Eve Online Dev Responds To Incarna Anger

An unimpressed Eve player, yesterday

Eve Online community overseer and marketing manager Pann last night responded to the anger among Eve players regarding the recent microtransaction-heavy Incarna update (which our own Alec examines here) and a leaked CCP internal memo entitled “Greed Is Good” (which you can download here). In a post on the official forums Pan apologised for not making a statement sooner and says that as of today the developers will start “getting some info out” regarding players’ questions. Read the post in full after the jump.

Another reason for many players’ anger is the open secret that Incarna represents a heavy-duty roadtesting of both the microtransaction tech that’ll be used in Dust 514 and the humanoid avatar technology that’ll be used in CCP’s upcoming World of Darkness MMORPG. At the Eve Fanfest this year the same grumbling could be heard everywhere from the smoking tent to the lecture halls- everybody there had signed up for a game about spaceships. It was one thing for CCP to be taking the game in a new direction with all of this “walking in stations” stuff. What was breeding ill-will was CCP taking Eve in a direction that benefited them.

(Eavesdropping on one such grumbling session I dd overhear by far the best quote of the weekend, though. After listening to his friends bitch about Incarna, one Russian guy piped up with “It’s not so bad. Now when we’re sieging player-owned stations we’ll be able to have sex with one another.”)

Anyway, here’s Pann’s statement to the community. There’s very little to see here besides the evidence that CCP are, at least, aware of the anger.

Hi, everyone

Some of you who have been around for a while may remember me. I was the original community manager for EVE. These days, I oversee the PR and Community teams. While most of what I do happens behind the curtains, I am still aware of what’s going on front and center. I would be lying if I said that what’s happening now didn’t make me sad, but I’m not here to ask for your sympathy. To be perfectly honest, I’m here to buy time while we try to sort things out. No sense in lying about it so I’ll call a spade a spade.

It’s clear that many of you are (understatement alert) angry. There’s a lot happening, things are changing quickly and we haven’t been as forthcoming as you were used to in the past. I’m willing to step out front and take a lot of heat for that since I was the one who made the decision to hold off on responding for a while to see if things cooled down once the new wore off.

I was wrong to do that and I apologize. We should have said something much sooner. We should have done more to address your concerns and be forthcoming, even if we weren’t going to be able to immediately give you all of the answers you were looking for or the answer your questions in ways that will instantly turn those frowns upside down. To be even more candid, I cannot answer all of your questions, either, but I am working with the people who can to start getting those answers for you. Again, I know we’re doing this past the expiration date of your patience but I hope you’ll bear with me.

I know that, with very few exceptions, most of you don’t know me from Adam. I haven’t earned your trust or respect; therefore I have no right to ask anything of you – but I am going to try, anyway. Can I please count on at least some of you to help bring the pitchforks and torches down a few notches?

Like I said, I won’t be able to answer all of your questions tonight, but I promise we’ll start getting some info out tomorrow. As I see it, the chief complaint is regarding the high cost of goods in the Noble Market. Second, many people are unhappy about the Captain’s Quarters. Third, there are some performance issues with Incarna. I would appreciate it if you would confirm my observations or tell me what I’m missing, but I do ask that you do it in a productive way. I will remove posts without prejudice if they are counterproductive to the conversation I hope to have with you.

If you’ve read this much, thanks for staying with me. If you have something to say, I’d like very much to hear it.

Humbly yours,


  1. markcocjin says:

    Too long, I just scanned.

    What caught my attention was the comment about having sex with each other.

    That is all.

  2. RCGT says:

    CCP is in full on damage control mode.

    They don’t understand, and perhaps never will, that microtransactions for GAME-AFFECTING, NON-VANITY items is worse than a non-starter.

    It is the death of the promise of EVE – that player efforts matter, that the player-driven economy matters, that emergent player-created stories matter.

    And the players are jumping ship.

    CCP uses the golf analogy. Golfers spend tons of money on better clubs – wouldn’t EVE players spend tons of money on better ships, weapons, etc? Well, this is hardly like buying clubs – it’s more like paying off the golf course to change your score, so you have a hole-in-one on every hole.

    This is EVE’s NGE moment.

    • ragingjambo says:

      I don’t understand how charging for vanity items is the end of the world for Eve players? Other games have been doing this for years, TF2 hats for example.

