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  1. #681
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadly.by.design View Post
    Get yer gold-grubbin' hindquarters back to the tower! Unless, of course, ye'd prefer to have Bounty Hunter stick a shiny shiv betwixt yer nethers.
    Not bad sir!

    I think we should make a concerted effort to rename ward b!tch to ward wench

  2. #682
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadly.by.design View Post
    I haven't done a lot of solo carry in pub games so far because my tier still tends to go 2/1/2 most of the time. I was solo Void in Radiant safe lane versus Jug and Abaddon. A friendly Enchantress was jungling. Things went decently for a while, but our mid SF was completely non-communicative and never called missing when Huskar would come down to gank.

    It went alright, but the team mechanics left them shut down my farm after the first 10 mins or so. I felt like my last hits were decent, but 3-on-1 bottom ganks happened too often. I know I should've been paying extra attention to mid since our jerk wasn't calling miss, but still ... Any advice on rolling solo hard carry?

    It was also my first pub game with Void, thanks to people wanting to swap heroes, and realize I was using my movement ability too offensively in the early game. I think I would've been better off saving it for escapes. That was already the case with half of my ults, too. My team would get in bad positions, or get teamfights turned around and have to flee. So, I'd throw down my ult on 3 of them for someone to escape. It's not a great use for it, but it felt like all I could do in my under-farmed/out-teamed position. So, I got ganked several times in-lane and died in most of our teamfights.

    /edit/ We eventually won, thanks to two defensive teamfight victories that turned the tide. Abaddon was their whole team, so things went better after we were hip to his tricks (and some CM feeding helped). Still, I can't help but feel silly going 2/9/19 as Void. Yuck. Here's the match -- and yes, my items are awful because I figured a Bfury was useless when my farm was already delayed.
    Laning solo with void is never fun, but enchantress is such a strong support from jungle. I can't think of any heroes with more kill potential in the first few minutes. Sadly I see a lot of Enchantress...es? rushing aghs/bloodstone in jungle instead of roaming.

    I still hate the hero though. Chen for life.

  3. #683
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpecialSoup View Post
    Laning solo with void is never fun, but enchantress is such a strong support from jungle. I can't think of any heroes with more kill potential in the first few minutes. Sadly I see a lot of Enchantress...es? rushing aghs/bloodstone in jungle instead of roaming.

    I still hate the hero though. Chen for life.
    Enchantress is awesome at lvl 1, doesn't Chen have technically better kill potential at lvl 1 though since hes essentially got the same lvl 1 spell but his gives bonus creep hp too

    Also just checked, Chens cd on his spell is 14 seconds while Enchantress's is 30 so technically he could enchant a creep, take a camp then wander into lane with a really bad slow and tiny dmg amp... but every little helps
    Last edited by DenieD; 19-09-2013 at 05:07 PM.

  4. #684
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    Quote Originally Posted by DenieD View Post
    Enchantress is awesome at lvl 1, doesn't Chen have technically better kill potential at lvl 1 though since hes essentially got the same lvl 1 spell but his gives bonus creep hp too

    Also just checked, Chens cd on his spell is 14 seconds while Enchantress's is 30 so technically he could enchant a creep, take a camp then wander into lane with a really bad slow and tiny dmg amp... but every little helps
    Enchantress can take two creeps at lvl 1 which is typically what gives her more kills (and can lead to some really easy set ups, e.g. troll net into centaur/hellbear)

  5. #685
    Lesser Hivemind Node Kaira-'s Avatar
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    I think I should play more All Random. All kinds of hilarious stuff can happen, like in this match with two of my friends: http://dotabuff.com/matches/315846723

    No jukes, only nukes. I'm a bit disappointed that lich didn't get dagon too.

  6. #686
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    Quote Originally Posted by DenieD View Post
    Been messing about with a situational Jakiro Veno Viper lane recently too... DoT city. Works well vs a late game Huskar as Viper hard hard counters him.
    Not to call this lane out but i'm fundamentally suspicious of tri lanes without a guaranteed disable. If Jakiro misses his ice path, you're kinda fucked if you're up against a trilane too. Jakiro, veno and viper are incredibly squishy heroes.

