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  1. #21
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    I'm getting sick of Valve.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teddy Leach View Post
    I'm getting sick of Valve.
    I suspect the hand of THQ more than that of Valve, but I acknowledge that you may have a point.

  3. #23
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    I think basically it's a case that big uk retailers like Tesco simply won't stock games that are tied into Steam. I noticed recently when Portal 2 came out, albeit you could buy it for 360 & PS3 as the chart topper it wasn't even listed in the PC gaming chart, same with Duke Nukem. Pretty shitty, but I'm not sure there is much that can be done about it given the retail clout of the firms like that.

    Also I suspect that the reason no ones discussing it is down to the plain fact that no publisher wants Tesco to blacklist them entirely, so thus they aren't going to comment on it.

    Also, this has nothing to do with Valve and everything to do with aggressive retail.
    Last edited by Kadayi; 27-06-2011 at 11:26 AM.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadayi View Post
    I think basically it's a case that big uk retailers like Tesco simply won't stock games that are tied into Steam. I noticed recently when Portal 2 came out, albeit you could buy it for 360 & PS3 as the chart topper it wasn't even listed in the PC gaming chart, same with Duke Nukem. Pretty shitty, but I'm not sure there is much that can be done about it given the retail clout of the firms like that.
    And yet Shogun 2 has sat happily in their chart for some time.

    I find it hard to believe being blacklisted by Tesco is something a publisher fears, considering they can take a week or more to get new titles on the shelf after release date these days they aren't exactly vital to bringing in those all important week 1 sales.

    I'd really like to see RPS checking this Steam situation. I've sent a few e-mails myself but, being just a lowly paying customer, I imagine I will be largely ignored :P

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creeping Death View Post
    And yet Shogun 2 has sat happily in their chart for some time.
    Well that is the anomaly. Though it might be case that Tescos don't realise it's tied into Steam, or this is a more recent embargo on their part.

    Also given that back in 2005 1 in 8 pounds UK was passing through Tescos I wouldn't underestimate their power as an organisation to dictate the UK retail scene. If anything they are even more financially entrenched these days. Hell for a long time Apple were opposed to selling their phones through them as it didn't fit their image, but ultimately they caved.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2005...s.supermarkets

    The interesting thing is to see whether DXHR makes it to the store shelves as the leak certainly is tied into Steam. I wonder whether that will still feature at retail, or whether it will be withdrawn.

  6. #26
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    Do EU competition/consumer protection laws not enter into this? What about domestic law?

  7. #27
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus The JG Man's Avatar
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    Well if it's a case of publishers choosing who to sell to, that's not really a problem for the law. They might have a go at Steam, who could reply that they only put up what publishers want them to put up; I appreciate it's nowhere near as simple as that, but it's different to Microsoft that there is plenty of choice still available for getting PC games, be it from retail, online ordering or DD.

    This problem is only going to get progressively exaggerated when HMV inevitably fails. Only the larger supermarket shops themselves have any PC games, meaning you'll either need to go to one of the bigger shops or GAME/Gamestation, who have about 4 PC titles between them that are not very well priced. I think PC gamers are a little more savvy about where to get games from, either because they play games where they pretty much have DD shoved in their face so they might open up to the idea, or because shops sell so few PC games, they have to look around anyhow. Something of a self-fulfilling prophecy.

    Interesting that this seems to be localised to the UK. How did it get from having decent PC game stock to just falling apart at retail? And why are certain publishers trying to buck this trend so poorly? Even if it's not desirable, surely it's better to have your product where it's actually visible?

  8. #28
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    I don't think it's a case of publishers not wanting to sell, more a case of some powerful UK high street retailers refusing to stock games associated with Steam on the grounds that it's advantaging a rival (which it technically is to be fair). Plain truth of the matter is though PC bricks and mortar is on its last legs and has been going down that route since Sony and Microsoft aggressively heavily promoted their consoles and pushed PC gaming to the side lines. It used to be that you could walk into a GAME and there would be hundreds of PC titles old & new to buy from, but nowadays with the recession stores are all generally running on low stock and you're lucky to find anything out side of the chart (though the charts are based on prediction more than anything else).

    I think by and large UK PC gamers have largely transitioned over to buying their games either digitally, or from e-tailers such as Play & Amazon (we go where the best price is). However a lack of high street presence in terms of the PC as gaming platform could well be detrimental to the player base in the long term if it persists.

