By Quintin Smith on October 28th, 2009 at 2:13 pm.
On the unlikely chance you’re familiar with Sci-Fi MMOG Entropia Universe, it’s probably because of the record-breaking prices achieved by its virtual sales. Reading about these figures is a lot like coming under artillery fire but with numbers instead of shells.
All of the following figures are in US dollars. Entropia Universe launched in 2003, and in 2004 the developers created a huge island complete with a scenic beach, monsters, and a massive mine. At auction, a player paid $26,500 US for that island. In 2005, another player paid the developers $100,000 for a space station. In 2006, that same player purchased a unique monster egg for $10,000, though the highest figure ever paid by someone for a piece of equipment is $30,000 for a high-tech Healing Kit. In 2007, five players (or more accurately five ‘avatars’ since one represented a real-world banking organisation) paid a total of $404,000 for five two-year licenses to operate banks within the game world, with each of the five avatars expending a further $100,000 investment to start their business.
Entropia Universe developers MindArk have a daily turnover estimated at some $1.25 million, giving it 15 times the turnover per player of any other MMOG and the new acronym definition of Money Money Online Game. Did I mention Entropia Universe boasts the key selling point of being “Free to play”? Crazy-bananas.
All this has taken place on Planet Calypso, Entropia Universe’ only current functioning world. There are, however, five other ‘Planets’ currently under development by third parties who have paid to become ‘Planet Partners’. Nobody knows how much the Planet Partners paid for this, but on the games’ forums the belief is that Planet Partners need to have several million dollars available for funding the project.
Mm. Facts and figures make me sleepy. To change tack:
Jim told me to check out Entropia Universe a few weeks back. I gave it the most cursory of glances, at first seeing something which kind of looked like a Futurist Wurm Online.
Now, one of my first pieces of games journalism was a tongue-in-cheek exposé of furry virtual world Furcadia. It started with a trip through all the scarcely populated family-friendly regions of the game before I finally reached the ‘Adult’ land, a place so choked with pleasure-seeking horses, foxes, badgers and dragons that moving your avatar was a matter of slipping into adjacent spaces as they opened up. There was a touch of the abyss about it. You were rooted to the spot in a crowd of hundreds of animal avatars, trapped with the thought that maybe 70% of the players controlling these animals were there for the purposes of masturbation, and perhaps 6% were touching themselves at that very moment. And yet the scene was so quiet, because any cybering was happening via private messaging. Like the autoerotic equivalent of a silent disco.
I mention this now because no other game since then has done such an incredible job of forcing the dank reality of humans down my throat. Turns out what Furcadia did for sexual loneliness, Planet Calypso does for avarice.
First of all, the structure of Planet Calypso- Wait. No. First of all: It’s shit. This game is shit. It’s a grindfest devoid of the colour, sense of place, charm and polish that makes that palatable. You [1] can [2] do [3] better [4], don’t go near it, don’t let your friends and family near it, and if they disobey you then make a habit of sneaking up on them while they’re sat playing and farting in their ear.
And can we stop using their glossy official screenshots and start using my in-game ones, please?
Thanks.
The structure here is similar to Eve Online without the player warfare (so, arguably without the point). Players on Planet Calypso earn cash either mining or hunting for materials, other players use these materials to manufacture items and sell them in shops, and the miners and hunters buy these items, creating a basic economy. There’s also a tertiary sector with room for hairdressers, shop attendants, make-up artists, pilots, animal tamers and newbie mentors.
Where Planet Calypso skews away from the norm is that this structure, and every other facet of the game, is saturated with money. In Planet Calypso you don’t pay a subscription fee, you only ever pay for in-game currency. $1 US is 10 Project Entropia Dollars (PED). Also, any player with more than 1000 PED can voluntarily cash out, receiving the money via official channels in their real-life bank account minus a transaction fee. So when a mid-level player makes a fancy gun, they’re also technically making, say, $2.
Naturally this paves the way for high-level players to make serious money from Planet Calypso, and plenty do. That guy who paid $100,000 for a space station is known as NeverDie. He turned the station into a resort containing shops, apartments, a nightclub, and 20 biodomes full of good huntin’ and mineral veins. 10 months after his purchase he claimed to have made that $100,000 back through little more than property rent and taxing the biodomes.
Calling the game ‘Free to play’, however, is reaching. New players start with nothing but a pair of shoes and a tattered jumpsuit that reveals patches of your bare ass. There are tutorials (inadequate ones; some altruist has placed a massive sign at the new player spawn telling you how to turn around) but you don’t get starting quests, and not only do you not have a weapon but you’re not allowed to fight without one. So you’re left with two options for making money. 1: Collecting sweat from monsters. 2: Collecting their dung. At the time of writing the sweat-collecting process had been removed from the game for tweaking, leaving you with the sole path of advancement of filling your pockets with shit then tramping back to town to see if you can sell it.
Maybe you don’t like collecting shit. So maybe you slap down $5 for a gun, ammo, some basic armour, some training and some pocket change. Oh, you’ll need ammunition too. Equipped, you return to the wilderness and start battling monsters. Suddenly you’re earning loot with a tangible, real-world value! You’re not just killing space Murlocs, you’re killing space Murlocs and getting 10p every time! The idea of making money from the game becomes very plausible. And the whole time you’re fighting the global chat ticker is constantly pinging, telling you such and such player just killed a monster worth $90, or built an item with a market value of $150. You can turn off these globals, but they come back on whenever you login. ‘This is the money you could be making’, the game is saying.
In all of this you’ve failed to notice your weapon’s been degrading, plus you’re out of ammo and hurting bad. So you slap down another $10, and this time spend some of it on increasing your skills. All of a sudden you’re embroiled in this game, this weird breed of unadulterated grossness where you end up trying to decide whether to stomach that horrible grind for another couple of hours or drop another $10. Suddenly you’re looking up to those high-level, high roller players, and wondering if you should become one. But the high level players have their own problems. Pets must be fed nutrio bars, and apartments need their monthly maintenance fee. Suddenly you’re not just hooked, you have a monetary investment in your character.
As an aside, this is the first game I’ve played where you can rent a sword from a bank.
Taking a trip to the forums there are some honestly worrying descriptions of how much veteran players are spending. People talk about dropping hundreds of dollars in a day, and I read one weirdly resigned user mentioning he’d spent upwards of $14,000 in total. In the same thread other players were complaining about the hourly cost of playing Planet Calypso. I say again: Not monthly, or even weekly, but hourly. Knowing all this, those mad numbers I dropped at the beginning of this article start to make a bit more sense.
Perhaps I’m giving the impression that Planet Calypso’s entire playerbase has been sucked into a money-vortex. It’s not quite so, because there seems to be an awareness within the community of the game’s failure to be a functioning economy.
It all makes me feel a bit ill. Think about what might have happened if Blizzard had made World of Warcraft using this model. When that thought occurred to me I shuddered for twelve minutes straight.
To close, there are a couple of good points to all of this. First of all, Planet Calypso seems to be losing its momentum. A lot of big-money players have been cashing out recently due to the odds turning against them, and the game’s tech upgrade to CryEngine 2 is likely one of the measures they’ve taken to revive interest in the game. The fact that Planet Calypso hasn’t broken any more records in the last couple of years is evidence of this.
Second, there is some creature design in the game I wholeheartedly endorse.
That’s all I got though.
I guess I’m writing as a warning as much as anything else. I hate to think of any of you guys getting involved in this bullet train crash of a game. It’s the sickliest thing I’ve played in a very long time.
28/10/2009 at 14:16 TotalBiscuit says:
What kind of idiot plays this game for any length of time without realising they’re being conned?
28/10/2009 at 14:27 Babs says:
Doesn’t that apply to any sort of gambling though?
28/10/2009 at 14:29 Lars Westergren says:
The state lottery: An extra tax for people who don’t know maths.
28/10/2009 at 14:33 Hendrik says:
The kind of idiots that spend all their money in casinos.
28/10/2009 at 22:32 Gutter says:
My brother is a compulsive MMO player, and when he tried Entropia he got lucky and found a mineral deposit that made him $600USD (thats how he explained it to me, so bare with me if this doesn’t sound right. I saw the payments receipt though). And yes, he got the money after a while, even if he is in Canada. He didn’t invest it in the game, he was fully aware that he just got lucky.
He isn’t playing anymore, and thats saying a lot about the game seeing as he will play anything that can connect more than 4 players in a game.
29/10/2009 at 00:52 CyberPunk says:
I have never depositted and have played for 2 years (nor have I accepted handouts).
The net worth of my account is hard to determine exactly but it is at least a few thousand dollars USD.
I started playing after getting sick of paying for other games just to get pissed off when developers made changes that destroyed all my hard work (had 2 Jedi Characters, on the same server and same account, in SWG before SOE nerfed the entire game, talk about disappointment). In other games, such as SWG, WoW, ect.; when you leave the game, all your progress is for nothing, in Entropia, if you’re smart, you can cash out your proceeds when you quit.
Entropia makes your time playing actually worth something.
There are some points in the review above which I can agree with; however, it is quite apparent to me that Quintin Smith is ignorant on many of the other points he’s made. Just like with any MMO, you need to have knowledge of the game to succeed, his lack of such has given him a poor experience.
Before you invest, take the time to learn the game, spend time sweating, trading, asking questions. If you are patient and determined, you can get by without ever depositting and play with the knowledge that you will succeed.
There’s alot of people who have negative views, many of them viewed the game as a casino, Entropia is not a casino.
28/10/2009 at 14:23 Antsy says:
3% of their player base is shuddering at any given moment, this article leads me to believe :P
28/10/2009 at 14:24 Lars Westergren says:
Go Sweden! mySQL, Spotify, and …. Entropia? Well, two out of three ain’t bad, I guess.
28/10/2009 at 14:28 The Codicier says:
i’m not sure whats more disturbing, the naked avarice of the game or the naked alien shlong of that mutant
28/10/2009 at 16:14 scoopsy says:
Yuck. “Maturity Class: Mutant” indeed.
28/10/2009 at 17:41 Stupoider says:
I also loved the “Spawn-time not yet known. Females have been seem :-D. Luckily!!”
LUCKILY.
28/10/2009 at 14:31 cqdemal says:
It took me a minute to register that it was a dong.
28/10/2009 at 14:31 phil says:
The games seems a nasty little mind trap, but on the bright side at least we now have another case study for the periodic games addiction threads.
28/10/2009 at 14:33 Quinns says:
Babs has the gist of it. The developers can still turn a profit if 40% of their players are walking away with more money than they put in.
28/10/2009 at 14:34 Flimgoblin says:
Can you actually do anything in the game without spending money? i.e. can you progress without spending a penny? or is it a case of keeping putting in the quarters (or in this case, tens of dollars) in the hope that you strike a jackpot and pay it all off?
28/10/2009 at 20:53 Zaphid says:
Theoretically you can play it for free, but you will be facing the most soulcrushing grind humanity has ever seen and you will also depend on other players paying for your shit (literally).
So, the answer is no.
