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  1. #61
    Well, here it is:
    http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/i...02-info.77203/

    Quite some goals for the patch. Will be a lot of work, but if they get it done, the improvements sound pretty good to me.

  2. #62
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Heck, yeah! If they pull all of this off, it'll be a good, good thing.

    dynamic XP for player kills, covered spawn entrances, underground tunnels in facilities, dynamic/customisable colours for squads in the UI, partial XP for damaging vehicles (flak, yay!), are among the things I look forward to, especially.

  3. #63
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Yeeeeeeeeees. SMGs and dynamic exp is all good but CUSTOMIZABLE COLORS FOR EVERYTHING OH GOD YES

  4. #64
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    Why the hell do you care so much about whether you're in green or blue squad?

    Anyway... the gameplay changes are meaningless without numbers, but I can speculate that the dynamic XP gain will ultimately slow down the cert gain, so it will be a nerf, and buffing support XP will make some stupid activities - i.e. Engineers who can get a half-decent XP without even leaving the Warpgate, or medics rezzing everything they see without giving it a second of thought - even more stupid.

    Invincibility on rez/Sunny spawn is definitely a bad idea - it honestly makes medics and rezzing in general rather OP when the rezzed player can just happily run away under fire, especially when you consider how long the range of fully certed medical injector is. And spawning on sunnies should never need this fix because you should spawn inside the fucking thing.

    The spawn room changes, etc. - yeah we'll see when we'll see, hopefully they will not be as atrocious as the ramps atted to some Biolabs which they didn't even bother texturing.

    Server transfer option is a horrible idea that not only won't fix the low pop problems, it will make them worse - since people on low pop servers will migrate to the medium/high pop ones, making the low pop servers even emptier.
    Last edited by Mohorovicic; 09-01-2013 at 11:07 AM.

  5. #65
    Network Hub Orius's Avatar
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    If you actually played the game instead of being a chronic whinge you'd know exactly why colours are a big deal.

    Patch sounds exciting, I'm loving almost everything mentioned there, seems like they're listening very closely to feedback indeed. Leaves me wondering if being excited about devs knowing their shit for once is a good or a bad thing, really. Not entirely sure if I agree with immortality for rezzes, just because of scatmaxes in biolabs, but I'm not entirely sure how it will work out in practice.

  6. #66
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    "I'm the ScatMax (ski-ba-bop-da-dop-bop)!"

    But seriously, yeah, it should not apply to medic revives, and reasonably only last for a few seconds after leaving the spawn tubes. Agree with Mr. M on spawning inside the Sundy, though. That'd be a neat sol-- workaround to the problem of being shot during the second or third load screen.

  7. #67
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
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    they could be invincible as long as you dont move or shoot.

    • General performance increases, particularly for lower end GPUs

      Didnt have any problems so far.


      Experience (XP) system enhancements:
    • Dynamic XP system for player kills, players who have more kills on their current life are worth more XP. Freshly spawned players will be worth a fraction of the current kill reward.
    • Partial damage XP for dealing damage to vehicles that you don't end up killing
    • Population XP / Resource bonus moved over to continent population instead of global
    • Better display of XP sources for things like defensive bonuses & population bonuses
    • Rebalancing of XP rewards to help support tasks

      Fuck yeah, that is so important. I love the "cheapness" of freshly spawned players


    • Server transfer token available in Depot

      whu?


    • UI changes to emphasize score per minute as a primary metric of player comparison
    • Sortable columns on outfit management & addition of "last online" column
    • New weapon type for all empires: SMG

      This sounds good. Ill be sure to get one. sounds like a good light assault gun


    • Short period of invulnerability will be added to freshly spawned / revived players - breaks upon game actions such as entering a vehicle or using a weapon.

      They should also add it upon moving.


    • Dynamic / player configurable colors for minimap & overhead indicators for enemies, friendlies, and squads within a platoon

      Awesome! this sounds great.


