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  1. #121
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Vexing Vision's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnravThreads View Post
    Gay gamers are rare? Not likely.
    Rare is the wrong word, but it's definitely a minority. If games would cater to more minorities, they'd include more game mechanics that interest me (as I'm a game-mechanics minority).

    All these labels...
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  2. #122
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus pakoito's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vexing Vision View Post
    Rare is the wrong word, but it's definitely a minority.
    No. No no no no nope. They play the same as straight guys. Being gay doesn't mean they have to play Sims and that stuff. They like dudes, they don't become princesses or something, and they'll stomp you in SF, CoD or Fifa.

  3. #123
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    I think he meant that homosexuals being a minority amongst the general populace, are a minority among gamers too.

  4. #124
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Althea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane View Post
    I think he meant that homosexuals being a minority amongst the general populace, are a minority among gamers too.
    Well, yes, that's a given, but we're no less of a minority in games and we don't need "special treatment". There are plenty of hetereosexual gamers who enjoy gay relationships in games (thinking of the love of M/M relationships amongst straight women here) or who aren't "creeped out" by them.


  5. #125
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Vexing Vision's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pakoito View Post
    No. No no no no nope. They play the same as straight guys. Being gay doesn't mean they have to play Sims and that stuff. They like dudes, they don't become princesses or something, and they'll stomp you in SF, CoD or Fifa.
    Sorry if I was being unclear - I'd be strongly surprised if being gay had any major effect on games being played (addendum: "Games" not focussing on hyper-sexual content). I also certainly do not wish to make any judgement on whether the inherent sexism in games is a good or a bad thing (an issue on which I personally remain completely neutral about).

    My point merely is that "Gamer interested in hawt man-elf on man-elf sex scene" is just as much a minority group as "gamer who likes turn-based strategy elements in his or her Roleplaying Games" from a biz perspective. You pick and cater to as much an audience as you can, but that will never include everyone on earth, regardless of gender, orientation or hair-colour.
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  6. #126
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Althea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vexing Vision View Post
    My point merely is that "Gamer interested in hawt man-elf on man-elf sex scene" is just as much a minority group as "gamer who likes turn-based strategy elements in his or her Roleplaying Games" from a biz perspective. You pick and cater to as much an audience as you can, but that will never include everyone on earth, regardless of gender, orientation or hair-colour.
    But they're not. The popularity of the male/male paranormal romance genre is proof enough that homosexual content in games is something that can be tapped to the benefit of the game.

    BioWare have come closest to catering for most tastes, but they still have a ways to go.


  7. #127
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Vexing Vision's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnravThreads View Post
    But they're not. The popularity of the male/male paranormal romance genre is proof enough that homosexual content in games is something that can be tapped to the benefit of the game.

    BioWare have come closest to catering for most tastes, but they still have a ways to go.
    Yes, absolutely. Additional content is always great. But on the same side, the popularity of Witcher 2 (which is really as heterosexual as they come) shows that there's also a strong market for that.

    For the record, I believe that Dragon Age: Origins did an excellent job of introducing the male-male relationship. I also believe that Dragon Age 2 and Skyrim (DA2 more, because of the greater emphasis on interaction with NPCs) do a horrible job of relationships - making everyone bisexual is boring and lazy and removing depth of the characters.
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  8. #128
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Althea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vexing Vision View Post
    But on the same side, the popularity of Witcher 2 (which is really as heterosexual as they come) shows that there's also a strong market for that.
    No? It shows that people value something a bit different and/or CDProjekt's views and beliefs. I'd be worried, actually, if people bought The Witcher 1/2 because of the way women are represented in it. I won't blame CDProjekt or even Sapkowski himself for it, because it's his world that seems to have a lot of basis in the way societies behaved in the same sort of time period for us. It's probably more representative than most historical dramas/games, actually.


  9. #129
    Network Hub Mihkel's Avatar
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    I think atm Bioware shouldn't really do romance. It's all gone downhill in that respect for them (be it hetero,bi,gay or whatever). It just comes across forceful and the subplot itself with the dialogue is stupid.


