DotAbsolution: See Sins Of A Dark Age In Motion

So, which IS better - League of Legends or Dota 2? Never been quite sure.

Swapping deep space for fantasy, Sins Of A Solar Empire creators Ironclad Games have released some game and talky-head footage of their upcoming MOBA Sins Of A Dark Age – the main sins being wrath, greed, and – no doubt the most hated by its players – sloth.

It’s hoping to be a bit more dynamic than most, using its Realm Quests system to keep shaking things up, but don’t take my word for that. Here’s the game director himself showing off some of that ‘gameplay’ stuff that’s been quite popular lately. There will be clicking.

So, that’s that then. I’m really not a MOBA player, so correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m not seeing much there to rip players away from the likes of Dota – especially if the Realm Questing adds too much randomness to the game. If you’ve yet to dip in, does any of this look like something that will finally ignite that passion? How many of these games can the market support?

I suppose the same could be said for all genres though, and it’s not like we’re short on shooters or third-person action adventure games that look about the same from a distance. Still, I can’t help but wince whenever there’s talk of moving the genre it to the next level. The current one seems quite intimidating enough for me, without having to go get a stepladder.

Sins Of A Dark Age is currently in closed beta. Founders Editions are on sale if you want to buy access, along with a few heroes to get started with, some in-game funbucks, and a somewhat arguable definition of the words ‘Best Value’. The final, finished game will obviously be free to play, with the current release date simply promising “When It’s Done”.


  1. Jake says:

    Fire the tiny catapult!

  2. ScubaMonster says:

    I’m rather tired of all these MOBA’s coming out.

    • Xerian says:

      I’m inclined to agree that theres too big an influx of ARTS games as of now, especially since almost every single one is a dota-clone with a tiny twist. However I do think this game’ll prove to be intriguing, probably not for esport-level players due to the random nature of the events, but to a casual audience I LoL, RoI (its rise of immortals, right?) and other such games (Smite, Bloodlines)
      (Edit: Screw semantics. And me, in a none-literal sense)

      • Malfeas says:

        I completely agree.

      • Xocrates says:

        Please never ever call them ARTS again. They’re not RTS in any way shape or form, and they most definitely do not deserve the label “ARTS”.

        MOBA may be a stupid and utterly generic name, but at least it makes sense.

        EDIT: Amusingly, I just noticed you spend a lot of time on a crusade to call the ARTS which you gave up on. Personally, I still cringe just typing that acronym.

    • LintMan says:

      I just want a MOBA that is free of microtransactions, please. I won’t touch any of the ones which have that, which is pretty much all of them.

      • DerNebel says:

        Play Dota.

        Not even kidding, Dota has no microtransactions that affect the game itself. At all. There is not a single piece of gamealtering equipment for sale, nor will there ever be. So if you can settle for random drops and the (drop-dead gorgeous IMO) default ‘skins’, then you are in for a treat. Every single hero is available from the very start and there are no ‘masteries’ or ‘runes’ that you unlock with levels.

        Also, it’s no excuse to say you can’t get a key. All my friends got theirs ages ago and I’m sitting on 10 by myself. If you’re interested, just reply with your steam name or something and I’ll hook you and your friends up. You’ll have to wait for saturday though, since I’m away from my Steam PC.

        • LintMan says:

          Do you mean DOTA2?

          I think can probably live with microtransactions if they’re truly just for purely cosmetic stuff and not for equipment, new classes, temporary boosts, and/or grind-reducers. My Steam name is ZootSuitBryon, thanks.

          • Iain says:

            I added you on Steam. Before you play, read and watch some of the guides here:

            link to

          • Riggaboo says:

            Just wanted to add that I have some spare beta keys. If anybody wants one, just reply to this and I’ll send it along (as long as I have keys to send, that is).

            Dota 2 is a great game and, imho, the best spectator sport computer gaming has to offer.

          • jitenakansa says:

            iPhone 5/4S / 4 / 3GS Repair Parts! The iPhone is the most popular cell phone on the market and as Apple continues to provide more features and functionality this drop down in these devices, link to

          • LintMan says:

            Thanks, Iain.

            @Riggaboo – I’d like one, since DerNebel can’t send one until Saturday. (If you send it, I’ll post here so he knows not to send one later)

          • DerNebel says:

            Just send the man an invite :P

            If you have spares, it’ll actually be a good idea to send him 4 or 5. Dota2 is so much fun with friends. Just, you know, be mature about it. There will be games where everything goes horrible and you feel shitty. Don’t let that get to you.