    • Ovno says:

      Read the leaked doc they are already talking about charging real money for balance changing items in eve, not just incarna, wod or dust…

      This will completely destroy what makes eve such an involving game to play, if you try hard enough you can beat anyone and do anything, now it will be if you pay enough…

    • IchigoRXC says:


      I believe he said non-vanity items, hats in TF2, costumes in Guild Wars, these are vanity, he is talking about bigger badder ships that you don’t have to work towards, or the like. Balance changing for the rich and/or foolish.

    • Jonny Stutters says:

      Errm, plex… multiple accounts…? There have been ways for people to buy an advantage in Eve for ages, it’s one of the reasons I gave it up.

    • RCGT says:

      Read my post about economy a little farther down.

      PLEX and non-vanity MTs are fundamentally different.

    • Lobotomist says:

      This could be easily EVE – NGE moment.

      Well , everyone has to fall sometimes

    • mbp says:

      Not true. Plenty of successful games have game enhancing non vanity items on sale in the cash shop. World of Tanks is an obvious example but lots of other f2p games like Lotro, Everquest 2 do it . If it is done in a sensitive way that allows players to save time but doesn’t convey an “I win” advantage then there isn’t a problem.

      Its the €50 monocle that is the problem

    • kyrieee says:

      That CCP chose Pann as their sacrificial lamb shows that they’re in full panic mode, but as always they will only try to remedy the symptoms and not the disease. I think the game has at best maybe two more years before a mass exodus unless they really start turning things around.

    • PopeJamal says:

      This is business as usual, I I don’t see what all the fuss is about. All they’ve done is added ANOTHER, unfair/non-gaming way to succeed in Eve:

      “Hey, I need some money to buy a top-end competitive ship. Hey! I know what I’ll do! I’ll scam somebody out of a ton of in-game cash and then use that to get my awesome ship. Mission: Accomplished.”

      That has absolutely NOTHING to do with knowing how to play the game and everything to do with being an asshole in “real life”. No game mechanics involved.

      “Hey, I need some money to buy a top-end competitive ship. Hey! I know what I’ll do! I’ll use alot of my “Real Life Monies of Awesomeness” to get my awesome ship. Mission: Accomplished.”

      That, also, has absolutely NOTHING to do with knowing how to play the game.

      This has been coming all along. Eve players were just to busy worrying about how to stick it to each other to realize there was a big lubed-up threat slowly creeping towards their back door.

      One good turn deserves another IMHO. That’s why I stopped playing Eve during the first year after launch.

    • Wulf says:

      Well said, PJ. That was the feeling I always got about EvE, too, that it was more about players coming up with inventive ways of sticking it to each other than anything else. The goonswarm went a great way toward offering me proof to back up my gut feeling, and your words do all the more. This is just CCP doing the ‘sticking it to people’ thing, which has been happening in EvE for a long time.

      I got this feeling early on listening to EvE players and how they consider all other MMOs to be ‘kiddy themeparks’ with ‘no real loss’ and ‘no real competition.’ And when probed about this, what they wanted was ways in which they could really be dicks to other players, but when a game institutes a system of fairness, they consider it a ‘carebear’ element.

      A great example of this was an EvE player telling me that having instanced resource nodes in GW2 is an incredibly bad thing and that it goes against an enjoyable gaming experience, that people being dicks to each other should just be part of the game, and no game should ever get in the way of that regardless of what any of the players involved happen to feel. Which is how EvE handles it, he told me.

      So in other words, Guild Wars 2 offers a way where all players approaching a resource node can actually get the node and depart the area as friends. This is the way that Ultima Online did it, too, and that made me so happy. Does anyone remember mining in Ultima Online? You could go mining with ten other people and have a nice, friendly chat as you were hammering away at the walls.

      I think it was Final Fantasy XII that first changed that. “IT IS A RESOURCE NODE! IT IS MINE!” occurred, followed by people dogpiling on the node. There was never a fair way to mine in FF XII. And WoW had that to a lesser degree where you’d feel sour if someone came along and started mining the node that you were already mining, and that was just a drawback of the game that allowed people to be jerks. It’s really just different design philosophies.

      GW2: Our philosophy is that outside of PvP, if players come together we want them all to come away from it happy, that they’ve engaged in a positive, social experience. No matter what it is they happen to beE doing.
      EvE: Our philosophy is that if players come together in any scenario, we want some or all of them to experience the hard truths of life. Some of them are going to be pissed off, and some will call for a better game, but that’s just too bad. They’re just ‘carebears’ and we don’t care about no damn ‘carebears.’ If they’re pissed off because of our game, that’s their own damn business.

