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  1. #1061
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RIDEBIRD View Post
    Yeah sure, yesterdays procedure was good, but after the no to split I really didn't want any more attention/cause more delays/be more troublesome. Your proposed process a la xing up and just setting up so people can hop on if they want to seems pretty much perfect.
    This.

    I think an issue arised last night when myself and others said "fine, Alpha and BRavo can split, we'll just stick in one channel" or something similar to that effect.

    What wasn't clear in our channels is that alpha & bravo had people in it that didn't want to split into squad comms.

    The eventual solution of recalling to warpgate and getting everyone into the same channel and then splitting those off who wanted to be split off into squads worked very well.


    It makes sense to be rolling an Alpha channel, a Bravo channel and then a joined Charlie and Delta channel from now on. That covers all bases (it seems the 24-sized channel is still too big for many) and fits the fact that we often don;t have 4 full squds, so charlie and delta channel is more likely to be 18-20 players not 24.

    If that makes sense, we'll head in that direction.
    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  2. #1062
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jesus_Phish View Post
    I think we're too open to all comers and don't have the right level of power structure in place to pull that off.
    This.

    Moreover, DWG sprung out of a comeptitive FPS gaming group that pre-existed. They have these structures in place. They are also (from what I hear) incredible task masters with an exceptionally specific playstyle requirements for their players. They also don't seem to care for shit about the strategic level and will hold onto Peris Amp for four hours when there's no reason to, simply because it provides the "on the ground" fight they want...
    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  3. #1063
    Activated Node Kyndylan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by laldy View Post
    Being totally silent on comms, no matter whether in 1 big channel or in "tactical/ strategic" set ups is counter-productive ... Besides which, when almost everyone is silent it's bloody boring.
    I'm probably guilty of being rather silent most of the time - it just comes naturally! I'll try and get better, particularly at informational call outs and suchlike. I'm afraid I'll never be the most banterous voice on Mumble...
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  4. #1064
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Boris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrEclectic View Post
    Hm, I can see the problem now...

    It is miscommunication. No, tactical/StratGir/whatever is not super-serious, or militaristic, or whatever. We are not such people. It's just a bit more focused and a lot more cooperative. And you don't have to obey to the Obersturmfuehrer or whatever. People take the initiative, make suggestions.
    Actually, you do. If you do not want to listen to the "Obersturmführer", you kinda should leave the platoon or just offer to be platoon leader yourself. If you join the platoon with no intention of following waypoints and disregarding objectives, please just don't join Strat.

    We are indeed not super militaristic and we don't expect blind obedience, but you are joining a team and teamplay is expected, just like in any other team game/sport.

  5. #1065
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyndylan View Post
    I'm afraid I'll never be the most banterous voice on Mumble...
    Probably just as well.

    Can you imagine even 12-man comms if everyone was like me, Gribble or Eclectic?

  6. #1066
    Activated Node Frengler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyndylan View Post
    I'm probably guilty of being rather silent most of the time - it just comes naturally! I'll try and get better, particularly at informational call outs and suchlike. I'm afraid I'll never be the most banterous voice on Mumble...
    You're not the only one - I have a bad habit of staying silent after a while but smaller channels will definitely help me. Also getting better and more used to the game will as well. But yeah, we have some very... talkative people
    "Time is a companion, travelling with us on the journey of life, to remind us to cherish each moment as it will never come again. What we leave behind is not as important as how we lived."

  7. #1067
    Activated Node Kyndylan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris View Post
    Actually, you do. If you do not want to listen to the "Obersturmführer", you kinda should leave the platoon or just offer to be platoon leader yourself. If you join the platoon with no intention of following waypoints and disregarding objectives, please just don't join Strat.

    We are indeed not super militaristic and we don't expect blind obedience, but you are joining a team and teamplay is expected, just like in any other team game/sport.
    On the whole I agree with this. But given what seems to be the RPS style of play, I'd hope this doesn't become an issue too much. Orders are fairly general ("assault this place" or "defend this building"). That leaves a lot of scope for individuals to decide what approach to take.

    Since that flexibility exists, you'd expect that it wouldn't be too much to ask for people to follow directions, and, on the occasion that they're very specific, to follow along in the knowledge that before too long you'll get some of your freedom back.
    As more experience RPSers - is gross insubordination often a problem?
    Last edited by Kyndylan; 09-04-2013 at 04:19 PM. Reason: Clarity
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  8. #1068
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyndylan View Post
    As more experience RPSers - is gross insubordination often a problem?
    not typically. there's been lots of bickering about comms and different styles, but generally this part hasn't been much of a problem. used to be worse in the beginning when we had a lot more backseatleading. i'm really rather glad that this is pretty much under control now.

  9. #1069
    Network Hub Orius's Avatar
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    Not often, no, but it has happened. Usually not in any large scale either, mainly a few inattentive stragglers.

  10. #1070
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Boris's Avatar
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    No, it isn't a problem. And yeah, you're given quite free reign over how you tackle an objective. Also, we understand if you're on another continent and can't join the one we're on because it's full, or the game spawned you 500 meters off for some reason, or whatever.