28/10/2009 at 14:34 Ketch says:
I played the old version of this with a few friends years ago, some random gave me a gun and some ammo which I immediately wasted on some bouncing horror before being mauled by it… Good times. Luckily I can say I didn’t spend a single penny! Hurray for me, playing the system!
28/10/2009 at 14:37 panik says:
“The structure here is similar to Eve Online without the player warfare (so, arguably without the point). ”
Well seeing as “warfare” makes up about 1% of your “playing” time in eve, its no big loss.
28/10/2009 at 21:23 Psychopomp says:
Before joining the RPS corp, the last three months had been straight warfare for me…
(We were losing a lot)
28/10/2009 at 14:37 Lack_26 says:
And these players putting down the big bucks don’t go and start and actual business why? (If they have that money they may well).
28/10/2009 at 14:38 Aio Dakina says:
Back in 2003, I remember the article that got me started in Entropia – from PCGamer.
It was fun back then too, the costs weren’t so atrociously high (they were very similar to normal MMOs – able to ‘live’ on $15/m) – and you still got the saleability of your character.
However, with any games like this, there are always people richer than you. So while it’s top-level spending for you at $50/m, there are people playing where it is quite within their budget to spend $10k/m.
It was a fun game, but greed and increasing costs made it bad. The old community was however, one of the most fun and vibrant ones in any MMO. Then it got shit.
Oh well.
28/10/2009 at 15:03 shiggz says:
My best guess is that many of the poor people use it as a 1$-20$ “hope card” or “get of slums card”.
Lottery winners pay very high taxes and welfare from taxes buys a lot of the lottery tickets. A sad symmetry to it IMO.
28/10/2009 at 15:17 Stupoider says:
Is that sign… advertising ‘faps’?
28/10/2009 at 16:13 Clovis says:
Ya, I noticed that too. Quentin, please explain. Faps? Really?
28/10/2009 at 18:06 Stupoider says:
I imagine you’re treated to a sexy striptease by a Boorum Male.
29/10/2009 at 00:32 chann says:
First Aid Packs I believe. But then the whole game is a bit of a wank.
28/10/2009 at 15:23 Trubka says:
I played Entropia for a while (just few days) a long time ago, I never spent any real money on the game, when I joined at first I was doing a “runner”(?) for other players :D Basically just making creatures angry and running so the other player can shoot them without getting hurt… yea that’s how I earned few bucks in the first hour or two them some guy gave me a gun, some ammo and we’ve been running in a small group for a while, killing creatures and all that stuff, exploring, etc. and I must say I’ve had a hell of a great time in that short time… I’m a “lonely wolf” type of gamer, I pretty much play mmos solo (that’s probably a reason why I don’t really play mmos anymore heh) but in Entropia I got into a group right from the start. It was awesome.
Then I stopped. And I’m glad I did that… if I was playing the game some time later after I got my credit card I might’ve regretted it.
28/10/2009 at 18:52 Lars Westergren says:
Ah, so you were kiting monsters. Interesting thought to have lower level players do that for pay rather than a hunter’s pet or similar.
28/10/2009 at 15:29 Desmolas says:
Seems like the videogame equivalent of the to me.
%95 of people lose out while the top %5 cash in.
28/10/2009 at 15:34 Gap Gen says:
So you’re left with two options for making money. 1: Collecting sweat from monsters. 2: Collecting their dung.
That is incredible.
28/10/2009 at 16:55 Dave says:
Richard Garriott wishes he thought of that.
28/10/2009 at 15:37 bill says:
Reminded me of this really interesting/depressing article i read about chinese mmos a long while back:
http://www.danwei.org/electronic_games/gambling_your_life_away_in_zt.php
28/10/2009 at 15:39 ThePinkNinja says:
This is a great idea for an Ironic single player or MMO game, where there is a game within a game, where the real life and real cash parts are also digital.
28/10/2009 at 16:05 Pace says:
Whoa, journalism! Excellent article.
28/10/2009 at 16:13 mbp says:
Check out this unbelievable post from the Entropia forums: http://www.entropiaforum.com/forums/general-discussion/165220-am-i-getting-scammed-200k-help-please.html
It reads like a fairly standard “help my account was banned in error and the mods won’t respond to my emails” that you can find on the forums of any mmo. It is only when you read down a bit that the penny drops that this 200k is not in game pes or virtual gold it is $200k real money that this unfortunate has invested in a banned account. $200k that they borrowed from real world investors who still expect to be paid back.
28/10/2009 at 17:14 Malibu Stacey says:
LOL that’s “unlucky”. Having read that 2 things come to mind:
1 – whats to stop the operators of this ‘game’ banning any account citing whatever they feel like as a reason once someone puts a stupidly large amount of cash into their account like this chap appears to have done?
2 – Am I the only one who wants to go hunting for exploits in this game & see how much you can take out of them using said exploits once found?
29/10/2009 at 15:41 Zacariaz says:
Don’t believe anything you read.
28/10/2009 at 16:40 12kill4 says:
A bad person will make you miserable; true evil will sell it to you…
28/10/2009 at 16:51 Cooper says:
Someone recommended this to me a couple of years back. Played it for an hour. Suffice to say, I don’t listen to said persons opinions with an ounce of respect anymore.
28/10/2009 at 17:03 toro says:
Excellent article.
28/10/2009 at 17:10 Malibu Stacey says:
Nice expose. There should be more articles like this in games journalism rather than the usual “OMG LOOK SHINY FPS MCXVIII HAS EVEN MORE REALISTIC LOOKING WEAPONS NOW!”. Please never stop keeping us informed and entertained RPS overlords.
It would be interesting to see if one could play as a “virtual hobo” in this game & see how much money you could take out of it without ever putting any in. Sounds like you may have to live off the generosity of others however which I wouldn’t be comfortable with.
28/10/2009 at 17:13 screeg says:
If this project met with any real success, the IRS (or similar governmental body) would shut it down as a Ponzi scheme. Second Life had to restructure their in-game economy for just that reason. You can’t just set up shop and act as a bank/casino without getting licensed and letting the government in for their cut.
I’m surprised it’s been allowed to go on this long.
28/10/2009 at 17:20 Malibu Stacey says:
‘Game’ is developed (I’m guessing hosted) in Sweden. Other countries don’t always have exact replicas of your US laws & governmental bodies such as your IRS & try as you may, your US laws don’t apply as even if you’re in the US playing the game, everything takes place on their servers in Sweden (or wherever). Plus you’re bound by their EULA which will (should) state which countries laws are applicable to any legal disputes.
28/10/2009 at 19:01 Grey Cap says:
@Malibu Stacey, screeg: Even here in Sweden we have laws against Ponzi schemes. However, I’m not sure this counts. Since the article made the economy sound like game currency changed hands mainly player to player (buying equipment from other players) they could con each other, but it wouldn’t be Entropia’s fault. The game does not guarantee a payout.
28/10/2009 at 17:14 Christopher Weeks says:
I don’t know how much it’s changed, but a couple years ago, I spent $20 and played this for a couple hours with my son. The entire time, I was waiting for the fun to start. Dullsville. (And I play Wurm!)
28/10/2009 at 17:24 ThePinkNinja says:
Makes you appreciate Blizzard…
28/10/2009 at 17:37 Peace of Eight says:
It’s virtual Amway!
28/10/2009 at 17:41 Tei says:
Projects like this one there was one billion during the DOT COM era. You have see none, or a very few, because most died under the weight of his own unfeasibility (humm.. this word don’t exist). The problem is… that this scheme is “how some people would love internet to work”, but is not “how people want internet to work” or “how internet work”.
Most of these fictitious “Closed Worlds” where created as a way to ask people money for “hosting” inside this special world. Much like how “Malls” work…
The web still have to conquer the 3D hill, with X3D, a plugin, or something else. But 3D is much harder than 2D, and we have still to get 3D right.
29/10/2009 at 03:02 TeeJay says:
“infeasibility” ;)
28/10/2009 at 18:06 Leeks! says:
I went to a recruitment meeting for a pyramid scheme (all undercover-like) for a project in a uni rhetoric class. Reading about this game gave me a very similar sense of creeping unease.
28/10/2009 at 18:22 Quinns says:
Faps is the nickname for some type of combat equipment. I think it might be something similar to healing, or buffing.
It makes for pretty hilarious forum posts talking about combat. “Aggro the mob then fap like a maniac to survive”, “Make sure you go into combat with someone who’ll fap you when you get into trouble”, etc.
28/10/2009 at 18:23 Quinns says:
Goddamnit why is Reply broken for me today.
28/10/2009 at 18:41 Delboy says:
From what I recall is stands for “First Aid Pack” … using one one heals you a certain number of hit points depending on how good (read “expensive”) it is.
I played this game for about a year. Put $100 dollars in in total, and “cashed out” about $200. I was one of the very lucky ones …. trust me …. this is a pryamid scheme game with the people in the top 100 places already decided!
Dez
28/10/2009 at 18:57 Lars Westergren says:
Quinns: I think RPS has a concurrency bug in the forum posting code, if you reply at the same time as someone else thing can go wrong.
I often have my “reply to” end up at the bottom of the lists. Once I got a page that said “invalid id” or something similar, and it displayed someone elses mail address.
Faps.. hehe. Reminds me of playing Settlers of Catan. “Does anyone have Wood for Sheep?”
28/10/2009 at 23:17 Aio Dakina says:
FAP stands for “Fast Aid Pack” (not first, strangely).
It’s the common name for a healing tool, taken from the first Beta Healing tools (Omegaton FAP [Model No.])… now there are plenty more, but still called FAPs. Hilarious I will admit ;D
28/10/2009 at 20:19 Flappybat says:
This blows my mind. I’ve never met anyone who’s played this, let alone ever read any forum or news posts about it apart from the odd factual tidbit like the intro.
28/10/2009 at 20:50 Mike says:
Cool article and rather worrying!
28/10/2009 at 20:50 Megamaj says:
Great article, and very well written. Probably one of the best I ever read here, and I’m a daily reader. Thanks for making me laugh, and making me glad for the other games which only take your time and your life but at least not your money.
28/10/2009 at 21:35 Psychopomp says:
My faith in humanity yesterday
|
|
|<<<Here
|
|
|
|
My faith in humanity today
|
|
|
|
|
|
|<<Here
28/10/2009 at 22:22 Persus-9 says:
Well I think there’s a certain diabolical beauty to the whole thing. It’s certainly more interesting and imaginative than most ways of separating fools from their money.
28/10/2009 at 23:16 TinyPirate says:
What people sometimes miss about PE is that those with the big cash are also often work quite closely with the dev team. For example, Jon Jacobs, the guy who bought the space station, was also in charge of “US strategic relations as well as, business development, marketing and content acquisition”, at least back in the day. Now, to be fair, I believe Mindark uses players as unpaid spokespeople, but bringing your biggest customers into your business in this way is somewhat unusual and opens Mindark to charges of nepotism.
28/10/2009 at 23:50 theleif says:
Get over it. The game just works like real life. We are just living in a big ponzi scheme. Which begs the question why someone would want to do it online as well.
