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  1. #41
    Lesser Hivemind Node Feldspar's Avatar
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    I admit some days I swear too much at work, and at some times I'm ashamed that I fall back on one adjective and two descriptive nouns (although the people thus described probably deserve it and don't get me started on Excel), but I find excessive gratuitous swearing jarring and somewhat boring; it's like you're adding extra words to a sentence just because you want people to know this is a 'gritty' setting. Most languages are versatile enough that a little bit of thought can produce something grittier and more invoking.

    On the other hand, it is equally jarring when a swearword should have been used but has been toned done, no-one has ever said 'frak' and not sounded ridiculous. If you want a laugh, track down the ITV edit of Robocop, produced to show the film on a Saturday afternoon. "Frag you, mothercrusher."

  2. #42
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Kadayi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobF View Post
    I hate that there's no art to it, no bluntness, no timing because a swear is all about the timing.
    ^This. I found GTA IV pretty egregious in terms of over use to the extent that it robbed a lot of the important scenes of any potency because the language in the game was the principal means of expression Vs the animation. There's a confrontation scene in the LaTD where things come to a head between Johnny and other members of the biker gang and the entire thing is reduced to this playground style faceoff because the writers had robbed themselves of anywhere to go with the dialogue in terms of language.
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  3. #43
    Lesser Hivemind Node ado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadayi View Post
    There's a confrontation scene in the LaTD where things come to a head between Johnny and other members of the biker gang and the entire thing is reduced to this playground style faceoff because the writers had robbed themselves of anywhere to go with the dialogue in terms of language.
    Maybe that was the point, because biker squabbles like this often seem like fights kids have on playgrounds over silly shit that only matters to them. That actually sounds like something GTA would do, considering it's satirical tone and all.
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  4. #44
    Activated Node spcd's Avatar
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    It does in Kingpin: Life of Crime. Awesome game in an awesome setting

    You have 3 keys for communication. I think they were: positive, negative, something involving the word 'fuck'

  5. #45
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Portal would be a 10/10 if GlaDOS swore all the time *winks*.
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  6. #46
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Kadayi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ado View Post
    Maybe that was the point, because biker squabbles like this often seem like fights kids have on playgrounds over silly shit that only matters to them. That actually sounds like something GTA would do, considering it's satirical tone and all.
    I'll be honest I think you're giving Rockstar way too much credit there.
    Why yes you're right I'm deliciously evil

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  7. #47
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    As a parent I always *hear* the swearing, I used to just tune it out but some games I really respect are ruined by 'eff dis', if I can't let my son play a game that plays fast and loose with morality like Hitman or fallout that's not a problem, he can't play it. But when an otherwise tasteful game is peppered with swearing its a waste.
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  8. #48
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Lambchops's Avatar
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    I'm with Vandelay and Rob on this one. Swearing is fantastic. A well placed swear can make a comment funnier, more cutting or manage to convey just how angry you might be at the time. Overusing swear words, or perhaps more importantly putting them in at horribly incongrous places, diminishes that power and comes across rather badly. There's a particularly egregious example in one of the Matrix films where some character or other utters the phrase "What the shit?" I mean really. C'mon now. Who the shit says "what the shit?" Terrible! Get ye to Glasgow, you'll learn to swear properly there (although you'll become guilty of overusing the "c" word, so it's swings and roundabouts really).

    That said I did find House of the Dead: Overkill hilarious. It was being stupid, it knew it and for the most part it worked well, in much the same way that for the most part your average episode of South Park works well.

  9. #49
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Lambchops's Avatar
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    Oh and since Rob mentioned Peter Capaldi I feel I have to link to this:


  10. #50
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    In most videogames, death is just around the corner. If I'm ever in such a situation, I'll be swearing a lot.

  11. #51
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus vinraith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    As a parent I always *hear* the swearing, I used to just tune it out but some games I really respect are ruined by 'eff dis', if I can't let my son play a game that plays fast and loose with morality like Hitman or fallout that's not a problem, he can't play it. But when an otherwise tasteful game is peppered with swearing its a waste.
    As someone who doesn't hear it, I'm curious about some examples of tasteful games you'd otherwise let him play if it weren't for the language.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lambchops View Post
    Oh and since Rob mentioned Peter Capaldi I feel I have to link to this:

    Whilst that's undoubtedly the pinnacle of swearing as an artform, they've gradually become more and more dependant on that one character to get all the laughs...

    The first series was sharp and clever, but it's increasingly lost it's edge and become more and more the "Malcolm Tucker Show" reliant entirely on ever greater amounts of swearing.