    My inclination is, that Microsoft, Activision and EA who all do have some stake hold in maintaining the PC as a relevant platform might well apply some pressure to UK retail at some point.

  9. #29
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    Either way, interesting to see how this one develops. And subsequently, I'm still keeping a hawk-eye out for cheap SM deals. Hopefully it's a Steamworks title (just like DoW: Retribution) so I can add it to Steam anyhow...presumably it'll be addable with the key, even if it's not available to buy in the region?

  10. #30
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    Pfft, Game et al can spit their dummy out and scream all they want - they won't be getting my business. I will purchase titles unavailable on the Steam store boxed through Amazon. Usually cheaper anyway.

  11. #31
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    Who sets the price for steam games anyway? I've seen loads of people say the dev's, but then people like Sigames say they sell it at a fixed price to steam and Valve sets the price

  12. #32
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    I would assume that since multi-player will be through the respective networks for the consoles, and since there are Steam achievements( http://store.steampowered.com/app/55150/) that the PC version will use Steamworks for multi-player.

    Sounds like our UK brothers are, once again, trapped in the midst of some hissy-fit on someone's part.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ice-Fyre View Post
    Who sets the price for steam games anyway? I've seen loads of people say the dev's, but then people like Sigames say they sell it at a fixed price to steam and Valve sets the price
    It's set by the developers publishers. Valve just take a % cut. Reckoned to be around 30% which is fairly comparable to a retailer cut. The reason why Activision titles are still hideously expensive, is purely down to Bobby Kotick being a bast.

  14. #34
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus The JG Man's Avatar
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    30%? That would explain why Steam's prices are relatively high...and perhaps why retail prices for PC games has seemingly gone up a tad? To match if that's the expected price.?

    I'd also noticed SM uses Steamworks after a quick googling. I imagine Relic significantly pushed for that one, considering it's documented that they increased sales after dropped GFWL and solely utilising Steam for Retribution. I can see SM (in the UK) going the way of BF3 - no chance of pre-ordering on Steam, but they won't not put it up, just in time for release.

  15. #35
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    I've asked THQ to comment on this.

  16. #36
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    Given it's still available on the UK Gamersgate & D2D it looks like Steam is becoming a local store for local people. Presumably there is nothing for us there.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by The JG Man View Post
    30%? That would explain why Steam's prices are relatively high...and perhaps why retail prices for PC games has seemingly gone up a tad? To match if that's the expected price.?
    Not quite sure what you're getting at there, but when you consider the costs of manufacturing, distributing and retailer mark-ups on games, much more of the retail price gets back to the publisher through Steam than it does through physical stores. There's plenty of interviews with developers and publishers around to back that statement, like this one with 1C.

    "Let's say one of our titles was sold through a till in a retail store right now for, say, 20. After retail report the sale to our third party publisher - at the end of the quarter following sale - and they then report the sale to us - 60 days after receiving their cut - 1C would receive around 7 for the sale of the game. That would come into our bank, in around September.

    But if we sold the same game through someone pushing the download button at one of our digital partners' websites for the same 20, we would net 14 - twice as much - into our bank by the end of May; three or four months' sooner."

  18. #38
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    Do publishers not realise they are consigning themselves to my personal bargain bucket when this happens

    Is it brick and mortar pressure that is causing this it seems UK based ones have often been more vocal about being anti steam

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelron View Post
    Not quite sure what you're getting at there, but when you consider the costs of manufacturing, distributing and retailer mark-ups on games, much more of the retail price gets back to the publisher through Steam than it does through physical stores. There's plenty of interviews with developers and publishers around to back that statement, like this one with 1C.
    In that interview (which was only from last week) Darryl Still actually states that retail chains are refusing to stock games that have steamworks included: -

    So no, Steam do not dictate at all. They are supremely easy to deal with and superbly competent at what they do. Their confidence in their offering, which pays no heed to any rival in store activities, compares very favourably to that of the retail chains who recently sent a command to publishers that if they include Steamworks in their title it will not be stocked. Those guys need to grow up, stop bullying, and focus their attentions on making their offerings as attractive as the people they are obviously looking over their shoulders in panic at.
    If they are getting arsey about that I wonder how they'll feel about EA Origin?

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rossignol View Post
    I've asked THQ to comment on this.
    Thanks Jim! Here's hoping you get a reply that clears it up :)

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