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  1. #21
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus LaKroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ksempac View Post
    There is a decent tutorial. I mean it's long, it's good, but some of it won't apply to us (co-op mode so i don't think we will have to give orders to AI ?) and I have no idea how much different a true mission will be.
    I've played a few of the single player missions, and they are quite different from the tutorial, but you use the skills you learned there of course. There are plenty of weapons and tools, such as the less-than-lethal guns, that are available in missions, but were not covered in the tutorial.

  2. #22
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus WallyTrooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ksempac View Post
    There is a decent tutorial. I mean it's long, it's good, but some of it won't apply to us (co-op mode so i don't think we will have to give orders to AI ?) and I have no idea how much different a true mission will be.

    Yeah I did the tutorial last night and found it really helpful. I then did a few missions with what I'd learnt. I'm guessing it'll be a little harder in coop because when I tell the AI to 'open, bang and clear' they do it flawlessly every time whereas we will need to practice that a bit. Anyway, I'm looking forward to tonight's antics.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by WallyTrooper View Post
    Yeah I did the tutorial last night and found it really helpful. I then did a few missions with what I'd learnt. I'm guessing it'll be a little harder in coop because when I tell the AI to 'open, bang and clear' they do it flawlessly every time whereas we will need to practice that a bit. Anyway, I'm looking forward to tonight's antics.
    The AI's breach, X and clear is actually pretty flawed, and it's not unusual to see 1-2 of them get cut down in the process.
    I'll explain more on that when we play.

  4. #24
    Lesser Hivemind Node Ksempac's Avatar
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    Btw CMaster can we all play together or will we have to split in team of 4? Does the game scale to the number of players?

  5. #25
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    You can have 2 "elements" of 5 people each. One element will come from each entry option.

    Some levels though that would be far too many (some, especially some custom, it's probably what you need).

    We would want to split comms between the elements. May be best to have two paralell matches if there are >5 of us for the early runs on simpler levels.

  6. #26
    Activated Node Jakkar's Avatar
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    Problematic. I've version '1.0', but I can't install any version of the 1.1 patch, it claims my copy is not installed ._.

    I imagine you'll be running 1.1? Unsure what it fixed/added.

  7. #27
    Activated Node Jakkar's Avatar
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    Ah, noted issue with the NOCD. This install has been sitting on an old harddrive for years beyond measure, I didn't even know I'd cracked it. Now having to download the entire game regardless of legitimate ownership simply to acquire the original EXE I apparently failed to back up however many years ago...

    Update: Ugh. Russian installs. Further patching issues. Bugger this, I've barely slept in three days. *collapse*

    Report on how it goes, would you kindly? I'd like to play with you some future day, if it goes well.
    Last edited by Jakkar; 06-08-2013 at 06:49 PM.

  8. #28
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    So yeah, we played a few hours of SWAT, and moved on from horrendous bloodbaths to something a little more controlled.

  9. #29
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    Yup. A few rough moments, but we were getting pretty good by the end. Definitely worth playing again, and trying to cut down on our deaths.

    Also, if we have more players next time, we may need several parallel games going (and multiple Mumble channels to boot). It depends how many people are interested, but I know for a fact that some PS2 folk had intended to play but hadn't got the game yet.

  10. #30
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    Yeah, while 11/16 arrests on Tarrone is pretty good, 8/10 downed officers is awful. I think we got away with quite a few things by sheer weight of numbers. I think we've also got a bit of an issue at the moment where we are in general overly reluctant to shoot (Seriously, there shouldn't be suspects with a 4/1 K/D). But when we do take the shot, several people do at once, explaining why there are so few incapacitated suspects.

  11. #31
    Lesser Hivemind Node Ksempac's Avatar
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    Yeah it was fun :)

    Next time, I'm going full door wedges to ensure we can focus on one task at the time. The last game when Cmaster + Cooper were advancing, LaKroy was protecting one corridor, i was protecting one stair, and yet i still got shot because there was a third way for suspect to rush in...that left a bad taste in my mouth (i had time to see him open the door but not enough to shoot).

    Lucky i yelled through Mumble even though i was dead, otherwise i think LaKroy would also have died.

