View Poll Results: What should the new look divisions look like?

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  • No change! I fear change!

    12 29.27%
  • Triplets! I love triplets!

    9 21.95%
  • GC's lovely 1-2-quad based tier system. It's clearly the best!

    20 48.78%
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  1. #161
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Screwie's Avatar
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    I might do that for a gutter runner, wardancer or any other catcher which might conceivably also be fielded as a blitzer.

    Though actually, if they blitz your ball-carrying catcher with a lone blitzer (relying on ST advantage for a 2d block), you could wrestle them to the ground, stand up unharmed and with no tackle zones around you, pick up the ball and run... but then (and assuming if you didn't take Wrestle, you'd take Block) you're swapping a dodge roll for a pick up roll...

    Hmm. Now I'm curious too.

  2. #162
    Lesser Hivemind Node Jiiiiim's Avatar
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    wrestle/dodge/tackle and high agility and movement is the most reliable way to break a cage, and catchers/gutters/wardancers fall under that category. Don't make a wrestler your primary ball carrier but I don't feel like catchers are really strong enough to be primary ball carriers, they're about nabbing quick scores and otherwise being where you need to be.

  3. #163
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Vexing Vision's Avatar
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    Yeah, agreed on anything I might use as Blitzer. Personally, I think I'll stick with Blodgers instead of... errr.. Wrodgers? for defensiveness.

    We'll see how that plays out though. :)
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  4. #164
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus President Weasel's Avatar
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    you can build catchers and gutter runners for scoring, if you like, but they can do that already out of the box. They shouldn't be getting hit with the ball anyway; ideally they'd be catching or being handed the ball within go for it or preferably normal movement range of the line, and running it in for the score in the same turn, or you could have them goalside of the scrum if the opponent has no safety, receiving the ball and running out of danger. Wrestle prevents them getting hurt in open play just as well as block (unless the opponent wants to risk a sending off and turnover to foul your prone player).

    Since you're generally talking about the fastest or joint-fastest players on your team, and the ones that come with dodge, and the ones that are likely to get SPP fairly quickly, it makes sense to specialise some of them for defensive purposes, hence wrestle (and probably dauntless for their next skill). They're the ones most likely to be able to reach that one blodging ball carrier who is nearly safe, and you want to give them a good chance of success when they arrive.

  5. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by groovychainsaw View Post
    I'm holding off to see what Javis' battered team looks like by game 3, I don't want to inflate my team and grant him some horrendous big guy inducement against me for my last game if i can help it...
    I've got 4 dead beastmen and no skillups (though 4 have 5 sp and another has 3)

  6. #166
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    Pres, I completely agree. On a WElf or Skaven team, which I've got the most experience with, a Catcher or a Gutter runner is always going to be able to score even without any skills. Hence, I often build them up as blitzers or assisters; guard on a catcher is brilliant, they can get just about anywhere, even inside cages, for the crucial +1 ST.

    Incidentally, just played Xercies' Space Elves and won 3-0... Was a close match, and a complete shambles of a first half, but Xercies had a couple of bad rolls at really unfortunate times which meant I managed to run in a couple of defensive TDs. Good game!

  7. #167
    Lesser Hivemind Node NieA7's Avatar
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    Just played a tight 1-1 draw with Low-Key's Undead, I'll write it up in a bit (despite the magnificence of the lizard playbook).

  8. #168
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    And the second clash between Dead Rodents Walking and The Tiny Dancers ends 5-3 to the rats. HughTower and I's match several seasons ago was a scoring bonanza, this time was no different. 350k in inducements saw HughTower receive a Bloodweiser Babe and Jordell Freshbreeze (a f***ing 5ag wardancer).

    HughTower elected to receive first and thankfully the ridiculously sunny weather immediately changed to 'fine' at first kickoff. I had little expectation of being able to stop the elves scoring, just like last time, and I was swiftly proven correct. The absurd agility and ball skills of the elves swiftly broke my lines and scored a few turns in. 0-1.

    But just as I've never had much luck stopping HughTower scoring, he's never had any joy in stopping me either. My GR promptly runs in a textbook one turn touchdown on my opening turn. 1-1.

    The third drive was always going to be bloody, and sure enough the casualties start to appear. My star thrower promptly gets taken down badly hurt, shortly followed by Fluffy (my rat ogre for those who don't know) maiming the wardancer in similar fashion. The wardancer gets back up, HughTower deciding to keeping 3 wardancers on field is of greater import than an apothecary, my thrower is simply dismissed as one of the usual casualties of a match. But now Nuffle decides to start screwing with Hugh and causes a fumble in the rear. True to Skaven form, I promptly swarm around the former carrier, keeping elves away as best I can. Sure enough, in turn 7 Jordell Freshbreeze screws up a leap, giving me the opening I need to break a ball carrier free to score. 2-1.

