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  1. #1
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus squirrel's Avatar
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    IT Geeks Here Are All Excited About upcoming Mavericks

    Because this new Mac OSX will be free for all Intel Mac users. I guess you all know this so I am too lazy too quote a source

    IT geeks here are all excited because this may start a revolution to household general computing platform: that a user friendly OS will be free of charge to user. Once you buy a Mac, you don't worry about paying for OS upgrade. You will enjoy all the OS upgrade until your Mac is not powerful enough to meet your computing needs and you buy a more up-to-date new Mac.

    And they believe that this is led by mobile platform market. I don't use smartphone but I do notice that upgrade of neither Android nor iOS requires any payment at all.

    MS is completely defenseless against this move. I bet this have been MS's nightmare for long and now they wake up to find that this becomes a reality in the market. MS cannot fight back, because it doesn't have any stake holding in hardware market. If it is to offer Windows upgrade free of charge, then what generates them revenue?

    I know many of you guys have been using Linux for long, but hey, this is a very user friendly OS now with free upgrading. Even I can easily learn to operate a Mac just within half an hour.

    Personal computing (not Windows PC) development is getting more and more exciting. Yahooooooooo~

  2. #2
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Zephro's Avatar
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    No it doesn't change much. Nobody actually pays for Windows, they get an OEM version bundled with the PC they buy or an OEM version bundled with a piece of hardware if you buy your own. Then Windows "upgrades" for free i.e. the Service Packages.

    At the end of the day buying Mac hardware will still carry a premium for the OS and PC hardware will still be cheaper even when you include Windows. So no change what so ever.

  3. #3
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    Yay let's move from microsofts closed shop to apples closed shop with steel reinforced walls, triple dead bolt locks and cctv straight out of north Korea

  4. #4
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    This has what to do with gaming? Seems more like it belongs in the off topic forum or the tech support one.

    And yeah, like Zephro said: Nobody really pays for Windows except for companies that have no choice as all the software they own is in Windows anyway. Students can get it for free, normal folk don't build their own PCs so they get it included with the machine they buy, and everyone else can "find a way".



    If money were the only issue, Linux would have taken over LONG ago. And last I checked, Linux only just became viable as a "normal person" OS a few years ago and is still lacking for "gamers".
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  5. #5
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus squirrel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zephro View Post
    Then Windows "upgrades" for free i.e. the Service Packages.
    Nonono. This is upgrade, not update. This is like Mac version of "upgrading from Wins XP to Wins 8" for free. (or more extreme, free upgrade from 95 to 8, although as I know 95 is not even a 32bit OS, just like my PowerPC iMac won't be benefited from this offer) Service Packs or 8.1 update is something like "F Y MS, what takes you so fxcking long to fix the issues you should have sort out at the day of launch?!"

    But yes, I guess most don't separately buy Windows. Over here, most of DIYers get there OEM Windows bundled with motherboard.

  6. #6
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Berzee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    This has what to do with gaming? Seems more like it belongs in the off topic forum or the tech support one.
    I was thinking the same thing, I'll move it over to OT. (If MAVERIX has startling new implications for games that I don't know about, please feel free to make a thread on PC Gaming Discussion though).

    As for me, I don't think Free is a good enough price to make me like OSX. The minimize/maximize buttons are in "the wrong place". Free OS upgrades is a nice idea where possible, though (as long as they're optionally applied, so you can choose older versions if you like).
    Last edited by Berzee; 23-10-2013 at 02:15 PM.
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  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Zephro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
    Nonono. This is upgrade, not update. This is like Mac version of "upgrading from Wins XP to Wins 8" for free. (or more extreme, free upgrade from 95 to 8, although as I know 95 is not even a 32bit OS, just like my PowerPC iMac won't be benefited from this offer) Service Packs or 8.1 update is something like "F Y MS, what takes you so fxcking long to fix the issues you should have sort out at the day of launch?!"

    But yes, I guess most don't separately buy Windows. Over here, most of DIYers get there OEM Windows bundled with motherboard.
    Yeah, yeah. Mac people always say that. It's still the same OS under the hood with little minor changes here and there, or new applications installed (why they need an OS upgrade I have no idea). Windows 95 - Windows 8 involves several complete re-writes. There's a reason it's still called OS 10.x.

