View Poll Results: Do you want to try advanced group tactics during strategic nights?

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  • Oh yes! Yesyesyes! Right there! *excited panting*

    10 45.45%
  • Might be fun to try.

    11 50.00%
  • Nah, not really interested, but you guys go ahead if you want to.

    1 4.55%
  • I think this idea sucks.

    0 0%
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  1. #1
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Advanced group tactics

    I'd very much like to lead a dozen players interested in experimenting with some "advanced" tactics for a tour de force on this Thursday's strategic night. I'm thinking we should try to do like this:
    • Before moving out, we'll take a few minutes to discuss some things we'd like to try during the night, then kit out accordingly.
    • During play, we will try to stick together whenever we're on the ground, unless someone is on a specific mission, such as stealth-hacking a vehicle terminal.
    • We'll take timeouts from time to time to evaluate what we've accomplished, and try to improve our group play.
    • If possible, I'd like to also try to do a debriefing discussion at the "end" of the play session, a time determined by the squad members before moving out. I'd also like to continue this in a thread on these forums, so that any lessons learned can be shared with the rest of the outfit. I'll take notes.


    This would require that we keep roughly the same players in the squad for a longer period of time, and that any newcomers are introduced to the concept, but we could probably manage that.

    Is anyone interested in this kind of play?

  2. #2
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    I will probably not be leading on thursday, so I'm down.

  3. #3
    Network Hub MitchK's Avatar
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    Sounds like fun! My Internet is finally returning to a useable state (fingers crossed it stays that way) so although I may be slightly late for the 7.30 start tomorrow I'd like to be a part of this!

  4. #4
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    I would very much like to try something like this. It's just the kind of thing I want from PS2 and I'd like to see if it can work.

  5. #5
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    I'm thinking that if there are too many interested to fit into one squad, we could try splitting evenly into two groups. We have a briefing all together, before we split comms and set out. We set a rough time for a debriefing that we will all attend by merging comm channels. We post any lessons learned in a kind of after action report here on the forums, maybe in this thread or a new one.

    Do you think it would be useful to run a paralel platoon for this, to avoid getting mixed up with "the standard stratgir" platoon, or would that only mess things up?

  6. #6
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    Personally I think it should be just one group for now to see how it pans out.

    Using AGT's will require everyones absolute focus and attention and willingness to follow orders and I'd say ability to use a mic. That's not something we have in Strat Thursdays, it's what we aim for, but we don't have it. We have it for the majority, but not everyone.

    It'll be easier to test AGT's out with one 12 man group, working alongside/behind the rest of the platoon.

  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    General observation:
    AARs are welcome. Why people haven't just started to write these I don't know. So, please go ahead and do so.

    (c.f. the ARMA forums)
    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  8. #8
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    I would suggest you just limit it to 12 people. There's no fair way to do sign-ups, but I think it will be a lot to manage otherwise.

  9. #9
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    Suggestion:

    Volunteer as PL tomorrow and just do this as part of StratGir night tomorrow (whether the whole platoon or just one squad or two is up to you).


    People are generally decent enough that if you say "we're gonna try something different" and explain that something different is simply those four points above, I would be very surprised if anyone takes issue. Better communication including enforced 'downtime' where we can have a chat about things is a very good thing.

    Just go ahead and do it...
    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  10. #10
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Actually, like all of this seems to be a good way to develop Stratgir to something different and more strategic. If you're up to it Esoteric, feel free to try to implement this (as PL) tommorrow as Cooper said.

  11. #11
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    If you can pull it off in PS2 do it, but I do not think the game is suited for this kind of gameplay with all the dying, re-spawning that spreads squads over large areas quickly. Unless you manage to find a nice squad vs squad fight over a base. Good luck =)

  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Hmm, I'll consider it, certainly. Been thinking of PLing a strategic night for a while anyway. I'm not sure I would be able to focus on the stuff I really want to achieve with this while also juggling all of the responsibilities of a balloon leader, though. Although, to be fair, there are two parts to this; one is trying out some organised squad-level tactics. This is probably difficult to manage while also trying to keep track of the big picture and making sure that all squads are doing worthwhile tasks and having fun. The other is related more to general organisation and communication; briefings, squad cohesion, occasional evaluations and a debriefing at the "end".

    What the heck, might as well give it a try. If this is something that sticks, it will only make it easier to get to where I want to go in the long run anyway, so why not. Just need to make sure that I can be available in time tomorrow night.

