Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1
    Network Hub Gwilym's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    165

    Hotline Miami's story/ending

    I'm making this a new thread, since I didn't want the old one to suddenly fill up with spoiler-marked text. Like Alec's review says, I'm not entirely sure how well the story stands up to scrutiny, but I think it'll at least handle discussion.

    I don't have time to do a proper opening post, so let's just paste what I was going to say in the other thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by LowKey View Post
    Just need to throw the trophy at her then bash her head in
    I'm absolutely convinced this sequence was engineered to make us watch this bit over and over. Being forced to suddenly apply our gratuitous thrill killing to cats and scantily clad women is pretty shocking, then the bad guy robs you of your satisfaction when you finally beat him, then the old guy points out that after so many horrible things the story doesn't really matter anymore, then you get stripped of even the illusion of vengeful agency. I think it's quite brilliant, and much better than the actual ending, which seems to basically be just a bathetic version of the one in Spec Ops: The Line. The secret ending improves it somewhat, since the writing is genuinely clever and funny, but it's still got a smarmy tone to it that grates somewhat.

    Discuss! I'm sure plenty of us have Thoughts. Despite being one of the most visceral games ever, causing Thoughts is something HLM is surprisingly good at.

  2. #2
    Network Hub sendmark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    284
    I thought the ending does fit the overall feel of the game. I heard there is story DLC on the way though.

  3. #3
    Lesser Hivemind Node TailSwallower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cold Toast, Straya
    Posts
    735
    I really enjoyed the twist to the main story and genuinely felt like some fuckers had to die for killing my girlfriend(?), but I'm a bit hazy on how we found out it was that guy who needed to die, or even what his involvement was considering the story that unfolds with Cleaver (or Helmet, pick whichever name you like).

    'Cause, Maskface goes and kills everyone in the panther lair and is satisfied, but Cleaver winds up somewhere totally different. Weren't we trying to track down the ringleaders/people-that-were-sending-us-out-on-killing-sprees in both cases? If so, how did we end up in two totally different locations?

    I loved the fact that we (as Cleaver) had to kill ourselves (as Maskface) to proceed. I killed him first go, which is fitting 'cause when the tables were turned it took me at least 10 tries to kill Cleaver.

    And yeah, I actually preferred the Cleaver ending sans password. It seems to fit better with what Richard and Co were saying in those cutscenes. The password ending seemed like the boring story that would have driven the whole game if it was a mainstream title. Maybe that was the whole point, or maybe I missed something.

    Also, did anyone else not kill the 2 ringleaders in the sewer? Now I'm wondering who else through the course of the game you could have spared.
    weekendwarrio.rs - We've got more games than time...

  4. #4
    Lesser Hivemind Node agentorange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    608
    Quote Originally Posted by TailSwallower View Post
    Also, did anyone else not kill the 2 ringleaders in the sewer? Now I'm wondering who else through the course of the game you could have spared.
    You don't need to kill any of the people in the telephone company as The Biker.

    The Jacket fucks up, and is led astray by the information in the police station, which points him to the Russian mafia - when in reality the culprits are the two dudes in the sewers who are trying to eliminate the Russian mafia. The Biker finds out the truth only in the alternate timeline because he has enough time investigate the records at the phone company, which he wasn't able to do when The Jacket kills him in the real timeline.

    Personally I think the story is too silly, and the entire thing would have worked better if they just cut out the two guys in the sewer and all the political motivation bullshit.

  5. #5
    Lesser Hivemind Node TailSwallower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cold Toast, Straya
    Posts
    735
    Hahaha, I killed everyone at the phone company because I knew they were supposed to die. See! That's what the game should have stayed focused on - fucked up gamer mentality, not the (as you say) political motivation bullshit.
    weekendwarrio.rs - We've got more games than time...

  6. #6
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Drake Sigar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Jolly Ole England
    Posts
    3,166
    Quote Originally Posted by TailSwallower View Post
    Hahaha, I killed everyone at the phone company because I knew they were supposed to die.
    Me too. Nobody can pin this shit on me, I was just following the universe's orders. If I didn't, it would probably explode or something.
    Last edited by Drake Sigar; 01-11-2012 at 10:29 AM.

  7. #7
    Activated Node
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    33
    It has a story? has yes i do like it, im so waiting to buy a better gaming pc so i can play some better stuff on Steam!!

  8. #8
    Activated Node BathroomCitizen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    99
    Quote Originally Posted by agentorange View Post
    You don't need to kill any of the people in the telephone company as The Biker.

    The Jacket fucks up, and is led astray by the information in the police station, which points him to the Russian mafia - when in reality the culprits are the two dudes in the sewers who are trying to eliminate the Russian mafia. The Biker finds out the truth only in the alternate timeline because he has enough time investigate the records at the phone company, which he wasn't able to do when The Jacket kills him in the real timeline.