          • LintMan says:

            Thanks DerNebel!

      • Malfeas says:

        Yeah, LoL doesn’t have game affecting micro-transactions either.
        Well it does, kinda, but all you can get, which affects gameplay, can be gotten quite easily (and quickly enough) through the “currency” you are awarded for won and lost games. The only thing you can buy only with this weird, so-called “real world” money are skins. That’s it.
        I think that’s the smart way to go. People like to customize and will pay for that, some people want to have things they could unlock by playing right away while some people simply want to enjoy the game and not be forced to shell out money simply to have an enjoyable time.
        Moba and LoL seem to get that.

        • vivlo says:

          Hey. I’m not agreeing. Beeing able to play any hero of the game hand-on, and not having to play 200+ hours to unlock them all and 200+ supplementary hours to unlock all the runes – or only one set of runes which fits to only one kind of gameplay – that doe smake indeed a big difference.

      • h4rdb0iled says:

        id love a beta key! steam name is jpepper


    • The Random One says:

      I’m rather indifferent to the success or lack thereof of genres I personally dislike.

      • SkittleDiddler says:

        I’m not. These kinds of copycat games tend to have a rather negative affect on the entire industry. Instead of concentrating on quality releases, we get developers who are only interested in following the trends and raking in the cash.

        How many years of boring-ass tower defense games did we have to put up with before publishers realized consumers no longer cared about that genre anymore? MOBA is headed in the same direction.

        • Mario Figueiredo says:


          First paragraph was just fine. Second one, not so much. What you got was years of Tower Defense games being lauded until people started to realize these were actually bad or boringly repetitive. Games like Plants vs Zombies or Defense Grid.

          The genre has been evolving since. Titles like Orcs Must Die or Defender’s Quest prove that it’s creativity and not repetition the standard by which a game should be judged.

          • SkittleDiddler says:

            That’s more or less what I meant to say, but my intense dislike of TD games left me raging a bit at the end there.

  3. chivs688 says:

    This will flop big time. The other big MOBAs in the scene, LoL and DOTA, are great games in their own right and are hugely popular. This seems to me that they just want a piece of that success, but it’s not going to work.

    It’s not the same as the FPS genre in that people will buy and play your game even if they’re already playing 5 other FPS’s at the same time. This is because RTS games require a lot of invested time in order to become good and get the most enjoyment out of it, therefore people don’t generally play 3 or 4 RTS games at the same time, it’s usually 1 maybe 2. With FPS games the games are so similar and easy to pick up and have fun for 20 minutes that it doesn’t matter how many you play.

    Plus the fact that this game looks to be much worse graphically, and this quest thing seems to be a simple way they are trying to be different without it really offering any significant benefit, I believe this game is going to have little to no players when it launches, let alone a lasting fanbase.

    • Xerian says:

      Please dont call them MOBAs, MOBA isnt even a fitting term, and its nothing but PR talk straight from the ever-so despicable Riot’s mouth. And ofcourse this game wont be as successful as Dota and League of Lesbians, but thats because of the obvious fact that it wont be able to become a proper ESport, mostly due to these “dynamic” quests. But yes, ARTS games, as they are in reality (MOBA isnt even a real fucking genre, so please stop using the term) require a lot of dedication, and when a big part of the game is randomised, it just doesnt do anything to attract so-called pros and whatnot, but sure it’ll appeal to the more casual ARTS audience.
      … And the game is way better graphically, than League – I dont see how you could state otherwise unless you’re legally blind on atleast one eye, or suffer from dual-lazy-eyes. (Is that a thing?)

      • The Magic says:

        Well MOBA personally MOBA I MOBA prefer MOBA LPG MOBA to MOBA MOBA MOBA and MOBA while MOBA ARTS MOBA has MOBA a MOBA nice MOBA acronym MOBA, I MOBA wouldn’t MOBA consider MOBA it MOBA a MOBA subset MOBA of MOBA the MOBA RTS MOBA umbrella MOBA term MOBA.

        A Dota2 Newbie

        • Muzman says:

          To be vaguely serious for a minute; MOBA will do as far as I’m concerned. ARTS makes me think of Savage 1&2 or even Natural Selection more than these games. It says nothing about the play format of heroes, creeps, lanes, towers, ‘ancients’ etc, all of which have nothing whatever to do with RTSs.
          Coining a new term (since dota clone is kind of lame) that refers to those particular features seems perfectly apt.
          (Also I wish people would actually call dota what it is now and then. There’s this whole fiction around it about defending ancients but people seem to have forgotten dota isn’t a word most of the time it seems)

          ed. hey replies have borked. Been a while since that happened.