    Although, Jakiro really shouldn't be missing his ice path considering how much slow there is. Hmm...
    Last edited by khaz; 20-09-2013 at 05:27 AM.

  7. #687
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWntT...YSI8el&index=9

    VG vs. IG in the Sino Cup.

    27 kills in under 15 minutes. And there's a Timber and a Spacecow in the draft.

    Chinese doto can be taught new tricks.

  8. #688
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    Quote Originally Posted by khaz View Post
    Not to call this lane out but i'm fundamentally suspicious of tri lanes without a guaranteed disable. If Jakiro misses his ice path, you're kinda fucked if you're up against a trilane too. Jakiro, veno and viper are incredibly squishy heroes.

    Although, Jakiro really shouldn't be missing his ice path considering how much slow there is. Hmm...
    Yup thats its biggest downfall but you don't need to go toe to toe so much, Gale + Veno Passive + Dual Breath + Jakiro Passive + Viper DoT + Viper Corrosive Skin... One of you (usually Veno) picks up an Orb of Venom after the first kill, cos ya know... its funny. You can just see the enemies HP melting off even between hits and the best thing is pretty much all of it is multi target-able

    I've tried running it with Viper Jakiro Witch Doc, that works quite well too... Maladict when you have enough DoTs to drop an elephant anyway seals the deal but I prefer the dmg to be a bit more upfront with Maladict.

    Vipers new corrosive skin is really broken on lane.

    I don't generally run Viper though yeh, hes not that great of a hero (although always nice to have a hard counter line up up the sleeve, and man he breaks Huskar bad).

    - Soup: Good point on the 2 creeps thing with Enchantress but that would require you waiting til the 1 min 30 mark in game (30 secs for creeps to spawn, grab the big one, 30 seconds cd on spell) to gank, the enemy won't be lvl 1 any more on the lane (most likely, they should have had 2 waves of creeps), I was thinking more of straight off the bat get a creep then flatten a lane. EDIT: OK I have terrible maths... thats 1 min mark technically DOH, fair enough.
    Last edited by DenieD; 20-09-2013 at 03:36 PM. Reason: DOH

  9. #689
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    DK going to MLG.

    Alliance, navi, the refurbished American teams, DK all in one tournament? Oof.

    I have to say, after reading a thread on reddit I agree about Valve being a little too cautious with making all stat visibility private. Dotabuff can longer tell which skill bracket your game was in as of this patch. I can't tell if Valve are hiding that their matchmaking is fundamentally broken - i'm still of the opinion its among the worst matchmaking services i've used online - or they just don't want people seeing any stats till they're confident they've got the system right.

    Its funny how the system has taken a full circle back to pre replay parsing days when everything was word of mouth.

  10. #690
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    Quote Originally Posted by khaz View Post
    DK going to MLG.

    Alliance, navi, the refurbished American teams, DK all in one tournament? Oof.

    I have to say, after reading a thread on reddit I agree about Valve being a little too cautious with making all stat visibility private. Dotabuff can longer tell which skill bracket your game was in as of this patch. I can't tell if Valve are hiding that their matchmaking is fundamentally broken - i'm still of the opinion its among the worst matchmaking services i've used online - or they just don't want people seeing any stats till they're confident they've got the system right.

    Its funny how the system has taken a full circle back to pre replay parsing days when everything was word of mouth.
    I think to some degree they may be wary of creating the atmosphere that was in HoN around Kill : deaths but with Win:Loss instead... it's a pitty that DotaBuff and Valve don't work a bit more together (Like I wouldn't be against Valve opening there own DotaBuff) and instead of saying "ok it can't get that information now", they could just make it private to the player.
    Last edited by DenieD; 24-09-2013 at 10:23 AM. Reason: silly smilies..

  11. #691
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    Yeah, I don't understand what their reluctance is with leaving that choice to the player. They tend to get a bit too autocratic at times. Also, not having access to stats doesn't stop that same selection of morons being morons. They'll just find another avenue to be morons in.