    Personally I think the story is too silly, and the entire thing would have worked better if they just cut out the two guys in the sewer and all the political motivation bullshit.
    Yes, that's my version too. The Jacket followed the wrong trail, so he ended up killing the wrong people!

    Although, I did like the ending. I think that the idea of the two guys in the sewer—which are the representation of the two devs pulling a meta-joke on us gamers—is quite brilliant, and makes you think a bit about the violence in videogames. As they said, it was all just a game.

    This, with the basic ending. The political/secret ending I think it's just superfluous stuff that we could even do without.

  9. #9
    Network Hub Gwilym's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    165
    I actually think the biker's part is the 'true' timeline, not an alternate one. There's that bit in mask's story where beardguy* says "all of this is not happening" before pointing to the biker's corpse and adding "that did not happen." Could just be more this is a computer game schtick, but he also says how something really terrible has happened the night biker dies (the biker seems to take it pretty hard too). Biker must play an important figure in the prophecy I have decided now exists within the game

    *who is absolutely my flatmate

  10. #10
    Activated Node BathroomCitizen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    99
    On a different note, I'm a bit surprised that the RPS chums totally passed over Hotline Miami's story. I personally find it pretty cool, and i'd wish more games used this 'unreliable perspective' of the main character.

  11. #11
    Activated Node
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    37
    Quote Originally Posted by Gwilym View Post
    I actually think the biker's part is the 'true' timeline, not an alternate one. There's that bit in mask's story where beardguy* says "all of this is not happening" before pointing to the biker's corpse and adding "that did not happen." Could just be more this is a computer game schtick, but he also says how something really terrible has happened the night biker dies (the biker seems to take it pretty hard too). Biker must play an important figure in the prophecy I have decided now exists within the game

    *who is absolutely my flatmate
    Just finished it, this was my interpretation at first as well. However, the murder of your gf and everything is after you kill the biker I think, so it doesn't totally add up, because there the game implies it was all a bit of a coma-dream/memory. I think it now more likely that the biker timeline is the 'what-if' scenario if they would just listen to each other and not start murdering immediately, since they wanted the exact same thing. And that of course points to the theme of 'it is just a game' again.

    Not the first game to question our reasons of following game-orders blindly, but pretty well executed and a lot of fun :)

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by BathroomCitizen View Post
    On a different note, I'm a bit surprised that the RPS chums totally passed over Hotline Miami's story. I personally find it pretty cool, and i'd wish more games used this 'unreliable perspective' of the main character.
    We intentionally avoided spoilers in the verdict. I think the story is fascinating though.

  13. #13
    Activated Node
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    39
    I thought it was obvious (to someone who was waiting for this game for months), but perhaps not, the 2 guys in the sewer are Dennis Wedin and Jonatan Soderstrom who made the game. They taunt you for taking delight in playing a violent game. This has to have been mentioned elsewhere!

    Not a fan of that to be honest, I think authors should stay out of their own work. Post modern meta-ness is a bit played out in my opinion, and ultimately detracts from the wholeness of the piece of art. Like Martin Amis sticking himself into the text of his own work, it's just a bit wank (literally, taking pleasure from himself). It stops the work being its own universe and becomes a transparent comment on 'art itself'. It's been done and it was never really needed because art is already a comment on art without announcing 'by the way, this is a comment on art'. Impressionism already drew attention to artifice without a sign pointing to it.

    It's like watching a play and having the actors wink at you... as Shawn Michaels said about kayfabe in wrestling once.

  14. #14
    Network Hub Gwilym's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    165
    Quote Originally Posted by DickSocrates View Post
    I thought it was obvious (to someone who was waiting for this game for months), but perhaps not, the 2 guys in the sewer are Dennis Wedin and Jonatan Soderstrom who made the game. They taunt you for taking delight in playing a violent game. This has to have been mentioned elsewhere!
    I've taken this as a given when talking about the story - I hadn't noticed that nobody has actually said it! The game really hands it to you, though. It's not very ambiguous.

    I largely agree with your take on artist-insertion*, although I'd say what you describe is more of a risk than a direct effect, and I'd also argue that in the medium of games it's far from having been played out - the format provides a whole new palette of possibilities for what you can do with it. This particular game though, for all I love about its narrative, uses this particular tool pretty badly. It's the sole cause of the ending's bathos, and it doesn't really add anything to make up for it. It shouldn't have been saved as a last-minute twist, I think that's the problem.

    *get it? because self-love**

    **get it? because this joke-explaining footnote is a meta-commentary on your commentary about meta-commentaries

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •