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Thread: [VS] Tactical Mondays?
25-03-2013, 05:53 PM #1
[VS] Tactical Mondays?
Now first thing, I am not talking of scrapping Silly Monday. Silly Monday is reasonably short, so this can be done afterwards. Or even another day. But today is Monday and I wanna give this a blast.
Me Loki Grible and Bankrotas were arseing about in the tower in the VR room, and ended up talking about giving some brief direction into assault and defense of various facilities, as well as some scenario training.
This is not, by any means, a numbers thing, and no assault/defense is the same, but some brief instruction and some squad tactics into how a certain base/building is assaulted/defended would go a long way to the team play thing that we so desperately need. This would be much like the event that MrEclectic and Esoteric ran a week or so ago in the warpgate.
We would like to look at assaulting a satellite tower in a semi structured way tonight to see how things go, then afterwards, maybe even the defense of such a structure. Starting at 9:30 in the VR Training Tower for roughly 30 mins, then taking what we've learned to the battlefield on Amerish where it will be fairly quiet and easy to get to (read: no queues).
Given the influx of new RPSers over the last couple of weeks, this could be vital to building and maintaining a squad based play style, and even allow people to come out and voice their own opinions on how to assault/defend things.
One thing I would like to reiterate is that this is semi structured play. This is not a "go here, stand here and only do this" kind of thing. It's a "right, we have this many people, do we have enough to lock down a spawn, or should we lock down the point, and how can we do that effectively" kin of thing.
So at 9:30 GMT tonight we would like to trial this idea with as many people as possible, working on squad tactics. Ideally, a mix of veteran regulars and newbies in each squad to help spread the experience around. We also ideally need a couple of people in each squad to have smoke, since this is very underutilised, yet can really make a difference (Ridebirds Delta force and the BioLab anyone?).
If this is popular, we could do this as a regular event. We have people who are better at certain things than others (flying for example, Eleven), who can pass their experience and tips and tricks to others. It's something the other big outfits do, that as of yet, we do not. It'd be nice if we can avoid becoming the zerg and be known for 1 squad taking entire facilities!
25-03-2013, 06:30 PM #2
- Join Date
- Mar 2013
I can't usually commit to playtime in advance, but if I'm on I'd be up for that.
25-03-2013, 06:33 PM #3
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
Using the fact that Silly Monday is short, but also normally brings in numbers, seems good.
Also, I really want to do a "how to get the best out of your Magrider" thing some day.
25-03-2013, 06:37 PM #4
I gues it will be on the vanu side? (as it is not specified) I also assume it might be open for the traitors? I't can't harm knowing the tactics of your enemies, and besides I can always learn more. I am not sure if I can make it though, as 9:30 is rather late for me.
I could also be wrong and you all hop on the NC side :P, might be wearth it sometime. Best way to learn the enemy is to play it for an hour or so.
25-03-2013, 06:38 PM #5
I'd love for this to happen, and I'd love to join in, sharing what thoughts I have, and hearing about others'. BUT... 9.30? That means it's going to start at what is essentially a reasonable bedtime for a working person in my time zone...
I would strongly suggest another time, if this is going to be a regular thing. Also, Mondays are the only day of the week where I will never be playing Planetside, unless I'm sick, so unless we move it to some other day, I won't participate.
25-03-2013, 06:54 PM #6
Not sure if I will be there. Spending more time with the girlfriend (been a bit much PS2!). I do think we should have training on sundays though, at 7pm GMT/2000 CET. Sundays are, from m yexperience, the best day for videogames for a lot of people. We want as many people on as possible seeing as training is important.
25-03-2013, 07:06 PM #7
It's open to both VS and NC. Yeah it can be done sunday but I would like to trial it tonight with a good number of people, which i know Silly Mondays brings in. Of course, it's not mandatory but the more people we have there, the better!
25-03-2013, 07:10 PM #8
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
Despite being CET I work in a stupid industry which means my single day off this week is tomorrow - woooo! So I will hopefully be there, I've really enjoyed the couple of sessions in this vein that I've been part of before.
25-03-2013, 07:11 PM #9
Go for it!
I will hold a drill in giving less of a fuck, aggression, situational awareness and fearlessnes. I did try to make that awesome but it's generally about not caring about dying, ever. This is why I am pretty good at chaotic FPS where there is a massive battlefield - I just run through everything and "magically" survive going from cover to cover, never stopping and never hesitating.
I think that mentality might not be for all, and perhaps this drill is mostly for fellow people that like to mainly kill - meaning HA and LA. Medics should join as well t hough, and I know Wibbster can train the others in fearless rezzing as he is often the one trying to revive me when I have stormed in to five maxes and ten guys..
