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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    Cornell's Engineering school starts out close to 50:50. It ends up close to 75:25. This is not because female engineers can't cut it. It's because they're sick of dealing with male engineers.

    I now work in the tech industry. From what I see in the office, I can tell you: You're part of the problem.
    Your Cornell numbers are completely made up. Feel free to provide proof showing otherwise.


    I don't work in an office, and the women I work with are treated with the same level of respect as their male counterparts.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estel View Post
    Have you watched her videos on tropes in movies+TV? They follow similar themes. My (pretty uninformed) takeaway was that whilst these tropes are a reflection of wider attitudes in our culture, their continued prevalence in all forms of media is a key factor in perpetuating these attitudes. As a society, we should be examining our behaviour and the tropes we encounter in the media around us in order to eliminate them, in order that these attitudes will be a thing of the past.
    I don't know. I don't get worked up over the fat, dumb, clumsy, inadequate men that are so over-portrayed in sitcoms these days. Should I be? Is it somehow harming me? Do you think less of me because these characters exist?

  3. #83
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Nalano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grau View Post
    I don't work in an office, and the women I work with are treated with the same level of respect as their male counterparts.
    [Citation Needed]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grau View Post
    Your Cornell numbers are completely made up. Feel free to provide proof showing otherwise.
    Oh, oh, you want numbers?

    Oh, well why didn't you say so?

    Boom motherfucker BOOM.
    Last edited by Nalano; 08-03-2013 at 05:27 AM.
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  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dead Herald View Post
    Sorry, three minutes is all I can give her
    That's what he said.

    /thread can use some levity

  5. #85
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus soldant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estel View Post
    Seriously? It's nice to hear that someone's face and voice are grounds for constructive criticism now.
    Did I say I endorse Dead Herald's statements? No?

    The hostility here seems to be less about statements like that, and more "Oh no people didn't find the video informative or interesting, they must hate women!"
    Nalano's Law - As an online gaming discussion regarding restrictions grows longer, the probability of a post likening the topic to the Democratic People's Republic of Korea approaches one.
    Soldant's Law - A person will happily suspend their moral values if they can express moral outrage by doing so.

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grau View Post
    I don't know. I don't get worked up over the fat, dumb, clumsy, inadequate men that are so over-portrayed in sitcoms these days. Should I be? Is it somehow harming me? Do you think less of me because these characters exist?
    It's called privilege.

    You're correct - it isn't harming you at all with these examples, because you've been in a position of power based on the way you were born and have completely proven, quantified advantages. Women have to deal with infinitely more of this crap, proven if you look at the news for two seconds. Just look at election season alone.

    It doesn't make the stereotype in sitcoms OK, but for every bumbling dad, there's also a sexually active male who's considered a golden god, but in return a sexually active woman who is considered slutty and socially deviant.

    There's sitcoms with positive examples that defy both, but it doesn't change that the issue still persists on a lot of levels in other mediums. This project is just highlighting some of them.

    Honestly, there's nothing going on that is actually a threat to anyone who's involved in whining about this, so all it really does is succeed in proving that people want this social institution to continue thriving. There's no reason to actually be outraged otherwise.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalano View Post
    [Citation Needed]



    Oh, oh, you want numbers?

    Oh, well why didn't you say so?

    Boom motherfucker BOOM.
    And your numbers are still bullshit, plucked out of thin air. 50/50 to 75/25? No.

    Even assuming, based on the chart you provided, that incoming Freshman and incoming Seniors in a single year is representative of a drop out rate for all years you're not looking at anything close to 50/50 to 75/25.

    Even the articles you use are bullshit biased garbage.

    Here is an example:

    "The top two reasons why women leave are the hostile macho cultures — the hard hat culture of engineering, the geek culture of technology or the lab culture of science … and extreme work pressures"
    Sherbin also highlights just how critical and surprising the numbers are, even to researchers.
    "The dropping out was a surprise to us. We knew anecdotally that women were leaving these careers. We didn't expect to see the number 52 percent."




    And then goes on to say:

    To reiterate: 52% or just over half, of the female STEM workforce leaves because of hostile macho cultures.
    Wait what?

    The two colors people like most are red and blue. (No percentage here, just a vague statement) We were surprised to find that 52 percent of people like these colors.

    52 percent of people like Red.

    That is basically what that statement just claims. The entire http://www.rachelappel.com article is based around hazy, manipulated figures.

  8. #88
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    I know I said I wasn't going to post again, but this guys has only 5 posts, all in this thread. Even if his join date is older, I find that weird.

  9. #89
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    It's like Grau doesn't even notice that he's dismantling his own argument as he goes. You're lookin a bit emotional there champ. A bit hysterical.

  10. #90
    Network Hub Dead Herald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estel View Post
    Seriously? It's nice to hear that someone's face and voice are grounds for constructive criticism now.
    You know I don't even recall writing that. Maybe I thought her argument would be easier to stomach if it was coming out of Felicia Day......Naaaaaah.

    I wouldn't call that a real argument, though. Although she has all the charismatic presence of a substitute math teacher. But rather than explore this, why not stick to the issues? I only had 3 involved posts cataloging legitimate beefs with her positions, yet you say nothing about that.