      So EvE kind of breeds this notion of screwing people over as a part of the game design philosophy. What I’m seeing right now is a shift away from that. You have games like Darkfall and Mortal Online, but they have tiny userbases compared to games which are attempting to open up the player experience and make it better for everyone involved.

      Here’s what it comes down to…

      To be honest, I don’t want to be in a situation where I strongly distrust and fear every other player I see, and where I feel that way about the developer in question too, where everything I’ve done in the game could be taken away from me in the blink of an eye. EvE has always been about this. CCP are now just demanding their slice of the schadenfreude.

  3. MajorManiac says:

    “Greed Is Good” – Name of the next update perhaps?

    • RCGT says:

      Seriously, read that leaked newsletter. CCP officially stopped being one of the “good guys” for me when I saw what they were telling themselves behind closed doors.

    • Wulf says:

      Considering the nature of the game they were making I always felt that it was incredibly naive to consider CCP to be the good guys, anyway. To be honest, I feel that the nature of a person or collective entity comes over a lot in not so much what they want to make, but how they go about the execution of making it.

      I got bad vibes from EvE from the get go, and thus, by proxy, I got bad vibes about CCP.

  4. talon03 says:

    That’s essentially 5 paragraphs of bluffing devoid of any actual information. I’m not entirely sure what he was hoping to accomplish with it.

    • Malibu Stacey says:

      See the part in the first paragraph where he says this is basically him stalling for time, go read that a couple more times until you get it.

    • talon03 says:

      Meh, the fact that he’s admitting to wasting everyone’s time doesn’t make it any less acceptable that he’s doing it

    • Batolemaeus says:


      Valerie ist one of the venerable old people. That they’re sacrificing her to take the bullet for their ineptitude is telling a lot.

  5. quirkymonsta says:

    Read that second line as “These days, I oversee the PR and Community tears.”

  6. grasskit says:

    link to 1.bp.blogspot.com

    that is all

  7. Kirioth says:

    Oh CCP, you so silly.
    They were doing so well. Popular game with interesting economy, good expansion release rate, and most importantly, they really seemed to really like the community they’d brought together.
    Still, cash is cash. Nothing like pissing off your relatively small customer base in the attempt to sell pointless shit to people who don’t want it. That’s just an outsiders perspective by the way, I did try EVE but found that I couldn’t quite get to grips wiZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    • Acefrog says:

      There planning on selling more than pointless shit is the thing people are pissed about.

      Oh and the fact that they have stopped adding gameplay content which lasts literally less than 5mins.

  8. Ovno says:

    I think I’ve just been sick. (Read the leaked doc)

    Does anyone else remember that april fools dev blog about micro transactions, and how in the comments to they said they would never ever allow micro transactions in eve…

    How the mighty have fallen…

    Glad I quit a while back.

  9. Kelron says:

    I read the leaked pdf, it’s very interesting. I can’t say I agree with everything in there, but some people seem to think games developers live in a magical fairyland where the ultimate objective is more fun for existing fans even if it comes at the company’s expense. Obviously any company wants to make money, but on top of that they NEED to make money if they want to be successful in the long term. CCP’s pipe-dream is to have EVE still exist in 50 years as some kind of all-encompassing universe simulator. In the shorter term they’re developing major additions to EVE and 2 more ambitious games.

    An internal newsletter can, and should, speak honestly about how they plan to fund this. Press releases from any company will be wrapped up in comforting marketing speak to stop people reacting like they have to this. The costs of their development projects and of running EVE must be constantly rising, but are new players picking EVE up at a high enough rate to keep up? I’ve seen suggestions that they should talk about raising subscription fees rather than adding microtransactions, but that would hardly go down any better with existing players and would make it even less attractive to new players.

    To quote the newsletter, “The market is changing and has been for years now… Adapting to a business model that is not only becoming increasingly commonplace, but fast becoming the de-facto standard, is essential”. As a company, they can’t afford to ignore a major change in the market when the majority of other MMO companies are already getting on board.

    • Acefrog says:

      Its more like NeX is just a money on the side thing.

      Since they can fund a compeletly new MMO I am pretty sure they are doing well enough to continue proper development on EVE. I am sure they have investorys to fund there petty side-projects

    • Psico_Payaso says:

      Agreed Kelron. But could you maybe explain to me what exactly happened? I mean, i have realized that they want to insert a micro-payment function into the game. Appart from that, what else happened to enrage the EVE players so much?

