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04-06-2012, 11:47 AM #1
BBC article discusses sexual harassment against women in the video gaming community
At least its somewhat more impartial than many of the videogaming-related articles on the BBC website that I've read in recent months (most notably the whole Mass Effect 3 furor), although I noticed they've disabled comments. Thankfully - although Joe Public would be unlikely to noticed the distinction - most of the criticism is toward Xbox Live. Jennifer Hepler (of the "skip combat sections" comment uproar) gets a mention though, as does James Portnow from Extra Credits.
Still, I cant help but think that the opening paragraphs and out-of-article quotes/captions that people inevitably scan give a bit of a one-sided view on us evil, patriarchal, sexist men.
04-06-2012, 11:54 AM #2
05-06-2012, 01:56 PM #3
- Join Date
- Jun 2012
You see, collecting people as a 'community' on the basis that they share a hobby is to me similar to calling out religious people since they share a religion with killers. It does not solve the problem in the slightest and only serves to imply that they are somehow responsible for the actions of others. All it does is polarize the situation further and gives the bad guys a chance to hide behind this 'community' concept. I think the proof for this is everywhere (both with extreme religious groups and extremely hostile gamers).
My point is, gaming is in no way special and it is the anonymity of the internet that is the 'cause'. I say 'cause' since these people of course are not assholes because of the internet, but they roam free without significant repercussions because of the internet.
Identifying gaming as a 'problem' or even the sexism (animosity is also incredibly strong among males, I don't see what makes females so special here) discussed is well intentioned but misguided imo. This is not the problem, the problem is much deeper. Just take a look what happens on roads to work every single day and I dare you to ignore the similarities that grown men AND women are showing right there.
 Oh and btw, my first post, love RPS :)
Last edited by kingmob; 05-06-2012 at 01:58 PM.
04-06-2012, 11:54 AM #4
04-06-2012, 12:04 PM #5
I am a completely evil, patriarchal and sexist man, and you can ask my Witcher-like collection of gamer girls for the truth of that.
And yet I would never insult or harass strangers like that, regardless of their sexual preferences, biological or self-identified gender. And indeed it's not an issue only related to girls - male gamers who manage to stand out in some way get the same amount of abuse. A stutter? Good luck. A high-pitched voice? You'll have a lot of fun in random live chats. Accidentally screw up a mission with strangers on the microphone? Good luck to you. Play in a random room where everyone else knows each other? Oh, you'll be "raped, owned and made a bitch" regardless of your gender as well.
Mind you, that doesn't mean I approve of this. Quite the contrary - everyone engaging in any of such talk to strangers outside highly-specialized fetish clubs should be permanently banned from the internet.
04-06-2012, 12:08 PM #6
It doesn't help, in my opinion, that developers are rather sexist too.
Marketing, visual design, gameplay elements - a lot are very 'male' oriented; A lot of games advertise with a male figure even if female is available (e.g. Dragon Age, Mass Effect), many more have little to no female presence at all, let alone female player characters (the majority of shooters) and there are those with piss-poor implementation of female characters (e.g. Patrician IV, some moments of Saints Row the Third).
So, to me, until developers improve we haven't got an ice cream's chance in hell of the community doing so.
04-06-2012, 12:11 PM #7
Remember when Blizzard wanted to introduce Real ID? Many female gamers where upset because they are generally horribly treated at their forums. If they write something interesting on the forums people call them attention whores and in WoW guys constantly ask them if they are hot & if they can get their pictures, etc. You can read more about this here: http://www.metafilter.com/93492/But-...ackaxe#3171416
Last edited by NecroKnight; 04-06-2012 at 12:13 PM.
04-06-2012, 12:34 PM #8
If anyone can point me to a gamming community which is worse than Blizzard forums, I'd be interested to know. RPGcodes is pretty awful as well(but not nearly as much), but it stems from different things like being extremely conservative.
Last edited by b0rsuk; 04-06-2012 at 12:36 PM.
04-06-2012, 12:35 PM #9
04-06-2012, 12:13 PM #10
04-06-2012, 12:24 PM #11
04-06-2012, 12:42 PM #12
Last edited by Rii; 04-06-2012 at 12:48 PM.
04-06-2012, 12:47 PM #13
04-06-2012, 12:29 PM #14
04-06-2012, 12:59 PM #15
Last edited by Rii; 04-06-2012 at 01:01 PM.
04-06-2012, 12:25 PM #16
I believe John Gabriel's Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory is appropriate to mention.
As soon as I read that article today the first thing that popped into my head was 'Oh, XBox Live Chat. Figures' followed by the aforementioned Penny Arcade comic. It's somewhat depressing that those were my thoughts rather that 'Man the internet is full of douchebags'.
Like VV said however, this isn't entirely limited to women. I can't count the number of times random people have raged at me or just someone on a server because they did something 'wrong' or just killed him. Heck, we used to have an entire forum on my Dark Age of Camelot server boards dedicated to people bitching and raging about this, that and everything.
04-06-2012, 12:42 PM #17
From my experience on the Internet, conflict of genders is a very common place for obvious reason. People don't really know who's who, so they don't really worry about consequences of their own speeches. So women accuse men, men return fire and bang. Sexual harassment. It's always men's fault because it is politically correct to accuse men and vice versa.
If you have the case, bring it to court. Otherwise just shut the hell up.
Com'n, "Fat", "Ugly", "Slutty"...... we all know how empty those words are. When I say "Fxxk you" to a man, I don't really mean I am gay, okay?
Last edited by squirrel; 04-06-2012 at 01:04 PM.
04-06-2012, 12:55 PM #18
04-06-2012, 01:00 PM #19
- Join Date
- Feb 2012
- Stockton-on-Tees, UK
Pretty fair article about something that is quite a big problem and one a lot of people want to bury with "I wasn't really being insulting, it was just smack talk". I guess I see the attraction of some place where you can let off steam and say whatever you like, but public games and public settings are not the right place for this. Also a lot of it is obviously not just smack talk but genuinely nasty.Irrelevant on further examination of the rest of the thread.
04-06-2012, 01:23 PM #20
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
Have a listen to the radio program linked in the same article:
Very interesting comment from one defender of the 'right to say whatever they want' on there saying they shouldn't have to change what they say to each other just because a woman is present. Erm, what? I don't make sexist remarks whether or not women are there! It's called NOT BEING SEXIST.
I really liked the solution proposed in the recent Extra Credits on harassment. Even if these trolls (in the traditional sense of the word) aren't actually sexist/racist/homophobic (though I am sure some of ARE these things), they are doing it for attention. The best way to tackle them is to deprive them of any way to get that attention. You can give people black marks if they say something horrible over mic or in game chat, and enough black marks against you means you begin the game auto-muted. Sure, people can un-mute you, but it's a sign to the community that you won't necessarily contribute.
Last edited by unitled; 04-06-2012 at 01:24 PM. Reason: missed word