    The only funny bit I can think of in the last series which didn't include Malcolm was the scene in the opposition offices about 'the Fucker is in the building' - which suggests they've decided that is 'teh funneh word'.

  13. #53
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vinraith View Post
    As someone who doesn't hear it, I'm curious about some examples of tasteful games you'd otherwise let him play if it weren't for the language.
    Sure, you have all of the games with sanitised warfare. Brothers in Arms, Battlefield bad company 2 and Battlefield 3,company of heroes and some of the others like rainbow 6 vegas.

    Outside of violent games lots of indie titles throw the word crap about like it's not really a swear, even Roboblitz,world of goo(?), has a few crap's in the script which when talking about old equipment.

    The thing is, would the games be worse without it? Would the games really be worse without it?
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  14. #54
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Lambchops's Avatar
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    I'm looking forward to what they come up with for a third series, it's been a long time in coming and it will be interesting to see if they change it to reflect the current landscape of UK politics.

    I'd agree that the first series was stronger overall, it was the perfect mixture of farce, superb dialogue and cutting observation.

  15. #55
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    The thing is, would the games be worse without it? Would the games really be worse without it?
    Who the fuck cares about the word "crap?" You see people's limbs blown off. This I don't get.

    I also don't get why cursing itself takes a special place in the pantheon of Things We Don't Do, when writing in most games is execrable. Every major complaint in this thread - at least by people who don't call themselves puritans: a subset that need not be acknowledged - is basically, "it doesn't fit the scene." Well, fuck, a lot of bad writing doesn't fit the scene. Why would cursing be any different? Why must we put it on a pedestal like it's that different from anything else?
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  16. #56
    Lesser Hivemind Node RobF's Avatar
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    Because with videogames it is a crutch and one that's fallen down upon often in the videogame pantheon of bad writing. So I think it's pretty fair to single it out, especially when it's a constant. We can target quest-speak and many other things as well but acknowledging that it is a problem is the first step towards dealing with it, right?

    Not that this forum thread will single handedly do that or anything but if enough people start raising their concerns that the swearing in games is fucking awful and when bad writing is actively worse for its inclusion, maybe we'll get somewhere in the end?
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  17. #57
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus DaftPunk's Avatar
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    He can't play games with swearing,yet you let him play games where you kill other people..which is worse thing,isn't it :/
    ... I take the lives of a few to protect the lives of many. I commit acts of war to preserve the greater peace. I take no joy in killing, but make no mistake; I'll do what needs to be done. Because it's my job. It's my duty. My name is Sam Fisher, and I am a Splinter Cell.

  18. #58
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Althea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    He can't play games with swearing,yet you let him play games where you kill other people..which is worse thing,isn't it :/
    No? The killing in games is "contextualised" and "unrealistic".

    Swearing doesn't work like that. If a kid hears a guy shouting "Shit!" in a game enough times, chances are he'll pick up on it and start saying it. He ain't gonna start murdering people because he fragged a bot 20 times in a match.


  19. #59
    Lesser Hivemind Node ado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadayi View Post
    I'll be honest I think you're giving Rockstar way too much credit there.
    That might be true, but then again maybe you give them too little credit. Ultimately it doesn't matter if you ask me because the analogy works weather they did it on purpose or not.
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  20. #60
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus The JG Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Well, fuck, a lot of bad writing doesn't fit the scene. Why would cursing be any different? Why must we put it on a pedestal like it's that different from anything else?
    Quote Originally Posted by RobF View Post
    Because with videogames it is a crutch and one that's fallen down upon often in the videogame pantheon of bad writing.
    I agree entirely with Nalano and I don't think your point holds up. Bad writing is bad writing and you see it everywhere. It's as prevalent in games as it is anywhere else. Writing, generally, is pretty poor. The reason we have shows or games that we like will part-way stand-out because of good use of language. I'm willing to bet that the games (or TV shows or films or whatever) people list as having bad usage of swearing are equally bad with other elements of its writing, it's just that swearing is a go-to thing because there's some weird tabooish thing around it, like Nalano pointed out.

    As for the puritans who simply don't like swearing, well I can appreciate that. I don't agree, but yeah, I see your point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Althea View Post
    No? The killing in games is "contextualised" and "unrealistic". Swearing doesn't work like that.
    Couldn't you say the same thing about the swearing though? Surely that is contextualised in the situation? Certainly not unrealistic in that sense, but I'd hope anyone playing a game such as a military FPS, would realise that it isn't entirely realistic, despite it maybe looking realistic itself.
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