 07:19 AM
I like your wisdom and ability to bring concrete proof on the table.

How do you argue with someone who says the Earth is flat?

Especially when it's gundato and you know he can argue forever?

Well, let's try to address just one of his many amazing points as an example:


(the dialogue system WAS pretty weak)

What is that even supposed to mean? How was dialogue system in Deus Ex "weak"? How does selecting one out of several available responses, each with a different outcome, make for a "weak" dialogue system? I mean you do realize it's technically identical to dialogue system in Fallout or PS:T? Or are dialogue systems in these games "weak" too? It's even fully voice acted. On both sides.

Kadayi
25-10-2012, 08:29 AM
I was listening to Rebel FM the other day and Arthur Gies was saying that Microsoft were investing a lot in setting up a bunch of new game studios at the moment, clearly with a view to ramp up for the new Xbox. I wouldn't be surprised if the bulk of their output were console exclusive titles tbh in order to strengthen the brand. Given Win 8 is principally for tablets there's not a great deal of incentive for them to continue to support the desktop/laptop PC market as it stands when it comes to product.

gundato
25-10-2012, 01:44 PM
How do you argue with someone who says the Earth is flat?

Especially when it's gundato and you know he can argue forever?

Well, let's try to address just one of his many amazing points as an example:



What is that even supposed to mean? How was dialogue system in Deus Ex "weak"? How does selecting one out of several available responses, each with a different outcome, make for a "weak" dialogue system? I mean you do realize it's technically identical to dialogue system in Fallout or PS:T? Or are dialogue systems in these games "weak" too? It's even fully voice acted. On both sides.

I think PS:T has a much more relevant dialogue system since you aren't having deep philisophical discussions with hobos on the street :p. But, I acknowledge, I am INSANELY biased toward PS:T and don't really have an objective view of it.

As far as "different outcomes": Deus Ex is no different than the (non-important) sidequests in the Mass Effect series. At best, you'll have an opportunity to (ineffectually) talk to the NPC again later, or you'll get an item or a fight. That's it.

And the "different coutcomes" and "non-linearity" of Deus Ex, much like most of the games from that era, is exaggerated. Outside of one or two occasions involving dialogue (off the top of my head: two :p), it is really no less linear than Metro 2033. And there is nothing wrong with that.

Shooop
25-10-2012, 01:55 PM
Sorry, but this is a really dumb question.

Microsoft owns Bungie and Halo is the one franchise that keeps their Xbox systems alive. If it went multiplatform, that could spell doom for Xbox.

The JG Man
25-10-2012, 02:02 PM
Microsoft doesn't own Bungie. It never has. There was a contractual agreement that meant any development done by Bungie would be owned by MS, but that is different. It's why Bungie are now being published by Activision...

The point that's being made here is that why would a multi-platform release (and seeing as we're talking only on the PC here, nothing that immediately takes part in the console wars in-fighting) 'spell doom' for the Xbox. The fact is, Halo 1 PC was successful and remains played to this day. Halo 2 PC was unsuccessful because it was a, generally speaking, poor port, saddled with GFWL and 'only' working on Vista which had a slow up-take as well as the fact it came out ages after Halo 2 actually did.

Considering most sales, especially on the console, take place within the first couple of weeks, would it really be doom if 3, ODST and Reach were released on the PC considering 4 is about to come out? Hell, even if 4 came out a month later on PC, would it really impact on the 360 sales that badly?

Jesus_Phish
25-10-2012, 02:15 PM
Microsoft doesn't own Bungie. It never has. There was a contractual agreement that meant any development done by Bungie would be owned by MS, but that is different. It's why Bungie are now being published by Activision...

The point that's being made here is that why would a multi-platform release (and seeing as we're talking only on the PC here, nothing that immediately takes part in the console wars in-fighting) 'spell doom' for the Xbox. The fact is, Halo 1 PC was successful and remains played to this day. Halo 2 PC was unsuccessful because it was a, generally speaking, poor port, saddled with GFWL and 'only' working on Vista which had a slow up-take as well as the fact it came out ages after Halo 2 actually did.

Considering most sales, especially on the console, take place within the first couple of weeks, would it really be doom if 3, ODST and Reach were released on the PC considering 4 is about to come out? Hell, even if 4 came out a month later on PC, would it really impact on the 360 sales that badly?

Halo 1 came out on PC almost two years after it was on Xbox and just one year before Halo 2 came on for Xbox. It was also originally intended to be released on PC and Mac. MS did actually own Bungie, they bought them exclusively to work on Halo titles for the Xbox while the Xbox was in development because they needed a big launch title and they figured that was it.

It's about selling consoles, not games. MS need to get xboxs into peoples homes. If you give them any other option to get the game, you're lowering the chance of selling them hardware. Which then means they're not using your hardware, which means you'll never get direct adverts and sales to them through that hardware and you lower the chance of them buying additional hardware.

Perhaps down the line Halo 3, Reach etc will find their way onto PC, but for now MS still need something that makes their console exclusive so they can continue to sell hardware.

The JG Man
25-10-2012, 02:33 PM
Oh, I thought MS just owned the Halo brand, not Bungie as a whole (hence why it was never released on Mac). My mistake!

I would argue though that releasing the first in a series late is different to releasing its sequel so late (case in point: how many people are frustrated by waiting for HL3?). You still have a considerable gap between Halos 1 and 2 and then 3. Despite Halo's popularity on the console, they certainly could've done themselves a favour if they had put more effort into the PC releases. I'd also argue that do you really think that the kind of people who wait for a specific game on a console to be out to get said console are the kind of people that will buy a gaming PC, let alone build one of their own? I don't dismiss any overlap, but it seems like that specific amount would be over-powered by an additional PC release for those interested.

Regardless, yes I hope one day the Halo games do come to the PC.

Jesus_Phish
25-10-2012, 02:42 PM
It was released on Mac too. Before MS bought it, the game was going to be a 3rd person over the shoulder shooter and they even had a panel at some Mac expo where Steve Jobs was introducing them.

I understand what you're saying. It can seem silly that an exclusive game wouldn't eventually come out to make more money years down the line, but if you look at the Halo games now, you can actually get most of them digitally still, but on console. As consoles embrace digital distribution more, there's even less of a chance of the console exclusives making it to PC to live on. Hell I can buy almost all the original final fantasy games on handhelds now.

For Sony or MS, it's probably more work than they're willing to do to bring games like Uncharted, Killzone, Halo and Gears to PC. When now, they can have them locked to their machines forever. Again, it's all about getting hardware in and selling through that hardware. Exclusives have the power to do that.

Maybe in a few years you'll be lucky and MS will decide it's time to release all the Halo series on PC in a big collection. I wouldn't bet on it though.

Shane
25-10-2012, 03:14 PM
Metro Last Light is the biggest overhyped piece of shit game ever.

But-but Metro 2033 is the best linear shooter I've ever played!


http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-whEZCOgjrQ8/T5tzQmGe-PI/AAAAAAAAASk/ppfxDHV4tOg/s1600/tin-foil-hat.jpg

Posting that while having a Deus Ex avatar, trying to be ironic on purpose?

Shooop
25-10-2012, 03:31 PM
Posting that while having a Deus Ex avatar, trying to be ironic on purpose?

Stop that, you might cause a singularity collapse.

Shooop
25-10-2012, 03:35 PM
Oh, I thought MS just owned the Halo brand, not Bungie as a whole (hence why it was never released on Mac). My mistake!

I would argue though that releasing the first in a series late is different to releasing its sequel so late (case in point: how many people are frustrated by waiting for HL3?). You still have a considerable gap between Halos 1 and 2 and then 3. Despite Halo's popularity on the console, they certainly could've done themselves a favour if they had put more effort into the PC releases. I'd also argue that do you really think that the kind of people who wait for a specific game on a console to be out to get said console are the kind of people that will buy a gaming PC, let alone build one of their own? I don't dismiss any overlap, but it seems like that specific amount would be over-powered by an additional PC release for those interested.

Regardless, yes I hope one day the Halo games do come to the PC.

