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  1. #61
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus soldant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkasaurusmex View Post
    And BTW, I don't know the specifics of it, but the expansions do claim to improve the AI. I am not sure if improves the tactical AI, but seems to improve the basic strategy of the AIs.
    They do, to an extent. There are still a lot of weird decisions (mostly in diplomacy) but it's a far cry from what it was on release. Even then it's not the same as a human opponent... but I also don't know anybody who can sit still long enough to maintain interest in a game that stretches as long as a Civ game.
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  2. #62
    For those of you still hoping to get more out of stardrive a few of us have been modding the code of the game for a while.
    TheDevek created a way to replace the running game code in a limited way.
    This has allowed us to fix up some bugs and add features.

    This is pretty cool for people that know a little code and want to try and modify the game logic. There is a lot that cant be changed but as the game can benefit from even pretty small changes it can be fun for those that like it.

    Anyway... I/We have been changing the code to make a better vanilla experience. so a lot of the changes wont be in your face but they will subtly make the game more enjoyable.

    Which is great as this simulatneously makes the game a better, IMHO, experience and keep the code mod compatible with content mods.

    Its fairly painless to try. Just an exe ran from the stardrive directory.
    The code for the mod is all up on bitbucket. You can download and compile it yourself if you really want.

    A compile version of the mod is on bitbucket as well as indiedb/moddb
    Deveks mod
    or
    Crunchys code mods.

    There is one big fix that is not in the vanilla game yet and that is a late game stutter where the game pauses for a second every few seconds.

    There are quite a lot of changes. The point being that its an attempt to get stardrive closer to what it could be.
    IMHO its a shame that the dev could not make SD as full as it should as my god... if it had the first 3x's of distant worlds it would be... legendary.

    Or if distant worlds had the combat/design engine of stardrive.

    Anyway just saying if you are still playing stardrive... consider trying out these changes.

  3. #63
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Stardrive was "space bears with a shitty game that isn't playable to completion but the dev will never fix it", right?
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  4. #64
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus vinraith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    Stardrive was "space bears with a shitty game that isn't playable to completion but the dev will never fix it", right?
    Even better, in the fine tradition of crap devs everywhere they're making a sequel rather than finish the original.

  5. #65
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vinraith View Post
    Even better, in the fine tradition of crap devs everywhere they're making a sequel rather than finish the original.
    I am not one of those people who feels a dev is bound to patch a game until it is perfect, but when your game falls apart if you play it too much. And for a 4x game where even one complete game is likely to get you into the territory where his game falls apart, it is just bullshit.

    I don't mind bugs, but you don't fucking release a game that you can't play. This isn't a "I'm sorry, this never popped up in testing" bug. This is a "Yeah... I saw it was a problem and just didn't care" bug.
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  6. #66
    Eh... I have completed the game back when the game was a wonderful lag fest filled with Out of memory errors.
    So yes its completable.

    People have different issues with the game some will be glaring to some folks some of them wont.

    You know i played a lot of games which i consider to be classically best in class. Master of Magic comes to mind. FE tries to come close and warlock and some other but never quite hit that mark and MoM was really bad in some of those respects.
    So... I may be a little more lenient in the respect to the quality of the game.

    Some say that the economy crashes for them which it does if you dont take care of it.
    Some say the quests are incomplete which i guess they are but they do resolve even the removed revoran quest had a completion to it. It was just hard to do.

    There are a variety of issues but on the other hand... The combat/design system is... Best in class IMHO.
    yes it could be better.

    An online repository of ship designs ranked by players would be nice.

    A hell of lot more...
    But its still a pretty cool game for what it is. IMHO.

    If you dont like it... Dont like it. If you do consider checking out the code mods.

    Or if you want to write your own code into the game consider trying out the repository.

    Last patch for the game was end of last month so to say that the dev will "never fix it" is a little inaccurate but yeah its taking a long long time. Hence code mods.

    As far as the sequel goes. Yeah... well money doesn't grow on trees. I don't like business decisions but often enough the choice is go out of business or not.
    The guy kick started the game for 17k which to me says the guy paid for the game out of his own pocket for the most part.

    Its not so much crap devs... Its inexperienced devs that dont have a lot of capital.
    IMHO a game made mostly by one person... Its not bad and in some ways better than anything else out there. Not a lot of ways but some.