  8. #8
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    OSX - ensuring your Mac is obsolete within 3 years AND NO MONEY BACK!

    Seriously, Apple's objective with 'updates' (major dots e.g. 10.4, 10.5 etc.) is to drag users onto new hardware - if they're making it 'free' it because they want people moving faster, that's all.

    They release these updates more often than Windows and desupport them quicker (generally speaking, Apple don't support more than 2 versions back - sometimes not more than 1 - which usually means about 3-4 years before your kit os obsolete because they rack-up the hardware reqs every time.

    The only real advantage of OSX is that you don't have to deal with all the junkware and malware which Windows has - but that's largely because there aren't enough "consumers" who are daft enough to install that stuff who use OSX. If that was to change - the junkware would arrive too.

    Apple sell iMacs to people who like 'shiny' and Mac Minis/Macbooks to people locked-in to their anti-competitive strategy for App Development for the most part. If they were forced (as they should be) to open-up iOS development, their hardware division would implode.

  9. #9
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus squirrel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trjp View Post
    OSX - ensuring your Mac is obsolete within 3 years AND NO MONEY BACK!
    Same for IBM compatible PC (I must be quite an old boy to know this term). I bought my current desktop in 2009 and now it is too outdated to play games released these days, main issue, HD4870 cannot run DX11. (But good luck, DICE supports DX10 for Battlefield 4 so once I sort out Internet problem, I can play, too.)

    Mac hardware upgrade as I observe is just keeping the same pace as IBM compatible PC.

  10. #10
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    Maybe you should stop using a card from 2008 if you want to play games from 2013?
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  11. #11
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Zephro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
    Same for IBM compatible PC (I must be quite an old boy to know this term). I bought my current desktop in 2009 and now it is too outdated to play games released these days, main issue, HD4870 cannot run DX11. (But good luck, DICE supports DX10 for Battlefield 4 so once I sort out Internet problem, I can play, too.)

    Mac hardware upgrade as I observe is just keeping the same pace as IBM compatible PC.
    Games aren't released by MS so that makes no sense.

    trjp's point is that MS still support patches for XP and will do until April 2014, around 13 years after its release. You can still have XP installed from 12 years ago and still get patches without needing to change hardware.

  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
    Same for IBM compatible PC (I must be quite an old boy to know this term). I bought my current desktop in 2009 and now it is too outdated to play games released these days, main issue, HD4870 cannot run DX11. (But good luck, DICE supports DX10 for Battlefield 4 so once I sort out Internet problem, I can play, too.)

    Mac hardware upgrade as I observe is just keeping the same pace as IBM compatible PC.
    So the PC you bought 4 years ago isn't out of date to play a game being targeted for the next console generation?

    Uhm. Okay...


    Seriously. What you are talking about are two different subjects. trjp is basically arguing that OSX is set up as a way to force users to upgrade their hardware due to limited support. Ironically, Windows is pretty good about supporting older hardware and has pretty low requirements outside of memory

    This is the win8.1 specs


    • Processor: 1 gigahertz (GHz) or faster with support for PAE, NX, and SSE2 (more info)
    • RAM: 1 gigabyte (GB) (32-bit) or 2 GB (64-bit)
    • Hard disk space: 16 GB (32-bit) or 20 GB (64-bit)
    • Graphics card: Microsoft DirectX 9 graphics device with WDDM driver


    Really quite low, all points considered (although, I wouldn't run it with less than 3 or 4 gigs), and, pending my checking the CPU flags, I am pretty sure my old Pentium 4 could run that. MS fuck up a lot, but letting you put their OS on older hardware isn't one of them.

    What YOU are talking about are the system requirements of software and games, which has little to do with the OS. If BF4 came out for mac, you could be damn sure the specs would be high. For that, the specs are largely a function of the current console generation. If you build a good computer able to run most new releases on medium-high settings late next year, it will probably last you until the end of this console generation (although, you'll probably be on low or medium-low by the end of it).

