View Poll Results: What should the new look divisions look like?

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  • No change! I fear change!

    12 29.27%
  • Triplets! I love triplets!

    9 21.95%
  • GC's lovely 1-2-quad based tier system. It's clearly the best!

    20 48.78%
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  1. #7261
    Lesser Hivemind Node NieA7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by somanyrobots View Post
    Snoozer and I just "played" our match. By which I mean I suffered one of the most thorough Nufflings I've ever received and conceded in turn 9.
    I just saw your roster, I take it you've not seen how much Grinn kicked me about otherwise you wouldn't be complaining so much. I had 220TV killed and another 200 MNG'd - I feel sorry for you with your full 6 positional players all at at least lvl 2, must be hard .

  2. #7262
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    My norse team in another league is down to 500 TV after 2 games. I have 2 positionals left.

  3. #7263
    Lesser Hivemind Node NieA7's Avatar
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    ...So it could be worse, but I still feel Nuffle giving my +ST zombie a -ST was particularly mean.

  4. #7264
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    Quote Originally Posted by President Weasel View Post
    I'm afraid that won't be possible, 'robots. For I have rolled on your Division today!
    Day 2 in Division 2 is now open for business.
    In my defense, it was tomorrow in my time zone. All praise to the admins!

    And yeah, the Lycanthropes are actually in pretty decent shape, only a couple of serious injuries in their history. Last night's match was more of a morale thing, Snoozer's armor rolls were off the charts and starting the second half with 7 players on the pitch was rather foreboding. Let alone that (my own colossal mistake) I set up thinking it was turn 8 instead of turn 9, so had ludicrously poor positioning. Just a deeply depressing start to the second half, that game wasn't going to get any better.

  5. #7265
    Lesser Hivemind Node NieA7's Avatar
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    Grinn managed to get 50% successful armor breaks in his match against me, even with a fair bit of mighty blow that felt a tad harsh against AV8. I had 6 players left for most the second half, two of which were ghouls in a sea of tackle. One of them drowned.

    Actually, looking at my match stats I clearly can't cope with bash teams (Chaos, Nurgle, Orc, Dwarf, Norse) as Necro as well as other types: my record (6 wins, 6 losses, 3 draws) is noticeably worse than against hybrid (9/4/3) and agile (3/2/1) teams. Anybody got any tips? I've tried bashing back (get slaughtered) and pulling back and marking space (works for one turn, then they're in my face and I can't dodge away) but I've never come up with anything really convincing.

  6. #7266
    Network Hub potatoedoughnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NieA7 View Post
    Grinn managed to get 50% successful armor breaks in his match against me, even with a fair bit of mighty blow that felt a tad harsh against AV8. I had 6 players left for most the second half, two of which were ghouls in a sea of tackle. One of them drowned.

    Actually, looking at my match stats I clearly can't cope with bash teams (Chaos, Nurgle, Orc, Dwarf, Norse) as Necro as well as other types: my record (6 wins, 6 losses, 3 draws) is noticeably worse than against hybrid (9/4/3) and agile (3/2/1) teams. Anybody got any tips? I've tried bashing back (get slaughtered) and pulling back and marking space (works for one turn, then they're in my face and I can't dodge away) but I've never come up with anything really convincing.
    Yeah I've encountered a similar problem. My general strategy with my necros vs bash is to try and break through with the ball and use my speed to stay out of blitz range. This usually involves marking a lot of players, which then leads to getting blocked a lot, which is bad. On D I just try to play stall the cage and hope for an opening, but it's hit or miss. Or try and get them to score and score myself quickly, which usually doesn't work with just speed but agi3.

    In general recently I've found my necros have been far less effective vs 2000TV teams than in the mid 1000s. Part of that has been sub-par dice my last several game (both injury and ball handling), but part of it is just not really having the skills to effectively deal with a lot of teams, and then there's my poor coaching.