  7. #67
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrunchyGremlin View Post
    Eh... I have completed the game back when the game was a wonderful lag fest filled with Out of memory errors.
    So yes its completable.
    Yeah... that isn't completable in my book. That is "If I get really lucky, the game won't break".

    As an example: Metal Gear Rising for the PC was not "completable" at launch. Jesse Cox figured out a way that involved having to change resolution multiple times during the final boss fight. And he is awesome for that. But that still isn't acceptable in the slightest

    And the fact of the matter is: those bugs are pretty much true for everyone and would pop up in basic playtesting. So either the dev didn't playtest it, or didn't give a fuck. Neither one of those is acceptable in my book


    Some say that the economy crashes for them which it does if you dont take care of it.
    Some say the quests are incomplete which i guess they are but they do resolve even the removed revoran quest had a completion to it. It was just hard to do.
    So shit doesn't work unless you really finesse it and get lucky and compensate for it being broken.

    There are a variety of issues but on the other hand... The combat/design system is... Best in class IMHO.
    yes it could be better.
    And the fact that it looked so interesting is why it is so depressing that it was broken and tied to a real shithead dev.

    Or if you want to write your own code into the game consider trying out the repository.
    So I can buy the game AND fix it myself? Oh joy!

    As far as the sequel goes. Yeah... well money doesn't grow on trees. I don't like business decisions but often enough the choice is go out of business or not.
    The guy kick started the game for 17k which to me says the guy paid for the game out of his own pocket for the most part.
    And he didn't succeed at making a product worth buying, and now wants to sell more garbage on top of that.

    If someone sells me a box with a piece of dog shit in there, I am not going to assume the next box will have a chocolate truffle.

    Its not so much crap devs... Its inexperienced devs that dont have a lot of capital.
    IMHO a game made mostly by one person... Its not bad and in some ways better than anything else out there. Not a lot of ways but some.
    And 17k start-up cash is more than a LOT of devs get, let alone in the 4x genre. This is a genre where games really ARE made in people's garages.

    I get that you like the game. It looked amazing. But it is a buggy piece of shit and, even worse, it was knowingly released as a buggy piece of shit. The former I can generally acknowledge, but the latter is just an insult. And this is an indie dev, so we can't even pretend that it wasn't his choice to release it in such a broken state. And we can't even pretend it wasn't his choice to continue along this path once he realized it was a broken piece of shit. That's why Obsidian (and even Troika) got away with a lot of their problems: They had publishers to blame. This guy doesn't.

    If the dev really wants to earn back some good will, there are a few approaches:
    1. VERY regular sales or even permanent price drops
    2. Comment that there are serious issues on the store page. You would be amazed how far a bit of honesty goes
    3. Possibly even release the first game as freeware. ESPECIALLY if the dev is outsourcing the debugging to the community anyway

    Beyond that, even if the next game is AMAZING it is a bargain bin price for me and a LOT of other 4x gamers because this was pretty close to a "scam".
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  8. #68
    Thats fine dude you have your level of what you will deal with.
    You dont like the dev or his method of buisness thats fine too.

    That is your personal Opinion that some others may also share. But its just an opinion.

    The facts are.
    The game can be completed.
    Its still getting patches.

    No amount of opinion will change that.
    Although those facts may not sway your opinion of the game and thats fine.

    I greatly enjoyed playing the game. Nothing else like it.
    I also really get a kick out of code modding the game.

    If those opinions dont line up with yours... So be it. There is no sense arguing about it.
    Im not trying to change your opinion.

    Im saying that if there are people who still enjoy the game or did enjoy it but some of these issues made the game frustrating then try out my mod.

    You dont have to try it out :)
    Your opinion is yours. Some will share it some wont. Even if those that dont are in a minority. There are always die hards and for those folks that get that... Code mods.

    Enjoy.
    Last edited by CrunchyGremlin; 14-04-2014 at 11:07 PM.

  9. #69
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    For fuck's sake Gundato, stop haranguing the guy for actually trying to patch the buggy POS. I don't disagree with any of your points, but it ain't his fault. He's actually trying to help!