Or as a certain doped-up hippie would have put it:
As soon as your born they make you feel small
By giving you no time instead of it all
Till the pain is so big you feel nothing at all
Working class hero is something to be
Working class hero is something to be
They hurt you at home and they hit you at school
They hate you if you’re clever and despise a fool
Till you’re so fucking crazy you can’t follow their rules
Working class hero is something to be
Working class hero is something to be
When they’ve tortured and scared you for 20 odd years
Then they expect you to pick a career
When you can’t really function you’re so full of fear
Working class Hhero is something to be
Working class hero is something to be
Keep you doped with religion, sex and T.V.
And you think you’re so clever and classless and free
But you’re still fucking peasants as far as I can see
Working class hero is something to be
Working class hero is something to be
There’s room at the top I’m telling you still
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
If you want to be like the folks on the hill
Working class hero is something to be
Yes, a working class hero is something to be
If you want to be a hero well just follow me
If you want to be a hero well just follow me
29/10/2009 at 00:24 narfi says:
Interesting read.
I have played EU for about 2 years of which I have really enjoyed.
There is some truth to what you have posted but it is also obvious that you only scratched the surface of what is there before drawing your conclusions.
The biggest part of the game that I like is the community. I mean the actual in-game community not those who just like to argue on forums without actually spending time ingame. The real money aspect as well as the extreme challenge of trying to succeed at making something from nothing makes this a game only for the persistent and intelligent. This pretty much insures that a majority of people who actually play are more mature than your normal gamers. I have had multiple people tell me how much more mature (and i dont mean dirty) the community in EU was compared to other games they had played.
I successfully played for over 6months with out spending any real life money. It is possible, but its not for the lazy or weak minded.
It is true that there is a gambling aspect to the game. That is part of what makes it addicting. But a mature person understands this and takes on the challenge of minimizing their cost while maximizing their profits. You could think of it as trying to figure out how to play the quarter slot machine for a dime a pull while everyone else is putting in quarters.
It is true that alot of people have deposited lots of money and some have lost it all. That is where the maturity is required to control your own spending habits. Imagine giving a 13yr old $1000 and letting him loose in a toy store, how much money would he come out with? What would the purchases be worth a year later? Now give a working middle class man the same money in the same store, what does he come out with? Did he even spend it all?
Without understanding the value of dollar you wont know what to do with it.
There have been plenty of experiments of people playing for $15 dollars a month, a figure used because that is equivalent of a subscription game. This style of game play is quite manageable but still requires a brain.
The point you made about collection dung is only partly true. Currently gathering is the only “free” way to earn ped directly from the game (though still indirectly as you need to sell to players) Dung is the least valuable thing you can find while searching the wildernesses of Calypso. Fruit or even better precious stones of varying types are what you go looking for as they will bring actual profits and get you started in your hunting/mining/crafting carriers.
Im sure that my honest opinion will be flamed as a fanboy response. The truth is there are days that I get frustrated in game, but those days are rare because I play within my means and I play for the challenge.
I have played for almost 2 years and have only deposited small amounts a couple of times. I have skilled in all 3 of the major carriers at different times while also toying with coloring & texturing customizable items.
There are multiple radio stations run by avatars who have done alot to bring the community together and have hosted multitudes of parties and events. They are regularly giving away stuff as prizes to free events for new players.
Did I mention community? :P thats the best part of the whole place.
gl and have fun,
narfi
29/10/2009 at 00:47 CyberPunk says:
I have never depositted and have played for 2 years (nor have I accepted handouts).
The net worth of my account is hard to determine exactly but it is at least a few thousand dollars USD.
I started playing after getting sick of paying for other games just to get pissed off when developers made changes that destroyed all my hard work (had 2 Jedi Characters, on the same server and same account, in SWG before SOE nerfed the entire game, talk about disappointment). In other games, such as SWG, WoW, ect.; when you leave the game, all your progress is for nothing, in Entropia, if you’re smart, you can cash out your proceeds when you quit.
Entropia makes your time playing actually worth something.
There are some points in the review above which I can agree with; however, it is quite apparent to me that Quintin Smith is ignorant on many of the other points he’s made. Just like with any MMO, you need to have knowledge of the game to succeed, his lack of such has given him a poor experience.
Before you invest, take the time to learn the game, spend time sweating, trading, asking questions. If you are patient and determined, you can get by without ever depositting and play with the knowledge that you will succeed.
29/10/2009 at 01:11 Kuber says:
It is 100% true that Entropia / Planet Calypso is a game with a high degree of difficulty. The major difficulties come in when you realize the extent of the skills system and how the skills you build interact with weapons and tools used as well as determining which creatures are best to hunt, or which areas to mine, or which items to craft.
When you’re using the right tools at the right time in the right place, the game is a hell of a lot of fun.
When you’re using the wrong tools at the wrong time in the wrong place, you can lose thousands of dollars before you know it.
People who are impatient, or just want to be able to point and click without thinking, or people who want to become a god within the game in a month or two should look for other games, as this one will disappoint you.
People who have patience, enjoy a bit of digging and understanding as to how the system works, and have the self-restraint to stay where they should be in the learning/acquisition curve can do well, break even, or even profit just a bit.
People who have unique ideas and innovative thoughts on how to make money in-game can profit even more.
I’ve been playing for about 14 months now, and I’m not one of those players that likes grinding hour after hour collecting sweat so that I can play for free. I have a real-life career that I can make money at much faster, so I deposit instead and just get down to playing the main core of the game. I figured it out a few weeks ago and basically I have spent about $1.50-$3.00/hour I’m in the game. I have also made some choices to spend for some of the higher-priced weapons and armor, so admittedly, my costs are a little higher.
For players who like walled gardens and provided quests and a paint-by-numbers style of game play, you might want to try some of those other games that were suggested. But if you’re capable of self-determination and creating your own internal motivations for achievements and mastery of the game, there’s plenty of goodness in Entropia to keep you entertained for years.
As far as it being a casino, that’s a stretch. While it is true that the same faulty beliefs that people take to casinos and lose big with can also help you lose big in Entropia, such as believing in the gambler’s fallacy, the ability to change your style of playing and alter your spending in the game really evolves the game far beyond a casino. The only difference with Entropia and other MMORPGs really is that you will consistently lose 100% of your money to other games. With Entropia, you still can’t lose more than 100% of your money. But you have the chance to get a little or a lot of that back, if you’re smart enough.
29/10/2009 at 01:20 Salix says:
I’m a bit confused. You say it’s shit, but the only real reason you give is that it’s like gambling…surely the fact that you can get _some_ money back (potentially more than you put in) is a good point. You could say subscription model games are gambling too (in a loose sense), but with a guaranteed 0% return!! I’m just wondering exactly why you think it’s shit. Is it because it’s too expensive? i.e. you go through your money too fast, or is it that the gameplay sucks? I dunno really what you are getting at.
29/10/2009 at 05:43 Psychopomp says:
“You say it’s shit, but the only real reason you give is that it’s like gambling…”
Did you miss the part where he said it’s a soul crushing grind, unless you pump hundreds of dollars in a month?
29/10/2009 at 04:11 Jetsetlemming says:
I thought this was a joke. I thought you had just taken some screenshots in Second Light and shopped in the text, and was making all this up.
And then you linked to that Boorum_Male wiki page and I see that this is all too real :(
29/10/2009 at 04:24 nichevo says:
Judging by these recent positive comments, I’d bet dollars to doughnuts that a link to this page has gone up somewhere in Entropia-land.
It all sounds too mercenary for me. It sounds like a game a dedicated gold farmer would play after coming home from his shift. $_$
But I would say that, given that I’m a brain-less uncreative type who likes walled gardens and paint-by-numbers.
29/10/2009 at 04:39 Kuber says:
Actually, it seemed like the author that was the one that liked the walled gardens and paint-by-numbers game play, by his own admission.
29/10/2009 at 05:45 Psychopomp says:
You do know he linked to EVE, right?
29/10/2009 at 05:49 Psychopomp says:
I would enjoy one of the players telling me how this isn’t *vastly* inferior to that-other-sandbox EVE, ignoring the fact that you can make real life money from EU.
29/10/2009 at 06:30 Salix says:
I can’t compare it to eve, but here is what I like about it.
The standard activities in the game are a HUGE grind. More to the point, grinding doesn’t really allow you to participate in new more fun acitivites/quests, it allows you to do more of the same thing, but gamble larger amounts of money. This isn’t universal though, with skills you can become competetive in PvP, allowing you in certain zones to loot other players (which can certainly be profitible), and participate in a type of quest thing called beacons. This is exclusive to skilling in combat related professions only though.
As such, with respect to gameplay, at the moment (this clause is very important, as the game is going through major changes right now) it is boring, pointless and potentially expensive.
Things to like about EU above other games though: You can choose how much you pay for the game, many people play quite fine for free, others like to pay large amounts. It’s a freedom which is quite nice I find.
Speaking of freedom, there is a huge freedom in this game, with the lack of obligatory quests, you aren’t restricted to a particular path to achieve success (whatever that may be). This is something I enjoy immensily, I can do whatever I want.
And indeed, people do do whatever they want. Players put on large scale events for other players, often for free. Events can almost always be found, which results in essentially a non restrictive quest system that doesn’t consist in: collect x amount of item y. These are unique, and potentially a lot more fun than the gameplay in almost all other mmos. If you can imagine an event, it’s likely someone has put it on.
This is all due to a great great community. Just great.
And at the end of the day, the hours you have put in, the grinding you have done, the challenges you have overcome, it isn’t all for naught. Once you want to move on from the game, you extract all your skills, sell them, sell your equipment, then withdraw all that money, with the good possibility that you will not have lost much money at all.
So yes, there are very bad points about this game, especially for newbies, but there are good points that make the game so worth it, and it’s getting better all the time.
29/10/2009 at 07:06 Pepto says:
Yup. I personally believe it is as hard as it is on newbies specifically to weed out the moany, whiney, want it all NOW noobs. OP expected what exactly? I thought he did research? How the hell did his research lead him to expect it would be peaches and cream and he would profit in his first what? month? LOL
This is a game for a class of player that has patience to see a long term project through to the end, that understands that they are not ‘God’s favourite’ creation, that understands that having 10 maxed out WoW chars doesn’t make them a fantastic gamer, that understands that just because EvE and EU are both in space doesn’t mean you can compare apples and oranges…well hey the list goes on but knowing the typical mentality of a lot of the posters here…you read “Yup”, thought I had agreed with the your opinion, and moved on.
This actually makes me happy…stay the hell away from the game I enjoy…you’d all ruin it for me anyway.
29/10/2009 at 14:30 Malibu Stacey says:
OP? This isn’t a forum. It’s not even a blog. Just because someone linked this in your EU forum doesn’t stop some knowledge of who you’re trying to argue with is being a basic tenet of any arguement.
