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  1. #21
    Lesser Hivemind Node
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Judging from last night, comms are indeed still an issue. This was a scheduled op that had a continental objective, and on top of that we were working closely together with TVA. If that isn't a time for squad comms, i don't know what is, to be honest. What confuses me is how no one seemed to even be bothered by the 40 man + clusterfuck that was general comms when i joined, and then everyone being happy with ab + cd instead of proper comms. Maybe i', just grumpy, but we used to operate much better (and that's not just about comms, but also following orders).

  2. #22
    Lesser Hivemind Node
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    For the comms, I never noticed any grumbling or people not wanting split comms? When people said lets split comms it was done right away. AB + CD. Sure it is not optimal but I never felt that Alpha/Bravo had any problems splitting up while being in the same channel. The only problems where me trying to hear what the other ROs where doing while my squad was chatting away.

    As for orders, well I tend to not really give very strict orders when I PL because honestly I do not really care that much as long as people find someone to shoot in the face. Because really that is the fun part of Planetside 2 innit? All in all I think we had a pretty good night, the only think lacking imho was more communication between the different platoons we had up and general info on TVA. I think cooper did the best he could but having him both run a public platoon and run the TVA liason might be putting a bit too much on one person.

    Still the only thing that matters to me when I play or lead is basically are people having fun? Yeah? Well then we are doing good. Also, I think we did really well with the TVA cooperation on Indar supporting/getting support etc.

    But next time we have a TVA Wednesday or other organized evening maybe make sure we have a PL that is on board with the plan? Because I just happened to be PL because I logged in when the last PL quit, I had no idea what the plan was or if there were supposed to be any specific comms etc. I have been moving all week so I were not up to speed on anything.

    Edit: And no I am not bothered by 40 man channels most of the time, and I am definitely not bothered by AB+CD. You know what bothers me? Silent comms. So no I will not lobby to change comms, but if someone else wants to split, well speak up.
    Last edited by Wardancer; 13-06-2013 at 01:59 PM.

  3. #23
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus Cooper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    The public platoon was meant to be only a public platoon. Public platoons should never be anything but pubbies I've learned in the past.

    However when I invited Eso to be second squad lead so I could open up a second squad in the public platoon it coincided with the main RPS platoon getting full. So people joined Eso's squad as they logged in.

    This wasn't optimal at all so I tried to have it such that Eso's squad ran entirely seperately, not taking orders from me. I probably should have just kicked the squad from the platoon entirely and have them be the start of a second RPS platoon.

    Regarding comms. It's Wednesday, so things being noisy was expected. The problem was that there was never a comfortable break in the action in order to arrange split comms. I think the A+B and C+D worked, I don't think we needed anything less, except that Eso's overflow squad ended up with A+B and we still had a channel of over 30.

    As for details of what TVA was doing, that depends when you were playing. On Esamir we were kinda alone until about 9pm when TVA coalesced. At which point I was trying to relay what TVA were doing, but by the time we had split comms the best I could do was provide updates over the RO channel.

    Next week:
    1. Let's set up "dual squad" comms as early on as possible. They will fill up so if the C+D channel starts as three people, that's not need to worry.
    2. I'll run a public platoon but I'll do so as a completely seperate entity. It being a half-overflow platoon should never have happened.
    3. If I run as liaison again I'll do so from a quiet channel where all I can hear are ROs (the PL channel) where I'll get info from ROs and relay info back to ROs. It'll be the ROs' job to let squads know how we are working with TVA (because we were).

    With regards to working with TVA we had few closely-managed moments of cooperation. An armour push on Esamir stood out. Mostly, however, the coordination was at a strategic level. We were best placing our forces, responding to reinforcements requests, deciding where to push etc. Which is what TVA is best used for when there are a large number of active outfits (which there were).

    If people want more tightly knit cooperation (and this is both welcomed and encouraged) then we should think about SLs coordinating directly with TVA SLs using in-game text or TVA TS.

  4. #24
    Seems to be, from my point of view, that the disagreement that has been running away beneath the surface (and 'disagreement' is probably too harsh a word, because you're all pretty nice people on here, but I've seen this come up since the day I joined the outfit several months ago) is mostly between two sides claiming the other is 'having fun wrong'.

    As someone who plays and runs board, card and roleplaying games as part of my job (god I love it), I've become familiar with the concept of a 'social contract'. There's a bunch of material on the web for it, easily searchable, and the outfit rules-as-written pretty much mirror the idea quite well ('Be awesome to each other' etc.).

    The key idea is that you have to know what kind of game that the people you are playing with actually want to play. So in this case, do the people online and in mumble want to play in a very focussed tactical style, or do they want the banter and to still follow objectives, and so on. It's all about communication (ironically, but of a different sort).

