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  1. #41
    Lesser Hivemind Node TheDreamlord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iridescence View Post
    I've not played it. Was just going off some video I saw where the guy was complaining about how hard it was to fly in it. I'm glad if that's not totally accurate.
    E:D flight model and combat is by no means easy. But it is incredibly rewarding and if one puts in the effort, their skill will increase and so will the pleasure out of it. Coupled with the mechanics of power management, speed-based turning arcs and weapon effective distance, there is a lot more there than pointing the mouse/cursor/nose on something on the screen.

  2. #42
    Network Hub EPICTHEFAIL's Avatar
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    True, there is a bit of complexity to the flight model, and one does need a while to get a hang of the combat. But all of this is optional - press up arrow twice to put 4 dots into engines and you can trade and explore without worrying about the AI killing you, since you can boost away and supercruise anyway. If you want​ to engage in combat, then do keep in mind that it is very different to the run of the mill space sims, and even with gimballed weapons it takes a quite bit of practice to figure out.

  3. #43
    Obscure Node Patryk's Avatar
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    Star Citizen, oh yeah. I love seeing comments from console exclusive gamers like "when it's commin out on X1?" haha.

  4. #44
    Activated Node seshFriend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor Paul1290 View Post
    I wonder how large the recent space-sim fandom will still be after they actually play these games.
    Maybe I'm horribly cynical, but to me the history of the genre thus far doesn't suggest good things there.

    Space sims are a genre that has always had more than its share of excitable "potential players" who have picky and specific visions for what the genre should be that are either too far fetched or too specific to them to be realistically viable in the long-term.
    They can have games made for them that "check all the boxes" so to speak but then they find they aren't as entertained as they thought they would be then shift to increasingly useless and unactionable criticism until they just leave to do something else for a few years.
    After those people play for a while, get disappointed without really understanding why, then leave, the genre will be back to a far smaller player base of fans with more workable notions of what a space-sim should be, carrying on with "business as usual".

    Sure there's a lot of talk about space-sims becoming "coming-back" and/or becoming "mainstream" again, but I have yet to see anything that suggests that this isn't going to be just a repeat of the same dance we've done so many times before.
    We did this dance with Elite, then with Wing Commander, then with Freelancer, which didn't occur at the same time regardless of what the usual "90s/early-2000s compression effect" suggests. On the side we've always always had our Bridge Commanders, Freespaces, and Independence Wars which didn't sell regardless of how much we loved them after the fact as abandon-ware or more recently as GOG games.

    Maybe I'm just too pessimistic and jaded at this point. I'm looking forward to enjoying these games when they are released and I'm fairly confident enough of the games themselves will turn out very well, I've already spent enough money on them.
    That said, I still haven't see much to suggest this will lead to a long lasting "mainstream presence" for space sims, though I'd love to be wrong.

    I'm hoping at least a couple of them eventually release dedicated servers, mod tools, maybe even source code if we're really lucky so we can still have some of these awesome games for a long while after the "mass of dreamers" leaves and things "go bust" again.

    Still, here's hoping it will be different this time around, though I'm not holding my breath.
    I'd like to think with the success of Eve: Online especially after that legendary battle where many thousands of dollars of digital merchandise was destroyed every minute the world might be ready for space sims.

    I think it is important to keep in mind that the market has totally changed and there are a lot more people buying games in weird niche markets.

    Maybe E:D and SC wont appeal to the casual crowd enough but no one thought that MMORPGs would appeal to the casual crowd either and then WoW happened. I do think that No Man's Sky could be a casual scene gem though. The gameplay looks relatively simple and the real joys come from discovery and adventure.

  5. #45
    Network Hub rsherhod's Avatar
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    I said this in the screenshot thread, but I'd like to ask it here in case I've missed something:

    Are there any single player alternatives to EVE around?

    I know we've got lots of space simulations on the way, but what I really want is a ship captain RPG. I want to say "make it so", rather than have to make it so myself. Controlling big ships in X3 is kind of close to what I'm after, but it's no RPG and it's really fiddly.

  6. #46
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsherhod View Post
    I said this in the screenshot thread, but I'd like to ask it here in case I've missed something:

    Are there any single player alternatives to EVE around?
    I think I'm just chasing you around the forums shouting at you now but...

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    Because EVE is exciting because of people, without it there isn't much left. The nearest thing to that feeling of being surrounded by many disparate factions is probably Space Rangers 2 or the name it's currently using on steam Space Rangers HD: A War Apart. Hunt pirates, trade goods, run away from fights you have nothing to do with and float about on the periphery of a war profiting from it.

    Which apart from the setting is an accurate description of Sid Meier's Pirates!(2004) which I've been playing recently.
    I'm failing to writing a blog, specifically about playing games the wrong way
    http://playingitwrong.wordpress.com/

  7. #47
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Drake Sigar's Avatar
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  8. #48
    Lesser Hivemind Node Harlander's Avatar
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    I don't know a whole lot about it, but one thing that distinguishes http://roguesystemsim.com/ from the rest of the pile of space games is that it realised that, if you're going to have a thin layer of something between you and the endless void, it probably shouldn't be easily-smashed glass.

  9. #49
    Network Hub dudebro's Avatar
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    Thanks, Harlander. I remember seeing that sim video... somewhere... but couldn't remember the name of the game.