29/10/2009 at 07:08 Some kinda uber... says:
Entropia is a great game. Assume you enjoy games. you go to the store.buy a xbox or ps3. 300$ or so thats 3000 peds ;) plus 5-10 games thats 250-500$ so you cost for this enjoyment would be 550-800$.
this same 550-800$ you can actually invest… hunt… mine… resell… and make money and enjoy the great graphics that most console games offer…
but the great thing is entropia is free to play. NO ONE makes you deposite.like most other MMORPG games charge monthly fees. boo to that… i have not deposited in many years and have made well over 60,000$ or 600k peds
29/10/2009 at 14:27 Malibu Stacey says:
How much of that $550-800 did you factor in spending on your PC so you can play this game since you’re not buying the games console?
29/10/2009 at 07:31 TotalBiscuit says:
Haha, look at all the shills.
29/10/2009 at 07:48 cheeba says:
Possibly the single most depressing thing about PC Gaming: No matter how soulless, grindy, cynical or broken any given MMO is, there’s always a scarily devoted (and often worryingly large) community willing to leap to its defense at any given moment.
30/10/2009 at 03:41 Noone says:
EU is never going to attract the kind of people that write, read and agree with this kind of article and its not intended to…
One of the greatest things about the game is that it very successfully gets rid of those with little patience and/or an immature approach to life.
It’s not for everyone but it has something for anyone.
One of the worst things about this game is the level of investment means that some people who thought they had what it takes and play for a few years only to find out they don’t, stick around alot longer than they should.
The majority of players fall somewhere inbetween.
29/10/2009 at 08:01 Does not matter says:
I play entropia like 4 years…. at start i invested in my avatar 200 USD, now i have close to 10 000 USD, and i did not purchased any licenses or islands, i profited via regular actions .. hunting, mining and crafting.
What i must say: this is not just a simple game for 16 year old players, this is a bit more serious.
What i must say2: yes, game have very huge cots to play at moment, but it wasnt so before USA crisis and world crisis start.
What i must say3: the game is like casino :( but only thing is you can tiny bit control your expenses, if RL casino slotmachine accept 0.50 as smallest spin, then in entropia you can pay 0.40-0.70 valued as 0.50.
Entropia is not so bad as this review say, but not very good it should be. Developer need a bit rethink balance and economy strategy for in-game, to make it healthy and growing again. Some time back it was like if you go hunt and spent 100 USD, you were getting back like 80-90 USD (sometimes also more then you spent) and with selling loot you ended up with 90-110, so with tiny loses or tiny profit … yes overall you were losing but compared costs were very normal (not big) and yes, called jackpot loots were possible and would make you in big profit … but for that you need work, skills, good gear, knowledge and etc
Cheers all
29/10/2009 at 08:20 Atami says:
This is the worst review I ever read.
For someone claiming to review games for such a long time, you lack any form of professionalism.
I advice you to get another job.
29/10/2009 at 09:15 TotalBiscuit says:
I ‘advice’ you to get a dictionary and stop being such a mindless shill for your dumb scam game.
Allow me to share a little wisdom. Those who invest money in a product are more likely to defend it the more money they spend. The reason? Because if their delusions are shattered and the product exposed for the trash it really is, they will be shown up as idiots for investing so much money in it.
Face it, you’re a shill who doesn’t want to admit the truth.
29/10/2009 at 11:06 Jim Rossignol says:
TB, chill out please. People are welcome to defend their game.
29/10/2009 at 11:13 Heliocentric says:
You mean defend their investments surely?
29/10/2009 at 12:07 TotalBiscuit says:
In that case I’m also entitled to attack it surely.
It’s pretty obvious what’s happened here, somebody’s posted a link to this article somewhere and said ‘hey guys, they’re ripping on our game, go get em!’. You’re not going to get objective commentary for these people, they are far too invested to do anything BUT defend it.
30/10/2009 at 11:28 CyberPunk says:
I’ve depositted $0 and am defending the game.
05/11/2009 at 16:11 Atami says:
TotalBiscuit … sad very sad … my apologies for not being a native English speaker
Thank you for your entertaining, “to the point” , reply :p
29/10/2009 at 09:07 babel says:
Hmm, yes well…
I have played this particular game for over 4 years, and spend less on it that i would spent when playing WoW with monthly fees, and have now few thousand dollars networth to my avatar, which i can take back when i feel like quitting.
But in no ways accomplishing that is easy, it needs TONS of getting into, and just by the first impression, the feeling might be just what the writer wrote. But this is not a game for peeps with short attention span, or those who look a “quick fix” from gaming, this is one that rewards after tons of hours & work, well not work, because i even enjoyed it, yes you heard it right, you can enjoy this game…
Well expences to play have gone up recently, but hey, its easy to cut them down, or have a break from playing alltogether, with no monthly fees i can do that without losing a single penny…
29/10/2009 at 10:31 EU Player says:
This review is just sucky, unprofessional and with so many factual errors that the thing should be deleted…
29/10/2009 at 10:32 Research? says:
Just want to point out…
2 methods of free in game money: There are 3.
Deposit $5 to start: You cannot deposit $5.
Facts and figures make me sleepy: The game is very very relient on facts and figures.
In all of this you’ve failed to notice your weapon’s been degrading: How did you fail to notice? Research would have informed you that they degrade
29/10/2009 at 10:35 781190 says:
I’m playing Entropia for three years now and found out myself this summer that I totally deposited wicked $20.000 into the game at the same point my avatar value was around $10.000, decreasing. Players can only profit from other players, there’s no way that a player can profit from the company running it which also wants their 17 out of 48 employee-managers paid. Yes, the company running the game has 17 managers cashing out big and 31 employees, most of them support workers from Mexico, so a nice 1:2 ratio around, none real development on the gameplay was done for years now.
Back in the days when I started Entropia was a much better game to play. You could run longer with your deposits and had a fluctuating market. However, nowadays through the decisions of the company running it, ingame prices are going downfalls, more and more players leave and no new players join.
To give an easy-to-understand example, I’m considered as an absolutely average mid-level player. One week of playing 4-6 hours a day oing mid-level-hunting costs me $200+ on the average. That’s the reason while I and many others stopped playing at the moment to hope for better days since there’s no way for an average person to refund this.
Through further investigations a team found out that Entropia once was created with the plan to be a platform for managers making their big deals online, so like a golf court you may say. However, it didn’t turned out that way, 99,9% of players are still no managers and probably never will be, however, when it comes to ingame bills they get treatened like they would be, and that’s the problem.
I won’t give my known ingame or forum name here since I consider myself as a respected member of the community, even if I’m known for such kind of talks, and don’t want to change this; and also support both, the community and Entropia. However, things have to be said.
29/10/2009 at 10:40 Faye says:
Playing for 3.5 years now and a guide ingame, I see a lot of newcomers that think they can earn free money in a week and buy a ferrari. This game is not for the 16 year old player. It’s actually a adult game and some consider it a casino. It all depends how you WANT to play it. Go hunting and try too big mobs will give you lose. Get to know the loot system and things turn out better. Also the main focus on this game is social skill.There are a lot of player made events, partys, forums , soctieys. The most fun i have in this game is organizing such a event and see ppl laughing when the do the event.
I do hate reviewer that spend little then 1 hour ingame and not move a muscle. A good review can only be made by playing this game for a month. Then you consider yourself a player in this universe. The exploring alone will set you back 1-2 weeks. It’s an immense game and even after 3,5 years I haven;t done everything there is. It’sall up too you how you like to play. Spend 10 dollar a month or spend 1000 dollar a day. The choice is you.
29/10/2009 at 11:02 fo0d says:
So you have been playing this game for years before reviewing it? Or have you managed to realize that “Suddenly you’re not just hooked, you have a monetary investment in your character.” in 2 weeks of gameplay?
“Mm. Facts and figures make me sleepy”. That’s too bad. Reviewing a product requires you to review EVERY aspect of the game or at least it’s Most important feature. Virtual/Real money exchange/expense/profit is the most important issue of the game. To determine if this game is a scam or a revolutionary milestone in gaming you really have to experience the game for more than a “few weeks”. A few weeks is what it takes an ordinary player to develop enough skills to succesfully face a low/mid range monster without necessarily having spent one single dollar.
This game CAN be free and for many it has been.
“You can do better?” EVE online costs 15$/m and gives you the possibility to mine shoot and travel at the speed of light, with little or no social interaction. Interesting. But why would you even want to compare the two games? Just because they are both MMPORGs it doesn’t make them comparable. Who ever has been playing EU for long enough will surely tell you EU is not WOW or EVE:O, its a different, complex and entertaining enviroment.
Lastly, reviewing a game on forum gossip cannot be very reliable.
PS: Total Biscuit: Before you end up criticising my use of the english language, many of the people you will interact with on the internet are not fluent english speakers/writers, nor am I. However, I agree on the fact that “Those who invest money in a product are more likely to defend it the more money they spend. ” Although the statement may be right, you cannot assume that anyone EU is a crazed idiot just because they MAY have spent money on the game. On the other hand you might want to ask yourself WHY people may want to spend money on a game.
30/10/2009 at 00:09 Psychopomp says:
““You can do better?” EVE online costs 15$/m and gives you the possibility to mine shoot and travel at the speed of light, with little or no social interaction.”
Translation: I never joined a corp
29/10/2009 at 11:04 bill says:
I got the same error on this post. Invalid (something) and then someone else’s email address.
29/10/2009 at 11:14 Richboy says:
1) Nothing in life is free
2) You pay to go to the movies to be entertained. You pay to be entertained in EU.
3) It’s a computergame. – play it if you like. It you don’t, take a walk with your dog outside.
29/10/2009 at 12:09 TotalBiscuit says:
There’s a difference between buying a game or a movie ticket and sinking thousands of dollars into items that don’t really exist.
29/10/2009 at 11:37 Chaz says:
Wow! Its like the Eurogamer Darkfall review all over again.
Understandable that all these folk making money from this “game” will want to ardently defend it. If the game falls in popularity, so their lovely little side earner also takes a nose dive. I don’t know what the stats are, but I’ll wager that far more people loose money playing this than make it.
29/10/2009 at 11:55 EU Player says:
I played EU for maybe 4-5 years and had a lot of fun at first, but over the years the cost to play has sadly increased to a point i have had to leave. The concept of this game is great, and in the past you would return with between maybe 70% to 130% of the cash you spent plus decay which is the companies cut – it was good fun and ped lasted a good time.
Nowadays the variance in general loot has become to big for it to be fun, as larger and larger jackpot loots suck up the general loot allocation. Sadly it has become to expensive imo when you can come back with 60% or less of money spent. Of course over the long run you get about 90% back of ammo/bombs/crafted tt value back, but if you deposit $30 on a monday and by wednesday it’s gone where is the “fun” in that?
I really hope the owners of this game realise why people are leaving these days, it used to be such a cool game that was value for money, atm though i have to agree somewhat with the review.
29/10/2009 at 12:05 fo0d says:
Chaz, I still have to hear about people profiting in WoW too.
Spending money willingly for a service does not sound like much of a scam.
Making money in the game might be hard, finding it entertaining and worth the money isn’t.
29/10/2009 at 12:26 CMaster says:
All the EU players coming and saying what a terrible review this is – could you please go back to whatever forum you were linked here from and explain that this isn’t a review. Review’s on RPS are called “Wot I think” or “Verdict” and this is neither. This is somebody who didn’t like the idea of EU writing about why they didn’t like it.
