Page 1 of 219 1231151101 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 4384

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sweden (Göteborg)
    Posts
    2,876

    Discussion: the state of the game

    This guy here has quite a lot to say on the state of the game:
    http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/i...ee-them.73820/

    Do you agree?

    (I'd like for this not to devolve into a whinefest, because there are enough of those on the public PS2 forums anyway, but some nuanced discussion and constructive critique would be fun.)

  2. #2
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    1,001
    Yeah, I pretty much totally agree on all points.. Read the whole thing. I still think PS2 is an excellent game, but he pinpoints everything that will make or break PS2 in the long term - ghostcapping and cert/KDR-stuff especially.

    Just his proposed ghostcapping solution would probably fix the current biggest problem with the game.

  3. #3
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    1,094
    I like the KDR point, because it indeed reinforces playing behaviours that are dissonant with what this game aims to become.

    As for the rest, I don't know. I feel really fortunate playing with you, guys, because I haven't experienced or at least had my game ruined by what that very vocal group of whiners keep whining about. The "Giraffe of Awesome" thread lists many of the reasons why I enjoy playing this game.

    On a side note, I've never played an MMO before, and this is the first FPS I've played in over a decade, besides Borderlands 1/2 (which are a lot more forgiving). I tried to dabble in BF3 (only because it came with my graphics card), but it just didn't make sense to me. And I couldn't stand the militaristic jingoism.

    So, with those credentials (or lack thereof), I think that PS2 is all about emergent gameplay. And, something that a lot of those threads miss, because most are started by lone wolfs (without even the accompanying cub), is that half the gameplay lies in the coms. Either the urgent cry "Sundy to the left" or "Inf coming over the ridge to the NW of the point", or Oak for example just taking the piss (fully certed at that) , it is a core element that is often overlooked.

    tl;dr: Oak is OP!
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 03-01-2013 at 12:07 PM.

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,093
    There are threads like this on official forums daily. Why did you pick this one in particular?

    Anyway, I am not going to write an essay here, so I'll just address the KDR argument.

    Removing KDR achieves nothing. I know this because I am a KDR whore and I play(ed?) Tribes: Ascend where it has been removed as a statistic. I simply Tab at the end of the match and compare my kills and deaths. And even if that was removed too, I would still know how "well" I did just by playing the game. I wouldn't know my exact stats, but I would still know if I died a lot or not.

    That said, KDR whoring isn't a problem in Planetside 2 for two reasons.

    One, death is meaningful. The respawn timer is sufficiently long(what is it, 15 seconds total to Sunderer? 20 to any other facility?) and the logistics of getting back to the battle are realistic enough(read: it takes time, even if your spawn point is near the battle itself) that killing an enemy puts him out of combat for long enough to make a difference to your team. Compare that with Tribes: Ascend where death timer is five seconds, and the ease to get to high speeds combined with mostly small map sizes usually means you can be back at your corpse in ten seconds flat. This problem simply doesn't exist in Planetside 2, and players with high KDR are actively helping their team by giving it numerical advantage.

    Two, because KDR whoring is extremely rare. Significant majority of players just don't care about their KDR ratio, as evidenced by them walking into the same corridor spammed with rockets again and again and again. Or hiding behind the same rock, despite the location being spammed with rockets, again and again and again. Do not mistake people who farm - which is a way to get XP - with KDR whores; they might seem similar, but they're not(Basically, people who just want to farm XP don't care when they die, and people who want to get high KDR do).

  5. #5
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Vienna, Austria
    Posts
    5,039
    - I dislike KDR, as I never use it at all.
    - I dont mind ghostcapping, but I do agree that it should scale with more people there defending.
    - Influence should be important. I like the way influence works now, that even if you cut someone off thats defending, they can still successfull hold a point till their connection reestablishes.
    - I dont think vehicles are overpowered, but I think the resource system is largely underused.
    - I like being infantry.
    - I agree that all certs should be spent on all classes, but I assume they want to promote class specialisation, but instead, it breeds mmo grindyness. could be, I dont play enough for this to be an issue, apparently.
    - Tom De Roeck.

    monochrom & verse publications

    "Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it."

