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  1. #41
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus squirrel's Avatar
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    I do not know much about this developer, so let me have an understanding of the story out of their own version. They are complaining that MS charged them for patching a patch of a published game, unfair as MS had charged for certification to publish and the patch that followed. And they dont think the bug involved was something that serious.

    Now I have to say that I believe it is completely that developer's fault. I said completely, not something like MS did a bit wrong. You release a faulty IT product, that is a fact. You, not your publishing partner, should be held responsible for the loss over the issue. How minor that error is, it is still an error. If it is so minor, why would you bother to correct it? Let's not kid ourselves, FEZ understands that they should patch out the bug (and out of a patch, that is not cool), but they dont want to pay. MS may be not considerate enough to accomodate an indie developer in such manner, but being not considerate enough is not a guilt at all.

    Dont try to claim the moral highground by playing with the holy title "indie developer", if you cannot go with only 2 employees, it's not MS fault, it's yours, FEZ.

    Youths these days should learn to bear responsibility. When one makes mistakes, pay up or shut up, embrace the lesson to do it better next time. Stop playing with such politics game, that's not a healthy social phenomenon.

    Plus, may I add one essential point: MS is the very first one accomodating patching for console games. If you publish on Gamecube / Playstation 2 and have a major screw-up, you may end up being a defendent in a class action lawsuit (god knows what people would sue you for compensation).
    Last edited by squirrel; 19-07-2012 at 01:17 PM.

  2. #42
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drake Sigar View Post
    I don't see why everyone hates this guy so much. At first glance his only fault seems to be his hilarious overreaction to being trolled.
    Well, it's a hilarious juxtaposition when the guy goes from "fuck PC gamers" to "fuck other indie devs" to "fuck Japan" to "why isn't anybody helping me???"
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
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    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  3. #43
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
    Plus, may I add one essential point: MS is the very first one accomodating patching for console games. If you publish on Gamecube / Playstation 2 and have a major screw-up, you may end up being a defendent in a class action lawsuit (god knows what people would sue you for compensation).
    If you publish on the gamecube or PS2 at this point you are kind of really stupid. If you meant Wii and PS3: Can't speak for Wii, but PS3 allows patches (not sure what Sony charges, but they allow free DLC so it probably is comparable to whatever Steam charges).

    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Well, it's a hilarious juxtaposition when the guy goes from "fuck PC gamers" to "fuck other indie devs" to "fuck Japan" to "why isn't anybody helping me???"
    Japan is kinky, they might still help.

  4. #44
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    1. Call out other developers for making shit games
    2. Release a shit game
    3. Refuse to fix shit game
    4. ???

    Someone above me mentioned MAYBE buying this in an idie bundle one day. It would actually keep me from buying a bundle. You know that smug asshole would think his shit game was the reason everyone was buying it. I wouldn't even download it if it were free to be honest.
    "What were we talking about? Pegasuses, pegasii, that's horses with wings. This motherf*cker got a sword that talks to him. Motherf*cker live in places that don't exist, it comes with a map. My God."

  5. #45
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by db1331 View Post
    1. Be shit
    2. ???
    Fixed that for you.
    I'm failing to writing a blog, specifically about playing games the wrong way
    http://playingitwrong.wordpress.com/

  6. #46
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    I've personally never been a fan of "The guy is a dick, I am gonna deprive myself of whatever". Decide to buy a game based on the quality of the game, not the dude selling it.

    For example, one of my favorite comics these days is X-Factor (the mutant investigation team, not the reality TV show). The writer, Peter David, is a royal assclown who could turn a story about the ghost of JFK choking a puppy at the bottom of a well into bashing of Republicans. Just because I want to strangle him every time he talks about something other than sci-fi and comics doesn't mean I can't enjoy the comics he writes.

    GoG have a horrifyingly bad PR team that basically only ever got lucky with one angle (calling everything "100% DRM Free" even though it is probably closer to 80 or 90%) and screwed up just about every other angle (seriously, think of a single PR stunt that has ever gone well for GoG :p). Does that have any real bearing on whether or not it is worthwhile to buy from their website?


    All the fez dev has really done, at least to me, is prove that nobody should ever pre-order his games. Let other people bugtest, then see if he is going to patch. And that's it.

  7. #47
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    I've personally never been a fan of "The guy is a dick, I am gonna deprive myself of whatever". Decide to buy a game based on the quality of the game, not the dude selling it.
    Well, the guy called me a dick, so he can go eat one. 'Sides, I don't own an ecks bawks anyway. :P

    And GoG was 100% DRM free until they started stocking modern games along with their old ones. And they tend not to consistently insult their customers.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
    Attorney at Lawl
    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  8. #48
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Drake Sigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Well, it's a hilarious juxtaposition when the guy goes from "fuck PC gamers" to "fuck other indie devs" to "fuck Japan" to "why isn't anybody helping me???"
    Going from the source you posted - I think most Japanese games suck and a lot of gamers are entitled shits. I mean, I would have used better wording to illustrate that I don't believe ALL Japanese games suck and ALL gamers are entitled shits, because I'm diplomatic like that.