To be fair, the article comes across as a bit of an attack article. It doesn’t try to see what makes EU appeal to some people and just gets outraged and offended at the system they use to extract money from the players (although nothing like as bad as that chinese article somebody linked to).
Still, my brief experience with the game many years ago were of an unpleasant and confusing time, even by MMO standards. I had someone give me a weapon and the PEDs to repair it through the mentor system, but sadly I was a waste of money to him as I never logged back in. And while we’re seeing several people come on and say that they made money out of the game, which I’m sure is possible, on average people have to lose money to keep the game going. The trick is to try and avoid losing too much I guess.
I’m also amused that despite the switch to Cryengine the game still looks horrifically ugly however.
29/10/2009 at 14:38 Malibu Stacey says:
In response to switching to CryEngine 2.
From the way it sounds all they’ve done is upgrade the engine. The art assets haven’t had any development probably because this would cost them money to have artists (modellers, texturers, mappers etc) re-do them all.
They could be releasing the art asset upgrade later however and keeping really really quiet about it just now or something ;)
29/10/2009 at 14:54 Uglycat says:
The shills are not selling the game well…
29/10/2009 at 15:08 Zacariaz says:
This is without a doubt worst written, most misleading and/or directly wrongful review I have ever read. I have never registered anywhere just to reply to something like this, but if I had to, I would have done so now, that’s how bad it is.
The only useful information is the rather bad explanation of how the RCE works and prospect of losing large amount of money if you’re not careful.
It is clear that the author of this “review” haven’t given it 5 minutes before declaring it “the worst game ever!”, at least I hope not, otherwise the author is on a personal vendetta for some reason, which is both very immoral and, I think, also illegal in some countries.
There are many people playing and enjoying Entropia Universe and almost all of them is complaining all the time. This is due to 2 issues.
1. Entropia Universe, unlike other MMO’s where you can reach level infinity in a week, is an immense challenge. That’s how it is and that’s why people like it. Because the graphics, gameplay and so on, is not that great, yet.
2. When you lose in Entropia Universe, it is real value you lose, just like if you lose you wallet in real life. Of course you’re upset, but this is also what makes winning so much better. BUT, Entropia Universe, though there are similarities, is NOT a casino. There are many reasons for this, but most importantly, you don’t know the odds and there are ways of ensuring that you win.
In fact, there is only one valid point, which is that although it’s possible in theory, to play this game for free, the reality of it is another matter, but then again, why should it be free? Few other MMO’s are.
Many people will not like Entropia Universe and while they blabber about how expensive and crappy it is, I know that the real reason is that the challenge is to great. This is OK, but instead of taking it out on Entropia Universe and the players who actually enjoys it, find another game which suits you better.
“Facts and figures make me sleepy.”
This is clearly true, so drink some coffee, wake up and write a proper review. PLEASE!
To anyone who would like to read a proper review, here is one very good one, written by a person who is new to the game and completely unbiased. And no, this review is not only fun and games, there are real issues, but at least this guy is honest and willing to give it a chance: http://thatgamingsite.com/article/272/1/entropia-universe/
29/10/2009 at 16:23 bill says:
note: not a review. article about people losing money.
29/10/2009 at 15:28 Smo says:
Entropia can’t be compared with any other MMO. If people like Aion or WOW, there is a 99% chance they will not like Entropia. Entropia players have a 90% chance they won’t like WoW.
Both look similar but have total different game concepts.
What I like:
+ a lot even extreme “uber” players talk and help beginners. Not very common in other MMOs afaik.
+ when I stop playing, i get a large amount of the money I spent back. Not only items, but also skills I developed over time are returned into real cash
+ I don’t need to buy items via eBay and hope, I really get what I paid for
+ I don’t need to hand over my avatar to someone else to skill it up, I can simply BUY the skills I need
Sounds bad?
Well, Entropia is for adults only. Most of us have families and real jobs, so we can’t play 80 hours/week. So if we want to get better, we can skill with time or we can simply buy what we need.
As said above: different game concepts :).
30/10/2009 at 00:58 Psychopomp says:
“+ a lot even extreme “uber” players talk and help beginners. Not very common in other MMOs afaik.”
EVE comes to mind. More complex MMO’s tend to have a friendlier playerbase, once you get past the elitist jerkwads.
“+ when I stop playing, i get a large amount of the money I spent back. Not only items, but also skills I developed over time are returned into real cash”
The games only real selling point
“+ I don’t need to buy items via eBay and hope, I really get what I paid for”
That’s nothing new. It’s called the micro transaction model.
“+ I don’t need to hand over my avatar to someone else to skill it up, I can simply BUY the skills I need”
And the game is designed so that’s the only way to progress in a reasonable time frame.
You know in EVE there’s no need to grind, or buy skills? New player’s are actually *desired* for certain fleet roles. In addition, when you lose something you can’t just plop down a bunch of money to get it back. I would argue plopping down some money is the *casual* solution.
29/10/2009 at 15:45 ron says:
these comments are fucking hilarious. nice article, you really struck a nerve with the pathetic people that play this shit.
29/10/2009 at 16:04 Aldo says:
Illegal? Someone forgot their sanity pills this morning, methinks.
I hesitate to venture, but perhaps some of the more ‘dedicated’ players of this game posting here are, in effect, gambling addicts. That’d explain an almost pathological need to excuse themselves by praising the game, same as playing roulette is ‘just a bit of fun’ right up until the scary bald man snaps your knees in half.
29/10/2009 at 16:16 Mel says:
Totally LimpBiscuit said these above, I just gotta respond.
“I ‘advice’ you to get a dictionary and stop being such a mindless shill for your dumb scam game.
Allow me to share a little wisdom. Those who invest money in a product are more likely to defend it the more money they spend. The reason? Because if their delusions are shattered and the product exposed for the trash it really is, they will be shown up as idiots for investing so much money in it.
Face it, you’re a shill who doesn’t want to admit the truth.”
“There’s a difference between buying a game or a movie ticket and sinking thousands of dollars into items that don’t really exist.”
You know, generally, a person should not take advice from someone who does not know what they’re talking about, such as Biscuit. Doesn’t probably matter what the advice is either. Doesn’t matter what the topic, some people just weigh in their opinion, probably because they have a “feeling”, lol, instead of any fact or experience. Would be like me offering an opinion that mattered on Steven Hawking’s latest most brilliant theory. I don’t know shit about it. And the last time I checked my money, I logged onto my bank’s website, lo and behold there it was…..but wait, those are digital dollars….
I do play Entropia, other games as well, sitting next to my 17 yr old son who is into league fps’s. This “game” is unlike anything you’ve ever played, really. In my mind, this is a genre of mmo that this game is continuing to break new ground, sometimes rocky ground. But I have never found such a combo of fps/mmorpg/sandbox(would like more)/gambling/investment/social network/challenge, etc…
Don’t really know of another game with all that, let alone that feeling if you drop a 10 cent mining probe and find something worth $50K US……
29/10/2009 at 23:59 D says:
That feeling isn’t just gambling? It’s fine if you chose to be a gambler, but it is irrational behavior and this article is just a cry against that, and particularly a cry about the way it sounds like people are lured into becoming gamblers. Did you know from the onset how this game would play, did you chose it upfront?
Infact the only thing TotalBiscuit has missed is that attacking peoples beliefs, however irrational they are, only strengthens their resolve in them. This is particularly noticable in religion ofcourse, but its true for any belief: any level of personal ‘investment’, group identity or even just as little as publicly announcing that you stand for something quickly becomes a contest to “prove your belief is well founded.” But gambling is irrational, it’s why the house always wins, and thats just science.
Also: “It doesn’t matter what the advice is”? Thats just being unserious. Like, what if it’s really good advice.
30/10/2009 at 00:21 Psychopomp says:
Translation:Someone made some very good points about my glorified casino, and I have no proper arguments to back them up. So, instead of attacking his points, I’m going give people a very good example of Ad Hominem.
29/10/2009 at 16:40 Kuber says:
I’d love to try out a few of these free MMORPGs that don’t cost any money to play. Can someone direct me to a few of them? Any in the Scifi/Cyberpunk genre?
Thanks!
30/10/2009 at 00:19 Psychopomp says:
There’s that new Shin Megami Tensei one.
29/10/2009 at 16:49 Railick says:
I tried this game out a few years ago after seeing a youtube video of some game play. I was bored and looking for a free mmorpg. Of course once I started playing it I actually had the thing uninstalled in about 5 seconds and never visisted it again.
I fell for this sort of thing once with a game called There which I actually enjoyed (and feel like I got my monies worth) where you live a virutal life. It is ia lot like Second Life but I actually enjoyed There MORE than second life for various reasons. Sadly I lost my account info and could never get There HERE again and lost all the money I invested in it :P Still the flying surf board races I had with other people and the fun chats I had with various other players was worth it. (It has some cool voice chat feature where when you talk your character's lips sync instantly with what you're saying. It isn't perfect of course but it is pretty good and I've never seen anything slightly as good as it. Arm A Has something like this but the lips aren't synched with the talking very well so it looks more like a puppet talking)
I sat and talked to some British chick for about 2 hours one night about various things and politics across the pond ect :) I have a huge thing for British and Aussie chicks on account of their pretty accent lol.
As to the above post
I've played a TON of free mmorpgs trying to find one that is right for me.
I highly suggest you try out Sword of the New World (which is not sci-fi) and if it MUST be a sci-fi game you can try out Rising Force Online.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rising_Force_Online
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granado_Espada
Sword of the New World is also known as Grando_espada
It is very cool you can have a ton of characters and actually USE them all. It is free to play with cash shop but the cash shop can EASILY be avoided totally, you can exist and level without it and join a guild and have fun with their wars they have without ever paying a penny.
Shadowcat “It hammers at my retinas like an evil woodpecker of pure energy”
29/10/2009 at 18:18 BaronWR says:
I remember paying it when it first came out. Was tempted by the “free to play” thing and the possibility of making your own money. I can’t comment on int now, but when I played it it was awful. The world was mostly empty, except for a single “oil well” on the far side of the world, which was the only place in the entire world it was possible to get something you could sell without spending money first: monster shit is actually an improvement. Unsurprisingly this location was full of people, waiting to get some cash. The only other way to make money was to hope someone with money would pay you to draw monster aggro. And even if you did make some money, everything degraded. I quit after an hour. The whole thing was a hugely cynical money sink, and I’m amazed it’s still going. I guess it’s the western equivalent of the scary Chinese microtransaction mased MMOs.
29/10/2009 at 19:01 JoeX111 says:
Awesome article Quinns, but it left me with one burning question: Where can I find this Furcadia expose?
29/10/2009 at 19:47 Jim says:
Spot on review!
As someone who plays EU, I cannot argue with what you’ve said, nor do I want to.
I think the cost of EU needs to be radically reformed. Entropia is the most expensive “game” in the world, BAR NONE.
Interested in possibly winning (and losing) up to and over $1000 US per day? Then Entropia is for you!