  10. #50
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus c-Row's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sendmark View Post
    Thankfully ED has a solo mode, but definitely already signs of this. The Freeport pirate station in Open Play is pretty much a no go area, griefers love to sit outside the station no fire zone in a viper with full cannons, which means they can effectively one-shot anything inside or close to the station without any repercussions.
    How dare they act like this in an anarchy system...
    - If the sound of Samuel Barber's "Adagio For Strings" makes you think of Kharak burning instead of the Vietnamese jungle, most of your youth happened during the 90s. -

  11. #51
    Lesser Hivemind Node Harlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by c-Row View Post
    How dare they act like this in an anarchy system...
    Maybe they saw anarchy and expected anarchism instead. Those guys outside the station were just waiting for their weekly term as executive officer!

    (Actually, there's a surprising number of what appear to be agrarian collectives in the ED beta)

  12. #52
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    Just purchased a Saitek x52 so I'm looking forward to having some dogfighting fun when I get home from work!

  13. #53
    Lesser Hivemind Node Harlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hariseldon View Post
    Just purchased a Saitek x52 so I'm looking forward to having some dogfighting fun when I get home from work!
    Hey, me too! I hardly play flight sims so it's not the wisest purchase but what the hell, I can afford to splash out on toys now and then

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harlander View Post
    Hey, me too! I hardly play flight sims so it's not the wisest purchase but what the hell, I can afford to splash out on toys now and then
    Same here tbh, but yeah I work hard so why not splash out on toys. As it is I may well give some flight sims a shot though as I used to love games like F19 Stealth Fighter from Microprose back in the day, so I do undoubtedly like flight sims I've just found them somewhat impenetrable in recent times, perhaps it's time to put the effort in.

  15. #55
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    I'm still a big fan of the Egosoft X games (X-Rebirth excluded, obviously). The sheer scale and openness of the universe has never failed to amaze me. Do I want to be a business magnate, a fleet commander, pirate, bit-of-everything? No problem - just go and be it. Slow to get going initially but little can match them for longevity.

  16. #56
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    I really want to love the X games, they're something I should enjoy, but I just find myself bouncing off them, probably because of the pain in the arse interface. Elite just makes sense to me in a way that X does not.

  17. #57
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    They are slow burners, no question about that. I backed ED (although I'm too mean to have bought into any early access builds) but I haven't seen anything mentioning fleet operations so far and X is a bit empty if you just stick to one ship.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor Paul1290 View Post
    Space sims are a genre that has always had more than its share of excitable "potential players" who have picky and specific visions for what the genre should be that are either too far fetched or too specific to them to be realistically viable in the long-term.
    They can have games made for them that "check all the boxes" so to speak but then they find they aren't as entertained as they thought they would be then shift to increasingly useless and unactionable criticism until they just leave to do something else for a few years.
    After those people play for a while, get disappointed without really understanding why, then leave, the genre will be back to a far smaller player base of fans with more workable notions of what a space-sim should be, carrying on with "business as usual".
    This is legit. It will be interesting to see.
    I tend to think it's mostly because a space sim can be any damn thing and the title really doesn't tell you much about the game. A lot of these new ones are trying to sell people on dog fights, for example, but I couldn't care less about that any more. Mostly I find endlessly looping quite boring.
    Often these games are only good at a couple of particular things and if you didn't come for that you won't like it. Space sims and their fans are not as homogenous as the inclusion of space and ships would suggest and sometimes even they are not aware of this.

    I remember when Freelancer came out and it was a pretty disapointing game in a lot of respects, with its static flat solar systems, static flat non economy, weird scale, somewhat clunky plotting and story that didn't take advantage of the game's strengths. But the 'free' part was actually pretty cool. It was 'lite', the controls were great and there was a ton of exploring to do. You could just hook up with a convoy and wander off and and get a cup of coffee and come back and see where you ended up. You could play around with the, admittedly limited, allegiance system. All kinds of fun.
    But I remember getting some mod for it that did a lot of things to 'fix' it, only to find the main thing they wanted to fix was the controls using too few buttons. They really needed to leverage those 101 keys, was the thinking. Just like the old games.
    Completely missing the point. But that's what they thought was 'wrong' with it.

    Unifying the various fantasies of space wandering, space fighter jet combat, Space fleet combat, open universe and social interaction, mining and business empire creation among others is probably folly.

    We'll see how No Man's Sky and Elite go, but Limit Theory does look almost specifically built to be Freelancer but better, which is alright by me. Star Citizen looks to be an MMO in space with space fighter combat so not terribly interesting.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by rsherhod View Post
    I said this in the screenshot thread, but I'd like to ask it here in case I've missed something:

    Are there any single player alternatives to EVE around?

    I know we've got lots of space simulations on the way, but what I really want is a ship captain RPG. I want to say "make it so", rather than have to make it so myself. Controlling big ships in X3 is kind of close to what I'm after, but it's no RPG and it's really fiddly.
    I think Limit Theory (mentioned several times in the thread, but mostly for its Freelancer-alike bonafides) has real potential in that area. The game is going to have some interesting separation in the roles of AI actors, effectively with a captain/crew distinction. I'm not sure whether you'll be able to delegate the "captaining" responsibility of your own ship, but you will be able to do that within a small (or large) fleet. It won't be a graphics-intensive replacement for Spaceship Bridge Simulator, if that's what you're after (and no direct crew management), but I think it has real potential on the "single-player EVE" front.

  20. #60
    Lesser Hivemind Node Velko's Avatar
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    If just one of them would goddamn release! This is just agonizing.

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