          • Xerian says:

            (@ Muzman)*
            Yeah, its seemed to been happening quite a bit as of late – Seen it on a bunch of articles on the site – it made me nostalgic of the times when it would happend frequently and you’d have the weirdest of comments when taken out of context. And I guess you’ve got a point, however neither ARTS nor MOBA aptly explains or says anything about the very specific features of mobas, ARTS’, dota-likes or what have you. Although on that note I must say ‘meh’ to the fact that I for several minutes actually cared about semantics.

            Edit: God damnit. *It borked again.

          • wengart says:

            I just say I play a game in the genre. Since I play Dota 2 I am a Dota 2 player. The Dotalike games are rare enough, the two big ones being LOL and Dota/Dota2, that I can say that and be understood.

      • LintMan says:

        ARTS seems like an overly broad/vague description. As I see it, the main factor of all these games is the micromanagement of a single unit (or very small number of units).

        How about something like:

        SURTS – Single Unit RTS
        SSRTS – Small Scale RTS

        You can also throw a M for “micromanagement” in there to get:

        SUMRTS – Single Unit Micromanagement RTS
        SSMRTS – Small Scale Micromanagement RTS

        • Xerian says:

          Maybe. Possibly, but lets just say screw semantics and be done with it, I dont know why I even cared in the first place.

        • zeroskill says:

          It has already been established by all instances that matter (me) that the correct term is Lord Management games .

      • Kaira- says:

        Don’t call them ARTS, they have jack shit to do with RTS.

      • Turin Turambar says:

        ARTS is also not a fitting term as it can’t be applied to games like MNC or Awesomenauts or Smite.

      • Zeus says:

        @ Xerian: ARTS games, as they are in reality (MOBA isnt even a real fucking genre, so please stop using the term)

        In which reality do you presently reside? I’ve never heard that term in my life. MOBA is used by everyone from mainstream GameStop journalists at Game Informer to scrappy little underdogs here at Rock, Paper, Shotgun (who will surely wind up winning the big game and dating Game Informer’s girlfriend by the end of the movie).

        It doesn’t matter where the term came from, be it Riot’s PR team or a crack that opened in the sky, issuing forth the bellowing voice of God.

        The fact is, in our reality, people use the term “MOBA” or “DotA Clone.” But I see the latter going the way of “Doom clone” and other semi-derogatory genre names.

      • kaihu says:

        It’s generally accepted that the most accurate genre name for this type of games is ASSFAGGOTS –
        Aeon of Strife Styled Fortress Assault Game Going On Two Sides

        On the serious side, who the fuck still cares that Riot came up with MOBA. It’s a lot more commonly used. and frankly less confusing than ARTS (since, really, these games have little to do with RTS). Just let it go. It’s pretty much become standard, and everyone is ok with it except that one guy in every thread that argues about it. Nobody likes that guy.

      • dmoe says:

        When he said “MOBA” in the video I stopped myself from punching my monitor.

      • DK says:

        They are not ARTS. Dawn of War 2’s Story Campaign is an example of an ARTS. MOBAs are not.

        Multiplayer Online Battle Arena is a perfectly servicable term because it encompasses everything from Bloodline Champions, DotA, LoL to Awesomenauts – while other games that have battle, are online, and take place in arenas, like Quake, already have a genre that identifies them that prevents confusing them with MOBAs.

  4. Zeno says:

    “An emphasis on co-op play”

    So, err, like every other MOBA?

  5. bartmon says:

    Yeah…not a lot of differences here in terms of gameplay, aside from the realm quest idea (which I’m not sure is a good idea in a MOBA). My first MOBA, and only, MOBA is DOTA 2…and after nearly 300 hours I still can’t stop playing it. I agree with chivs, MOBA players won’t want to dedicate the time to master multiple games from this genre.

    Even after 300 hours, I’m still learning new things every match about different heros and various strategies. That’s probably what will keep my playing DOTA 2 for 300 more hours.

    • karmafarm says:

      Are you in fact copy pasting this same point umptyseven times all over the thread in the hope that it will inform and enliven the conversation? Cos if so it ain’t working. Also please stop saying league of lesbians, it’s not actually offensive enough for anyone to flame you but it’s not all that funny. It’s like breathing second hand smoke except it’s not smoke, it’s casual and pointless sexual objectification. That’s all, thxbai.