    Having a perpetual rookie ghoul is a huge handicap and I think once my other ghoul dies (he already has a niggle) the team will really struggle to get anything done.
    Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

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  7. #7267
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NieA7 View Post
    Actually, looking at my match stats I clearly can't cope with bash teams (Chaos, Nurgle, Orc, Dwarf, Norse) as Necro as well as other types
    Foul... Honestly, how often do you do it? twice a match right? Well, if fouling goes aainst you thats a shame, but if you injure a few players the momentum shifts, suddenly MV4 zombies are encapsulating, stronger more skilled and faster players, and then fouling them.

    Once you get the opponent down to 3 players you can try picking up the all and everything.

    [/exagerating but still true]

    Zombies are for being hit, they are there to slow down your opponents, skill them as such, for example, i prefer wrestle to block as if you ever get the numbers advantage your opponent would be hesitent to give you an opportunity to foul even more.

    Werewolves, ghouls and wights can carefully manage the ball, but ghouls and zombies should be in the thick of it.

    But ghouls are fragile? Yes, and tempting, an opponent who sticks around trying to injure the ghoul is one fouled the next turn. When your ghoul dies your opponent might cheer, but to you its just another BH you replace with the infinite money all corpse teams end up with, sure you might have to wait a whole game until he is a blodger but that's a risk you'll have to take.
    Last edited by Heliocentric; 06-10-2012 at 08:21 PM.
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  8. #7268
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    Clone High vs. Wayward Gladiators

    potaetoedoughnut got the first half to attack. His guys failed to penetrate, the block dice were full of skulls and both downs. I got to harass the ball carrier but couldn't get it loose. It was passed to the ag4 wight who was forced to make a semi risky break for it. As the first action on my turn the yhetee skull-bd'd himself and failed the loner roll. This left my team wide open so I couldn't do much more for the remainder of the half.

    On my attack drive the yhetee double skulled again, but fortunately the ball landed quite securely in the middle of my formation. The formation was a little too loose, though, as the necros could get players in without so much as a dodge roll. Both of us got some players to guard the ball. Things didn't look too hot for me when the ball bounced in the undead's favour. That was when when luck turned around and potaetoedoughnut failed a couple of crucial dodges. I got the ball and started to be successful in blocking as well. By the end, six undead were sent off so I got away pretty easily. And so the game ended 1-1.

    ***

    It wasn't an easy match, but Nuffle saved me from the shame of defeat! Again!

  9. #7269
    Network Hub potatoedoughnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    Foul...

    But ghouls are fragile? Yes, and tempting, an opponent who sticks around trying to injure the ghoul is one fouled the next turn. When your ghoul dies your opponent might cheer, but to you its just another BH you replace with the infinite money all corpse teams end up with, sure you might have to wait a whole game until he is a blodger but that's a risk you'll have to take.
    Fouls aren't as effective against high AV bash teams like chaos, orcs, or dwarfs.

    The problem with getting ghouls injured at high TV is that is hard to level them up again. I've had a rookie ghoul for 10 games now and earned a grand total of 3 spp while picking up 4 injuries and 2 KOs. With no skills and opponents that have tackle and MB it's hard to get anything done with them. They unreliable ball handlers and even when they get the ball they fall over pretty easily. And they're often taken out of the game at some point due to stun/KO/cas so they don't have the opportunity to do much.
    Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

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  10. #7270
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by potatoedoughnut View Post
    Fouls aren't as effective against high AV bash teams like chaos, orcs, or dwarfs.
    Its funny, these teams are actually easier to slow down. Take out their sure hands guy or their passers. But, sure, you break armour less, thats why you use more assists. :D
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  11. #7271
    Network Hub OpT1mUs's Avatar
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    Hello, I wish to get stomped in this league of yours, so please add me in.

