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  1. #1
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus squirrel's Avatar
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    Cheatings Only Happen in PC World or They Also Occur in Console World?

    I've been quite tired of all the hackusations in most online games, on PC of course. So I want to ask this, for some of you who are knowledgeable on console gaming, is hacking and cheating also a possibility on console gaming? I mean, on PC, people wrote and implement all kinda hacks no matter how well protected the game softwares themselves are. On consoles, however, the hardwares themselve are well guarded so I expect programming on those isn't that possible for most hackers. Is cheating really an impossibility on consoles? Would people who lose a game be forced to admit the fact their opponents possess better skills and therefore people would give up on hackusations?

    I really don't understand why people can come up of all kinda hackusations. I mean, so what, winning or losing in virtual world give you no advantage or disadvantage in the real world.

  2. #2
    Cheating is definitely a big problem on consoles.
    In some games it's even worse than on PC, Borderlands for example.
    While i only played it via local coop with some friends i have followed quite a lot of forum discussions and read frequently about players recommending the PC version for online play because of massive cheating on the Xbox side.

    The CoD and Battlefield players in Xbox forums are also discussing a lot about problems with cheaters.
    Last edited by InsertNicknameHere; 19-02-2015 at 09:40 AM.

  3. #3
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus karaquazian's Avatar
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    You really have to ask? Of course cheating happens on consoles.

  4. #4
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Consoles usually get a grace period around release where hacks are fewer. But the complete lack of community ran private servers dooms all games in the long term.

    Edit: It's like any immune system, pathogens develop, antibodies are created. But once a publisher moves on to the sequel and hasn't given the community the means to self manage the game is rigged. Sometimes cheating is as primitive as intentionally added rate limitations to tip the bias of predictive movement, which is impossible to diagnose from a chugging connection.
    Last edited by Heliocentric; 19-02-2015 at 01:32 PM.
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  5. #5
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    Theres cheating on consoles.

    In Destiny, people always find ways to kill the raid monsters withouth engaging, using glitches. The last one was the host of the game to disconnect when the raid leader is doing a "not invulnerable" animation, so he stay in that phase.

    Console games are "weak" against multiple forms of cheating. One type of cheating is some people using programable control pads, with one of these the weapon that "can shot as fast as you can tap" become machineguns.

    Is not cheating, but theres a adaptor(XIM) that allow people to use keyboard+mouse. On a game where you can change the camera aceleration, the result is almost like playing with mouse and keyboard.
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  6. #6
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    There has always been cheating on consoles. Gameshark, anyone?

    That said, who the fuck cares if someone cheats on Borderlands? It's a coop game.
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  7. #7
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    You have variations of cheating. There is abusing what is in a game, like glitch abuse. There is also external abuse, which can take a variety of forms from console exploits to packet manipulation.

    Glitch abuse needs no explanation. You could probably include other things like player collusion in online multiplayer in the in-game abuse category.

    Some games try to counter things like host advantage or the disadvantage of a high ping. This opens itself to plenty of manipulation by players. Modern Warfare 3, with its broken netcode, is only one of many examples. If the host is penalized in some fashion, then some people will cripple their internet connection during matchmaking and restore it right after the match starts. If their is enough of an assumed advantage for laggy players (being really hard to hit, but with generous aim compensation on their side), then you will have people intentionally crippling their connection for the duration of matches. It was easy enough to manipulate your connection if you just started streaming video or running a torrent client.

    Console cheat devices like Action Replay, Gameshark, Codebreaker, and the rest let you alter memory or game code (generally small alterations, but there were tricks that let you do larger, and these could also open the door to major console exploits), and these work with both online and offline. Online, some code creation groups would refuse to publish codes that affected online play, but codes were still created and saw private distribution.

    Once a system is exploited, it is opened to more major changes, including things like customized executables.

    Phantasy Star Online on the Dreamcast (and later ports as well) had a host of both glitches and cheat device hacks. Hacked items could (intentionally) render a character unplayable. You could grief people with a glitch that let you target them with attack spells, or used hacks to target them with negative healing. Item duping was rampant. Etc. There was a lot of griefing in a game that was primarily co-op.

    Modern Warfare 3, and probably other Call of Duty games as well, had cheat makers who sold access to cheats via subscription service (with updates as they were patched out.)

  8. #8
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    Glitch/exploit abuse are the most common on consoles. Since they generally are easy to do and anyone can do them.

    3rd party devices exist but are less common since they require people to buy something and get it shipped, then hook it up and set it properly. Not as simple as downloading some software on the PC and hitting Go.

    Due to reliance on P2P hosting for online games (ugh) since the likes of Halo 2, special routers and tampering with them have been a thing for the longest time. Netcodes have improved but so have the people designing these systems. You still see this a lot.

    I know lots prefer Dark Souls on consoles vs PC due to cheaters being less common.

    I would say overall there are a lot less cheaters (beyond exploit, glitch abusers) on consoles, but they are there.