25-03-2013, 11:02 PM #10
Well tonight went fairly well I feel. A lot of positive feedback from people.
We focused on assaulting a tower in a fairly aggressive yet minimalistic shock assault.
A part diversionary force attacking from the small door between the main garages consisting of mostly engis and medics with a small La force assaulting the balcony on the 1st floor by the cap room, who would move n on the stairs behind the defending force, whilst they are focused on the main diversionary force below. This was then followed by the main force taking up defensive positions in and the cap point and locking it down. The LA's would then watch the balconies and provide assistance to those under heavy fire.
In all it took roughly 20-30 seconds for 1 squad to breach the tower and take up the defensive positions which was really quite amazing. The enemy only managed to take the point back with a max crash of 4-5 maxes (3 of which died to my Suicide C4, if a medic was still up at that point could have scraped a lot of us up)
It was good that after one run through in VR MrEclectic was able to see what we were trying to do, and he provided excellent feedback and assistance in explaining the objective where I could not (I'm a little chaotic in my descriptions), so thank you so much. Yeah you talked a lot, but I felt for the most part it was extremely constructive and supportive; I am very grateful!
Thanks to Grible and Loki for supporting me on this and for our "tactical meeting" earlier in the evening, as well as bankrotas.
Also thank you in the most part to everyone that took part. You all seemed to be very keen on the idea of tactical play and many offered valuable suggestions and challenges to my own ideas that will help others understand what they are looking for in any assault.
The main points to take away from tonight are:
- Diverting the enemies attention to allow a small force to gain the upperhand in a complex is an extremely potent tactic.
- Using Line of Sight (LoS) to your advantage is key.
- You don't need to be geared to the teeth to be effective.
- Most importantly - Squad based play is the most effective weapon in your arsenal, by a long way. If you know that your buddy has your back you can focus on watching theirs.
I welcome constructive feedback (does not need to be positive so long as it is structured in a constructive way). I would like people to suggest ideas for the next run, which, all being good and if people are happy, to be next Sunday.
It would be nice if a couple of BL's and Beacons could meet up around 6pm GMT next Sunday to go through a squad based tactic and nail it down before helping me to deliver at 8pm GMT that evening. Ideally 3 others who would be available that evening to head up a squad each. Of course if more BL's and BEacons show up that would be amazing and we can take volunteers.
This would also serve as a fantastic opportunity for people to step up as SL and PL and learn how to in a strat situation with a safety net.
Again thank you for tonight and I look forward to hearing your comments
25-03-2013, 11:27 PM #11
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
Watching your numbers on the map after we in Bravo had been prematurely wiped out, I thought the length of time Alpha and Charlie held point A at the Bastion, against multiple platoons, first run out, was pretty impressive. If we'd had another 2 squads waiting in the wings to jump in right as you were getting overrun with the same tactic followed by mass rezzing I reckon we might have been able to lock down the whole tower.
A lot of interesting and useful points were brought out considering that the discussion only focused on one door, two stairways, one cap point room and 2 balconies. Just taking the time to think and look at these things with guns down for a few minutes works wonders.
The format was pretty good; I think though that it might be more valuable to move to drilling in VR sooner after the initial tactical explanation and save the discussion on detail for a feedback session after live practice against an enemy.
Drilling mainly movement and timing in VR rather than trying to simulate enemies with another squad seemed to work better.
I really enjoyed the session, thanks again for your efforts Dewi and all the other guest lecturers.
25-03-2013, 11:43 PM #12
26-03-2013, 12:07 AM #13
- Join Date
- Jan 2013
Tonight was a great start! For this to really be realistic, we need to do live-fire exercises though. As friendly fire can get a bit annoying with the weapon lock, we could send 12 people over to the TR side of things and then basically do a 12v12 thing where we can happily shoot and kill each other.
26-03-2013, 12:44 AM #14
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
One thing which just popped into my head is that I'm not sure if it's the actual specific tactics here that made our stand last for so long - more the fact that we said "we're focussing on this one point, here are some places which are awesome to hide about in, spot enemies and use Mumble". Most of the stuff taught tonight is really useful even if you aren't doing the actual squad assault thing, and the idea of having a squad work this tightly (i.e. all on one point, flanking, etc) was rather awesome.
Would it be possible we could get some future tutorial-tactics-y things about other locations (e.g. Amp Stations, Bio Labs), just so people have a better idea of how to assault such places and where good shooting locations/hidey holes/etc are?