  10. #130
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mihkel View Post
    I think atm Bioware shouldn't really do romance. It's all gone downhill in that respect for them (be it hetero,bi,gay or whatever). It just comes across forceful and the subplot itself with the dialogue is stupid.
    She looks like Barbie dress-up. Actually, they all do. Like you expect a gigantic nine-year-old to pick her up and move her arms about.
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  11. #131
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vexing Vision View Post
    My point merely is that "Gamer interested in hawt man-elf on man-elf sex scene" is just as much a minority group as "gamer who likes turn-based strategy elements in his or her Roleplaying Games" from a biz perspective. You pick and cater to as much an audience as you can, but that will never include everyone on earth, regardless of gender, orientation or hair-colour.
    Not really. If a game is in any way character-driven, then it's no big feat to introduce a variety of sexualities to the characters. The same way it's not difficult to introduce a variety of genders and ethnicities to characters.

    But representation (with respect to the general populace of even just the 'game playing' populace) of women and non-white characters in games is more apparent than gay characters.

    That being said, this may be as much to do with the character development and dialogue of games writing; which remains poor and bypasses any kind of discussion where sexuality may be made apparent...
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  12. #132
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Drake Sigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mihkel View Post
    I think atm Bioware shouldn't really do romance. It's all gone downhill in that respect for them (be it hetero,bi,gay or whatever). It just comes across forceful and the subplot itself with the dialogue is stupid.

    NPC: "We're under attack!"

    You: "That robe really brings out your eyes."

    And the award for innapropriate timing goes to...
    Last edited by Drake Sigar; 02-12-2011 at 07:44 PM.

  13. #133
    Network Hub orcane's Avatar
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    That's pretty... wat? :D
    Stealth Mode!

  14. #134
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    For an example of Bioware's ineptitude at showing realistic romantic relationships, see DA:Redemption and Felicia Day's "flirting" with the templar. It's totally random and forced, going from light-hearted chat to a proposition to find a bed really quickly. In Day's interviews and tweets, she talked so much about how there's "flirting" in the DLC and webseries, as if this was a selling point, that I think Bioware have developed a very 'special', out-of-touch idea of how such things work.

    Although, SPOILERS FOR DA:O and WITCH-HUNT:




    There was an excellent moment in Witch-Hunt, if you imported a save where you romanced Morrigan, where she quotes something you said early in the relationship, dozens of gameplay hours earlier, in an emotional conversation to try and convince you to leave her be. This was really really well done, and although the DLC was admittedly perhaps less interesting for those who did not romance Morrigan, it showed more depth to a relationship.

  15. #135
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    Speaking of DA:O. I still hold that it's their best work so far.

  16. #136
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Althea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IDtenT View Post
    Speaking of DA:O. I still hold that it's their best work so far.
    Why? Over-long, many, many cut corners, no great storyline, some really boring characters - I could be here all day finding faults in DA:O.

    It's really not that good, it just appears like it is because it has no real competitor in the market.


  17. #137
    Lesser Hivemind Node Flint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnravThreads View Post
    Why? Over-long, many, many cut corners, no great storyline, some really boring characters - I could be here all day finding faults in DA:O.

    It's really not that good, it just appears like it is because it has no real competitor in the market.
    Alternatively, some might find the length just the right one, no cut corners of any significance, a good storyline and great characters. It's not their best IMO but I do think it is a great game and doesn't simply "appear" to be so.
    Give me steam and how you feel to make it real.

  18. #138
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Althea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flint View Post
    Alternatively, some might find the length just the right one, no cut corners of any significance, a good storyline and great characters. It's not their best IMO but I do think it is a great game and doesn't simply "appear" to be so.
    You can't not have cut corners in a game, they were either cut or they weren't.

    And they were.


  19. #139
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Ravelle's Avatar
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    If only the game didn't crash to desktop on any random time so I wouldn't have to start parts all over again, really want to start that game again but the crashes demotivated me.

  20. #140
    Network Hub Taidan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnravThreads View Post
    You can't not have cut corners in a game, they were either cut or they weren't.

    And they were.
    Yeah, but weren't those particular cut corners added again later as paid DLC?

    *snark*

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