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Thread: Batman

  1. #1
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus sabrage's Avatar
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    Batman

    I'm assuming this'll turn into a DKR shitstorm in 3 days, but I'm broke and I probably won't see it for a while and I've been avoiding previews so I don't really want to get into that right now.

    Adjunct to our highly off-topic discussion in the Summer Sales thread, let's get into the extended animated universe. I grew up watching The Animated Series, and re-watch an episode or two from time-to-time and they stand up extremely well. If you're a fan of the Batman of the last 20 years, TAS went a long way towards setting the tone. Mask of the Phantasm is an absolutely fantastic film, and to spin off of what was discussed in the other thread I watched it as an extremely young child and I can't help but wonder if it didn't fuck me up a bit. I didn't think that SubZero was much to write home about.

    Moving onwards, I was a big fan of Batman Beyond when it was still aired, but I have to wonder if perhaps it hasn't aged as well as my memory wants to think. It definitely felt like a spiritual sequel to TAS, as opposed to the more cartoonish New Batman Adventures (but maybe I just hate Robin.) The film addendum to that, Return of the Joker, brings Mark Hamill back as The Joker and deals with some fairly dark subject matter, but again it's been quite some time since I've seen it.

    Of the rest of the animated shows, I've only seen two: The Batman, which felt to me more like a vehicle to sell new toys than a dedicated attempt to make a good show. Some may enjoy the new character designs, I did not, but again TAS designs are pretty much ingrained in my interpretation of Batman. Then there's Justice League/Unlimited, which has quite a few fans but, having little interest in the rest of DC's repertoire, held little interest for me.

    DC has been churning out quite a few animated films independent of any of their series in recent years. Gotham Knight was released around the time of TDK, and was made in an effort similar to The Animatrix. I quite liked the segments "Have I Got A Story for You" and "In Darkness Dwells", but I thought the other ones were kind of a waste of time. It should follow that, if you don't like anime, you should probably avoid this one. The only other one I've seen was Under the Red Hood, which is very much an attempt to push their animated films towards an older audience. I thought the animation was a little weak, but if you like your Batman pitch black (and I do) this will probably be your forte.

    That's the extent of what I've seen. It looks like Netflix no longer has anything from DC available for streaming, but they did at one time have quite a wide selection. Pity.

    Edit: I see that gundato did a much better job than I did in far less words, so here's his input:
    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    Yeah, should probably go to a different thread.

    And Year One's "villain" is crime itself, and a huge part of the plot is Jim Gordon's affair.
    Mask of the Phantasm dealt with vengeance and lost love, and also doesn't really have a true villain in the sense that the core plot is about Bruce and Andrea (when The Joker gets upstaged by plot, you know it is a good story :p).

    And vin:
    (DCAU movies. So the stuff that is basically in the same continuity as TAS and Justice League)
    Phantasm is basically "Year One" with respect to the DCAU. So that one would be "before TAS" as it were.
    Sub-Zero is (timeline wise) in the timeskip before Tim Drake became Robin (good as a Victor Fries story, but kind of meh overall)
    Mystery of the Batwoman (kind of skippable, is one of the weakest movies). This one's timeline is not 100% obvious, but probably after the aforementioned timeskip.
    Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker (my favorite Bat-movie because it truly shows Terry becoming Batman, and Bruce stepping down. comes after Batman Beyond)

    Other Movies
    Under the Red Hood (technically this might come after Young Justice becuase it is the same guy voicing Bats, but this is really on its own. Pretty much ties with Phantasm as my second favorite Bat-movie)
    Year One (this is the Batman origin story)
    Last edited by sabrage; 17-07-2012 at 10:57 PM.

  2. #2
    Lesser Hivemind Node Timofee's Avatar
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    Apologies I don't feel I can contribute anything constructive but since this is doing the rounds...