It's sadly all a matter of keeping Xboxes profitable. Halo is Microsoft's golden goose and keeping it tied to only one platform means guaranteeing that platform will continue to be profitable. It's not a good thing for us consumers, but it's a wonderful business position.

Tikey
25-10-2012, 05:17 PM
Posting that while having a Deus Ex avatar, trying to be ironic on purpose?

It's a conspiracy!

RedRobin
15-11-2012, 12:04 PM
It's a conspiracy!

lol! Oh No!

Mohorovicic
15-11-2012, 01:00 PM
Thanks for the meaningful bump.

Since Microsoft doesn't even want to risk me giving them money, I just watched an LP. It looked pretty nice, probably not worth the price tag but I can see myself enjoying it. Kind of like modern CoDs in that regard, especially considering the several set-pieces they managed to throw in. Obviously I didn't play it but the gunplay looks solid, the semi-unique blend of health regen and arcade FPS run & gun is still there, most of my complaints are of secondary nature(weird pauses between spoken sentences, lightguns are just reskins of USMC guns, not enough technobabble).

Spoilers (http://i45.tinypic.com/2qbajp3.jpg) below if you care.

I'm torn on Cortana's death. On one hand, it took balls to do it I'm sure and it definitely is a strong way to take over a series and start a new trilogy. On the other, I keep thinking about Newt and Hick's death in Alien 3 which was just a dick move of a new director. Well, all that assuming that Cortana will actually stay dead; She's such an integral part of the series at this point that I wouldn't even raise an eyebrow if she was brought back(or a new Cortana was made who then assimilated the memories of the old Cortana from the space ether dimension zone).

Wonder how hardcore fans of the series reacted. Say what you want, but you spent quite a bit of time with her across god knows how many games there are. I guess it will be up to Halo 5 to really get it across that you are alone now. Doubt they will pull it off.

TechnicalBen
15-11-2012, 01:13 PM
They put QTE in the game. This is all I need to know. It's dead. :P

Vandelay
15-11-2012, 01:23 PM
Reading a few of these comments and hearing generally positive things about the Halo series, I thought I might try out the ones available for PC. Turns out, Microsoft don't even want me to buy those as they are not available on any digital store, not even Windows Marketplace. They do have a trailer for 2 though!

Grizzly
15-11-2012, 01:33 PM
I liked on the Crysis console trailer how they used the term "Remastered lighting" instead of "We had to take out HDR."

Uh, what? "Remastered Lightning" is indeed, "We had to take out HDR", but you forget the "But we added in the Global Illumination from Crysis 2 instead".

lordpiggsworth
15-11-2012, 01:33 PM
I'd crack up if they did Halo 4 for PC... Windows 8 only.

Mohorovicic
15-11-2012, 01:36 PM
They put QTE in the game. This is all I need to know. It's dead. :P

Okay, seriously? It's time to set the QTE record straight.

Games are interactive. I shouldn't use that word, but it's the one that conveys the point the fastest. You do stuff in games. You aren't supposed to just sit and watch stuff happening on its own in a videogame for long. You're not playing a videogame then, you're just watching a goddamn movie.

At the same time, you want cutscenes because they're cool and they push the story forward. So obviously, an ideal solution would be to combine interactivity with cutscenes.

I'm sure you can see where this is going; that's what most QTEs are supposed to be. Keeping you in the game, keeping you involved with what's going on on the screen, preventing from going into "passive mode" where you take your hands away from the controls and rest head on your hand just watching stuff happen. Because when you enter that mode chances are very good the videogame just fucking failed at being a videogame.

There are other benefits to QTEs. It keeps things personal, for one. Think of the final scenes of Modern Warfare 2 - it requires your input to shamble to Shepard, it requires your input to attack him, it requires your input to crawl for the gun, then it requires your input to pull out the knife out of your goddamn chest and throw it in his eye. All of this could easily be a cutscene. It would probably work out better as one too, from the drama perspective. But they left that interactive because watching a cutscene this long after spending twenty minutes of frantic gunning everything that moves would be anticlimactic and frankly speaking, boring. And it makes it more personal. Don't you feel better for *personally* killing the guy who betrayed you, killed your other self and started a war between USA and Russia instead of just watching it happen? Well, you don't, because you don't give a fuck about any characters in Call of Duty games or the gameworld in general. But the point still stands.