    At its core, DotA 2 is a competitive game for competitive players. Its a game that rewards improvement over time and that means allowing those players access to stats. At the very least, their own.

    For all of HoN's stats obsessed tards, its detailed persistent stats recording system is very good and it works. And it gives a clear indication of what your strengths and weaknesses are. The game may be a distant third in EU/NA but in SEA its 150k strong with a very healthy competitive scene so its clearly not hurting the player base. LoL has an equally detailed persistent stats recording AND a league system to boot and is the biggest game in the world; so i'm not entirely sure what Valve's problem really is.
    Last edited by khaz; 24-09-2013 at 11:06 AM.

  12. #692
    Network Hub Stirbelwurm's Avatar
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    Well, maybe they just want to take a different approach and see how it works out. Who knows. But another point of that change, which is overlooked most of the time, was demonstrated by Dendi for example.
    With that change, people can't harass the pros anymore, if they don't want to. Dendi is a pretty popular player and you can bet, that there are lots of people that constantly bother those players in some way. With this change they (the pros) have an easier time just playing the game.

    Most of the people that complain about the change, state that their main reason of complaint is, that they can't call out "noobs" in their team anymore, since they can't see the player history anymore. I think that's a retarded reason. People base their critic of the matchmaking on the number of wins a player has, as well as his performance in his last five games or so. But right now everybody should know that the matchmaking does not strictly work that way and that there are more variables to it, ones which the players couldn't see until now either. So imo this is not primarily about restricting the matchmaking algorithm critcs, maybe they just want to push the discussions in another direction.

    Then again, these are all just assumptions on my side, they may be totally wrong. Also, for whatever it is worth, they opened a subforum just for matchmaking in the playdota forum.

    (just for the record: I also think that matchmaking got worse over time)

    EDIT: I also just took a look, the default for profile privacy seems to be off, so another reason for me why I don't understand most of the criticism about this change. Imo most people won't bother changing this setting, so I don't think this will hurt the community nearly as much as most people want to make us believe.
    Last edited by Stirbelwurm; 24-09-2013 at 01:41 PM.
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  13. #693
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    I don't know honestly. It won't hurt the community no but it makes the matchmaking system seem more of a clusterfuck.

    I don't particularly care about looking at other player stats as i'm experienced enough to tell how good a player is just from being in the same game as them. What I do care about is looking at my own stats once in a while, that's all i'm asking.

  14. #694
    Network Hub deadly.by.design's Avatar
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    I honestly don't care about brackets and all of that. While stats are fun to track, what I really care about is being matched in fewer Russian teams or up against grossly superior opponents. I get that some of that is subjective with you being on a team of random people and finding out if they communicate or not. There are bound to be some bad games because of that, but it stings so bad in those matches where your teammates are clearly doing their own thing, yet become blamethrowers when things go poorly. I really do prefer the oblivious bad players to the obnoxious blowhards. Heck -- even when I'm underperforming or getting complains, I freakin' ASK teammates for suggestions. Most of them are more interested in criticism and feeling like they have someone to blame.

    That being said, while the horrible team chance is high for my ranking, I can't really blame players for that. They didn't ask to be matched with me, either... so my only grief is with players with bad attitudes.

    /edit/
    Ehh, bad dota day. 4 bad pubs in a row, to varying degrees. The first two had disconnects and the second two had teammates who either didn't communicate or use skills, etc. That's not to say that I'm necessarily Mr. Play-so-well, but it really stinks when you see the loss coming so early on. (like early lane feeding in the one game and our PL going afk for 5mins in the other...) Eventually, I feel like I start playing worse out of frustration and it's time to close the game for the day.

    /playing during U.S. work hours sucks
    Last edited by deadly.by.design; 25-09-2013 at 02:10 AM.

  15. #695
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    Sad to say deadly but in this type of game and this game specifically (It has a long history), you will never run out of dicks. Valve have been more successful than most at removing or reducing these negative elements but they're part and parcel of the game. You simply have to deal with it, use the mute button where necessary and move on.

