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  1. #1
    Network Hub Rath's Avatar
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    Anti-Immunisation (or "Good luck treating measles with homeopathy")

    So amid a major measles outbreak (over 600 thought to be infected in the Swansea area), the Independent comment section is rife with people who proudly boast that they will never vaccinate their children, still arguing that the MMR jab is dangerous despite the feared link to autism having been disproved, and that all vaccinations are merely a front for the profiteering of pharmaceutical companies.

    On top of that, you've got a chain of demonstrable charlatans promoting the use of homeopathy (flavoured water) in order to "treat measles naturally".
    Neal's Yard promotes homeopathy for measles. This could kill real children. - Telegraph Blogs

    I can't help but be reminded of this;

    No, you're not entitled to your opinion - Patrick Stokes
    Last edited by Rath; 09-04-2013 at 04:04 AM.

  2. #2
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    Autism is dangerous now? More dangerous that dying?
    I'm failing to writing a blog, specifically about playing games the wrong way
    http://playingitwrong.wordpress.com/

  3. #3
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Anti-immunization movements aren't new, but thankfully the ill results of their delusions largely hurt only themselves. NYC tempers the potential for the <1% of non-compliant parents for public school children to harm the rest of the population by mandating and enforcing home quarantines at any sign of contraction of any of the listed diseases until at least 18 days past the last sign of the disease.

    As missing three weeks of school is tantamount to failing that school year, effectively it's signing an exclusion policy for all non-compliance.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
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    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  4. #4
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Hypernetic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Anti-immunization movements aren't new, but thankfully the ill results of their delusions largely hurt only themselves. NYC tempers the potential for the <1% of non-compliant parents for public school children to harm the rest of the population by mandating and enforcing home quarantines at any sign of contraction of any of the listed diseases until at least 18 days past the last sign of the disease.

    As missing three weeks of school is tantamount to failing that school year, effectively it's signing an exclusion policy for all non-compliance.
    I thought you couldn't get into public school at all without immunizations.

  5. #5
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypernetic View Post
    I thought you couldn't get into public school at all without immunizations.
    You basically can't, unless you're an amazing essayist and don't mind your child repeating the third grade because they contracted Measles.
    Last edited by Nalano; 09-04-2013 at 04:58 AM.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
    Attorney at Lawl
    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  6. #6
    Network Hub Gerbick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliocentric View Post
    Autism is dangerous now? More dangerous that dying?
    That's exactly what we told my mum, when we got all our kids vaccinated, and she was crying out about "MMR = Autism" and all that bullshit. She used to give me homeopathy 'treatments' when I was a kid too. When I broke my arm I was given some little sugar pills and told the pain would go away. It didn't. And if it wasn't for my dad, I think she'd have left my arm to 'heal' naturally, without hospital intervention.

  7. #7
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Xercies's Avatar
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    I really can't believe that there are still people that believe the MMR=Autism bullshit out there really weird.

  8. #8
    They should run some TV adverts with members of families who've contracted measles. A few have been on the national news expressing deep regret for opting out of various vaccination programmes. Sadly it's not just MMR. The anti-vaccination lobby will have a crack at most vaccines, on general principle. It's so loopy it'd be funny if it wasn't so dangerous. Check out some of the sh*t Jenny McCarthy has been saying. Depressing that people can't see through it. It amounts to stuff like: "I wouldn't feel my kids rat poison and aluminium; would you?! That's what's in vaccines!!!"

  9. #9
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus SirKicksalot's Avatar
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    If alternative medicine would work, it would be called medicine.

  10. #10
    Network Hub Maknol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Anti-immunization movements aren't new, but thankfully the ill results of their delusions largely hurt only themselves. NYC tempers the potential for the <1% of non-compliant parents for public school children to harm the rest of the population by mandating and enforcing home quarantines at any sign of contraction of any of the listed diseases until at least 18 days past the last sign of the disease.