    I just don't like the suggestion that you can just do whatever you want. In strat, if the PL calls for a recall to warpgate, you'd better be in that gate within a minute. If they want you to get in a bus, be in the bus. Not doing what you're told results in the other 11 people in your squad not having as much fun as they could have, and it's just downright rude to keep people waiting.

    If you can't handle that you're sometimes told what to do in a certain timeframe, don't join Stratgir.

  11. #1071
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    I think we once ever had to kick someone for being a jerk. Other than that nobody ever really indirectly goes out of their way to disobey orders or think their idea is better. It's been well drilled into most people not to question the SL or PL while they are leading, to leave it until after the night and to respect their efforts.
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  12. #1072
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris View Post
    Actually, you do. If you do not want to listen to the "Obersturmführer", you kinda should leave the platoon or just offer to be platoon leader yourself. If you join the platoon with no intention of following waypoints and disregarding objectives, please just don't join Strat.

    We are indeed not super militaristic and we don't expect blind obedience, but you are joining a team and teamplay is expected, just like in any other team game/sport.
    Boris is right, and I phrased my self badly. You do have to follow orders. But, if you come up with a good idea, and present it in a timely and concise manner, as to not confuse, delay or interrupt the function of the unit, you can and in fact should do that. Also, taking initiative is also encouraged. If for instance we are flanking from the right, but you're a Light Assault and can find a position overlooking the objective, do so. Just inform the rest of the squad. In the same scenario, if you spot a better approach, again inform the SL. He'll evaluate and act accordingly. Most often he'll go with that, unless he had something specific in mind. He won't disregard you, but debate interrupts the flow of the game and the enjoyment of the rest of the unit.
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 09-04-2013 at 05:03 PM.

  13. #1073
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Well, it did happen in the call to arms platoon I led last time. This one guy was in bravo squad apparently raising all hell for Ridebird (SL), questioning my judgement etc. When told to stop bothering Ridebird, he came over to the alpha channel and started shouting about how this last half hour had been a monumental waste of time and that we needed a change in leadership. He wasn't greeted with many pleasantries for that and left soon after. It's happened a few times before and since, that someone has questioned the current leadership, whoever that was, asking for votes of no confidence basically. All of them have been booed out and none persisted for get long.

    in any group of people his large, there are sure to be a few who just don't how things are done. I'd say we've had very little trouble for the amount of people we've processed.

  14. #1074
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrEclectic View Post
    Boris is right, and I phrased my self badly. You do have to follow orders. But, if you come up with a good idea, and present it in a timely and concise manner, as to not confuse, delay or interrupt the function of the unit, you can and in fact should do that. Also, taking initiative is also encouraged. If for instance we are flanking from the right, but you're a Light Assault and can find a position overlooking the objective, do so. Just inform the rest of the squad.
    This is very good advice! Just be respectful and your suggestions will be met with respect in turn. "Suggest we go for that enemy Sundy north of the tower?", "Could I suggest that half if the squad flank around to the west to hit from two fronts?"

  15. #1075
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Yeah suggest things, and in tactical you do follow orders and are swift with redeploys and such. If that does not fit you, get in the joined channel.

    Cooper, to be clear, I guess you meant we smack Alpha+Bravo together and then Charlie and Delta are each seperate squads..? Like I wrote that is. Your post now says something else. Or basically 24+12+12 regardless of which squads are in there? I think PL should sit in 24 channel and be sort of direct with those 24 in leading, and then PL can direct other tasks to either charlie or delta. That's why I want A+B together, as well as that's generally where new players come in.

    By the way, we should have recruitment up for all squads on all days now!! This needs to be done.

    Out of the 13 that responded to the survey 92% prefered what shall henceforth be known as Compromise Comms, meaning A+B as one, C and D as seperate tactical squads.
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  16. #1076
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    The issue with keep A+B together and splitting C and D is that C and D are often the squads that are not full. So instead of 24+12+12 you'll have something more like 24+10+8

    It seems to make more sense to have 12+12+18...
    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  17. #1077
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    The issue with keep A+B together and splitting C and D is that C and D are often the squads that are not full. So instead of 24+12+12 you'll have something more like 24+10+8

    It seems to make more sense to have 12+12+18...
    But, nobody said A and B have to be full before going into C and D?

    You can have 14 across A and B and then continue to fill that up if C and D are full of people wanting tactical and quieter comms.
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  18. #1078
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    Surely C and D are full of however many people want to be in them (and if there aren't many then just have C), since this is about offering the choice of squad vs group comms?

    EDIT: Cross posted... what Jesus_Phish said.
    Last edited by LordKiwi; 09-04-2013 at 06:01 PM.

  19. #1079
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    I am confused. C & D will be full with however many people want to play that way. If that is 12+12, cool, if it is like last night 10+8, cool. No one shall be forced to play either way.
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  20. #1080
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus The JG Man's Avatar
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    With it being ad-hoc you're rarely going to have the perfect scenario of a perfect split between AB and CD, where CD are full. Despite that, yesterday seemed to work pretty well, even when some people were logging off. A tight squad is a tight squad and whilst having 4 people might not be enough, the difference between 10 and 11 is much smaller than going from 4 to 5. After a certain point, the value of an extra person decreases with the more of them there already are.

    If there's enough to warrant the split, there's enough to do it. I don't see the problem there.
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