  3. #3
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    I rewatched Batman Beyond the other month, and it still ages surprisingly well. Yeah, you'll laugh endlessly at the slang, but it worked. Mostly because it was never meant to be "Batman in the future" but was always "Batman training his successor". It is really nice to watch Terry (Will Friedle voice acted his ass off) transition from the traumatized punk in the pilot to Batman (as of Return of the Joker).

    There is a reason that one of the fan nicknames for him is "The Batman of Hope".

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    Lesser Hivemind Node Leopig's Avatar
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    Think I will pass on this. Never been a huge fan of Batman. Loved the Avengers though. Batman is just all emo, self-indulgent ,pretentious brooding crap.
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  5. #5
    Lesser Hivemind Node fiddlesticks's Avatar
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    The best Batman film was clearly Batman Returns. I present exhibit A.

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    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Drake Sigar's Avatar
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    Rewatching the 90s animated series recently gave me a new appreciation for the art style, and Mark Hamill will always be my definitive Joker.

    Shame you didn't get into Justice League, it was a great show. There was such respect in the writing for all the characters, and perhaps a bit of Batman-worship going on.

    Last edited by Drake Sigar; 18-07-2012 at 12:12 AM.

  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Ravelle's Avatar
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    I''m a huge Batman nut and I started at the Hush story Arc, it's the only DC comic series I read.

    As for animations, I've never really followed the animated series or Batman Forver. Mostly just caught some random episodes now and then. The movies are okay but since I read the comics I know the plot already and it's basically for people not wanting to read.
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  8. #8
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ravelle View Post
    I''m a huge Batman nut and I started at the Hush story Arc, it's the only DC comic series I read.

    As for animations, I've never really followed the animated series or Batman Forver. Mostly just caught some random episodes now and then. The movies are okay but since I read the comics I know the plot already and it's basically for people not wanting to read.
    Give the first season or two of TAS a shot. A lot of the comics have actually been influenced by those episodes, and they are remarkably well done.

    Also, Under the Red Hood provides a MUCH more streamlined version of the associated stories and it greatly benefits from it. Between that and the recent Red Hood books (before the DCnU with Skankfire), I actually give a crap about Jason Todd now. I NEVER thought that would happen :p

  9. #9
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    Batman: TAS, including the reduced art style New Batman Adventures, is still one of my all-time favorite cartoons. I own the "complete" set that came in the big-ass box with a slipcover, and I've rewatched the entire run at least once a year. Everything about the series was just great, from the voice acting to the storylines. Sure, there were episodes that were lacking, but every show has that. Mark Hamill will always be my favorite Joker and Kevin Conroy will always be my favorite Batman because of this series and how well they did their jobs. Plus, TAS introduced us to Harley Quinn, which gives it a major leg up, in my opinion. I was also a great fan of Batman Beyond and Justice League/JLU. They kept a lot of the voice cast from previous outings, and the overall quality was just as good as it had always been. I guess it makes sense considering that they're both still placed well within the Bruce Timm-Paul Dini universe.

    I hated The Batman, mainly because of the character redesigns. I also didn't quite care for the voices that they were using. But I'm somewhat happy with Batman: The Brave and the Bold. It's not as good as TAS, but it's got its moments and I've warmed up to it over time. Under the Red Hood was a great Batman movie, and while I wish they would have gotten Conroy and Hamill to reprise their roles I didn't think that the guy who played Batman was too bad. John Di Maggio actually pulled off a good Joker by my reckoning. It wasn't as manic as Hamill's, but he had a certain dryness in the way he did the voice that made him come off as a lot more sinister and calculating.

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    Lesser Hivemind Node icupnimpn2's Avatar
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    Batman: The Brave and the Bold is quite entertaining. Had a great mix of humor and guest superheroes, including some of the more esoteric parts of DC's repertoire. It has its roots in the live action show and Superfriends.


  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Ravelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundato View Post
    Give the first season or two of TAS a shot. A lot of the comics have actually been influenced by those episodes, and they are remarkably well done.

    Also, Under the Red Hood provides a MUCH more streamlined version of the associated stories and it greatly benefits from it. Between that and the recent Red Hood books (before the DCnU with Skankfire), I actually give a crap about Jason Todd now. I NEVER thought that would happen :p
    I did a a while ago but the first season consists of a villain introduction each episode, at what episode does the series turn in to an actual series?
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    I like the one where he hangs upsidedown and broods about having no parents.

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    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Voon's Avatar
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    I really wished that I could watch Return of the Joker again. It's the best thing that came out of the Beyond series and of course, Hamill's there.
    I always loved this part of that movie

    It's the only time that I think Batman would just outright kill Joker, and the whole part of this is pretty much done in a genuinely dark, creepy way.

    OTT, got my hands on the odd The Doom That Came to Gotham Elseworlds comic by Mignola and it's an interesting story, for one. Didn't really feel the 'wow' factor in this but it's a good page-turner. Bonus points for Lovecraftian horrors
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    Quote Originally Posted by icupnimpn2 View Post
    Batman: The Brave and the Bold is quite entertaining. Had a great mix of humor and guest superheroes, including some of the more esoteric parts of DC's repertoire. It has its roots in the live action show and Superfriends.
    Outrageous!

    As a comic book reader from an early age who had access to all of his dad's comics from the 70s onwards, I love Brave and the Bold. A fanboys dream and a bloody funny show even without the nods to old canon.

    I just remembered how amazingly good it was watching a minute of that 'I'm Batman' supercut. Darling I don't have to answer to you, I'm Batman [actually Batwoman in Batman's body]

    Still TAS is the definitive one as far as any true fan is concerned. Every minute of JLU with Batman is also great - particularly the one where the Injustice Gang capture him and he plays them all off against each other.

  16. #16
    my dad and i just bought the Dark Knight on Dvd and Blu-ray yesterday.

  17. #17
    Lesser Hivemind Node Leopig's Avatar
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    On dvd AND bluray? whats the point of that?
    If graphics are not important why spend so much on a GPU?

  18. #18
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Lambchops's Avatar
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    On Betamax and VHS!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leopig View Post
    On dvd AND bluray? whats the point of that?
    My guess is that it was one of those bundle deals that I've seen them start doing now. Kind of like how they're tacking on shitty "digital copies" that are really just you streaming from their crap-ass, PC-only, have to install garbage software first, service. But the DVD/Bluray combos are actually handy, unlike the crap digital copies. It makes it so you can drag a copy to someone else's house if they don't have a Bluray player, or take it on a road trip for the kids to watch in the car. I've never seen a portable Bluray player, but there are tons of portable DVD players out there, and a lot of "family" cars, like minivans, have been putting them in the back seat for a few years now.

  20. #20
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus gundato's Avatar
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    Now that I have seen movie Batman, I can come back here

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravelle View Post
    I did a a while ago but the first season consists of a villain introduction each episode, at what episode does the series turn in to an actual series?
    Define "actual series". I guess when they start recycling villains? Wiki suggests around episode 7 or so.

    But one of the things that made TAS so great WAS the villains. In the early seasons, Batman really was secondary. If your heart doesn't break during Two-Face's introduction, you are a bad person. And if you aren't moved to tears by Robin's Reckoning, you have no soul.

    Honestly, most of the robin-centric episodes were surprisingly good. Robin's Reckoning for one (Dick remembers becoming Robin as he tracks down Tony Zucco), the episode where Tim Drake goes up against Clayface ("Sometimes, there are no happy endings"), and the episode where Dick becomes Nightwing all spring to mind as REALLY good.

    Plus, just about any episode that examined Harley Quinn. Joker was played pretty slapstick for TAS, but holy crap was he a monster. When one of my friends was complaining that Return of the Joker was out of character and "too mean" for Joker, I basically sat them down and made them watch how he treated Harley. Needless to say, it is VERY believable that he would torture and mutilate a little boy.
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