  13. #13
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wardancer View Post
    If you can pull it off in PS2 do it, but I do not think the game is suited for this kind of gameplay with all the dying, re-spawning that spreads squads over large areas quickly. Unless you manage to find a nice squad vs squad fight over a base. Good luck =)
    Yeah, there is that little problem. I think that can be alleviated some by making sure that people spawn in the same general location, and do not, as a rule, move out alone, but rather wait until there are three or four respawns, before rushing back into the fight. Also making sure to utilize our excellent medics should help a bit. Medics should maybe try to be a little bit more careful too. I'm still having problems with this myself...

    Redeploying is also an option if you find yourself on your own, away from the rest of the squad.

    We'll give it a shot and see how it works out. It can't hurt to try.

  14. #14
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Designated sundy/gal drivers will also help. With the new redeploy system it will also be less of a hassle.

  15. #15
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wardancer View Post
    If you can pull it off in PS2 do it, but I do not think the game is suited for this kind of gameplay with all the dying, re-spawning that spreads squads over large areas quickly. Unless you manage to find a nice squad vs squad fight over a base. Good luck =)
    Recalls to WG.


    They're common parts of any night out in PS2. Sometimes recalls need to be fast. (An aside: We need to get better at really fast recalls and move-outs from WGs. We've all seen how effective Gal drops are, but the front lines move so fast in PS2 that a recall and move out from WG that takes more than 2 minutes can be rendered useless...)

    But when they don't need to be fast, they are the closest PS2 gets to 'downtime' between raids where this kind of discussion occurs naturally in MMOs.
    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  16. #16
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    As usual, I can't guarantee I'll be on for any particular amount of time, but I'm happy to follow orders when I am around.

  17. #17
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    Even so there are hardly any goals in the game where a small coordinated attack will do much difference because capping bases takes a very long time. Making a perfect assault on a tower and killing 15 people have minimal effect because they respawn right away. This is what i see as the main issue with small advanced tactics. Even if you perform a tactical wonder-piece that should be in the officers handbook the effect can and will often be negible at best. The only real target for something like this is to find and eliminate sunderers which if it works, hooray do it.

    If the game had ANTs or other juicy targets where a fast strikeforce could do some long lasting damage in a short amount of time this would be bloody brilliant. Which also happens to be one of my big gripes with the game atm, lack of "side" objectives for "commandos".

    I do not say this to try to dissuade you or just to complain, just voicing some issues I see with this. If you manage to find a way that works for you and use it to support the "normal" platoon this could good especially to assassinate sunderers.

  18. #18
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
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    Yeah, I've been thinking that myself. If we're on the defensive, recalls need to be lightning fast and I'll try to improve on that. When you're reinforcing an offensive, on the other hand, it might be possible o
    take a five minute timeout to regroup and collect our thoughts on the last
    engagement before moving out again.

    I shall try this. It's going to be a lot to keep track of...

  19. #19
    Lesser Hivemind Node NickWhite's Avatar
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    Always try something different. Always.

    I guess it can work, last time out i poked and prodded with the use of this sort of thing and saw some potential.

    I think for this to really work on a platoon scale though, the SLs and PL need to be exactly on the same wavelength. The PL and SL would have to really specifically communicate to their respective unders. E.G PL: "Bravo, get some annihilators in that tower and hold the NC push coming from the north." SL: "Bravo 1 go medic, 2 ammo engie, 3 get some AT mines on the floor out there, 4 & 5 Heavys, 6 & 7 Burster MAX" etc etc. This would mean SLs enforce the already referenced "hold comms for a second squad, PL is giving me important instructions" we talked about before.

    Suggestion: This idea may be best used in defensive situations. Where you have the structural or geographical upper hand. Quick reckies of the land from the air, then setting up with beacons and sunderers at the critical points of defence. Or Alternitavely, in TPs and BLs the satellites, jennies and access to cap points.

    In regards to the rallying/frontlines issue. I would really push for everyone, as soon as they hear the eg: "redeploy at warpgate" they asap /suicide and redeploy. With one person from each squad quickly adding, "i'll pull our galaxy." If everyone actually did that then we would be set up and ready to move out within little over a minute. Though i feel that that level of efficiency is something that outfits get over time, as creases are ironed out and people get accustomed to the game.
    Last edited by NickWhite; 06-02-2013 at 01:45 PM.
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  20. #20
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus RIDEBIRD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wardancer View Post
    If the game had ANTs or other juicy targets where a fast strikeforce could do some long lasting damage in a short amount of time this would be bloody brilliant. Which also happens to be one of my big gripes with the game atm, lack of "side" objectives for "commandos".
    I really hate this as well. Sattelite bases is usually doable with good galdrops tactics, even if you are outmanned 10 to 1, and that's about it.

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