    • Kelron says:

      There was the suggestion that you might be able to pay real money for balance-affecting items in the future, but I don’t really see how that’s different from what people can do now by purchasing PLEX for real money and selling them for ISK. It simply removes a step.

      I suspect the main cause of anger is that CCP want new players and new money, rather than catering to every whim of the existing community.

    • Psico_Payaso says:

      Well, if that’s the case, then I really cannot see the reasons behind this uproar. You could buy items, indirectly with real currency, now you can buy items directly with real currency. Trees or Living organisms consisting primarily of wood with leaves on the upper extremities. If you get my poor metaphor :)

    • steviesteveo says:

      Is it actually wrong for players to expect developers to give them more fun? And perhaps even to complain if they fail to do that?

    • Psico_Payaso says:

      Of course not, but why didn’t they complain about that “paying real money for ingame money” option? The second it becomes official and not subtle everyone is complaining! I have to say I am just assuming here, since I am not an EVE player, I just recently became interested in this game.

    • Malibu Stacey says:

      I don’t really see how that’s different from what people can do now by purchasing PLEX for real money and selling them for ISK. It simply removes a step.

      Other than completely bypassing the player-driven economy. Yeah that’s the step you’re bypassing right there, the part which makes the whole game hang together.

  10. Ludden says:

    I thought the Walking in Stations stuff was supposed to bring new players to EVE.

    Well, so far they’ve managed to scare me the hell off.

  11. RaytraceRat says:

    Dear CCP, please don’t ruin the game. I love reading about EVE and dream that maybe one day I will have enough time, skill, patience, social skills and financial acumen to play this game.

  12. Zonejeu says:

    I do feel for their staff and community people who are all very dedicated to their job and the game itself, however messing up this bad with a game this old is a tough take… I’ve been playing EVE for 3 month casually, now canceling my registration by lack of time mainly, but this update was a simple trigger I guess.

    Let’s hope they’ll be able to fix it soon and in a good way :-/

  13. Ertard says:

    Did they just hire the remains of Kaupthing Bank for their business development team or..?

    They’re quite likely signing their own death sentence, unless they manage to make the game very accessible for a mass market. No one from the F2P crowd that pays for shit is going to take the time to get through EVEs atrocious learning curve.

  14. max pain says:

    But is it a CCP game?

  15. thebigJ_A says:

    Read the leaked doc. I think I’m gonna be sick.

    I played Eve for 6 months or so some years ago. I’ve always had a soft spot for it, even though it wasn’t for me. A big part of that was because CCP seemed like a unique company that really treated their community well.

    This shit, though. Man. “Hey, golfers spend money on golf clubs. Maybe we can get these suckers to spend money on ships!” Gross.

    This lost them at least some money. I was going to give Dust a try. Not any more. An fps, on a console, and they’re going to finance it via microtransactions? Not even vanity microtransactions, either. Who here wants to play a shooter where you never know if you lost because you weren’t as good as the other guy, or because the other guy spent a fiver on an uber-gun? I sure don’t.

    • wu wei says:

      For me, more than anything else, it was the “I shop there for I am” graphic. What that one phrase revealed about their corporate view of me as a consumer said everything I need to know.

      See, I thought maybe I paid them money on a monthly basis to develop the game I was paying them for, not to use it to find new ways to make more money from others while charging us to beta test the engine for their next MMO.

    • Batolemaeus says:

      This felt much worse:
      “You can develop a friendship by ‘spending’ your time, or you can pay to get the same benefits that friendship would otherwise allow”
      To which I honestly have only one response:
      “Fuck you”

    • Sarkhan Lol says:

      That they would paste Barbara Kruger’s stuff into something like this demonstrates pretty clearly that they have no self-perspective.

  16. Psico_Payaso says:

    Also I wonder why they wouldn’t check the current situation and needs of the players (the consumers, after all) and act accordingly. I mean with the furious response on EA’s BF3 poor pre-order decisions and the ones before that and all, one could easily realize that the micro-transaction business model would not be welcomed with open arms by the veteran EVE players (obviously).

  17. johnpeat says:

    I think this is all a brilliant ploy to avoid people noticing they’re playing a JOB :)

  18. RaveTurned says:

    I don’t think I understand the logic behind the uproar. Can’t you already use real currency to buy as much PLEX as you like, which you can sell for ISK to buy pretty much anything? I suppose it depends whether the gameplay-effecting items they’re talking about are better than anything available on the market, but so far there’s been no details on that.