    I make the mistake of underestimating Nuffle at this point, something we've all done and regretted. It's HughTower's last turn of the half, he has no one-turners. So I adopt a safety formation, planting my players right up against my own touchline. The kickoff promptly brings a riot, having the ref move the clock back a turn. Shit. Now I'm completely out of formation and the elves can move forward at their leisure. A veritable army of tree-huggers moves towards my almost non-existent defence, and in spite of my best efforts to form an in-depth wall of tackle zones, that bloody Jordell Freshbreeze leaps clear (vindicating himself for his earlier cock-up) and runs home the equaliser. 2-2.

    Still, HughTower received, giving me the half's last laugh. As the only race particularly capable of using this opportunity, I felt it would be rude to pass it up. My one turner ran in a last minute touchdown, preserving my lead at the half's end. 3-2.

    The second half began as the first ended, with a riot. This time the clock moved forward a turn, making the whole half a fast and furious affair. Too much so apparently for my Rat Ogre to take, failing a critical wild animal roll, which coupled with my placement mistakes made a one turn touchdown an impossibility (and my coveted two goal lead a more tricky prospect). Misery loves company, and that same turn I also burned a reroll on a 2+ pickup (something which became a pattern for me that half) then my thrower promptly screwed up his pass. Bugger. Things went from bad to worse when next turn HughTower was able to penetrate my lines and get a throw back to his own players, also taking out both of my Stormvermin (one badly hurt, one just unconscious but I never got it back). My best efforts to retrieve the ball (a wrestling GR managed to get the ball free next turn) HughTower managed to retain possession long enough for Jordell 'Utter Bastard' Freshbreeze to break through and score again. 3-3.

    I'm annoyed at this point. I should be 4-2 up, instead it's level at 3-3. Still, it's my drive again and the game has taken to giving me rerolls. Maybe this time my team can not completely muck up an easy one turn touchdown. Yes, yes they can. 4-3.

    3 turns each to go, I know HughTower could end the game with his touchdown, denying me any one-turn retaliatory asshattery. I pray to Nuffle. Turns out, fickle as he is, Nuffle was listening this once. An ill-planned turn from HughTower saw a thrower burn a reroll on the pickup then pass to the other thrower, who promptly fumbled it. Again I seize any opportunity I can get and swarm the ball and any players that might move to support players near it. Two turns left, victory is in sight, I know HughTower doesn't have many players he can get within range of scoring while I have plenty who can mark, all I have to do is mark up some and flatten the others. In the end it was Nuffle and not me that decided the result, the first intended ball-recipient failed a dodge and caused a premature turnover, ending the elves' hopes of a draw there and then. Given my early aggression, I had multiple players in place to score and it only took a few easy rolls to get one last bonus touchdown. 5-3.

    Very well played HughTower. I think we both made some nasty mistakes that match, mine just ended up not being so costly. It was quite scary how similarly the match played to our last encounter, albeit with larger more scary teams this time. Best of luck in your other matches and I look forward to our next match (that last bit is technically what we call a lie, playing you is stressful and my blood pressure would love never to see you again ;) ).

    Incidentally, all fixtures to date validated.

    PS. Ugh, rolled 50k on winnings, rerolled down to 40k. Winnings bug wound up giving me 20k. Also rather amusingly I now have a 5AV linerat (also with a niggling injury). Expect to see him on a line of scrimmage near you.
    Last edited by DarkFenix; 13-06-2011 at 11:36 PM.

  9. #169
    Lesser Hivemind Node ntw's Avatar
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    Only 2 matches remaining to be played to end "Day 1" :
    DivA - Duffin vs alh_p
    DivC - sinister agent vs combat

    All other Divs have been rolled onto "Day 2"
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  10. #170
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus LowKey's Avatar
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    A heavy slog between my Undead and NieA7’s Necros resulted in a 1-1 draw. The majority of the game revolved around large punch up in the off-centre of the pitch with the 6 zombies on the LOS generally just hanging out in the middle. Most of my game was pretty uninspiring, with a cheeky breakaway for my TD and getting frustrated with the flesh golems who proved a major impediment with their standfirm (bu dum dum tish), NieA7 played a more attractive game scoring his TD by drawing in my defence before playing a nice hand off down the centre.
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    Overall a fun game that got a bit confusing as the majority of the players being both the same type and wearing similar colours, next time ill choose electric pink. <o:p></o:p>

  11. #171
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Kelron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vexing Vision View Post
    Yeah, agreed on anything I might use as Blitzer. Personally, I think I'll stick with Blodgers instead of... errr.. Wrodgers? for defensiveness.