    And either way, you were kind of wrong on both of those since the example you specifically mentioned isn't even true as DICE "fixed" it.
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  13. #13
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Kadayi's Avatar
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    As someone who actually uses macs for a living this just seems like a clever move towards getting pretty much the entire mac user base all on the same OS version, which actually makes a lot of sense given the near yearly updates of OSX has created a fragmented user base especially among professional business users. It makes life a lot easier for software developers to know that they're likely to maximize their demographic, and that any updates simply need to aim for working with that version.

    It's nothing to do with being benevolent or marking the end of chargable OS upgrades, it's all to do with shoring up the userbase and getting both business and casual users onto an OS standard that makes life easier for hardware and software developers (including apple themselves) as well as expanding the penetration of the Apple app store to the home user base.

    Smart move, but charging for what were in my experience little more than the equivalent of Windows service packs was always cheeky to put bluntly.
    Last edited by Kadayi; 23-10-2013 at 02:43 PM.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadayi View Post
    Smart move, but charging for what were in my experience little more than the equivalent of Windows service packs was always cheeky to put bluntly.
    True, but I've more the once read that in the end the price of the iterations compare after N amount of years with a new version of windows, pretty much being in sync. Not sure if this ever was true, but it always felt more like a ruse to me making people think its cheaper but in the long run still being the same as a windows license.

    Oh well, people get way to excited about iterative releases of Operating Systems anyway, I find neither exciting nor innovating.
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  15. #15
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    I could see them going the Windows route, pay for new releases not incremental updates. I always thought it odd for Apple to charge $20-$50 for updates that seemed like a Windows service pack. Of course they may offer more since you pay the apple Premium for the first party applications. Win8.1 is a bit of change since MS is supplying core apps to the Start Screen and did some updates to them. Still nothing quite like Apple provides.

  16. #16
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pepper View Post
    True, but I've more the once read that in the end the price of the iterations compare after N amount of years with a new version of windows, pretty much being in sync. Not sure if this ever was true, but it always felt more like a ruse to me making people think its cheaper but in the long run still being the same as a windows license.

    Oh well, people get way to excited about iterative releases of Operating Systems anyway, I find neither exciting nor innovating.
    Well, the issue is that people tend to have their OEM copy and then just buy the dirt cheap Windows upgrade. Or pay attention and realize that lots of places (including MS, if memory serves) will sell the previous version of windows shortly before launch for dirt cheap to encourage people to upgrade for a very low price.

    To be fair, this is just the usual. Mac and Windows (and Linux, these days at least) all are better at some stuff, worse at others. It is just hilarious that Mac, at least over the past decade, have been better at fucking people over for their cash than MS EVER has been. And now that they are actually offering a free update (comparable to Win8.1), people are cheering them and acting like they are revolutionizing the world.
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  17. #17
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    To be fair, this is just the usual. Mac and Windows (and Linux, these days at least) all are better at some stuff, worse at others. It is just hilarious that Mac, at least over the past decade, have been better at fucking people over for their cash than MS EVER has been. And now that they are actually offering a free update (comparable to Win8.1), people are cheering them and acting like they are revolutionizing the world.
    People have a habit of cheering Apple on whenever they do anything these days, even if someone else did it first. I know they generally make a very nice user experience, but as a whole Apple could probably release a iWatch and people would flip their shit
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  18. #18
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    To be fair, Mac OS updates include updates to their software suite and not just the OS. MS charges for Office, has no Garageband nor any other built in alternative to Mac software. Other than Windows Movie Maker which is not as good as iMovies.

  19. #19
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Zephro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moraven View Post
    To be fair, Mac OS updates include updates to their software suite and not just the OS. MS charges for Office, has no Garageband nor any other built in alternative to Mac software. Other than Windows Movie Maker which is not as good as iMovies.
    Huh, and here I remember MS being virtually lynched for bundling IE with Windows.

  20. #20
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    Microsoft couldnt include that anyway, remember the problems they got in over Paint and Internet Explorer? Pretty much everyone agreed that that was insane. Microsoft actually does update their software suit over time, just not the whole interface revamp you see between versions. Then gain, does Macintosh really change the whole interface of the office suit every major iteration?
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