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  1. #1
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
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    WAS - Weapon Appreciation Society

    a discussion has been going in the state of the game thread, which I think needs its own thing.

    look around you. look around you. can you tell what Im looking for? yes! guns!

    guns is an element composed mostly of spite and metal. and custard.

    thanks guns! thuns!


    Why for the love of god does anyone like the shitty TR stuff is beyond me. I dont think they are better. Or atleast, I dont get the feeling being unjustly killed by TR more often than I kill them.
    - Tom De Roeck.

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  2. #2
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    I tried running around for 15 minutes with the CARV, unaugmented. Couldn't kill shit with it. Might just be a lack of experience, or a lack of forward grips/compensators, i don't know. I wasn't overwhelmed by it, to be honest.

  3. #3
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Bankrotas's Avatar
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    Can I have a guess, that players try to play with weapons, that are more belonging to other faction in style and then realizing, that that faction has better assortment of that weapon style?

    I'm planning to get even more hard hitting weapons on my NC (ACX-11 and REAPER DMR) just to keep my feeling of faction and just cause I love those good sounds they produce.
    For VS, I really would like to try out more guns, to learn them more.
    Last edited by Bankrotas; 27-03-2013 at 10:03 AM.
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  4. #4
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
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    you do know they added the vr training room right? you can try any guns and any mods for free.
    - Tom De Roeck.

    monochrom & verse publications

    "Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it."

  5. #5
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Yes, I do much prefer the shitty TR stuff since it doesn't have ridiculous recoil and spread as our guns do. This mostly goes for the LMGs however where I now, after being stupid enough to try TR, am having a really, really hard time getting used to the absolute shit that the Pulsar and Orion is in comparison. They fire slower, they hit for less and the recoil and spread is much higher. They're just straight up worse for me.

    Weapons I do love on Vanu are VX67 which is amazing and feels amazing, and the Phobos which is also amazing. I've tried the Pulsar, Orion and Flare for Vanu as LMGs, but none of them are very good. I do like the Pulsar at range, but the damage degradation is so significant that I fail to see a point trying after feeling the power of dakka. Any tips on what I should use? The whole hipfire Orion thing is imo totally useless, just spreads all over (laser sight or not), and without foregrip the Orion gets very spazzy in the side to side recoil.
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  6. #6
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    TR weapons have better stats imo, at least the ones that matter.

    Comparing the Medic and Engineer starting weapons, the TR ones come out on top. They do more damage, they have a lower ROF, they have higher accuracy, they've huge clip sizes.
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  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Bankrotas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantaCat View Post
    you do know they added the vr training room right? you can try any guns and any mods for free.
    My arse itches from wearing purple spandex too long And I don't like spending too much time in virtual reality, it's not real life you know, no real people to kill.
    Hear from the spirit-world this mystery:
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    Angel and demon, man and beast art thou,
    Yea, thou art all thou dost appear to be!

  8. #8
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    The HV45 is a must, as is a shotgun of your choice. I prefer the nova with the extended clip for a 12 shot magazine. With slugs, it becomes very decent at medium range fire, as it kills in 3 shots and doesnt have any drop.

    Also, i'm really not sure what you're on about with the carv, ride. It's been nerfed a lot, and yeah ... it takes 1 bullet less at range to kill due to damage degradation of the orion, but the orion COF is a littler tighter (=spread). Is it possible that this is a perception thing? I.e., the weapon sound/feel makes it seem a lot more powerful?

    Edit: i'm not saying there's no difference, but it's pretty marginal imo ... except when it comes to the 100 round mag.
    Last edited by qaz; 27-03-2013 at 01:14 PM.

  9. #9
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    Ridebird, I'm surprised you don't like the Pulsar Lsw as it's pretty much better than the Carv in every respect, except ammo. I agree on the Orion though : i can't hit any damn thing with it.

  10. #10
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Nono, the Carv is vastly superior to the Pulsar. First shot recoil + overall spread is shit on the Pulsar.