    We'll see how that plays out though. :)
    Wrestle has some use as a defensive skill, mainly on faster low AV players - if you get blitzed you can get back up again before your opponent can, leaving them with a player on the floor for the next turn. You also don't risk an injury on your own player, although taking the chance to gain a turnover might be better if your opponent doesn't have block.

    Wrestle and strip ball is also the most effective combo for getting the ball out of enemy hands, anything except an attacker down makes them drop the ball (barring sure hands), and it has a reasonable chance of working even on a 2-against block. Lots of teams have access to 4 catcher/runner types, but there's rarely any need to build them all into scorers. Making 2 into blitzers or cage breakers adds flexibility to your team, and their base stats and skills generally mean they can still score if necessary.

  12. #172
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    One of the problems with building players as dedicated scorers is that it skews the development of your team. You end up with two or three players with all the SPPs and relatively unskilled other players. And, as we ALL know, blood bowl players don't have a particularly long life expectancy; your dedicated scorer WILL die!

    Eventually, most ball carriers will have blodge and safe hands so wrackle vastly increases your chance at getting the ball carrier down and knocking vthe ball loose.

  13. #173
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Screwie's Avatar
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    Interesting stuff. So basically, my personal definition of "catchers that can be used as blitzers" needs broadening quite a bit.

  14. #174
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus President Weasel's Avatar
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    To expand on something Kelron said, it's definitely worth going into options and unticking "use automatically" for wrestle. There may well be an occasion when your opponent's non-block-having player gets attacker down/both down on the first or second block of his turn, and you want the option to take the hit and generate the turnover.

  15. #175
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Screwie's Avatar
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    Oh yeah, I've done that Wrestle turnover trick before. :)

    I was also pleasantly surprised after unchecking "use automatically" for Diving Tackle. When it asks if you want to use it, the game actually tells you the dice result before you choose - so you know whether or not DT will work before you commit.

    EDIT: This probably happens for other skills too, but I've never had cause to turn a skill like Accurate off so it came as a bit of a surprise...
    Last edited by Screwie; 14-06-2011 at 12:46 PM.

  16. #176
    Network Hub alh_p's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ntw View Post
    Only 2 matches remaining to be played to end "Day 1" :
    DivA - Duffin vs alh_p
    DivC - sinister agent vs combat

    All other Divs have been rolled onto "Day 2"
    Duffin and I were scheduled to play our match this evening, due to something coming up, I was hoping to postpone till Wednesday. Would the other denizens of Division A and our mod overlords object to a 24hr extension? (pretty please)

  17. #177
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    unitled: Too true, my GR's are on ridiculously high SPP compared to the rest of my team. My one-turner just hit 71 SPP last game, I have another on 47 and one on 38. The only other player coming even close is my primary thrower with 33. It often simply isn't very easy to get other players to score, generally the game has too much at stake and against other speedy teams it's very risky.

  18. #178
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    Pres: that's really good advice. Especially worth bearing in mind against big guys who are often difficult to actually stand up! It's also worth turning pro off automatic as there are situations where a team reroll is better.

    Fenix: that's a major problem with Skaven teams... linerats are really fragile so the temptation is always to stick with the safe scores. Of course makes it all the more heart breaking when one of them dies.

  19. #179
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus groovychainsaw's Avatar
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    As others have said, the plan with my catcher is never to be tackled with the ball (he's not a good ball carrier with str2!), only to catch it and run it in for a TD on the same turn. So wrestle is a good defensive, messing with any blocking safeties, combining well with dodge, preventing injuries (unless my opponent goes for a foul) and still leaving me with 5MA on the following turn with the blitzing player on the floor (and usually, less movement to come and get me). AND I get to use him as a safety myself, running around deep in my own half, used to great effect in my last game. I might build some of my other catchers differently (I'll get up to 4 eventually!), but with only one in my team, I wanted to start with some survivability for him.
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  20. #180
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    Isn't the problem then that someone blitzes/blocks your catcher the turn before you need them though? You can't stand up, catch, then run in the ball. Even low ST players can be good carriers with the right skills (safe hands, blodge, fend, etc.), especially as you'll usually have players standing near them for the assists (or cancelling out opposing assists).

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