    Regardless, I wonder if this is a more managed PR play than it seems on the surface. CCP start charging for vanity items. A memo is “leaked” detailing a number of other things that they could theoretically charge for. A shitstorm occurs. CCP ask players what they’re most upset about. My guess is those points that provoke the most irate response are shelved, and the rest trickle into the game over the following months. Probably a much more effective mechanism for provoking feedback than a questionnaire or focus-group.

    • RCGT says:

      A lot of people don’t get this part.

      FUNDAMENTALLY, if you buy a PLEX from CCP, sell it for ISK, then buy a ship with ISK:
      Someone is using that PLEX for game time, portrait swap, character transfer, etc.
      That ship was produced by the in-game economy: shipbuilders who get their materials from miners and refiners.

      If CCP enacts non-vanity MTs:
      The PLEX is being destroyed. CCP doesn’t have to provide a true service for the money.
      The ship is magicked in from Neverland. The in-game economy is screwed. Ship-builders are screwed.
      CCP-driven, cash-driven.

      This of course is ignoring the balance issues that are brought up by “golden ships” and “golden ammo.” Namely, Pay-To-Win.

      EVE is unique in part because of its economy. CCP doesn’t get it.

    • Psico_Payaso says:

      RCGT, thanks to you I just undertstood what the real problem is. This makes of course sense.
      But will the economy really collapse if a small number (i assume small, because only the impatient people would normally buy stuff with real money, i am naive i know ; ) ) engage in micro-transactions?

    • RCGT says:

      link to hosted.corelicorp.net

      Broken promises don’t engender much faith.

    • weego says:

      There is no broken promise and those posts show careful business speak.

      “We will not introduce microtransactions into EVE” is a promise
      “We currently have no plans to introduce microtransactions into EVE” is a statement that can change 5 seconds after the person posts that and it was still true.

      Not that I’m saying that this is right, but using phrases like “broken promises” is emotive and not really appropriate when talking about the actions of a for-profit company.

    • abremms says:

      the economic argument is really the best one that can be made against buying ships outright with plex, but at the same time I have to wonder… if a t-shirt costs 1 plex ($19.95 i believe?), wtf are they going to charge for a SPACESHIP? maybe thats why MT prices are so rediculous? I dunno, i’m stil pretty baffled by the whole thing.

    • RCGT says:

      $5000 of course!

      link to xtranormal.com

  19. SuperNashwanPower says:

    As he is the overseer, I am calling this as a social experiment to see how annoyed you can make a community of people before they begin … depositing bricks in your living room. Via the front window. Hopefully Pann has the password or he will need 75 science to run off down that secret passageway.

    • Acosta says:

      Again, “She”, Valerie “Pann” Massey.

    • SuperNashwanPower says:

      Female you say, not male?

      Even if God HIMself offered me a gold plated Humvee, six gift wrapped hookers and thirty million pounds, I still could not be induced to give the slightest shit.

    • Acosta says:

      I was just correcting you. If you think I implied you should change your argument because she is a female, you are wrong (and it would be pretty pathetic, how old are you to even think I was saying that?)

  20. WMain00 says:

    I could see this ending CCP and Eve altogether unless they drastically change their tune. They don’t seem to understand that Eve is an extremely niche video game that is only popular to a very small percentage of the market. No matter how hard they’ve tried to make Eve a welcoming experience for newcomers, it is still a very dry and difficult game to get into, with a steep learning curve that puts off a vast majority of players. With competition on the horizon in the form of new space related MMO’s, upsetting the community they so heavily rely on for keeping them afloat is not a good idea.

    That and the likelyhood of success with Dust 514 is extremely low unless they put in some very thorough advertisement and PR strategies, which they can’t afford. That they decided to make the game exclusive to one console only effectively wipes out a good margin of the console market. Similarly if you ask most console gamers today who CCP are or what Dust 514 is, they wouldn’t be able to tell you.

    Really, I think the problem is that this is stemmed from CCP being made up of alot of players of Eve Online who have no concept of gaming reality other than Eve. Entire sections of the company are made of people who have dedicated a serious amount of time to the game, but don’t have the professionalism to consider the games market, competitors or proper business strategies. To them Eve is all. It’s not unlike Activision being solely made of yes-men in relation to Modern Warfare.