QTEs keep things videogame when they otherwise wouldn't be. They're a good thing and they're here to stay. Deal with it.

Sketch
15-11-2012, 02:13 PM
I think there's 2 QTE's in the game too, one at the start, one and the end. It's still very Halo-y.

DaftPunk
15-11-2012, 02:13 PM
I sense great anger in you Mohorovicic (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/forums/member.php?1820-Mohorovicic).

Shooop
15-11-2012, 02:27 PM
When I'm watching a cutscene I want to be watching a cutscene. Being demanded to mash a button as quickly as possible or be insta-killed isn't good gameplay, it's annoying and stupid. QTEs are simply the developers taking the laziest way out of making a game actually a game.

Why don't you just press buttons on an unplugged controller while watching a movie instead? You'll have just as much fun and interactivity.

Kaira-
15-11-2012, 02:30 PM
When I'm watching a cutscene I want to be watching a cutscene. Being demanded to mash a button as quickly as possible or be insta-killed isn't good gameplay, it's annoying and stupid. QTEs are simply the developers taking the laziest way out of making a game actually a game.

Why don't you just press buttons on an unplugged controller while watching a movie instead? You'll have just as much fun and interactivity.

Nothing in the definition of QTE requires "mash buttons or die and re-try". They could be (and have been) implemented in far better manner, but for some reason allowing QTEs to affect outcomes (in other ways than "welp you died") is something that games tend to avoid.

Mohorovicic
15-11-2012, 02:30 PM
Being demanded to mash a button as quickly as possible or be insta-killed isn't good gameplay, it's annoying and stupid.

Yeah. Good thing that's not how QTEs work then, huh?


Why don't you just press buttons on an unplugged controller while watching a movie instead? You'll have just as much fun and interactivity.

Okay the previous statement was blatantly ignorant but this? You're just being stupid. Actually you're being double stupid because not only your argument doesn't work on any level, it's actually the opposite of what QTEs are for.

Shooop
15-11-2012, 04:36 PM
Yeah. Good thing that's not how QTEs work then, huh?

Too bad a lot of them actually do. Or prevent you from actually moving forward through the game - which in a way is almost the same thing.




Okay the previous statement was blatantly ignorant but this? You're just being stupid. Actually you're being double stupid because not only your argument doesn't work on any level, it's actually the opposite of what QTEs are for.

It's not my fault you're too ignorant to realize the very base of any video game, and I'm certainly in no position to educate you on it.

So enjoy pushing buttons on a controller or keyboard, watching things happen, and being blissfully unaware that you are in fact pushing buttons on a controller or keyboard. It's OK, we won't judge you, you special snowflake you.

gwathdring
15-11-2012, 06:47 PM
I don't like replacing cutscenes with quick time events. A lot of games don't seem to understand what makes cutscenes work, and most of my encounters with QTEs are just another type of ineffective or obnoxious cutscene. Having a grace period is a rather important part of any game; there needs to be a spot for you to rest both so you're more capable of handling what is to come and so the action can maintain dramatic effect through contrast. If it's all guns-blazing all the time, then guns-blazing stops being quite so exciting.

Less abstractly, for better or worse gamers are really used to cutscenes. It's downright disorienting when a game throws inconsistent QTEs at you in the middle of what you think is going to be a set-down-the-controller moment (I'm looking at you, Assassin's Creed II). That's not to say there isn't a space for "press X to continue" mechanics in games. But it's very difficult to make them so that they are a) relevant b) interesting and c) not frustrating. I really can't think of many examples. And if they don't satisfy all three of those conditions, there's usually a better way to implement the design goal. Unless the design goal is "use QTEs" or "make everything interactive because videogames" in which case there's something wrong with the design goal(s).