  9. #9
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus karaquazian's Avatar
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    Although I guess "cheating does happen in pc world", vastly overpriced pcs with crappy power supplies and ancient graphics cards and hard selling of mug warranties.

  10. #10
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus neema_t's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    There has always been cheating on consoles. Gameshark, anyone?

    That said, who the fuck cares if someone cheats on Borderlands? It's a coop game.
    It's kind of shit playing with someone who one-shots everything and leaves nothing for you to do but stand around and watch.

  11. #11
    Lesser Hivemind Node EPICTHEFAIL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karaquazian View Post
    Although I guess "cheating does happen in pc world", vastly overpriced pcs with crappy power supplies and ancient graphics cards and hard selling of mug warranties.
    A round of applause to you good sir!

    As someone who was too lazy to build their own PC and paid the hideously overinflated price, I give unto you a warning: never buy a pre-built PC. Ever.
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  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neema_t View Post
    It's kind of shit playing with someone who one-shots everything and leaves nothing for you to do but stand around and watch.
    You play Borderlands... for the challenge? That game is all about ridiculous guns that shoot guns that shoot swords versus equally ridiculous bullet sponges.
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  13. #13
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    Even so, others who played the game and worked to progress might feel cheated by others who simply bot or one shot things. Look at any online PvE game and the majority will be against cheaters.

  14. #14
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moraven View Post
    Even so, others who played the game and worked to progress might feel cheated by others who simply bot or one shot things. Look at any online PvE game and the majority will be against cheaters.
    The operative word in your post there is "work." If it's work, you're doing it wrong.
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  15. #15
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    The operative word in your post there is "work." If it's work, you're doing it wrong.
    That's a little unfair. Practically every genre is latching wholesale onto the principle of effort investment. Heck, one might argue they always did only now they are getting more layered with it. Any game where every piece of content was not readily at your fingertips introduces an effort gradient and rewards of some form.

    When most of a medium's logic stack is behind creating phases of pain and relief its not unusual or unreasonable for a someone to feel that its like 'work'. Heck, some books are 'work' to process and properly parse even though they are completely passive experiences on the surface.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    You play Borderlands... for the challenge? That game is all about ridiculous guns that shoot guns that shoot swords versus equally ridiculous bullet sponges.
    You must have played a different Borderlands than I did, because "all about ridiculous guns that shoot guns that shoot swords" lasts for a few minutes tops before you realize Borderlands gun designs are heavily restrained and honestly rather generic.

    Random loot hits the "numbers go up" drive, but you still have a game that relies on being a game where you have fun shooting stuff. Teaming up with a cheater takes all the fun out of shooting stuff. Heck, it may even hurt the "numbers go up" drive, because the majority of weapon drops are actually underwhelming and you don't have the shooting action to fill the gaps.

  17. #17
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus somini's Avatar
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    I agree with the regular people, Blands is a appropriate name. It's a game that cites Diablo as an inspiration. Worse, Claptrap!
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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Tei View Post
    One type of cheating is some people using programable control pads, with one of these the weapon that "can shot as fast as you can tap" become machineguns.
    The amusing thing about that is you didn't/don't need a programmable controller you could get the same effect by holding the trigger in the right place, tested on cod4. Cod4/waw also had major cheating going on using chipped 360's, noclip, godmode etc and in waw you even got spammed messages on the screen from the cheat creators maybe the the same in 4 but never saw them.

    Quote Originally Posted by neema_t View Post
    It's kind of shit playing with someone who one-shots everything and leaves nothing for you to do but stand around and watch.
    But but it's coop your causing no harm if your "helping" the other player/s (sarcasm)
    Last edited by Please enter the name by; 20-02-2015 at 12:06 AM.

  19. #19
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baines View Post
    Heck, it may even hurt the "numbers go up" drive, because the majority of weapon drops are actually underwhelming and you don't have the shooting action to fill the gaps.
    So, basically, what you're saying is, cheaters shortcut to the only part of the game that's fun.

    Which is why they cheat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    That's a little unfair. Practically every genre is latching wholesale onto the principle of effort investment.
    Games weigh heavily on the reward aspect of effort/reward relationships. If they didn't, they'd be indistinguishable from real life.

    When you hear someone say "I spent four hours figuring out a boss," then you know they got some satisfaction of figuring that boss out.

    When you hear someone say "I spent six weeks grinding the same boss for a drop so I can pass a DPS check," you're listening to someone who is in an abusive relationship.

    When you hear someone say "I hate how they nerfed the difficulty of this boss; now it's just a loot pinata," you hear someone desperately trying to salvage their abusive relationship.
    Last edited by Nalano; 20-02-2015 at 12:16 AM.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
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  20. #20
    Implying one shotting things is fun and yes not being able to shoot things and getting carried is not fun for most people, a shock I know
    Last edited by Please enter the name by; 20-02-2015 at 12:18 AM.

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