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  1. #3461
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    moms, as the great Mahatma Gandhi once said, "Be the change you want to see in the world."*

    Also I'm just going to leave this here.
    http://www.theguardian.com/environme...more-than-cars

    *Although, to be fair, he probably wasn't thinking of this context...
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  2. #3462
    Network Hub TWChristine's Avatar
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    Sometimes I'm fascinated with how conversations evolve, kind of like that telephone game..

  3. #3463
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Boris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moms View Post
    OK, all of you need to go out and get laid.

    Like, right now!!

    Well, yeah. But I'm depressed and have no self esteem :P

    Quote Originally Posted by TWChristine View Post
    Sometimes I'm fascinated with how conversations evolve, kind of like that telephone game..
    Chinese whispers?

  4. #3464
    Network Hub gary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guvornator View Post
    moms, as the great Mahatma Gandhi once said, "Be the change you want to see in the world."*
    I don't think the worlds number 1 fan of nuclear weapons is a very good role model.
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  5. #3465
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guvornator View Post
    moms, as the great Mahatma Gandhi once said, "Be the change you want to see in the world."*

    Also I'm just going to leave this here.
    http://www.theguardian.com/environme...more-than-cars

    *Although, to be fair, he probably wasn't thinking of this context...
    Interesting article. I personally don't see eating meat as morally wrong but neither do I see it as a right, so an argument such as that in the article is the sort of one that I would consider. I think for me its in a similar category to considering the farming methods used in my meat purchasing.

  6. #3466
    Lesser Hivemind Node madmoxxi's Avatar
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    ARE YOU STILL DISCUSSING MEAT?!
    Wow...
    You need me again, sweet lips?
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  7. #3467
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mickygor's Avatar
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    It's important!
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  8. #3468
    Moderator QuantaCat's Avatar
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    Jag, Im sure you forgot about Von Braun who wanted to make space rockets originally.
    - Tom De Roeck.

    verse publications

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  9. #3469
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus BasicPauly's Avatar
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    @Boris

    Quote Originally Posted by Boris View Post
    Well, to be fair I always claimed that I don't think that there is an entity controlling us all, that's what you suggested.
    I actually didnt suggest that, I was just stating that our views differ.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boris View Post
    Now you're directly contradicting what you said earlier about that very intelligent robots should also be treated fairly. Which of your two standpoints would you like to hold?

    You just did, though.
    No, I didnt.
    I think that they will never be the same, but I also think they should be treated fairly. Even if a robot human were created, It is by definition never going to be the same, but I would still not want it to be indiscriminately destroyed. This was pretty clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boris View Post
    So basically, "I don't think this is wrong because it's depressing, I think this is wrong because it is depressing."
    Nope. I do think its depressing, but that has no bearing on why I think its wrong. I dont see determinism as being the probable answer. This was also pretty clear





    @Everyone else - Normal discussion:

    Quote Originally Posted by fish food carl View Post

    EDIT: When I say it's not predestination, I simply mean that nothing predicts or comprehends the cosmic "chain of events". Our comparatively simple choices are still present (as they appear to us), it's just that there is an explanation for them that extends beyond "I chose to do this for no apparent reason".
    My lack of understanding of determinism is no doubt problematic, but my argument is towards the statement from earlier that free will does not exist or is an illusion.

    Im inclined to think that the "i chose to do this for no apparent reason" thing is entirely possible. Random factors can influence decisions, for example the weather, so how does this fit into the suggestion that free will doesnt exist? Especially if we are not talking about predetermination?

    Even if life is to some extent predictable, I simply dont agree with the view that the entire universe could be predicted therefore eliminating any randomness and indeed free will. Im more inclined to sit somewhere in between.


    Quote Originally Posted by kreggurree View Post
    Interesting article. I personally don't see eating meat as morally wrong but neither do I see it as a right, so an argument such as that in the article is the sort of one that I would consider. I think for me its in a similar category to considering the farming methods used in my meat purchasing.
    Well, from a biological standpoint (omnivores/ carnivores etc) it is right. I dont think you could ever argue that it is morally wrong for a tiger to hunt prey to survive when that is what it has evolved to do.

    Same goes for humans doesnt it? We have evolved to do it, so why is it morally wrong? I think the morality comes into play when we talk about how those animals are treated prior to us actually eating them. Possibly also with the whole overbreeding thing :P.
    Last edited by BasicPauly; 22-07-2014 at 03:09 PM.
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  10. #3470
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    Quote Originally Posted by BasicPauly View Post
    Well, from a biological standpoint (omnivores/ carnivores etc) it is right. I dont think you could ever argue that it is morally wrong for a tiger to hunt prey to survive when that is what it has evolved to do.