  10. #70
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Granath View Post
    For fuck's sake Gundato, stop haranguing the guy for actually trying to patch the buggy POS. I don't disagree with any of your points, but it ain't his fault. He's actually trying to help!
    And good on him, but he was actively defending the game for being a horrendously buggy piece of shit AND claiming it wasn't that bad (while pointing out bugs even I didn't know about). I am all for a patch to fix things, but until it DOES fix everything, people shouldn't misrepresent the game as being playable for anything short of a masochist, lest more people give the dev money and encourage the mentality of "I think this game is broken. Oh well, I'll release anyway. Maybe my fans will fix it for me"

    Quote Originally Posted by CrunchyGremlin View Post
    Thats fine dude you have your level of what you will deal with.
    You dont like the dev or his method of buisness thats fine too.

    That is your personal Opinion that some others may also share. But its just an opinion.

    The facts are.
    The game can be completed.
    Its still getting patches.
    Its not really opinion that the game is incredibly buggy and you yourself point out that it can be horribly broken if you don't do things "correctly". It is also not opinion that these are bugs that would have shown up under any sort of in-depth playtesting. That the dev is a piece of shit who took advantage of his customers and the fact that people like TB tend to only give initial impressions IS opinion though.
    If you want to argue it is still fun, feel free. But saying the game is completable is like saying "If you squint real hard, you can see ta-tas through the static on skinemax" (which isn't even true anymore, what with the rise of "digital" cable. Poor kids now have to rely on completely unrestricted internet porn instead of really awkward static porn).

    It does seem the dev is attempting to patch again, but it seems like every few months he completely gives up.
    Last edited by gundato; 15-04-2014 at 12:18 AM.
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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    And good on him, but he was actively defending the game for being a horrendously buggy piece of shit AND claiming it wasn't that bad (while pointing out bugs even I didn't know about). I am all for a patch to fix things, but until it DOES fix everything, people shouldn't misrepresent the game as being playable for anything short of a masochist, lest more people give the dev money and encourage the mentality of "I think this game is broken. Oh well, I'll release anyway. Maybe my fans will fix it for me"
    I don't disagree, but perhaps you could find a more tactful way of expressing your opinion at someone who is actively trying to fix the steaming pile the developer left his customers.

  12. #72
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Granath View Post
    I don't disagree, but perhaps you could find a more tactful way of expressing your opinion at someone who is actively trying to fix the steaming pile the developer left his customers.
    I admit I could have been nicer to the guy, but he is also actively encouraging people to buy a buggy piece of shit that is still broken AND is misrepresenting it. If he hadn't chimed in while me and vinraith were commenting on it I wouldn't see a reason to point things out (I honestly WAS confirming that Star Ruler was the space bears game since all 4x games have generic as hell titles :p), but he is the one who decided to defend the game and say "it isn't that bad".

    I am sure his intentions are great, but I for one don't approve of defending devs who actively exploit their customers. ESPECIALLY in a thread that was, at least initially, about finding new 4x games to play.

    If/when it is fully playable and fixed, I won't really care too much (I don't like the idea of that dev getting money, but I also don't like a lot of publishers :p). But right now it is still VERY broken.
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  13. #73
    I like arguing too :)
    But lets stick to facts as those something can be done about.

    The economy. I dont consider paying attention to my money flow and making sure its positive is a flaw in the game.
    The flaw in that is that is that it can happen pretty quickly while im engrossed in some other action. Although in the later official patches to the game that has reduced tremendously.
    One of things i did here was to change freighters so that they are a lot smarter in where they get resources from. This pretty much fixes the whole planet starving issues.
    I tried putting in a fix so that the freighters would not pick up or deliver to systems in combat but thats not working so well at the moment. it works but its not fast enough. need to make it so freighters will drop their targets when the system becomes in combat. Right now they just wont take it as a target if the planet is in combat when its deciding to make the deliveries and that window i think is too small.

    I have also petitioned zero to fix this whole freighter business as his next patch concept. See what happenes there....


    Incredibly buggy is an opinion. Compared to what? MMO's where basic character abilities don't work for years. Battle field?

    Buggy in the sense that there are a lot of minor annoyances that add up to make the game hard to play. yeah. Some of those I have fixed. But its still an opinion.

    My biggest issue in the game was the troop management in the end game and fighters not landing well on carriers.