    He's just sounds like some fool who doesn't deal with the limelight well, certainly not worthy of my hatred or attention.
    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    I've personally never been a fan of "The guy is a dick, I am gonna deprive myself of whatever". Decide to buy a game based on the quality of the game, not the dude selling it.
    Nothing wrong with refusing to buy from a person or company for ethical or social reasons. The bad press usually helps keep them in line.

  9. #49
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drake Sigar View Post
    Going from the source you posted - I think most Japanese games suck and a lot of gamers are entitled shits. I mean, I would have used better wording to illustrate that I don't believe ALL Japanese games suck and ALL gamers are entitled shits, because I'm diplomatic like that.

    He's just sounds like some fool who doesn't deal with the limelight well, certainly not worthy of my hatred or attention.
    Well, I had to look him up for the purposes of this thread, but yeah: xbox exclusive 'cuz he says we're all pirating shits, re-enters an indie dev competition he already won in an ethically dubious cockblock of other devs, solid foot-in-mouth disease with Japanese gamers, and then he's publicly broadcasting how he painted himself into a corner, but has zero public cred, so the chickens are coming home to roost.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
    Attorney at Lawl
    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  10. #50
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    Not read the replies yet... BUT HAS NO ONE SEEN WHAT TEAM MEAT BOY HAD HAPPEN!?!?!?!

    Oh, I'm less angry now. This has happened so many times in the past, when are companies going to learn?

    World of Goo already lost a purchase from me when they were told by their Console Publishers they had to take down the PC store during the Console release dates (to cover an exclusivity deal). I loaded up their page to buy, only to be greeted with an excuse, so I told myself it's their loss. :P

  11. #51
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Drake Sigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Well, the guy called me a dick
    :O Never has an insult been so undeserved.

  12. #52
    Activated Node The First Door's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drake Sigar View Post
    I don't see why everyone hates this guy so much. At first glance his only fault seems to be his hilarious overreaction to being trolled.
    It isn't the reaction to being trolled that personally annoys me so much, it is the school yard bully attitude he has. He insults people/groups of people who he thinks will take it without fighting back and then gets upset when other people call him on it and wonder why the world is against him.

  13. #53
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Smashbox's Avatar
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    If I had a genie/three-wish-situation, I'm pretty sure one would be that troll could never be used as a verb again.

    Except in the fishing/actual definition context.

  14. #54
    Lesser Hivemind Node Kodeen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    GoG have a horrifyingly bad PR team that basically only ever got lucky with one angle (calling everything "100% DRM Free" even though it is probably closer to 80 or 90%)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    And GoG was 100% DRM free until they started stocking modern games along with their old ones
    What are the DRM'd games you are referring to? I don't think I've seen anything besides CD checks for multiplayer, which they've had for a while.

  15. #55
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodeen View Post
    What are the DRM'd games you are referring to? I don't think I've seen anything besides CD checks for multiplayer, which they've had for a while.
    Nalano is (probably) referring to how many of the newer games have CD keys and may or may not need you to make an account for multiplayer. I believe Operation Flashpoint (before it got pulled down and later re-upped as ArmA: Cold War Crisis) was the first game to need a serial.

    I am referring to the need to authenticate to download the game and patches. Many disagree, but it is hard to say they are "100% DRM-Free". But they are close enough that nobody cares, and "100%" sounds better than "80 to 90%". Thus, it is their one successful PR move that didn't involve The Witcher (which I credit to CD Projekt Red)

  16. #56
    Lesser Hivemind Node Kodeen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    I am referring to the need to authenticate to download the game and patches.
    Not sure I know what you're talking about here. Are you talking about the MD5 checks that the downloader and installer perform?

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smashbox View Post
    If I had a genie/three-wish-situation, I'm pretty sure one would be that troll could never be used as a verb again.

    Except in the fishing/actual definition context.
    The word has completely lost its meaning to be honest. I haven't seen it used properly in ages.

    Time to look for a new word..

  18. #58
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodeen View Post
    Not sure I know what you're talking about here. Are you talking about the MD5 checks that the downloader and installer perform?
    Getting off topic, but think of Gamersgate. You have to log-in to download the game (authenticating that you have the rights to said digital media).

    GoG: you have to log-in to download the game (authenticating that you have the rights to said digital media) as well as any patches (normal patches don't work for GoG games, usually).

    Its a very mild form of DRM (possibly the bare minimum that isn't "The honor system") and MANY people will argue it isn't by virtue of very specific definitions of DRM, but it is just to show that GoG did manage to get at least one bit of PR right.

  19. #59
    Lesser Hivemind Node Kodeen's Avatar
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    Of course you have to log in. Otherwise it would be TPB. The DRM-free refers to the game itself (once downloaded).

    Anyway, yeah, off topic. As far as Fez, I'm also not of the mind that if I don't like the creator, that I should boycott the product. However, if he has demonstrated an unwillingness to fully support his products, I don't know why I should trust him to do so on PC or anywhere else.

  20. #60
    Lesser Hivemind Node RobF's Avatar
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    I don't know why I should trust him to do so on PC or anywhere else.
    Because fully supporting a product on the PC doesn't generally cost $40k a pop?
    My actions are in no way born out of some sort of Darwinist offensive
    I just get a bit fidgety times

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