Personaly I feel that that is a big flaw in any society it occurs in...
Victim blaming is a huge problem in any case, but in sexual assault cases often seems more cruel. Frustratingly (in the UK at least) there have been some well publicised cases of false rape accusations recently which will only provide ammunition for those wanting to justify it.
- Rape is terrible in a way that can't be joked about
- No topic is so taboo it can't be joked about
- Rape is more mentally distressing than murder
- Nothing is more mentally distressing than murder, and games depict murder all the time
- Gamers use "rape" in a cavalier and ultimately juvenile way that is offensive to victims of rape
- ...just as they use the words "faggot," "nigger," "cunt," and "jew" as a verb
There. Can we go on to the next topic, now?
It seems like Western society is yet to come to full terms with rape: what it is and how to deal with it. There are still current issues, like victim blaming and "they didn't say no", which sit uneasy. It will remain a touchy issue until we sort out how we stand on these issues as a society. Unlike rape, there is little ambiguity surrounding murder. This allows people to relax and joke.
As a lot of people point out, we are surrounded by art dealing with murder. It ranges from the serious to the slapstick. This increases our comfort with murder. Rape is always dealt with seriously. This compounds peoples inhibitions about discussing rape.
It's good to see this topic being kept sensible. Rape is an important issue that we rarely discussed intelligently. There are things to discuss.
People's indifference to widespread rape in prisons or rape being used as a means to punish perceived debauch behavior, in certain Islamist societies is what I'd describe as cases where rape is considered justified.
Last edited by Kadayi; 30-04-2012 at 09:23 AM.
Making light of (or even advocating) prison rape does seem to be a phenomenon with relatively broad appeal. It may not be officially sanctioned or make the rounds in polite society, but it reliably crawls out of the woodwork whenever a rapist or child molestor is the subject of discussion. I'm less inclined to see it as an aberration than as a chilling indicator of just how thin society's veneer of 'justice' as meaning something other than 'revenge' is for most folks.
Relating back to the thread at hand, the phenomenon of the ambivalent social response to prison rape doesn't seem to speak to our perceptions of rape so much as it does our perceptions of justice.
Last edited by Rii; 30-04-2012 at 05:52 PM.
No, I do not believe it justifies rape, my point was that people in general don't make a big fuss over it because for them it's not something undeserved.Also I'm failing to see how it's existence that justifies it according to your previous comment: -
Bloodlust is not a sentiment deserving of compensation. And if it were, why does the victim themselves not determine the punishment to be carried out? They are certainly in the best position to evaluate their own needs in that respect.It aims to compensate society and the victims when monetary compensation is clearly inadequate.
This is where we disagree. The only legitimate justification for incarceration is for the protection of others, or (in certain, limited contexts) the individual themselves.Punishments inherently have a form of retribution which forms part of the deterrent effect. Not justifying prison rape here, but justice inherently requires some kind of punishment which might be thought of as 'revenge'.
Last edited by Rii; 30-04-2012 at 05:51 PM.
Retribution in modern sentencing is not bloodlust. It's punitive in nature but that doesn't mean we're going back to smashing people's heads in with sledgehammers. Retribution in a case where a person is genuinely and clearly filled with remorse obviously isn't always justified, but for a man like Ivan Milat (to use an Australian example) it clearly is appropriate. In that case he had absolutely no compassion, regret or remorse for his crimes. The families of the victims would get nothing from simple compensation (how do even compensate for the death of a loved one?) but at least the state can punish the prisoner and attempt to use it to deter others from following the same path. Doesn't always work but it's better to set the legal precedent than to just go "Oh well I know he killed people, but still... let's give him the benefit of the doubt and let him off lightly. I mean nobody's paying attention, right?"
Ok, I'm going to bail on this because it is leading us way off track. In half-forming responses to what you have written I have noticed some logical gaps in my own thought; I will have to give the matter further consideration.
But where were we? Oh yeah: rape.
But isn't the use of modern penal systems more for the purpose of reform and rehabilitation rather than vengeance?
I don't understand why people care about this so much. I've not seen a shred of evidence suggesting that cavalier attitudes to the use of the word "rape" make anyone more likely to commit the crime. If you care about the issue volunteer or donate to a charity like this one, don't get angry at insensitive people on the internet.
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