  6. #6
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    1,094
    Quote Originally Posted by QuantaCat View Post
    - I agree that all certs should be spent on all classes, but I assume they want to promote class specialisation, but instead, it breeds mmo grindyness. could be, I dont play enough for this to be an issue, apparently.
    Especially about this point, it's been only one month for most of us, but I've already progressed a lot at my main classes and vehicles, and also spent CPs at classes and vehicles that I only occasionally use, just as a back up for the outfit. I think that any way to cert faster, or share certs among classes, would diminish somewhat the longevity of the game, and make the gap between new players (that are essential to keep the game going) and older ones even greater. It does feel grindy sometimes, but on the other hand, within a month almost everyone has a decently upgraded main vehicle and a couple of specialized classes.
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 03-01-2013 at 12:52 PM.

  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    1,094
    On a side note, here is Malorn's Manifesto:
    http://www.ps2.riptidegaming.com/?p=22

    He is apparently a PS1 veteran, and an influential one at that. It is a long read (I just skimmed through it), but it does raise a lot of interesting points about gameplay balance and design philosophy.

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,093
    Quote Originally Posted by MrEclectic View Post
    On a side note, here is Malorn's Manifesto:
    http://www.ps2.riptidegaming.com/?p=22

    He is apparently a PS1 veteran, and an influential one at that. It is a long read (I just skimmed through it), but it does raise a lot of interesting points about gameplay balance and design philosophy.
    A highly amusing read too, since I'm just going over his "pillars of PS1 design" and thinking to myself "this is not in PS2... this is not in PS2... this is not in PS2... this is in PS2 but only in the negative aspect..." and so on.

  9. #9
    Lesser Hivemind Node Feldspar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    634
    I think the main point missed out on that first post (didn't read down the thread, I suffer from allergies to official forums) is fun.

    What I see there is "the most efficient way to play the game", "the best way to play the game", the only way to play the game" and not "I have the most fun playing when...". It seems the point of the game is to earn certs. I'm sorry, but I play the game to fill time and have a bit of fun riding about in vehicles and shooting people on foot with like-minded people, oh, and die a lot.

    I don't care about grinding, once I find myself doing that I get bored fast. KDR? I do look at it to laugh at how badly I'm doing.

    As for base defenses, yes, I'm sure there's some balancing that could be done there, but with care, slowing down base assaults and defenses also could slow down the fun, basing the amount of XP giving on how hard the base was fought over might actually be a good idea.

    I'm certain there a lot of people who take the game far more seriously than me, I'm a patient person who can wait until he unlocks the new toys and probably won't specialise heavily in anything.

  10. #10
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    1,001
    BuzzCuts post was probably posted since he is the leader of the arguably biggest and also most disciplined outfit in PS2, as well as his entire post was well written and very rage-free (also 90% of the official forums is OMG PAY2WIN!1111!!).

    One thing I noticed now that I don't agree with is the infantry part - I don't think vehicles are that OP. Infantry is effective, fun and racks in kills as well. Regarding the KDR I think many people don't mind it, but it's pretty obvious FPS skills matter way more then tactics regarding cert gain. I think that's a problem that he addresses nicely, even though he might focus on the KDR a bit much.

    Regarding fun, I think PS2 is the most fun I've had in a game in a very long time. That being said, if you are as BuzzCut, and to a lesser extent like me, fun is winning and being effective. I don't really enjoy games if I lose or if I'm bad at them for playing a specific way. If there's then a specific way to maximize effectivness and personally "winning" that actively encourages people not to fight tactically (like camping a sundy instead of destroying it), there's a problem.

    XP should be made much more dynamic. If there's a sundy that's spawning tons of infantry constantly, make it so that you get more XP for destroying it then farming it for a minute or so. Every sundy should not be 5000 xp, but the one's that are extremely crucial and valuable should be. Dynamic XP and the mission system in that way would help so goddamn much to encourage people to fight and not farm.

  11. #11
    Lesser Hivemind Node apricotsoup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    960
    I agree with a surprisingly (for me) large part of this.

    I wouldn't say vehicles are necessarily overpowered but there are specialisation problems between various different sources. Anti air in general is largely only effective against air (it can get kills on others and I have numerous infantry kills with my burster max but it's far far less effective than an anti-infantry weapon) compared to something like rocket-pods which are hugely effective against all targets and HE rounds which obliterate infantry and aren't that noticeably worse against armour than more specialised sources.

    Sorting out some of that along with the dynamic xp ideas are a good way of keeping me interested :3

  12. #12