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  1. #3141
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bankrotas View Post
    So... They are nerfing C85 modified...

    Thanks to Fredfred (Kittenrainbow) for warning NC :/
    PTS

    Live


    Comparison with Renegade:
    According to reddit:
    Quote Originally Posted by Stats changes
    180 RPM -> 120 RMP
    225 m/s -> 400 m/s
    150/40m/125/100m -> 135/10m/70/40m
    5 round mag -> 8 round mag
    8 pellets -> 12 pellets
    So a buff probably, although you'd have to try it to know for sure. Still think it needs a magazine more like 20 rounds to really work. Also, you want to know about pellet spread and COF bloom.

  2. #3142
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bankrotas View Post
    So... They are nerfing C85 modified...
    Can't be. I mean, they're nerfing the Modified?! Probably one of the worst weapons in the game?! That Modified?!

    The Vortex is also nerfed on the PTS. Thing is though, they've specifically said that Vortex will get a buff, and that they're doing a balance pass on vehicle secondaries, so probably that would mean that the Modified would receive one as well. So perhaps these tweaks are just intermediary steps: set some base values, and work from there, before releasing the update.

    Hm, judging from the numbers though, it's more of a slight buff. They've stated though that they're reducing the effective range of AI secondaries. So, it's a minor buff to the Modified, combined with a general nerf on AI secondaries. End result must feel underwhelming to the NC.
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 10-12-2013 at 11:07 AM.

  3. #3143
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Bankrotas's Avatar
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    CoF is 1.33 near pellet ammount. Damage range nerfed, max damage buffed by 33%, min damage nerfed by 44%. Would you really put something like this on a tank?
    Just a reminder ye olde C85 had almost 3k damage per shot.
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  4. #3144
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bankrotas View Post
    CoF is 1.33 near pellet ammount. Damage range nerfed, max damage buffed by 33%, min damage nerfed by 44%. Would you really put something like this on a tank?
    Just a reminder ye olde C85 had almost 3k damage per shot.
    As I wrote in my edited reply, they've stated that one of their goals in this balance pass is to reduce the effective range of all AI secondaries. So you get a small buff to its damage, along with the significant nerf to range effectiveness we all get. It's just that the Modified has always been terrible, so the end result is still underwhelming. Let's see the numbers for the rest of the AI secondaries, and compare the new Modified to those.

  5. #3145
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Bankrotas's Avatar
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    Thing is a shotgun, how the hell can it be good at range? I use it once. You have to be lucky to get 1h kill at 25 meters.
    And what's the point of buffing it's velocity, if weapons is rendered useful only under 50 meters?

    Edit: Once it drops under 83 dmg per pellet, it loses any 1 hit kill ability. so around 24 meters PTS modified loses it's OHK, while current one retains it to 40 meters. Not like you'll hit that many pellets even with such small CoF.
    Last edited by Bankrotas; 10-12-2013 at 12:51 PM.
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  6. #3146
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    http://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/c...speed_changes/

    so ... ZOE's due to be killed completely. good news is that the invested certs will be refunded. Rejoice, NC and TR .... and now fucking buff the magrider.

  7. #3147
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cephas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qaz View Post
    http://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/c...speed_changes/

    so ... ZOE's due to be killed completely. good news is that the invested certs will be refunded. Rejoice, NC and TR .... and now fucking buff the magrider.
    Euch. I get the merits of it, but that's too harsh. ZOE is now useless in anything but CQC (meaning the one reason I used it - AA - no longer exists).

    Since people tend to have it on ALL the time it's going to make CQC a complete pain. I think it'll still have some situational merits though.

    Edit: Not sure about cert refunding. It seems like a slippery slope. I'd maybe reduce the cert cost and refund the difference for people.

  8. #3148
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Dominicus's Avatar
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    ZOE is now useless in anything but CQC
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  9. #3149
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus WallyTrooper's Avatar
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    I'm more annoyed with this nerf than I thought I'd be. I was of the view (pre-nerf) that ZOE wasn't good in most MAX situations. In a biolab or other point defence being able to tank damage was important and for breaching a room charge was still much faster so made for a better choice. Hence ZOE was retained just for AA duties which I thought was a decent use of the ability. With the nerf I see no use for ZOE at all. The situations it would be useful for is when you're lone wolfing around a base against one or two enemies (not common or productive really) or when you outnumber the enemy and can have permanent repairs whilst involved in CQC (so effectively point defences before the real opposition arrives).