    • New Hot Spot system that displays where active fights are occurring on the map
    • New spawn buildings with more exits, protected balconies and easy roof access to make them less campable.
    • Tunnel systems for amp and tech facilities to give access from spawn rooms to interior of bases and base walls without having to go above ground.
    • Making MAXes render more reliably at long distances for players in vehicles

      Thisll only be good for air, as vehicles arent really threatened by maxes yet.


    • AA improvements, notably flak changes for turrets and skyguards, giving them some better ability to aim, although not drastically impacting their DPS.
    • Fixes to missiles so that they more reliably detonate and actually blow stuff up
    • Air vehicle weapon tweaks
    • Increases to reload speed for certain HE ground vehicle weapons
    • And of course... lots of bug fixes
    Last edited by QuantaCat; 09-01-2013 at 01:35 PM.
    - Tom De Roeck.

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  8. #68
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    Quite like the look of the patch notes.

    Quick question: Umm, what's the difference between an SMG and a Carbine? More specifically as it's likely to relate to the game rather than in real life; as a Brit I have as much experience in real life guns as I do in cosmetic dental work.

    My experience of the Carbines in the game has broadly been short to mid range bullet hoses, with choices and attachments within that range to stretch functionality toward either that short or mid range preference. My assumption of how SMGs work however is pretty much the same - short to mid range bullet hose, and presumably with enough choice to stretch that definition about.

    Broadly, as a class, how might they compare to Carbines? Range difference/ROF difference/accuracy difference?

  9. #69
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
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    arent carbines medium to long? SMGs surely are short range, like shotguns; only they have quick reloads and 30ish bullets/LAYSER BEEMS PEW PEW PEW
    - Tom De Roeck.

    monochrom & verse publications

    "Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it."

  10. #70
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    I believe in real life, the main difference between an assault rifle and a carbine, is the carbine is shorter and better for use at short ranes, because of that. The submachine gun is even more so, sacrificing medium-long range capability for even better performance at shorter ranges. Many SMGs also suffer from hight recoils, since they weigh less, have smaller recoil-dampening mechanisms and have shorter or nonexistent stocks to compensate for recoil. They usaually fire smaller rounds as well, pistol rounds are common for SMgs, whereas most carbines fire rifle rounds, which can travel more surely across larger distances, and have greater penetration power, oftentimes.

    I used to be a gun nerd, yeah...
    Last edited by EsotericReverie; 09-01-2013 at 01:58 PM. Reason: typos

  11. #71
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    I'd imagine the SMGs will fire faster, with a tighter spread, possibly have more ammo, but will do less damage per shot and will just be effective at short range.

    Re: Server transfer tokens - a good idea. Lets you move your character to another server if all your mates start playing over there and you don't want to roll a new char.

    One thing I'd really like to see about the colours (which is a great feature to implement) would be one for colour blind people. I know one of our guys is colour blind and it would be of great benefit to him and others to be able to set a colour blind mode. The only game I know of that has one is WoW, where it uses dots and crosses on the tool tip if something is friendly or hostile.

  12. #72
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mrpier's Avatar
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    In game I guess the differences from carbines will be larger mag-size, sharper damage and accuracy drop off over distance and higher rate of fire, so probably even worse at mid range fights, but perform better close range. This would correlate roughly with real world SMGs that use small caliber/pistol rounds for close quarters combat (effective up to about 100 meters). A step up from the pistol basically where instead of going into combat with 6-14 rounds you have maybe 25-50 rounds and full automatic fire capability.

    I find the default LA carbine for the VS works really well at mid range fights.

  13. #73
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
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    oh oh oh, do you think SMGs will be the new secondary gun?!
    - Tom De Roeck.

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    "Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it."

  14. #74
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    Patchnotes sounds really good, but i still want bases to matter more, make resources more important. If your team wants a capable airforce they should have to make sure they keep bases that spawns aircraft/gives air resource, so if the TR are massing mossies we should be able to make a real dent in their ability to spawn mossies by capping their airbases. Sort of like how techplants cut off access to heavy tanks (why esamir is one of the most fun continents since it only has 1 techplant). That way "commando" raids behind enemy lines could help the main zerg battle, let us cut of enemy reinforcements, for example increase spawntimers to bases with bad connections to warpgate (which would also make commando raids easier to stop since they will usually have very low influence).