      • Koozer says:

        Maybe it’s actually a compliment, this being the only way her frustrated inner feelings can show as much?

      • Xerian says:

        I said it once because I thought it sounded funny.
        I’m sorry.

  6. Wonderboy2402 says:

    Big red warning flag goes up when I a hear a dev saying “stand out in many ways with innovative…” And then goes on to cite thing standard in the genre. And then looks exactly like the other games.

    • DerNebel says:

      I agree here.

      I think the biggest problem with the gameplay trailer was that they completely failed to convey any sense of players interacting with each other in fast-paced competition. Dota-likes (or ARTS’s or MOBAs or “Lane Pushers” or whatever you want to call them) thrive on two teams of players directly and indirectly competing in absolutely everything they do. For this competition to be exciting, the games need to be fast, brutal and demanding in almost every moment the entire game. In LoL, the only respite is the time to take to walk to lanes and Dota doesn’t even give you that. Smite fails in this aspect by giving you too many nobrainer moments in lane where you literally need to consider nothing, and this game looks to follow that path.

      Dota, LoL, HoN and, if you want to include it with this crowd, Bloodline Champions all excel in this. Smite does not. Demigod did not. I will assume the LotR one doesn’t either. And it looks like this won’t either, based on the footage and descriptions I’ve hear. “Realm Quests” belong in MMORPGs, not in a football match.

      There is a reason that League of Legends is the biggest game on the planet right now. It’s free, it’s fast, it’s fun, it’s superhard, and, when you start out, it’s very simple. The magic it has, though, is that it doesn’t stay simple. The more you play, the more the game becomes team oriented from start to finish. There is depth everywhere in LoL, and these developers need to realise that randomisation doesn’t make your game deeper, but rather the opposite.

      In short, I don’t see this game challenging HoN or BLC, much less Dota, and there’s no way in hell LoL will even notice it. Oh, and this implies that it won’t be a good game. Calling it now.

  7. ShDynasty says:

    Lifeless dev reading cue cards behind the camera makes me want to play game!

  8. Arathain says:

    Re: alt-text. You’re a mischievous man, Mr. Cobbett.

    I would imagine Ironclad are trying to do something a bit like Sins of a Solar Empire, in which they never made the mainstream, but acquired and cultivated a decent sized fan base who were willing to pay for expansions by doing something a bit different.

    I do wonder if that market space exists in the shadow of the two greats of the genre, though. It’s tough enough hacking out a persistant space with a multiplayer at the best of times. There are plenty of perfectly decent multiplayer titles with empty servers six months post release.

    How are titles like Smite and Bloodline Champions doing at this point, anyway?

    • Xerian says:

      As far as I know, Smite is still in beta.
      And… I’ve actually never tried Bloodlines.

    • Rubyace says:

      I haven’t played BLC in a month or two but when I did it seemed to have around 1000 to 2000 players online all the time. So not going too strong but still running. Thought the problem with BLC is the store which has way too high prices if you do not use real cash.

  9. Xerian says:

    Richard, a word of advice: Say ARTS instead of PR-fodder from Riot. Its in no way an actual genre, nor even fitting for the genre. And in my opinion, Sins looks intriguing, atleast for casual audiences, however I heavily doubt it will become an esports-game, or even game with a professional meta due to the randomised nature of these quest-thingiemajigs…
    Buuuut we’ll see I suppose.

    • Brun says:

      Despite your obvious pre-existing hatred for Riot, “MOBA” clearly, concisely, conveniently, and specifically refers to DotA-likes or LoL-likes – it’s the closest thing we have to a generally accepted name, and the debate over the term notwithstanding, *everyone* knows what you mean when you say “MOBA.” As such, its use by the article author is completely acceptable since it is the clearest way for him to convey his meaning.

      I think we’d all appreciate it if you didn’t troll every single post containing the phrase “MOBA” or “LoL-like” in this thread with some long-winded nonsense about how Riot is despicable and we shouldn’t use those terms, just to spite them. They are the quickest and least confusing means of referring to the genre.

      • Xerian says:

        But it isnt nonsense, and MOBA is nothing but PR-fodder from Riot, whom is indeed a despicable company.
        And I’m not trolling, I’m just trying to get my point across clearly, and teach people a thing or two in the process.
        And just… No. A ‘MOBA’ is the most loose term in the world. A multiplayer online battle arena game could be anything from LoL to Call of Duty…
        So please, dont say its concise, convenient nor clear. When it is none of said things.