Edit: your first post kinda implies you've looked at other locations/plan to, but I'm a bit too tired to make sense of this. TL;DR: MOAR PLS.
Also, it was quite awesome watching 30 students sat around Sensei Dewi and Sensei Eclectic. It was like being in Primary School again.
Last edited by Danny252; 26-03-2013 at 12:48 AM."Swans are so big, they're like the Ostriches of the bird world"
26-03-2013, 01:22 AM #15
I really enjoyed tonight - I've only been playing PS2 for a week or so, and although I'm happy enough in a general FPS, the squad/location tactics in here is something I'm lacking in.
In terms of feedback, there were a few wee niggles (for me, may not apply to everyone). It could be hard to find the 'instructors' at times because of so many folk being there, and hard to hear when people were firing or driving vehicles about. For the former, if the instructors could talk in terms of descriptions, rather than saying 'here', then that would be great (they mostly did, to be fair). and for the latter, a blanket ban on people making noise would be really helpful.
I would have really liked to get more into drilling, and drilling as many times as time allows. I don't think we necessarily need to have pretend opposition in place - just getting the squads used to moving together with some purpose and cohesiveness would be great. To do it enough times so that it becomes second nature, really.
Oh and Dewisant, your instruction was anything but 'chaotic'; you were exceptionally clear and straight-forward. Thanks again, to you and everyone who was leading, it was a really good experience.
26-03-2013, 05:59 AM #16
- Join Date
- Feb 2013
- Stockholm, Sweden
I'd say that it was quite a successful event. The tactics were sound, we managed to get some decent squadplay going and now we just need to get the timing down.
I appreciated the length of the event as well. About 30 min seem alright for the more theoretical discussions we got. Enough to get into the question at hand, but not so long that you lost focus. Other than that, I agree with sinomatic about trying to do more training runs. One suggestion I would like to add is that we try to implement a "step by step" plan and have someone call out the timing for the first few training runs. I think having someone go "Approach tower", "Breach", "Approach second floor", "Breach", "Secure Cap point" would be invaluable (this can also be done in normal stratgir. play by calling out when an area has been cleared).
26-03-2013, 07:26 AM #17
Sounds like a good evening, sorry I couldn't be there!
the issue with hearing the instructors could be solved with priority speaker in Mumble, maybe? I've also had to turn in-game volume down to about 50% to be able to hear Mumble clearly.
hoping to hop on for the Sunday event!
26-03-2013, 09:50 AM #18
It was nice theorycrafting before the event, I hope to add more to this thing.Hear from the spirit-world this mystery:
Creation is summed up, O man, in thee;
Angel and demon, man and beast art thou,
Yea, thou art all thou dost appear to be!
26-03-2013, 09:55 AM #19
Dewisant, Grible, Loki and Banrkotas, thanks for organising that last night, and apologies for not shutting up. To my defense, it was due to enthusiasm. It was a great session, and I was so excited, especially since this is an aspect of the game I really enjoy. And thanks to everyone who attended, and I hope that it didn't get too confusing.
As for the test run: Bravo's Gal was shot down halfway through to the target, but we managed to get out. We legged it to the objective, but before we could breach, we run into a full sundy and some other inf. They were obviously preparing to leave. I called it out to my squad and Dewi, but here is my crucial mistake: should have been patient, watch what they were doing, while directing the squad to take ambush positions. At least Planetside is different to RL: Respawn and fight another day.
As for next "Grazing, not hazing" sessions, people seem to agree on war tourism (sic!), so let's do some. I also think that some coordinated AV fire is in order, perhaps some swagriders like Qazz and Cortosis (and invaderZim and Mindburst) could also show some basic Magrider tactics (for instance Qazz is an IR smoke man, and Cortosis a Magburner aficionado), some of our better pilots like Sir Hoc and Eleven discuss air tactics, and Ridebird his "charge like a madman, kill'em all, and have Wibbster heal me" ways (there is method in his madness).
Last edited by MrEclectic; 26-03-2013 at 10:09 AM.
26-03-2013, 10:09 AM #20
Some useful videos, that have helped me improve my game (this is my first modern FPS, and first MMO, so I am a total noob):
Especially his video on how to set up your mouse, and the one about burst fire. And in his video on situational awareness, we see him cut down a squad worth of RPS (he runs with CONZ).
On the subject of setting the mouse for FPS gaming, I've also found the first page of this useful:
The following video also demonstrates how to enter a room, how to always keep alternating between running and walking, and the importance of flanking:
And if you are a medic, indeed save the certs (its cost in Certs is actually reasonable) and get the H-V45.
Last edited by MrEclectic; 26-03-2013 at 10:16 AM.