    It's still not a major problem but it's annoying that the Prowler nerf was reduced. I feel the balance of OP weapons is still in TR's favour. Sympathy for NC as well, they've really been shafted of late.
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  10. #3150
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cephas's Avatar
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    To be honest I have issues with how slowly things get buffed/nerfed. I get that they want to keep a balance and not make certs worthless overnight but there has to be a faster, more reasonable way than the current system.

  11. #3151
    Lesser Hivemind Node Ksempac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cephas View Post
    Euch. I get the merits of it, but that's too harsh. ZOE is now useless in anything but CQC (meaning the one reason I used it - AA - no longer exists).

    Since people tend to have it on ALL the time it's going to make CQC a complete pain. I think it'll still have some situational merits though.

    Edit: Not sure about cert refunding. It seems like a slippery slope. I'd maybe reduce the cert cost and refund the difference for people.
    Good, because Charge is already better, so maybe will finally take note of that .

    As for cert refunds it's not slippery slope, they do it every time they significantly alter a cert line

  12. #3152
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cephas's Avatar
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    I agree charge is better - but there should be options! There are too many things that are just worthless in the game.

    The problem is what counts as "significant". People well get annoyed if something doesn't receive a cert refund but probably should and vice versa.

  13. #3153
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    I used ZOE simply because it meant lugging a MAX around long distances was less of a pain, and only really activated it outside of combat. I'm going to miss it for just that reason.

  14. #3154
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Dewi's Avatar
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    Instead of ZOE I'd love to see a much faster charge, almost like a mages blink from WoW. Keeps us fast and maneuverable and keeps with the idea of alien tech. Make it 3/4 the distance of a regular charge and have 60 sec cooldown at lowest to 45 sec at max rank. Does NOT clip through walls
    Last edited by Dewi; 11-12-2013 at 11:36 AM.

  15. #3155
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mickygor's Avatar
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    For what it's worth, from NC's perspective, ZOE was a lot more effective than you guys seem to give it credit for. It didn't drop anywhere near as fast as you think it does, and the constant movement buff was seriously difficult to deal with. The nerf's extreme (all SOE knows how to do), but something had to be done.

    Edit: Actually, this was the only change needed.
    Sprinting infantry should now be able to outrun and evade the ZOE
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  16. #3156
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus LaKroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dewi View Post
    Instead of ZOE I'd love to see a much faster charge, almost like a mages blink from WoW. Keeps us fast and maneuverable and keeps with the idea of alien tech. Make it 3/4 the distance of a regular charge and have 60 sec cooldown at lowest to 45 sec at max rank. Does clip through walls
    Teleporting MAXes? Oh yeah.

  17. #3157
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cephas's Avatar
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    I'd like it if Charge actually had collision. Maybe to stop that being completely OP it wouldn't activate instantly and the preceding "charge time" you would have some indicator that is what was happening.
    It would also work on friendly people.

  18. #3158
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Dewi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickygor View Post
    For what it's worth, from NC's perspective, ZOE was a lot more effective than you guys seem to give it credit for. It didn't drop anywhere near as fast as you think it does, and the constant movement buff was seriously difficult to deal with. The nerf's extreme (all SOE knows how to do), but something had to be done.

    Edit: Actually, this was the only change needed.
    I would argue the same back to you Bastiat and say it falls a lot faster than you think it does. In a point room NC maxes are seriously difficult to deal with, but that is their nature.

    I realise I am defending something I despise here, but the ability itself I have no issue with, just the way people use it.

  19. #3159
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Dewi's Avatar
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    Also, missed a not out in my original post about what I would like instaed of ZOE.

    Dear Santa...

  20. #3160
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mickygor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dewi View Post
    I would argue the same back to you Bastiat and say it falls a lot faster than you think it does. In a point room NC maxes are seriously difficult to deal with, but that is their nature.
    Well yes perspective is subjective, but then the terror of opponents is not - people reacted more negatively to ZOE MAXes than they did non-ZOE MAXes, and that's because they could pop in a room, kill 2 or 3 people, and pop out before they died. Even if you did drop quicker, you're not there long enough to bring down rockets, of which yours is the only one that could dodge them (almost missed a d in dodge there, such spelling error).

    WRT NC MAXes in a point room, both rockets and AV grenades can be chucked in en masse without fear of repercussions. Which is exactly what we've been experiencing constantly for the last 3 months or so.
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