    Think CoH/DoW resources, if you are not out on the map capping the resource points you will be shit out of luck. This would also make the bonus from holding a continent matter more.

  15. #75
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus bonkers's Avatar
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    Changes sound pretty good. Not a fix for every issue I have with the game but it's going in the right direction.
    SMGs as secondaries would be awesome. Especially once Hunter Cloak is back in (please, SOE?)

  16. #76
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mrpier's Avatar
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    Heh, I doubt it, it would be a clear upgrade. Aren't most/all of the pistols pretty much useless. I think I might have gotten one or two kills with the default VS pistol so far.

  17. #77
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Nah, pistols aren't too shabby, actually, but only up real close. Good to switch to instead or reloading if you go low on ammo, methinks.

  18. #78
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    Well, according to SOE, a carbine is an AR without the stock...

    In the game, carbines are basically ARs with slightly faster reload times and slightly worse at range... and no stock.

    In real life, carbine definition is kind of fuzzy, but in practice it means a rifle or assault rifle with shorter than usual barrel.

    Quote Originally Posted by QuantaCat View Post
    oh oh oh, do you think SMGs will be the new secondary gun?!
    I don't think so, since that would clearly make them an upgrade. They would need to come up with several new low damage tiers to make SMGs that are sidegrades to pistol.

    I'm thinking they will be like shotguns - a faction-wide universal CQB weapon, weaker than the shotty but with the ability to (poorly) deal damage at range as well.

    Also they might be cross-faction NS, depends on how lazy SOE is.

    Oh, and in real life, the only difference between an SMG and AR is that SMG fires pistol cartridges, while ARs use intermediate cartridge.

  19. #79
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    The changes seem to be to the right direction, although we'll have to wait and see in 3 weeks.

    The invulnerability thing is great, but it depends on how it will be implemented. What's its duration, and most importantly, what actions break it. As others have pointed out, a revived scat max that is invulnerable even for a couple of seconds is an "I win" situation.

    As for SMGs, I hope that they are high RoF, low damage per bullet, and with really bad CoF, so they'd be useless beyond 15-20m. A little longer effective range than shotguns, considerably shorter than carbines.

    What has me worried though is the increase in render distance of MAXs. It will be as if drawing a huge bulls-eye on each one of them. If the rest of the balancing tweaks on A2G weapons and G2A deterrents aren't sufficient, this will still do nothing against the liberator spam. Every zepher gunner camping at the ceiling will be targeting the MAXs as a matter of principle, especially when you consider that where there are MAXs, there is also support infantry around. "A, there they are, the little buggers!"
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 09-01-2013 at 03:24 PM.

  20. #80
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus MrEclectic's Avatar
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    As for the GPU optimization thing: good to have, but not that of a priority, compared to CPU optimisation. The game is CPU bound. The CPU has to keep constantly calculating which players are in your vicinity and what they are doing, and then requesting from the GPU and the sound chip to render them. I think that especially the sound subsystem is a resource hog. Positional data have to be processed for each sound source within the player's render distance, and then effects, such as reverb, applied to each sound. Reverb in particular is a difficult filter to implement in parallel, although there are examples. And there are implementations that utilise the GPU to do the parallel part of the filtering. I realise that CPU optimisation for this kind of game is really difficult, and I believe that they have come up with a great framework for tackling this problem. But more needs to be done towards this direction.

    In the long run, a complete overhaul is needed, and porting the game to DX11, as to take advantage of multithreaded rendering (a technology that only Civilization V made extensive use of, to my knowledge). But sound will always be a bottleneck, unless they force everyone to be using Windows 7 or newer, and come up with a solution that utilises WDM audio drivers. But that won't happen for a while, as there are still gamers around using Windows XP (WHY?!?!?!)
    Last edited by MrEclectic; 09-01-2013 at 03:28 PM.

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