        • Brun says:

          teach people a thing or two in the process

          It is not your responsibility to teach anyone. No one asked you for instruction. Condescending to everyone, based on the pretense that you’re some kind of “enlightened” individual, doesn’t exactly help your cause either.

          And just… No. A ‘MOBA’ is the most loose term in the world.

          Stop with the pedantry, please. While it’s a loose term in the most literal sense, by convention it refers to a very specific subgenre of game.

          • Xerian says:

            I’m in no way acting nor thinking that I’m enlightened or anything. I’m just utterly bored, and it is a fact that moba is a horrible term and no matter who coined it or where it came from, it doesnt even fit the genre very well, and its looseness could easily lead to people using it for games that’re irrelevant to the genre, thus why I reckon something like a MOBA-ARTS-thing-lane-pusher-RAHRAHRAH would be more appropriate, rather than simply calling it a moba, but that may just be me going all OCD over it, but its just a silly description of a game, as it doesnt even mention any of the key features of the kind of game it supposedly applies to.

          • Brun says:

            I’m in no way acting nor thinking that I’m enlightened or anything.

            I’m guessing you misspoke and meant Dota clone, however its a-okay. You’re only human afterall

            Thus you’re bad for using it, and you should feel bad.


            it doesnt even fit the genre very well

            Again that’s just in the literal sense. Plenty of other terms don’t always fit their genres – RPG being the best example.

          • Xerian says:

            That was sarcasm. And quite obvious, too – unless you’re not too bright anyway, which I’m in no way inclined to think about you though. And I’d say RPG fits quite well in most cases, you’ve nearly always got a role which you act out in a number of ways, be it a dragonborn, a guy hunting monstrosities, mutants and other baddies, or some lad or lady infected by some thingiemajig hunting other thingiemajig-infected thingiemajigs.

          • Brun says:

            And I’d say RPG fits quite well in most cases, you’ve nearly always got a role which you act out in a number of ways

            Clearly you’ve never seen Wizardry’s comments on this matter.

          • Xerian says:

            I definitely have – Hes in my forum signature. Oh how I do love that guy.
            Seriously. Hes entertaining as hell. But yes, I realise I’ve gone overboard with the ‘hatred’ for the name moba, and I’m sorry. I guess being sick and bored and having nothing to do got the better of me, and screw semantics. Whatever you call the genre, its a lovely genre and I sincerely hope theres room in it for this game, as it does look like it’ll be rather good, even if it adresses another type of player.

          • Sian says:

            “And I’d say RPG fits quite well in most cases, you’ve nearly always got a role which you act out in a number of ways, be it a dragonborn, a guy hunting monstrosities, mutants and other baddies, or some lad or lady infected by some thingiemajig hunting other thingiemajig-infected thingiemajigs.”

            And that’s about as loose a description of roleplaying you can get. By that logic, EVERY GAME OUT THERE is an RPG, because you always take on some role or another. As an avid fan of pen & paper roleplaying, I’d prefer to not call any game on a computer an RPG, because the freedom to truly play a role can only come with a human dungeon master/storyteller/game master/what have you. Computers are, by their very nature, too rigid. That being said, I’m not going on a crusade to abolish the term because it’s the accepted standard in the scene. That’s how language works: terms and words evolve naturally. Forcing a change never works.

            The only thing I do get into arguments about is abbreviating MMORPGs to just MMO, simply because there are other types of MMO out there now and we should be able to clearly tell them apart.

    • Richard Cobbett says:

      ARTS is no more meaningful a name, it’s just the one you prefer. And when companies like the above are happy to just say “MOBA” on the grounds that everyone knows what they mean, I really don’t care who coined it.

      If Riot had gotten everyone calling them “LOL-alikes” or whatever, I’d see the distinction. As it is, MOBA seems just as good a way to describe the genre, is more appropriate for its sub-genre since nobody else has anything similar to compete with it, unlike RTS, and sounds better anyway. So, for the moment, I’m going to keep using it since it’s the one I prefer to use. Sorry.

      • Xerian says:

        However ARTS is an actual genre.
        And god almighty, I’d love for someone to make an FPS game called DUTYFACE: LEGENDS OF FACEWAR AND BATTLEDOTAFIELDS.
        That would be an amazing game.

        And an edit would be the fact that you shouldnt be sorry whatsoever, but I just oppose the term quite heavily as it doesnt even give any sort of description to the genre, which is a genre I quite love…
        Hence why I find it to be a silly term.