30/10/2009 at 00:50 Psychopomp says:
Wait
Level headed MMO fans exist?
29/10/2009 at 20:04 DoubleWolf says:
I’ve been able to make money at this game, even at very low levels. I could sell off everything I have, pull the money out and actually profit above and beyond what I’ve put into the game. I’m sorry if you couldn’t figure it out.
You say the game is shit, well I say your review is shit. This isn’t your average game. It’s not for kids and it’s not for people that can’t figure out how to make their own way in life. If you need your hand to be held every step of the way like you’re a fucking kindergartner then this isn’t for you. Go nerd it up in a game with orcs and goblins and pay $15 dollars a month with no chance to ever see that money again. This game is for smart, grown-ass adults with a sense of ambition and some creativity. So open up your mind and use that shit!
30/10/2009 at 00:44 Psychopomp says:
“This game is for smart, grown-ass adults”
So, not for you, then?
30/10/2009 at 17:39 DoubleWolf says:
Well seeing as how I’m having success here, then yes, this game is for me. Apparently not for you since you love EVE so damn much… if that’s what you like, then stick with it. If you like commenting on every post in threads then you do that too. Keep up the good work buddy! We’re all pulling for ya! One day you’ll make it and be the best forum troll around!
31/10/2009 at 01:50 Psychopomp says:
You may be an adult legally, but you’re far from grown.
29/10/2009 at 20:10 Railick says:
@Doublewolf – I played UO for 7-8 years paying 10 dollars a month and sold my two accounts for 700 dollars a piece without ever having to pay for virtual UO bucks so . . . BTW UO Has Orks ;)
Oh and I meant to say I actaully enjoyed playing the game and didn't have to work at it as if it were a second job or business I was running. (although I did actually run a business in the game but it was slightly diffrent from EU. I was able to make my character work for me I didn't have to actual create anything or provide and active service)
Shadowcat “It hammers at my retinas like an evil woodpecker of pure energy”
30/10/2009 at 00:40 Psychopomp says:
It seems the fanboys only have two arguments
1)No other game lets you make real life money
Congratulations, you have one unique feature. The gameplay’s still dull, soulless and uninspired. As far as a sandbox goes, EVE and Wurm are about 93690273 times more fun. As far as the micro transaction model goes, it’s the worst of the worst.
No, you can’t get your investment back in other games. You know why? The games are good enough, they don’t need “YOU CAN MAKE MONEY,” as a selling feature.
2)It’s not an easy game.
You know what? Neither are Wurm or EVE. If EU didn’t have money making as a feature, it would be the very bottom of the free MMO barrel.
*Runescape* has more charm, and ingenuity than this tripe.
30/10/2009 at 03:56 Noone says:
EU will never appeal to the kinds of people who write and read and agree with this type of article and it’s not supposed to.
One of the greatest things about the game is that it quickly weeds out those who don’t have the patience, time or maturity to succeed in tasks that take years to complete.
One of the worst things is that the level of investment means those who thought they had what it takes and after years found out they didn’t tend to hang around alot longer than they should.
The majority of players fall inbetween and are the most level headed, mature and internationally diverse online group I’ve ever met.
30/10/2009 at 06:01 Psychopomp says:
Yet again, EVE and Wurm.
30/10/2009 at 05:22 Frye says:
“…. let alone that feeling if you drop a 10 cent mining probe and find something worth $50K US……”
Actually they’re called slot machines and have been around for quite a while.
Far from telling other people what to do and how to live, the dangers of a casino being labeled a game can cause a lot of grief really does not belong on a gaming site. The half-truths of the ‘fans’ are already apparent. What are the odds of a new player actually increasing his 200$ to 10000 after the devs have taken their cut? The payout-ratio of the ‘house’ will surely be well below a regular casino. Thing is, you don’t really need to know anything about the game to know with absolute certainty that almost everyone will lose money except for a die-hard core that has direct financial gain plugging their game wherever they can.
This kind of scheme is usually accompanied by heavily moderated forums and inside-information leaking to the right people.
30/10/2009 at 11:51 Salix says:
In EUs defence, and also in agreement with the review, I gave some good points of EU that are definately worth considering. The entire reason I play and enjoy EU are for reasons _despite_ the shit gameplay and the expense (though I don’t deposit, so this doesn’t really apply for me).
:)
30/10/2009 at 14:10 Snall says:
…sure seems like a lot of these posts are awfully (pun too) similar. Too funny.
30/10/2009 at 15:07 Xen says:
This game is not for mental midgets. Mental midgets won’t like it. It will be too hard for them. You can see some of them posting here.
31/10/2009 at 01:53 Psychopomp says:
Plopping down some money to replace something you lost in a game is the exact opposite of the hardcore solution.
Sorry, it just is.
30/10/2009 at 15:09 Snailweed says:
The bad things are there and the good things are there with the game, but calling it a grindfest alone is for example wrong. take World of Warcraft. I played that since release and its a welfare grinding game where the ***** can become pro like Ensidia within half a year, all you do is raid raid raid grind grind grind for better gear, difference is you pay blizzard cash but don’t get anything for it.
Aion too…. only that Aion looks like an mix up between Age of Conan an Cabal Online gone wrong.. horribly wrong.
every MMORPG is an grind game unless gear has zero meaning or impact on the game-play.
EU looks interesting, very interesting if you ask me, seeing that you start with zero there is actually sweat you can gather and sell, and this you can do without paying nothing at all, so your cashing in real money by playing for free. and a quick read on the community there also seems to be “quests” coming too.
I’ve written my share of game reviews, and why the author of this one still has his job, let alone where allowed to post this half arsed 5 minute slap together thing… I don’t know. Ive never played EU but at first glimpse it looks like a game that will take allot more dedication from the player than any MMO I’ve seen, maybe eve online but it’s not the same.
and it does seem that there are good things about it’s need in dedication.
let me use the infamouse WoW again as an example, logging in and you stand in dalaran, funky day, 1 hour till your raid, you look around and 90% of everyone you see thats the same class as you have the same armor and pretty much the same spec, everyone do the same spells and same rotations, what matters is how good you are at doing that. a dead monkey can do that.
not to mention that the major playerbase of WoW today might be 20+ but they all act like 10 year old boys who has never seen a naked girl before. getting the random “Hi do u want to heel me n ma friendz in heroic lol” makes me want to slowly kill myself with hair…
Entropia seems to have alot of maturity about it, ALOT. if a wow raid wipes 5 times on one boss people will loose concentration and fail more and get angry cause they cant get their easily paid welfare epics due to bob who cant perform better than a dead chimp…
EU is an unfinished MMORPG, it has so much to come in the coming weeks and months that throwing hard judgements on what the game is like so early is quite simply stupid.
I will be testing this game, and I wont play for 1 week and call it shit, as it quite obviously seems that one has to play ALOT more than that to get going anywhere.
31/10/2009 at 01:53 Psychopomp says:
“Entropia seems to have alot of maturity about it”
The commenters here sure had me fooled.
30/10/2009 at 15:51 Railick says:
This thread amuses me a great deal.
30/10/2009 at 17:44 Vinraith says:
Yup, every Entropia thread follows this beautiful arc. First RPSers show up and nod in agreement, then someone from the “game” community discovers it, links it, and the shills come pouring in to insult anyone that doesn’t buy in to this lovely little scam/casino/money pit. It’s fun!
30/10/2009 at 17:51 Railick says:
I heard there was an expansion coming out where you can sell them your home and everything you own and they will allow you to live in a complex with them in Wacco texas where you can play the game all the day. Then you can work on their farm to earn extra EU bucks if you need them (And you will, trust me you WILL)
30/10/2009 at 19:10 ruskea says:
this is all fact.. and all these EU defenders u see here posting are the same faces u see on forums.. they only do it coz either they hit a jackpot on first week ingame (and think it really is this good for everyone) or they have sooo much money on their avatar that they do everything to keep the playerbase as high as possible (so the value of items they own wont drop) but does it really matter.. i dont remember any newcomer buying any 10ks usd+ items EVER… those items just change hands amongst the ubers/rich… conspiracy? to get the value higher or stay put
and the game designers.. huh wtf? can u still see such amateurs in game business… well sometimes i really think its for purpose.. all those money eating BUGS seem to reappear on VUs.. but if theres a bug that make MA lose money… ppl get banned and the bugs get fixed in minutes
30/10/2009 at 19:14 Railick says:
It is odd Ruskea. I can understand why the people who have invested a lot of money in the game want to defend it though. You realize if this review convinced everyone to stop playing it they'd be at the bottom again and all that money they spent on the game would collapse :P
This game is like a bank where you get to play with your money and gamble with it. The real game though is getting all your money out before the whole game collapses and get as much money as you can before that happens eh :P
To be fair on persons 12 minute shudder is another persons 12 minute joygasim.
31/10/2009 at 01:45 ruskea says:
well if i would own 10ks usd worth gear and skills i would try to do everything to keep the players in and try to get newcomers as much as possible..
30/10/2009 at 23:50 HonestEntropian says:
Do not even visit their website!!
Entropia will foster a gambling addiction in you! Before you know it, you’ve spent more than you EVER intended to pay for ANY game and this becomes the reason you will continue to pay and pay and pay, hoping that one day, you will get it back.
But you won’t.
12 months down the road, personally, I’ve LOST 10,000 USD!
The last month has forced me to downgrade, so I am affectively back where I was 9 months ago in terms of gear and equipment, I have no money on my account to take part in any of the main professions, the value of my skills is deteriorating as the in-game economy is taking a beating.
Stay far, FAR away from Entropia Universe, for your own well being and sanity. Trust me – your money is FAR better spent elsewhere… anywhere else.
I for one am uninstalling as I type… sure, I’m giving up $10k I “invested” (hahaha investment my a$$) but it’s better to lose this 10k now and learn my lesson, than look back in another 12months and see my deficit rising past 30k (your cost to play increases relative to your skill level…. $10/month noob, $10/hour mid-level).
I wish I never downloaded this VR casino/scam/ponzi, my life is infinitely worse off because of it.
31/10/2009 at 02:01 Psychopomp says:
Still waiting for a EU fan to make an argument that isn’t made up of ad hominems.
For a game that’s for “smart, grown-ass adults,” it’s fanbase seems to be comprised of screaming manchildren, and Jim.
Spoiler: It’s not smart to gamble.
31/10/2009 at 02:04 Psychopomp says:
I also feel I should point out that these people are allowed to vote.
31/10/2009 at 02:17 Vinraith says:
“I also feel I should point out that these people are allowed to vote.”
What, 12 minutes worth of shuddering wasn’t enough for you?
03/11/2009 at 06:19 (fish) says:
You’re simply judging gambling to be wrong. That’s your choice, but there’s a ridiculous number of people who enjoy gambling for the thrills it provides. EU seems (I haven’t played it) to be a game attempting to leverage that and judging from the emphatic response would appear to have worked.