    As missing three weeks of school is tantamount to failing that school year, effectively it's signing an exclusion policy for all non-compliance.
    Nice, I'd never heard about that. What about deluded parents choosing to homeschool their children to circumvent it? Does that happen?

  11. #11
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Heliocentric's Avatar
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    If MMR did actually raise the risk of autism of ~5% I'd still immunise them because all the immunisation dodgers are an epidemic waiting to happen.. And autistic is better than dead.
    I'm failing to writing a blog, specifically about playing games the wrong way
    http://playingitwrong.wordpress.com/

  12. #12
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maknol View Post
    Nice, I'd never heard about that. What about deluded parents choosing to homeschool their children to circumvent it? Does that happen?
    The relevant question:

    Must students instructed at home meet immunization requirements for in-school students?

    The provisions of Public Health Law Section 2164 which require parents to submit proof of immunization prior to admission of their children to a school do not apply to students being educated at home. If the Commissioner of Health notifies school officials of the outbreak of a disease for which immunization is required, however, parents of children on home instruction who seek to participate in testing or other activities on the premises of a public or nonpublic school must produce proof of immunization or the children must be denied access to the school building.

    However, should the parent choose to go this route, they have to provide a very exhaustive Individualized Home Instruction Plan, which is a full curriculum of the student's education as they pertain to state standards, which the district can then choose to deny or is obligated to assess progress (and assign social workers if deemed insufficient) as the parent remains in the district.

    So, in effect, you'd have to teach your child everything in the entire public school curriculum at your own expense, and they get to test you on it.
    Last edited by Nalano; 09-04-2013 at 07:04 PM.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
    Attorney at Lawl
    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  13. #13
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus
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    Its a stupid and dangerous act not to vacinate. Short of dangering your own health you are also playing with the health of the population at large. We are using herd immunity(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herd_immunity) to protect those that absolutely cannot have vaccins due to medical reasons(No, autism isnt a medical reason since no relation has been proven thus far). Also one can always attract said virus even if one has received a vaccination. The of ever getting it is small because everyone receives a vaccin to getting in touch with the virus is difficult to begin with.

    The only way to stomp some sense in these people is a major outbreak in their area that has a few dozen casualties, preferably amongst the younger members of the community. Yes its cruel, but inevitable if this continues.

    How enjoyable:

    http://www.jennymccarthybodycount.co...ount/Home.html

  14. #14
    Lesser Hivemind Node Feldspar's Avatar
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    It brings to mind the killing of aid workers in Pakistan because they were engaging in a polio vaccination program, which was obviously a western imperialist plot (children dying of treatable diseases being a wholesome thing).

  15. #15
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Anti-immunization movements aren't new, but thankfully the ill results of their delusions largely hurt only themselves.
    Well, them and anyone who is immune suppressed. So various people with life-long diseases, AIDS sufferers, anyone on Chemotherapy, anyone with donated organs, people who've had nasty digestive illnesses etc.

    Equally, vaccinations are not always sensible. There are real risk associated with them, however typically small. That has to be balanced against the risks of not receiving the inoculation.

  16. #16
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CMaster View Post
    Well, them and anyone who is immune suppressed. So various people with life-long diseases, AIDS sufferers, anyone on Chemotherapy, anyone with donated organs, people who've had nasty digestive illnesses etc.
    I said largely, not entirely. Even among those with healthy immune systems and full immunizations, vaccines are not 100% effective and you can still - rarely - contract the disease off a carrier.

    The reason I said largely is because the sorts of religious communities for which anti-immunization is a thing also, thankfully, tend to sequester themselves away from everybody else.
    Nalano H. Wildmoon
    Director of the Friends of Nalano PAC
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    "His lack of education is more than compensated for by his keenly developed moral bankruptcy." - Woody Allen

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xercies View Post
    I really can't believe that there are still people that believe the MMR=Autism bullshit out there really weird.
    It's not that weird when you had people pushing that view and pushing it hard using anything they could twist to fit the agenda.

  18. #18
    Network Hub Rath's Avatar
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    Any excuse to post it;


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