        • Cosmonaut Zero says:

          MOBA is not a great term for a genre, but then neither is Survival Horror, and that stuck. Language is funny like that, and it is never beholden to our petty interests. None of the alternatives are great, and MOBA has a lot of momentum. You’re probably going to have to deal with it. I mean, I’m partial to LoMa, but that’s just because I think it’s goofy and fun, and I like initial-syllable shortenings more than acronyms.

          ARTS is misleading. The genre really doesn’t need to have anything to do with RTS. That’s where the first mods were made, sure, but clinging to that when the genre has grown into its own thing is like saying Myst is a Puzzle Powerpoint. There are MOBAs/LoMas/ARTSes/DotAlikes/whatever that don’t look or feel anything like an RTS. Does it feel right to call Awesomenauts or Super Monday Night Combat or Smite Action Realtime Strategy? It doesn’t feel right at all to me. And yet they are part of the same genre. What makes a LoMa a LoMa is much closer to a competitive action RPG with an accelerated pace than the RTS systems that were twisted to accommodate it originally.

          Actually, that’ll acronym up nicely. I hereby by submit Competitive Action Role-Playing Game, or CARP Game as the One True Acronym.

          PS: I’m sorry Riot banned you Xerian. But you probably shouldn’t take it out on us by spamming every single comment on an article only tangentially related to them.

          • Ergates_Antius says:

            Speaking of names that stick despite not really being “correct” : RTS. Very very few RTS games involve any kind of strategy, they should be RTT – real time tactics.

          • Xerian says:

            I wasnt banned, and really I havent the slightest idea why I’ve nearly spammed this entire post. I’ve never really been one for semantics, but I guess it just comes from my extreme dislike of Riot as of late. And I guess you’re right ’bout the RTS bit and all that.

          • Brun says:

            Agree. Strategy is for things like Civilization, Crusader Kings, and Total War. Starcraft and C&C are tactical games as there’s no large-scale strategic aspect.

          • darkChozo says:

            RPG is another one that only makes sense by convention. “RPG elements” encompasses mechanics that have very little to do with playing a role, and the term only makes sense when used in comparison to wargames in the context of tabletop gaming.

      • zeroskill says:

        I for one have read the PC gamer review of Dota 2 and if I may say so myself, it was nothing short of embarrassing. Therefore, frankly speaking, I believe your opinion in the matter, matters very little, since you, as a representative of the PC gamer site have already shown your incompetence in the growing field of ancient defending.

        Good day sir.

    • Ergates_Antius says:

      I hope you realise that your behaviour here today has pretty much guarenteed that no-one on RPS will *ever* use any word other than MOBA to describe these games.

      • Brise Bonbons says:

        I will continue to use LPG (Lane Pushing Game) and MOBA interchangeably, for the record; MOBA for convenience, and LPG for that smug sensation I get from feeling savvy about genres and stuff.

        Because surely everyone cares.

        I do think ARTS is nonsense, as nowadays pretty much every RTS is an action RTS. Not like we’re swamped with molasses-slow RTS games that emphasize careful thought over frantic clicking.

        • raydenuni says:

          LPG is my preferred name as well. It is specific enough that you wouldn’t call other strategy games LPGs.

      • zeroskill says:

        They are called Lord Management Games. Do you people know nothing.

  10. x1501 says:

    I still can’t believe that instead of making a full-fledged sequel to Sins of a Solar Empire, they’re working on this dead-end crap. Apparently Stardock’s grand idea of going Elemental instead of working on Galactic Civilizations 3 was that just too inspiring.

    • Xerian says:

      Yeah, I myself would love a sequel. I really liked Sins, and would looooove a sequel thats more polished and a tad more thought-out. It’d be lovely.

    • LintMan says:

      Yep, same here – I’d love to see Sins 2. Ideally with deeper gameplay.

  11. Turin Turambar says:

    Seems like another LOL clone, but with random quests put on top of it.

    I dunno, I don’t see this as being successful. They should have made Sins 2.

    • Xerian says:

      I’m inclined to agree, although I do think the genre needs more diverse gameplay rather than just the lanepushing we know and like / love / despise / what-have-you. We can only hope they do work on a Sins of a Solar Empire follow-up soon enough. If they arent doing so somewhere in a dark corner already.

      • Brise Bonbons says:

        I will agree with this. There is plenty of room to innovate in this format (team-based strategy that focuses on controlling a handful of units), and I think developers will need to stake their claim very far afield indeed, lest they be trampled underfoot by DOTA2 and LoL.