    And Valve's autocratic matchmaking ways is not helping either. The original DotA eventually splintered into several strands because playing on b.net became unfeasible. Garena, listchecker, rgc, irc in-house leagues and rooms (open and/or private), dota-league, countless other clients in China...

    Part of the reason why China and SEA haven't adopted DotA 2 wholesale is because LoL provides everything all those splintered groups offered in one place. Its a similar story with HoN in SEA.

    If Valve truely care about keeping the community together and not letting its player base splinter like above they'll bring out a dedicated league system of sorts. This is a competitive game, Valve need to offer something that showcases it. Leave it up to the players whether they choose to be public about their competitive side or not.
    Last edited by khaz; 25-09-2013 at 05:51 AM.

  16. #696
    Ugh.

    I just played Anti-Mage with an Enigma who tried to get every creep kill in the lane and screwed up over half of the creep pulls (wrong timing). 24 minute battlefury terribleness. The mid Drow in our team failed to gank but got some decent farm and later in the game decided it would be a good idea to time his shots so that he would deny me most of my kills and use his superior attack speed to not let me farm creepwaves I asked him to let me take so I could get my farm up. The Kunkka fed Centaur Warrunner (2 hearts) and literally missed every ult he threw completely. Not a single hero hit. The other team had a Clinkz, Mirana and Silencer. Enigma didn't buy wards, bought dust but never used it despite me asking him to, or transfer it to me.

    The result of the game my score being 3/6/12.

    Drow: AM noob
    Kunkka: lol AM lost us game
    Enigma: (silence)

    Are people really so stupid that they don't know how basic Dota fundamentals work? You have a hard carry for a damn reason. I think I'm done with Dota for a few days.
    Last edited by Battlehenkie; 25-09-2013 at 07:23 AM.

  17. #697
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    is this really becoming the lets whine about soloq games thread? join rps guild, theres at least 3-4 people to play with every evening.
    also im quite fine with valve keeping stats to themselves. the dubious benefit of stat tracking for personal growth or whatever, is offset by the the fact that it would not give any tangible benefit for community as a whole. seriously am i the only one that is quite happy of not having brackets/tiers/ladders etc., it would just another thing to whine, obsess and shitalk about. let riot and blizzard do it, i have no interested in dota being like them.

  18. #698
    Quote Originally Posted by grasskit View Post
    is this really becoming the lets whine about soloq games thread? join rps guild, theres at least 3-4 people to play with every evening.
    Just venting some steam. If those posts aggravate you so much I won't post *shrug*. I'm in SEA and there's no-one in the RPS guild playing in that region.

  19. #699
    Network Hub grasskit's Avatar
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    its not aggravating its just disappointing when every other post in this subforum is often times complaining about terrible game someone had. understandable since on average win/loss is ~50/50

  20. #700
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    Quote Originally Posted by grasskit View Post
    is this really becoming the lets whine about soloq games thread? join rps guild, theres at least 3-4 people to play with every evening.
    also im quite fine with valve keeping stats to themselves. the dubious benefit of stat tracking for personal growth or whatever, is offset by the the fact that it would not give any tangible benefit for community as a whole. seriously am i the only one that is quite happy of not having brackets/tiers/ladders etc., it would just another thing to whine, obsess and shitalk about. let riot and blizzard do it, i have no interested in dota being like them.
    Except DotA 2 is like them and was like them long before these other games even came along. And, these systems still exist in the mm system to match players. We just aren't privy to them. The only thing we've agreed upon so far is letting the choice of stat displays up to the players instead of choosing to blanket everyone under one rug. Valve can be a little too autocratic at times.

    Even for the casual players, the systems that run DotA 2 are competitive ones. Its just to what level they wish to engage with those systems.

    And calling stat tracking a dubious benefit is odd as its equally applicable to the "would not give tangible benefit for community as a whole" statement as well. Some players like stats, some don't. Let them decide how they choose to use this option.

    It is valve so no doubt they have something they're working on which they will implement eventually but there's been no real indication when and where this is coming.

    As for the solo queue rants, sometimes its just good to rant.
    Last edited by khaz; 25-09-2013 at 12:57 PM.

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