I really struggle to think of QTE mechanics that weren't frustrating/surprising, were relevant, and were interesting. I think Just Cause 2 had some QTE mechanics that were pretty functional. They were well paced so they weren't frustrating, they were relevant (hijacking isn't skill-based in the game, but it still requires time and attention, which worked for me; hacking a pipeline required being fast and taking down any nearby security forces first, which made plenty of sense, really), and they were sometimes interesting (you had to time it right, otherwise you might end up crashing the vehicle you're breaking into). There are other ways to do it that also would have worked, but the QTEs didn't seem out of place or bad to me.

Arkham Asylum/City has some good QTE mechanics and some bad ones. The whole "tap this button really rapidly to open a metal grate" thing sucked. It wasn't interesting, it was sometimes frustrating, and it was only sometimes relevant (it didn't always make sense that Batman would take a significant amount of time to get through the grates; there was already mechanical precedent for actions that took significant amounts of time after initiated through the controls ... that didn't require QTEs throughout.) Similarly with the "press grapple rapidly not to die" QTE. The idea is that the grappling hook can save Batman from pretty much any fall, and that Batman dying through falling is kind of lame. I'm on board so far. But the whole rapid tap? It isn't significantly more difficult, it isn't more interesting and it isn't more relevant than a "Press grapple once not to die" QTE. On the other hand, I really enjoyed the combat. It was easy against a decent sized group, but started getting difficult against a veritable mob. I felt like Batman in that sense. Aiming my punches one by one, struggling with a single opponent as in Zeno Clash ... that wouldn't be interesting or relevant when I'm playing as Batman. Batman can take down a lone thug easy.

That's my take on QTEs. Stuff like otherwise normal cutscenes with QTEs stuffed in? They usually don't feel interesting and relevant to me as a player. I'd be just as content/frustrated watching the cutscene in a non-interactive mode. The possibility of failing them, then, becomes an additional frustration with at best no benefit to me as a player.

Grizzly
15-11-2012, 06:56 PM
It's downright disorienting when a game throws inconsistent QTEs at you in the middle of what you think is going to be a set-down-the-controller moment (I'm looking at you, Assassin's Creed II). That's not to say there isn't a space for "press X to continue" mechanics in games. But it's very difficult to make them so that they are a) relevant b) interesting and c) not frustrating. I really can't think of many examples.

I actually liked Assassin's Creed 2's QTEs. Aren't those the ones that say "press a button and get a slightly different cutscene"? Like Ezio dodging a vase instead of getting smashed by it, and then getting back up?

Patrick Swayze
15-11-2012, 07:04 PM
IRT MOHOROVIC

She isnt dead dude.

She's in the Domain.

Jesus_Phish
15-11-2012, 07:09 PM
I actually liked Assassin's Creed 2's QTEs. Aren't those the ones that say "press a button and get a slightly different cutscene"? Like Ezio dodging a vase instead of getting smashed by it, and then getting back up?

Those are the only ones I've ever encountered. They seem to have very little to do with the game other than as you said, changing a cut scene a little.

Sketch
15-11-2012, 07:28 PM
Except when you don't hug Leonardo they change the game A LOT :'(

Shooop
15-11-2012, 07:33 PM
If only more people took the AssCreed 2 approach to all QTEs they wouldn't be so despicable. But 90% of them are either "Do it or you die and start over" or "Do it or you can't proceed to the next part. It's not an option or a fun little mini game, it's a haphazardly thrown-in mechanic that reeks of last-minute additions to inflate the game's length.

Just watch the first 10 minutes of Resident Evil 6. It's disgusting.

Namdrol
15-11-2012, 07:54 PM
Just finished watching this pretty epic montage of Halo 4.....
So I ask this question... Do you think the Halo series will ever come back to PC? :(




More cartoony than epic.

TechnicalBen
15-11-2012, 10:39 PM
Okay, seriously? It's time to set the QTE record straight.

Games are interactive. I shouldn't use that word, but it's the one that conveys the point the fastest. You do stuff in games. You aren't supposed to just sit and watch stuff happening on its own in a videogame for long. You're not playing a videogame then, you're just watching a goddamn movie.

At the same time, you want cutscenes because they're cool and they push the story forward. So obviously, an ideal solution would be to combine interactivity with cutscenes.