    It will also free up people to advance, and use less lethal options (I'm a big fan of the ll shotgun)
    Last edited by Ksempac; 07-08-2013 at 10:13 AM.

  12. #32
    Obscure Node Boosh's Avatar
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    It was really good fun, I think we started to naturally fall into a good 'routine'. Obviously things can go awry very quickly, which is nature of the game. Perhaps worth discussing roles before each map so responsibilities are clearly defined, especially for breaching doors.
    I enjoyed the last couple of runs through Tarrone trying the non-lethal shotgun, which was quite effective! That was until we met the psycho bitch with a pump action who took a full 5 rounds of pepper in the face and still took me out.

    Constant judgment calls is what really makes this game though, very tense. I'd be interested to know how the 'morale' works with suspects who try to resist, I understand a high velocity beanbag in the face can help, but will they also be affected by overwhelming presence? For example 8 officers entering the room from different directions, lots of shouting, gas etc.

  13. #33
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    Stuff that makes suspects more likley to surrender:
    Officers shouting (more officers -> more likley)
    Stun/disorientation. So Flash, C2 on doors, etc
    Injury - if they've got some bullets in them, more likley.
    Pain - so stingers, pepper, tazer, melee, beanbags. Note that some perps will pretty much just shrug off stingers/beanbags and pepper. Some have gasmasks that make them immune to pepper and gas.

    Out of the less lethals, tazer is the most effective by far. A shot with it, or a melee hit with it with disable any target for several seconds, and seriously drop their morale.

    Also, shooting someone in the arm/leg, while likley to make them surrender (especially if you make them drop their gun with a good hand shot), will sometimes cause them to flee instead.

  14. #34
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus LaKroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ksempac View Post
    The last game when Cmaster + Cooper were advancing, LaKroy was protecting one corridor, i was protecting one stair, and yet i still got shot because there was a third way for suspect to rush in...that left a bad taste in my mouth (i had time to see him open the door but not enough to shoot).

    Lucky i yelled through Mumble even though i was dead, otherwise i think LaKroy would also have died.
    Yeah, we could have handled that situation better. I think it passed my mind that the door could be an issue, but I guess I thought you had it covered. On the other hand, you essentially saved my life and I managed to survive the whole level. Conclusion: I agree that wedges would be especially useful on the Tarrone map! :)

  15. #35
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus LaKroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boosh View Post
    Constant judgment calls is what really makes this game though, very tense. I'd be interested to know how the 'morale' works with suspects who try to resist, I understand a high velocity beanbag in the face can help, but will they also be affected by overwhelming presence? For example 8 officers entering the room from different directions, lots of shouting, gas etc.
    In single player, I tried clearing rooms with lots of hostiles beginning with CS, then a flashbang on entry. That seemed to demoralise them even though they outnumbered the SWAT team.

  16. #36
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Shoot them in the knees! That'll teach those scoundrels.
    I'm failing to writing a blog, specifically about playing games the wrong way
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  17. #37
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    Once we've got the basics down of handling suspects and using our arsenal (which I think we did), next step is working a bit more tightly as a team.

    When breaching a door, instead of just standing behind it, we should be positioned to avoid their lines of fire, and when entering the room, peel left and right to clear the area thoroughly. Also, if we buddy up, you dramatically increase your odds of survival. Have on person watching your back constantly, so you know you're safe to reload/use the optiwand etc.

    This also holds for chasing suspects. Sometimes you do want to pursue a fleeing suspect, sometimes you don't. It depends on the level/area, and your capacity to incapacitate them at range. But a mistake Red team made a few times was to move alone after a suspect, which you should really never be doing.

    Also, on morale - while it may not necessarily drop their morale entirely, a tazer hit will stop a suspect and make them halt for a few seconds, and I think pepper spray does the same (although I don't know if gas masks protect them from spray).

  18. #38
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Gas mask block spray, visors greatly reduce the effect of flash bangs, body armour practically cancels out beanbags.
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  19. #39
    Activated Node Jakkar's Avatar
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    Very eager to play if I can get it working for next time, let us know, CMaster =)

  20. #40
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus WallyTrooper's Avatar
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    Speaking of which, when is next time? I had a great time and would love to go again. Next Tuesday?
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