    Qazz: It can fully be perception (it sounds, looks and feels much more powerful, but that is the Vanu course I fear - except for the Lancer), but I killed several infantry at about 50 meters in under half a second with the Carv. That is not possible with the Orion due to side to side recoil shaking up a storm and bullets flying everywhere. I have my Auraxium with the Orion and I know it in and out, but I would take the Carv any day over it and did _much_ better with the Carv. On my uncerted TR HA I had 1.8 K/D while playing solo for about an hour.

    edit: You can link all the spreadsheets you want, I still think they don't varry over much how the weapons act in game. Saying that the Orion has tight COF and little spread is simply not true for example. It seems quite off. Take the SVA88 - a weapon that should be exactly similar to the Orion in COF. It is not. It is very, very different.
    Last edited by RIDEBIRD; 27-03-2013 at 01:30 PM.
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  11. #11
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    It is not a matter of the type of recoil and spread you see then? Some weapons have recoil upwards and only to one side, which is more manageable, if you learn the pattern. Others have recoil upwards, and randomly from side to side. This is impossible to compensate for, making these guns less accurate in practice. There's also a huge difference in first-shot recoil between guns, that can change the feeling quite a bit.

  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    I know, Pulsar has the pattern and I compensate. There is however absolutely no need to compensate on the Carv (you also can't due to equal horizontal recoil).

    Pulsar has ridiculous first shot recoil. I think that might be what throws me off.
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  13. #13
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    I have spent quite some time in this game, and I'm also someone who likes to play with a wide variety of weapons. I've got all Auraxium Medals on our carbines (except for Solstice Burst... seriously, who plays this gun when u can have Pulsar C or Solstice SF which are able to fill the same niche and more?) as well as 4 out of 6 Auraxium Medals on the LMG's (actually working on the 5th with the SVA-88, gonna get the Ursa for the last Medals as well). I've also spent some time with Shotguns, Assault Rifles, Sniper Rifles and so on...

    I've come to the following conclusions, regarding most of our Vanu Weapons:

    They are ok. Easy to use, because we have low recoil and therefore we don't have to "do" much to work against our recoil. Mostly I'd recommend our weapons to be used as "spray and pray", since our First-Shot Recoil multipliers (on most weapons, not all of them) SUCK, heavily, and Single-shot as well as Burst-Fire doesn't pay off because of that. Actually, your Bullets will go wherever you do NOT want them to go if you do. CoF (Cone of fire) is also very unpredictable, so "shoot more-think less" applies even more (not indefinitely, of course).

    So, basically, what you may have learned in other FPS's, regarding Burst-Fire, does not apply to most of the VS Infantry Weapons - basically, you give away the advantage of them when you try too hard to be an "outstanding Marksman".

    F.e. most of the NC Weapons are pretty much the opposite of that - Kicking like a horse, harder to control because of that, sustained fire CAN be a nightmare, but when used carefully you hit harder, and kill faster.

    What makes the TR Weapons the strongest over-all Infantry Weapons right now, is that they have a good mix between all that - First-Shot Recoil on some weapons is manageable, CoF is not worse as ours (Vanu's) is, all that combined with decent Magazine Size, decent RoF and Recoil still lower than you're used to from most FPS's lets you fire much, shoot sharp, hit good, reload less.

    All of that with the fact that VS's only "real" upside comes with our downside as well - no bullet drop but damage degradation - makes me say that I'd quite frankly take some of our enemies weapons over some of ours at any time.

    Of course we have some outstanding guns as well: VX6-7 (I'd call it best over-all carbine at any time), HV45 (... seriously, where does it's awesomeness end?), Orion (I know, some ppl don't like it, but I think it's a hell of a gun (not many attachments, small clip, I still like it)).