    My solution to troops was to ease that troop management.
    Planets autoload troops to ships that need them if the planet has them.
    Assault shuttles will automatically launch at nearby planets.
    telling an assault shuttle to go to a planet will make the troops autoland on arrival.

    I did a lot of work on carrier fighter interactions.
    Fighters rearm at the carrier when out of ammo.
    Fighters land easier on the carrier.
    fighters use the carriers sensor range for target choices.
    Carriers and be set to automatically use the best fighter they have rather than having to refit the carrier for new fighter types.

    That reduces that level of frustration so much that it makes taking the planets too easy and to some that opinion is game breaking!

    So i have some work to do to make the planet taking a little more difficult.
    One i have improved the AI troop defenses slightly to have a few more troops on planets.
    in future i want to fix this further and create some mechanism that makes troops harder to score a landing. Something to do with shields and defenses. Thinking about making the shuttles have to go through one orbit of the planet before they can land.

    There also are the OOM errors which zero patched a while back to reduce those errors some and in my mod along with dialtones ideas i put in the ability to change the maintenance costs of ships which reduces the number of ships in the game without a hard cap so that it doesnt feel like a ceiling.
    Combined with some other fixes that reduce the number of troops moving around in the empire and targetless supply shuttles taking up resources... it reduces these errors quite a lot. I let the AI play to year 2500 on 50X speed with 0 hiccups. No crashes and about a 1000 ships in game.

    I also put in some more multithreading where i could. Not a lot but some of it has a benefit.

    Yeah so my opinion of the game is skewed because i have made changes to it that make it more enjoyable to me.

    The basic vanilla game is what it is. Is it terrible... i dunno. i have played worse games. Worse I have played games that i did not enjoy. At least stardive even in its previous state i enjoyed it.
    Thats just me.

    If you did not you did not. I wont say that there are not issues in the game. There are. I would not be code modding the game if there were not.

    Im not trying to say your wrong. I just dont feel as strongly about the issues you see.
    I completed the game. The end game was hard as hell but i did it.

    And i would agree either get the game on sale or wait another year to see if its improved. It has a lot of potential but until that all comes out its not a great deal if not on sale. I still think though that its worth checking out see what a modern 4x RTS should be like as far as the ship design and combat is concerned.
    If you already have the game consider trying out my code mods.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    I admit I could have been nicer to the guy, but he is also actively encouraging people to buy a buggy piece of shit that is still broken AND is misrepresenting it. If he hadn't chimed in while me and vinraith were commenting on it I wouldn't see a reason to point things out (I honestly WAS confirming that Star Ruler was the space bears game since all 4x games have generic as hell titles :p), but he is the one who decided to defend the game and say "it isn't that bad".

    I am sure his intentions are great, but I for one don't approve of defending devs who actively exploit their customers. ESPECIALLY in a thread that was, at least initially, about finding new 4x games to play.

    If/when it is fully playable and fixed, I won't really care too much (I don't like the idea of that dev getting money, but I also don't like a lot of publishers :p). But right now it is still VERY broken.
    You have a lot of opinions that you state as fact.

    Some of your opinions that you do this im pretty sure are just wrong.

    You say the dev doesnt have a publisher.
    What makes you say this. "Play it cool"?

    You say a lot of 4x games are developed in a garage.
    Name a lot of them.
    Further name those are done primarily by one guy. I can really only think of one.

    You say the debugging is outsourced.
    Show where that is that case.

    You say hes exploiting his customers.
    In what regard?

    You are obviously quite upset about something that brings you to the point that you will bend the truth to fit your view.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrunchyGremlin View Post
    You have a lot of opinions that you state as fact.

    Some of your opinions that you do this im pretty sure are just wrong.

    You say the dev doesnt have a publisher.
    What makes you say this. "Play it cool"?

    You say a lot of 4x games are developed in a garage.
    Name a lot of them.
    Further name those are done primarily by one guy. I can really only think of one.

    You say the debugging is outsourced.
    Show where that is that case.

    You say hes exploiting his customers.
    In what regard?