Saying it’s not smart to gamble is like saying it’s not smart to drink alcohol or smoke drugs, there are definite side effects to all three common vices but some people enjoy them and you might like to consider that it’s also inevitable that there are people who are more intelligent than you that smoke, gamble and drink. They do it because they enjoy it, quit behaving like they shouldn’t be allowed or that they are automatically idiots for enjoying something.
04/11/2009 at 20:41 Psychopomp says:
I’ve no problem with people and their vices.
I have a problem with people looking down upon others for not wanting any part of their vices.
31/10/2009 at 02:50 Klaus says:
Well, this has been delightful. I didn’t even pay for Horse Armor, so the mind boggles. I understand they/you have to support the game lest they/you realize how much money and time they’ve/you’ve wasted but surely other people are entitled to say the game is shit? I haven’t played it but I don’t think I would anyway, regardless of the article; I’m not fond of MMORPG’s and paying anything more than a subscription fee would cause me to laugh and uninstall. Excuse the web lingo, but I am lol’ing at you EU people.
But seriously EU peeps, start acting like grown-ass adults please.
03/11/2009 at 04:55 Noone says:
Neither EVE nor Wurm have an equivalent of EU’s relationship to the RL economy and the subsequent effectiveness at removing the socially inept from wanting to participate for longer than a short time. In EU you’re never gonna come across a highly skilled 12 year old who just learned what the word gay means and tries to use it in every sentence. I can understand why that wouldn’t appeal to certain types of people.
And if you have the time and patience to play smart and count every cent then you really can make more money than you put in or if you want you can blow all your money trying to get a big score. This sort of article is aimed at the latter personality types and it’s not really a fair assessment of the game but life isn’t fair…
04/11/2009 at 21:06 Psychopomp says:
So, I heard 12 year olds have to patience for Wurm’s pace and gameplay.
03/11/2009 at 12:55 Dassrullen says:
The game itself is Meh at best, very poor gameplay and very repetitive BUT very addictive when it comes to the lootmoment. Trust me i know, couse i have been an slave to this pathetic game for over 5years(and that makes me pathetic too). I have now forced my self to quit(im quite sure that the game is trigged and rigged to hell) and spend time in games that deserves it, games with story, gameplay, amazing environments and love for gamers, nothing that exists in EU.
Its sad to see a game with such potential as EU/PE had once upon a time just fading away in nothingness. But that is the backside of the RCE-modell, a developer cant just put in gameplay and items in the game without impact in the Economy.
03/11/2009 at 14:26 neofit says:
Back when I was sending mails to apply to every beta I could find on the net, I got accepted into the PE beta. Their e-mail also stated that I needed to provide my real credit card number so they can test their money transactions code. My real CC number. To test their beta code. I never responded.
03/11/2009 at 17:30 Railick says:
lmao @ neofit – I think you made the right choice there mate :P
04/11/2009 at 21:01 Brian says:
Anybody in the Austin, TX area who plays this? Hit me up; I’m interested in writing a newspaper article on the real-world currency angle. bgaar (at) statesman (dot) com
04/11/2009 at 23:05 Railick says:
<edit> Ignore that I didn't realize it was a reply acause I was using the forum :P
Shadowcat “It hammers at my retinas like an evil woodpecker of pure energy”
07/11/2009 at 08:43 Noone says:
Me too
11/11/2009 at 08:43 MMORPG Center says:
what he said:)
11/11/2009 at 08:47 MMORPG Center says:
hmm the quote didnt work, anyway EU is one of the soulless, and horrible experience i ever had. It ignores any gamedesign mmo standards in the industry. Movement, interface, gameplay. That doesn’t mean you cannot innovate, but if you make it worse…
I must say that the micro-transaction ideea is not bad, but how is implemented as a game, is horrible, i tried the game twice, once before the upgraded, and after upgrade. I talked with people around, veterans about the game, explored etc, but they seemed that all have no ideea how a decent mmorpg is, no gaming experience, so that’s why they think EU is DA Shietz.
Good ideea, poorly executed, but hey they produced a lot of money lol. If you have fun and think EU is da shitez, good for you.
15/11/2009 at 22:14 Kerham says:
The problem with this review is that Entropia Universe was never intended as a *game* per se. Is an economical platform, a massive multiplayer economic sandbox, a 3D socializing network, whatever you want to call it, but not a game.
My understanding of a game, be it single or multiplayer is that of a recreational activity in pursuit of fun/relaxation.
Due to the implication of real money, EU can’t be that.
I mean EU being reviewed here has same significance and is targeted as good as Adobe Photoshop would be or Mozilla Thunderbird.
I don’t understand how can you compare EU with some game when in EU you need to calculate if your armor doesn’t protect you too much or if you can find some even more rentable equipment setup for same task. In the mean time, in most of the games you just need the most powerful armor, given that your skills/rank/class etc allows you to use it.
I am *playing* (for lack of a more descriptive term) EU on and off for 4,5 years now. I need breaks from it in the same manner in which I need holidays from work. My financial balance with EU is a negative one, if I must talk about it, but I am a sucker for challenges.
In what regards gambling/jackpots, there lies a difficult task for developers. On one side, you have to make the experience affordable for most customers possible, on the other side, it must be attractive for most customers possible. Since EU is quite boring, and you need lots of time and dedication to study, try, fail, grind again, sometime succeed, etc., it appears the question if that is interesting for somebody with a monthly salary of, don’t know, let’s say 2000 EUR. What sum would such customer want to spend, and what *prize* would such customer get attracted by? What about somebody with a salary of let’s say 10,000 EUR? And so on.
Is also a dilemma for the customer, in what measure is the grind justified, in what measure is the expenses curve justified, etc.
I won’t go into discussions about graphics, UI, AI, lag/absence of it, features, character customization etc because for me those are merely formal aspects and there yes, EU can be compared with other MMOs, on some will get way ahead, on some will get way behind, but that’s not the point imo.
One important thing though: gold launch of Project Entropia (as was initially known EU, renamed for marketing purposes) took place in January 2003. For comparison, WoW was launched in November-December 2004. We’re not talking about some tentative of a software launched 3 weeks ago which hopes to scam 50 suckers before getting bust.
09/12/2009 at 04:30 ruskea says:
ooh kerham.. another eu fanatic who defends this game by saying something like this “u can have fun in here without wasting peds” so all u players who like to play.. this game aint for u.. u can PLAY WOW (for example) for month with 15$ and in this game it last maybe 3h when ur noob (by just mining or hunting).. less when ur mid lvl
and kerham yes i made a new ava to see how bad this shit is after the CE2.. i didnt see any other players in spawn.. i did not see anyone in PA.. how the hell u supposed to start as newb.. when i finally found someone to point me away to good sweating place.. oh god.. gathering the sweat is even slower than it was before.. about one hour i sweated and gained 0.8ped worth sweat thats less than 0.1usd and this is a fact that makes ppl to deposit real money to this game.. by working irl u woulda earned approx 10e+ in an hour.. so why grind 0.1usd/h.. so if u wanna play this game u are pretty much “forced” to put money in this game..
and ive come to conclusion in 3+year experience that they do monitor players.. and when they see someone depositing all the time to the game they just reduce those players chance to gain loot… “forcing” them to put more money in if they wanna play.. and talking about myself i am “hardcore” online gamer and gambling addict i lost alot of money in those 3+ years.. more skilled my avatar became the more money this game ate.. and while watching many same lvl players gain some nice loots i just couldnt take it anymore.. my avatar isnt supposed to win and finally got rid of it.. still have had fun reading about the downhill this game is going..
Choose any other game… this ship is sinking.. and fast with its current 5k players which is shrinking all the time
16/02/2010 at 17:11 Rasta says:
It’s true, that this is an attack article that is very biased. The level of professionalism in terms of the author’s writing is quite low. The author’s concept of the game is also quite low. Just because you read an article on a site like this which no one ever heard of, doesn’t mean that what you’re reading is accurate. It’s just an opinion, and please remember to take it with a grain of salt.
Entropia Universe has a generally bright and expanding player base, and a bright future ahead of it — and is the only MMORPG in history to switch graphics engines. That alone is a big clue that the game is a successful one. It has a real cash economy and it’s up to you to determine how much you will spend, or if you will play for free. The beauty here is that you do not have to pay a monthly subscription fee, so you don’t get your account locked if you decide not to pay for a month or more.
There are different ways of making money in the Entropia Universe, such as sweating, trading, good loots, or collecting fruits and animal dung. Loots aren’t always good, but in my experience I have had some very nice loots which has helped support my gameplay. There are going to be large peaks and valleys in loot synonymous to a sine wave, and sometimes it takes many months before you get out of a valley or down from a peak. I have deposited some, but have set a limit as I’m not a complete idiot like some of these people you hear complaining who had no idea about how to match their spending with their skill progression, armory, and weaponry. If you follow a strict gameplan, you can do very well in this game but it takes dedication. If you’re a weak soul, then I wouldn’t recommend playing Entropia and rather should direct your interest in playing Furcadia.
Sweating is a grind, but it’s not supposed to be easy. I do find sweating fun though, as it’s a group activity that involves teamwork. There are other grinds in other MMO’s that earn you nothing but skills which are worthless, whereas you get multiple skills and make some money through sweating. If you were to sweat creatures and deposit a little bit of money ($10.00 per month for instance), you can have quite a bit of fun. Sure you’re not going to be uber, but most people who are playing games are in it for the entertainment, and there’s no doubt that you don’t have to be anywhere near the uber level in order to be entertained. In fact, I know some people that just run around this universe exploring, and shoot a couple mobs here and there, or drop a few probes here and there.
The skill system is very advanced; I’ve never counted how many there are but there must be hundreds. There are many different types of rifles, mining finders, amps, clothes, and a good player base to help you out if you need assistance. It is true that you can lose your pants in the Entropia Universe, but the people who lost a lot of money are those that I consider stupid people. The world is full of stupid people — they drive on our highways, shop at our stores, and play our games. There’s nothing that we can do about it. If you lost money in Entropia, it’s not Mindarks fault — they just provided the platform. And that platform is one in which allows a player to spend $0.00 or $1,000,000.
Give this game a shot, and follow an experienced player’s advice — one that has a good reputation. When it comes to people’s wallets, of course they are going to bitch and moan when their monetary losses were due to their own stupor, and lack of knowledge in reference to how this game actually works.
16/02/2010 at 17:14 TCM says:
A very interesting shill, to be sure.
16/02/2010 at 20:56 PleasingFungus says:
The BEST shill. Come on!
“It’s true, that this is an attack article that is very biased.” (hm, yes, Quinns is being paid by ENTROPIA UNIVERSE’s many enemies)
“There are different ways of making money in the Entropia Universe, such as sweating… or collecting fruits and animal dung.” (I do love sweating and collecting dung, it is a pleasant escape from the real world)
“It is true that you can lose your pants in the Entropia Universe…”
18/02/2010 at 13:23 Steve says:
I’ve always came back to Entropia after playing different FPS and strategy type games. It’s just a different breed than an MMO with a monthly sub fee and it takes some restraint and patience to learn how to conserve your peds and stretch them out. Also, I know many people in game that don’t deposit, and a few lucky ones that hit some big HOF’s and gave them a good head start.