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoLAoS View Post
    I know I said I wasn't going to post again, but this guys has only 5 posts, all in this thread. Even if his join date is older, I find that weird.
    I found RPS a few weeks ago by way of Steam, I think.

    I'm generally not a big forum poster/commenter. There was a thread I was interested in when I joined, but for whatever reason I decided against posting in it.

    I just feel this whole issue is ridiculous, and people are making more out of it (and getting offended over it) when it's really a non-issue. This and violence in video games are things that make me go "Meh, go find something worthwhile to champion."

    Quote Originally Posted by Serenegoose View Post
    It's like Grau doesn't even notice that he's dismantling his own argument as he goes. You're lookin a bit emotional there champ. A bit hysterical.
    Emotional? Not really. Just pointing out what I see are flaws in an argument. Like I said, his numbers are made up. Doing the whole "boom motherfucker boom" thing doesn't make them any less made up.
    Last edited by Grau; 08-03-2013 at 06:44 AM.

  12. #92
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    Wow, this thread went for almost several posts before a woman saying x was warped into a woman saying xyzqvqzqzv. Well done everyone, that was very impressive. I'd say "pat yourselves on the back", but you're clearly way ahead of me on that one.

  13. #93
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    Off topic, but does anyone know what the game with the cavemen is at the 11 minute mark?

    On-topic I was underwhelmed by the video. I felt like she was making this video for my parents, and I guess I was expecting more after the controversy and subsequent gobs of money she received.
    Last edited by Wengart; 08-03-2013 at 08:39 AM.

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angel Dust View Post
    Did you skip through the video or something? She mentioned this with the specific examples from ancient myths.

    I'm mostly with everyone in the 'well that was a big bit of nothing' camp though. Her arguments are weak or underdeveloped*, her delivery monotonous and the whole thing just felt lifeless. There is certainly a lot that could be said about all of these tropes and the industry itself but, based on this, she doesn't appear to have the insight or the teeth to really dig into all of that. Maybe she's just warming up but at the moment it feels like she really needs a partner; someone with more fire in their belly to balance out her more moderate approach.

    * One example, for me, was the whole 'woman == ball' thing. I thought 'hmm, that is kind of true, the main villain is far more developed or prominent as a character than the damsel' but she didn't take that thread anywhere.
    No did you skip all of my comment where I talk about the rest of the video?

    Yes she mentions about how they've been used since we started telling stories, but to mention that and then go on to just start pointing out that they're used in games as if games made up the trope or games are the only medium that still use the trope is just silly. I only point it out because she spent maybe 2 minutes talking about the history of the trope and then another 18 minutes talking about it in two big video game franchises and then another 2 minutes talking about it broadly across other games. At no point did she ever bring anything new to the discussion or show how the trope being used in games is any different/better/worse/just as bad as using it in a movie or book.

  15. #95
    Network Hub Dubbill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wengart View Post
    Off topic, but does anyone know what the game with the cavemen is at the 11 minute mark?

    Joe & Mac
    . I've never heard of it but it's captioned in the video.
    Open-faced sandwiches are upon you whether you would risk it or not.

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dubbill View Post

    Joe & Mac
    . I've never heard of it but it's captioned in the video.
    Classic arcade game. Shame on you people.

  17. #97
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    oops, had comments disabled during the video. I recall playing this game at my aunts for hours and hours one weekend.

  18. #98
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    To the people who want to vomit or are disgusted by this thread, you must be the most innocent people on the web and I wish I had your innocence. I'm in Camp Soldant here, you can't start tarring us all as horrible because one guy was stupid enough to make a "LOL HER FACE" comment. Tar him, go nuts. If it makes you all feel better I'll go back and rewrite my post and replace every instance of "her" or "she" with "the video", though I'd like to point out I originally didn't because I discuss a video by a woman the same way I discuss a video by a man.

    Apart from two or three posters who made very stupid remarks about her appearance or her being a her, people are picking holes in the video presented because it is not a good video. Not because it was made by a woman.

    If this had of been a video from The Nostalgia Critic, The AVGN or some male journalist I'd equally have pointed out how bad it was and how he didn't need to run a KS campaign for it.

  19. #99
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    But the comment about her face is still a comment about her face. You can try to slide it aside, but it still was still randomly turning attention to appearance.

    Doug Walker can get criticized for, I dunno, mugging too much because it takes away from the content of his reviews and goes over the top. But no one ever said "review's bad, oh my GOD look at his dorky ass beard what an unattractive specimen."

    I'm not contesting she needs more fire with this. That part I totally agree with. I feel like she didn't talk enough about the social institutions that create these kinds of tropes and what the implications behind the tropes are in a societal context vs. a gaming context.

    It felt just like a list. Which can probably get the attention of some new people, but not a whole lot who haven't already noticed. But one episode doing that doesn't exactly grind my gears yet.

  20. #100
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Jesus_Phish's Avatar
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    I'm not trying to slide is aside! I didn't make it. Neither did Soldant. Neither did the majority of people who are discussing in this thread. You can't say the entire thread is vomit inducing because one guy made a fool of himself. That'd be like saying "This one time, I stood next to an Irish man and he smelled of cheap beer. Man, all Irish people are so smelly."

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