    You are obviously quite upset about something that brings you to the point that you will bend the truth to fit your view.
    Crunchy,

    If he bought the POS that is Stardrive then he has a right to be upset. Even if he didn't, he still has a point that the game is awfully buggy, outright broken at points and that the developer is a dick for taking the money and running. Minor errors in statements of fact don't refute those point. I agree with him that the developer - and it doesn't matter if it's one guy or 100 who made the game - should not be rewarded with any purchase of Stardrive or any other game the guy makes until he fixes this product. Even you seem to say as much, so in that regard you're agreeing with each other. Where you guys tend to disagree is on the severity of some of these issues. Personally, I'd lean more towards Gundato's version than yours, which seems to downplay issues that ultimately make the game unplayable (from a technical standpoint) or strategically broken.

    However, please note that your efforts are greatly appreciated in helping to maybe make it a stable and perhaps even decent play experience. Good luck and we all hope you continue to make significant headway in this endeavor.

  16. #76
    Oh sure he has every right to be upset about his own impression of the game.
    I wont argue that but that isnt the point there. The point is what is he so upset about really.

    but whatever.

    Let me ask you. You say the game is broken. What specifically is broken?
    There are a number of issues that i did not think were a big deal that others consider broken.

    So what is it to you that is broken?

    To be clear im not trying to be a dick. I really want to know what is so broken to you in the game that you consider the game broken or unplayable
    Last edited by CrunchyGremlin; 15-04-2014 at 02:53 AM. Reason: Clarity

  17. #77
    It's obvious you like the game enough to write code to try and fix it.
    Well, we don't.

    So that's that, is there much more to say about this? Do you really want to argue with people over how bad the game is as if it was an opinion?

    Okay, let me reiterate. The game is bad. This is not even an opinion, it is a fact. It barely even works. People were sold a product that didn't do what was promised, which by definition is a scam, by the way.

    Saying that "I don't think it is bad" or "Well if you use my mod you won't have so many problems" is like saying " I don't believe in gravity". No. Stop. It's not even worth an argument, much less a discussion.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Caddybear View Post
    It's obvious you like the game enough to write code to try and fix it.
    Well, we don't.

    So that's that, is there much more to say about this? Do you really want to argue with people over how bad the game is as if it was an opinion?

    Okay, let me reiterate. The game is bad. This is not even an opinion, it is a fact. It barely even works. People were sold a product that didn't do what was promised, which by definition is a scam, by the way.

    Saying that "I don't think it is bad" or "Well if you use my mod you won't have so many problems" is like saying " I don't believe in gravity". No. Stop. It's not even worth an argument, much less a discussion.
    You dont believe in gravity?
    I am pretty sure its real. But i can assure you that my knowledge of that isnt based on an opinion.

    stating an opinion like its fact.

    You got issues with the game. Lay them out. Ill hear them.
    Its bullshit for you to come down on me for my opinion and the cry about how you deserve your opinion. More to claim your opinion is fact.
    More to start flying off the handle that someone might actually like the game.

    You think i change the game to the way i like it because i like the game as it is? Thats messed up thinking man.

    What the hell is wrong with you?

  19. #79
    Lesser Hivemind Node frightlever's Avatar
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    My big disappointment with Stardrive was that the battles looked beautiful but the game was just horribly flawed. The guy should make a Gratuitous Space Battles style game, eg points based fleet construction vs certain challenges. I'd play that. Honestly didn't play enough of Stardrive to hate it.

    Oh, one man 4X developers - Malfador Machinations, and his last two games were shit as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by CrunchyGremlin View Post
    You dont believe in gravity?
    I am pretty sure its real. But i can assure you that my knowledge of that isnt based on an opinion.
    What you're doing there is deliberately misunderstanding Gundato's point. That's not arguing/debate, it's wrestling with a straw man to make yourself feel better - at which point you've lost the argument.

    Argue better, is what I'm saying.
    Last edited by frightlever; 15-04-2014 at 10:00 AM.

  20. #80
    Sure I get stupid when i get upset :P
    Which perhaps was the point of the initial comment. Still picking one part out of the post to deny the whole thing is something of a straw man itself.

    yeah the space battles in SD are pretty good and a point based fleet combat would be cool. IMHO the space battles in SD are the best available in a 4x.

    The rest of the game is passable. Not great but functional. That some dont like it or were turned off is fine. That is the nature of games. no matter how good or bad it is some will think its great while others hate it. There is no sense trying to convince anyone different.

    However I would like to know the specific places where you are turned off due to game inadequacies.

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