    Unless CCP seriously starts to properly consider its strategies and just how much it relies upon a very small and fragile community, I could see Eve ending within the next 5 years due to community exodus, and CCP collapsing not long after.

    • kyrieee says:

      Really, I think the problem is that this is stemmed from CCP being made up of alot of players of Eve Online who have no concept of gaming reality other than Eve.

      No, the problem is that the lead devs and the management don’t play EVE. They’re out of touch with the player base and they’re rapidly alienating it.

    • Pie says:

      They hire a guy from Citigroup to be CFO, I doubt he even understands what EVE is.

  21. sonofsanta says:

    So this is the start of a new golden age in F2PBSWAS (Free To Play But Still With A Subscription) games?

    I dunno, it just seems like CCP are making it easier and easier to stay away these days. I have no idea who their market for WoD is either, I suspect they’re expecting hordes of teenage girls to come flooding to them but I doubt very strongly it will happen.

    • Jae Armstrong says:

      Their market is, you know, people who play World of Darkness. They exist, you know. White Wolf didn’t survive two decades on a game line nobody played.

    • Batolemaeus says:

      Nope, not WoD players.
      The WoD mmo is marketed towards a young female demographic and designed with that in mind. That’s why there’s such a focus on fashion tech and compelling you to buy virtual shirts more expensive than the real deal.
      Sorry. :/

    • Hmm-Hmm. says:

      You mean the Twilight fanbase?

    • Wulf says:

      It’s been mentioned before but WoD isn’t actually WoD. It’s Vampire: The Masquerade (oWoD) Lite. My favourite parts of that roleplaying game (Mage and Werewolf) seem to have been ignored, and their media seems to concentrate on the ‘sexy vampire’ demographic. Sooo… there you go.

      Whomever Not Really Vampire: The Masquerade: Online (NRV:TM:O!) is aimed at, it’s not WoD players.

  22. tmargul says:

    My favorite quote: “Fighting wars with perseverance and real money”.

    Pretty much sums up the goal of a lot of game companies these days: set yourself up as an virtual arms dealer, and then have your customers compete to see who is willing to spend the most money.

  23. Dass_Jennir says:

    I don’t really see the problem. They already have plex which enable players to buy things for real life money anyway. As long as they let players sell the micro transaction items on the market i don’t see how it would be any different.

    • tmargul says:

      I don’t know that it is all that different. What should be disturbing, even to people who are ok with RMT (I’m not one of them), is just how much their game design is being driven by their desire to force people to the cash shops, instead of making an enjoyable product.

      That is really the biggest danger of microtransaction based models.

    • Malibu Stacey says:

      You can buy a PLEX for real money & you can then sell that PLEX in game for ISK. The point is that the ISK has to be earned by the player buying your PLEX from you & you then use the ISK to buy stuff all of which help make the in-game economy keep going. Also it circumvents the macro farmers ISK market or at least helps keep them artificially devalued which in turn means the in-game economy is healthier.
      The problem with £/$/euros -> items is that it circumvents the economy. Without the economy, EVE loses a lot of the appeal (oh me & my friends just blew up your pirate battleship with deadspace fittings worth hundreds of billions of ISK, poor you? Oh you just plugged your credit card into the website, spawned yourself a new fully fitted one & wiped me & my friends out).

  24. VelvetFistIronGlove says:

    From the bulletin: “Think of it like this: you can develop a friendship by ‘spending’ your time, or you can pay to get the same benefits that friendship would otherwise allow. (I’m sure you can think of a few other situations where one might temporarily ‘buy’ services otherwise gained only through social interaction.)”

    Yeah, I can think of one: prostitution.

  25. Huw Dawson says:

    EVE players doing what EVE players do best: resisting any and all change.

  26. Negativeland says:

    I will remove posts without prejudice if they are counterproductive to the conversation I hope to have with you.

    That’s not how you say “Sorry, we screwed up”…

  27. Aganazer says:


  28. Dave says:

    They fucked that right up.

  29. Tei says:

    I don’t think CCP has done anything wrong. And balances, bugs, patches, etc… are normal on the MMO genre. A patch can inbalace the economy… is a bug that the next patch can try to fix.

    Maybe are planning something nefarius, but has not done anything nefarius yet. The side effects of a vanity item, is not what I call a evil act.