        And by far afield, I’m talking abandoning lanes entirely and adopting radically different game metaphors (i.e. SF/space; but I’m thinking something more like Drox Operative with a team vs team mode, rather than the pure “fight other team amongst lanes of creeps” of Stellar Impact).

        Personally I’d love to see an effort in this genre that focused on the economy and resource collection aspects of the RTS supergenre, but somehow I get the sense that I’ll be waiting a long time for the industry to make that game for me. Hmmm, now where did I put those SC2 mod tools…

        • Turin Turambar says:

          Oh, I agree there is room to grow for the genre, in fact I was saying this isn’t very innovating or different. It’s literally the same shit with a single new feature. That won’t be enough.

  12. elfman says:

    I really wouldnt go against the elephant in the room which is DOTA2 …

    • Xerian says:

      To me it seems they’re trying to reach another ‘audience’, which is the more casual ARTS-and-the-likes player, those that dont enjoy dota because of the many reasons that you dont enjoy dota, and those that dont like LoL because of the many reasons that you wouldnt enjoy LoL, and I really do think the random quests and whatnot would be substantially more fun to a more casual player than the same enemy champions in almost every match on LoL, or the many things to know about dota before you can even consider playing well. I for one will most likely be trying this game out, and if its good, mechanically solid and fun, then I’ll definitely be playing it from time to time.

  13. orionite says:

    If this was a single player game with quests, story and character development, I could see this as something I might be interested in. But why would I switch to this when I can already play LoL, DOTA or HoN? It doesn’t seem to add anything to the experience.

    • Xerian says:

      Well, it does give the player more diverse matches as opposed to the same-ole meta of LoL, or the many overwhelming features of dota, and that I think will be the main selling-point behind it. The fact that its got something that makes it stand out as a more casual and fun game, rather than ‘hardcore’ or what have you Esports game. I’m looking forward to seeing how well they execute it, cause I goddamn love Sins of a solar empire.

  14. MrWolf says:

    Hey, Xerian: MOBA.

  15. Valerius Maximus says:

    Wow, another MOBA. I’m assuming this is dead before it even releases.

  16. mariejanet657 says:

    Sophie. if you think Eddie`s blog is impressive… last monday I got a brand new Lexus LS400 from having earned $5074 this-past/4 weeks and just a little over ten/k lass month. it’s certainly the easiest work I’ve ever had. I actually started four months/ago and pretty much immediately started making a nice at least $79 per-hour. I follow this great link,

    • Xerian says:

      I agree that its an impressive blog. Last week I just got a brand new child!
      I stole it from a kindergarten though.

  17. Hobz says:

    If only someone could teach us that MOBA is not a genre and that we should call it ARTS…

  18. Rawrian says:

    I’d rather play Awesomenauts. It might be not so sophisticated, but it’s got a distinctive and consistent style.

    • Brise Bonbons says:

      As much as Awesomenauts is not my type of game, I do respect it a lot for doing something really different with the basic lane pushing mechanic.

      It is a great example of the right way to push the ideas in the genre forward. I’m afraid I can’t say the same about Sins of a Dark Age based on what I see here.

  19. Xerian says:

    I guess I should go away. I’m sorry but its a genre that I do quite love, and here is a company that I also do love trying to go into it, despite the fact that I’d prefer them do something else, but its an interesting proposal having randomised events happend in the game – – It’ll allow for much more diverse experiences.
    I’m looking forward to it.

  20. Trithne says:

    Pretty sure half the posts in here are Xerian. That’s dedication.

    As for the game itself, it looks really sluggish and samey. And the Dotalike sphere is concerned with competitive play, which abhors randomness like slugs abhor salt, so I don’t see their Realm Quests doing them any favours.

  21. krisanto says:

    I’m really really interested in Xerian’s backstory on why he hates the term MOBA with such a raw passion.

    • Xerian says:

      As am I, as I usually hate semantics and have no idea why I even care. It may just be the fact that I love the genre and find it to be lacking calling it such a dull and loose term. I dont know, and really I dont care, half of what I’ve said has been pure boredom and sarcasm. So really, I wouldnt take note. But thats just… Myself, I guess.

      • krisanto says:

        Oh, that’s disappointing. I was waiting for a long childhood flashback scene wherein the MOBA dojo murders your family, leading you to master the way of ARTS and seek vengeance.

        • Xerian says:

          I’d watch that movie. But fuck me, all of a sudden I have no idea why I’ve unleashed a flurry of semantics-based comments, I’m usually not one to comment very much, nor one to even like nor be bothered with semantics, I guess we can all learn from this though: Dont be on the interwebs when sick and all smashed by medicine :i
          Seriously, fuck me.

