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  1. #1
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    In Praise of: Kick-Off Return

    Kick-Off Return eh? Who the fuck's going to want that then? Dwarves maybe I suppose, the slow fucks, but no other fucker's going to want to waste 20 points of TV on a skill that only works when you receive and all it does is get you 3 steps closer to the ball.

    That's what I thought anyways.

    Kick Off Return, as a human player, has revolutionised my offence. I have a Strong Arm/Accurate thrower, I gave him KOR a few games ago as I didn't know what else to give him as I thought that Safe-Throw was fatally bugged.

    Now, instead of needing 2 men in my backfield to receive the kick I just need my thrower as he can cover the entire pitch without a GFI with KOR. I can use more men up on the line of scrimmage to put a serious hurt on whilst he is deep gathering the ball. If the kick goes short, even better. KOR gets my man up to it fast and gives me enough movement to setup my cage inside my opponents half where ever I want it to be rather than scraping it into position at the limits of my movement under duress.

    KOR, the little skill that could.

  2. #2
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    One of my first double choices on a 'fling. Can dramatically improve the odds of the turn 8/16 one turner and if you can get under the ball a free catch roll is always good for any AG3 team. That said it is one of those little skills that you'd like on most teams but you can normally find something you want more. I always take it very early on Orcs, Dwarf and Khemri but elsewhere it tends to be a very late choice that rarely makes it onto the pitch before the player meets his end.

  3. #3
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Screwie's Avatar
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    Yeah it's unfortunate it's a double skill for stunties, as they would be giving up a lot of skill options in order to take it.

  4. #4
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    The most dangerous time on offence for a bashy team is, it seems to me, the time which lasts until the ball is safely in the hands of your carrier and the carrier is in the cage. Anything that reduces that is good, and so I really like KOR.

  5. #5
    Lesser Hivemind Node cyberpunkdreams's Avatar
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    I've only tried it on my dwarf team so far, and it's really valuable for them. I have it on a +mv runner, making them almost fast in offence! I'll be getting it for my DoD gobbos too, if I can. As for other teams... definitely nice to have, but hard when there are so many other skills from which to chose.

    (BTW, I think safe throw is working as it should be now.)

  6. #6
    Lesser Hivemind Node Jiiiiim's Avatar
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    Gives you a bit more control receiving the kickoff, including that horrible monster known as the Blitz result. I haven't regretted putting it on Pythagoras on the humans

    On a related note this is exactly the sort of little thing I'm looking for in the Coaches' Corner submissions >_>

  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus ChainsawHands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair Hutton View Post
    Now, instead of needing 2 men in my backfield to receive the kick I just need my thrower as he can cover the entire pitch without a GFI with KOR.
    My elfs would like to thank you in advance for only using one player to cover the pickup.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChainsawHands View Post
    My elfs would like to thank you in advance for only using one player to cover the pickup.
    Good job I'm not good enough to be in the champions league then isn't it! Hah, how do you like them apples?

    Also, I'm using my extra man to gang foul an elf on the line of scrimmage.

  9. #9
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair Hutton View Post
    Also, I'm using my extra man to gang foul an elf on the line of scrimmage.
    Who needs the ball anyway? You can start scoring when the pitch is clear.
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  10. #10
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus ChainsawHands's Avatar
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    Even better: picking up the ball's only a 1/9 chance of a turnover, it's a mighty 1/6 if you're fouling first.

    I can see the attraction of freeing up a player, but you're still only going to get 3 blocks and a blitz, and I've learned from painful experience (some of it painful for me, some for my opponents) that not covering the pickup against a fast team like elfs or skaven will at some point leave you a TD down.

  11. #11
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Screwie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChainsawHands View Post
    My elfs would like to thank you in advance for only using one player to cover the pickup.
    Depends on the elf... MA 7 covers so much of the field I'm not sure KOR is worth it.

    MA 6 or less it's fantastic though.

  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Screwie View Post
    Depends on the elf... MA 7 covers so much of the field I'm not sure KOR is worth it.

    MA 6 or less it's fantastic though.
    That's not what he meant. He's being menacing,
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  13. #13
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Screwie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    That's not what he meant. He's being menacing,
    Ah, I don't do menacing :P

  14. #14
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus President Weasel's Avatar
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    On the one hand, an additional player on the frontline makes it harder for the baddies to reach the ball on a blitz result; on the other... isn't that your thrower over there with two gutter runners hanging off him? Looks like the third one has the ball and is nailed on for a touchdown.

    That said, kickoff return is definitely a useful skill, and one I would take instead of kick on all those teams where people suggest getting a kicker.
    I even called one of my orc throwers "Leader McKickoffreturn" as those were the skills I planned to give him - I am pretty sure he died before I could.

  15. #15
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus ChainsawHands's Avatar
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    Menacing is a... bizarre interpretation, unless you think that I'm trying to menace someone I'm not playing against any time soon into not making a positioning mistake against me if we ever do play. ;-)

  16. #16
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus groovychainsaw's Avatar
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    As part of my reconstruction of my human team, I'm considering getting the second thrower and making him block/leader/kickoffreturner, so this is a good discussion for me, gives me confidence that it is not a stupid idea - I already have accurate/strong arm thrower (who is 3 points away from getting the dumpoff I want for him - which might launch into a long discussion about why i shouldn't get dumpoff, but I'm willing to have that argument ;-D)
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  17. #17
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    Dump-off seems like an oddball pick for Humans. Basically in situations where you dump off I think the Humans AG3 is going to be further inhibited by the large number of tackle zones that are going to be hanging around any potential targets.

  18. #18
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus President Weasel's Avatar
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    'It's a stat that is only useful when you've screwed up - you should be spending all your time and effort ensuring you've wasted the TV you sank into the skill. Get block so he stays up or sure hands so he can't get stripped" vs 'it's a stat that's really useful when you've screwed up - when you've spent all your time and effort protecting the ball carrier but haven't managed, or some ridiculous leap player has hit him anyway, dump-off can save your entire match. If you only use it once in a season and it turns defeat into victory it's worth all the TV" with a side order of "I hate dump off because you have to use it before you know if your ball carrier is actually going to spill the ball".


    Job done, let's move on.

  19. #19
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    I think Dump Off works really, really well on AG 4 players, it means that opponents have to properly man mark your players otherwise the ball is just going to go to a free elf. And as they say, the tighter you squeeze the more that slip through your fingers. However, I think at AG3 the ball is going to end up on the ground just as much as when your carrier is hit without it and worse potentially out of the scrum.

  20. #20
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus President Weasel's Avatar
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    Accurate and strong arm work for dump-off though, don't they? He's at least ag4, effectively.

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