    • Malibu Stacey says:

      The problem people have is that from their internal leaked comms, it appears they are looking very likely to do nefarious things as a follow on from the cosmetic.
      If you know someone is going to do something you won’t like, is it absolutely necessary to wait for them to do it first before you start protesting?

  30. Xizor says:

    Everyone getting reminded that the game industry is now a multi-billion dollar industry and is focused on making money rather than entertaining people.
    That said… I feel like CCP is a bit like Two-Face in Batman right now.. you thought they were good.. you hoped they were good… but in the end..

    • Wulf says:

      Of course, some of us knew that that DA was rotten to the core from the start.

  31. dwl says:

    I suspect they’re going to push a F2P model as soon as the micro-transaction code has been proven to work. PLEX must be costing them a lot of lost subscription revenue by now and I don’t imagine that new players are rolling in as steadily as they once did.

    • RCGT says:

      Every single PLEX on the market is bought and paid for. If you pay for your account with PLEX, all that means is that someone else is paying CCP for you to play.
      CCP loses no money.
      In fact if the PLEX is destroyed or used for MTs then CCP actually gains money. (Gained above and beyond the usual subscription fee, that is. They don’t even have to provide gametime.)

  32. TacKLed says:

    Someone better tell IA from Infinity to hurry up so they can capitalize on the downfall…. if this can be compared to SWG NGE.

  33. grasskit says:

    this details whats happening and why people are angry at CCP in very good detail. A MUST READ:

    link to eveonline.com

  34. HunterJax says:

    Yeah CCP really need to tread carefully, micro transactions for a game that is Pay to Play is definitely not what anyone wants, even for vanity items, The best way for CCP to make more money is to increase the player base, not try and suck more out of their existing players. Eve currently is a very diverse game and quite a steep learning curve but if they put their mind to it I am sure there is plenty that can be done/added/improved to attract a few more players without negatively effecting game play, As their customers I’m sure we can make a difference to the direction the games going if we all voice our opinions.

  35. Acosta says:

    I think the biggest problem seem to be the supposed internal leak, that I guess it’s authentic if they have not addressed it yet.

    Basically, lying is bad, and getting caught on it it´s worse.

  36. 0p8 says:

    ….like a lot of others, i subscribed to eve after reading the famous 2005 pc gamer mag article about guiding hand, and have played sporadically since.
    Having experieced, and grown to love the game, i would imagine now that the “trust is gone” (and knowing how emotionally invested EvE players are), that a player exodus will happen much sooner than some ppl have said.

  37. Grayvern says:

    You’d think the certified economist they employ would tell them that this is a bad idea.
    To my conception of morality however it seems downright filthy, if you are already making a profit while providing happiness, to decrease happiness to increase profit.

    That and if your game is really complex, time consuming and hard engendering a small but dedicated player base alienating those people seems like financial suicide.
    Because there has been no talk about how Eve will increase it’s audience, space stations don’t count when it’s arguably the core mechanics that make it inacessible.

    To be honest though ever since Braben made those idiotic comments about a metecritic for game reviewers I’ve decided that game developers don’t start out neutral, but have to prove their worth before I’ll care.

    • Acosta says:

      “certified economist”

      “greed is good”

      I don’t see the problem.

  38. echoMateria says:

    What happens here reminds me of “The Emperor’s New Suit”. People are finally coming out and saying what they were afraid to say all this time.

  39. Pie says:

    Played since RMR……loved this game so much.

  40. Grayvern says:

    Greed in economic terms isn’t good for real world examples see banking crisis that came from sub prime investments.

    In Eve terms they risk damaging the core appeal of the game, the simulation of economy, while failing to provide a new, meaningful, way to attract players.

    Sustainable profit vs unsustainable profit, CCP risk sharing the fate that 3D in cinemas seems to be undergoing.

  41. Acefrog says:

    Mass protests beginning ingame on all major trade hubs, shuting down access haha.
    Check, your move CCP.

  42. Highstorm says:

    APB Reloaded has been following a similarly hairbrained scheme. They’ve been having these fantastic “deals” of the week, allowing you to permanently unlock guns (as they’re otherwise leased for X number of days) for 4,999 of their G1 points. That comes to $62.49 (£39).

    Oh but if you’re a premium member, paying the 7 or 10 dollar monthly, they cut you a deal at 3,999 points! (Essentially $50/£31.)

    More than the price of a full PC game. To unlock 1 gun in 1 game. Thank you sir, but no.

  43. Kablooie says:

    Amazing. CCP really shot itself in the virtual foot, this time.