    Just to make sure ppl are convinced I know what I'm talking about :

    https://players.planetside2.com/#!/5...40462017/stats

  14. #14
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    On a general note, I think that these two are important statistics in a weapon, besides the obvious like RoF or dpb: first shot recoil multiplier and bullet velocity. Especially the latter: even if the opponent has a bit higher RoF, faster travel time means that your bullets reach him first than his you.

    Well, obviously everyone loves the Hydra (H-V45). It is a great weapon, and I think it is what every Vanu weapon category should have. Unfortunately, that is not true for the carbines or the LMGs: VX6-7 shares its hipfire accuracy and RoF, and the Serpent has its amazing ADS accuracy even mid-range plus an even higher RoF (850 rpm). In fact, VX6-7 has a terrible x3 first shot recoil multiplier. I'm about to get my Auraxium medal at VX6-7, and I think I'm switching to Serpent afterwards. By the way, one of the things that helped this FPS noob survive a bit more in Auraxis is learning to hip fire, and these weapons have been invaluable to that.

    I love my Nova, especially in towers, and IMHO the semi-automatics are the only shotguns that should have been included in the game. Their RoF allows some reaction to the opponent, yet they are still devastating.

    For bolt snipers, the Parallax. Amazing weapon. Even at the edge of the infantry render distance, just 1.5 mil-dots compensation is sufficient, and the bullet flies so fast that they probably won't have much time to be lucky and change stance or direction of movement before they get a head shot (smile!).

    As for LMGs, SVA-88 all the way. Fitted with Adv Foregrip, Compensator and HVA, it is an amazing gun. And it can also hipfire in an emergency. I've also used the Pulsar LSW, which is a great, versatile and user friendly weapon, which I'd recommend to people who don't want to get the SVA-88. And the Orion, which is supposedly CQC, but others have noted its shortcomings. But yeah, compared to the TR and especially the NC, there is not a viable long range Vanu LMG. The damage drop off is too severe. And the funny thing is, that if you try to compensate for the recoil in long distances by switching to single shot mode, there is bullet drop!

    Also, and here's something else funny, Vanu weapons across all categories have slightly worse bullet velocity than the other factions equivalents. So, not only do we do less damage in long range, we also have to lead more. which means we miss more.
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 27-03-2013 at 03:27 PM.

  15. #15
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    By the way, the reduction in hipfire CoF bloom afforder by Laser Sight and Adv Laser is there, even if you turn the laser off (by pressing L, or whichever is the key you have bound "turn lights off" too). Also, if you had it off, and respawn, your character's model will appear with the laser beam on. Just turn it on and off again.

  16. #16
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xxotic View Post
    Great post, and makes mine obsolete

  17. #17
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    I'd recommend the Phobos over the Nova any time. More powerful with higher fire rate = profit. But yeah, seems I have totally missed out on the SVA88. I think bullet velocity and first shot recoil is what I am now struggling to bare with on hte Orion and Pulsar after trying TR.
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  18. #18
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    By the way, High Velocity Ammunition (HVA) adds a level of damage at the edge of the damage degradation distance, while Soft Point Ammuniton (SPA) degrades to the normal level as it would, and not to a level worse as the forum rumour was.

  19. #19
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Bankrotas's Avatar
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    Out of lmgs I think EM6 has slowest speed. Yep.
    Hear from the spirit-world this mystery:
    Creation is summed up, O man, in thee;
    Angel and demon, man and beast art thou,
    Yea, thou art all thou dost appear to be!

  20. #20
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    I don't know wether to like the SVA-88 or not... A weapon clearly designed for long ranges (High Bullet Velocity, low First-Shot Recoil, Attachments such as High Velocity Ammo) but yet it features highest RoF of ALL Vanu LMG... paired with highest vertical recoil (alongside Flare). And it has a Single-Shot fire mode built in....

    I still prefer the Flare mid to long ranges, and will prefer the Ursa once I have it (just nice they hit a liiiittle bit harder than our usual LMG), so for me it's a niche weapon with a couple of nice functionalities... but won't be able to compete with other weapons in their specific niches in the long run (my opinion)

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