I'm sure you can see where this is going; that's what most QTEs are supposed to be. Keeping you in the game, keeping you involved with what's going on on the screen, preventing from going into "passive mode" where you take your hands away from the controls and rest head on your hand just watching stuff happen. Because when you enter that mode chances are very good the videogame just fucking failed at being a videogame.

There are other benefits to QTEs. It keeps things personal, for one. Think of the final scenes of Modern Warfare 2 - it requires your input to shamble to Shepard, it requires your input to attack him, it requires your input to crawl for the gun, then it requires your input to pull out the knife out of your goddamn chest and throw it in his eye. All of this could easily be a cutscene. It would probably work out better as one too, from the drama perspective. But they left that interactive because watching a cutscene this long after spending twenty minutes of frantic gunning everything that moves would be anticlimactic and frankly speaking, boring. And it makes it more personal. Don't you feel better for *personally* killing the guy who betrayed you, killed your other self and started a war between USA and Russia instead of just watching it happen? Well, you don't, because you don't give a fuck about any characters in Call of Duty games or the gameworld in general. But the point still stands.

QTEs keep things videogame when they otherwise wouldn't be. They're a good thing and they're here to stay. Deal with it.
No. I don't want cutscenes. Every other Halo game got the balance right. If I did not want the cutscecne, I just skipped it "whoo new spaceship battle", next level. If I wanted it "whoo cool story bro" etc. I'm happy. QTE should die in everything but a QTE game. At least I'm open to giving others choice. ;)

Mohorovicic
16-11-2012, 02:39 PM
It's not my fault you're too ignorant to realize the very base of any video game, and I'm certainly in no position to educate you on it.

Oh thank god. I don't even want to imagine what someone who objects to giving player more control over what's happening thinks is the very base of a videogame.

Shooop
16-11-2012, 02:48 PM
Oh thank god. I don't even want to imagine what someone who objects to giving player more control over what's happening thinks is the very base of a videogame.

You don't actually enjoy video games do you? Why the hell are you here? If you want the game to play itself then just buy a movie and push buttons while pretending you're controlling the characters on the screen. It's OK, I won't tell anyone else how this makes you a strange, sad little man.

gundato
17-11-2012, 01:44 AM
Jesus god damned christ. I wander off for a week and mohor is the voice of reason? The crap...

But yes. QTEs, in principle, are a wonderful idea. They keep cutscenes interactive. Trust me, as awesome as MGS4 was, it would have been a LOT better if there was something to do during the hour long cutscenes other than do the potty dance.

The problem is that QTEs have been poorly used at times. But I am also sure we have all played some bad FPSes and RPGs and RTSes: Are those inherently bad genres?

Obviously this is up to interpretation, but here are my thoughts

QTEs as a way to finish off a mook: See pretty much any recent game with melee attacks. These annoy me since they take you out of your rhythm and, in the case of the first God of War, can scale to the point that it is too difficult (after the 75% point, I can't kill minotaurs with the button mashing any more).

QTEs as a way to finish off a boss: if done correctly, this can make killing the boss VERY satisfying. See basically any God of War. However, without context clues, this can end poorly. See the Kraken in The Witcher 2

QTEs as a way to keep you on your toes during cutscenes: Resident Evil 4. Pretty much every QTE was there to make sure you were focused on the action, and most of them made sense in the context of the controls

QTEs as a way to increase immersion: God of War 3 and Infamous 2. GoW3 has the killing of poseidon where you depress both thumbsticks with your thumbs as Kratos gouges out his eyes with his thumbs, and the pounding of bone into the dirt with Zeus where the game won't end until YOU have closure on that. Infamous 2 does it in a really heartbreaking way with respect to the good ending where, after an artfully done level where the token "evil" teammate chooses self-sacrifice and the token "good" teammmate chooses life and you finally get some god damned closure on the Beast, you need to activate the sphere and commit suicide. The game has you depress every single shoulder button, one by one. Then, you are just told to "let go". Turns what is already a tearjerker into a full on snotfest as you experience something of what Cole has gone through for the past two games as you have to do just that: Let go.

Ironically, MGS3 also had a good example when you had to kill the final enemy. Really helps to drive home just how Naked Snake/Big Boss feels by forcing YOU to pull the trigger.