    Other key things that social contracts enforce include not getting angry when something is going contrary to what was envisioned, and sitting down/talking about it, and that nail seems to be getting quite squarely struck on the head here.

  5. #25
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus sinomatic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Quote Originally Posted by PhatChance52 View Post
    The key idea is that you have to know what kind of game that the people you are playing with actually want to play. So in this case, do the people online and in mumble want to play in a very focussed tactical style, or do they want the banter and to still follow objectives, and so on. It's all about communication (ironically, but of a different sort).
    We are RPS: Banter is still a part of every single mumble set-up and playstyle that we have. I think it's important that everyone actually knows that.

    Splitting into dual or single squad comms does not necessarily mean a change in playstyle, it just means there's more room for people to hear orders, to hear each other, and for people to get the space to speak (perhaps people who don't usually speak up when the normal crowd are chatting away).

    A tacgir squad will use squad comms and aim for a change in playstyle (more tactical, focused, co-ordinated, do maneuvers etc), but there is still room for banter and chat and having a laugh.

    I thought it was important to reiterate this again as I heard split comms being referred to as 'tacgir comms' last night and wouldn't be surprised that the false belief that splitting comms means changing playstyle (or mood) may be at least partially behind the reluctance some people have about it?

    Personally, I'm equally happy in the all-in-one channel (provided it's not too messy) or in single squad comms, but as Wardancers mentioned it's no fun when there's no chat at all, and we need to work on that. It's really on the SLs and the regular chatty folk to keep the atmosphere up when we do split, and to (gently) encourage the quieter folk to brave the mic a bit more.

    Basically: we have room for all comm setups and playstyles, but we need to make sure everyone knows what they are, that they are welcome to ask for them, and ultimately that every style we have should still be chatty and fun because: RPS.

  6. #26
    Lesser Hivemind Node Grible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Quote Originally Posted by sinomatic View Post
    Basically: we have room for all comm setups and playstyles, but we need to make sure everyone knows what they are, that they are welcome to ask for them, and ultimately that every style we have should still be chatty and fun because: RPS.
    Whole heartedly agree!

    As one of the noisy ones I don't normally mind which type of comms we have - I'll talk in either, but it gets boring if the comms are silent, and we suck in game if they are too noisy. But clearly the Squad isn't functioning if their are no orders and call outs, never mind the banter, which actually helps keep people on mission most of the time!

    Way-back-when this all started (like November!) I was a bit against split comms as every time we split it became apparent that the noise in the main channel had all been created by about 10% of the people all trying to give orders - not in fact by the banter, which often promptly died. This situation has abated.

    I genuinely think now that we are more effective as an outfit in game, and the jokes are funnier on comms, in separate squads. Think of it as stand-up (group) vs sketch (split comms). Also it gives you ready made straight guy (mocking other squads efforts is fun!) I also heard voices from some relatively new guys the other night which in a mass group channel just wouldn't happen. (Which btw is clearly Dewi's fault. )

    If we split into channels people need to understand it's not about being "serious face" even true TacGir isn't mega levels of serious. Just cos you're going to go into a room by twos, use smoke and clear the windows doesn't mean you can't mock someone for running into a scat-max and falling off the balcony (afterwards!).
    I think we are in reality in danger of losing sight of the TacGir (Set moves, Special skills, New weapons) in favour of Squad Play (Follow my lead, Stick together, Watch the flank!). Not that Milsimming is going to over whelm the outfit suddenly.

  7. #27
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus EsotericReverie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Sweden (Göteborg)
    TrooperWally lead a really good TacGir squad tonight, being actually really focused. So that was good.

    And Coffeetable did a good job a while before that, moving about two squads worth of giraffes on a merry chase around Indar. I took over for a bit, which went okay in the beginning, and then I lost the momentum (damn cold!), at which point Laldy took over, bless him, and did well too.

  8. #28
    Secondary Hivemind Nexus WallyTrooper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Cheers Esoteric! I'm glad it seemed focused, at least for a while. I definitely faded (a consequence of a busy week of work I think) over the evening but Frozen Rain stepped up to take on the TacGir mantle and did very well. Particularly enjoyed getting into a lovely sniping position and calling out spots to the rest of the platoon - great work for a first time at TacGir, well done Frozen Rain!
    WallyTrooper = TrooperWally

    Wally is now on Steam!

  9. #29
    Network Hub Qw33r's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Germany, Baden-Württemberg
    I enjoyed the TACGIR, too. We were really effective, especially with that many Medics. Thank you for your great leading!

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