    Same goes for humans doesnt it? We have evolved to do it, so why is it morally wrong? I think the morality comes into play when we talk about how those animals are treated prior to us actually eating them. Possibly also with the whole overbreeding thing :P.
    I think we agree Paul, I mean I don't see it as A human right like when we talk about our right to freedom of speech etc.

  11. #3471
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mickygor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BasicPauly View Post
    Im inclined to think that the "i chose to do this for no apparent reason" thing is entirely possible. Random factors can influence decisions, for example the weather, so how does this fit into the suggestion that free will doesnt exist? Especially if we are not talking about predetermination?
    You can predict particle interactions quite simply (relatively speaking of course) using an amplituhedron. Given enough processing power, we could model the environment which gave rise to the weather that influenced your decision.
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  12. #3472
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus BasicPauly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickygor View Post
    You can predict particle interactions quite simply (relatively speaking of course) using an amplituhedron. Given enough processing power, we could model the environment which gave rise to the weather that influenced your decision.
    You could model it, but you couldnt predict the full chain of events with 100% accuracy, given the sheer number of factors and possibilities.

    I dont think we ever could, even if we get pretty darn close (which is of course my opinion, but what I also believe :P ).
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  13. #3473
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus mickygor's Avatar
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    Unless that number is infinite, it's predictable. We might never achieve the ability to predict everything before we're gone as a species, but it's the potential that counts.
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  14. #3474
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus BasicPauly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickygor View Post
    Unless that number is infinite, it's predictable. We might never achieve the ability to predict everything before we're gone as a species, but it's the potential that counts.
    But theres a potential for anything.. Doesnt necessarily make it probable.
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  15. #3475
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
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    In other news, I am turning PhD chapters into papers and just came across a chapter sub-heading I forgot I ever wrote, and can't work out whether I wrote this in earnest or I was just amusing myself at the time:
    Being-in-the-Zone as the 'unrealized in fact' of feeling being felt by radiation Or: Are we trees to the world's painters?

    Quote Originally Posted by CROCONOUGHTKEY
    KING GEORGE IS A FROG
    le BANG~__-MICHEAL FUCK OFF~~__-INTERPOL KNOW YOU WELLBIENG~—
    OFF
    NOT RUSHMORE MOUNTAIN
    KILL WESTON KILL MUST KILLTHEWESTERNINMYHEADDOESN’TEXSIST
    TEXASISDEADINPARISHEWASAMAN..BINGBING.TETTOHEAD.SP ACEOK,TIMEDEADANDSTOPPED1920HOKKAIDO.UNDERSTOODAT1 ONE.
    UNDERSTANDTHISANDFUCKOFFPIRATEBAY.TIMEDOESNTEXSIST FORMEASIMPATEKPHILLPE.
    BANG

  16. #3476
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    ^ not sure that this wasn't actually already posted somewhere in this forum, but you made me think of http://lolmythesis.com/

  17. #3477
    Network Hub laldy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    In other news, I am turning PhD chapters into papers and just came across a chapter sub-heading I forgot I ever wrote, and can't work out whether I wrote this in earnest or I was just amusing myself at the time:
    Being-in-the-Zone as the 'unrealized in fact' of feeling being felt by radiation Or: Are we trees to the world's painters?
    "Being-in-the-Zone as the 'unrealized in fact' of feeling being felt by radiation" I recognise and understand each word, but the order they are arranged in is causing some confusion.
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  18. #3478
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus jaguar skills's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuantaCat View Post
    Jag, Im sure you forgot about Von Braun who wanted to make space rockets originally.
    And what happened? His academic peers said "nah werhner, this space shit doesn't make sense. Serious academics build specialised rockets for blowing things up, what you're doing is silly. Now build me a V2 before I taunt you a second time."
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanye West
    I think what Kanye West is going to mean is something similar to what Steve Jobs means. I am undoubtedly, you know, Steve of Internet, downtown, fashion, culture. Period.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanye West
    I am God's vessel. But my greatest pain in life is that I will never be able to see myself perform live.



  19. #3479
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus jaguar skills's Avatar
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    Here's a thing that's real. Not a spoof pretend trailer made as a commentary on the state of cinema, this is a real thing that you can pay money to watch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kanye West
    I think what Kanye West is going to mean is something similar to what Steve Jobs means. I am undoubtedly, you know, Steve of Internet, downtown, fashion, culture. Period.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanye West
    I am God's vessel. But my greatest pain in life is that I will never be able to see myself perform live.



  20. #3480
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus BasicPauly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaguar skills View Post
    And what happened? His academic peers said "nah werhner, this space shit doesn't make sense. Serious academics build specialised rockets for blowing things up, what you're doing is silly. Now build me a V2 before I taunt you a second time."
    Thats enough of that french taunting Jag! paha.

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