          • krisanto says:

            Hey, relax. I don’t think anyone here really hates you for that. It’s just really funny to see someone randomly barrage the comment section with arguments regarding the semantics between MOBA and ARTS.

          • Xerian says:

            I kind of hate me, cause I’ve managed to annoy myself with annoying behaviour. Especially as I hate it when people get all miffed and / or angry about semantics, yet I’ve just spent a great deal of time and tapping to discuss and talk about semantics. And okay, hate is a strong word. I’m most definitely miffed.

          • RedViv says:

            Bright side: You realise what you’re doing. Almost anything wrong with internet discussions comes from a blatant inability, whether intentional or not, to take a single step back and just observe, for a moment.

  22. Koozer says:

    This game has no style!

    The only original thing he mentions are those dynamic quests, which quite frankly sound a little bit annoying. It would be like playing a nice game of chess, in which you know every possible move and know where all the pieces are, and to suddenly be told that an evil wizard has spawned a dragon at c5 that will eat all of your units. It’s not fun, you’ve just ruined the strategy.

    • Arglebargle says:

      Yeah, I gave up on chess when they went algebraic. Dragon at c5?? No diginity! No panache!

      And what a terrible name.

  23. Totally heterosexual says:

    Where did my comment go? :(

    Game looks fine, im not all that much into MOBA’s myself but I enjoyed a lol match once or twice.

  24. Snargelfargen says:

    As a casual player MOBA player, I think the realm quests sound kind of fun; Adding a bit of randomness encourages improvisation, something which I think brings out the best in players of all skil levels. It definitely won’t level the playing field, but that’s not really the point. It just takes some of the pressure off of gettting a win. It would be nice if there was some sort of stats tracking for smaller objectives. As I see it now, the biggest problem with current MOBA’s is that there often isn’t any incentive* to keep playing or expend any real effort once one team has a significant upper hand.

    *Well there’s a punishment for quitting games, but that’s all stick, no carrot.

    Edit: Oh, my bad guys, I didn’t know this article was about acronyms. Calling games ARTS is dumb and confusing if you say it out loud. MOBAMBOMAOBOA

  25. Robin_G says:

    I’d have taken the fantasy flavored SoaSE style game over another Dota clone promising a unique twist only to die because it’s not Lol or Dota 2.

  26. BurningPet says:

    Cant believe _Hunter prevailed with this MOBA term.. it didn’t make sense the first time i heard it, it doesn’t make sense now.

    I cant help but feel this game will utterly fail and i really think companies should broaden their research beyond – what genre has lots of costumers right now.

    A very brief study would have proven most of those would not leave LoL/HoN/DOTA 2 and that this genre is too hardcore for people to devote themselves to more than one of these game. (ofc there are people who play both, i argue that those are either in transition phase or are really casuals who play where their friends currently play, either way, they do not pay a single dime on the games).

  27. RedViv says:

    And here I thought the creators of Lane-y Games would from now on take a good look at Rise of the Immortals, and realise that they need a rather distinct graphics style to make the game look and play enjoyably. Readability, folks. It’s not like this would be the first game of its type, or the first multiplayer game at all.

  28. mr.ioes says:

    This will be forgotten before it’s even released. Just like Crashers.
    Lackluster MOBAs don’t work, sorry. User chivs688 explained it well.

  29. Mark says:

    Quite interested in this one personally. The MOBA genre (who cares what we call it, honestly) really doesn’t actually have that many games compared to most others. I can think of more turn based strategy games a than I can mobas.

    For some reason people seem to think because LoL and Dota/Dota2 are really popular this means no one else should be allowed to make more games in the same category? I guess since we’ve got Call of Duty and Battlefield no one should ever bother making another FPS again.

    I realise most LoL and Dota players won’t want to learn another game but I’m sure there some room left for maneuver in the genre to make a game that appeals to slightly different people. Considering the whole genre starting out as a bloody Starcraft / WC3 map people seem extremely insistent that the magic forumla has been found and no other permutations could ever be even slightly worthwhile.

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  31. gromit says:

    Nothing against Ironclad, I wish them all the luck, but if anyone wants a Dota 2 beta key leave your steam name here and I’ll provide. Or bother any of your steam friends that has it already, they should have lots at this point.

  32. vivlo says:

    hm thi does look quite dull… i mean, the animation, the very first seen in the video, looked unattractive, unoriginal, and i thought “well, Dota2, you can keep me for a while still”. Am i the only one ?