  12. #7272
    Lesser Hivemind Node Nullkigan's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, but complaining about necromantic teams having a hard time dealing with the specialism of another team just reads to me as "I'm sad my team can outdo other teams in ONLY 90% of situations". You can occasionally be outbashed and have a slow line? So what! You have a huge number of really good positionals, and whilst they're mixed between bash and ball it's the best mix in the game and you never have access to less than four for either tactic. Topped off with cheap disposables you can use to foul, low TV and regeneration. Ghouls getting ganked is a balance mechanism for them being good ball handlers.

    There's a reason they're one of the most popular teams, and it's not because people are into extreme diets.

    Although the comments on TV differentials/high level players do need to be addressed again soon. Especially with the way the league is currently set up. I still feel bad about having an average tv advantage of about 800 this season, but I like playing my team. With only three matches a season it is way too easy for a single bad game to dump super-levelled teams down amongst newbies.

    Also see: arguments about the long-term balance of high-AV teams, such as chaos, dwarves, and yes most of the undead teams.
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  13. #7273
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpT1mUs View Post
    Hello, I wish to get stomped in this league of yours, so please add me in.
    See, this one has the right attitude. go to the first post and add your name on the spreadsheet linked by the word "here" rename a "FREE SLOT" to your name and fill in your details
    I'm failing to writing a blog, specifically about playing games the wrong way
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  14. #7274
    Network Hub OpT1mUs's Avatar
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    I did, just didn't know what to put under Division , I am a complete scrub at this..

  15. #7275
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nullkigan View Post
    I'm sorry, but complaining about necromantic teams having a hard time dealing with the specialism of another team just reads to me as "I'm sad my team can outdo other teams in ONLY 90% of situations". You can occasionally be outbashed and have a slow line? So what! You have a huge number of really good positionals, and whilst they're mixed between bash and ball it's the best mix in the game and you never have access to less than four for either tactic. Topped off with cheap disposables you can use to foul, low TV and regeneration. Ghouls getting ganked is a balance mechanism for them being good ball handlers.
    I completely agree except the bolded bit, ghouls dont need to be on the ball as i previously suggested, and the deep pockets go a long way to resolve their fragility.

    I mainly play necro because I'm obsessed with the idea of having a team full of other peoples players, but even without that fun (and money saving) mechanics) I'd still likely consider necro because they are a decent team.

    Sure they take a long time to develop, but eh, this IS a persistent league.
    Quote Originally Posted by OpT1mUs View Post
    I did, just didn't know what to put under Division , I am a complete scrub at this..
    We will need to start a new season, we just started game 2 of 3, we'll likely be wrapped up in 2+1/2 weeks for a new start.
    Last edited by Heliocentric; 06-10-2012 at 09:19 PM.
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  16. #7276
    Lesser Hivemind Node NieA7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nullkigan View Post
    I'm sorry, but complaining about necromantic teams having a hard time dealing with the specialism of another team just reads to me as "I'm sad my team can outdo other teams in ONLY 90% of situations".
    Erm, I was saying I couldn't do it, not the team, I wasn't complaining I was asking for advice, and being high strength is hardly a specialism when 5 teams can do it. Apart from that, good summary!

  17. #7277
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    Div 2: Read in Tooth and Claw (Nec) vs. Lucky Lycanthropes (Nec)

    NieA7 and I met up today, the first time my boys have played against another Necromantic team. I had a sizeable TV advantage, giving him Nekbrekerekh and a Babe. NieA7 won the toss and chose to receive, setting up a very strong line to punch through my weak zombie LoS. He came out roaring, hammering my line and scoring two stuns in the process. Then he failed a hand-off between his ghouls, giving me a small opening. I moved a wight onto the ball, and started dashing players up to cover it; but the second player to get in position, my less-skilled werewolf, failed his GFI and his reroll, getting KO'd in the process. NieA7 caged up in the middle of the field, but still well within range, so I was able to get a zombie and a werewolf onto the ball carrier. NieA7 broke for the sideline, trying to reform his cage away from my players. He zigzagged down the field, his +AG ghoul consistently dodging away, until finally I got my (accidental) Strip Ball ghoul to make a block on him and free up the ball. But when I passed a player over the ball to pick it up (Side Stepping away from a block), the bounce went straight into a whole pile of NieA7's players. Dang. NieA7 wound up with a turn 7 TD, after which one his KO recovered and neither of mine did. Dang. Then we both lost a player to Sweltering heat, but his was a zombie and mine was a Flesh Golem. Dang. The weather then switched to pouring rain; I received the kickoff and made a valiant attempt at 2-turning EEEELFBAAAAALLLL, but was thwarted by the rain and the difficulty of playing necros like they're elves. End the first half, 1-0.

    The rain stopped, at least, as I received in the second half still down two players. I played very loosely, aggressively pushing upfield. I got lucky, as NieA7 tried to exploit my gaps a couple of times only to be thwarted by failed dodges. The drive ended with a seriously risky handoff to a marked-up werewolf; but he made the grab, dodged free, and scored a TD in turn 11. 1-1. The ref ran the clock down to resume, while my KOs finally woke up, evening things up a bit (though I had a zombie who'd been sent off for fouling, as well). NieA7 caged up heavily on the left side, and things settled into a bashfest. I did succeed in shaking the ball loose in turn 14, but the bounce stayed near his team. But he didn't pick it up for a turn, which let me bash in, push a zombie onto it, and bounce it behind his mob. I got a werewolf to the ball, and a ghoul in position to run at it; but he knocked the wolf down, and picked the ball up with a wolf of his own. But the maneuver ate a couple of vital turns. NieA7 still had one trick up his sleeve, though. He dodged a wight away from the mess, and got him just barely within scoring range. My ST4 wight blocked him, but didn't knock him down. So on turn 16, NieA7 opened up his ball carrier in terrific style, and had Nekbrekerekh throw a sure-thing 2D block against that wight...and rolled double-skull, double-skull. Game end, 1-1.

    Read in Tooth and Claw 1 - 1 Lucky Lycanthropes

    My thanks to NieA7 for a terrific match! Very enjoyable, and challenging throughout. The dice broke slightly in my favor, especially in clutch moments (the werewolf-handoff and Nek's spectacular failure), which makes it even more impressive on NieA7's part that I barely scraped out a draw. I suspected at the start of the season that Tier 1 would be more than a match for me, and it appears to be true :).

  18. #7278
    Network Hub OpT1mUs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post

    We will need to start a new season, we just started game 2 of 3, we'll likely be wrapped up in 2+1/2 weeks for a new start.
    Can I change my team in that time, like if I decide not to play Khemri, can I just change it in the table before the league starts?>

  19. #7279
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpT1mUs View Post
    Can I change my team in that time, like if I decide not to play Khemri, can I just change it in the table before the league starts?>
    Until your join the league ingame you can change as often as you like as long as you don't pass the race balance limits on the spreadsheet (max of 5 teams per race) Necromantic, Nurgle and Skaven are the only teams maxed atm.

    If you fancy an unreasonable challenge vampires and ogres are entirely unrepresented.
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  20. #7280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nullkigan View Post
    Although the comments on TV differentials/high level players do need to be addressed again soon. Especially with the way the league is currently set up. I still feel bad about having an average tv advantage of about 800 this season, but I like playing my team. With only three matches a season it is way too easy for a single bad game to dump super-levelled teams down amongst newbies.

    Also see: arguments about the long-term balance of high-AV teams, such as chaos, dwarves, and yes most of the undead teams.
    It's only a three game season! If you play your TV appropriately then you'll get promoted and be back towards the top again, and only have had to play three games against weaker teams. If you don't get promoted then your argument is defeated!

    And anyway - you haven't played me yet! My TV is only 200 less than yours I think.
    Last edited by Everblue; 06-10-2012 at 10:44 PM.

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