05/06/2010 at 19:31 RAZER says:
Well, the game is not as bad as some people try to make you believe. Sure you can loose a lot of money, but if you play with your head, you can play for free or for a little amount of money. It is true that if you wanna advance in the game and buy better and better weapons and armor you would probably need to put some real money in the game unless you get lucky and loot something big. But if you can resist that urge and keep playing at a low level and progress in game naturally, you can do that for not to much money. Also remember that every item you buy in game is not lost money, you can sell them again and have the money transferred back to your bank account. This also goes for all the skills you gather.
Just remember that you probably not make a lot of money and that you can give up your day job and that it is a game and that you are playing for fun. If you remember that and try to get involved in the community I think it is one of the best games around.
One thing that does that is the fact that it is an 18+ game and most people you meet are mature and are able to have a normal conversation and you can ask serious (and not so serious) questions, and most people will try to help you in any way they can (except giving away free stuff).
I have been playing this game for about 5.5 years and I only seen a hand full of people that were shouting bad words in game or that were annoying people, and those guys will not last very long most of the time.
09/06/2010 at 03:19 Naifas says:
I also started to play EU 5.5 years ago. I am not rich IRL nor ingame. I understand it’s dificult, and it’s a “love it or hate it” game. I’m still around after all that time, and average perhaps 80$ depos per year. You have to understand that the devs will take a cut on your ingame activities returns (some say around 5%). Some of your invested cash seems to also be channeled to larger drops that you may get or not (luck factor), and there’s the base return, which goes from 50 to 80% of your investment. I play at medium-high level when i don’t mind to loose more than the usual but have fun playing solo and testing my avatar’s strength. I play at low level when i don’t want to lose much and i team up when i don’t want to lose much while going for the big creatures. Every profit that happens in the meantime are lucky happenings. Or not :). You have to equation in the returns the market values which may by themselves keep your head over the waterline. In the meantime, i still have fun. I manage a society (yes, manage), and we support a lot each other. We even have a small ingame investment fund that pays for our little society events while making a few extra bucks on the side for all (we make an average of 1-2% a month). We meet IRL too, very often to drink, eat, and talk about the game. Sometimes, some people travel to meet other players abroad. Girls also play EU. Some meet their partners in life overthere, it’s not uncomon. I play with my wife, or played, since she spends a lot of time in the couch after she got pregnant :).
Of course if you expect the game to pay you to play, in a long term, you’re fucked. If you expect to get rich playing the game, wake up.
I don’t know what to think of players like ruskea or valentin, who pump gigantic quantities of dolars into the game just to burn it all in no time. There are ways to play it like slot machines (condition craft on mining amps anyone?). But only the doomed addicted gamblers choose to go down that path. I really think it should be stressed out that yes, you can play casino style, but beware, your odds, as in the casinos are not good! There are several ways to play it “safe” or “normaly”, but gambler players just won’t listen to the voice of reason.
The game is not free to play, but you can use the platform for free. There are missions now, or quests, like you call it, even for arriving noobs so you don’t feel so lost in the begining. You got free activities that can reward you with stuff with market value, but if you choose playing without putting a dime in, it will take you for ever and you will rapidly lose the interest in the game. I mean, yeah, you can go sweat creatures for a couple of months meet people there, chat with them and start to learn a bit while collecting the animal’s essence, but after 2-3 months of it, i bet you’ll want to move out and start to seriously try out the game. If you put in 20$, it’ll be enough to start as a hunter or miner. Get as much info about what gear to get before doing anything :). Knowledge is power. Knowledge is money. It will save u serious cash.
Goals. Besides those of missions, you can enter events organized by players or by the game devs. Or you can set your own. Example: grinding X mobs for that armor part or weapon.
Decay: Yes, everything decays. It’s what makes the economy work, like IRL. Oh, i decayed all my food, i better go get some more to stock my refrigerator :). (for EU players, i’m talking about L stuff, but you know it also affects the price of UnL, right?)
EVE: recently, a friend of mine that played EU is thinking of cashing out (with a large profit must i say) to dedicate entirely to EVE. Three months have passed. He did not cash out from EU yet, but is thinking about quitting EVE, although he likes the game and it’s complexity that is similar to EU, it is too time-consuming and he can’t do breaks like he used to in EU. The amazing part is that in EVE it seems after a couple of days you can do serious damage in pvp, and he fully dedicated to that activity.. while in EU, when he used to try pvp, he usually ended up at the revival terminal :D, even with 2 years of gameplay on top :). I don’t have anything against EVE or WoW, or other games, hell, i whish i had time to play them all currently. MOnthly fees are not an issue, if tried 1 at the time. But… in subscription fee game, i feel that if i’m not playing every single free hour that i have, i’m wasting my subscription, while in EU, there’s no stress at ll concerning that. I can make a deposit tomorrow and use that deposit in september for example, after a looong holiday. And it accumulates with your ingame earnings if any, our your preceding deposits. When i loot something in a game, nowadays, i always think about how much $ is it worth. And that thought only makes sense in EU.
I understand the reviewer’s frustration after his encounter with EU. It’s just not for everyone. It’s not a rose garden, and it can be hellishly difficult. Some like the challenge. SOme don’t. Have a nice trip back home.
PS: You can only lose what you put in
PS2: Yeah, i also find freakish the extreme value of certain assets ingame
PS3: it’s wild west capitalism ingame, be warned :)
27/08/2010 at 16:52 John says:
It would be a pyramid scheme except that:
a) virtual producs and services have value
In real life, an business owner makes more money the more people they get to become a customer. This is kind of like a pyramid scheme except that products and services are being sold. They even make a program where the pay the customer if the customer finds other customers. The difference, as I just stated, is that the customer is getting an actual product or service in the process or exchanging money.
Now, if you buy a virtual apartment and it operates in a similar manner (guy at the top makes money off you, and you try to get other people to buy apartments there), would you consider the apartments an actual product or service? I think this is the source of all of the confusion people feel when they play these games. If it’s not a product or service, then it could be argued this is a pyramid scheme.
So I think the root of all of this distress lies in the idea that virtual things have no REAL value, so the inevitable conclusion is that no product or services are offered in the transactions. This would mean it’s a pyramid scheme of some sort. The problem with this kind of thinking is that it’s prejudiced against virtual products and services. Let me ask you: Is a painting a product? Many people would consider what’s deemed these days as a painting to just be a piece of canvas (its real value) with paint thrown on it that some insane people will spend thousands of dollars for. Virtual property IS real because people are willing to buy it!!!! A virtual apartment is real. You can go in it and decorate it and enjoy it with friends. Virtual societies are real. Virtual friends are real. We need to get over this.
If I can get away with selling you nothing and get rich on it, then I deserve to be punished and have my business destroyed by the courts. That’s why we go after ponzi and pyramid schemes. The problem with online worlds is that half of the people think nothing is being produced for sale and it’s just a casino and the other half think something is being sold and it has value and it’s not just ignorance or addiction being exploited by a few businessmen to get rich. This is idealogical.
There’s some possibility now that open spaces are more important to evolution than competition. So people will run towards open spaces where they can build and socialize more than they will run to places where they can compete. That’s what is being alluded to. This leads me to believe that virtual reality will induce in humanity a rapid evolutionary change. The same thing would happen if space travel suddenly were cheap or energy reduced in price by ten times. We will most certainly evolve in a direction less physical and more mental. These are purely my opinions, based on my presumption that the internet and virtual property are a vast open space comparable to open spaces in our evolutionary past and that the studies that have backed up this idea that open spaces are more important than we thought are grounded in reality.
So what do you think? Will we evolve to become more virtual in the way we live? We already communicate at light speed in virtual reality. Why limit ourselves to physical constraints? When the possibility arises to upload our mind to the internet or to a computer device, evolution will surely be in full swing and it will be rapid and stunning.
27/08/2010 at 17:36 John says:
The #1 the courts must ensure is that:
a) products and services are being received
b) that the people who profit from the sales are not monopolizing or unlawfully exploiting their customers
The internet and virtual societies cannot exist in the dark. That would be inviting dark age mentality and witch hunts and crime. The courts must tackle this issue. They must also tackle the issue of who owns the virtual assets? The company that owns the server and code, or the customer? Will the government protect the customer in the event of disaster or if the company declares bankruptcy or in a crime?
It’s difficult to trust MindArk when they exist in a real vacuum inside sweden. Legitimacy needs to be lended to them and for that they must challenge the courts and get everyone involved in the matter.
Having said this I have no doubt that virtual assets have value and that virtual economies tied to the real one are perfectly plausible, but it’s hard to see this reality unless government gets involved and hte laws can be enforced to protect everyone involved from non-criminal and criminal mishaps.
25/09/2010 at 11:44 eva says:
I’ve been playing this game for five weeks and have yet to make a deposit. I did my share of sweating the first week and I did A LOT of reading. The problem with most people is they just depo and go. Sweating is there for a reason, you gain a lot of skills and you meet a lot of people. It does suck yes, but the amount of things I learned doing that was immeasurable. This game like any game isnt for everyone.
04/10/2010 at 13:25 Belenor says:
Well, I deposited some 220$ (actually, the latest deposit done today, so not yet accounted in EU). And I have an EU account since 2004 if I remember correctly. Notice that I did not say “I play since…” This is what I like with EU. I do not know other online games, so I have to ask – what happens if I do not pay the monthly fee? Is the account locked and I cannot play if I do not pay again? Probably. Well, with EU, I usually have a quite long periods I do not play, because I have so many other hobbies :-) But no worries, I just stop playing and return to the game a few months later to pick up where I stopped without any troubles with unlocking and paying. And I can stop anytime without a feeling of wasted money when not playing, you know, paid the fee one day and broken both hands the socond? No worries with EU :-)
Well, not much of an advantage, I know, but I like it :-) But I’m a strange fellow :-)
12/10/2010 at 18:49 Hidan says:
@Eva
well i have been playing this game for a week as well, and while i do agree that we dont have to depo and still enjoy the game with sweating and meeting all the communities while doing so
but sooner or later, if you are hooked up with this game, you will want to Depo, and that is where everything will start ( the infamous Profit or loss problems ) and after reading all the replies here
i understand that this game is mostly based on purely Chances
you can just depo $5, go buy Mining gear, and go mine, then when you are super duper lucky, you get a World PED for thousands of PED
you can also depo $100, go buy loads of mining gears, go mine, and got nothing
now the $5 depo guy will start telling people that this game makes money, vice versa
so i do agree with people saying that this game is similar to gambling on casinos
although i do enjoy being in the game with the community, but other than sweating, i wont be doing much else
hence, for a player that does not depo like me, will have a hard time enjoying the overall game since we’re not able to participate on the uber events
sure there are some who did not depo a single $ and have lots of PEDS by today, but that dedication is hard to commit in this game
13/02/2012 at 10:59 EntropiaPlanets says:
For anyone interested in learning more about Entropia Universe, there is a wealth of information out there. For forums with Entropia Universe discussion, a wiki, and various tools integrated into a single Entropia Universe website, check out http://www.entropiaplanets.com.